S48.E05: Master Class in Deception

[Nashville]

3 hours ago, KeithJ said:

She did not tell Star she should sit out.  They were talking that they had to sit someone during the challenge. Eva said they couldn't sit the three strong members of the tribe and then she said they needed the other two for puzzles. That left Star. She then said "Maybe we can sit Star?".  I don't think she had any mean intentions there.  Just because the truth hurts someone's feelings (Star wasn't one of the strong players and wasn't good at puzzles) doesn't mean someone is being mean to them.

In the same episode where Eva made this comment I seem to recall specific mention being made that Star (by her own admission) either couldn’t swim or couldn’t swim well - which makes me wonder/suspect if (a) Eva’s question was posed as part of a discussion about who to sit out should the next comp be water-based or swimming-intensive, and (b) that somewhat significant bit of contextual reference got left (deliberately?) on the cutting room floor.

[PaperTree]

8 hours ago, seacliffsal said:

Okay, i've looked around and, yep, I'm alone at a table for one.  Sigh.  But, here goes...

I thought the Eva segment went on for far too long.  Jeff really does forget that his talk show tanked and was cancelled.  Therefore, I do not understand why he wants to turn a once top-rated show (Survivor) into a low-rated cancelled show (his talk show). ......

I'll join you at that table😎

4 hours ago, fishcakes said:

Now we mostly only see strategy and plotting and I think it really affects how people coming into the game think it must be played ruthlessly at all times.

And endless idol/advantage/whatever hunting.

[iMonrey]

4 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

And on the subject of Cedrek and Sai, in hindsight I don’t think I blame him so much for Sai staying as I do Bianca.

I blame both. Bianca should have kept her mouth shut but that doesn't mean it wasn't a dumb move on Cedrek's part. He'd already very nearly voted out Sai once before. There was no reason on earth to think she was his best ally in the game. 

3 hours ago, princelina said:

Well they've already had a deaf person, a one-legged girl, and probably others I forget.  Anyone "different" is going to be a small spectacle - should they not cast them?  

You raise a good point. I guess maybe for me the difference is how the story is handled. They really, really made a big freaking deal out of turning this into a "very special episode" in a way they haven't with other firsts you mentioned. An entire half hour segment with no commercial break? It was really that groundbreaking? I mean, if the point here is to say "See! They can do what anyone else can do!" then why this big to-do about how big a deal it was that she did it? It's like they're talking out both sides of the mouth by saying "she can anything anyone else can do" and at the same time "what a historic moment for the show that she did it."

[Tango64]

17 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

They really, really made a big freaking deal out of turning this into a "very special episode" in a way they haven't with other firsts you mentioned. An entire half hour segment with no commercial break? It was really that groundbreaking? I mean, if the point here is to say "See! They can do what anyone else can do!" then why this big to-do about how big a deal it was that she did it? It's like they're talking out both sides of the mouth by saying "she can anything anyone else can do" and at the same time "what a historic moment for the show that she did it."

Yes. I like Eva and I'm sympathetic to the challenges she lives with, but yes, this.

[Chicago Redshirt]

I apparently dozed off during the middle of the episode where Eva had her issues during the challenge and woke up as Joe was helping ground her. Nothing against the episode or the issue...just a function of my not having gotten a lot of sleep lately, episodes going for 2 hours, me being old etc.

So maybe I'll go back and see what happened and have the tears flow, or maybe I'll be a cynical bastard.

In any event, I would have thought that all players involved would be looking to boot Joe and Eva ASAP, since if either gets to FTC, they are likely to win based on that display alone.

Instead, Eva gets essentially gifted an immunity idol. Yes, arguably Eva deserves it because she was the one who solved the puzzle. But why hand her something to protect her even more as the merge is (semi-obviously) on the horizon? 

And why do it so publicly where all the people of that tribe now know that she has an idol?

Sometimes I really don't understand how players play this game.

[violet and green]

2 hours ago, Nashville said:

In the same episode where Eva made this comment I seem to recall specific mention being made that Star (by her own admission) either couldn’t swim or couldn’t swim well - which makes me wonder/suspect if (a) Eva’s question was posed as part of a discussion about who to sit out should the next comp be water-based or swimming-intensive, and (b) that somewhat significant bit of contextual reference got left (deliberately?) on the cutting room floor.

Yeah, I saw a secret scene where one of the other tribes got treemail and there was one of those little parchments with a rhyming thing telling them about that upcoming challenge and it was full of water puns and obviously involved swimming - and I also read somewhere that Star had only learnt to swim two weeks before coming on Survivor. (As she immediately volunteered to sit out the swimming-involved challenge on this ep, that kind of underlines that.)

Without context, Eva may have seemed blunt, or she may well be blunt in her presentation in general - but factually, if someone knows they are a weak swimmer it is best to sit out swimming challenges if they can manage to logistically, or also if they are worried about going in the ocean, which to some degree Star clearly is. She's great in landbased/running challenges.

[princelina]

4 hours ago, iMonrey said:

You raise a good point. I guess maybe for me the difference is how the story is handled. They really, really made a big freaking deal out of turning this into a "very special episode" in a way they haven't with other firsts you mentioned. An entire half hour segment with no commercial break? It was really that groundbreaking? I mean, if the point here is to say "See! They can do what anyone else can do!" then why this big to-do about how big a deal it was that she did it? It's like they're talking out both sides of the mouth by saying "she can anything anyone else can do" and at the same time "what a historic moment for the show that she did it."

What can I say - it was a feel-good moment and that usually makes for good tv - I can see why they kept it and made a fuss over it 😊

3 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Instead, Eva gets essentially gifted an immunity idol. Yes, arguably Eva deserves it because she was the one who solved the puzzle. But why hand her something to protect her even more as the merge is (semi-obviously) on the horizon? 

And why do it so publicly where all the people of that tribe now know that she has an idol?

Star seems like a sweet person, but definitely not a Survivor genius! 😄

[LadyChatts]

21 hours ago, TVFan1 said:

I wonder if the alliance of Joe, Shauhin, Kamilla, and Kyle will continue together through the merge recruiting more allies. I can get behind that.

 

There was a deleted scene posted on Reddit where Kamilla talks about loving Joe and Shauhin more than her old tribe (minus Kyle of course).  While on Civa, there was an alliance between Kyle, Kamilla, David, and Chrissy.  I'm curious if this will be a case where those 4 reunite and bring in Shauhin, Joe, and Eva, leaving Vula and Star/Charity/Mitch on their own (although I really can't believe anyone is going to want to keep Joe/Eva long term, unless they just want to hand them the $1 million).  I'm honestly curious where Star, Mitch, and Charity find themselves, as I don't know if they all realized just how on the outs they were with their former tribes. 

[tv echo]

Here's something else that made me believe that the producers were pushing Eva to have an "episode" - instead of allowing each team to decide who would handle each part of a challenge (like when they've had to throw balls in a hoop or atop a tower), this time each one of the team members on each team was responsible for putting one ball in one slot. Therefore, Eva could not be helped or replaced by anyone on her team, when she started having trouble getting her ball in the slot. Kudos to her team for not getting mad or frustrated at her. Major kudos to Eva for finally getting the ball in the slot. 

[Tachi Rocinante]

The Eva bit was heartbreaking and yet heartfelt at the same time. Kudos to Joe.  It also went on waaay to long, especially her wailing - they could have cut it off earlier, but they were definitely milking it in post.

Cedrek is like a few doctors I know personally - absolute professionals and geniuses in their chosen field, but borderline simpletons everywhere else.  I wouldn't be surprised if he was on the spectrum.

If Mitch gets underestimated, I can see him going far.

[SG429]

1 hour ago, Tachi Rocinante said:

The Eva bit was heartbreaking

And we can only shudder at how this would have played out had she lost

[KittyMom4]

3 hours ago, tv echo said:

instead of allowing each team to decide who would handle each part of a challenge (like when they've had to throw balls in a hoop or atop a tower), this time each one of the team members on each team was responsible for putting one ball in one slot.

I for one like this rule, mainly because it eliminates one person getting blamed for losing the challenge for the team and in the same breath, one person taking credit for winning the challenge for the team. It also keeps the player who thinks he/she is the best shot, best puzzler, etc from not allowing anyone else to take over. 

[iMonrey]

5 hours ago, KittyMom4 said:

I for one like this rule, mainly because it eliminates one person getting blamed for losing the challenge for the team and in the same breath, one person taking credit for winning the challenge for the team. It also keeps the player who thinks he/she is the best shot, best puzzler, etc from not allowing anyone else to take over. 

But ultimately Sai lost the challenge for Civa when it came down to her versus Eva, so wouldn't she get the blame? (Not that I care.) I mean I understand what you're getting at but I don't think it really solves the problem of it coming down to one person.

[Sunnykm]

I also liked this challenge because they each had to put a ball in the slot.  So many times one strong, athletic or a great puzzler will win the challenge and it puts a target on their back.

[blackwing]

Maybe I just haven't been paying attention, but am I the only one who didn't even realise there was a Bianca?  She was the one who talked about how with Thomas gone, she is way less of a thread, right?  She was a threat???  In whose mind other than her own?

I don't feel sorry for her at all.  She engineered her own exit by opening her mouth.  Chrissy realised it instantly and told Sai that Bianca was lying to them all.

I know people get upset when they get voted out.  We have seen people sobbing on the way from TC along the exit path (like the Indian girl from last year).  But this is one of the few times where I think the ousted contestant pretty much instantly sobs as soon as the announcement is made and throughout the torch snuffing.

Bianca was a legend in her own mind.

I don't understand why Sai gave Eva the idol.  I don't understand why Sai told the ENTIRE tribe she had a clue she couldn't figure out.  How about picking the person you trust the most and work on it with them?  She acted like it was a tribe idol.  Then she gave it to Eva because Eva solved it.  Other people have solved idol clues for others (even in this very season), it doesn't mean they need to automatically give up the idol.

I think part of it is that Eva solved it and part of it is because of the autistic episode.

If people are smart, they will target Joe or Eva next.  If Eva makes it to the end, she will win without a doubt.

On 3/26/2025 at 9:07 PM, tvfanatic13 said:

So these words actually came out of Peachy’s mouth: once your balls drop, you can move onto the next phase, as in life. He I actually comparing the challenge to testicles dropping. 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️

I feel like Jeffy was trolling us, he must be reading these boards or TWoP, because some of us have been talking for years and years about how much Jeffy loves balls.  The bigger the better, especially if on a hunky (usually white) alpha male.  So when he said this, I actually rewound and listened twice hahaha.

Jeffy loves the individual immunity portion of the competition, because then he can lovingly talk about the alpha males' balls.  I think this year his targets are clearly David and Joe.

[Rodney]

32 minutes ago, blackwing said:

I don't understand why Sai gave Eva the idol.  I don't understand why Sai told the ENTIRE tribe she had a clue she couldn't figure out. 

Because Sai didn't do that.  Star did.

[blackwing]

53 minutes ago, Rodney said:

Because Sai didn't do that.  Star did.

Ah thanks for the correction.  But the spirit of the question remains the same... why did Star feel like she had to gift the idol to Eva?  People have had help obtaining an idol in past seasons and no one ever feels like they had to hand it over.  In fact, some have talked about how it is a shared idol but it really belongs to the person who has it in their pocket.

[Rodney]

45 minutes ago, blackwing said:

Ah thanks for the correction.  But the spirit of the question remains the same... why did Star feel like she had to gift the idol to Eva?  People have had help obtaining an idol in past seasons and no one ever feels like they had to hand it over.  In fact, some have talked about how it is a shared idol but it really belongs to the person who has it in their pocket.

Because Star felt like Eva was the one who earned it for solving the puzzle.

[tv echo]

CBS is re-airing this episode tonight for maximum exploitation.

BTW, I'm not alone in suspecting producer manipulation - here's a recent post by Coby from Survivor Palau...
 

When the producers cast Eva, they did not know that she and Joe would form such a close relationship. So, unless they were irresponsible, production had to have prepared for how to deal if Eva had an episode during filming. Now we'll never know what would have happened or what Joe would or would not have done if Jeff hadn't spoken.

[KeithJ]

I thought Jeff made it clear why he asked Joe if he wanted to go over and hug Eva.  It sounded like he wasn’t allowed to and it was against the rules (something about keeping tribes separate after challenges).  If Joe wasn’t allowed to go over and hug Eva, of course Jeff had to give him permission to.  Could he have just gone over anyway?  Probably. 

[realitytvfan1017]

On 3/26/2025 at 9:30 PM, Rodney said:

And with that, the entire Thomas/Bianca duo is eliminated back-to-back.  But unlike with Thomas, I wanted to hug Bianca so badly.  She was devastated.

But at the same time, she shouldn't have blabbed to Cedrek, of all people, about not having a vote.  He and Chrissy clearly voted her out after she did that.

That moment with Eva was uncomfortable, but . . . surprisingly powerful.  It might've exposed both her and Joe's games, though.

But Eva got an ally in Star (after having been enemies with her) and an idol for her troubles!  Good for her!

Sai survives again.  Ugh.  I have a love-hate thing with her, so it's bittersweet for me.

Merge (or "earn the merge") next week!  Awesome!

Bianca made a bad decision but Cedrik’s wasn’t much better imo. Why was Mitch out of the loop about the vote? I hope they explain next week. Who do we think is the mergatory vote next week?

On 3/26/2025 at 9:30 PM, Rodney said:

And with that, the entire Thomas/Bianca duo is eliminated back-to-back.  But unlike with Thomas, I wanted to hug Bianca so badly.  She was devastated.

But at the same time, she shouldn't have blabbed to Cedrek, of all people, about not having a vote.  He and Chrissy clearly voted her out after she did that.

That moment with Eva was uncomfortable, but . . . surprisingly powerful.  It might've exposed both her and Joe's games, though.

But Eva got an ally in Star (after having been enemies with her) and an idol for her troubles!  Good for her!

Sai survives again.  Ugh.  I have a love-hate thing with her, so it's bittersweet for me.

Merge (or "earn the merge") next week!  Awesome!

The Eva and Joe moment was so touching but exposed their games. Wonder if having the idol now will hurt or help Eva’s game. I wonder how this will help Star going forward.

On 3/26/2025 at 10:28 PM, Rodney said:

And yet she was smart enough to take the opportunity offered to her to switch to Bianca.  She wasn't so fixated that she was unwilling to switch targets.  Had she stayed on Sai, then yes, I'd agree.  But she switched, so I do not.

I just don’t see any of these players making it to the end, I have to agree with the OP on that. 

[realitytvfan1017]

On 3/27/2025 at 1:01 AM, TVFan1 said:

Bianca did do this to herself. If she would have kept quiet about not having a vote, then probably either Sai or Chrissy would have gone home. As soon as she told Cedrek, I knew she was done.

Got a little emotional over the Eva and Joe scene. The preview made it seem more hype than it really was, though. I didn't think Star would give Eva the idol.

I wonder if the alliance of Joe, Shauhin, Kamilla, and Kyle will continue together through the merge recruiting more allies. I can get behind that.

 

Love this new Vula four. Hope they stick together.

On 3/27/2025 at 2:00 AM, Skooma said:

Mitch is the ONLY person on that tribe that gets anything done in the challenges.  He is incredible.  He had to get all three balls in that net thing himself.  Nobody else came close.  Heck, Cedrek managed to shoot his ball backwards.

And about Cedrek.  Why didn't he vote out Sai?  He could have had a nice group of three other people to work with instead of a woman who plans to kick him to the curb as soon as she can. 

He doesn't read people at all if he doesn't know Sai is big time pissed at him already.  And since he didn't tell her about this vote beforehand and he obviously told her most recent nemesis, Chrissy, she will now be big time double pissed at him.

Good for Mary getting to celebrate a win.  Bad on Sai for being a sore loser.  Hey, Sai, you were the one who had to bail out once and then the second try you failed too.  You cost your team the lose.

And of course if Sai didn't go all diva and demand to "rest" at the super  easy reward challenge; she could have sat out the immunity challenge instead.  The one she screwed up.

I revise my opinion, Mitch is the only bright spot on that tribe.

On 3/27/2025 at 2:00 AM, Skooma said:

Mitch is the ONLY person on that tribe that gets anything done in the challenges.  He is incredible.  He had to get all three balls in that net thing himself.  Nobody else came close.  Heck, Cedrek managed to shoot his ball backwards.

And about Cedrek.  Why didn't he vote out Sai?  He could have had a nice group of three other people to work with instead of a woman who plans to kick him to the curb as soon as she can. 

He doesn't read people at all if he doesn't know Sai is big time pissed at him already.  And since he didn't tell her about this vote beforehand and he obviously told her most recent nemesis, Chrissy, she will now be big time double pissed at him.

Good for Mary getting to celebrate a win.  Bad on Sai for being a sore loser.  Hey, Sai, you were the one who had to bail out once and then the second try you failed too.  You cost your team the lose.

And of course if Sai didn't go all diva and demand to "rest" at the super  easy reward challenge; she could have sat out the immunity challenge instead.  The one she screwed up.

I’m hoping Sai is blowing up her place in the game and is the mergatory vote.

On 3/27/2025 at 4:24 AM, Rodney said:

In fairness, she's not the only one after Charity.  Nearly all of the original Civas save for Mitch are, too.

I’m curious what it is about Charity they don’t like, I don’t know much about her yet to make an opinion. I was trying to watch her reaction after what happened with Eva to see if I can get any insight.

[realitytvfan1017]

On 3/27/2025 at 7:29 PM, violet and green said:

Yeah, I saw a secret scene where one of the other tribes got treemail and there was one of those little parchments with a rhyming thing telling them about that upcoming challenge and it was full of water puns and obviously involved swimming - and I also read somewhere that Star had only learnt to swim two weeks before coming on Survivor. (As she immediately volunteered to sit out the swimming-involved challenge on this ep, that kind of underlines that.)

Without context, Eva may have seemed blunt, or she may well be blunt in her presentation in general - but factually, if someone knows they are a weak swimmer it is best to sit out swimming challenges if they can manage to logistically, or also if they are worried about going in the ocean, which to some degree Star clearly is. She's great in landbased/running challenges.

I think the whole initial Star and Eva rivalry was due to a lot of miscommunication on both parts and they both seriously misjudged each other.

[fishcakes]

5 hours ago, blackwing said:

why did Star feel like she had to gift the idol to Eva?  People have had help obtaining an idol in past seasons and no one ever feels like they had to hand it over.  In fact, some have talked about how it is a shared idol but it really belongs to the person who has it in their pocket.

I am puzzled by that as well, but how I read the whole thing is that Star knew that Eva had been against her (really, everyone was against Star, but Eva was the only one on her old tribe that Star had never told about finding the Beware advantage), but going by her THs after the IC, I think Star felt like she understood Eva better and because she also has autistic relatives felt close to and positive about her. I think she misinterpreted Eva's solving the puzzle as Eva wanting to help her and not Eva just wanting to solve the puzzle, and giving her the idol was pure generosity. What took me aback was that there was no hesitation on Eva's part to take it, no, "are you sure?" or "okay, but this is our idol" or "this will be a tribe idol," just "OKAY, THANKS."

2 hours ago, tv echo said:

BTW, I'm not alone in suspecting producer manipulation - here's a recent post by Coby from Survivor Palau...

LOL, "the Stephenie of the New Era" is some shade. Stephenie was beloved by viewers in Palau but grew more and more disliked in subsequent seasons.

Edited Saturday at 03:39 PM by fishcakes

[PhoneCop]

Regarding Jeff and his fixation on BALLS:

Quote

The On Fire podcast is back for Survivor 48, with producer Jeff Wolfe. Wolfe starts by mocking Probst for the latter’s challenge commentary, particularly when balls are involved. Probst admits he can’t help himself and that the fourth grader inside of him takes over. “I have a limited wit; it expands to about like the seventh grade. So, if there’s a chance to make a joke about balls, I have to. I mean, it’s truly the limits of my comedy.”

Edited Saturday at 07:44 PM by PhoneCop

[jsm1125]

I know people think Bianca was an idiot for telling Cedric about her lost vote, but Justin didn’t tell anyone about his lost vote, and Cedric voted him out anyway. Bianca has stated in exit interviews that Cedric told her about Justin’s lost vote. 

So does Cedric just not want to work with people who lose their votes? Unless we get a flashback next episode, I think we won’t see Cedric’s reasoning for this vote because it doesn’t shine too great a light on production: the forced vote loss via a game of chance should never have happened, and Bianca and Justin got fucked because of it. 

Edited Saturday at 08:25 PM by jsm1125

[Nashville]

8 hours ago, tv echo said:

CBS is re-airing this episode tonight for maximum exploitation.

BTW, I'm not alone in suspecting producer manipulation - here's a recent post by Coby from Survivor Palau...
 

When the producers cast Eva, they did not know that she and Joe would form such a close relationship. So, unless they were irresponsible, production had to have prepared for how to deal if Eva had an episode during filming. Now we'll never know what would have happened or what Joe would or would not have done if Jeff hadn't spoken.

“Unless“…?  😆

 

6 hours ago, realitytvfan1017 said:

I think the whole initial Star and Eva rivalry was due to a lot of miscommunication on both parts and they both seriously misjudged each other.

In truth I’ve been suspecting for a while now that much of the animosity directed towards Eva may have been based on her tribemates’ ignorance regarding her autism.  I’ve noticed Eva’s MO tends to be she generally doesn’t show a lot of personal animation or expressiveness towards any individual unless/until she’s engaged in direct conversation with them; if Eva isn’t directly engaged with or focused upon an individual, though, she tends to retreat into her shell more than a bit - something which other players (unaware of Eva’s autism) may mistake for standoffishness, and react accordingly.

[realitytvfan1017]

44 minutes ago, Nashville said:

“Unless“…?  😆

 

In truth I’ve been suspecting for a while now that much of the animosity directed towards Eva may have been based on her tribemates’ ignorance regarding her autism.  I’ve noticed Eva’s MO tends to be she generally doesn’t show a lot of personal animation or expressiveness towards any individual unless/until she’s engaged in direct conversation with them; if Eva isn’t directly engaged with or focused upon an individual, though, she tends to retreat into her shell more than a bit - something which other players (unaware of Eva’s autism) may mistake for standoffishness, and react accordingly.

That makes a lot of sense. 

[anniebird]

On 3/27/2025 at 1:15 AM, Lantern7 said:

Man, Eva had herself a powerful moment. I didn't think it was too schlocky. I don't think Probst faked tears, but I still figure that he slept on his back that night because he was that turned on.

Eva's meltdown and triumph shows she's way braver than I could ever be. I'm on the spectrum as well, and I could see myself in her position. But I could never be on Survivor. Most of it is because I'm not into the outdoors and covert scheming, but I don't have the personality for it. I did make it a few stages into another reality show's casting, but I think that was because of me being enrolled outside of "regular" education for a lot of my life.

 

My granddaughter is on the spectrum and goes to a boarding school with many autistic students. They started watching Survivor because of Eva - I look forward to hearing what they thought of this episode. I was very moved by it.

For those of you who felt manipulated, I understand, but I think having a child or grandchild on the spectrum makes you hypersensitive to what these kids go through on a daily basis.

Edited Yest. at 12:25 AM by anniebird

[Skooma]

18 hours ago, blackwing said:

Ah thanks for the correction.  But the spirit of the question remains the same... why did Star feel like she had to gift the idol to Eva?  People have had help obtaining an idol in past seasons and no one ever feels like they had to hand it over.  In fact, some have talked about how it is a shared idol but it really belongs to the person who has it in their pocket.

Not only did she say Eva earned it by solving the puzzle but also she said in a confessional she had autistic family members.  So emotionally she started feeling a lot closer to Eva. 

So there was an emotional bond created that transcended the mere game for her it seems.  And I applaud it.  It's nice when people like Joe and her see the bigger picture in life.

[anniebird]

8 hours ago, Skooma said:

 

 

So there was an emotional bond created that transcended the mere game for her it seems.  And I applaud it.  It's nice when people like Joe and her see the bigger picture in life.

I thought the emotional connection was lovely, and Joe seems like maybe the nicest Survivor contestant ever, but I wouldn't blame the other players for voting one or both of them off as soon as they can.