S04.E07: Honor Among Thieves

[DeLurker]

 

That was also the most chemistry I've seen Sarah Shahi have with anyone.

I gotta go with Nestor Carbonell on that one.

[DEM]

I agree with all of that, stealinghome. I saw Shaw's line to Root as an invitation to hang out together (whatever that entailed). Also, regarding recognising MARV, I think unless one has that topic on-the-brain, so to speak, in the context of a jewel heist, one probably wouldn't think, "In that grey strongbox are infectious disease samples."

Edited November 13, 2014 by DEM

[Netfoot]

What 3D printers have been very successful in printing is guns. Just putting that out there.

 

Because a gun is simply a hollow tube, sealed at one end.  Add a handle to hold it by, and it becomes a good gun.  A spring-loaded arm to fire the percussion cap, and you've got a sophisticated gun.  By comparison, a tablet is a simple case containing very sophisticated, highly miniaturized solid state circuitry, liquid crystal display unit, sophisticated chemical battery, antennas for wifi, bluetooth, NFC, etcetera, cameras, focusing lenses, memory...  Most of these items I believe would be beyond the scope of a 3D printer.

 

3D printer resolution is around 100µm (100 micro-meters).  By comparison, Intel's 4004 microprocessor was built using 10µm technology.  So even if a 3D printer could print a semiconductor directly, the printer would have have 10x10 = 100 times the resolution of today's printers.  And then, you'd be able to print a 4004 which, if you didn't know, was the first ever 4-bit microprocessor, built in 1971. 

[Julia]

Just, a few people were speculating that there might have been some other reason for the big bad to want a bank of 3D printers. In a city with strict gun control laws, an endless supply of guns which can get through metal detectors seems like one possibility.

Edited November 13, 2014 by Julia

[SnarkyTart]

I gotta go with Nestor Carbonell on that one.

Aww, I do like Nestor Carbonell and will always have a spot in my heart for Richard Alpert.    I would agree that Shahi and Carbonell brought some heat to their on-camera attraction.  But, for me, it looked like a slow simmer.  Had they met in other circumstances (and pre-Machine), they might have dated, gone to movies, out to dinners, held hands, kissed and eventually consumated their relationship.  As it was, the episode ended with Shaw telling Nestor's character that she wasn't ready to be in a relationship.

 

By contrast, the on-screen attraction between Shaw and Tomas was more like a pressure cooker about to explode.  Had they met in other circumstances (pre-Machine), they would have gone straight to a hotel room and taken turns throwing each other up against a wall...a table...the floor.  Their real time relationship ended with Tomas inviting her to Barcelona, and Shaw inviting him to join Team Machine.  She confessed that the invitation to Barcelona had been quite tempting. 

 

As for Root/Shaw.  I still can't stand the Root character.  I won't forget that Root murdered Alicia Corwin, kidnapped poor Finch and traumatized him, and forced him to watch her torture Denton Weeks.  Later she kidnapped Shaw and was on the verge of torturing her, but when interrupted, left her to be killed by the Special Counsel hitmen. Then, in "Godmode", Root turns her gun on Finch and would have murdered him then and there if she hadn't been stopped by Shaw shooting her.   

 

It was hard to stomach so much of Root in Season 3, the special snowflake of the Machine, ultimately becoming the de facto leader of Team Machine...all ominiscient and smug, ordering around the Team.  (Yes, I've wanted her character gone for a long time.)   Seeing her make all the remarks to Shaw that sound for all the world like Root wants to have a sadomasochistic sexual relationship with Shaw, with Root of course in the role of the psycho sexual sadist, only pisses me off.  Plus, that role seems like it would be natural to Root, but Shaw is nobody's BDSM prop! 

 

I don't have any problem with the show depicting gay or lesbian relationships.  They already did it with a large amount of class in what I thought was a groundbreaking episode about the lesbian heart surgeon and her wife.   I'm actually hoping that it will be revealed at some point that Root is not actually a lesbian, because a television depiction of a lesbian who is a psychotic sexual sadist is not something that anyone needs.  imo. mmv.

[Netfoot]

If my memory serves me, the original Glock pistol carried a barrel made from a ceramic material (with octagonal rifling), and could not be detected by metal detectors.  The reason that the regular makers don't produce all non-metallic firearms is because they choose not to.

 

Just saying, the idea of printing tablets isn't believable because tablets are very complex -- perhaps too complex to be printed.  Guns on the other hand are suitable for 3D printing, because they are basically incredibly simple machines. 

 

The other problem is that 3D printing is a slow and expensive process.  OK for knocking out an initial prototype or one-off special, but definitely not suitable for mass production.  Again, bulk tablet manufacture doesn't sound sensible.  But a printer farm that can be used to produce all manner of fairly sophisticated one-off items on demand, might be a valuable asset for Samaritan.

[Snarkette]

Every Amazon tablet self-updates its firmware. No way this kindertablet wouldn't. Easy enough to deploy spyware later, plus ditto to all the "universal fabrication" mentioned above. This was very un-Harold-ly written.

[Mars477]

If my memory serves me, the original Glock pistol carried a barrel made from a ceramic material (with octagonal rifling), and could not be detected by metal detectors.  The reason that the regular makers don't produce all non-metallic firearms is because they choose not to.

Wrong.  The ceramic pistol is a myth.  No ceramic parts would be able to withstand the brunt of the stresses that occur when a bullet is fired.

 

I gotta go with Nestor Carbonell on that one.

I'd still have to stick with Damien Lewis (that was a good show...)

Edited November 13, 2014 by Mars477

[Netfoot]

Wrong.  The ceramic pistol is a myth.  No ceramic parts would be able to withstand the brunt of the stresses that occur when a bullet is fired.

 

Perhaps there is no ceramic gun out there, but there certainly are all-plastic guns out there, made with 3D printers.  And if you or I could make one in our spare bedroom, I suspect that Smith & Wesson could make a far better one, using manufacturing processes not available to the average 3D printer.  And while S&W might refuse, I doubt Samaritan would have difficulty locating some company that wouldn't.

 

The only point I was trying to make is that if Samaritan wanted 10,000 all-plastic guns for whatever purpose, they could be ordered from a large manufacturing company for far less than it would cost to 3D print them, and they'd probably work better too.  And get delivered faster.  The value of a 3D printer farm isn't in mass production of items in bulk.  It is in producing all manner of unique, specialized, one-off items for any and every conceivable nefarious purpose, day after day, as the need for such items arise. 

[Syme]

Didn't she flunk out of the medical school on account of her poor bedside manner?

 

She was booted from her residency, as I recall. By then she'd been though ?5 years? I'd say.

3D printer resolution is around 100µm (100 micro-meters).  By comparison, Intel's 4004 microprocessor was built using 10µm technology. 

 

Only on PTV would I run into someone who recalls the 4004.

This is your fault, Glark!!!!

[MrWhyt]

Perhaps there is no ceramic gun out there, but there certainly are all-plastic guns out there, made with 3D printers. 

the various 3d printed guns aren't all plastic, they still need a metal barrel, plastic can't stand up to the force of a fired cartridge.

[immortalfrieza]

And once again, TV writers forget that gold is, ya know, heavy; Shaw's tough, but those ingots she so casually tossed in the river probably weighed at least 8 pounds each, and there was a bagful of 'em. Oi.

Actually, a typical gold bar is 12.4 kilograms, so roughly 27 pounds, so assuming that's what each gold bar in the bag weighed a bagful would probably weigh several hundred pounds. I doubt Shaw would even be able to lift the bag much less casually toss it in the river, so it's even more ridiculous than it sounds.

I'm really annoyed at Harold's naivete!  See, here's the deal Harold since they've made you really dumb this episode. The tablets may have been all good and harmless but they are still a way of monitoring everyone in New York (at this point) and then, they can be hacked.  Or not, the info will be there for Samaritan god; and all it has to do is pick the next family member up of the nearest street corner camara.

 

So, ummm, nope.  It was doing GOOD to do good.  Cannot believe they have done this to you.

I was annoyed as well. Not only is it stupid of Harold to think even for a moment that stopping Samaritan would be bad in any way, it's a false dilemma. What Harold should be focusing on is stopping Samaritan right now, and then everybody can go back to their old lives (at least I hope so, let's PLEASE not have Samaritan dragged out for several seasons!). With cases like the tablet guy Harold could easily toss the guy another 12 million to start up later once he's able to access his money again and Samaritan is no longer a threat. All they're doing here is preventing Samaritan from unleashing it's own evil while putting the good that Samaritan's actions might have also done in the process on hold until it's safe to let those good things happen. And besides, it's already been mentioned further up that those tablets weren't very likely to actually stay in the hands of those kids for long, if they ever got there. I do agree with other posters that say it's far more likely Samaritan was going to use those 3D printers for something else and the tablets were just a convenient smokescreen.

[Camera One]

I enjoyed this episode, though I too am not a huge fan of heist storylines.  But the humor with Root, and picking a good actor for Tomas really helped.  I agreed with many previous posters, that the episode got much better when the other relevant team with the Shaw trainee showed up.  I liked him, and I hope he doesn't just become cannon fodder.  

 

Why weren't Shaw and Tomas wearing masks as well?  I thought Finch looped the footage, but he didn't deal with the video footage at the end of the mission?

 

Would it get back to Samaritan that the woman who Root impersonated went back into the building?  I did find Root's French babysitter routine quite funny.

[Netfoot]

the various 3d printed guns aren't all plastic, they still need a metal barrel, plastic can't stand up to the force of a fired cartridge.

 

All-plastic guns do exist, such as The Liberator.  These generally carry a metal plate so as to comply with the Undetectable Firearms Act, but generally, this type of plate is present for legislative reasons only, and the firearm will work just fine without it.  In fact, the only part that is still routinely made out of metal is the actual firing pin, and since only the very tip of the pin itself needs to be metal, these firearms can have only the tiniest metal fingerprint.

 

In any case I'm now feeling that I've been over-thinking things and seeing Samaritan-backed plotting in places it doesn't exist.  The plan probably really was to get surveillance hardware into all those homes too poor to provide their own computer, as explained in the show.  Not to get control of a 3D printer farm for whatever reason.  3D printing the tablets is an impractical idea that I attribute to a brain-fart on the part of the screen-writers.

[MrWhyt]

 

The plan probably really was to get surveillance hardware into all those homes too poor to provide their own computer, as explained in the show.  Not to get control of a 3D printer farm for whatever reason.

Yeah if Samaritan wanted a 3D printer farm i'm sure it could set up multiple shell companies and fronts and have how ever many it wants in it's grasp. Same with guns for that matter, it would not be hard for it to get a "legitimate" source of weapons.

[Oscirus]

I'm really annoyed at Harold's naivete!  See, here's the deal Harold since they've made you really dumb this episode. The tablets may have been all good and harmless but they are still a way of monitoring everyone in New York (at this point) and then, they can be hacked.  Or not, the info will be there for Samaritan god; and all it has to do is pick the next family member up of the nearest street corner camara.

 

I don't think Harold was naïve at all. He did go along with the plan. But his point still stands that  they just robbed under privileged kids of what was essentially a tool to help them improve themselves in life. It can be argued that  Samaritan can later access the computers but Samaritan can access computers anywhere in schools etc, so at worse they only inconvenienced the machine.

 

Ultimately, this is what I love about Finch and what separates him from everybody else. Whereas the rest of the team sees results, Finch considers and often lives with the consequences of these actions. He's pretty much been the heart of the show from day one. It's why the team is so loyal to him.

 

I am worried about Finch though. This is the third case in a row that Finch has pulled double duty. Hopefully it's just me being paranoid but that doesn't sound good for his longevity.

 

As for the case of the week, it was alright but the reveal at the end with certain team members getting caught by Samaritan is definitely an interesting development for the future.

[ABay]

Last night was the first chance I had to watch the episode. The best I can say about it right now is that at least it wasn't as bad as the one with the kids. It might seem better later in the context of the full season. Right now, I'm underwhelmed.

[basiltherat]

I think Samaritan thinks big enough that it wanted BOTH the printer farm AND the laptops.  If one didn't work, the other would; and if both did, well, all the better!   Make no small plans.

[Izeinwinter]

This seems most likely - It's not a very good way to produce tablets - a conventional assembly line would do that better, and can be automated just as easily, but if you do it with printers and automated assemblers, Samaritan still gets tablets in all those homes and can also use the facility and the steady stream of versatile components to knock of whatever custom kit it wants on zero notice. Not guns so much - it has access to however many of those it wants, but specialized - and untraceable -  drones, custom bugging kit, prototypes for entirely new technology..

 

I really love the way the show just threw in the implication that Shaw and Root have been sexual sparring partners for months now, without ever saying a word about it. The brilliant thing is that both that silence and their behavior up to this point is perfectly consistent with who they are as characters. - Root would still tease someone she was sleeping with, and Shaw would still be Shaw about it. Heck, it even makes Root getting a little bit more attached lately more in line with her character - It's the accumulated effect of intimacy. 

 

The end exchange is also just glorious. Shaw can't bring herself to admit out loud that she came to see Root, so she makes up that utterly transparent lie about needing help with the virus (She's an actual doctor. She knows more about how to do that than Finch does!). It isn't meant to fool Root, merely to save Shaw from being sappy. 

 

.. Also, this means Samaritan has to think Shaw's cover identity sleeps with every attractive brunette to cross her path. Remember, to  Samaritan Root is someone new every 3 days! 

[tv echo]

I can only take Shaw in small doses and Root in even smaller doses, so this was not one of my favorite episodes.  But every POI episode is still a cut above a lot of the crap that's on TV nowadays, so it's still a win.

[Netfoot]

Actually, a typical gold bar is 12.4 kilograms, so roughly 27 pounds, so assuming that's what each gold bar in the bag weighed a bagful would probably weigh several hundred pounds. I doubt Shaw would even be able to lift the bag much less casually toss it in the river, so it's even more ridiculous than it sounds.

 

There were 30 bars in the bag, it looked like.  30 bars at 27 lbs would be 810 lbs.  The BMW saloon they were driving might have been able to carry the load of 810 lbs plus four adults, but it would have been a strain.

 

The 27 lb. (400 oz) gold bar is about 2" by 3" and maybe 8" long.  The ones in the bag looked smaller than that -- maybe 1Kg bars?  (Maybe even smaller)  So, looks like 30 Kg or about 66 lbs.  Not impossible to lift, but not easily hurled one-handed.

 

Strangely,  it looks like Shaw simultaneously hurled two similar bags, one-handed, as if they'd been joined at the handles.  Hence 132 lbs.   Still not impossible, but not easy.  Shaw is deliciously fit, but not exactly built like the Incredible Hulk!

[mad_typist]

Was surprised and pleased that they are apparently going with Shaw/Root as an actual thing, after hinting strongly at it in S02.E05 this year. As others have said, this is a fairly chaste show, so I imagine this casual banter/flirting is as much as we'll get on that front. It's a little hard to interpret it, of course, as it's been established that Shaw suffers from suppressed/muted emotions, so while it's likely that Root loves her (in her own special psychotic way) I'm not sure we'd ever see Shaw outwardly express the same.

 

The actor they cast to play Tomas was suuuuure easy on the eyes. I wasn't as impressed with his acting, sadly, so while he had good unspoken chemistry with Sarah Shahi, I wouldn't want to see him pop up again personally.