Chit-Chat: The Feels

[Soapy Goddess]

20 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

And who does she owe money to?

People who funded her campaign. Like Oprah, who took over 2 million dollars for her appearance at a rally for her.

[Soapy Goddess]

17 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

He had four years to do the wait & see game.

Yes, but he came in a novice. Most people aren't the same as they were 8 years ago. Politics is something that's learned. It's like a bad marriage. Hopefully, the second time around you learn what you did wrong and how to improve.

[Soapy Goddess]

6 hours ago, Annber03 said:

He and the GOP have zero interest in actually doing anything about the border. They will never fix it because if they do, then there goes their main campaign talking point.

I believe you have this backwards. It's always been the Dems that want more votes, legally or not.

 

6 hours ago, Annber03 said:

And if the GOP does go through with thier mass deportation plan, that is going to destroy our economy. Getting rid of immigrants, both those here legaly and those who aren't here legally, is not going to magically bring jobs back, nor is it going to magically make it easier for people who aren't immigrants to get jobs. Immigrants provide a significant benefit to our economy. Getting rid of them is asinine for a whole holst of reasons. 

Relax. Mass deportation of 11+ million people is ridiculous and never gonna happen. Since you like to regurgitate history, tell me why it's okay that millions of people were allowed to enter the US illegally over the last 4 years.

 

6 hours ago, Annber03 said:

we already saw how he handled our economy 

We did. And most people said they were better off under DJT than Biden. 

6 hours ago, Blergh said:

I only hope President Biden offered a personal apology to her (along with giving her a 'heads up' ) before he went through with the pardon.

According to all reports, he didn't tell her or even give her a heads up. Instead he had her repeatedly say "NO...it's not gonna happen". So either he was lying, or just decided one day to say fuck it, and not tell anyone.

[Annber03]

4 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

I believe you have this backwards. It's always been the Dems that want more votes, legally or not.

 

Uhhhhhh. Yeah. No. Which candidate was making calls in Georgia hoping to get more votes to ensure they won in 2020? 

(Hint: it wasn't the Democratic candidate.)

Quote

Relax. Mass deportation of 11+ million people is ridiculous and never gonna happen. Since you like to regurgitate history, tell me why it's okay that millions of people were allowed to enter the US illegally over the last 4 years.

I hope it won't happen, but we've also never had a president get the OK from the Supreme Court telling them they can do whatever the fuck they want while in office without consequences before, so...who knows. 

I'd be interested to see where you get your numbers on the amount of people who've come here illegally, and whether they actually fit the definition of "illegal". 

But either way, I'm just...not bothered by people coming acorss the border? Even those who don't always go through legal means to get here, because most of them have valid reasons for not going through all the hoops and red tape (fleeing dangerous situations, for instance), so I'm willing to be sympathetic to their reasons for coming here. 

And that argument does not negate my point that the fact remains that Trump has no interest in doing anything about the issues at our border. Nor does the GOP. Not anyting actually serious and beneficial to both immigrants and those of us who were born and raised here, anyway. 

Quote

We did. And most people said they were better off under DJT than Biden. 

And those people would be sorely mistaken and are blaming Biden for economic issues that he did not cause. The fact remains that inflation was much lower here compared to other countries, and we had job growth during Biden's time in office. Any prices going up were the result of corporations playing price gouging games, an issue that Biden, and Harris, have both tried to control and would've continued to try and control, had Harris won.

I'm not sure how anyone can look at how he handled the pandemic and still think he was better than Biden, for instance. That did a number on our economy, and BIden and the Democrats had to come in and clean up that mess. You know, like they always do every time the Republicans drive our economy into the ditch. 

But hey, if you'd like to explain to me how Trump's tariffs are going to make your average working family's financial burdens any easier, or how women who are forced to have children they may not be able to afford how that'll benefit their finances, I sure would love to hear it. 

[FilmTVGeek80]

19 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

I believe you have this backwards. It's always been the Dems that want more votes, legally or not.

I'm sorry, it's you who is backward. Can you please provide some examples of Democrats illegally trying to procure votes? As Annber03 pointed out, it's 45 who has a history of trying to get votes by illegal means.

 

21 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Relax. Mass deportation of 11+ million people is ridiculous and never gonna happen. Since you like to regurgitate history, tell me why it's okay that millions of people were allowed to enter the US illegally over the last 4 years.

Please don't tell people to relax. Even if these mass deportations don't happen, it won't be for lack of trying on that orange sociopath's part.  Who was it that tried to get a border bill passed? The Biden administration. Who stopped it? The bloated gas bag that is about to slither back to The White House. Let's not pretend the right actually cares about the issue of illegal immigration. 

26 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

According to all reports, he didn't tell her or even give her a heads up. Instead he had her repeatedly say "NO...it's not gonna happen". So either he was lying, or just decided one day to say fuck it, and not tell anyone.

He's the president and gets to make that call, whether that means he changed his mind. After 45 decided to nominate a crackpot who wants to focus on revenge for his enemies to head the FBI, it's pretty easy to see why no parent would leave the fate of their child to that band of psychos.

[Soapy Goddess]

31 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I'm just...not bothered by people coming acorss the border? Even those who don't always go through legal means to get here, because most of them have valid reasons for not going through all the hoops and red tape (fleeing dangerous situations, for instance), so I'm willing to be sympathetic to their reasons for coming here. 

The only thing they're fleeing is poverty. And that doesn't give them the right to cross our borders illegally. And it's not fair to those who have come into our country legally. The buck has to stop somewhere. We can't keep supporting the entire countries of Middle America, etc.

36 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

And those people would be sorely mistaken and are blaming Biden for economic issues that he did not cause.

And that would be your opinion.

 

36 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

I'm not sure how anyone can look at how he handled the pandemic and still think he was better than Biden

He did fast-track the vaccine. What did Biden do?

 

37 minutes ago, Annber03 said:

But hey, if you'd like to explain to me how Trump's tariffs are going to make your average working family's financial burdens any easier, or how women who are forced to have children they may not be able to afford how that'll benefit their finances, I sure would love to hear it.

Tariffs can be negotiated...as witnessed by Truedeau.

For the record, I'm on your side when it comes to abortion. It should remain legal everywhere!  But that said, DJT said he was going to leave it up to each individual state.

[anony.miss]

1 hour ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Like Oprah, who took over 2 million dollars for her appearance at a rally for her.

Winfrey denied that lie weeks ago:

"Oprah Winfrey on Monday shut down a report that Kamala Harris’ failed presidential campaign paid her $1 million to stump for the Democrat.

“I was paid nothing — ever,” Winfrey told a TMZ reporter who approached her as she walked to her car.

"..The campaign paid for the production costs of ‘Unite for America,’ a livestreaming event that took place Sept. 19 outside Detroit, Mich.,” a Harpo spokesperson said in a statement to Variety. “Oprah Winfrey was at no point during the campaign paid a personal fee, nor did she receive a fee from Harpo.”

https://nypost.com/2024/11/12/us-news/oprah-winfrey-denies-report-that-harris-campaign-paid-her-1-million-i-was-paid-nothing-ever/

I find it a particularly ugly trashing two exceptional Black women by painting them as a pimp & his greedy ho, but that's where Republican media is today, sadly.  I also (call me crazy!) think it's only right that Harris pay the companies that provided her campaign with services -  too bad Trump has refused to do the same.

Edited December 3 by anony.miss

[Soapy Goddess]

9 minutes ago, anony.miss said:

Winfrey denied that lie weeks ago:

"Oprah Winfrey on Monday shut down a report that Kamala Harris’ failed presidential campaign paid her $1 million to stump for the Democrat.

She only denied that SHE (personally) didn't receive any money. However, her production company DID get paid. And for the record, I was only using Oprah as an example. Everyone from Springsteen, Beyonce, etc. were ALL PAID to show up and/or perform. Harris spent over a BILLION dollars of campaign funds, mostly going to celebrities. And it's a fact that she still owes over 2 million.

Edited December 3 by Soapy Goddess

[Anela]

1 hour ago, Soapy Goddess said:

You misunderstood. I meant votes cast by illegals.

 

Sorry, but when I read some of these replies, I get the feeling that somebody is either going to bust an aneurysm or have a heart attack. Because all this negativity can and does have an effect on the human body.

Let's face it, everything written here is pure speculation. Yes, you all base your opinions (and that's ALL they are for now!) on past behavior, but that can change. I'm not willing to spike my BP based on speculation. If I'm wrong, then I'll get a prescription. 

My mother died from an aortic aneurysm bursting, and it wasn't negativity that created it. Unless you count her being moved out of the mostly quiet heart ward, and up to the top floor, the busy, loud, Medicare ward, because people with money and/or good insurance, were prioritized.

Also, please stop telling us to relax, it will never happen, when that's exactly what we were told about roe being overturned. Now there is more talk about gay marriage being taken away, birth control being banned, etc. 

53 minutes ago, MostlyContent said:

The open border.  It backfired.  

IMO, the Democrats were rather counting on the Latino vote being in their corner ....pretty much forever.  Seeing the massive influx of illegals flooding across the border and the massive amount of money being spent on *not* enforcing the law, the people who are here legally and may have waited for years in order to do so don't much care for those who cut in line. Add in the fact that a large percentage are Catholic, and not as subject to abortion angst as some just leads to the fact that 55% of Latino males voted Republican as concerns their choice for the presidency. 

Edited to add:  I'm certainly not talking about illegal people voting in the elections.  Rather, the Democrats counting on a lot of them eventually being given citizenship which would, they thought, add to the + side of votes for the Democrats.  

 

Well, they do.  

The immigration bill wasn't killed so much by Trump's influence, but because it did nothing to address the real problem and actually allowed a higher number of illegal border crossings a day than we have now, which is ridiculous.   

I realize that all 'sides' ascribe different motivations to different actions, but border issues are one of the main issues ranked highly by most Republicans.  Whether or not one agrees, that's a fact.  

 

I agree. You know, the right of the president to pardon *whoever* is a peculiar right of every president.   While each 'side' may quibble and bitch about the choices, they have the right to do it.  And........c'mon!  If it were my son, I'd most likely do the same thing in the same set of circumstances.  Biden probably doesn't know who he can trust at this time.  

Trump told the republicans to kill the border deal that Biden and Kamala set up. the same deal that had some Democrats complaining, because they were basically acting like republicans. Trump wanted to ruin anything that might have Biden looking good in general. He does not care about this country, or any of us. That's proven by who he's appointing for various jobs. 

Edited December 3 by Anela

[anony.miss]

2 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

 However, her production company DID get paid.

Yes, it's in the quote I included - how is Harris hiring Harpo productions to produce their town hall nefarious?  It's a highly regarded media company with an excellent track record.  If the company sucked and Harris hired them anyway, that might raise an eyebrow,  or if she'd paid Oprah to endorse her, that would feel off, but none of that applies.

And given her history with Obama, Oprah was going to endorse the first female WOC presidential candidate come hell or high water, so I'm not seeing the big "Oprah got bought!" scandalo! here.

Quote

Everyone from Springsteen, Beyonce, etc. were ALL PAID to show up and/or perform.

They weren't paid - that's just another right wing rumor that  started on Facebook/jumped to right wing media, and has been debunked:

"A Nov. 12 Facebook post claims Vice President Kamala Harris spent millions of dollars to convince celebrities to endorse and campaign for her. "This is how much Kamala Harris paid artists to publicly support her!" reads the post's caption. "Beyoncé $10 million, Megan Thee Stallion $5 million, Lizzo $3 million, Eminem $1.8 million."

Similar claims were found elsewhere on Facebook with differing amounts of money listed. Some posts added Oprah Winfrey to the list"

As for Beyonce:

"Tina Knowles, Beyonce’s mom, said on Instagram that claims her daughter was paid $10 million for speaking at a Harris rally are false. ”Beyonce did not receive a penny for speaking at a Presidential candidate Vice President Kamala Harrris's Rally in Houston,” the post says in part. “In fact she actually paid for her own flights for her and her team, and total Glam.”

A source close to the situation similarly told USA TODAY that Megan Thee Stallion was not paid for her endorsement.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2024/11/25/harris-endorsements-oprah-beyonce-eminem-fact-check/76499666007/

More proof nobody was paid: "There are no payments for celebrity endorsements listed in campaign finance reports from the campaign."

Edited December 3 by anony.miss

[tearknee]

14 hours ago, Bastet said:

 

 

I know it's just a co-incidence but seeing that name...:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Wright

[andromeda331]

I really don't get the big deal about undocumented immigants  crossing the border. Their coming from crappy countries for a better life. How is it different from coming on boats for a better life? Their willing to do the work that no one in this country will do. They make up majority of working in the fields, constructions and restaurants. 

Edited December 5 by andromeda331

[SweetieDarling]

5 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

I'm sorry, it's you who is backward. Can you please provide some examples of Democrats illegally trying to procure votes? As Annber03 pointed out, it's 45 who has a history of trying to get votes by illegal means.

https://www.inquirer.com/politics/election/bucks-county-commissioners-meeting-republican-activists-diane-ellis-marseglia-20241120.html

Quote

Ellis-Marseglia, in justifying her vote to count provisional ballots that lacked one of two required voter signatures, declared that court precedent no longer mattered in the U.S. and said she was taking her vote to get a court’s attention. “People violate laws any time they want,” she said.

 

[Spartan Girl]

This year’s White House Christmas decorations are lovely. I like the carnival Christmas tree.

I am so sad that we’re going to have to go back to Melania’s crappy decorations knowing full well that she doesn’t give a damn. 

[Ohiopirate02]

4 hours ago, Anela said:

Also, please stop telling us to relax, it will never happen, when that's exactly what we were told about roe being overturned. Now there is more talk about gay marriage being taken away, birth control being banned, etc.

I don't see a nationwide ban on birth control or gay marriage, but the states with Republican legislatures and governors will have laws passed to restrict these things. The birth control stuff will happen because the Right is willfully ignorant on how the menstrual cycle and pregnancy work. They believe emergency contraceptive is the same thing as mifepristone (the so-called abortion pill) as well as believing IUDs are also abortifacients because they prevent implantation because "life" begins when the sperm meets the egg full stop. These are the same people who think doctors can go in remove an ectopic pregnancy and reimplant the embryo in the uterus resulting in a healthy baby. Also the same people who firmly believe a D and C done after a women miscarries is somehow not an abortion even though the medical codes say it is.

[bluegirl147]

7 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

And I know Trump and MAGA don't care about this little detail but he was guilty of all the crimes he was charged with. It's not like they went after an innocent man. Nope, not only did he did it all. It's no secret that he committed all the crimes.

Trump has no problem admitting he did illegal things. He just doesn't think they are illegal.  Yeah sure he asked GA Secretary of State to find votes for him.  He  just wanted every vote counted.  Yeah sure he took classified documents but he could make them not classified just by thinking it. Yeah sure he told his cult to go storm the Capitol on Jan 6th.  He just wanted to stop the steal that was happening.  He is the living example of if you don't like the law get the law changed.  But just for him. Everyone else  has to follow the laws.  Well maybe not his Republican friends.  But everyone else does.

7 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

I think Mitt was on Team Trump for a spell before bailing out.

Trump dangled Secretary of State in front of him in 2016. He was never going to nominate him. He just wanted him to come to Trump Tower and kiss the ring.

 

[fastiller]

7 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Quick question: are there ANY Republicans that have not bent a knee to him in the past ten years? While I appreciate any opposition within the GOP, it always feels like that seems from negative dealings with him.

=&=

7 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

The only ones I can think of are Liz Chany and Mitt Romney, look what happened to their careers.

And Adam Kinzinger.  Like @andromeda331 said: look what happened to his career.  Some pundits (Lincoln Project, Ana Navarro, a few others) were & still are vocally non-knee-bendy.

[bluegirl147]

7 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

It's always been the Dems that want more votes, legally or not.

And it's always Republicans who want to suppress the vote.  But just of those they think are Democrats.

7 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Relax. Mass deportation of 11+ million people is ridiculous and never gonna happen.

Even if that doesn't happen it has scared people. And that is so very often the point with Trump.  The cruelty is the feature not the bug.

6 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

The only thing they're fleeing is poverty.

The only thing?  Isn't that enough?  You know what comes with poverty? Crime. Substance abuse.  Preventable diseases.  Higher infant mortality.  Shorter lifespans.  We see it in our country that has (at least for now) some form a safety net.  

6 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

But that said, DJT said he was going to leave it up to each individual state

And if you live in an anti choice state then I guess  you are just shit out of luck you won't be able to have a reproductive choice. Or not die from a miscarriage. 

4 hours ago, anony.miss said:

They weren't paid - that's just another right wing rumor that  started on Facebook/jumped to right wing media, and has been debunked:

Those particular celebs have endorsed and supported previous Democratic Presidents.  To act like they had to be paid to do the same with Kamala Harris is ridiculous.

 

[Ohiopirate02]

9 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

Those particular celebs have endorsed and supported previous Democratic Presidents.  To act like they had to be paid to do the same with Kamala Harris is ridiculous.

Springsteen in particular has been very consistent on his politics for the last 45 years.

[Yeah No]

On 11/30/2024 at 1:27 AM, Annber03 said:

I stayed out of the "screaming at someone with an ugly truck" conversation myself, but I just want to repeat once again that, speaking on a general level,we do not have to be kind or tolerant or accepting towards people who actively are trying to take away our and other people's basic civil and human rights. Or who already have done so (see all the abortion bans). 

If somebody really does not get why we are legitimately angry about that and those who support that, to the point of not bothering to have anything nice to say about or to people who voted for that, then I truly don't know what to tell them. If people aren't going to be kind or accepting or tolerant of us, then they don't get to be surprised or shocked if people respond and treat them the same way in turn. That whole pesky Golden Rule thing, and all that. 

I'm all for getting one's frustrations out in a healthy, constructive way, but only along the way of making some kind of positive change for the better. Watch out how you do it or it might only perpetuate the cycle of hate, not solve anything. And that's not the world I want to live in.

This "tit for tat" mentality gets us nowhere. We have to model the world we want to live in, not continually react with anger and hate to everything and everyone that offends us. It only makes us unable to defeat them because we're bogged down in reacting, not making real, positive change. And it only makes them hate us more. It solves nothing in the long run.

On 11/30/2024 at 1:58 AM, FilmTVGeek80 said:

You're at a loss over what? Some people are making a mountain out of a molehill. She didn't jump out of the car and beat someone up. She yelled an obscenity - and not even directly at the person.

As far as I remember the post did not specify whether calling them an asshole was audible to the person in the car. It did not state whether the windows were open or how close they were either. And in this era of escalating road rage it's not an unrealistic assumption to imagine that they might hear it or even see us mouth the word. People yell obscenities at each other from car windows all the time and yes, the occupants can often hear them or even see them mouth the words. And that's often enough to spark a road rage incident. And that's not in my opinion "making a mountain out of a molehill".

I don't want to put down someone getting out their anger, but once it is directed at people we don't know just because they own a certain kind of car that's to me not a valid assumption nor a constructive way to do it. Making those kinds of assumptions targets and "profiles" people unfairly. Like me walking into my apartment building in the '80s and the anti-abortion demonstrators assumed I was going into the clinic. Not a valid assumption. And making those assumptions might possibly get us in trouble. Any time we allow our emotions to get the better of us it can lead to something we didn't foresee. One minute we're just yelling "asshole" at some guy we didn't think could hear us and the next minute he's running our car off into a ditch and we're fighting for our lives. If you think that's an unlikely situation I advise learning a bit about road rage incidents.

My husband drives for a living and the stories he tells are shocking. He once raised his hand in his car and the driver next to him thought he was giving him the finger and tried to run him off the road. Dangerous stuff. So it's just not plain good common sense to yell obscenities in your car at someone if there's any chance at all that they might even see you mouth the words!

But even beyond that it's not a mountain out of a molehill if you yell obscenities at people in any situation where they might possibly hear you because again, it only perpetuates the cycle of hate and solves nothing, plus it can ultimately get you retribution or in trouble with the law if it escalates. And again, I think it's better to put one's energies into modeling the world we want to live in, not continually react with anger and emotion to people we barely know just because they voted a certain way or own a certain kind of car.

[Dimity]

24 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

Even if that doesn't happen it has scared people. And that is so very often the point with Trump.  The cruelty is the feature not the bug.

Cruelty has always been a Trumpism.  Some people want to believe this is his He Man Tough Guy image but underneath he's a pussycat.  No.  Underneath is a sociopath.

[bluegirl147]

1 minute ago, Dimity said:

Underneath is a sociopath.

Not so much underneath anymore.

[Dimity]

26 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

To act like they had to be paid to do the same with Kamala Harris is ridiculous.

This is what I will never understand about Trump and the cult. Even when they win they can't stop lying.  About everything.  Every single thing.

[bluegirl147]

1 minute ago, Dimity said:

This is what I will never understand about Trump and the cult. Even when they win they can't stop lying.  About everything.  Every single thing.

It tracks though.  After the Women's March in 2017 they were all saying everyone that went was paid by George Soros.  If that was true why didn't I get a check?

They think Democrats have to be paid to support Democrats.  Meanwhile Elon Musk was in Pennsylvania wanting to pay bribe voters with a million dollars a day.

[Dimity]

7 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

Meanwhile Elon Musk was in Pennsylvania wanting to pay bribe voters with a million dollars a day.

Whatever happened with that BTW?  And interesting you bring up Musk - why is it the Republicans are aces with two billionaires essentially buying the White House (Musk and Theil) but are working themselves into a lather over the fake possibility that Harris and/or Biden paid a celebrity to endorse them?  Deeply weird.

Edited December 3 by Dimity

[fastiller]

4 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

 After the Women's March in 2017 they were all saying everyone that went was paid by George Soros.  If that was true why didn't I get a check?

Wait, so I'm not the only one waiting for my check from Soros?

[Yeah No]

On 12/2/2024 at 10:20 AM, Eri said:

And this is why they (Democrats) will continue to lose elections. They sit and fight with each other while the Republicans will vote in a 70 million strong bloc every election no matter what. While the Democrats have different views and alignments on the political spectrum, Republicans largely do NOT. Even the least radical conservatives share the same beliefs as the radicals, just expressed more quietly and gently. Until the Dems truly align themselves as a voting bloc, as a coalition, and majorly reform our electoral system, nothing will change.

I have said this here a few times myself. Only I think Republicans do differ on some things, it's just that those things aren't important enough to them to get them to vote Democratic because of the successful campaign of fear and misinformation spread by the most vocal Republican mouthpieces about the things that ARE more important to them.

Many Republicans are socially liberal but fiscally conservative. They somehow put up with the social conservatives because the fiscal fears put in them by their candidates and commentators would make voting Democratic even worse to them than voting Republican even if it means looking the other way on their positions on the social issues.

Somehow Democrats don't have that kind of hold on their electorate. Even calling Republicans "fascists" or "a threat to our democracy" doesn't seem to be enough to scare them into getting up and voting Democratic. But tell a Republican that Democrats want to raise taxes, empty their wallets and let "illegals" come live in their neighborhoods and the fear of that keeps them voting Republican even if they believe in gay marriage and abortion. As long as it doesn't affect THEM they can turn their backs on those social issues.

Edited December 3 by Yeah No
Had to clarify something.

[bluegirl147]

4 minutes ago, fastiller said:

Wait, so I'm not the only one waiting for my check from Soros?

Maybe he only paid the celebs like Madonna and Scarlett Johansson.  After all the rest of us were just a bunch of fat (their word) lesbians.   I saw that description used so many times in the comments on stories about the March.

That March had young people. Old people. Women. Men. Kids.  White people. People of color. It really was reflective of what this country is.  Meanwhile Trump rallies all looked the same. 

[Ohiopirate02]

23 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

It tracks though.  After the Women's March in 2017 they were all saying everyone that went was paid by George Soros.  If that was true why didn't I get a check?

They think Democrats have to be paid to support Democrats.  Meanwhile Elon Musk was in Pennsylvania wanting to pay bribe voters with a million dollars a day.

Part of this is because the Trump campaign has paid people to show up to his events. Back in 2020 there were screenshots of the Craigslist ads looking for people to attend the rallies circulating on the internet. By their logic, if Trump is paying for people to attend his rallies and possibly also paying celebrities like Kid Rock or Hulk Hogan to show up at his events, why wouldn't the Dems be doing the same?

I honestly do not know if any of the D-list celebrities who have shown up on stage with Trump were paid, but it would not surprise me to find out they were. I also would not be surprised to find out they actually never got paid for their appearances because Trump has a track record of not paying his bills.

[tearknee]

Most people didn't March in 2017.

That's how Nixon won twice.

How Reagan won twice (although running someone named Fritz was worse than if they had proffered JC again).

And how Trump won twice.

Brexit was another non-heeded warning.

Edited December 3 by tearknee

[peacheslatour]

2 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

Trump has no problem admitting he did illegal things. He just doesn't think they are illegal.  Yeah sure he asked GA Secretary of State to find votes for him.  He  just wanted every vote counted.  Yeah sure he took classified documents but he could make them not classified just by thinking it. Yeah sure he told his cult to go storm the Capitol on Jan 6th.  He just wanted to stop the steal that was happening.  He is the living example of if you don't like the law get the law changed.  But just for him. Everyone else  has to follow the laws.  Well maybe not his Republican friends.  But everyone else does.

Trump dangled Secretary of State in front of him in 2016. He was never going to nominate him. He just wanted him to come to Trump Tower and kiss the ring.

 

Mitt looks like he wants to cry.

 

[Eri]

4 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Many Republicans are socially liberal but fiscally conservative. They somehow put up with the social conservatives because the fiscal fears put in them by their candidates and commentators would make voting Democratic even worse to them than voting Republican even if it means looking the other way on their positions on the social issues.

But tell a Republican that Democrats want to raise taxes, empty their wallets and let "illegals" come live in their neighborhoods and the fear of that keeps them voting Republican even if they believe in gay marriage and abortion. As long as it doesn't affect THEM they can turn their backs on those social issues.

Yes, that fear = racism / xenophobia / homophobia / sexism / "other-ism" 

I'm not directing my comment at you personally, but rather making a general observation – it shouldn't be overly complicated. I don't care if someone is gay/pro-choice and is a Republican, they are supporting the politicians who want to make my life more difficult (health-wise), who want to reduce my place/standing in society (socially) and who associate, often openly now, with people who want me dead (physically). So if there was a rhetorical question asking me "if someone is gay or support abortion rights and associated Republican, are they anti-gay/anti-abortion?" The answer is yes, a hundred, a thousand times, yes.

Edited December 3 by Eri

[FilmTVGeek80]

10 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

You misunderstood. I meant votes cast by illegals.

 

Sorry, but when I read some of these replies, I get the feeling that somebody is either going to bust an aneurysm or have a heart attack. Because all this negativity can and does have an effect on the human body.

Let's face it, everything written here is pure speculation. Yes, you all base your opinions (and that's ALL they are for now!) on past behavior, but that can change. I'm not willing to spike my BP based on speculation. If I'm wrong, then I'll get a prescription. 

Votes by illegals? That’s happening where? I asked for facts supporting your claim that Dems are soliciting illegal votes. That’s not proof, but a Republican fantasy.

It’s great that you’re probably in such a safe demographic that you don’t have to worry about the horrific things 45 has planned and stated he wants to do - that they won’t aversely affect you. You can just sit back and hope for the best. Many people don’t have that luxury. A lot of us base our speculation on FACTS, not just wishing for the best because that’s what we want to believe. What in the past almost decade of 45 showing us who he is says that his behavior is going to change? What in the appointments he’s making suggests someone with learned experience looking to surround himself with the best? But, good luck with that prescription given the crackpot he wants to put in charge of all of our health.

9 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

She only denied that SHE (personally) didn't receive any money. However, her production company DID get paid. And for the record, I was only using Oprah as an example. Everyone from Springsteen, Beyonce, etc. were ALL PAID to show up and/or perform. Harris spent over a BILLION dollars of campaign funds, mostly going to celebrities. And it's a fact that she still owes over 2 million.

I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make here. Is there some indication she won’t pay whoever is owed money? Sorry, she’s not 45 who proudly stiffs everyone who is stupid enough to trust that he’ll pay them for their services.

9 hours ago, MostlyContent said:

The open border.  It backfired.  

IMO, the Democrats were rather counting on the Latino vote being in their corner ....pretty much forever.  Seeing the massive influx of illegals flooding across the border and the massive amount of money being spent on *not* enforcing the law, the people who are here legally and may have waited for years in order to do so don't much care for those who cut in line. Add in the fact that a large percentage are Catholic, and not as subject to abortion angst as some just leads to the fact that 55% of Latino males voted Republican as concerns their choice for the presidency. 

Edited to add:  I'm certainly not talking about illegal people voting in the elections.  Rather, the Democrats counting on a lot of them eventually being given citizenship which would, they thought, add to the + side of votes for the Democrats.  

 

Well, they do.  

The immigration bill wasn't killed so much by Trump's influence, but because it did nothing to address the real problem and actually allowed a higher number of illegal border crossings a day than we have now, which is ridiculous.   

I realize that all 'sides' ascribe different motivations to different actions, but border issues are one of the main issues ranked highly by most Republicans.  Whether or not one agrees, that's a fact.  

 

There’s absolutely no evidence whatsoever that Dems want an open border and certainly not to help with elections. Plus, how is immigrant becoming legal citizens and then voting legally an example of Dems soliciting illegal votes?

45 proudly declared he killed that bill which had bipartisan support. It wasn’t going to fix everything but was going to do more than the fat lot of nothing the Republicans have done. Oh, wait, they barely built a wall…that did nothing. 
 

Republican voters care about immigration. The Republicans in Congress only care about so much as to use it as a scare tactic to get votes. Not because they want to solve the problem. 

3 hours ago, Yeah No said:

 

As far as I remember the post did not specify whether calling them an asshole was audible to the person in the car. It did not state whether the windows were open or how close they were either. And in this era of escalating road rage it's not an unrealistic assumption to imagine that they might hear it or even see us mouth the word. People yell obscenities at each other from car windows all the time and yes, the occupants can often hear them or even see them mouth the words. And that's often enough to spark a road rage incident. And that's not in my opinion "making a mountain out of a molehill".

I don't want to put down someone getting out their anger, but once it is directed at people we don't know just because they own a certain kind of car that's to me not a valid assumption nor a constructive way to do it. Making those kinds of assumptions targets and "profiles" people unfairly. Like me walking into my apartment building in the '80s and the anti-abortion demonstrators assumed I was going into the clinic. Not a valid assumption. And making those assumptions might possibly get us in trouble. Any time we allow our emotions to get the better of us it can lead to something we didn't foresee. One minute we're just yelling "asshole" at some guy we didn't think could hear us and the next minute he's running our car off into a ditch and we're fighting for our lives. If you think that's an unlikely situation I advise learning a bit about road rage incidents.

 

But even beyond that it's not a mountain out of a molehill if you yell obscenities at people in any situation where they might possibly hear you because again, it only perpetuates the cycle of hate and solves nothing, plus it can ultimately get you retribution or in trouble with the law if it escalates. And again, I think it's better to put one's energies into modeling the world we want to live in, not continually react with anger and emotion to people we barely know just because they voted a certain way or own a certain kind of car.

I’m well aware that road rage is a real thing. Which is why I don’t do things to provoke other drivers - or try not to. And yet, I also don’t feel the need to shame someone for ONE incident that happened ages ago and resulted in no harm. So, yes, I think you’re making a mountain out of a molehill over a small anecdote/incident that’s probably been forgotten about by the original commenter and the other driver - who if they even saw or heard the obscenity probably moved on with their life because it wasn’t a big deal to them. 

[bluegirl147]

9 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

I’m well aware that road rage is a real thing.

Why is it always us that get criticized for letting off some steam?

Back in 2016 I saw a truck that had it's tailgate painted with a picture of Hillary saying Benghazi Bitch.  That is what I consider road rage.

[anony.miss]

5 hours ago, SweetieDarling said:

https://www.inquirer.com/politics/election/bucks-county-commissioners-meeting-republican-activists-diane-ellis-marseglia-20241120.html

Ellis-Marseglia, in justifying her vote to count provisional ballots that lacked one of two required voter signatures, declared that court precedent no longer mattered in the U.S. and said she was taking her vote to get a court’s attention. “People violate laws any time they want,” she said.

 

Thanks for the link to the article you quoted - the reporting makes it clear nothing illegal is happening:

"Casey has used standard legal procedures to fight for as many remaining provisional and mail ballots as possible to be counted as the race plays out, but the county-level wrangling over ballots has led to accusations from Republicans that Democrats are attempting to “steal” the race."

I appreciate Marseglia clarifying her comment about legal precendent:

"Her reference to court precedent not mattering, she said, was a comment on the U.S. Supreme Court’s decision to overturn Roe v. Wade. Since her comments went viral, Ellis-Marseglia said, she has faced threats and vitriol."

More violence and hate - somebody really needs to warn Trumpers that threatening to harm people they disagree with helped fuel two Trumpers trying to kill off Donald J.

 

Edited December 3 by anony.miss

[tearknee]

20 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

Why is it always us that get criticized for letting off some steam?

Back in 2016 I saw a truck that had it's tailgate painted with a picture of Hillary saying Benghazi Bitch.  That is what I consider road rage.

Looks down at the hell my egg donor is hopefully burning in and then lifts my head back up and states forcefully that i don't have any time for collective solidarity just because of gender.

HRC was the wrong candidate in 2016 but it because she was HRC and not a cleanskin with no baggage from the 1990s. Voters were sick of the Clintons and the prospect of First Gentleman Bill did not help this feeling.

With ordinary normal people/voters, it's optics and emotional impressions that matter. Not HRC's academic or policy qualifications. That she was a staffer on the team that investigated Watergate - which, by 2016, was 42 years ago, made her seem even more of a relic of an earlier age.

[lookeyloo]

13 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

People who funded her campaign. Like Oprah, who took over 2 million dollars for her appearance at a rally for her.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2024/nov/13/instagram-posts/records-show-harris-campaign-paid-winfreys-company/

[anony.miss]

5 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

Those particular celebs have endorsed and supported previous Democratic Presidents.  To act like they had to be paid to do the same with Kamala Harris is ridiculous.

I agree  - and the story overall is suspicious as to motive, since it's not even illegal to pay for an endorsement (as long as you list it on your campaign finance forms). So why build and spread this lie?  Because it's meant to invoke ugly old stereotypes about Black women being morally corrupt, unable to succeed/get ahead/be endorsed based on skills and talent (and for Oprah, able to be bought by the highest bidder, despite being a billionaire herself). And of course the right wing media ran with it, filling the heads of their viewers with a complete lie (as they did with the "Haitians are eating people's pets!" crap).  Same as it ever was with right wing media, but I still find it repulsive every time they pull this shit.

Edited December 3 by anony.miss

[bluegirl147]

16 minutes ago, tearknee said:

Looks down at the hell my egg donor is hopefully burning in and then lifts my head back up and states forcefully that i don't have any time for collective solidarity just because of gender.

HRC was the wrong candidate in 2016 but it because she was HRC and not a cleanskin with no baggage from the 1990s. Voters were sick of the Clintons and the prospect of First Gentleman Bill did not help this feeling.

With ordinary normal people/voters, it's optics and emotional impressions that matter. Not HRC's academic or policy qualifications. That she was a staffer on the team that investigated Watergate - which, by 2016, was 42 years ago, made her seem even more of a relic of an earlier age.

My point was this person took a lot of time and effort to do that.  I hate Trump but I would not paint my car to show my hatred.

[peacheslatour]

35 minutes ago, tearknee said:

Looks down at the hell my egg donor is hopefully burning in and then lifts my head back up and states forcefully that i don't have any time for collective solidarity just because of gender.

HRC was the wrong candidate in 2016 but it because she was HRC and not a cleanskin with no baggage from the 1990s. Voters were sick of the Clintons and the prospect of First Gentleman Bill did not help this feeling.

With ordinary normal people/voters, it's optics and emotional impressions that matter. Not HRC's academic or policy qualifications. That she was a staffer on the team that investigated Watergate - which, by 2016, was 42 years ago, made her seem even more of a relic of an earlier age.

I voted for her in 2016 because even back then I knew that Donald Trump was evil. Hilary was just another corporate left-center politician but she wasn't going to fuck the country over. Think how much better her handling of the pandemic would have been. She would have listened to the experts and not demonized poor Fauci who knows more about immunology than anyone else in the world.  W. even gave him Presidential Medal of Freedom. But Trump's ego wouldn't let him give anyone else the spotlight and attention he feels he himself deserves.

[bluegirl147]

3 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Think how much better her handling of the pandemic would have been.

Not just that. Think of who wouldn't have been appointed to the SCOTUS. Roe would have been safe.

[Dimity]

[partofme]

1 hour ago, tearknee said:

HRC was the wrong candidate in 2016 but it because she was HRC and not a cleanskin with no baggage from the 1990s. Voters were sick of the Clintons and the prospect of First Gentleman Bill did not help this feeling.

I don’t know if it makes me weird but I was very excited to vote for Hillary and would have loved for Bill to be First Gentleman.  My vote wasn’t a reluctant vote.  I voted for Hillary in the primary, as well as the 2008 primary.  I also had the honor of voting for her in the 2000 New York Senate primary and general election and again in 2006.  

[Dimity]

I love Hilary Clinton, she's awesome as far as I'm concerned.  And please, I'd love to know why reporters continually barrage her with questions about why she stayed with Bill after he cheated but there's crickets with regard to Melania.  Bloody, damn crickets. 

[peacheslatour]

9 minutes ago, partofme said:

I don’t know if it makes me weird but I was very excited to vote for Hillary and would have loved for Bill to be First Gentleman.  My vote wasn’t a reluctant vote.  I voted for Hillary in the primary, as well as the 2008 primary.  I also had the honor of voting for her in the 2000 New York Senate primary and general election and again in 2006.  

She was unquestionably more qualified, smarter with more experience in the world of politics. I voted for her but it wasn't like the thrill of voting for Obama. That was such an exciting time. I felt like our country had finally evolved past a lot of the racism and prejudice of the past. While he was in office, marriage equality happened, we got Bin Laden and in my little corner of the country we were euphoric because we got legal weed and the Seahawks won the Super Bowl. Good times.

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, peacheslatour said:

I voted for her in 2016 because even back then I knew that Donald Trump was evil. Hilary was just another corporate left-center politician but she wasn't going to fuck the country over. Think how much better her handling of the pandemic would have been. She would have listened to the experts and not demonized poor Fauci who knows more about immunology than anyone else in the world.  W. even gave him Presidential Medal of Freedom. But Trump's ego wouldn't let him give anyone else the spotlight and attention he feels he himself deserves.

 

1 hour ago, bluegirl147 said:

Not just that. Think of who wouldn't have been appointed to the SCOTUS. Roe would have been safe.

And all this is why I hate the third-party and non voters probably more than anyone. I hate the MAGA cult, but at this point, it’s a disinterested kind of anger, more of a reflex, because as the saying goes, never expect more than a grunt from a pig. But the others? They knew what was at stake, they saw what happened in 2016, yet they did it to us again. We tried to warn them, BEG them to see sense, and they accused us of being vote shamers or Blue MAGA all so that they could feel morally superior in their nihilism. It’s so performative it’s pathetic.

And the worst part is they won’t accept responsibility. “Kamala should’ve done this, Biden should’ve done that, I don’t want to be complicit…” STFU.

[bluegirl147]

I voted for Obama in the 2008 primary.  I knew when he spoke at the DNC in 2004 he was going to be President one day.

I happily supported Hillary in 2016.  I didn't feel like it was her time or anything like that.  I simply thought she was the most qualified candidate.

8 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I love Hilary Clinton, she's awesome as far as I'm concerned.  And please, I'd love to know why reporters continually barrage her with questions about why she stayed with Bill after he cheated but there's crickets with regard to Melania.  Bloody, damn crickets. 

She loves him.  And he loves her.  Now yes he was a dog but I'm assuming they worked through it and they are still together.   For the family values party you would think they would admire that. But nope, they would rather support a man who has cheated on every wife and never shown an ounce of remorse.  

 

 

[Bastet]

Just now, Dimity said:

And please, I'd love to know why reporters continually barrage her with questions about why she stayed with Bill after he cheated but there's crickets with regard to Melania.

Hillary has to be the only woman in history the "family values" crowd has castigated for sticking with her marriage.

[peacheslatour]

11 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

I voted for Obama in the 2008 primary.  I knew when he spoke at the DNC in 2004 he was going to be President one day.

I happily supported Hillary in 2016.  I didn't feel like it was her time or anything like that.  I simply thought she was the most qualified candidate.

She loves him.  And he loves her.  Now yes he was a dog but I'm assuming they worked through it and they are still together.   For the family values party you would think they would admire that. But nope, they would rather support a man who has cheated on every wife and never shown an ounce of remorse.  

 

 

Bolded mine. It's so interesting you should say that. My husband and I watched the same speech, looked at each other and said "There is our first black president". You could feel the excitement even back then.

[Avaleigh]

1 hour ago, anony.miss said:

I agree  - and the story overall is suspicious as to motive, since it's not even illegal to pay for an endorsement (as long as you list it on your campaign finance forms). So why build and spread this lie?  Because it's meant to invoke ugly old stereotypes about Black women being morally corrupt, unable to succeed/get ahead/be endorsed based on skills and talent (and for Oprah, able to be bought by the highest bidder, despite being a billionaire herself). And of course the right wing media ran with it, filling the heads of their viewers with a complete lie (as they did with the "Haitians are eating people's pets!" crap).  Same as it ever was with right wing media, but I still find it repulsive every time they pull this shit.

Adding to all of the above, the inference the right wingers were trying to push here is that if Harris can't be trusted to find the right people to run the financing within her campaign, how can she be trusted with the finances of the country? It's just another way to push the harmful stereotype about Black people not paying their bills. 

Meanwhile, people like Guiliani can admit that they're still owed money from the Trump campaign ($2 million IIRC) yet the right never go after Trump for not paying his bills. Trump not paying people money for services owed has been routine for him for decades as numerous people in construction and the political world can attest, but somehow they feel Harris's behavior here is more egregious. I wonder why?🤔