Unverified Intelligence: The Speculation/Wishlist Thread

[Kromm]

Noticed there wasn't one of these.

[Kromm]

What's not totally holding together for me is why Garrett and Ward simply haven't eliminated Coulson and his team.  Why create distractions for them instead?  There's no power base to need to unseat with deception.  In the short term we know Ward needs info from Skye, but they didn't know this earlier on when they had plenty of opportunities to eliminate the team. 

They need something from these folks--at least a few of them.  Coulson and Skye because they are walking talking samples of the alien fix it all.  Simmons seems less likely as a secret HYDRA now that they're bothering to send Ward back in, but she and Fitz maybe have something in their heads HYDRA wants.  Really May seems the only totally disposable one, from HYDRA's perspective (unless we count Triplett too).

[KirkB]

You're right, actually. Why not have Ward walk in, get them together in one room, and shoot everyone but Skye? He can then drag her back to Garrett and they can torture her until they get what they want.

[Kromm]

You're right, actually. Why not have Ward walk in, get them together in one room, and shoot everyone but Skye? He can then drag her back to Garrett and they can torture her until they get what they want.

Right.  It's confusing that they keep bouncing back and forth between Coulson's team seeming expendable, and the reality that (face it) HYDRA hasn't really seriously tried to eliminate them.  

 

New speculation: Poor Agent Oswalt (yes I know that's really not his name) is toast sooner or later (probably sooner rather than later).

[caseylane]

Perhaps Hydra knows that Coulson is known to not only other Shield members but also teams like the Avengers. Having someone on a team with that access has to be a good thing for Hydra. Let Coulson get this minor victories while Hydra stays in the loop.

[KirkB]

Wait, so Hydra thinks it's a good idea to keep around someone who could potentially call in Iron Man, Captain America and Thor?

[BkWurm1]

Weren't we told that Garrett didn't want to kill Coulson just because they used to be friends?  Sure he's willing if it comes to it but he's also fine with having an excuse not to kill him.  I figure we are supposed to think the same thing about Ward.  Ward said he came to see Coulson as a good man but that he owed everything to Garrett so Ward is in favor of leaving the team alive at least for now as well.  Garrett seems to be operating along the same lines, that hey, if it is convenient, stay a sleeper agent, but if not, (he has 24 hours to do it the easy way) then Coulson and the team are expendable.  

[Kromm]

I'm also confused about whether or not Garrett is supposed to be the ultimate boss or not.  They act like he is.   I mean the baddie we are shown in Cap 2 was supposed to be the big boss, I guess, and presumably recruited Garrett in the first place, but that boss isn't on the board within the scope and timeline of this show.   So does Garrett still report to someone higher up, or not?

[KirkB]

Actually, with everything that went down in Winter Soldier, it's entirely possible Garrett IS the highest 'ranking' Hydra operative left free.

[Sarahastro]

I'm also confused about whether or not Garrett is supposed to be the ultimate boss or not.  They act like he is.   I mean the baddie we are shown in Cap 2 was supposed to be the big boss, I guess, and presumably recruited Garrett in the first place, but that boss isn't on the board within the scope and timeline of this show.   So does Garrett still report to someone higher up, or not?

I think it's also possible that Garrett is officially in Hydra but is kind of acting as a free agent. His speech to Coulson in "Turn, Turn, Turn" made him sound more like an opportunist than a true believer in Hydra's ideology.

[Raja]

Actually, with everything that went down in Winter Soldier, it's entirely possible Garrett IS the highest 'ranking' Hydra operative left free.

I guess that matches with the son of Coul being the highest ranked SHIELD agent around who has not surrendered to the FBI or other governments equivalent.

[HistoryGirl]

Here's my speculation for the finale.  For whatever reason it just popped into my head this morning while getting ready (obsessed much?)   We've been seeing Fitz suffer in silence about how he's "not good enough"-- whether in comparison to Ward or to Triplett.  I suspect that this is why he's afraid of telling Simmons how he feels. My theory?  That Ward grabs Simmons (as a hostage) and Fitz offers himself in her place.  Hydra wants him, this we know.  Plus it's been Simmons who's sacrificed herself all along, so it's Fitz's turn.  This could be our cliffhanger:  Ward with Fitz as Hydra operatives. 

[KirkB]

I'm not sure Ward or Garrett would trust Fitz to be 'bad'. If anything, I'd say they may be focusing on Fitz as a warning of sorts. I have a feeling one of the agents isn't going to make it through the finale. Coulson is obviously safe. They clearly can't kill Skye. I doubt very seriously it's May. Trip hasn't been enough of a presence yet for anyone to really care. And Ward is bad, so a lot of people may very well want him to die. That just leaves Fitz and Simmons. Now, Simmons has already had a brush with death so they may want you to think she's safe, just to suddenly kill her. But I think it's more likely that Fitz's feelings of inadequacy and his jealousy or whatever it is toward Simmons and Trip is going to lead him to do something bravely stupid or else flat out sacrificial.

[HistoryGirl]

.That just leaves Fitz and Simmons. Now, Simmons has already had a brush with death so they may want you to think she's safe, just to suddenly kill her. But I think it's more likely that Fitz's feelings of inadequacy and his jealousy or whatever it is toward Simmons and Trip is going to lead him to do something bravely stupid or else flat out sacrificial.

Up until a day ago I was thinking the same thing, but now I'm not so sure just from a creative standpoint. If they were to kill of Fitz we would see Simmons crack. We've seen that already with the almost-death of Skye. It would be a repeat of a scene that has already happened. Which, boring. If it's the reverse (Simmons dying, Fitz reacting), we've sort of seen that too when she jumped out of the plane.

I agree though, if they were going to kill someone, the anvils have been pointing toward Fitz. But solely because they've already "been there" with Simmons, I'm doubting it. I'm hoping that everyone survives, with maybe Ward having the least potential of survival.

Hydra doesn't have to trust him, they just have to manipulate him in such a way that forces him to work for them-- like threatening that they'll kill Simmons if he doesn't play nice.

Edited April 24, 2014 by HistoryGirl

[KirkB]

See, if I were Hydra I wouldn't trust Fitz enough not to blow them all up, himself included, in order to save Simmons, Coulson, and/or the world. So unless he were truly on your side, which would never happen, I think he'd be more risk than reward.

 

Up until a day ago I was thinking the same thing, but now I'm not so sure just from a creative standpoint. If they were to kill of Fitz we would see Simmons crack. We've seen that already with the almost-death of Skye. It would be a repeat of a scene that has already happened. Which, boring. If it's the reverse (Simmons dying, Fitz reacting), we've sort of seen that too when she jumped out of the plane.

 

 

   The fact it's been done before, or might be boring to the audience, doesn't preclude the possibility of them doing it. I don't know about the creative abilities of this team (the showrunners I mean) but a big heroic sacrifice makes for great drama and is a pretty common trope.

[HistoryGirl]

I've speculated on this before (see: fitzsimmons thread) where in the finale it's revealed that Simmons works for someone not-SHIELD/Hydra (or SHIELD adjacent) to monitor Fitz. Someone on tumblr suggested that maybe Simmons & Weaver work for SWORD (a Joss Whedon creation, coincidentally). Not having recognized the organization, I looked it up and apparently it deals with extraterrestrial terrorists. It would explain Simmons trying to get Weaver to analyze Skye's blood and could justify Fitz's lack of a father. Similarly, maybe this is all how Guardians of the Galaxy fits into the MCU?

Edited May 3, 2014 by HistoryGirl

[gik910]

Kind of a different direction but is anyone curious about how Agent Carter might effect AOS (and the greater Marvel Universe)?

[KirkB]

Good question actually. Since we know know Hydra has been insinuated into SHIELD from early on, if not since the beginning, it will be odd if none of this is referenced in Peggy's show since she and Howard helped create SHIELD.

[Sarahastro]

Perhaps Zola will make an appearance. That would be cool.

[HistoryGirl]

Kind of a different direction but is anyone curious about how Agent Carter might effect AOS (and the greater Marvel Universe)?

What I heard was that it's a one-off storyline. Like it'll only be around for one season.  I imagine its focus will only be to service the start up of SHIELD. 

[kennyab]

We're two days out from the season finale, and I've had way too much time on my hands to put together a grand unified theory of the Agents of SHIELD thus far, so here's my final unspoiled speculation before we get some answers. Like any other extremely important scientific pursuit, this theory builds on the groundbreaking work of others in this nascent field of research.

 

So, in the last installment, we saw that Agent Garrett, after injecting himself with blue alien serum, became connected with the universe. He also displayed a spittle-induced star field pattern on his shirt, very reminiscent to that of cosmically aware characters in the Marvel Universe. This power is mostly associated with members of the alien Kree race, many of which are blue skinned. So injection of serum derived from the alien not only heals, it bestows this awareness to those "lucky" enough to receive a dose. The human mind seems unable to process it correctly, and it ends up driving the recipient insane. This, we now know, is the true reason Coulson was begging for death when Fury brought him back -- the new senses were too much for him.

 

We also learned that this was the real reason he was reprogrammed by Fury. When Coulson oversaw the TAHITI project, he found that the only way to counter this effect, even temporarily, was to erase the memory of the procedure from minds of the test subjects. Ultimately, though, each new trial resulted in failure. To Coulson and his team it appeared as if the subjects all became insane. But after reviewing the results of this project, Fury realized that something else was happening and knowledge was being given to these people.

 

Knowing that SHIELD had been infiltrated and might not survive, Fury continued looking for a way to make TAHITI successful after Coulson's resignation from the project. He was aware that more and more threats to humanity would begin to pop up, and the cosmic awareness given by the serum could help defend the world if its power could be harnessed. He found a new method of re-wiring the human brain, and when Coulson died he used that technique (perhaps with a blessing given by Coulson before his death) to create a type of sleeper agent. Coulson's conscious mind wouldn't have access to the insights that cosmic awareness would give him, but it could still provide insight.

 

And with that insight, Coulson was sent out by Fury to find those things that might threaten and help humanity. And one of those things was Skye. Coulson brought her onto the team based on a gut feeling. He was never able to really put into words the reason for the decision, and it didn't make sense to most people, but deep down he knew that it was important for her to be there. And that's because Skye isn't human but Inhuman, a member of a genetically-modified offshoot of early homo sapiens, engineered by the afore-mentioned Kree.

 

Skye, who shares a genetic heritage with Raina, a person obsessed with transformation and the revelation of one's true identity. Skye, who was found in the Hunan Province of China a few hundred miles from the Yunnan province, where one finds the easternmost portion of the Himalayas, the mountain range that is one of the homes to the Inhumans in the comic universe. Was she secreted away from Inhuman society as a baby, prompting her parents (who were dubbed monsters by the village that shielded her) to come search for her? Her Kree heritage allowed her to take the serum without the ill effects humans experience, and if the presence of the Inhumans are about to become known to the rest of the world, that would likely set off Coulson's internal ping.

 

As others have speculated, Coulson may be unknowingly in charge of the MCU's version of the Caterpillar project, Fury's plan to protect the world should SHIELD fail. And Skye, if Inhuman, is very much a caterpillar, waiting for the Terrigen Mists to transform her into superhero on the side of the good guys.

 

Very ready for Tuesday to find out how much of this is accurate.

[KirkB]

First of all, nice post. Very insightful. I just hope the showrunners have put even half as much thought into it as you have. Secondly, now I have this image in my head of Skye being exposed to the Terrigen Mists and turning into Lockjaw.

[kennyab]

First of all, nice post. Very insightful. I just hope the showrunners have put even half as much thought into it as you have. Secondly, now I have this image in my head of Skye being exposed to the Terrigen Mists and turning into Lockjaw.

Ha! I even like Skye well enough, but this cracked me up.

[HistoryGirl]

kennyab, that speculation was genius.  I think you're probably right.  I stumbled onto some Guardians of the Galaxy tid bits while going down the internet rabbit hole and it sounds like Krees at the least will be in GotG. Inhumans seem to be more Avengers 2.

 

Interestingly enough, I also discovered that the 6 infinity gems are a part of the larger mythology with 2 already having been shown (the Tesseract is one, currently on Asgard and the second was in Thor: Dark World-- can't remember what happened to that by the end of the film).  I do wonder if the season finale will hint toward GotG since that's going to be coming out in August. 

[KirkB]

The tesseract is powering the Bifrost and the other infinity stone was given to the Collector by Sif and Volstagg. He seemed quite happy to have it too. "One down, five to go."

Edited May 11, 2014 by KirkB

[HistoryGirl]

The tesseract is powering the Bifrost and the other infinity stone was given to the Collector by Sif and Volstagg. He seemed quite happy to have it too. "One down, five to go."

But the Collector is bad, no? 

[KirkB]

Traditionally, yes. In the comics he is an Elder of the Universe, who has been around for millions of years and 'collects' things, hence the name. But he's the kind of guy who would capture a couple of humans and then blow up the Earth so his collection would be one of a kind.

Edited May 11, 2014 by KirkB

[James Moar]

The stated intention was to put one of the Infinity Stones into safe keeping elsewhere, to help prevent them from being gathered together, rather than have two of them held together in Asgard. Presumably the Collector isn't known to be bad here.

Of course, there's an obvious flaw with giving one item from a set of six to someone with a monomania for collecting. But 'Odin' may realise that....

[KirkB]

I kind of figured the Collector is probably the only one who knows what the infinity stones can do together. The way Sif and Volstagg were talking, I just figured they meant we saw how crazy people got after the tesserract, let's not keep two of the things in the same damn place. You're probably right in that they don't know the Collector is a bad guy, if indeed he is here. As for for 'Odin', if he had any inkling of what the infinity stones could do together I doubt he would let any of them out of his sight in the first place.

Edited May 11, 2014 by KirkB

[kennyab]

kennyab, that speculation was genius.  I think you're probably right.

 

 

Thanks, HistoryGirl. Honestly, a lot of the big pieces of speculation (Skye is Inhuman, Garrett has cosmic awareness) comes from different things I've read on the inter webs. I just wanted to try to figure out how the TAHITI project and Fury's reasons for bring Coulson back tied into the bigger picture, and this made the most sense to me for how everything dovetails into a single narrative.

[Kel Varnsen]

So what does everyone want or suspect they will see in season 2. I watched Winter Soldier again on the weekend and one thing I would really be interested in them exploring is the fact that The Black Widow dumped all of SHIELD's information on the web. I am not so much interested in how the general public deals with it but what about the team. I mean for the entire team their whole career would be up there for anyone else on the team to read about. Would Sky read Coulson or May's file? Would there be any crazy shit that no one knew about? That could actually be kind of interesting.

[JayKay]

Yes, that would be great. I'd wondered about that too. Something like that wouldn't become some meme and be forgotten, that would change the whole culture and world climate. And BW dumped Shield secrets, as well as everything they'd gathered about other people and nations. The ramifications are fascinating to think about. I hope it has personal and wide-reaching effects on the show.

You'd think it would matter quite a bit to Skye at least, because this is what she wanted in the beginning. I wouldn't even mind if the Rising Tide returned with an evolved mission statement.

They could have a lot of fun with it too, if they wanted. May's "Cavalry" story is available for reading by anyone. I'd love if something silly like film studios wanting to make movies out of certain agents' files was a thing. She would hate it.

[Jack Kerouac]

I'm going to take a wild guess that they are not going to deal with that at all.

Edited September 16, 2014 by Jack Kerouac

[Jediknight]

So what does everyone want or suspect they will see in season 2.

I expect Agent 13 to make at the very least 1 appearance, Rumlow will show up, and with the possible joke made by the Russo brothers, a certain character that likes to wear a skull shirt.

[ottoDbusdriver]

So what does everyone want or suspect they will see in season 2.

 

Less Lizzie Keene. A lot less of the bad wig.  More Red. More Dembe.

 

In all the tv promos for Season 2 I've seen, it's almost all Red and 1 or 2 shots of Wiggie.

[Kel Varnsen]

Yes, that would be great. I'd wondered about that too. Something like that wouldn't become some meme and be forgotten, that would change the whole culture and world climate. And BW dumped Shield secrets, as well as everything they'd gathered about other people and nations. The ramifications are fascinating to think about. I hope it has personal and wide-reaching effects on the show.

You'd think it would matter quite a bit to Skye at least, because this is what she wanted in the beginning. I wouldn't even mind if the Rising Tide returned with an evolved mission statement.

They could have a lot of fun with it too, if they wanted. May's "Cavalry" story is available for reading by anyone. I'd love if something silly like film studios wanting to make movies out of certain agents' files was a thing. She would hate it.

For that matter the whole world now knows that someone in SHIELD died before the battle of NY and then was brought back to life with alien tech. How does that work, because that would be huge news. 

 

Personally I think they could have some fun with the little stuff. I mean it would basically be that people in a job could read the HR files on all their co-workers. Actual good writers could have some fun with that.

 

Or if they wanted to do really serious and get away from the Hydra stuff for awhile, they touch on the fact that the information dump would have blown the cover of a bunch of SHIELD agents who probably weren't evil and were on dangerous undercover missions. Have the AoS team do some extraction work.

 

and with the possible joke made by the Russo brothers, a certain character that likes to wear a skull shirt.

 

Are the Russo bros going to have any involvement in the show in season 2?. I find it amazing that those guys went from directing sitcoms like Happy Endings and Community to directing one of the best action movies I have seen in a long time. Why can't they find someone that good from TV to run the show.

[Jediknight]

Are the Russo bros going to have any involvement in the show in season 2?. I find it amazing that those guys went from directing sitcoms like Happy Endings and Community to directing one of the best action movies I have seen in a long time. Why can't they find someone that good from TV to run the show.

I don't know if the Russos will have any involvements, but they put it out there about Castle.  We know Marvel has his film rights back, so perhaps Marvel puts him in an episode.

 

As for why they can't find someone that good, because those guys are working on Arrow.

[FurryFury]

Arrow has a lot of problems as well, it's hardly perfect.

[myril]

For that matter the whole world now knows that someone in SHIELD died before the battle of NY and then was brought back to life with alien tech. How does that work, because that would be huge news. 

Not necessarily. If I am not mistaken that information was never on any SHIELD server, it was pretty much kept on paper. Otherwise HYDRA wouldn't have had to make such a big deal about figuring it out differently, they had access on highest security level. There are some secrets not out yet.

[Kel Varnsen]

The other thing I was thinking about was I really wonder how difficult it would be to get some of the stars of the movies to show up on the show. I mean when actors sign contracts for movies, there is usually a clause where they have to do promotion for the movie (go on Letterman that sort of thing). So knowing how marvel likes to play hardball with negotiation and they feel that anyone whose initials aren't RDJ are replaceable, I am surprised they haven't started throwing in contract clauses where the actors have to appear on the show (at least for cameos or voice over stuff or like some kind of video screen thing).

[rujasu]

The thing is that Marvel wouldn't really get much out of having one of the major stars do a cameo.  Ratings might spike for a week, but they'd fall back to Earth on the next episode.  So I doubt the AOS cameo possibility would be worthwhile it to bring into negotiations over stars of movies that make hundreds of millions for Marvel.  The only way they'd do it is if they had a major star who is generally willing to anything and wouldn't be bothered by making a few TV appearances.  Oh wait, they do have that guy, his name is Samuel L. Jackson and he's appeared on AOS twice.

[Kel Varnsen]

The thing is that Marvel wouldn't really get much out of having one of the major stars do a cameo.  Ratings might spike for a week, but they'd fall back to Earth on the next episode.  So I doubt the AOS cameo possibility would be worthwhile it to bring into negotiations over stars of movies that make hundreds of millions for Marvel.  The only way they'd do it is if they had a major star who is generally willing to anything and wouldn't be bothered by making a few TV appearances.  Oh wait, they do have that guy, his name is Samuel L. Jackson and he's appeared on AOS twice.

I suppose the only way it could work was if they combined the cameo with a really well written episode that could actually grab people's attention. I mean that seemed to work for How I Met Your Mother when they had the Brittney episode. But they would need the cameo episode to be much better than normal, then keep up that level of quality, and maybe you are right, I am not sure I see that happening.

[JayKay]

My favorite part about his appearance in the finale is how his big rescue was clearly filmed completely separate from Simmons in the water. It made the wtf-yness even more wtf-y. I would be surprised if SLJ appears for as long or longer than he did last season.

The ratings drop may have stolen some of the wind out of Marvel's sails and they may not fight as hard for big names as they did in season 1. Maria Hill and Agent Carter herself are still gets though. If the quality of writing improves in season two, I'd love to see more of CS as Agent(?) Hill.

[ChelseaNH]

How many people ran out and read the thousands of documents that Snowden leaked?  The vast majority of the world's population is relying on news digests of the data, not the actual data.  And given the volume of stuff that was dumped from SHIELD, there are teams of people still going through it to find what all is there.

[Kel Varnsen]

How many people ran out and read the thousands of documents that Snowden leaked?  The vast majority of the world's population is relying on news digests of the data, not the actual data.  And given the volume of stuff that was dumped from SHIELD, there are teams of people still going through it to find what all is there.

But wasn't most of Snowden's stuff just about NSA wiretapping. Once you know that one thing is there much interesting. I read some of the wikileaks stuff with the diplomatic cables. Even that was kind of boring. Compare that to something like "weapon developed using alien technology" or "plans for how the helicarrier engines work" or "location of secret SHIELD bases" or  "what actually went down in New Mexico" and that might be a lot more interesting to people. That said I am more interested in the characters in the show learning each other's secrets.

 

And thinking more about my post regarding MCU star cameos, I think a cooler option would be to get some behind the camera people working on the show. I mean it would be really cool if they got Shane Black or The Russo bros or Jon Favreau to direct an episode. 

[JayKay]

Yesss, I would love love love if the Russos got onboard for an episode or two. They didn't get "too big" for Community after Winter Soldier, so maybe they'd give AoS a shot.

@Kel which characters do you see as being most likely to read up on their teammates and which wouldn't? I'm interested in that too.

[ChelseaNH]

It occurred to me today that this show is sort of hermetically sealed in a couple of senses:  So much shooting obviously takes place on soundstages and backlots, and so many characters are inside the whole SHIELD bubble of knowing all the weirdness that is afoot in the world.  Moving production out of Hollywood is probably not going to happen, but it would be interesting to have some regular civilians show up every now and then.

[Eegah]

One that literally just hit me that so excited me I had to get here right away: what if Skye's father is also Peter Quill's father? Given how separate Guardians of the Galaxy is from the rest of the MCU, that could be a great way to tie it in.

[ChelseaNH]

Quill's father was presumably off-planet when his mother died.  That doesn't rule out the connection, but my impression is that Skye's father has been around and making acquaintances with Hydra ever since Skye was recovered.

 

I'd like to see a mission statement more specific than "we protect the innocent."  Lots of organizations do that, so why do we need one more?  Stark is building a SHIELD analog, and they'll actually have resources, plus he's got his Avengers pals, so they're in a good position to do with the unknown/supernatural/extraterrestrial weirdness.  The government is hunting Hydra.  Is SHIELD going to try to duplicate the efforts of larger organizations with more funding?  How are they going to avoid being also-rans in the race to protect people from whatever?

Edited September 24, 2014 by ChelseaNH

[ottoDbusdriver]

With the return next week of Simmons in the previews, I'm guessing she went undercover to infiltrate Hydra while looking for her old instructor from SHIELD Hogwarts (remember that interrupted message she had during the aftermath of Winter Soldier) -- but she left abruptly in order to make it look like she was ditching them because Coulson suspects he might have a mole in his motley crew, and they are trying to smoke out the mole.

 

This isn't even an original plot idea, having seen it on other shows.

 

Plus, there's no way that Simmons is evil Hydra as well as Ward -- because that would suck !!

Edited October 1, 2014 by ottoDbusdriver