Spoilers and Spoiler Discussion

[Katsullivan]

4 hours ago, RedVitC said:

After thinking about it I'm actually glad that between Barry + Nora and Iris + Nora they've given Iris the storyline that gives the relationship a place to go to if that makes sense. There's a little more story to flesh out there. 

There is - and technically, Iris has the stronger storyline potential here because she's basically George McFly to Nora's Marty. She's the character that gets to be seen in a different light - like Marty realising that George wrote scifi, Nora will see that her mom used to be cool. There isn't much story to go with Nora/Barry - unless the show wants to write Nora being disillusioned by Barry which I can't see this show doing.  

The x-factor in this is the almost consistently shitty way that Iris's storylines are dealt with on this show so... I dunno.

Plus this news about DP (and I think post-SDCC, we can all stop "speculating" about the nature of her relationship with CP) is directing an episode and has control over how little and how badly Iris/CP is portrayed? Not good.

[Starry]

19 hours ago, BeautifulFlower said:

They confirmed it gets resolved in 5x02. I'm curious to why Nora is cold towards Iris. 

They also mentioned that Nora is very clingy to Barry. In an interview, Grant said Nora is 24. Todd already confirmed Nora comes from 30 years in the future (even Barry said it in the trailer). If Nora is 24 in 2048, she was born in 2023 or 2024. No matter what, Nora probably has never met Barry.  popular theory is that Iris probably forbidden Nora to time travel.

Either way, I hope it's not OOC reason, because I can't imagine Iris being  terrible mom.

I'd rage if they portrayed Iris as a terrible mom.

I'm almost sure Barry dies before Nora is born. It's even possible he dies before Iris finds out she's pregnant with his baby. Grant said that Barry is sad about the moments he would miss, like hearing Nora's heartbeat for the first time and seeing her first smile. Your child traveling back in time doesn't prevent you from experiencing those moments. It just means you meet her as an adult before you eventually experience them.

I'm making myself sad thinking about it. I hope Nora messing with the timeline changes the future and Barry gets to be there when his kid/s is born.

[Kate45]

On 7/23/2018 at 9:42 AM, DearEvette said:

Candice's reaction to the "arrow free" vow renewal. "The shaaaade, honey" made me LOL.  Also Helbig's reaction "buttons." 

What “buttons” are you talking about? Did this happen on the panel? Sorry, I just don’t remember what part you are talking about. 

Grant and Candice were both triggered by the double wedding crap from what I can tell. Both have mentioned it in interviews. 

On 7/23/2018 at 11:25 PM, Proteus said:

Ah, ok. I didn't think of it like that. You're probably right.

In the TV Line video interview they say the new Wells will have some romance. I wonder with who.

I’m about 95% sure that the new Wells will be the new LGBT character that Todd mentioned. 

Edited July 25, 2018 by Kate45

[DearEvette]

1 hour ago, Kate45 said:

What “buttons” are you talking about? Did this happen on the panel? Sorry, I just don’t remember what part you are talking about. 

In one of the many clips Trini posted above (one of the ones of SDCC panel) a viewer asks a question about if we can get a non-Arrow infested vow renewal for Barry and Iris.  There is a lot of reaction to the question, one of which is Candace saying "shade" but if you listen through the chatter someone says "buttons" I think it is Helbing.

[Trini]

8 hours ago, Kate45 said:

I’m about 95% sure that the new Wells will be the new LGBT character that Todd mentioned. 

I hate how right you might be.

[Proteus]

57 minutes ago, Trini said:

I hate how right you might be.

 

9 hours ago, Kate45 said:

 

I’m about 95% sure that the new Wells will be the new LGBT character that Todd mentioned. 

I don't think so.

[Trini]

So is anyone familiar with Chris Klein? The actors on the show frequently have to sell ridiculous writing, so he better be good.

[Kate45]

1 hour ago, Proteus said:

 

I don't think so.

Who do you think it will be? I doubt they will add any other new characters given that they added so many this year. Plus, the Wells characters tend to be the most sex driven characters. I think the only references we have had to threesomes came from HR. I totally think it’s him. We shall see. 

[Trini]

From Comic-Con, we know that Barry's getting a new suit to go with the Flash Ring -- but based on this interview, it seems the Season 4 suit was getting too damaged (during stunts, etc.), so that may be why there's a new suit for Season 5. (And maybe that's why last season also had the most episodes with Barry not in the suit at all.) And I think Helbing said that it's going to be the most "comic accurate" yet. --Which I don't think they need to do, the suits they've had so far have been good, and work for a live-action TV show. I really hope they're not putting Grant in a unitard or something.

Current comics costume:

[Starry]

I too thought the new Wells would be the LGBT character. Whoever ends up being, I hope they give him a love story they handle with care and not just a few lines to lampshade the fact he/she is LGBT. 

[Trini]

Quote

Do you have any information on Iris’ handwritten vows from last year’s Arrowverse crossover? Will The Flash‘s Nora use that to somehow prove her identity to Barry and Iris? —Kendra

Ah, a fan of my Pinned Tweet from eight months ago. Well, after the Flash team’s visit to our Comic-Con suite, I remembered to ask showrunner Todd Helbing if, in fact, we will see those vows again. Perhaps in Nora’s possession. And his answer was… nope. [Sigh]

https://tvline.com/2018/07/26/hawaii-five-0-season-9-spoilers-steve-danny-expendables/

Edited July 26, 2018 by Trini

[wingster55]

22 hours ago, Kate45 said:

Who do you think it will be? I doubt they will add any other new characters given that they added so many this year. Plus, the Wells characters tend to be the most sex driven characters. I think the only references we have had to threesomes came from HR. I totally think it’s him. We shall see. 

Why can't it be Nora? 

[Proteus]

23 hours ago, Kate45 said:

Who do you think it will be? I doubt they will add any other new characters given that they added so many this year. Plus, the Wells characters tend to be the most sex driven characters. I think the only references we have had to threesomes came from HR. I totally think it’s him. We shall see. 

I think it could be a guest star. It doesn't have to be a series regular. I also don't think it has to be a man. We've had several gay men on Flash already.

[Kate45]

1 hour ago, wingster55 said:

Why can't it be Nora? 

It can absolutely be Nora. I just don’t think it is her. It could also be a trans person. I’m just giving my guesses. 

50 minutes ago, Proteus said:

I think it could be a guest star. It doesn't have to be a series regular. I also don't think it has to be a man. We've had several gay men on Flash already.

Hmm, possible. That’s what they already have with Singh, so I don’t think so. 

Who are the several gay men on Flash? I can only think of Singh. Who am I missing?

[Maverick]

 Pied Pier.  Earth-X Snart.  The Ray.  

[Kate45]

1 hour ago, Maverick said:

 Pied Pier.  Earth-X Snart.  The Ray.  

Hartley is Bi. Earth-X Snart was a guest star, and I don’t consider The Ray to even be a guest star on the show. A crossover appearance doesn’t really count to me. So, 2 gay men (3 if you count The Ray) and Hartley who is Bi. Several should be 5-7, but either way I don’t see how that would rule out a gay man joining the cast. Perhaps we will get a casting announcement soon. Otherwise, it’s someone on the canvas. 

[Maverick]

 I'm not arguing for or against; I'm just answering your question.    And I don't recall them stating Pied Piper is bi.  I think they specifically said he came as gay and that's why his parents disowned him.  

[Kate45]

1 hour ago, Maverick said:

 I'm not arguing for or against; I'm just answering your question.    And I don't recall them stating Pied Piper is bi.  I think they specifically said he came as gay and that's why his parents disowned him.  

I could have sworn that Hartley was Bi from 1x11, and I thought that was why his parents disowned him. I havent watched that episode in a while, so I could be wrong. Also, I may be confusing the character of Hartley with the actor (Andy M) who is either Gay or Bi. 

[cambridgeguy]

On 7/25/2018 at 10:03 AM, Starry said:

I'd rage if they portrayed Iris as a terrible mom.

It's more likely that if Barry "died" (doesn't the future newspaper still have him vanishing?) when Nora was very young/not born then he'd be remembered in the best possible light while Iris would be stuck as the sole disciplinarian.  I don't think it's unreasonable for her to be the overprotective sort so that can easily lead to resentment even though it doesn't make Iris a bad mom.

[Trini]

So Helbing said at Comic-Con that Wally(Keiynan) will be in 3 episodes in Season 5. We know he's in the season premiere; and I'm assuming that one of the other episodes is the 100th. With the theme this season being family/Legacy, they have an opportunity to do a proper send-off for Wally - I hope they take it!

Edited August 1, 2018 by Trini

[BeautifulFlower]

1 hour ago, Trini said:

So Helbing said at Comic-Con that Wally(Keiynan) will be in 3 episodes in Season 5. We know he in the season premiere; and I'm assuming that one of the other episodes is the 100th. With the theme this season being family/Legacy, they have an opportunity to do a proper send-off for Wally - I hope they take it!

A proper send off is what I've been wanting since Todd said he would be in 3 episodes. Last season was just pitiful. Before moving to legends and the finale, Wally's last appearance on The Flash was 4x07. Or we counting anything in correlation with The Flash, I guess we count part 1 of Supergirl since that was the wedding episode.

[wingster55]

On 7/25/2018 at 12:00 PM, DearEvette said:

but if you listen through the chatter someone says "buttons" I think it is Helbing.

I'm pretty sure Todd said "Legends" after Grant asked if the vow renewals would be on their show or another. 

[Kate45]

1 hour ago, wingster55 said:

I'm pretty sure Todd said "Legends" after Grant asked if the vow renewals would be on their show or another. 

I think so, too. Which is funny, since they are actually did get married on Legends. 

[BeautifulFlower]

http://thathashtagshow.com/2018/07/exclusive-the-flash-season-5-caitlin-snow-father/

Quote

Described as a Caucasian male in his 50’s, Dr. Snow is an extremely intelligent geneticist who has been MIA for a few decades. As he returns to Central City, Dr. Snow will do his best to make up for lost time with his daughter Caitlin and his wife Carla. But what they don’t know about Thomas is that he is keeping a big and mysterious secret.

Honestly, this is ridiculous. They established for 3 seasons that her father is dead. Before someone say it, Flashpoint couldn't have changed this as they again confirmed in season 3 that Caitlin's father is dead. They even said he had a disease. It's impossible for him to fake his death. He died from his illness and his wife would have to make the funeral arrangements. So there's really no way he could have fooled his wife with his supposed death.

If this casting breakdown is true, this show is about to make the biggest retcon ever.

[Trini]

2 hours ago, BeautifulFlower said:

If this casting breakdown is true, this show is about to make the biggest retcon ever.

... Again. But I already didn't have any expectations Caitlin's arc. I only hope - since apparently he doesn't have much of (or any?) story this season - that they remember that Caitlin and Cisco are supposed to be close friends, and he gets stuff to do that way.

Edited July 31, 2018 by Trini

[adora721]

So, if this is true, then KF has known about him all this time? It was KF that Cecile was channeling when she said, "I found Thomas; he's been this way all the time." First, how can an alternate personality find anyone? Can KF now leave Cait's body and search out her dad?! Did the writers use the wrong verb? 

Her father died of Multiple Sclerosis.

[BeautifulFlower]

37 minutes ago, adora721 said:

So, if this is true, then KF has known about him all this time? It was KF that Cecile was channeling when she said, "I found Thomas; he's been this way all the time." First, how can an alternate personality find anyone? Can KF now leave Cait's body and search out her dad?! Did the writers use the wrong verb? 

Her father died of Multiple Sclerosis.

Maybe Killer Frost did it while she hanging out in town. I mean apparently she hung out with Cisco, Ralph, and Wells. Caitlin doesn't remember anything Killer Frost does. Even though they established in season 3 she does. Ugh

Yeah, he died of an illness. They have been telling the audience every season that her father is dead. Caitlin remembers seeing her father sick d him dying. My dad died a while back. I learned that funeral arrangements are handled by next of kin-his spouse.  According to the description, she couldn't have faked his death. They said Caitlin's mom became cold after his death. She had to watch him die and buried him. It's literally impossible for that man to have faked his death.

 

Caitlin's story is so freaking messing. Honestly, if a show has to continue to retcon someone's story to keep them around, maybe it's time for said character to go. I have never seen a show like this.

[adora721]

47 minutes ago, BeautifulFlower said:

Maybe Killer Frost did it while she hanging out in town. I mean apparently she hung out with Cisco, Ralph, and Wells. Caitlin doesn't remember anything Killer Frost does. Even though they established in season 3 she does. Ugh

Or more likely, KF found him while working on the seedy side for Amunet's slave market. Perhaps daddy Snow went looking to cure himself of his disease on the darkside as well - like father, like daughter.

Edited August 1, 2018 by adora721

[Maverick]

 I  don't remember every scene about Caitlin's family over the past 4 years, but isn't it possible her mom lied to her and knew all along that her father was alive.  

[BeautifulFlower]

8 minutes ago, Maverick said:

 I  don't remember every scene about Caitlin's family over the past 4 years, but isn't it possible her mom lied to her and knew all along that her father was alive.  

According to the description, he has to make up for lost times for both of them. I'm assuming she had no part. Especially since they said Caitlin's mom became cold after his death. If she did have a hand in his fake death, then she is one cruel mother.

[Kate45]

3 hours ago, BeautifulFlower said:

Maybe Killer Frost did it while she hanging out in town. I mean apparently she hung out with Cisco, Ralph, and Wells. Caitlin doesn't remember anything Killer Frost does. Even though they established in season 3 she does. Ugh

Yeah, he died of an illness. They have been telling the audience every season that her father is dead. Caitlin remembers seeing her father sick d him dying. My dad died a while back. I learned that funeral arrangements are handled by next of kin-his spouse.  According to the description, she couldn't have faked his death. They said Caitlin's mom became cold after his death. She had to watch him die and buried him. It's literally impossible for that man to have faked his death.

 

Caitlin's story is so freaking messing. Honestly, if a show has to continue to retcon someone's story to keep them around, maybe it's time for said character to go. I have never seen a show like this.

Actually, in season 1, they said her parents were alive. Then, in season 2, he died when she was a kid. Which in turn caused her mother to become cold toward Caitlin. 

If they are announcing the casting call, the role has likely been filled.  I’m guessing this will be a storyline starting in episode 4 or 5?

My problem with this constant retcon is that it means that I’m not invested at all. I feel like they will tell us this story today and can switch it tomorrow when they feel ready to tell it a different way. There are no stakes and no consequences. 

[BeautifulFlower]

18 minutes ago, Kate45 said:

Actually, in season 1, they said her parents were alive. Then, in season 2, he died when she was a kid. Which in turn caused her mother to become cold toward Caitlin. 

If they are announcing the casting call, the role has likely been filled.  I’m guessing this will be a storyline starting in episode 4 or 5?

My problem with this constant retcon is that it means that I’m not invested at all. I feel like they will tell us this story today and can switch it tomorrow when they feel ready to tell it a different way. There are no stakes and no consequences. 

I could've sworn they said he died back in season 1.

Edited August 1, 2018 by BeautifulFlower

[Kate45]

12 hours ago, BeautifulFlower said:

I could've sworn they said he died back in season 1.

No, in 1x14, Caitlin says that she has to tell her *parents* that her dead fiancé is actually alive. Then, sometime in season 2 (I don’t remember the episode) she mentions that her father is dead and that he died with she was young. 

[adora721]

35 minutes ago, Kate45 said:

No, in 1x14, Caitlin says that she has to tell her *parents* that her dead fiancé is actually alive. Then, sometime in season 2 (I don’t remember the episode) she mentions that her father is dead and that he died with she was young. 

Yes, and in 2x11, Cait tells faux Jay that her father died of MS when she was a child. No consistency at all in her backstory.  

[Trini]

Not a surprise, but the actress that plays Caitlin's mother is back to film:

[BeautifulFlower]

6 hours ago, Trini said:

Not a surprise, but the actress that plays Caitlin's mother is back to film:

I'll give it to Todd He's seems really committed to giving these characters story (sadly sans Cisco). However, after 4 years, I'm tired of Caitlin's story.

[ruby24]

Yawn. I couldn't possibly care less about Caitlin or anything that happens to Caitlin at this point. To be honest, I think it's time for her to leave the show. There's nothing else to do with her, there's no way to make that character interesting. 

[Trini]

Posting this here since it's about leaked set photos. Apparently, photos of the new suit are circulating, and Grant is already getting hate about it (or rather his body); so he put out A Statement:

 

So I guess the new suit is more body-conforming, as I feared. -- I haven't seen the photos.

[ruby24]

I've seen it and I really don't think it's that bad? I don't know. It looks a little more comics accurate to me if anything.

[BeautifulFlower]

10 minutes ago, Trini said:

Posting this here since it's about leaked set photos. Apparently, photos of the new suit are circulating, and Grant is already getting hate about it (or rather his body); so he put out A Statement:

 

So I guess the new suit is more body-conforming, as I feared. -- I haven't seen the photos.

Ugh, I hate body shaming. Grant doesn't deserve this. People need to get over wanting buff dudes for comic book heroes. 

With that said, I've seen the suit (prototype most likely), and I like it. Only one thing bothers me.

[Starry]

I did like the s4 suit and I don't like what I've seen of the new one (hopefully the final product looks better) but fanboys whine about everything. Nothing is comic accurate enough. They'll never be satisfied until these actors start looking like cartoon characters.

[cambridgeguy]

I've always wondered if Grant hates wearing the suit (all versions of it) in general.  He always seems to be popping off the cowl in particular even when it makes no sense and his eyes/face are visible enough for him to show off his acting abilities.  Maybe he'd be happier if he switched to more of a Jay Garrick styled look - throw in a domino mask if they're going to maintain the illusion of a secret identity even though it seems like most of Central City should recognize his face by now.

[Proteus]

I wonder if she's the LGBT character:

https://deadline.com/2018/08/the-flash-kiana-madeira-recur-spencer-young-spin-gender-switching-casting-cw-drama-1202442920/

Kiana Madeira (Sacred Lies) is set for a recurring role on the upcoming fifth season of the CW’s The Flash in a casting with a twist. Madeira will play Spencer Young (aka Spin), originally a male character in the comics, but producers decided to change it up as a female role for the DC drama.

Madeira’s Spencer Young (aka Spin) is a young aspiring social media influencer who seizes the opportunity to make herself famous when she discovers there is a new hero in Central City. Spin will be introduced in episode #504.

Edited August 9, 2018 by Proteus

[ruby24]

She probably is. It has to be someone who's at least recurring for Todd Helbing to have mentioned it.

[Trini]

6 hours ago, Proteus said:

I wonder if she's the LGBT character:

https://deadline.com/2018/08/the-flash-kiana-madeira-recur-spencer-young-spin-gender-switching-casting-cw-drama-1202442920/

Kiana Madeira (Sacred Lies) is set for a recurring role on the upcoming fifth season of the CW’s The Flash in a casting with a twist. Madeira will play Spencer Young (aka Spin), originally a male character in the comics, but producers decided to change it up as a female role for the DC drama.

Madeira’s Spencer Young (aka Spin) is a young aspiring social media influencer who seizes the opportunity to make herself famous when she discovers there is a new hero in Central City. Spin will be introduced in episode #504.

 

Oooh, this could be really interesting... (before it fizzles out in the second half).

I'm glad they seem committed to more recurring female characters.

With this character being connected to social media, she could potentially be a nemesis for Iris* with her work being in media/news.

*(and Team Flash, of course)

The show always does their own version of the comic character, and in the comics, Spin was using another metahuman who had the power to make people's fears manifest and influence minds(?) to commit crimes and turn people against the Flash. So I'm thinking that this version will just have 'influencing' powers herself, and use them for evil.

The "new hero in Central City", that's going to be Nora, right?

Episode 5.04 is the one with the new writer, Kelly Wheeler.

Edited August 10, 2018 by Trini
edited for clarity

[Kate45]

4 hours ago, Trini said:

The "new hero in Central City", that's going to be Nora, right?

Or Cicada, depending on how he appears to the city. This may be the LGBT character. Did they release a casting call for this character?

[Trini]

3 hours ago, Kate45 said:

Did they release a casting call for this character?

Not that I've heard.

[BeautifulFlower]

So I've been rewatching some things from this past season. In 4x18, Caitlin read a sticky note from KF that said sorry the blood on jacket. Then, when they wee preparing to go after Devoe for killing Ralph, KF said she was ready to get blood on her jacket. Hell, she made icicle to try to stab Devoe. Ummm.....is this "hero" behavior? Exactly what has she been doing to get blood on her clothes?

[Trini]

 

A little speculation about the new suit: Maybe the reason for no chinstrap is so that they can actually show Barry pulling down the cowl? Since it happens fairly often. Still need to see this from different angles and in motion, though. But maybe they'll put the chinstrap back later?

[BeautifulFlower]

Quote

 

We're getting another poster close to premiere 

Edited August 11, 2018 by BeautifulFlower