S07.16 A Hundred Thousand Angels

[Night Cheese]

I didn't hate this episode as much as, seemingly, the entire internet did. The Faith lives thing is straight out of fanfic, but honestly, I feel like with 10 episodes left, if they can end the show with Faith somehow still being alive and making her way to the Ridge and Jamie and Claire having their whole family there, together, I'd be ok with that ending. Even as I type that, I'm mentally acknowledging just how *truly* fanfic-y it is, but whatever. I guess it's possible that it all gets walked back and explained away in the prequel series. I didn't realize that series was filmed, let alone ready to premiere this year. But I think my 6 months of Starz will be up before it premieres, so I'll have to check the internet for any Faith stuff that comes from it.

Aside from that, I really loved the John/Claire scene. I could watch a whole hour of them just talking. I'm honestly thankful for David Berry and the Outlander directors for helping make a character that I am, at best, indifferent to in the books, to one that I really love on-screen. The girl that played Fanny was a real treat as well. Kudos to the casting director(s) for finding her.

I thought the Jamie/William scene was nicely done and well acted by both. William's identity crisis in the books reads to me as more bratty and petulant than sympathetic, but the actor does a good job with his material. He's still bratty and petulant, but the actor brings something more to the character.

Overall I thought 7B was really strong. I liked MOBY a lot and thought the writers did well to condensing down books 7 and 8 for this season. I'll be back for season 8. 

Here's an article where DG talks about giving the showrunners the Faith lives idea while also subtly crapping on the show and this episode.

 https://parade.com/tv/outlander-season-7-diana-gabaldon-finale-shocker

[jqdeco]

If the writers/producers follow thru with this Faith survived story, that will mean all 3 of Jaime’s children were raised by other men. I find that very sad and horrendous, soap opera storytelling. Truly a jump the shark moment.

[Cdh20]

5 hours ago, Night Cheese said:

I didn't hate this episode as much as, seemingly, the entire internet did. The Faith lives thing is straight out of fanfic, but honestly, I feel like with 10 episodes left, if they can end the show with Faith somehow still being alive and making her way to the Ridge and Jamie and Claire having their whole family there, together, I'd be ok with that ending. Even as I type that, I'm mentally acknowledging just how *truly* fanfic-y it is, but whatever. I guess it's possible that it all gets walked back and explained away in the prequel series. I didn't realize that series was filmed, let alone ready to premiere this year. But I think my 6 months of Starz will be up before it premieres, so I'll have to check the internet for any Faith stuff that comes from it.

Aside from that, I really loved the John/Claire scene. I could watch a whole hour of them just talking. I'm honestly thankful for David Berry and the Outlander directors for helping make a character that I am, at best, indifferent to in the books, to one that I really love on-screen. The girl that played Fanny was a real treat as well. Kudos to the casting director(s) for finding her.

I thought the Jamie/William scene was nicely done and well acted by both. William's identity crisis in the books reads to me as more bratty and petulant than sympathetic, but the actor does a good job with his material. He's still bratty and petulant, but the actor brings something more to the character.

Overall I thought 7B was really strong. I liked MOBY a lot and thought the writers did well to condensing down books 7 and 8 for this season. I'll be back for season 8. 

Here's an article where DG talks about giving the showrunners the Faith lives idea while also subtly crapping on the show and this episode.

 https://parade.com/tv/outlander-season-7-diana-gabaldon-finale-shocker

I know most people hate Book William so Charles had his work cut out for him! I have enjoyed every bit of his story onscreen, it was pared down perfectly.

[Noneofyourbusiness]

17 hours ago, jqdeco said:

If the writers/producers follow thru with this Faith survived story, that will mean all 3 of Jaime’s children were raised by other men. I find that very sad and horrendous, soap opera storytelling. Truly a jump the shark moment.

Apparently Diana has said that she didn't want to spend time showing Claire and Jamie raising a child because she finds that boring, hence Claire going back through the stones and the time skip.

[taanja]

1 hour ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

Apparently Diana has said that she didn't want to spend time showing Claire and Jamie raising a child because she finds that boring, hence Claire going back through the stones and the time skip.

I'm right there with her! 

I came here to read how the whole Faith is alive thing and I am finding out that wasn't in the books? Well color me confused!

[nodorothyparker]

 

1 hour ago, Noneofyourbusiness said:

Apparently Diana has said that she didn't want to spend time showing Claire and Jamie raising a child because she finds that boring, hence Claire going back through the stones and the time skip.

And yet they end up collecting multiple stray children along the way and spend an inordinate amount of time dealing with the antics of fifty eleven precocious grandchildren and all the assorted drudgery of raising said grandchildren. All the goings on with dirty diapers and breastfeeding and potty training in Fiery Cross alone is enough to nearly break some readers.

The Faith is alive! thing is just an idle musing by Claire in the most recent book after seeing Fanny and Jane's mother's locket, which does have Faith engraved on it. But at least there, there's a sort of basis for her thinking. Roger and Bree have just returned to the ridge with a story about another book-only time traveler they met in 1739 who had miraculous healing powers in his hands. And she's just resurrected a baby they believed was dead with a similar power in her hands that she can't really explain but makes her start thinking about what she'd seen Master Raymond do and her own dead baby and what he might have done there. Even then, it's maybe a chapter or so of what-ifs in a more than 900 page book before conceding how utterly far fetched the whole thing is. A supposed stillbirth remembering a lullaby however many years later to pass on to her own children is a show-only thing.

[mythoughtis]

On 1/18/2025 at 3:38 PM, GHScorpiosRule said:

This show is going to crash and burn for its last season, I can just see it. Gabaldon and the writers did not NEED to go to this well and write such nonsense.

Just like normal, screen  adaptations of books always screw something up.  Faith is an example. 
 

In addition. Even if Faith lived, she wouldn’t  remember a song sung to her once as a premature infant long enough to teach it to her daughter. Or are we to assume Faith lived in the far future and just drug her daughters back to the past? 

Edited Tuesday at 01:04 AM by mythoughtis

[areca]

1 hour ago, mythoughtis said:

Or are we to assume Faith lived in the far future and just drug her daughters back to the past? 

Perhaps she learned of her parents and was taking her family to meet them.

[jqdeco]

Finally got to watch the entire episode in one sitting. I liked it better than I thought I would.  I hated the Jane story in the books, but I liked the actress that played her and thought she did a good job. Never had any use for Fanny in the books and same in the show so far. It took until book 9 before I could tolerate William and I don’t see that changing either. 
Rollo’s death was sad but he was an old dog and at least died in his sleep.

I don’t remember in book 2,  but when Faith died, didn’t the nun finally convince Claire to let her take the baby? So Master Raymond either switched babies before Claire saw her or dug up her grave and brought her back to life? And then what? The only way Faith would know that song would be if Raymond taught it to her (after creepily spying on Claire), which would mean he raised her or was a part of her life enough to teach it. And why would he do any of this? This is General Hospital level retconning a story and to much time will be wasted in the final season explaining this nonsense instead of following the book.

[mythoughtis]

It occurred to me just now that Raymond has other things to ask Claire for forgiveness for.  Saving the Comte.   Some of  his other possible descendants - Ezekiel Richardson?  The one who is playing loose with Williams life and threatening Bree… and responsible for what is going to happen to Lord Grey 

Edited Tuesday at 11:19 PM by mythoughtis

[taanja]

3 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

It occurred to me just now that Raymond has other things to ask Claire for forgiveness for.  Saving the Comte.   Some of  her other possible descendants - Ezekiel Richardson?  The one who is playing loose with Williams life and threatening Bree… and responsible for what is going to happen to Lord Grey 

I haven't read the books but I came here to find out if what the show just showed us also happened in the books. and ... I guess not?

I was speculating Claire's real baby got switched for a dead one <<< for what reason I can not fathom --- Master Raymond had some plan? Who knows. maybe he raised the baby -- that way he could teach it that song.

I didn't hate the twist of Faith having lived - but I have NO clue how they (the writers) will make it make sense!

[SassAndSnacks]

Team - I just don't know.  

Maybe I need to watch this one again, even though I don't want to.  So many, "I'm sorry, what?" moments in this one.  In no particular order - 

• Claire is awfully mobile for someone who was shot in the guts days before, underwent surgery with no anesthesia, has no pain killers, and is using a sus script for Roquefort penicillin.  
• I cringed when Claire pissed in the bucket Jamie was holding.  Can't we give this woman SOME dignity? And also the actors.  Do you think they got they got the script and Sam was like "Ok, I'm holding a bucket while Cait faux pisses in it."  Just why? I know, she needed to check for blood.  But there's another way to write this scene, I'm sure of it.  Anyway, this is the least of my gripes, I'm just saying it to say it!
• I need to double-check, but the painting of Ellen showed a woman with dark hair, no?  Also, they should maybe have had Sophie sit for that painting, so that we got the whole Bree Looks Exactly Like Ellen reference a little more.  
• Completely unmoved by Rollo's death.  I'm sorry.  I have nothing against that Good Boy, but I do have major issues with anything Rachel and Ian.  This was another scene with them where I was wondering if I should be invested or not, and I wasn't.  Also, the eyes.  WHY?! (Yelling in my best Nancy Kerrigan)
• I didn't post about the previous episode, but the Battle of Monmouth took place in the summer.  It was outrageously hot.  Thus, Molly Pitcher came to fame.  I know we filmed in Scotland in the winter, but c'mon.  
• Bree...  As always, Bree...
• And finally, shouting in Nancy Kerrigan WHY WHY WHY!!!!!!!!! WHY did we go there with Faith / Fanny.  WTAF?!  I heard Fanny singing the seaside song, and I was like...no, do not do this.  And they freaking did.  In Bees, which is admittedly a giant stinker of a book, they almost where there with this crap, but even Diana, who has little to no restraint for shite, didn't go there.  I hated it.  I can't add anything more than what everyone said.  But I hated it.  We're going to spend the last season clearing this shit up.  I hate freaking fanfic of this show.  I have lots of my own fanfic ideas, this isn't one!  
• PS - William slept with his niece.  Awesome.  We've officially entered VC Andrews territory, only she (and her ghost writers) did it better.

Phew...

I did love some things too.  I promise.

• David Berry has carried the back half of this season for me.  I'm not even a LJG fan, but I find myself strangely attracted to this man.  Is it the eye patch?
• Rik Rankin anyone?  
• I cared absolutely nothing about Buck MacKenzie.  Now I want to lick Oban from that man's whickers. 
• Loathe Geneva, but I loved Jamie telling William something positive about her.  
• I enjoy the flashbacks to a simpler time, when the writing of this show was better.  

I just don't know.  Do I dislike the whole "Faith Lived" schtick more than "Claire Is An Ether Addict?"  It's a battle of worsts there.  Pretty tough to beat "Claire Is An Ether Addict."  

[Ziggy]

1 hour ago, taanja said:

I haven't read the books but I came here to find out if what the show just showed us also happened in the books. and ... I guess not?

I would not go so far as to say that it didn't happen in the books.  What happened in the show is roughly what happened in the books:

1. Fanny does have a locket that has "Faith" inscribed.
2. Faith is Fanny's mother.
3. Claire and Jamie's first child was named Faith.
4. Claire wonders if Fanny's mother is actually her daughter.

All of that was in the books.

Master Raymond does seem to have some powers, so who knows what he might have done.  He said he needed to ask Claire for forgiveness, so it does lead one to wonder whether he knows something about Faith or somehow saved her.

[Night Cheese]

Since there are non-book readers here looking for more book context, I'd add also that the fantastical/magic elements are more prevalent in the books than the show. It's understood that Claire is really some type of "white witch" who just hasn't fully come into her powers yet. Bree and family meet a traveler in 1739 who has powers. Master Raymond used some sort of dark magic to heal Claire (although that one is in the show as well as the books). 

So is it a stretch that Master Raymond took Faith, healed her, and raised her? Not really. Is it straight out of fanfic? Absolutely. There's probably dozens of fanfics with the same exact premise. It's also pretty cruel to steal a baby like that and make a mother think her baby is dead, complete with gravestone. 

There's a lot of mystery still to be revealed about Raymond, St Germain, Fergus, Percy Beauchamp, etc. that I'd rather see explored than bringing Faith back from the dead. I just hope Diana lives long enough to publish whatever she needs to publish in order to tie up all those loose ends. I doubt we see it in the show, but hopefully we see it in print.

[taanja]

13 minutes ago, Night Cheese said:

Since there are non-book readers here looking for more book context, I'd add also that the fantastical/magic elements are more prevalent in the books than the show. It's understood that Claire is really some type of "white witch" who just hasn't fully come into her powers yet. Bree and family meet a traveler in 1739 who has powers. Master Raymond used some sort of dark magic to heal Claire (although that one is in the show as well as the books). 

So is it a stretch that Master Raymond took Faith, healed her, and raised her? Not really. Is it straight out of fanfic? Absolutely. There's probably dozens of fanfics with the same exact premise. It's also pretty cruel to steal a baby like that and make a mother think her baby is dead, complete with gravestone. 

There's a lot of mystery still to be revealed about Raymond, St Germain, Fergus, Percy Beauchamp, etc. that I'd rather see explored than bringing Faith back from the dead. I just hope Diana lives long enough to publish whatever she needs to publish in order to tie up all those loose ends. I doubt we see it in the show, but hopefully we see it in print.

Ok. gotcha! I read somewhere that in the books Claire has some magical powers. I remember Master Raymond healing Claire with lights/touch, but the show has NOT shown Claire having that ability. It also has not (so far anyway) shown any scenes in 1739 with Bree or anyone else having special healing powers.

I don't read fanfic. The baby somehow living seems far fetched/fantastic but it also goes quite nicely with a freaking show whose entire premise is TIME TRAVEL!!!

I am actually OK with this twist. I wondered HOW it happened in the books. And I want it to make -- maybe not logical sense -- but some kind of sense that .. well ... makes sense!

Or it's gonna be like Game of Thrones. Dude never did finish that novel! He let the showrunners write the ending that was kind of sucky. I mean BRAN??????? fucking Bran playing the long game - knowing the whole time he was going to be king!

Sorry, I digress!

[Ziggy]

43 minutes ago, taanja said:

Ok. gotcha! I read somewhere that in the books Claire has some magical powers. I remember Master Raymond healing Claire with lights/touch, but the show has NOT shown Claire having that ability. It also has not (so far anyway) shown any scenes in 1739 with Bree or anyone else having special healing powers.

I don't read fanfic. The baby somehow living seems far fetched/fantastic but it also goes quite nicely with a freaking show whose entire premise is TIME TRAVEL!!!

I am actually OK with this twist. I wondered HOW it happened in the books. And I want it to make -- maybe not logical sense -- but some kind of sense that .. well ... makes sense!

Or it's gonna be like Game of Thrones. Dude never did finish that novel! He let the showrunners write the ending that was kind of sucky. I mean BRAN??????? fucking Bran playing the long game - knowing the whole time he was going to be king!

Sorry, I digress!

One thing the show has shown is the connection between Jem and Mandy.  A MUCH bigger deal of this is made in the books, but they definitely have a connection.

There is a chapter in the books where Bree and a family friend each take one of the kids (Jem and Mandy) and go further and further apart to try and determine how far apart they can be (a mile, several miles, a hundred miles, etc.) and still have the connection.  They do this just before she and the kids go back to find Roger.

[Future Cat Lady]

The whole Faith thing has made me very curious and I think it's a misdirect. They knew it would get fans talking and that was the point. After seeing some speculation on TikTok, I think this storyline is a set up for the prequel. We don't know much about Claire's parents and I think the new show will give them a new backstory. It won't be part of the books, but it won't contradict it.

[Cdh20]

9 hours ago, SassAndSnacks said:

Team - I just don't know.  

Maybe I need to watch this one again, even though I don't want to.  So many, "I'm sorry, what?" moments in this one.  In no particular order - 

• Claire is awfully mobile for someone who was shot in the guts days before, underwent surgery with no anesthesia, has no pain killers, and is using a sus script for Roquefort penicillin.  
• I cringed when Claire pissed in the bucket Jamie was holding.  Can't we give this woman SOME dignity? And also the actors.  Do you think they got they got the script and Sam was like "Ok, I'm holding a bucket while Cait faux pisses in it."  Just why? I know, she needed to check for blood.  But there's another way to write this scene, I'm sure of it.  Anyway, this is the least of my gripes, I'm just saying it to say it!
• I need to double-check, but the painting of Ellen showed a woman with dark hair, no?  Also, they should maybe have had Sophie sit for that painting, so that we got the whole Bree Looks Exactly Like Ellen reference a little more.  

I did love some things too.  I promise.

• David Berry has carried the back half of this season for me.  I'm not even a LJG fan, but I find myself strangely attracted to this man.  Is it the eye patch?
• Rik Rankin anyone?  
• I cared absolutely nothing about Buck MacKenzie.  Now I want to lick Oban from that man's whickers. 
• Loathe Geneva, but I loved Jamie telling William something positive about her.  
• I enjoy the flashbacks to a simpler time, when the writing of this show was better.  

I just don't know.  Do I dislike the whole "Faith Lived" schtick more than "Claire Is An Ether Addict?"  It's a battle of worsts there.  Pretty tough to beat "Claire Is An Ether Addict."  

The picture of Ellen is actually the actress cast in Blood of My Blood ( so much of that episode was used to sell/ reference that prequel). 
 

I agree with loving how much time John got this season! 
And bless Jamie for finding some good adjectives to explain Geneva. No son needs to know the truth about that whole incident. William said he saw the picture of the Earl- he knows whose idea it was! 

[surfgirl]

On 1/18/2025 at 7:36 AM, areca said:

Further, I think they committed to ending the series differently so that the show's ending would not affect Gabaldon's future book sales.

I don't think that's an issue because I doubt she'll ever finish her books at this point. 

[SassAndSnacks]

12 hours ago, Future Cat Lady said:

After seeing some speculation on TikTok, I think this storyline is a set up for the prequel.

Let's hope!  I was a little skeptical about the prequel when I initially thought it was only the story of Jamie's parents.  I've always been more curious about Claire's family and why / how she is able to travel.  I was pumped when I saw that her parents are a part of this.  And the trailer looks fab.  Fingers crossed.

[aemom]

I was watching thinking WTF?? How could I have possibly forgotten about this in the books? I came here to restore my sanity, so thanks. 

Not impressed with this turn of events at all, we'll have to see how it goes.

I wonder if we will see Fergus, Marsali, et al. in the next Season? There's major things in the books that involves them.

[GHScorpiosRule]

11 hours ago, SassAndSnacks said:

Let's hope!  I was a little skeptical about the prequel when I initially thought it was only the story of Jamie's parents.  I've always been more curious about Claire's family and why / how she is able to travel.  I was pumped when I saw that her parents are a part of this.  And the trailer looks fab.  Fingers crossed.

I rolled my eyes when I first heard about this prequel, and I have NO intention of giving it my time. Even worse, Roberts couldn’t do his JOB and focus and finish this SHOW first. Too interested in his own show and here we are, where the second to last season is filled with holes and lazy writing. Leaving not only buik readers, but non-buik readers lost in the sea of confusion.

Yeah, yeah, a lot of unnecessary stuff was culled, but Marsali AND Fergus are supposed to be involved and present. It was Fergus who helped Claire with Lord John’s eye healing!

And yes, I understand this was supposed to have been the final season, and it’s horrible.

Bitter? Who, me?

[nodorothyparker]

From Gabaldon's Facebook page. Long winded, as you might expect of an author whose last couple of books weighed in at 900-plus pages each, but she sounds frankly annoyed the show has put her in the position of having to address the Faith question. She is pretty clear that the show is on its own here and whatever happened to Baby Faith is not and won't be book material.

 

Quote

 

I got this message today, and as it was part of the Sudden Storm of concern over Faith, I thought I’d answer it here (as well as in the place where it was posted):

Diana,

But then we have Matt Roberts telling everyone in articles like this that when you say no they listen to you and don't do things that you strongly disagree with. (https://www.tvinsider.com/.../outlander-season-8-faith.../)

It implies to anyone who isn't following you personally here or on other SM that you are on board with their version of the story changes.

:::sigh:::

And my reply:

Dear X--

Well, naturally he's not going to say in public that they ignore my advice (and objections) when it suits them, though very plainly they do. <g>

People who work in show business are, as a rule, _very_ circumspect in what they say, because there's a really strong probability of it showing up in print (and what shows up will not necessarily be what the quotee actually _said_, either. Often things are paraphrased, and paraphrased (or condensed) in a way that is actually at odds with the original statement).

I try not to do that, either: a) I actually like the show's production people, and believe that they are in fact usually <cough> doing what they think is the right (or necessary*) thing, and b) I'd quite like to keep on working with them. They do, by contract, have to pay me a consultant's fee; they don't have to send me scripts or talk to me, let alone invite me to write the occasional episode.

And c) I have enough experience with the media (thirty-three years of it, in fact...) to understand i) how it works, and ii) how it _doesn't_.

Let me just observe that in thirty-odd years of being interviewed about my books, I have seen exactly _three_ interviews that were accurate. (I don't accuse the interviewers of deliberate messing-aboutness; a lot of it is just minor carelessness (they read my Wikipedia page--which is Totally Not Accurate to begin with, since I have neither the time nor interest to visit it every day and correct the nonsense people put in there--and use that as background; or they ask me minor things (like where I got my various degrees) and--not realizing that there are THREE state universities in Arizona, and all three of them include "Arizona" and "University" in their names--and I have two degrees from one of these institutions (Northern Arizona University), but worked for twelve years at one of the others (Arizona State University)--they more often than not default to the one university (University of Arizona) with which I've never had the slightest relationship.)

None of that's at all important; it's just a very minor illustration of how easy it is for a print version of a verbal interview to end up implying something different than what the person actually said (or meant). And it's counterproductive to all concerned for there to be an appearance of serious disagreement among the people associated with a show. (This is why actors, directors, etc. seldom bad-mouth each other (or the show's production), regardless of whether there's actual friction. And usually, there’s not.)

* "necessary" - NOT infrequently, there are actual unavoidable physical reasons for the show doing something in a way that ideally, they wouldn't have. For instance, I'm seeing a good bit of email from people who live near Monmouth, complaining that while EVERYONE knows (and it's certainly part of the historical record) that the Battle of Monmouth was fought in the summer and was remarkable for the heat of the day, the show has arbitrarily decided to shoot it in _winter_, ferGawd'ssake, and how could I "let" them do that?

O. K. There's no reason why most TV viewers should know anything about the mechanics of television production, and most of them don't. However, part of said mechanics deals with the shooting schedule.

(This is one of the reasons for shooting two episodes as a block; so that dates and locations can be shuffled in case of need.) A shooting schedule normally proceeds from Episode One onward. The only (well, normally) reason why episodes would be shot out of sequence would be in case of an important location that covered more than one episode--hence the show spending a couple of months in South Africa, in order to shoot pieces of Season Three.)

So the Battle of Monmouth falls at the end of Season Seven. They're filming it in Scotland. The end of the season is in fall; it's frequently Very Cold, but it's seldom hot, and when it is, it's unpredictable. There's no economically/physically reasonable way of making a whole battle look like it's having heat-stroke, and--given that the people who _know_ it was hot during the battle number maybe a couple of hundred at most—and the fact that the heat does not really affect any of the characters they’re using--they just let it be cold. I mean, producing a show is always about picking your battles ("battles" used in the broadest sense, meaning encompassing weather and locations, and unpredictable availability of cast or resources).

Now, returning to Matt <cough>--we get along very well, and always have. I visited the (hugely expanded) studio sometime last year (last year is a Complete Blur, for assorted reasons), and had a long, congenial chat about a whole lot of things, among me, my husband, Matt and Maril. We talked about Claire's parents (my POV being that they're dead <g>, but if Matt wanted to do a storyline about them in the Prequel, it was OK with me (he did, and it worked brilliantly—the actors are wonderful!)).

In the course of this long and very far-ranging conversation, we discussed things I was doing in Book Ten and what other projects I might have in mind, no matter how far out (I do, of course, have the Prequel Book (1) in my TBD pile--and no, it won't have Claire's parents in it; they're dead. Repeat after me: “The books are the books and the show is the show”).

Master Raymond was mentioned (I don't know by whom), and I said that a) I do have pieces of the book _about_ Master Raymond, but that's about #4 in my stack--meaning I write down stuff when it comes to me, but b) I'm not actually _working_ in a regular way on that novel.

As this was a conversation, rather than a Meeting, I then mentioned casually that I had at one time considered doing a second graphic novel, and IF I HAD (WHICH I BLOODY DIDN’T AND I’M NOT GOING TO**), it might have included something about Master Raymond and what—if anything—he might have done following his visit to save Claire’s life at the hospital.

OK. This is the way I work; I don’t sit down and type out a detailed timeline of things I might write over the next ten years. I don’t work with an outline, and I don’t write in a straight line. I get ideas, and some of them come with words, and if they do, I write them down. If they don’t, but seem interesting in some way, I just remember them—sometimes (as I work on other things, usually), one of those will drift back into my mind, and this time I see a possibility, or a faint relationship with something else.

** I’m not going to write a second graphic novel because a) I have way too many other things that I’d rather write first, and b) the first one was OK, and fun to do, but not very popular—owing in part to ignorance on the part of the audience as to what a graphic novel _was_ (this was a number of years ago, and my readership is largely a lot older than the normal readers of graphic novels). We had a lot of people who bought it and were Displeased to find that it was “a comic book!!” (This, in spite of my insisting that the Amazon listing include page shots…) Even more of them were Very Displeased that the artist had somehow failed to read their minds and draw their perceived version of Jamie or Claire. However…

One of the things I liked about writing a graphic novel was that it gave me the opportunity to tell parts of the story that the book didn’t. See, one of the benefits of a visual medium (being comic books, TV or video games) is that you can have multiple points-of-view operating at once. You can’t (normally) do that in regular text. (You can do it sequentially, of course, but that’s not the same effect.)

So THE EXILE isn’t told solely from Claire’s point of view; it includes POV’s from Jamie, Murtagh, Dougal, Geillis, etc. Consequently, there are bits of the story that aren’t in OUTLANDER at all, or that explore what Someone Other Than Claire was doing at the time.

That was interesting, and that’s what caused me to think about Master Raymond. As noted above, I do intend to write a book ABOUT HIM (if you follow my Facebook page, you will have seen a few bits of it (my little meditation on Halloween—“In the cold time, when the spiders die…Sometimes I think I see it, too.”—is from that book. There’s a little more, below…

Anyway, as I said, that book isn’t on top of my mental pile, but ideas still show up, and I tuck them away in some mental crevice, from which they peek out now and then, like curious moray eels… And one of those was my thought as to whether Master Raymond might have intervened in some way that we didn’t see, after the nuns ejected him. I have not written a word about this, and quite possibly never will.

OK. You aren’t going to see any of those thoughts in Book Ten, because they don’t belong there. If you ever _do_ see them (and they aren’t even developed thoughts; just what I call kernels), they’ll be in Master Raymond’s own story (should I live that long…).

But the bottom line here is that No, Faith isn’t/wasn’t alive in the Outlander novels, she’s not going to be, and neither Claire nor Jamie will ever think so. William will not ever have Moral Qualms over having unknowingly had sex with his half-niece (though it’s interesting to see how many people think that possibility is Just Horrifying…I mean, really; what’s more wrong about having sex with a prostitute who’s related to you than one who isn’t, as long as no children result?).

Repeat after me: The books are the books, and the show is the show…

 

 

Edited 16 hours ago by nodorothyparker

[mythoughtis]

Well I’m glad to see that Faith’s story as written in the books is  still Faith’s story.   I’m also glad that the author was not on board with what the show did - even though she was made to sound as if she was.   There are so many things for the show to wrap up in one season that they needed to discard  this storyline - but of course they were  done filming season 8 before they learned how  upset they made their fans in season 7.  I’m sure they don’t care. 

[surfgirl]

Jeebus, Diana could have NOT written that post and instead worked on Book 10, how's about that?!?

[nodorothyparker]

She's actually put out a number of excerpts from book 10 on that same Facebook page (which is why I look in periodically because I'm such a spoiler whore), so I'm inclined to believe her when she says she has made some progress on it. But that post is also followed by a separate post of a Master Raymond book excerpt and she readily admits she doesn't write in a straight line and flits between whatever stories she's thinking about at any given moment, so there's that.

I'm apparently one of about three people in her readership who doesn't give even a fraction of a shit about Master Raymond. I just don't and I'm going to be annoyed if we have to sit through nonsense about him in the show's final stretch.

[ch1]

i don’t care about Master Raymond either.  

[GHScorpiosRule]

1 hour ago, nodorothyparker said:

I'm apparently one of about three people in her readership who doesn't give even a fraction of a shit about Master Raymond.

 

9 minutes ago, ch1 said:

i don’t care about Master Raymond either.  

Add me to the list.

And since next season is the last, I want the focus to return and be on Jamie and Claire; it started with them, let it end with them. And since Roberts, Davis, and the rest, don't give a shit about what happened in the buiks and are going off on their own tangents*, they can give the viewers this much.

*I remember his bullshit reason for filming the fight between Jamie and Black Jack at Culloden in the bootiful sunlight as great cinematography or some such shit, when it's KNOWN FACT that short battle was dreary, overcast and rainy. Hence the bog, you maroon!

[oceanblue]

Apparently there are 4 readers who don't give a shit about Master Raymond.   I barely remembered he existed.   

[Noneofyourbusiness]

On 1/20/2025 at 12:55 PM, nodorothyparker said:

A supposed stillbirth remembering a lullaby however many years later to pass on to her own children is a show-only thing.

Psychic powers do exist in Outlander, but I think it's more likely that they'll say Raymond overheard Claire singing it to Faith and he continued singing it to her.

On 1/20/2025 at 12:04 PM, taanja said:

I came here to read how the whole Faith is alive thing and I am finding out that wasn't in the books? Well color me confused!

To be fair, the show said that Faith lived, not that she's currently alive. If her daughters ended up in a brothel, she probably died in the interim, unless she accidentally got separated from them through the stones.

On 1/21/2025 at 12:23 PM, taanja said:

I was speculating Claire's real baby got switched for a dead one <<< for what reason I can not fathom --- Master Raymond had some plan? Who knows. maybe he raised the baby -- that way he could teach it that song.

The Gabaldon interview quoted on the previous page of this thread where she mentions the graphic novel she didn't write has her saying that it would have shown that Raymond resuscitated the baby (presumably after she was already buried) but didn't have time to get Faith to Claire and Jamie before they left France. So the intention there wasn't that it was a switch. Hopefully not in the show, either.

On 1/21/2025 at 4:03 PM, taanja said:

Ok. gotcha! I read somewhere that in the books Claire has some magical powers. I remember Master Raymond healing Claire with lights/touch, but the show has NOT shown Claire having that ability.

Because she only started using that power in the latest book.

On 1/21/2025 at 11:23 PM, Cdh20 said:

The picture of Ellen is actually the actress cast in Blood of My Blood ( so much of that episode was used to sell/ reference that prequel).

Yes, they altered the picture from Season 1 so the face would resemble Harriet Slater's. The hair still doesn't look red like it should, though. And somehow the picture has lost the pearl necklace that was given to Claire.

On 1/22/2025 at 12:50 AM, surfgirl said:

I don't think that's an issue because I doubt she'll ever finish her books at this point. 

If we're only talking about the main series, there's only one planned left and she's only 73, so I'll sure she'll get it out before she's 100. Side books are another matter, but people are less anxious about them anyway.

[SassAndSnacks]

14 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

From Gabaldon's Facebook page.

Holy Toledo!  There's a lot to unpack here.  

Superficially, I'm pleased that I'm not the only one annoyed about snow on the ground during the Battle of Monmouth.  FFS!

Her dismissal of Claire's parents as not that important annoys me.  But these are her characters, so... 🤷‍♀️

3 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

I'm apparently one of about three people in her readership who doesn't give even a fraction of a shit about Master Raymond.

1 hour ago, oceanblue said:

Apparently there are 4 readers who don't give a shit about Master Raymond.

Count that as 7.  

I think this season would have really benefited from the Buik threads with Fergus and Marsali.  I know the actors weren't available, but they were such integral parts of Book 8.  I don't know about you, but I missed the Germaine / Lord John hijinks through the Continental Army.