S18.E15: Cheat and Retreat

[princelina]

3 hours ago, Chatty Cake said:

 Juan has to be a recruit. That man does not want to be married.  I would say David is a recruit to although he wanted to have the benefits of a marriage. I have no idea why anyone would cast Ikechi. 

Ikechi must have put on some good act as he followed them from Texas to Chicago!

Edited Tuesday at 03:58 AM by princelina

[Gator Stud]

On 2/11/2025 at 7:07 PM, atomic said:

Wow. My heart is broken for Allen. 💔 It took him so long to accept what Michelle was saying even when she was practically spelling it out for him. But now it's just hit him like a ton of bricks. Glad he's getting out of there to be home with Luffy. David and Madison both make me sick. Disgusting, grimy people cut from the same trash human cloth.

Neither David nor Madison is disgusting.  Michelle deserved every thing she got and more. David did NOT cheat on Michelle.  How do you cheat on someone who wont hold your hand or look you in the face when they talk to you because they are so repulsed? If someone would not hold my hand after 2 dates, there would not be a third.  What to speak of 6 weeks later.  Michelle didnt really care that David had moved on; she didnt like David.  She is so fake.

Allen was delusional. If Madison would not kiss him or hold his hand after 6 weeks, why would he think this was going to go anywhere?  That said, he did not deserve to be betrayed by David and Madison. Also, they didn't really cheat. They sent texts to each other. They flirted. If I was a newlywed, I would not let my new wife hang out with some guy in the gym everyday. Or hang out at a bar together. That is Allen's bad.

Also, Madison did him a big favor upgrading his wardrobe.  He looked good in the new clothes and I am sure plenty of women will snap him up.  I bet he is already off the market. Also, kudos to Allen for maintaining self control and not punching David in the face.

 

[Retired at last]

I kind of agree that David didn't cheat - there was NO marriage and his "wife" wanted nothing to do with him. Madison had an obligation to spell it out to Allen that it wasn't going anywhere and not to get his hopes up. Instead, she kept saying they were growing closer and other things to keep him encouraged, although, deep down, he knew.

I did have to laugh when you said as a newlywed, you would not let your new wife hang out with a guy in the gym. This is the same girl who left her husband alone at home while she went out to party the night they got home from their honeymoon, and many nights thereafter. There is no "letting" Madison do or not do anything she doesn't want to do - and what she wants to do is drink and party.

[Gator Stud]

9 minutes ago, Retired at last said:

I kind of agree that David didn't cheat - there was NO marriage and his "wife" wanted nothing to do with him. Madison had an obligation to spell it out to Allen that it wasn't going anywhere and not to get his hopes up. Instead, she kept saying they were growing closer and other things to keep him encouraged, although, deep down, he knew.

Madison had to say that stuff because if she backed out of the marriage, I heard MAFS charges you $50K. If this is true, the blame lies with Production not Madison. Michelle should say she wants a divorce, but Production wont let her, so she just tortures David by being fake. That's on Production too.  They should get 10 couples, and maybe 3 survive.  Instead of forcing them to stay together.

[Retired at last]

It will be interesting to see if the Ick man appears again or if he is kicked out since he "served his wife" with phony divorce paper. And, does he get fined? Does Emem? She kept saying that she wanted to make it work, but clearly she didn't (no blame there). She is still part of the group, but he has taken off. But, I am sure he will be back. 

I wonder how the move to Peacock will change the format or number of couples or the rules they have to follow. Unfortunately, like many here, I sure won't be paying to see it.

[LuvMyShows]

I guess I'm in the minority, but what David did was def cheating. I am assuming that something physical has happened between him and Madison. If not, then I don't view it as cheating, just as him being unfaithful to the spirit of the thing but not truly unfaithful. Sure, Michelle had frozen him out, but he was still married and obligated to what he signed up for. If he didn't want it anymore, he could either try to talk to her in private about making an "arrangement", end the marriage, or wait until the 8 weeks were over. If it hadn't gotten physical, I can't see him going through with all the protracted and in-depth lying and cover-ups. He freaking lied big time to a pastor and tried to convince his cousin to lie for him. He's a sh*t and not the great guy he seems convinced that he is. What Madison sees in him is beyond me, especially once she watches the show and actually sees his insane level of dishonesty.

[Gator Stud]

28 minutes ago, LuvMyShows said:

I guess I'm in the minority, but what David did was def cheating. I am assuming that something physical has happened between him and Madison. If not, then I don't view it as cheating, just as him being unfaithful to the spirit of the thing but not truly unfaithful. Sure, Michelle had frozen him out, but he was still married and obligated to what he signed up for. If he didn't want it anymore, he could either try to talk to her in private about making an "arrangement", end the marriage, or wait until the 8 weeks were over.

Until we see proof of cheating, there was no cheating. Is it possible they hooked up? Yes.  Is there proof?? No.   But even if they hooked up, that only meant that Madison cheated.  David cant cheat because there is no marriage.  For those wanting the contestants to end the marriage, are you going to give them $50K to pay the penalty for ending the marriage?  If not, then why should they go into debt ending a marriage instead on waiting it out a few weeks?  Production set it up this way.  They are the ones to blame. I dont blame Michelle for not ending the marriage.  She just did the math.

[Doublemint]

There was a legal marriage.  The absence of physical touching, conversation, etc. does not void that fact.  There are marriages where this happens over time, in this case, it happened after the actual wedding.   David and Madison signed up for this 8 week time, and are dishonorable liars.  Karla just spoke truth to Madison.

[Elizzikra]

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How do you cheat on someone who wont hold your hand or look you in the face when they talk to you because they are so repulsed?

You stand up. You take vows. You sign the marriage certificate. And this case, it's eight freakin weeks. There is a definite end date in sight. There was definitely a marriage, however incompatible and dysfunctional it might have been. David could have waited. There was no reason not to wait, and absent that, not to be honest about what he was doing. 

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There was a legal marriage.  The absence of physical touching, conversation, etc. does not void that fact. 

Agreed. 

Say Michelle had been the one to send a flirty message to some guy? Would everyone say "hey, not really cheating?" 

Quote

For those wanting the contestants to end the marriage, are you going to give them $50K to pay the penalty for ending the marriage? 

This has never been confirmed as far as I know. It gets thrown around a lot but it's just speculation. Again, can David really not go without sex (or flirting) for eight lousy weeks?

Quote

he has taken off. But, I am sure he will be back. 

Must he come back? Can't he just stay gone?

[Gator Stud]

2 hours ago, Doublemint said:

There was a legal marriage.  The absence of physical touching, conversation, etc. does not void that fact.  There are marriages where this happens over time, in this case, it happened after the actual wedding.   David and Madison signed up for this 8 week time, and are dishonorable liars.  Karla just spoke truth to Madison.

Cmon man.  Michelle is repulsed and dead inside.  Why lie about how she feels? Are you going to pay the $100K fine for them to break the marriage? If not,  I dont think you have much standing.  You dont want to blame Production but that is the only reason why they stay in toxic relationships.  You dont see the "Experts's" interventions to get them to stay in their toxic marriages? You dont think they are to blame?

[Gator Stud]

45 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

You stand up. You take vows. You sign the marriage certificate. And this case, it's eight freakin weeks. There is a definite end date in sight. There was definitely a marriage, however incompatible and dysfunctional it might have been. David could have waited. There was no reason not to wait, and absent that, not to be honest about what he was doing. 

Agreed. 

Say Michelle had been the one to send a flirty message to some guy? Would everyone say "hey, not really cheating?" 

This has never been confirmed as far as I know. It gets thrown around a lot but it's just speculation. Again, can David really not go without sex (or flirting) for eight lousy weeks?

Must he come back? Can't he just stay gone?

Keep telling yourself lies. I would have had sex after the third week if some person was constantly insulting me and refusing to hold my hand. It takes two to dance. And there is no way I would pay $50K to bail on some rudegirl. Who does Michelle think she is? She was pissed Basement David got with a hotter woman. Her ego was bruised. Lets keep it real. Would you keep dating  someone who refused to hold your hand and found your repulsive?  Or hook up with someone who found you beautiful? What if you had to pay a $50K fine to not date the person you found repulsive.  Why dont you blame Production for this mess?

[atomic]

They don't get fined $50K for ending the marriages early. It happens all the time, including last season. You really think Orion who lived with his mommy like David could afford a fine that was probably more than his yearly salary?

 

[redpencil]

2 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

Quote

For those wanting the contestants to end the marriage, are you going to give them $50K to pay the penalty for ending the marriage? 

This has never been confirmed as far as I know. It gets thrown around a lot but it's just speculation. Again, can David really not go without sex (or flirting) for eight lousy weeks?

If there's a fine, it's for backing out of filming completely. That's why you see participants who have ended the marriage early still hanging around, going on outings with the other couples, etc. David could have asked to do that. He did not.

ETA: Madison had the same option and didn't take it. Sure, it would have been harder since she was leading Allen along in a way David wasn't doing with Michelle, but David's not the only one who did this in the wrong way.

Edited Wednesday at 06:06 AM by redpencil

[Elizzikra]

19 hours ago, Gator Stud said:

Keep telling yourself lies. I would have had sex after the third week if some person was constantly insulting me and refusing to hold my hand. It takes two to dance. And there is no way I would pay $50K to bail on some rudegirl. Who does Michelle think she is? She was pissed Basement David got with a hotter woman. Her ego was bruised. Lets keep it real. Would you keep dating  someone who refused to hold your hand and found your repulsive?  Or hook up with someone who found you beautiful? What if you had to pay a $50K fine to not date the person you found repulsive.  Why dont you blame Production for this mess?

Wow … um ok. 
Before I go back to deluding myself, I do absolutely blame “the experts” or “production” or whoever for making bad matches. There was never any chance for David and Michelle. I never said there was. What I did say was that there was a legal marriage and there was no reason that any member of any of these couples can’t 1) manage to not date/flirt with/sext/have sex with anyone else while legally married and 2) why any one in any of these marriages needs to lie about having dated/flirted/sexted/had sex with anyone else. 
 

Also the fine for ending the relationship early is not documented anywhere. I have reason to believe that David lied because he thought his text to Madison was going to end up costing some random amount of money.

i also don’t agree at all that Madison is hotter than Michelle. I think Michelle has been stunning all season on After Party though I have not liked her episode looks as much. Madison’s overdone style isn’t really my thing.

Edited Wednesday at 11:34 PM by Elizzikra

[Retired at last]

While horrible as a person, I also think Michelle is much prettier than fake Madison. She is more feminine and does look nice on AP. 

I also agree with the comments that said that Madison is not nearly into David as much as he is into her. Serves him right. How does she do that? First, Allen is gaga for her and now David. 

Just my theory, but I have always thought that producers interview the applicants and pick the few they like and then they let the experts match them from those selected. I don't think the experts do much more than that.

[Hip-to-be-Square]

Madison needs to drop the droopy fake lashes and the cirque du soleil makeup. 

[ytown]

I like Pastor Cal but he said that Michelle "was turning the corner". If he really felt that I can now understand why almost every couple fails that the experts pick. She was turned completely off from moment one and treated David like sheat.  Michelle has this game that she got screwed over which is completely fake but it gave her an out from being the bad person that very few believe but she played it up.   I can only guess that she was  pissed for not getting what she wanted and David was her punching bag since she wasn't happy she dam sure didn't want David to be.  I don't think David owed her anything since he knew what she was doing and he pivoted.

Hate to see Allen get screwed over but at least Madison wasn't nasty to him but I can't rationalize her dishonest way of doing what she did only because Allen was a stand up guy the whole time and she should of communicated to him where she was in their relationship.

Personally I don't care if David and Madison had anything physical although the experts acted indignant as they act like these 8 weeks of fake marriages where infidelity is some sort of a breach of holy matrimony.😝

 

Edited Thursday at 01:39 PM by ytown

[Elizzikra]

Quote

the experts acted indignant as they act like these 8 weeks of fake marriages were infidelity and a breach of holy matrimony

They always do act like the marriages are ... I don't know exactly. But I keep hearing Pastor Cal saying "y'all married now - you can have sex" and that always bugged me. Like unmarried people can't have sex but people who have married but otherwise don't know each other should be having lots and lots of sex. Which - hey, if they are two consenting adults and that's what they want to do, that's great. I guess, to me, it's like the experts always see these magical bonds and connections between the husbands and wives and they are blind (or write off) all the reasons that they aren't connecting?

FWIW, I like Pastor Cal too - but that one comment he's made a couple of times is like fingernails on a chalkboard to me.

[princelina]

The "experts" just continue to act as if everyone is here for the Right Reasons, as they used to say on The Bachelor.  Even if the participants let it be known during the interview process that they were not!

[Elizzikra]

11 minutes ago, princelina said:

The "experts" just continue to act as if everyone is here for the Right Reasons, as they used to say on The Bachelor.  Even if the participants let it be known during the interview process that they were not!

This is true. That’s a really good point.

[Retired at last]

I think it is interesting that in the past, it seems like many more couples were consummating  their "marriages" on their honeymoons. I like it that they are waiting now. I don't think the success rates were higher when they just had sex right away. And I especially like it when the men don't jump right in if they aren't feeling attracted, even if their new spouses were willing. This season, Ick could have had Emem, Juan could have had Karla, and I think Tom was probably jumped on by Camille, so I am glad that worked - although it seems they have cooled off. Camille mentioned showing him the fancy lingerie she bought AFTER D Day, so they have definitely cooled off. 

[Crashcourse]

Well, Tom's back might still be a little sore after Camille jumped on it.