S17.E21: Climbing Down From Decision Day

[Elizzikra]

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Whatever she did, Austin doesnt feel like he can be straightforward with her. She needs to work on that.

If Austin doesn't feel like he can be straightforward with someone, HE needs to work on it. It's his problem. 

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She ratted out her hubby for vaping, even though there is nothing wrong with that

Becca said Austin was dishonest about a number of things. Keisha asked for an example. Becca said that Austin said he didn't vape, but she found him vaping any number of times. She didn't "rat him out." They aren't in middle school. As you noted, vaping is legal and many people do it. Austin is more than legal age for it, so why keep it a secret? Why lie? 

People hide things or lie about them because they are either embarrassed about them or they don't want to deal with someone's response. Either way, that's the person's own decision. Own the behavior and own the reactions you get for it.

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I dont even think he lied.  I think he just didnt tell her. And Becca is considering that a lie. 

She said she asked him if he vaped. He lied outright and said he did not.

But yes, there is such a thing as a lie of omission, when one withholds information that they know another party wants. Yes, there are a million little things every single day that people don't share with their partners and they aren't lies of omission, but the ones they intentionally leave out because they don't want to deal with a reaction - those are lies.

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When my ex got wasted on alcohol, did I complain at all? No, because I didnt give a shit. What is worse alcohol or weed?  More people died yesterday from alcohol poisoning than weed in the history of humankind.  People who died from weed =0.

Who gets into fights: people who are wasted on alcohol, or people who are stoned.  Lets cut the the BS propaganda on all of this.  Austin vaping > Emily drunk blackouts.  I didn't LIE, I just didn't tell her.  Did she tell me every time she had a drink?  She lied by omission too, right? 

None of this has anything to do with Becca and Austin and the great vaping scandal of 2024. My original point was that one can be dishonest with a partner without actually telling a lie; by leading a person to believe something other than the truth by selectively sharing information or not. I also took issue with the assertion that one person "makes" another person lie (actively or by omission) because he/she reacts so badly to the truth that it's uncomfortable for the person lying. 

Becca said she didn't care if Austin vaped. Even if that's a lie - say she really detests it and told Austin that - Becca wouldn't be "making Austin lie" about vaping. He would just be trying to avoid conflict by telling her he doesn't vape. It's still his choice to be dishonest. Becca can't "make" Austin do anything; if she could, they would have had sex.

Edited March 16 by Elizzikra

[Gator Stud]

10 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

Becca said Austin was dishonest about a number of things. Keisha asked for an example. Becca said that Austin said he didn't vape, but she found him vaping any number of times. She didn't "rat him out." They aren't in middle school. As you noted, vaping is legal and many people do it. Austin is more than legal age for it, so why keep it a secret? Why lie? 

People hide things or lie about them because they are either embarrassed about them or they don't want to deal with someone's response. Either way, that's the person's own decision. Own the behavior and own the reactions you get for it.

Why does he have to ask Becca's permission to vape weed? Does she have to ask his permission every time she wants to do something?  Every time I drink, I dont have to clear it with my gf.  I dont know why Becca creates that type of environment where guys want to keep benign secrets from her.  This seems like something Becca should work on. And she is easily manipulatable. The shrink got into her head and manipulated her into joining Team Mean Gurl.  She was ok at the beginning of the season, but her bestie Claire was a bad influence and got her to see the worst in Austin. 

Maybe Austin was vaping to deal with the stress of the show.  I do know one thing: every season I see people getting fucking WASTED on the daily and this type of judgement doesn't come their way. Its like its normal.  Emily was fucking wicked wasted at that bachelorette party.  When she was with Brennan, she downed all those shots that would have put me under the table. Then people on this forum kept insisting that she was not an alcoholic- saying she is just having a good time. Then Austin vapes and doesn't make an ass of himself, and all of a sudden he is the druggie bad guy?

The people who think this way have an issue with weed, but just dont want to come out and say it, so they couch it in other issues. They are prejudiced against smoking weed. They think Austin is bad just because he smokes weed. And Emily is good because she drinks alcohol.

[Elizzikra]

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Why does he have to ask Becca's permission to vape weed? Does she have to ask his permission every time she wants to do something? 

He doesn't. But if he is honest, if she asks if he vapes, he'd say "yes." She said he lied and said no.

Also, since they share a home, they should agree on whether or not vaping is ok in the apartment. I don't care if people vape but I don't want it in the house because I don't like the smell.

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I dont know why Becca creates that type of environment where guys want to keep benign secrets from her.  This seems like something Becca should work on.

Once again, you want Becca to take responsibility for Austin's actions. I could just as easily ask why Austin wants to be in a relationship where he isn't willing to be an honest and authentic person. Austin should work on why he finds it easier to lie than to tell the truth and deal with the reaction.

I think that we see the actual events very differently. What Becca said was that she asked Austin if he vapes and he said no. Then she witnessed him vaping on multiple occasions, including in the bathroom of the apartment they share. It did not seem that Becca was saying that Austin failed to announce to her a single occasion of vaping or that he didn't "get her permission" to vape on a single occasion. She asked if it was something he did and he said no. He does vape so his answer was a lie. That's on him, not her.

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She was ok at the beginning of the season

When they had only known each other hours, then days? Well yeah. Everyone gets along better when they hardly know each other. I can be at a party with people I can't stand and get along just fine with them but if I have to share a 1200 square apartment with them (and possibly a bed) things are going to be a lot more difficult a lot faster.

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Maybe Austin was vaping to deal with the stress of the show.  I do know one thing: every season I see people getting fucking WASTED on the daily and this type of judgement doesn't come their way. Its like its normal.  Emily was fucking wicked wasted at that bachelorette party.  When she was with Brennan, she downed all those shots that would have put me under the table. Then people on this forum kept insisting that she was not an alcoholic- saying she is just having a good time. Then Austin vapes and doesn't make an ass of himself, and all of a sudden he is the druggie bad guy?

The people who think this way have an issue with weed, but just dont want to come out and say it, so they couch it in other issues. They are prejudiced against smoking weed. They think Austin is bad just because he smokes weed. And Emily is good because she drinks alcohol.

I just don't see that. First - Becca said Austin "vapes." That could mean weed. It could mean nicotine vapes. I'm guessing weed because Austin seemed stone a lot of the time, but who knows?

Second, I don't really see anyone passing judgement on Austin for vaping .I don't think anyone has said he was a bad guy druggie. I saw plenty of people saying Emily had a drinking problem solely based on her behavior at the bachelorette. Me - personally - I don't have a problem with weed or alcohol. They are both legal in my state for people over age 21. I think both can be used recreationally without issue. 

What I think people DO have an issue with is Austin's lying. He lied about going out with the producer. He lied about vaping. I don't see anyone trying to argue that weed is somehow worse than alcohol but I do see a lot of support for the belief that honesty in a relationship is a whole lot better than lying, and especially if one refuses to take accounability for one's dishonesty by blaming it on their partner's potential reaction.

Edited March 16 by Elizzikra

[Yeah No]

3 hours ago, Gator Stud said:

In CA and CO, people openly smoke.  There is no stigma.  Everybody vapes too.  There is no reason to hide something if your partner is cool with it.  She outed him with the vaping anyways, so it kinda obviates your point. She probably doesnt like that he drinks too, but wont bring that up because she knows how stupid it would sound. 

I never saw him vape.  The only reason why I know, is because she outed him out of spite.  So that implies that she obviously had a big problem with it.  Or else she would have never mentioned it, like Emily's cheating.  Vaping is worse than cheating?  No one I know would ever say that. 

Becca didn't out Austin for vaping.  She outed him for lying about vaping.  Big difference.  And it does understandably make a difference to her that he lies, probably much more than whether or not he vapes.  If he didn't lie and hide so much from her the vaping itself would probably not be an issue.

Of course there's no reason to lie about vaping unless you're so worried about your image on camera that you'd even hide it from your wife so as not to make it a potential issue and potentially have her out you on it.  He admitted he lied about it and I'm sure that if hid the vaping because Becca told him she didn't want him to do it he would have said so.  But he didn't.  It was news to both Keisha and us when Becca said she didn't care one way or the other about it.

[Yeah No]

2 hours ago, Gator Stud said:

Why does he have to ask Becca's permission to vape weed? Does she have to ask his permission every time she wants to do something?  Every time I drink, I dont have to clear it with my gf.  I dont know why Becca creates that type of environment where guys want to keep benign secrets from her.  This seems like something Becca should work on. And she is easily manipulatable. The shrink got into her head and manipulated her into joining Team Mean Gurl.  She was ok at the beginning of the season, but her bestie Claire was a bad influence and got her to see the worst in Austin. 
 

Whoa wait a minute, where is there any evidence that Becca creates some kind of toxic environment that makes a guy unable to feel comfortable being himself?  Hey I was young, cute and intimidating to some men once but if they were too timid to ask me out that wasn't MY fault.  I was a nice, friendly, warm person that didn't put on airs and erect walls and yet a lot of underconfident guys didn't have the nerve to ask me out.  And by my estimation Becca is not that kind of person either.  

Austin needed to man up and take responsibility for his hang ups and issues and not blame them on Becca.  Maybe he had a hard ass for a mom and that's what's behind this behavior.  But it's not fair to project it on Becca like she's to blame for it.  All he had to do was be open about the vaping with her and see how she reacted.  If she came down on him THEN, sure, let her have it.  But all this assumption and projection with zero proof is just baseless in my opinion.

I dated a guy in college that smoked weed.  It wasn't the weed that made me break up with him but his draining negativity and depression that he could never overcome.  The vaping is not the issue for Becca, trust me.

[Yeah No]

2 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

Second, I don't really see anyone passing judgement on Austin for vaping .I don't think anyone has said he was a bad guy druggie. I saw plenty of people saying Emily had a drinking problem solely based on her behavior at the bachelorette. Me - personally - I don't have a problem with weed or alcohol. They are both legal in my state for people over age 21. I think both can be used recreationally without issue. 

What I think people DO have an issue with is Austin's lying. He lied about going out with the producer. He lied about vaping. I don't see anyone trying to argue that weed is somehow worse than alcohol but I do see a lot of support for the belief that honesty in a relationship is a whole lot better than lying, and especially if one refuses to take accounability for one's dishonesty by blaming it on their partner's potential reaction.

Haha, I didn't even read your posts before I said pretty much the same thing!

[Kiss my mutt]

Today I learned: You can vape weed. 🤔

[Elizzikra]

46 minutes ago, Kiss my mutt said:

Today I learned: You can vape weed. 🤔

But not in my house. I don’t like the smell. Smoke up all you want on the back porch.

[Maximadc]

Emily's high alcohol tolerance and regular blackouts tell me that she is a stage 2 alcoholic. 
We can argue about this for as long as we want, but it is just a medical fact. If she doesn't change how she spends her free time, it will be too late in ten years. This fact alone will be enough to break a marriage, so I feel that the producers begged Brennan to stay until the end because the entire season was falling apart. 
Emily's story with the guy in the bar didn't help either. So why do we even talk about Brennan's personality if he was discussed by the partner he was paired with? 
That said, Emily will be an excellent match for someone else in this universe. She should start with relationships that would last longer than one night. Brennan will find his soulmate and be happy at some point in his life.
They both are not perfect people who should never been put in this situation.

Edited March 17 by Maximadc

[princelina]

8 hours ago, Yeah No said:

And I'm going to bold the next sentence because it's important:  If Becca were that concerned about optics and lying about stuff that would look damaging for her she wouldn't let everyone see her in her worst moments and would instead hide everything potentially seen as negative about her. 

I don't know if this is true though - being a victim is cool in certain circles these days, and I'm willing to bet Becca belongs to one of those circles.  Austin is definitely a liar, but Becca has been ridiculously stupid for most of their marriage.  And I already know that you are a kinder person than me and more willing to give her the benefit of the doubt for being messed with when she was trying to make the marriage work, etc., but I'm still not buying it - she met him on a tv show; if it were me the biggest fear I'd have is that the guy wouldn't like me and I'd be prepared for it.  If she wasn't prepared for that at all and just kept on making erotic terrariums and begging for sex then she's just kind of an idiot 🤷‍♀️

[Hip-to-be-Square]

3 hours ago, Kiss my mutt said:

Today I learned: You can vape weed. 🤔

What is vaping? 🤔 I'm a very square lady! 😅

Edited March 17 by Hip-to-be-Square

[Yeah No]

2 hours ago, princelina said:

I don't know if this is true though - being a victim is cool in certain circles these days, and I'm willing to bet Becca belongs to one of those circles.  Austin is definitely a liar, but Becca has been ridiculously stupid for most of their marriage.  And I already know that you are a kinder person than me and more willing to give her the benefit of the doubt for being messed with when she was trying to make the marriage work, etc., but I'm still not buying it - she met him on a tv show; if it were me the biggest fear I'd have is that the guy wouldn't like me and I'd be prepared for it.  If she wasn't prepared for that at all and just kept on making erotic terrariums and begging for sex then she's just kind of an idiot 🤷‍♀️

It's interesting that you brought this up because it gives me the opportunity to say what was already on my mind to say about this.  I personally feel that most of these people are too messed up to ever find happiness in a relationship but I do see glimmers of hope in Becca.  If the worst that can be said about her is that she is unrealistic, gullible, immature and has self esteem issues, there's more hope for her than for a possible alcoholic or a controlling therapist to be, or a narcissistic possible actress.  And there's more hope for her than pretty much any of the guys too, although I'm not sure yet about Michael.  She's already showing signs of self-reflection and self-questioning on a level that none of them are showing yet and I fear that they are headed for doubling down while she is headed for waking up enough to one day get over her issues.   I think this experience might be the catalyst to snap her out of most of what she's doing to sabotage herself, although it might take time.  Unfortunately I think it will just serve to cement most of the others in their self defeating behavior. 

[Quiet1]

8 hours ago, Yeah No said:

 

Austin needed to man up and take responsibility for his hang ups and issues and not blame them on Becca.  Maybe he had a hard ass for a mom and that's what's behind this behavior.  But it's not fair to project it on Becca like she's to blame for it.  All he had to do was be open about the vaping with her and see how she reacted.  If she came down on him THEN, sure, let her have it.  But all this assumption and projection with zero proof is just baseless in my opinion.

 

Whoa, taking pot shots at his manhood and mom in this day and age, really? When and for what did he blame on Becca? I heard him apologize and take responsibility for lying about the producer being part of their group when they went out. I don't think he heard about the vaping story yet, so he hasn't addressed that. So far we just have her interpretation of that situation. 

I do wonder if Becca truly doesn't care about the vaping why was it brought up. If someone lied about something I didn't care about it would make me laugh. Like, it's so silly you felt the need to lie about that. It wouldn't make me angry. I would only be angry if it was something I cared about. 

I also don't understand the need for good guy/bad guy. They are all just incompatible. The women seem to want to make the men out to be at fault for something. They seem angry and miserable. For me it would just be an interesting experiment that showed we were incompatible and be excited and looking forward to what's next in life. Best of luck to everyone. 

I am a bit curious just what did Becca find intriguing about Austin. Why did she want to continue? 

Also, wondering, do they get paid to be on the show or is it just about getting to be on TV? Thanks to anyone who knows. 

Edited March 17 by Quiet1

[Yeah No]

3 hours ago, Quiet1 said:

Whoa, taking pot shots at his manhood and mom in this day and age, really? When and for what did he blame on Becca? I heard him apologize and take responsibility for lying about the producer being part of their group when they went out. I don't think he heard about the vaping story yet, so he hasn't addressed that. So far we just have her interpretation of that situation.  

Hello, I was responding to someone who was blaming Becca for Austin's behavior and trying to show that there could be reasons for Austin's behavior that weren't her fault that could have been coming from his issues.  They were hypothetical examples.  I really don't know what issues he has that have influenced his behavior here and neither does anyone else, but I think it's fair to say that there are many reasons Austin is responsible for his own behavior.  For sure Becca has some responsibility in it but it's just too easy to put the blame all on her, which is what I was responding to there.  Feel free to disagree but please understand the distinction.

[Gator Stud]

15 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

Once again, you want Becca to take responsibility for Austin's actions. I could just as easily ask why Austin wants to be in a relationship where he isn't willing to be an honest and authentic person. Austin should work on why he finds it easier to lie than to tell the truth and deal with the reaction.

I think that we see the actual events very differently. What Becca said was that she asked Austin if he vapes and he said no.

I'm just not stupid.  If Becca really didnt care about vaping they wouldn't even need to talk about it, hence no lie.  But she obviously does care about vaping so she would consider it "lying" every time he vaped but didnt inform her. Why would you ask if someone is vaping unless you wanted to vape yourself, or nag them about vaping. Becca is lying badly.  She thinks we are stupid and dont understand logic.  She is not cool with vaping despite what she told us.

[Gator Stud]

15 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

I just don't see that. First - Becca said Austin "vapes." That could mean weed. It could mean nicotine vapes. I'm guessing weed because Austin seemed stone a lot of the time, but who knows?

Second, I don't really see anyone passing judgement on Austin for vaping .I don't think anyone has said he was a bad guy druggie. I saw plenty of people saying Emily had a drinking problem solely based on her behavior at the bachelorette. Me - personally - I don't have a problem with weed or alcohol. They are both legal in my state for people over age 21. I think both can be used recreationally without issue. 

You are passing judgement on cannabis users.  How often do people ask whether they drink or whether they are a teetotaler? Like never.  I never even asked this question when I was dating. You dont understand how destructive this fake propaganda has been to American families. The only reason why there was even a War on Weed in this country is because.....well I will just let you read why:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html

[Elizzikra]

2 minutes ago, Gator Stud said:

You are passing judgement on cannabis users.  How often do people ask whether they drink or whether they are a teetotaler? Like never.  I never even asked this question when I was dating. You dont understand how destructive this fake propaganda has been to American families. The only reason why there was even a War on Weed in this country is because.....well I will just let you read why:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html

How do you know that I myself am not a cannabis user? You assume a lot. I have no judgment about people who smoke pot nor am I some sort of soldier in the “war on weed.”
 

As I have said consistently, I don’t think the issue here is weed; it’s lying. Maybe Becca asked because she is curious. Maybe she asked because she wanted to have a conversation about whether or not they would vape inside the apartment. Maybe she vapes herself and wanted to hit his pipe. I have no idea. Simply asking the question doesn’t imply that she had some sort of negative opinion about it.

18 minutes ago, Gator Stud said:

I'm just not stupid.  If Becca really didnt care about vaping they wouldn't even need to talk about it, hence no lie.  But she obviously does care about vaping so she would consider it "lying" every time he vaped but didnt inform her. Why would you ask if someone is vaping unless you wanted to vape yourself, or nag them about vaping. Becca is lying badly.  She thinks we are stupid and dont understand logic.  She is not cool with vaping despite what she told us.

We don’t know that Becca asked more than once. Becca said “I asked him if he vaped. He said no. Then he vaped in our bathroom.” That doesn’t say or even imply that she asked multiple times or that she expected a report of every time he did vape. 

[Elizzikra]

10 hours ago, Hip-to-be-Square said:

What is vaping? 🤔 I'm a very square lady! 😅

It’s a way of inhaling nicotine or pot through an electronic inhalation device. There is no actual flame. Basically an e-cigarette (without tobacco) or an e-joint. Whatever it is that you are inhaling is vaporized and you suck the vapor through the device.

I’m not explaining this well…

[Gator Stud]

13 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Whoa wait a minute, where is there any evidence that Becca creates some kind of toxic environment that makes a guy unable to feel comfortable being himself?

Is there evidence that Becca was not lying about how she was cool with weed? Yes there is evidence that she is toxic and creates toxic and creates toxic environments.  And it came out of her own mouth.  She admitted that she has gaslighted previous partners. Gaslighters create toxic environments.  Now all of a sudden she is an angel and not a gaslighter?  Since when. Have you gaslighted people? I have not.  She lied on Emily and hid her slip up, but is all over Austin, lolz. She lied about not caring about vaping or else there is no reason for Austin to hide it.  Then she called Austin a pothead on national TV without any evidence.  But somehow its not appropriate to call Emily an alcoholic despite us seeing her getting wasted and wasted time and time again.  I see the double standards.

 

10 hours ago, Hip-to-be-Square said:

What is vaping? 🤔 I'm a very square lady! 😅

Here is the science behind it if you want to geek out on it.

https://www.leafly.com/news/science-tech/science-vaping-marijuana-oil-concentrates

[Maximadc]

During the after-party, Austin said that they agreed to divorce and try friendship/relationship after that. He let Becca speak first and was shocked to hear that she wanted to stay married. He didn't want her to look bad and said yes, although clearly, it was not his plan. I would not be surprised if they had planned to go out before the decision day. I still don't understand why going out with the producer after decision day was a crime, but it tells me that Becca is a controlling partner who would play a victim if anything doesn't go how she wants it to.
i feel that Austin was trying to hide from her as much as possible to avoid another meltdown. It explains his hesitation to tell Becca he was not into her physically.
Again another mismatched couple where Becca needs someone more mature and tolerant to her fragile health and emotional issues and Austin needs a younger girl he can go to bars, vape, have a  good time without exhausting psychological dissection of his actions.

 

[Hip-to-be-Square]

43 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

It’s a way of inhaling nicotine or pot through an electronic inhalation device. There is no actual flame. Basically an e-cigarette (without tobacco) or an e-joint. Whatever it is that you are inhaling is vaporized and you suck the vapor through the device.

I’m not explaining this well…

So, it's a mini mechanical device that creates nicotine or weed vapors that the device user breathes in, right? Hmm- I think I understand it now.  Thank you for the explanation! 

Edited March 17 by Hip-to-be-Square

[Elizzikra]

1 minute ago, Hip-to-be-Square said:

So, it's a mini mechanical device that creates nicotine or weed vapors that the device user breathes in, right? Hmm- I think I understand it now.  Thank you for the explanation! 

That’s it.

[Hip-to-be-Square]

46 minutes ago, Gator Stud said:

Is there evidence that Becca was not lying about how she was cool with weed? Yes there is evidence that she is toxic and creates toxic and creates toxic environments.  And it came out of her own mouth.  She admitted that she has gaslighted previous partners. Gaslighters create toxic environments.  Now all of a sudden she is an angel and not a gaslighter?  Since when. Have you gaslighted people? I have not.  She lied on Emily and hid her slip up, but is all over Austin, lolz. She lied about not caring about vaping or else there is no reason for Austin to hide it.  Then she called Austin a pothead on national TV without any evidence.  But somehow its not appropriate to call Emily an alcoholic despite us seeing her getting wasted and wasted time and time again.  I see the double standards.

 

Here is the science behind it if you want to geek out on it.

https://www.leafly.com/news/science-tech/science-vaping-marijuana-oil-concentrates

Thank you for the attached explanation of what vaping is- I'm going to stick to being a straight edge, but it seems to be a novel and very useful invention for people who do partake in weed. 

Edited March 17 by Hip-to-be-Square

[seacliffsal]

1 hour ago, Gator Stud said:

You are passing judgement on cannabis users.  How often do people ask whether they drink or whether they are a teetotaler? Like never.  I never even asked this question when I was dating. You dont understand how destructive this fake propaganda has been to American families. The only reason why there was even a War on Weed in this country is because.....well I will just let you read why:

https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/23/politics/john-ehrlichman-richard-nixon-drug-war-blacks-hippie/index.html

I actually do ask people if they drink alcohol or not as if they don't drink, I won't either as I don't want to offend them or 'tempt' them.  I can drink alcohol or not, so I try to be respectful to others.  I, too, have been asked if I drink or not.  I have several friends who are in AA (or another program) and respect their boundaries and struggles.

[atomic]

1 hour ago, Gator Stud said:

Is there evidence that Becca was not lying about how she was cool with weed?

Becca had a bong in her apartment during the matchmaking special. I would say that's a pretty good indication that she really doesn't have a problem with it. As other posters have speculated, I think Austin, himself, feels some kind of internal shame about vaping, so he chose to hide it and lie, in fear of his "dirty secret" being exposed on the show.

[Peppermint]

Sorry to interupt the pothead/drunk/cheater/liar discussion, but I have a question about Chloe and Mike.

Is it possible that the "Runaway Bride" issue was Show created just to bolster sagging ratings ?? Was it part of their contract to have the already chosen bride fake a runaway, then wait a few weeks to reappear as a new choice ?? Cleverly applied make up can change your look, even make you look like a different ethnic group. We never saw her front view...just long dark hair like Chloe....was Chloe wearing one of those quaint old fashioned veils ?? Remember when short veils covered the bride's face, then when the groom was given permission to "kiss the bride" he lifted the veil up over her hair and they kissed ?? {Gawd, I'm OLD}.  Mike's group would be so busy gawking at each other after her refusal that they wouldn't pay too much attention to her [especially veiled.} The bride's group was likely producer's friends or out of town Little Theatre actors..."Hey, I need 2 sorority sisters, a Mom and Dad, a stepfather, an elderly Auntie, and a gay male cousin. That should be enough, budget, y'know." 

Chloe is either not serious about the foster children, or is woefully uninformed. Abused, damaged children require oceans of care and compassion and just plain work. My cousin fosters just this kind of child and one at a time is all she can handle. The girls CANNOT be left alone with her husband for obvious reasons, there are weekly therapy sessions, and the fosters are not allowed to leave the home county, therefore, no out of state family trips. She loves her work, but the idea of 5 at a time...no way !!  And add every morning alpaca poop raking, vet bills for 100 plus animals [ the baby llama tripped on a rock and broke his leg, and there seems to be a fever spreading among the pygmy goats] , and a normal person might just go mad...

Okay, 5 cents worth just paid. Back to bitching about " who cheated who, and who don't even care anymore..."

[StatisticalOutlier]

1 hour ago, Gator Stud said:

Then she called Austin a pothead on national TV without any evidence. 

Did she?

17 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

I just don't see that. First - Becca said Austin "vapes." That could mean weed. It could mean nicotine vapes.

I didn't take notes while watching the show or anything, but that's my recollection, too--nobody on the show has ever said what Austin vapes.  

Quote

I'm guessing weed because Austin seemed stone a lot of the time, but who knows?

But vaping weed stinks.  There's no way you can vape cannabis in the bathroom of an apartment you share with someone and they won't smell it.  It's produced a stinky cloud over the entire island of Manhattan.

You even said you make people vape weed on your porch and not inside.  (I'll leave aside the discussion of whether it's fair to make neighbors smell it for another day.) 

I haven't used cannabis since the kinder, gentler, days of 1970s weed, but I'd much rather someone in my life vape weed every once in a while, the equivalent of having a drink occasionally, to vaping nicotine all day every day. 

45 minutes ago, Hip-to-be-Square said:

Thank you for the attached explanation of what vaping is- I'm going to stick to being a straight edge, but it seems to be a novel and very useful invention for people who do partake in weed. 

I wish they'd use edibles.  Those don't stink. 

[Yeah No]

2 hours ago, Gator Stud said:

Is there evidence that Becca was not lying about how she was cool with weed? Yes there is evidence that she is toxic and creates toxic and creates toxic environments.  And it came out of her own mouth.  She admitted that she has gaslighted previous partners. Gaslighters create toxic environments.  Now all of a sudden she is an angel and not a gaslighter?  Since when. Have you gaslighted people? I have not.  She lied on Emily and hid her slip up, but is all over Austin, lolz. She lied about not caring about vaping or else there is no reason for Austin to hide it.  Then she called Austin a pothead on national TV without any evidence.  But somehow its not appropriate to call Emily an alcoholic despite us seeing her getting wasted and wasted time and time again.  I see the double standards.

There is no double standard.  I just don't base my opinion on these people on what comes out of their mouths but what I see about them in general that I think adds up to something.  Perhaps it comes from my personality type and background in Counseling Psychology but I am sensitive to seeing self awareness and growth in people and in this case I see more self awareness and personal growth in Becca than most or even all of the others this season despite outward appearances that I personally don't consider as important to what's really going on inside a person.  I'm trained and it's my way to cut through the BS to see that.  It's my wheelhouse, what can I say?  Other people are good at other things.  This is where I live. 

And I personally feel that Becca is not now a gaslighter if she ever was one.  She wouldn't have mentioned it on TV if that were the case.  The one thing a gaslighter doesn't want to admit is that they were ever a gaslighter!  She mentioned it because she wanted to show that she knows what gaslighting is.  It's to the point that she even feels like she has to defend what she says about Austin because he is always denying everything.  The only thing he admitted was not telling her about the vaping and then trying to deny it in front of people that knew better, but he was caught dead to rights on that and had no other choice.

So based on all of that I feel that she is taking ownership of her past and admitting to it while I see signs that she's overcome some of it.  In this case, though, Austin is pressing all her buttons and she's going into a sort-of PTSD based on his confusing behavior.  She is onto him as being more concerned with his image on TV than with her, and she is pissed off about it understandably because he keeps trying to act like she's wrong about that and paint her as some sort of insecure wacko (which incidentally is gaslighting right there).  I don't think she is.  Based on what I see of him I think she's right and I don't blame her for coming back at him to expose him for what he is.  I wouldn't want some guy to make me look like a wacko in front of the entire audience and my friends and family.  In other words, she's not gaslighting him in doing that.  She's defending herself and that's obvious to me.  He's been gaslighting her even without being accused of anything.  It's ridiculous.

And based on the bong someone saw in her apartment it's obvious she doesn't care about vaping and might even be positive about it.  She just wants to show that Austin has a pattern of hiding things about himself from the world and in some cases also her, and that this is why she doesn't trust him and feels insecure in the relationship.  You're not insecure if you really have reasons to feel insecure.  The issue is HIS, not hers.  But he is all too willing to make her look to the world like it's her issue and not his.  That's the only reason she's outing him on it, because otherwise the world and the audience would likely believe him and not her.  Some people will still believe him but not someone like me.  

And I have not said that Emily is not an alcoholic.  I am fully aware that she might be and probably is but that still doesn't make her deserve the nasty attitude and disrespect she has gotten from Brennan.  I am more concerned with a person's true intentions than with their failings here.  The men here are showing signs of having nasty intentions while the women have failings but are being put on the defensive because the men they're with are not treating them with the respect they deserve.

I have not seen Becca call Austin a pothead.  That's news to me.  I think I would have remembered that.

[Crashcourse]

41 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

There is no double standard.  I just don't base my opinion on these people on what comes out of their mouths but what I see about them in general that I think adds up to something.  Perhaps it comes from my personality type and background in Counseling Psychology but I am sensitive to seeing self awareness and growth in people and in this case I see more self awareness and personal growth in Becca than most or even all of the others this season despite outward appearances that I personally don't consider as important to what's really going on inside a person.  I'm trained and it's my way to cut through the BS to see that.  It's my wheelhouse, what can I say?  Other people are good at other things.  This is where I live. 

And I personally feel that Becca is not now a gaslighter if she ever was one.  She wouldn't have mentioned it on TV if that were the case.  The one thing a gaslighter doesn't want to admit is that they were ever a gaslighter!  She mentioned it because she wanted to show that she knows what gaslighting is.  It's to the point that she even feels like she has to defend what she says about Austin because he is always denying everything.  The only thing he admitted was not telling her about the vaping and then trying to deny it in front of people that knew better, but he was caught dead to rights on that and had no other choice.

So based on all of that I feel that she is taking ownership of her past and admitting to it while I see signs that she's overcome some of it.  In this case, though, Austin is pressing all her buttons and she's going into a sort-of PTSD based on his confusing behavior.  She is onto him as being more concerned with his image on TV than with her, and she is pissed off about it understandably because he keeps trying to act like she's wrong about that and paint her as some sort of insecure wacko (which incidentally is gaslighting right there).  I don't think she is.  Based on what I see of him I think she's right and I don't blame her for coming back at him to expose him for what he is.  I wouldn't want some guy to make me look like a wacko in front of the entire audience and my friends and family.  In other words, she's not gaslighting him in doing that.  She's defending herself and that's obvious to me.  He's been gaslighting her even without being accused of anything.  It's ridiculous.

And based on the bong someone saw in her apartment it's obvious she doesn't care about vaping and might even be positive about it.  She just wants to show that Austin has a pattern of hiding things about himself from the world and in some cases also her, and that this is why she doesn't trust him and feels insecure in the relationship.  You're not insecure if you really have reasons to feel insecure.  The issue is HIS, not hers.  But he is all too willing to make her look to the world like it's her issue and not his.  That's the only reason she's outing him on it, because otherwise the world and the audience would likely believe him and not her.  Some people will still believe him but not someone like me.  

And I have not said that Emily is not an alcoholic.  I am fully aware that she might be and probably is but that still doesn't make her deserve the nasty attitude and disrespect she has gotten from Brennan.  I am more concerned with a person's true intentions than with their failings here.  The men here are showing signs of having nasty intentions while the women have failings but are being put on the defensive because the men they're with are not treating them with the respect they deserve.

I have not seen Becca call Austin a pothead.  That's news to me.  I think I would have remembered that.

Now I feel like I'm being gaslighted! 😱

[Gator Stud]

51 minutes ago, StatisticalOutlier said:

Did she?

Yes she said he vaped excessively.  I translated her comment for everybody.  She didnt need to share that with everybody, even if it was true- especially since her new bestie, Emily was wasted a bit of the time and she said nothing about it. 

[Yeah No]

32 minutes ago, Crashcourse said:

Now I feel like I'm being gaslighted! 😱

Hey, you're entitled to your opinion.  Of course I think mine is best.  Who doesn't think theirs is the right one?  If they tell you otherwise, then they're really trying to gaslight you, LOL.  😉

31 minutes ago, Gator Stud said:

Yes she said he vaped excessively.  I translated her comment for everybody.  She didnt need to share that with everybody, even if it was true- especially since her new bestie, Emily was wasted a bit of the time and she said nothing about it. 

Can you quote chapter and verse on that?  Because even your explanation has me confused and I need to know where I can verify that on my own.  But even if she said that, that still doesn't mean she disapproves of vaping.  She just may not like a guy that does that incessantly to the exclusion of other activities.  The guy I dated in college was like that with weed.  I didn't really care if he smoked weed, it just felt like he was doing that so often he didn't want to do anything else.

Edited March 17 by Yeah No

[Hip-to-be-Square]

1 hour ago, StatisticalOutlier said:

Did she?

I didn't take notes while watching the show or anything, but that's my recollection, too--nobody on the show has ever said what Austin vapes.  

But vaping weed stinks.  There's no way you can vape cannabis in the bathroom of an apartment you share with someone and they won't smell it.  It's produced a stinky cloud over the entire island of Manhattan.

You even said you make people vape weed on your porch and not inside.  (I'll leave aside the discussion of whether it's fair to make neighbors smell it for another day.) 

I haven't used cannabis since the kinder, gentler, days of 1970s weed, but I'd much rather someone in my life vape weed every once in a while, the equivalent of having a drink occasionally, to vaping nicotine all day every day. 

I wish they'd use edibles.  Those don't stink. 

    I dislike the smell of pot too.  I'm kind of naive to recognizing drug use since I don't drink, smoke or do drugs.  A few years ago, I briefly dated a guy who was trying to hide his pot use from me- his car smelled, and his sweatshirts smelled strange.  I put two and two together and told him that he should be truthful about smoking pot so that he can find a girl who is compatible with his lifestyle rather than trying to rope me into dating someone who smokes pot when it's something I don't do, and I would not be comfortable being around it.  

   Pot can be an issue when someone lies about it to a partner or drives while impaired- or it smells up a public bus, the neighborhood or an apartment complex. 

[Chatty Cake]

Catching up on the episode today. My god these women are losers going on and on about how strong they are when they were whimpering losers all season. Becca using more of that annoying therapy speak like she was in trauma. He wasn’t attracted to her, he tried for longer than he should have but other than that he did nothing wrong!  He couldn’t force himself to have sex with her. She grossed him out for some reason, maybe the acne, piercings her body shape, her hair….etc I could see him being repulsed. Especially since she was controlling and manipulative. If he wanted to vape off camera she had no business outing him. What a stank pig she has shown herself to be.

Lauren seems like such a nice lady. It’s too bad she got saddled with Ory. Did he have pink eye in his scene? Gross!

Brennan had closure during the relationship. His friend should not tell him he needs to see drunk ass Emily ever again. The guy was pretty much tortured by her!

Cameron has a point about Claire. She was a sour grapes type of gal. He also outed her as a lying liar. Why was her ass in the other’s relationships? Once you separate you shouldn’t have access to the other couples because the person is most likely bitter.

Chloe needs to work on her marriage(if her and Michael are really together) before trying to foster. She doesn’t know that she can handle several foster children. She needs to be a grown up about the topic. 
Oh man, the question about getting what you asked for, you know Chloe was lying. LMAO! That freak shouldn’t be telling her he needs more data. What a jerk! He’s having sex with her, there’s no reason to tell her he could say no. Asshole!
 

Oh lord! That stupid aura photo shoot. How dumb. I wouldn’t want a photographer that wears a hat like that either. Red flag. Plus the lady was full of shit. Becca is NOT nurturing nor is she empathetic. She’s a giant crybaby. Drunky’s reading was slightly more realistic.

Edited March 17 by Chatty Cake

[Maximadc]

I feel that we are watching different shows at this point.
I see the boys reacting to the girls' actions in all three cases.
Emily - cause - alcohol and agressive behavior - resulting Brennan's distancing and withdrawal.
Becca - needy and emotionally fragile- resulting Austin hiding stuff and giving vague answer.
Claire - cold and calculating - Cam - defensive and removed himself from the situation.
Just the way how I see this season. 

Again I blame the production and believe all these matches were purposely mismatched.

 

Edited March 17 by Maximadc

[Elizzikra]

Quote

 

But vaping weed stinks.  There's no way you can vape cannabis in the bathroom of an apartment you share with someone and they won't smell it.  It's produced a stinky cloud over the entire island of Manhattan.

You even said you make people vape weed on your porch and not inside.  (I'll leave aside the discussion of whether it's fair to make neighbors smell it for another day.) 

 

My house is sufficiently far from others that the smell really doesn't carry. 

Vaping nicotine also stinks. I mean, I guess some people like the smell but I find them unpleasant. This was part of my reasoning that Austin was pretty stupid to lie about it; since it's impossible to miss the smell unless you are completely noseblind.

Quote

Is it possible that the "Runaway Bride" issue was Show created just to bolster sagging ratings ??

Sure. Maybe it's even likely. I didn't think much about not seeing anything about the original bride. I figured that since she withdrew, she either wanted to not be shown (and they agreed) or they decided not to give her any exposure at all since she didn't go through with it.

[Chatty Cake]

7 minutes ago, Hip-to-be-Square said:

    I dislike the smell of pot too.  I'm kind of naive to recognizing drug use since I don't drink, smoke or do drugs.  A few years ago, I briefly dated a guy who was trying to hide his pot use from me- his car smelled, and his sweatshirts smelled strange.  I put two and two together and told him that he should be truthful about smoking pot so that he can find a girl who is compatible with his lifestyle rather than trying to rope me into dating someone who smokes pot when it's something I don't do, and I would not be comfortable being around it.  

   Pot can be an issue when someone lies about it to a partner or drives while impaired- or it smells up a public bus, the neighborhood or an apartment complex. 

Let’s be real though, if Austin had been having sex with Becca, she wouldn’t have given a shit about the vaping. She’s mad and bitter that he didn’t want her. 

[Yeah No]

I'm not pointing fingers at anyone here, but in my history of watching this show I've seen far more people wanting to believe the men than the women.  The grooms have to do something so heinous that it isn't possible to hide and the brides have to be damned near perfect for for opinion to turn against their husbands no matter how bad they are.  I have not doubted that the women this season have some big faults but when stacked up to  the men I still think they are the nicer people.  In Cam and Clare's case, though, I think they're equally as bad as each other.  I'm really talking about Emily and Becca here.  I am actually in agreement that Chloe is either an actress or a nutcase and my opinion is still out on Michael.  

Interestingly, in my experience online the opinion tends to run the other way on other sites with more people defending the women over the men.

Edited March 17 by Yeah No

[Elizzikra]

Quote

She grossed him out for some reason, maybe the acne, piercings her body shape, her hair….etc I could see him being repulsed. Especially since she was controlling and manipulative. If he wanted to vape off camera she had no business outing him. What a stank pig she has shown herself to be.

That's a really harsh description of Becca, in my opinion. She's not a stick figure and she has acne. That doesn't make her repulsive. I'm not sure which piercings she has that are "repulsive;" I didn't notice any other than I'm assuming she has one hole in each ear. I have multiple piercings though, so clearly I'm not someone who is disgusted by them. You're entitled to your opinion and you certainly don't have to like Becca (and obviously don't) but "stank pig" is just a really cruel way to describe another human being. 

I've said my bit on the vaping elsewhere...

[Hip-to-be-Square]

10 minutes ago, Chatty Cake said:

Let’s be real though, if Austin had been having sex with Becca, she wouldn’t have given a shit about the vaping. She’s mad and bitter that he didn’t want her. 

So true! He could've staged chicken fights or been doing coke on the glass coffee table, but it would've been a non-issue as long as he was making sure to blow her back out in the bedroom! 😅  Becca was horny and his continuous sexual rejections made her put him under a microscope.  

[Chatty Cake]

9 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

That's a really harsh description of Becca, in my opinion. She's not a stick figure and she has acne. That doesn't make her repulsive. I'm not sure which piercings she has that are "repulsive;" I didn't notice any other than I'm assuming she has one hole in each ear. I have multiple piercings though, so clearly I'm not someone who is disgusted by them. You're entitled to your opinion and you certainly don't have to like Becca (and obviously don't) but "stank pig" is just a really cruel way to describe another human being. 

I've said my bit on the vaping elsewhere...

I saw a nose ring that looked like it may have had snot on it from all the crying. Sorry to be graphic but she just seemed hygienically challenged. 

 

4 minutes ago, Hip-to-be-Square said:

So true! He could've staged chicken fights or been doing coke on the glass coffee table, but it would've been a non-issue as long as he was making sure to blow her back out in the bedroom! 😅  Becca was horny and his continuous sexual rejections made her put him under a microscope.  

Exactly. She only took issue because she was rejected and he liked the producer more than her.

[Gator Stud]

1 hour ago, StatisticalOutlier said:

But vaping weed stinks.  There's no way you can vape cannabis in the bathroom of an apartment you share with someone and they won't smell it.  It's produced a stinky cloud over the entire island of Manhattan.

No, its the opposite.  Smoking weed is the thing that stinks.  Vaping weed smells like fresh flower and often has a nice aroma.

[Yeah No]

4 hours ago, Peppermint said:

Sorry to interupt the pothead/drunk/cheater/liar discussion, but I have a question about Chloe and Mike.

Is it possible that the "Runaway Bride" issue was Show created just to bolster sagging ratings ?? Was it part of their contract to have the already chosen bride fake a runaway, then wait a few weeks to reappear as a new choice ?? Cleverly applied make up can change your look, even make you look like a different ethnic group. We never saw her front view...just long dark hair like Chloe....was Chloe wearing one of those quaint old fashioned veils ?? Remember when short veils covered the bride's face, then when the groom was given permission to "kiss the bride" he lifted the veil up over her hair and they kissed ?? {Gawd, I'm OLD}.  Mike's group would be so busy gawking at each other after her refusal that they wouldn't pay too much attention to her [especially veiled.} The bride's group was likely producer's friends or out of town Little Theatre actors..."Hey, I need 2 sorority sisters, a Mom and Dad, a stepfather, an elderly Auntie, and a gay male cousin. That should be enough, budget, y'know." 

Chloe is either not serious about the foster children, or is woefully uninformed. Abused, damaged children require oceans of care and compassion and just plain work. My cousin fosters just this kind of child and one at a time is all she can handle. The girls CANNOT be left alone with her husband for obvious reasons, there are weekly therapy sessions, and the fosters are not allowed to leave the home county, therefore, no out of state family trips. She loves her work, but the idea of 5 at a time...no way !!  And add every morning alpaca poop raking, vet bills for 100 plus animals [ the baby llama tripped on a rock and broke his leg, and there seems to be a fever spreading among the pygmy goats] , and a normal person might just go mad...

Okay, 5 cents worth just paid. Back to bitching about " who cheated who, and who don't even care anymore..."

Hi, sorry you came on when we were going on about that other stuff - If you go back into the episode threads several of us had the same thoughts about the fake runaway bride for ratings.  I said that perhaps the producers realized this season was a dud with all the other couples falling apart so maybe they wanted to spice things up and perhaps make us think Michael would find his "perfect match".  I even had the same thought about that first bride scene looking like a setup.  It was overly edited and just didn't seem to add up.  

You're also far from alone about Chloe and that has been discussed here too.  Some of us think she's either a wacko who is highly unrealistic or trying to push Michael away with deliberately OTT dreams.  Or worse yet, maybe she's an actress hired to play a part by the show.  Anyway, welcome to the club, it's a big one here!

[Chatty Cake]

5 hours ago, Peppermint said:

Sorry to interupt the pothead/drunk/cheater/liar discussion, but I have a question about Chloe and Mike.

Is it possible that the "Runaway Bride" issue was Show created just to bolster sagging ratings ?? Was it part of their contract to have the already chosen bride fake a runaway, then wait a few weeks to reappear as a new choice ?? Cleverly applied make up can change your look, even make you look like a different ethnic group. We never saw her front view...just long dark hair like Chloe....was Chloe wearing one of those quaint old fashioned veils ?? Remember when short veils covered the bride's face, then when the groom was given permission to "kiss the bride" he lifted the veil up over her hair and they kissed ?? {Gawd, I'm OLD}.  Mike's group would be so busy gawking at each other after her refusal that they wouldn't pay too much attention to her [especially veiled.} The bride's group was likely producer's friends or out of town Little Theatre actors..."Hey, I need 2 sorority sisters, a Mom and Dad, a stepfather, an elderly Auntie, and a gay male cousin. That should be enough, budget, y'know." 

Chloe is either not serious about the foster children, or is woefully uninformed. Abused, damaged children require oceans of care and compassion and just plain work. My cousin fosters just this kind of child and one at a time is all she can handle. The girls CANNOT be left alone with her husband for obvious reasons, there are weekly therapy sessions, and the fosters are not allowed to leave the home county, therefore, no out of state family trips. She loves her work, but the idea of 5 at a time...no way !!  And add every morning alpaca poop raking, vet bills for 100 plus animals [ the baby llama tripped on a rock and broke his leg, and there seems to be a fever spreading among the pygmy goats] , and a normal person might just go mad...

Okay, 5 cents worth just paid. Back to bitching about " who cheated who, and who don't even care anymore..."

I would say yes to the runaway bride being staged but Michael is rather gross and creepy. I mean if you came down the aisle and saw the acne, the tattoos, the hair…..etc I could see becoming panicked at the thought of having to spend time alone with him. Not to mention his weird outfits. I think the bride definitely ran off.

Not sure if Chloe realizes she’ll look mean if she rejects Michael so is making up wanting a ton of foster kids and animals to scare him off. Good tactic if she is.

[Peppermint]

Recorded this season but waited til this week to binge-watch it. Couldn't get really excited to watch. The last couples I really was interested in were Chris and Allyssa [sp?] & Bennett and the Dr from New Orleans. Sad that they broke up after moving to Richmond. Maybe if her residency had been in Louisiana ??

When I heard Allyssa say, with such contempt "He sells cars", I wanted to march up that hill and bitch-slap her. If you reap what you sow...she probably needs a John Deere for the harvest. Yeah, I loved me some Chris.

Now that Show has turned into an 8 week house party with all the couples paying more attention to their new "friends" than their new "mates", I probably won't be watching past episode 3. It used to be nice to see couples cooking for one another, talking about work, and their future. Now it's drink & gossip & find fault. Back to Soaps. Same shit, but the people aren't real and aren't hurting each other IRL.

Ciao y'all.

 

[Kimboweena]

2 hours ago, Chatty Cake said:

I would say yes to the runaway bride being staged but Michael is rather gross and creepy. I mean if you came down the aisle and saw the acne, the tattoos, the hair…..etc I could see becoming panicked at the thought of having to spend time alone with him. Not to mention his weird outfits. I think the bride definitely ran off.

I heard something early on about the bride changing her mind about the whole "married at first sight" thing before she even saw Michael.  So I didn't think she backed out because of his appearance.  Don't remember the source, if it was mentioned on the show itself. Does anyone else remember this?

[qtpye]

8 hours ago, Peppermint said:

Is it possible that the "Runaway Bride" issue was Show created just to bolster sagging ratings ?? Was it part of their contract to have the already chosen bride fake a runaway, then wait a few weeks to reappear as a new choice ?? Cleverly applied make up can change your look, even make you look like a different ethnic group. We never saw her front view...just long dark hair like Chloe....was Chloe wearing one of those quaint old fashioned veils ?? Remember when short veils covered the bride's face, then when the groom was given permission to "kiss the bride" he lifted the veil up over her hair and they kissed ?? {Gawd, I'm OLD}.  Mike's group would be so busy gawking at each other after her refusal that they wouldn't pay too much attention to her [especially veiled.} The bride's group was likely producer's friends or out of town Little Theatre actors..."Hey, I need 2 sorority sisters, a Mom and Dad, a stepfather, an elderly Auntie, and a gay male cousin. That should be enough, budget, y'know." 

At this point, the participants might as well be deepfake artificial intelligence.

I think fake AI people might have a better chance at a successful marriage when compared to this crew.

[ChiCricket]

5 hours ago, Gator Stud said:

No, its the opposite.  Smoking weed is the thing that stinks.  Vaping weed smells like fresh flower and often has a nice aroma.

Ok..maybe to some people it smells like fresh flowers, to me it smells like skunk.

 Source, my grandson who vapes in his room. 

JS everyone doesn't like the same smells. I also can't stand cigarette smoke.

Ps I'd rather be around a pothead than an alcoholic, if push comes to shove.

Edited March 18 by ChiCricket

[princelina]

19 hours ago, Yeah No said:

It's interesting that you brought this up because it gives me the opportunity to say what was already on my mind to say about this.  I personally feel that most of these people are too messed up to ever find happiness in a relationship but I do see glimmers of hope in Becca.  If the worst that can be said about her is that she is unrealistic, gullible, immature and has self esteem issues, there's more hope for her than for a possible alcoholic or a controlling therapist to be, or a narcissistic possible actress.  And there's more hope for her than pretty much any of the guys too, although I'm not sure yet about Michael.  She's already showing signs of self-reflection and self-questioning on a level that none of them are showing yet and I fear that they are headed for doubling down while she is headed for waking up enough to one day get over her issues.   I think this experience might be the catalyst to snap her out of most of what she's doing to sabotage herself, although it might take time.  Unfortunately I think it will just serve to cement most of the others in their self defeating behavior. 

Even that crazy Sam of the wax melts found a husband, and said she was ashamed of her behavior on this show - so there's hope for everyone 😄

12 hours ago, Gator Stud said:

I'm just not stupid.  If Becca really didnt care about vaping they wouldn't even need to talk about it, hence no lie.  But she obviously does care about vaping so she would consider it "lying" every time he vaped but didnt inform her. Why would you ask if someone is vaping unless you wanted to vape yourself, or nag them about vaping. Becca is lying badly.  She thinks we are stupid and dont understand logic.  She is not cool with vaping despite what she told us.

Or she said something like, "What's that smell?"  "What smell?"  "It smells like _____ in the bathroom."  "I don't smell anything."  "How can you not?  Were you vaping?"  "No". "Then what's that smell?"  "I don't smell anything" and on and on.  The lie is the offense, not the original action which you never thought you were making a big deal about when you started.

7 hours ago, Maximadc said:

I feel that we are watching different shows at this point.
I see the boys reacting to the girls' actions in all three cases.
Emily - cause - alcohol and agressive behavior - resulting Brennan's distancing and withdrawal.
Becca - needy and emotionally fragile- resulting Austin hiding stuff and giving vague answer.
Claire - cold and calculating - Cam - defensive and removed himself from the situation.
Just the way how I see this season. 

Again I blame the production and believe all these matches were purposely mismatched.

 

I agree with you on the first two, but Cam started lying during the post-ceremony champagne toast, so Clare was lucky to be a cold bitch.  Becca should take some lessons!

[Gator Stud]

1 hour ago, princelina said:

Or she said something like, "What's that smell?"  "What smell?"  "It smells like _____ in the bathroom."  "I don't smell anything."  "How can you not?  Were you vaping?"  "No". "Then what's that smell?"  "I don't smell anything" and on and on.  The lie is the offense, not the original action which you never thought you were making a big deal about when you started.

We are not stupid.  She lives in freaking Colorado.  She knows exactly what that smell is? Why does she have to ask him what the smell is when she knows what the smell is. That's called passive-aggressive nagging. She thinks the viewers are stupid. She says she is cool with it but then ask what the smell is when he is vaping in the bathroom. No she is not cool with it, or else she would not have outed him on national TV. She wouldnt have even mentioned it. Like when I took women out on dates, I didnt point out that they were drinking or mention that it smelled like alcohol, lolz. 

9 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Can you quote chapter and verse on that?  Because even your explanation has me confused and I need to know where I can verify that on my own. 

I think the exact words were, "Austin vapes ALOT".  Thats a lowkey way of calling someone a pothead.  She pretends like she doesn't care, but she does care, or she would not have outed him. "I dont really care about this except I am making a bid deal about this".  She is not really fooling anybody.  

[StatisticalOutlier]

3 hours ago, ChiCricket said:

9 hours ago, Gator Stud said:

No, its the opposite.  Smoking weed is the thing that stinks.  Vaping weed smells like fresh flower and often has a nice aroma.

Ok..maybe to some people it smells like fresh flowers, to me it smells like skunk.

He said fresh flower, singular.  Not fresh flowers.  "Cannabis flower" is another term for the part of the marijuana that is smoked, and lots of people think it stinks. 

(I had a feeling people wouldn't know the difference between "flower" and "flowers" in this context.  Suffice to say vaped weed smells nothing like lilacs or magnolias.)

1 hour ago, Gator Stud said:

I think the exact words were, "Austin vapes ALOT".  Thats a lowkey way of calling someone a pothead. 

Well, you said she called him a pothead on national TV, not that she implied he was a pothead, or spoke in code about his being a pothead.  And if she was speaking this indirectly, it's unlikely people who aren't steeped in pot culture would get the reference/accusation.