S01.E04: 4

[HumblePi]

http://pitchfork.com/features/interviews/8853-fiona-apple/

 

This is only a side-note to this episode but the opening song in this episode made me curious about the singer. Fiona Apple is an independent artist very much out of the mainstream of the contemporary music scene. The song 'Container' just haunted me and I had to find out exactly where this bizarre but haunting music was coming from. Then I read of an interview with Fiona Apple, and I was even more intrigued. Saying that, I'll let those who may be interested in her background and career enjoy her candid interview given two years ago. 

 

http://youtu.be/6muh9kTlr88

 

 

[shelley1234]

This just occurred to me: We're understandably spending a fair amount of brain time wondering what the truth is. And we're assuming that at some point, the show will tell us. But what if the show's point of view is that there is no truth, only seven billion versions of the truth to correspond to the seven billion individuals who inhabit the planet? That would not only be interesting, it would be accurate.

 

Whatever the detective decides is the truth is only what he thinks is the truth, filtered through the lens of his own subjectivity. If it comes to a jury, whatever they decide is the truth is only what those twelve people were able to agree was the truth. In no case will any truth be truer than Noah's and Alison's truths.

 

If that's the show's truth, it will be a truth I've never seen on television before.

 

I watched Joshua Jackson on Conan last night and he said something very similar that the show highlights that there is no actual truth...just what someone experiences as their truth.  I think it is one of the things that attracts me most to the show is how there can be two vastly different recounts of the same event.  Conan mentioned what we have all mentioned numerous times over that the difference in clothes between the two stories is so dynamic and just brings you into the "he said" "she said" angle.  Josh then went on to tell Conan the other side of the horrible first date story that his girlfriend Diane Kruger told the last time she was on his show.  Ahh Joshie.  

[attica]

Another of the inconsistencies I found really interesting was the wallpaper in the hotel room. In Noah's version, the floral print is sparse, tasteful, over soothing blue tones. In Alison's version, it's rose-overload, jangly and oppressive, over a kind of gross neutral yellow. The room itself is airy in Noah's, dark and claustrophobic in Alison's. Clearly, the show is paying all kinds of attention to this kind of thing.  (Still, in neither version does the room live up to the hype of the desk clerk as 'an excellent room'.)

[HumblePi]

Another of the inconsistencies I found really interesting was the wallpaper in the hotel room. In Noah's version, the floral print is sparse, tasteful, over soothing blue tones. In Alison's version, it's rose-overload, jangly and oppressive, over a kind of gross neutral yellow. The room itself is airy in Noah's, dark and claustrophobic in Alison's. Clearly, the show is paying all kinds of attention to this kind of thing.  (Still, in neither version does the room live up to the hype of the desk clerk as 'an excellent room'.)

I have the suspicion that the writers intentionally produced a hotel room that, despite the $250 room rate, has a sparse and almost clinical vibe to it despite the quaint flowered wallpaper. It didn't have the romantic feeling of a hotel room where an affair begins.

[Former Nun]

This show is slowly but surely boring the shit out of me. I was really into it for the first two episodes, but I am rapidly losing patience. If they are going to tease the police interrogation as an Integral part of the show, then they need to give more information.

 

 

I'm with ya', DB in CMH.  I just want to know who's dead and if someone killed him/her...oh, and who's responsible.  I'm bored with the affair.  There's no chemistry between the two adulterers--or me, for that matter.   I fast-forward through most of the "romantic" scenes because I just don't care.  Ruth Wilson's mouth always bothers me--in profile she looks like Marge Simpson...actually, most Simpsons characters.  I'm sorry I'm wasting my time--and now I just wasted yours with this!

[Constantinople]

This just occurred to me: We're understandably spending a fair amount of brain time wondering what the truth is. And we're assuming that at some point, the show will tell us. But what if the show's point of view is that there is no truth, only seven billion versions of the truth to correspond to the seven billion individuals who inhabit the planet? That would not only be interesting, it would be accurate.

 

Whatever the detective decides is the truth is only what he thinks is the truth, filtered through the lens of his own subjectivity. If it comes to a jury, whatever they decide is the truth is only what those twelve people were able to agree was the truth. In no case will any truth be truer than Noah's and Alison's truths.

 

If that's the show's truth, it will be a truth I've never seen on television before.

 

That may be, but I'd still like to know:

 

1. Who the detective thinks is dead; it he thinks it was murder, suicide, or an accident; and the reasons why the detective thinks that.
2. Ditto for Noah
3. Ditto for Alison

​

Because if I don't even get that much, my truth will be that Tommy Westphall imagined everything, and I'll either stop watching or start hate watching.

[stillshimpy]

I think there's a lot of validity to the concept that there is no reality, only perception (usually stated as 'perception is reality') and that there are no universal truths when it comes to human interaction.  However, the detective thing is, once again, the detail that is such a "Wha....?  Okay, so he has to be lying to one or both and it is likely purposeful, or this is a multiple reality presentation."  There's pretty much nothing else to suggest that this show will suddenly upend things and decide it is a scifi show with Alternate Universes, so I'll stick with the former until something steers me towards the latter, I guess. 

 

I also remember an old acting technique/trick, which is that even if someone is cast as a bit player or background, to remember that in his or her character's mind, that scene is about that character.  That no one else plays the lead in our own reality.  So even if someone is simply supposed to sit quietly in the background and not draw attention or focus, it's still important to be playing a person, vs. a prop.  

 

Which is only to say that whatever the detective is up to, if the whole thing was told from his perspective he's the intrepid detective, on the case, with a mission and he doesn't really give a crap about much of anything other than doing his own job.  Despite the differing details for his personal backstory, it would seem he was just employing a common enough technique.  Offering someone a break, so they will let their guard down and then trying to catch them before the guard is back in place.  So whatever he is doing, or saying, it's more likely serving his own purpose in being there, rather than trying to bond with either Allison or Noah.  

 

He's probably single and just trying to keep them both off-balance.  

 

Funny how that was the detail that caught so much of my attention though.  I think because I'm not super intrigued by the mechanics of Noah and Allison's affair, where they did the deed and how many times, because the actual title of the series presents it as a foregone conclusion that they will have an affair and everything since the first seconds of the first episode has supported that that's where it was going.  

 

I suspect it will get more interesting now that they've gotten to the place I've known all along they would get to from the darned title.  That's where the boredom came in for me.  There was no suspense in Allison stomping away to a supposed ferry to Connecticut (or the moon, or wherever) , just as I knew that when Noah makes his noble speech (ha, ha) in the hotel room about not wanting to hurt Allison there was very little suspense in what would happen.  Never a moment of "it's not too late guys, turn back now, go home and put your lives back together and don't create a problem just so that you'll have to face fixing your lives...just fix your life without the problem creation".  It was clear, they were going to get it on.  Showtime would be all giddy with the "we can show bits and parts!" aspect of being pay cable, which meant as much skin as they could squeeze out of that definition.  

 

Oh, one thing that gave me a little bit of a "Hehehe" in all of this?  The detective allowing Allison basically one drag off of her cigarette before suggesting they go back inside.  Considering cigarettes are something like fifty thousand dollars a pack or some such sin-tax-inspired amount, that was particularly funny to me in his attempts to needle her.  

 

Just like telling a woman he knows had an affair that he's been married for longer than dirt has been around and he's still so in love was an attempt to discombobulate her, regardless of his personal truths.  

Edited November 5, 2014 by stillshimpy

[Milburn Stone]

I think part of the reason I'm starting to consider the "there is no truth, only everyone's individual truth" interpretation is Sarah Treem's involvement with the show. And when I think Sarah Treem, I think In Treatment. And when I think In Treatment, I think of a world in which every single human being has a purchase only on the truth that is uniquely his or hers. I think the recognition of this fascinates her. And I think she's exploring it again.

[taragel]

This just occurred to me: We're understandably spending a fair amount of brain time wondering what the truth is. And we're assuming that at some point, the show will tell us. But what if the show's point of view is that there is no truth, only seven billion versions of the truth to correspond to the seven billion individuals who inhabit the planet? 

 

That's the party line the cast and creators have been spouting in interviews. But....with no truth, you also have no coherent story to follow. Real life is maddening and not all that interesting because of the lack of story arcs. I'm not sure how long viewers will stick around for that. It's compelling four episodes in, but viewers are impatient...

[JudyObscure]

All of you make this show so much more interesting to me.  I want to go back and watch again for the wall-paper and the Marge Simpson lips.

 

Humble Pi I hadn't heard that there might be more seasons! If that's the case I would like to start all over from Helen's point of view.  I don't want her to have an affair of her own, because I like to think she's far above her self-centered husband.  Rather, I would like to see her gradual suspicion and the moment when she catches on, maybe even sets a trap for Noah.  Wouldn't it be interesting to see her follow them on the ferry or hide in the dress shop?

[RimaTheBirdGirl]

O Shimpy: Why do you think that the Unknown Victim is "fairly clearly not Cole?"  Because of Alison's fairly cool "I still can't believe he's gone?"  

  

And All:  here are the Fiona Apple lyrics:

  

I was screaming into the canyon
At the moment of my death
The echo I created
Outlasted my last breath

    

My voice it made an avalanche
And buried a man I never knew
And when he died his widowed bride
Met your daddy and they made you

  

[Hook:] 3x

  

I have only one thing to do and that's
To be the wave that I am and then
Sink back into the ocean

  

Sink back into the o-
Sink back into the ocean
Sink back into the o-
Sink back into the ocean
Sink back into the ocean

[Texasmom1970]

Thank you Rima the lyrics to the Fiona Apple song are interesting, I am sure I will offend her fans but the song itself makes me cringe every time I hear it st the start of an episode. Not sure why but it really bugs the hell out of me.

[stillshimpy]

O Shimpy: Why do you think that the Unknown Victim is "fairly clearly not Cole?"  Because of Alison's fairly cool "I still can't believe he's gone?"

 

Ah, but Rima, 'twas Noah's reaction that makes me believe that, if there is only one crime or suspected crime.  Noah is deep in an interrogation/interview about someone's death and openly admitting to an affair with Allison.  Discussing it in-depth, but Noah referred to the deceased in an extremely detached manner, as if that person was no one to him, "I thought 'this fella's' death was an accident?"  I think that's too removed a way to refer to his paramour's dead husband, that he's being questioned about.  He might say "I thought his death was an accident?"  but "this fella" indicates that it is someone Noah barely knew of, let alone knew.  

 

Since he's admitting to boffing another man's wife, I think Noah wouldn't feign quite that level of detachment from the whole thing if that man was dead.  "This fella" like he can't remember his name or a man he only encountered in passing doesn't fit for the spouse of his married lover.  

 

However, someone already figured out what might possibly account for that:  There might be more than one death and Noah only thinks he's there to talk about the guy run down on the road, vs. Cole's death, which is possible.  

Edited November 6, 2014 by stillshimpy

[Ellaria]

That's the party line the cast and creators have been spouting in interviews. But....with no truth, you also have no coherent story to follow. Real life is maddening and not all that interesting because of the lack of story arcs. I'm not sure how long viewers will stick around for that. It's compelling four episodes in, but viewers are impatient...

 

Agree. At some point, the show will have to arrive at an "accepted" version of the truth. It may be the detective's interpretation of the truth. Or it may be something that is revealed only to the audience. Long term, I'm not sure that it would be satisfying to remain in truth limbo.

 

Ruth Wilson's mouth always bothers me--in profile she looks like Marge Simpson...actually, most Simpsons characters.  I'm sorry I'm wasting my time--and now I just wasted yours with this!

 

You didn't waste my time because I agree...I just hesitated posting about it.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Ellaria Sand

[Milburn Stone]

That's the party line the cast and creators have been spouting in interviews...

 

Of course, the use of the word "spouting," not to mention "party line," carries a pejorative flavor. What if it's the case that the reason the cast and creators are talking this way is that it's actually the concept of the show? (As I'm coming to believe, independently, since I haven't seen or read any cast or crew talking about it.) I.e., not a bug, but a feature.

 

There may be many who don't like that about the show, just as there are those who find it the one thing that makes the show different from all others and therefore interesting.

Edited November 6, 2014 by Milburn Stone

[RimaTheBirdGirl]

O O Shimpy,  thank you.  I stand convinced, and had forgotten that "this fella'" came from Noah.  That would be an unlikely phrase from the cuckolder.  Absent TPTB messing with our expectations.  

 

I actually enjoy not knowing the victim.  Reverse who-dunnit.  And its puzzle-quality sets off so well the contrasting responses to the pathos.  Because Alison breaks my heart.  

 

Although I do think that if I knew what went on inside her, I might be terrified.  I find her variable and unfathomable.

 

 (And now I keep thinking of Cinderfella.) 

[taragel]

Of course, the use of the word "spouting," not to mention "party line," carries a pejorative flavor. What if it's the case that the reason the cast and creators are talking this way is that it's actually the concept of the show? (As I'm coming to believe, independently, since I haven't seen or read any cast or crew talking about it.) I.e., not a bug, but a feature.

 

There may be many who don't like that about the show, just as there are those who find it the one thing that makes the show different from all others and therefore interesting.

 

I suppose it could sound slightly pejorative though it wasn't really my intention. But perhaps it's a subconscious disdain, because I'm very firmly of the opinion that stories should have a storyline, and not be amorphous and completely ambiguous because to me that makes them ultimately pointless. I think it's a little bit pretentious to imply that there is no verifiable truth to your story and a bit of a cheat. Why include the framing device of the detective/crime if that's not going to pay off, you know? We could learn their memories of the affair in an entirely different way -- like therapy sessions as someone suggested. 

 

Then again, maybe they'll be the first show to set up mysteries, not pay them off, and yet the execution will be so good that viewers won't care. (And for the record, I loved the Lost finale and didn't give a crap that they hadn't explained things....but I was not in the majority there.) 

 

But that being said, hey seem to have at least some idea/structure in mind to fill three seasons so I'm eager to find out what that is. At four episodes in, I'm curious as to how they'll continue to make a very banal affair compelling enough to stretch 30+ episodes.

Edited November 6, 2014 by taragel

[Boundary]

It's kinda clever that after 4 episodes we don't know who died but it's beginning to bug me because without a victim, you really don't have a killer. And without both, ultimately you don't have a mystery, you just have hot air. The affair itself is a fairly familiar concept and each POV will have conflict/drama from each respective family but all in all it's something we've all seen somewhere else. Unless the affair itself ends badly and gets embroiled in the murder investigation, in which case it becomes an interesting "she-said, he-said", I don't see how this show can fill 30 episodes.

[briochetwist]

 

Finally, if we we're going to have all these high def close ups of kissing, they should have cast an actor with an upper lip that moved.  It's like watching a Muppet kiss.

 

Does she remind anyone else of Marge Simpson, or is that just me?

[Bcharmer]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I remember it being the detective who used the word "fella."  He said something like,"We want to find out who killed (or murdered) this fella."  To which Noah replied, "I thought it was an accident."  Between that, and Alison's "I can't believe he's gone" pretty much eliminated Cole, Noah's father-in-law, or any female (obviously), as the deceased. 

[stillshimpy]

You're almost certainly right on that, bcharmer, I only ever watch once on this particular show and whereas the phrasing really stood out to me -- because it would be a weird way to put that if the victim was Cole and they were there discussing an affair with Cole's wife in-depth -- but you're right, I may be placing the line in the wrong character's mouth.  

 

I think it still is too off-hand and casual if the interview was about Cole's death, but perhaps it's purposefully misleading.  

[Bcharmer]

Exactly, Shimpy...  the "fella" remark, and the detective also referring to the dead guy as "the victim" makes it way too casual for it to be Cole. I realize they had to dance around a bit with the dialog to avoid saying the person's name, trying to keep it as mysterious as possible, for as long as possible... but it did give me the impression it wasn't anyone emotionally close to either Noah or Alison.  At first, I thought they might be talking about the brother in law, Scotty, but it could also be her boss (whatsisname).

[Muffyn]

Now you all have me voting for fish guy as the victim.  He's about as tertiary as a character can be.  

 

OK, so I want to ask this somewhere.  In real life, has any man every lifted a woman up from the bed while in mid thrust and put her up against a wall to continue the act?  I understand that they wanted to get them to the position where she would be standing and see herself in the mirror.  I just question the practicality and safety of that maneuver.  Having had a quite a bit of experience in this arena myself, I can say no one, no matter how enthusiastic or well within the throes of passion, has ever hoisted me up that way.  

 

And yes, she has Marge Simpson lips.  They probably should stop giving us so many profile shots.

Edited November 9, 2014 by Muffyn

[Espy]

Hahaha Muffyn - I chalk that one up to "looks fun on camera, dangerous in real life".

 

I wondered the same thing while I was watching that scene.

[stillshimpy]

I have a feeling that particular move is usually pulled off with a lot more mutual cooperation or resulting trips to the emergency rooms or chiropractors. Possibly both with a stop off at Walgreens for some icy hot/Advil/Ace Bandages.  Also, only in movies and on TV are there spaces of wall completely devoid of a) pictures b) light switches/thermostats/window frames or sills. 

 

And without going into too much darned detail, I dated a competitive body builder in college and I leave it to you all to figure out if I am speaking from my back's ability to find out how much a light switch to the spine really, really doesn't fuel passion or not.   

 

Circus sex.  Sure, it looks fun onscreen, but it ought to come with a disclaimer at the bottom of the screen that, if it doesn't read "do not attempt at home, professionals on a closed set" ought to probably suggest some pillows or "be sure to lift with your legs" ...or something.  

[Muffyn]

I went over this maneuver in detail with Dr. Muffyn over the phone (He's out of the country at the moment).  After way too much back and forth explaining this, he finally decided it's a quick path to a fractured penis.  Then he had to stop thinking about fractured penises.  This did not lead to a hot and heavy phone sex conversation.  

 

Stillshimpy, light switch to the spine - ow!  I will, however, try to fit "circus sex" into conversation from now on. 

[jeansheridan]

One detail I loved was how the hotel room had different wallpaper and furniture in their versions. Allison's version the room is much more claustrophobic and dingier. It is that level of detail that intrigues me.

I found Noah' s response to her son's death thoughtful and maybe too perfect. He asked all the right questions.

I agree that the chemistry is not typical but I think that makes sense. This is not a fun affair. Allison is depressed. Noah is unfulfilled. In some ways they are playing at being happy. This doesn't have the joy of a fling. I find it interesting. A slow moving disaster.

[Muffyn]

I just rewatched this episode.  Noah really is a self-centered dick.  He is just sooooo distraught about wanting to fuck Allison.  She should have left him on the island.  And $250 for a hotel room.  He could have gotten a hooker for much less.  OK, since my mind is no longer on the circus sex (TM StillShimpy); I am back to my cranky self.   Noah had better not show up on my lawn.  

[JudyObscure]

I watched this one again yesterday. It's so different without the tension of thinking they might get caught at any moment on Block Island. This time I actually thought I was watching two people fall in love. Alison was so tender with Noah after he told her about his mother's MS and he was perfect with her when she told him about Gabrielle. When she asked him if he looked at her now and just saw death, something passed between them that was very reassuring to her. I think these two have found someone who loves them just as they are at this point in their lives. Alison doesn't want to control Noah, but actually likes for him to take charge, something he didn't particularly want when he was newly married to Helen but is ready and eager for now. Noah sees her darkness and loves her more for it, he isn't asking her to be the young, light hearted person she once was and can never be again. None of this is Helen's or Cole's fault but it helps me see why Noah and Alison were willing to hurt so many people to be together.

[Boundary]

I rewatched this last week as well and my experience of it was different too. First time I watched I was exasperated by the toing and froing but I actually was more sympathetic second time around. Especially that moment in the bar when Noah gets the phone call from Helen, after he hangs up there's this loaded silence when Alison recognizes that the mood has changed. She then gets pissed off when he brushes her off. I was initially really annoyed by that scene but last week I loved it. There's a tonne of non verbal communication in that scene that I just liked.

 

This was the first of two fights they had. This one was his fault and they made up when he implicitly apologized at the clothing store. The second fight was her fault, they made up when she explained her situation. It's ironic how those arguments cement their relationship, it's a result of freer communication compared to their respective marriages. 

 

 I think these two have found someone who loves them just as they are at this point in their lives. Alison doesn't want to control Noah, but actually likes for him to take charge, something he didn't particularly want when he was newly married to Helen but is ready and eager for now. 

 

Agree. It's actually a theme throughout the whole season that Alison doesn't want to control him, she never makes demands on him (even though he continually does so himself) and I think he appreciates that. It's a thin line between wanting to be a knight in shining amour, a messiah complex if you will, and just wanting to support someone. I think it's the latter for Noah, even though it's easy to interpret him as being egotistical. When she asked him "what do you see now?" he doesn't verbally answer her because it's not about him and how he sees her, rather it's about how she sees herself. She's standing under this dark cloud and probably just wanted some reassurance that she's not alone.

 

None of this is Helen's or Cole's fault but it helps me see why Noah and Alison were willing to hurt so many people to be together.

 

Noah and Alison's story often gets buried under the avalanche of criticism of their actions but sometimes it's good to see that the writers have made an effort of showing why these two would decide to shatter their families. It's subtle though, it's easy to assume it's all about lust (2 sex scenes plus 1 interrupted one in this episode alone) but this episode was the first one to make an attempt at showing that the connection was deeper.

Edited December 27, 2014 by Boundary

[minimilah]

It's ironic how those arguments cement their relationship, it's a result of freer communication compared to their respective marriages.

i was thinking this, too. their communication is MUCH better than the communication they had in their marriages. they're more open to each other, they talk, they communicate, they pay attention to each other, they work things out. i feel like there is no unresolved stuff there.

that's why i'm under the impression that those things that "ruined" their 1st marriages (finances, inlaws, tragedy) - those things would bring alison and noah closer together.

just like someone else wrote - they love each other just the way they are. it's like alison and noah both discovered and "freed" their true selves when they met each other. i always felt how comfortable they are in their scenes together, they just look so right. and i wish we had more scenes of that "rightness".

for me, it was the hospital scene when alison's grandma died where i was like - that's really IT for them. they found each other and that's IT.

[Higgs]

Pilot (very early)

Helen and Noah:

Look at me. Open your eyes. Look at me. [breathing heavily] [Moaning] What? [Laughs] What? Nothing. Why are you laughing? It's... [Laughs] What? Nothing. What are you laughing at? Your face is a little funny, that's all. [Laughs] Sorry. I'm sorry. No, you're not. Come on. I am. Oh, come on! Don't. Are you pissed? A little. Don't be pissed. Come on. [Murmurs] Shh. You can't laugh. I know. I won't laugh anymore. I won't laugh. Come on.

Ep 4 (last lines spoken)

Noah:

"Alison, I'm a grown man. I know what I want.

....

Look at me. Look at me. Look at me."

Watch Alison and Noah "look at" each other in their sex scenes, and it's all one needs to know. It's legitimate to argue that, of course, sex with a new partner is almost always more exciting than with any spouse of 25 years, maybe even more so because of its illicit nature. But what if the intense emotional connection that Noah achieved with Alison was much greater than what he ever had with Helen? We have not been given the answer to that question, but it should be obvious how I would bet, the only uncertainty being the odds I would offer.

Edited December 27, 2014 by Higgs

[truthaboutluv]

i was thinking this, too. their communication is MUCH better than the communication they had in their marriages. they're more open to each other, they talk, they communicate, they pay attention to each other, they work things out. i feel like there is no unresolved stuff there.

 

 

I have just started binge watching this show and judging by the entire comment, I'm guessing this is in relation to the whole season which I haven't seen it yet. But that said, just based on this episode, I definitely do not see that and don't get that to this point in their relationship. Honestly, I think there is some level of honesty between them because they are at that point where there is no expectation - he won't leave his wife, she won't leave her husband, so there's really nothing to lose and/or nothing truly at stake. But I certainly don't think that means there is this amazing communication between them. 

 

I don't see great communication and openness between those two. I see two people both wanting an escape - her from her pain (we saw this in the first episode when she asked Cole to make it stop) and him from his life and more particularly feelings of inadequacy. It also fits with their perceptions of the past - how Noah seemed to remember Alison as this almost scarlet temptress practically throwing herself at him. Because why not, it fed his ego and allowed him to not be Noah, guy with four kids who is practically under the thumb of his wife's parents.

 

As for Alison, while I can sympathize with her loss and her grief, that's the thing with our individual memories and issues. In other words, she remembers her pain, her loss, people wanting her to be better and okay for them. However, someone else lost a child. It wasn't just her loss and we get no perspective from Cole, so sure she seems more sympathetic. But what about this guy who lost his son too and has a wife checked out on him and then she goes and bangs some other guy. 

 

Ultimately, at this point in the show, I feel like we're seeing two people who on some level are clearly trying to justify their affair and this is what has been the bulk of the discussions here - how much of it was real and just their perception of reality, again to justify their actions. Was Noah's kids really that bad, his in-laws that awful, was Cole really so removed from Alison or was she not letting him try to help her, etc. Was it really some amazing connection with a person they could be themselves with or just two people who didn't want to deal with their current lives and found a way to escape?

 

I think also, the thing about a storyline like this is obviously we're seeing the beginnings of their story so it would of course seem like they get each other at this point, see each other better than anyone else because in comparisons, both of their relationship with their spouse, have years of history, strains, arguments, etc. on them.  But there is a reason many people who have affairs who get together ultimately break up later because the relationship doesn't always stay new and eventually some of that some restlessness, issues that affected the first marriage, creep back up. 

Edited December 31, 2014 by truthaboutluv

[Higgs]

truthaboutlove, you cannot imagine the deep regret I feel in not being able to disagree with a single word you wrote. As you suggested, the vast difference in assuredness between you, who have not yet seen the entire S1, and the last group,of posters, is that you are evaluating the predictive nature of what is shown in the first episodes, while our snotty little group are going back to understand why it ended the way it did. I look forward to your post-binge reevaluation.

If it's truth about love that anyone might be interested in, especially as it concerns an "affair", I recommend without reservation, "Stoner", by John Williams, which I just finished reading. The characters and contexts are nothing like this show, but (most of) you will cry.

Edited December 31, 2014 by Higgs

[truthaboutluv]

I look forward to your post-binge reevaluation.

 

 

Did it in the episode 10 thread and all I'll say, as to not spoil those doing a binge watch like me, is that none of my feelings changed one bit. So I guess I'm sort of happy to feel justified in my feelings and observations.

[SlackerInc]

I'm kind of over these people though. 

 

Oh wow, I thought this was the best episode yet--and I had already really liked the first three.  I'm completely swept up in their dizzying romance (almost literally dizzying).  I found it heart-poundingly intense, an adrenaline rush, as well--so the complaints I'm reading of it being boring (not from you but from others) are also mystifying to me.

[Jax7917]

I'm new to the show..

I just wish they had attractive leading actors so I can find out what is so desirable about either one of  them. The show is trying to make Alison seem like a beauty, but no. Just no.

I just finished this episode and I know there are 2-3 other seasons. I do wonder how far they can take this story line.