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S01.E08: No, No Monsters

chitowngirl

By chitowngirl
in Matlock (2024)

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andromeda331

andromeda331

(edited)

I really wish there wasn't a secret plot by Matty against the law firm or that she wasn't rich. This would be a really great show if she was what she claimed. An older woman suddenly had to go back to work while raising her grandson because her daughter a drug addict died and using that she's much older as a positive to help with her job. 

I really like the generational stuff like Matty dealing with a co-worker getting "fresh" vs the client. Her going off on Edwin when he brought up working while Ellie was growing up. That's still pretty common today moms doing the bulk of parenting while working. Worried she's doing the same with Alfie. 

I like her and Olympia's growing friendship. I like that she didn't go behind her back because Jason asked her too.

But her underhanded and sneaking around to get emails, laptops and all the lying she does I really hate.

So Lacy was willing to ruin a woman because she was having an affair. That's crappy but not surprising. She claims that she thought the nanny could get another job. Really? After putting up a picture that make it look like she was terrible at her job. What a bitch. 

I get what Sarah was trying to do with Billy. But I thought it was too soon for that. He just got dumped. Give him time before going tough on him. That's okay Billy, you listen to Adele all you want if that's what helps you. I did like him pointing out that he wasn't wearing noise canceling headphones.

 

Edited by andromeda331
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Bastet

Bastet

(edited)
12 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Her going off on Edwin when he brought up working while Ellie was growing up. That's still pretty common today moms doing the bulk of parenting while working.

Not just common but the norm; pathetically little since "the second shift" was first documented has changed.  Especially the emotional labor, which is what Matty said without - being of her generation - using the specific term, even where things inched a little bit forward in terms of division of physical labor.  She kept track of what needed to be done when and down to things like who the kid's best friends were.  For him not to know that and to have the family's life bend around his schedule didn't cause anyone to bat an eye, but to this day Matty remembers everything she missed as she was made to feel guilty.

12 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

I get what Sarah was trying to do with Billy. But I thought it was too soon for that. He just got dumped. Give him time before going tough on him.

I thought Sarah was on point for the world of corporate law, which is why he thanked her in the end.  When she stumbled upon him following Claudia's perfectly logical but heartbreaking response to his proposal, she did nothing but immediately hug him.  It was all about the personal, and 100% supportive, no premature mention of how the break-up could wind up being for the best.  But as they get back to work, she shifts her friendship to being about guarding his professional flank when he's not up for doing it himself, which is - despite Olympia's newly relaxed attitude - quite realistically in jeopardy if he is perceived like a "Gen Z snowflake".  As she tells him, relationships come and go, but a professional reputation sticks. 

Sarah has been presented as ambitious and competitive, and those attributes are so often portrayed as negative on TV (as in life) once they're possessed by a woman, but here we're clearly shown she doesn't take advantage of an equal co-worker's vulnerability to get ahead, she tries at every turn to help him, not just in how she talks to him but how she tries to cover for him to others.  He toasts her in the end for very good reason.

Edited by Bastet
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Ellee

Ellee

(edited)
On 12/14/2024 at 12:26 PM, Ellee said:

I really think it is going to be Elijah if we’ve seen the villain yet.  I guess on the other hand — is this the first we’ve seen of Sr.’s assistant?  I’m sure he could easily forge Sr.’s signature. Now whether or not he knew what he was doing ….

Lol — rewatching this episode. 
 

Continuing on with the assistant — he signs Sr.‘s name — prints the document — gets interrupted and never picks up the document from the ‘printing room’ — document never filed.  ‘Someone’ should have noticed that it was missing though don’t you think?  
 

Just a thought. 
 

ETA:  Love the line — ‘Forgot to leave my card. No use kissing  ass if no one knows the lips are mine ‘

Edited by Ellee
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shapeshifter

shapeshifter

A recent article examined another wrinkle in the link between "Big Pharma" and the opioid addiction crisis: “Giant Companies Took Secret Payments to Allow Free Flow of Opioids” ( free "gift" link:https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/17/business/pharmacy-benefit-managers-opioids.html?unlocked_article_code=1.iE4.qnnc.j42L6ckZyuez&smid=url-share)

Quote

…The P.B.M.s [(benefit managers)] are hired by insurers and employers to control their drug costs by negotiating discounts with pharmaceutical manufacturers. But a Times investigation this year found that they often pursue their own financial interests in ways that increase costs for patients, employers and government programs, while driving independent pharmacies out of business. Regulators have accused the largest P.B.M.s of anticompetitive practices.…

If the show gets another season, and if they don't wrap up this main plot thread before the end of the season (which I hope they do!!!) this detour/connection between insurance companies and Big Pharma could maybe be an off-ramp for Matty's investigation into the Jacobson Moore law firm, and *maybe* even allow her and the show to become more like the OG Matlock.

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sugarbaker design

sugarbaker design

On 12/13/2024 at 10:27 AM, DanaK said:

That blowup was interesting and unexpected. Perhaps that could be what led the daughter to drugs, her parents were too busy to pay attention to her or perhaps too busy to see the early signs of drug use. It certainly continues to cast Matty and Edwin’s marriage in a different light from the initial sweetness and light we initially saw

Busy parenting doesn't lead to drug addiction.  Matty might feel that way deep down, but it just isn't true.

On 12/13/2024 at 12:10 PM, Daff said:

I agree. The past three-four episodes there have been events which make Matty stop and think-you can actually see it on her face-what part did I (we) play in daughter’s fall? She’s still hellbent though to find the drug company liable, but she’s beginning to accept they may have been a part of it, too.

This whole season, I imagine, is really Matty's journey of grief and guilt.  I know she and her husband outwardly blame the drug company and that document, but I don't even know if she realizes she's feeling so guilty.  I hope part of this season's story arc involves Matty learning something about addiction, how it's an awful disease. How the family/friends/loved ones didn't create it, they can't control it or cure it. While I usually love a revenge storyline, watching Matty go through all this is making me uncomfortable.  (I'd be much more comfortable if she went after Wellbrexa.) I just hope this season ends with Matty finding some kind of peace, not needing to blame anyone or anything for Ellie's death.

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schnauzergirl

schnauzergirl

6 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

A recent article examined another wrinkle in the link between "Big Pharma" and the opioid addiction crisis: “Giant Companies Took Secret Payments to Allow Free Flow of Opioids” ( free "gift" link:https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/17/business/pharmacy-benefit-managers-opioids.html?unlocked_article_code=1.iE4.qnnc.j42L6ckZyuez&smid=url-share)

If the show gets another season, and if they don't wrap up this main plot thread before the end of the season (which I hope they do!!!) this detour/connection between insurance companies and Big Pharma could maybe be an off-ramp for Matty's investigation into the Jacobson Moore law firm, and *maybe* even allow her and the show to become more like the OG Matlock.

It was renewed for season #2 right after the second or third episodes.  Not sure how long the current storyline will hold up, but can imagine a cliffhanger on the last episode of this season.

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Dowel Jones

Dowel Jones

"I really wish there wasn't a secret plot by Matty against the law firm or that she wasn't rich."  (Sorry, quote didn't copy as I had wished)

This is often the pitfall of series that rely on a secret.  They paint themselves into a corner.  You can't maintain the facade around the secret forever, and once it's exposed, the foundation of the series is shaky unless the writers can navigate to a new theme.

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Chicago Redshirt

Chicago Redshirt

19 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

I don't think they can because Matlock is practicing law under fake name and false credentials and probably all the cases she worked on would be thrown out.

The writers could have Matty realize the foolishness of her quest to hold any of the Jacobson Moore attorneys liable for their relatively small contributions to the opioid crisis, plus the ethical and legal shortcuts she is taking to get there and decide it's not worth it.

The writers could have her keep her real identity as Madeline Kingston a secret and decide that the best way to honor her daughter is to keep on as Madeline Mattlock and use her salary and bonuses as charity work.

The writers could have Matty discover Senior/Julian/Elijah/pretty-much-anyone-but-Olympia was behind the coverup and bring them to justice sooner rather than later.

The writers could have Olympia and Matlock start up their own pro-bono-only firm Lawrence Matlock/Kingston and take Sarah and Billy with them. In fact, I would love for them to regularly go up against the Jacobson Moore attorneys. They need revenge for that BS case with the Texas two-step.

Basically, the writers have a lot of leeway if they start to realize that the "Matty seeks revenge" thing is more of an albatross than it's worth, which, if the reaction in this forum is a good measure, it absolutely is.

Suits, another legal drama with an unsustainable premise, is illustrative. For those unfamiliar, the show was based on there being a fancy NY law firm so exclusive that it ONLY hired Harvard Law grads. The firm had a partner who hired someone who had a photographic memory but who had not even finished college to be a lawyer. So they hid the fact that he was a fraud and had drama about keeping that secret. Gradually other people within the firm became aware that he had not gone to Harvard and also participated in the coverup.At some point, the powers that be behind the show realized that they couldn't keep it going and had it come out, and had the fraud attorney pay the price for his lies, but then become a real attorney in a fast forward.

I think a lot of people would be fine with a show that just involves Matty getting her wins in court and life by being perpetually underestimated, Olympia being fabulous and the occasional contributions from the rest of the cast, whatever form that might take.  

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schnauzergirl

schnauzergirl

5 minutes ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

The writers could have Olympia and Matlock start up their own pro-bono-only firm Lawrence Matlock/Kingston and take Sarah and Billy with them. In fact, I would love for them to regularly go up against the Jacobson Moore attorneys. They need revenge for that BS case with the Texas two-step.

 

I've been thinking along these lines as a possibility for season #2.  It doesn't address whatever Olympia might feel learning of Maddy's lies, subterfuge, etc.  No quite sure how her real identity could remain hidden.  

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Percysowner

Percysowner

20 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

I don't think they can because Matlock is practicing law under fake name and false credentials and probably all the cases she worked on would be thrown out.

There are ways around it. it does seem as if she did maintain her bar license even after she stopped active practice. Her maiden name could, by coincidence, have been Matlock and she continued to use it when she practiced and never changed it as her professional name. Yes, I know she and Artie talked about how Matlock was his mom's favorite show, but it could have been her favorite BECAUSE he had the same name as her mother. She could have covered her bases and changed it legally, so she is practicing under proper credentials. Basically, there are ways that using her Madeline Matlock persona meets legal criteria.

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Chicago Redshirt

Chicago Redshirt

1 hour ago, Percysowner said:

There are ways around it. it does seem as if she did maintain her bar license even after she stopped active practice. Her maiden name could, by coincidence, have been Matlock and she continued to use it when she practiced and never changed it as her professional name. Yes, I know she and Artie talked about how Matlock was his mom's favorite show, but it could have been her favorite BECAUSE he had the same name as her mother. She could have covered her bases and changed it legally, so she is practicing under proper credentials. Basically, there are ways that using her Madeline Matlock persona meets legal criteria.

I think that they have established  that whatever her actual maiden name might have been, Madeline Kingston adopted the fake name "Matlock" as a nod to Ellie.

Now, presumably Madeline Kingston took steps to establish the "Madeline Matlock" identity and to make sure she was licensed in NY as such. Alfie could plausibly set up web sites and a fake online trial for Madeline Matlock, but I don't think his teenaged hacking could get Madeline Kingston admitted to the bar as Madeline Matlock. 

I really wish there were some people who could  have pushed back about this idea and pointed out all the problems with it and just been like "Let's just do a straightforward feel-good show with Kathy Bates as a clever lady who outwits people."

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peachmangosteen

peachmangosteen

(edited)
2 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

The writers could have Olympia and Matlock start up their own pro-bono-only firm Lawrence Matlock/Kingston and take Sarah and Billy with them. In fact, I would love for them to regularly go up against the Jacobson Moore attorneys.

This is what I've been wanting since the beginning but sadly I feel like it's the least possible outcome.

Edited by peachmangosteen
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Johannah

Johannah

(edited)
3 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

...

I think a lot of people would be fine with a show that just involves Matty getting her wins in court and life by being perpetually underestimated, Olympia being fabulous and the occasional contributions from the rest of the cast, whatever form that might take.  

Yes!  That is a show I could watch.  This one?  Not sure how much longer I can last.  I'm already fast forwarding through the conspiracy scenes.  I'm probably missing pertinent stuff about the COTW, but, it's better than getting pissed off.

Edited by Johannah
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GHScorpiosRule

GHScorpiosRule

5 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

The writers could have Olympia and Matlock start up their own pro-bono-only firm Lawrence Matlock/Kingston and take Sarah and Billy with them. In fact, I would love for them to regularly go up against the Jacobson Moore attorneys. They need revenge for that BS case with the Texas two-step.

You do realize that pro bono means representing at no charge? How would they be able to sustain such a firm if they only did pro bono work? Not possible. They would have to do work/take on cases for clients who can pay.

shapeshifter

shapeshifter

10 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

You do realize that pro bono means representing at no charge? How would they be able to sustain such a firm if they only did pro bono work? Not possible. They would have to do work/take on cases for clients who can pay.

How rich💰is Matty? Could she afford to support such an endeavor as a tax write-off?

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Nashville

Nashville

On 12/17/2024 at 6:30 PM, AnimeMania said:

I don't think they can because Matlock is practicing law under fake name and false credentials and probably all the cases she worked on would be thrown out.

Why?

  1. I could see a legal issue if Maddy were signing documents using a fake name, but at this point in time I strongly doubt Maddy’s signature is at issue; she’s preparing documents for signature by a partner in the firm, not signing them herself.
  2. A legitimate lawyer’s signature would most likely be required for any formal legal filings, but that doesn’t mean only lawyers can “touch” the case; there’s still a ton of non-lawyer staff (paralegals, researchers, admin support, etc.) who could be “hands on” with a document before formal filing is an issue - so Maddy’s participation in developing a case or document wouldn’t necessarily disqualify it from legal consideration.
shapeshifter

shapeshifter

18 minutes ago, Nashville said:

Why?

  1. I could see a legal issue if Maddy were signing documents using a fake name, but at this point in time I strongly doubt Maddy’s signature is at issue; she’s preparing documents for signature by a partner in the firm, not signing them herself.
  2. A legitimate lawyer’s signature would most likely be required for any formal legal filings, but that doesn’t mean only lawyers can “touch” the case; there’s still a ton of non-lawyer staff (paralegals, researchers, admin support, etc.) who could be “hands on” with a document before formal filing is an issue - so Maddy’s participation in developing a case or document wouldn’t necessarily disqualify it from legal consideration.

What about when Maddy stood up in court and defended the client?

Nashville

Nashville

2 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

What about when Maddy stood up in court and defended the client?

Didn’t see Maddy signing anything in the process, and so long as Olympia remained lawyer of record for the defense (and signed as such on all court filings) I doubt it would be an issue - and as time passes, it’s even less likely to become one.

There’s an adage in government circles which I suspect ports readily into the legal realm, if it hasn’t already: Truth doesn’t matter, documentation does - and in my experience the truthfulness of this adage only increases over time, as individual memories fade and the hardcopy record is increasingly relied upon as the definitive statement of past reality.

3-5 years from now hardly anybody present in the courtroom that day (outside of the defendant) will remember this case ever existed, much less that Maddy did the closing argument - and as time passes the likelihood of some future researcher uncovering this little nugget of knowledge decreases, unless they dig all the way down to the atomic level of the court reporter transcripts.

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Irlandesa

Irlandesa

9 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

How rich💰is Matty? Could she afford to support such an endeavor as a tax write-off?

She probably could set up a Project Innocence type of thing that she funds and fundraises for.

But they could also do a lot of cases on contingency if part of it is wanting to stand up to the "man." 

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