All Episodes Discussion

[biakbiak]

The original episode was two hours so I wondered if it was scheduled wrong because it did just cutoff in the middle of a sentenve.

I don't know if he did it but the boyfriend's "crying" seemed so fake.

[Ina123]

I think the abused spouse story is getting old to juries. There are so many abuse shelters today. There's lots of help everywhere. I don't condone it, I just think it's becoming cliche. There are other answers for most people today.

 

That said, I could never have convicted her of 1st degree...possibly 2nd, or better, manslaughter. She was stupid to not take the deal. Six years with a possibility of being only three. Geesh. That was a no brainer.

[Ina123]

I've never understood how these people can continue to live with someone that they honestly have to know killed someone. Even if they are out on bail before conviction I couldn't live with them. I'd be scared to.

[RedheadZombie]

She was convicted of 1st degree murder, not second degree, not manslaughter.  I guess the jury wasn't convinced that it was self defense.  I think she planned it quite carefully, and only screwed up when she mentioned the red flashlight in her initial "intruder" story.  The cop finding the gun was a total fluke

But were there any lesser charges? I don't remember. If the charge was only first degree murder, the jury couldn't convict for second degree or manslaughter.

[RedheadZombie]

That mother can FOAD, as far as I'm concerned. She should have been jailed with the statutory rapist. Then of course, she's front and center crying about her beautiful baby. She couldn't bother mothering the girl but loves the attention her death brings.

I was shocked she was so young. She looked twenty years older. She lived a rough life.

[walnutqueen]

But were there any lesser charges? I don't remember. If the charge was only first degree murder, the jury couldn't convict for second degree or manslaughter.

 

It wasn't mentioned, so we really don't know.  But if the jury had believed her, they probably would have acquitted her.

[saber5055]

Many women are abused and battered

Wow. That statement alone is incredibly depressing. 

 

How all those abused and battered women choose to deal with the abuser ... their decision I guess.

But if the jury had believed her, they probably would have acquitted her.

 

A jury's verdict is not always the correct one. OJ Simpson comes to mind.

Edited April 4, 2016 by saber5055

[Ohmo]

It wasn't mentioned, so we really don't know.  But if the jury had believed her, they probably would have acquitted her.

 

Not necessarily.  I can see the DA taking all of the lesser charges off the table once she rejected the deal.  She was offered the lesser charge and didn't take the deal.  I think it's possible that some jurors could have believed part of her story but still thought she was culpable.  They could have been in "jury no man's land" and with the choice being "something or nothing," they went with something.

 

I don't know what I would do.  As I said upthread, I'd be more inclined to convict her of involuntary manslaughter.  I don't believe all elements of her "fight to the death story," but I also don't believe that she had a grand plan either.  Do juries get to know if the accused has rejected a deal?  That would be an important thing to know for me because then I'd think that she had a choice and deliberately chose to reject the offer.  She'd be the one who narrowed her options, not me.

[ari333]

I felt for the sister. SHe seemed caring and normal.  

 

I wish we had the second hour of what happened.

 

I was kind of leaning away from the bf, but Im wrong a lot. :-)

 

It didn't seem that the rules were followed in that she was not "ejected" from the club with the bf when they got into that spat.  So that made me side eye the security dudes.  They made a big deal out of the fact that BOTH folks in an altercation have to leave. Yet golden girl was allowed to stay Shocker. Great ; leave a beautiful woman (or any woman) who came escorted....leave her  unescorted by bouncing the bf for some small infraction (and that's what it sounded like) . How convenient.  

The part I found fishy is that the bf left without her and said that that had happened before. That is odd. imo.

Edited April 4, 2016 by ari333

[saber5055]

Do juries get to know if the accused has rejected a deal?

 

So many times juries don't get to hear testimony that would help either side, and some evidence can be withheld from trials for so many legal-loophole reasons. Our legal system is pretty much a quagmire. Some heavily biased evidence can be admitted while other testimony/evidence isn't allowed. 

[biakbiak]

She was ejected from the club a few minutes after he was ejected they just didn't eject them at the exact same moment which makes since to me for fighting as they also don't want it to continue right on the sidewalk in front of the club and give them a few minutes breathing time.

[ari333]

She was ejected from the club a few minutes after he was ejected they just didn't eject them at the exact same moment which makes since to me for fighting as they also don't want it to continue right on the sidewalk in front of the club and give them a few minutes breathing time.

OK.

But why did she ask for his credit card? It sounded to  me like she planned to stay and purchase drinks, food IDK. It seems they (the staff) would have settled his/their bill before he got bounced if he was paying. imo.

[biakbiak]

T

OK.

But why did she ask for his credit card? It sounded to  me like she planned to stay and purchase drinks, food IDK. It seems they (the staff) would have settled his/their bill before he got bounced if he was paying. imo.

To go to another club or get a cab for herself, a lot of reasons. They showed the footage of her being escorted out of the club by the manager repeatedly and said it was 4-5 minuyes after he left.

[ari333]

T

To go to another club or get a cab for herself, a lot of reasons. They showed the footage of her being escorted out of the club by the manager repeatedly and said it was 4-5 minuyes after he left.

OK I should pay more attention.

I still say I'd wait for my significant other and not a "Screw you; Im goin home" [/Eric Cartman]

[teebax]

Abused spouses, especially battered women, will tell you that is easy to write, sometimes if not always, impossible to do. There is no way for someone who has never been abused to even imagine what that situation is like. Words are easy, actions are not. Especially when an action can cause a very serious REaction from the abuser.

Thank you so much for posting this. I get really angry when I see people blame victims of abuse for not "just" leaving. It's not even remotely that simple. I was in a very abusive lesbian relationship for five years. Now, I'm a tough Army vet who can kick almost anyone's ass, but I'm not violent. So I wasn't used to hitting people out of anger. That was how she handled everything. Before I knew it, she had me convinced I was worthless and unlovable and had completely alienated me from my family.

 

One day I finally got up the nerve to tell my older sister what was really happening behind closed doors (no one who knew us knew it was going on.) My sister told me the next time my girlfriend puts my hands on her I should kick her ass. I don't know why I'd never told myself this, but my sister somehow giving me permission to defend myself clicked with me. Sure enough, the next time that horrible woman put her hands on me, I laid her ass out. Then I threw her out of my house.

 

I say all of that to say this: you don't know what's happening behind closed doors, and it's not just as simple as "leave." 

 

Disclaimer: I'm not saying she should have killed him. I can't support that. But I understand.

[saber5055]

Bless your heart, teebax, for sharing your story. There is physical abuse and mental abuse. Sometimes I think the mental kind is even worse than the physical that you can see and TRY to defend yourself from. The mental abuse comes in small doses, over a period of time, until the victim is unable to do anything to defend her/himself. Yes, men can be abused too.

 

I totally understand when someone finds the only way out is to kill the abuser. It's called being at the end of your rope. And until you have walked in those shoes, it's easy to tell someone what they SHOULD do. Being able to actually DO it (example: leave) can be impossible for so many reasons. 

 

The scars an abuser leaves on his/her victim never go away. NEVER.

 

I'm so glad you got the help you needed, teebax, and I hope your life is better now.

Edited April 5, 2016 by saber5055

[ari333]

Bless your heart, teebax, for sharing your story. There is physical abuse and mental abuse. Sometimes I think the mental kind is even worse than the physical that you can see and TRY to defend yourself from. The mental abuse comes in small doses, over a period of time, until the victim is unable to do anything to defend her/himself. Yes, men can be abused too.

 

I totally understand when someone finds the only way out is to kill the abuser. It's called being at the end of your rope. And until you have walked in those shoes, it's easy to tell someone what they SHOULD do. Being able to actually DO it (example: leave) can be impossible for so many reasons. 

 

The scars an abuser leaves on his/her victim never go away. NEVER.

 

I'm so glad you got the help you needed, teebax, and I hope your life is better now.

\YES so much  THIS

this^^^^^^

I think the mental and psych kind of abuse can actually be worse...... as weird as that sounds.

Not to diminish physical abuse. That must be horrific.

[Jpxfactor]

To me it looked more like an ambush and not self defence.

[teebax]

To me it looked more like an ambush and not self defence.

It seems like you're trying to simplify what is a complicated issue. If she was, in fact, abused, and a lot of people here including me think she was, it's much more complicated than her just ambushing him. When one is terrified of another and finally snaps, that can manifest itself in many ways. One of those ways may be in an ambush, but the root cause of it is still the abuse.

 

If you ever saw The Burning Bed that's what I'm talking about. Yes, the husband was asleep at the time she killed him, and some might say why didn't she just leave. It's just not that simple.

[Sims Addict]

I agree with others that she should have taken the deal. While I am exceedingly sympathetic to abuse victims (and feel there is merit in her abuse defense), a man is dead and there has to be some reckoning for that.

 

I am surprised no one has mentioned her best friend from childhood. I am sure that woman was well-intentioned, but she came off as very cloying to me. The slow cadence, tilted head, and attempt at "soft" eyes fell flat to me. Then, she went from "I sent Christmas cards with no response....to....that explains she was a battered woman!" I was far more likely to believe the neighbor and co-workers who had been around the couple. I wish they had spent more time interviewing them and not a friend who admittedly had lost touch with her and really didn't know much about Jane's current life.

[Jpxfactor]

I still believe it's murder...

[saber5055]

I still believe it's murder...

 

 

Of course it was. So is justifiable homicide murder. If someone kills another person, it's murder, regardless of circumstances. Soldiers murder people every day, all around the world. And many walk free when they "murder" someone.

 

And if my husband, an ex-Olympic-medal-winner, a professional athlete, were abusing me, I wouldn't confront him face-to-face. No way am I a physical match for a man like that. Plus I'd just get another beat down for how dare I question him for anything he does, including beating the tar out of me.

 

"The Burning Bed" should be required viewing for every woman everywhere. Otherwise, I think only those of us who have lived long enough can understand this woman's life.

[ButterQueen]

I'm old enough to know all about "The Burning Bed", but that doesn't mean I don't think this wasn't' murder. I was not truly convinced she was abused.

[Jpxfactor]

I wasn't convinced either. It took planning .. But she never thought they would find the gun and look at her. Nice try. No cigar.

[Ohmo]

Owen Labrie, Ex-St. Paul's Student Convicted of Sex Assault, Seeks New Trial

[funky-rat]

The one that always sticks with me is Mystery In Rock Hill.  I can't remember when it originally aired, but the transcript online says it was "updated" in 2010.

 

It was one of the strangest and bizarre cases I'd ever seen, and one of the saddest.  And it ignited a fury of supporters that I hadn't seen since a certain case that I will not mention (because I don't want to turn this into a discussion on that case) that has been in the news recently.  Billy Wayne Cope was a big dude - very heavy.  He claimed he had a nightmare about the rapture of the church, and got up to check on his kids, and found one of them dead.  He does a bizarre 911 call in which he tells them his daughter is dead, and declines to do any CPR or render any aid, saying she is "with Jesus" or something similar.  He confesses 3 different times to killing her, changing his story each time.  He even confesses on video, standing in her bedroom.  At some point, they test DNA found on the daughter (she had been assaulted) and discover it belongs to someone else - a convicted rapist who had recently been out on bail.  But the prosecution contends Billy knew the rapist, and offered his daughter to him, so they convict both of them.  Billy's wife worked nights, and he "worked" days.  There was also a letter he allegedly wrote to a family friend saying he was guilty.  That letter was later found to be forged by said friend.  In a bizarre twist, said friend was watching his wife after she had gallbladder surgery, and she died in that friend's care.  And that friend had several other people die under her care.  But no one ever looked into her.

 

The whole thing was extremely strange, and initially, I was pretty outraged myself.  I couldn't comprehend how this guy was in jail when DNA clearly showed it wasn't him.  I was in the process of looking for further info about the case when I came across a website that was put up by the prosecution, in direct response to the Dateline ep.  It listed the full transcripts, evidence photos (all of them), and went over what they thought the episode glossed over, or missed completely.  And there was a LOT.

 

It did mention that Billy and his wife had their kids taken away once before.  Because they kept a "messy" house.  But that they'd gone to classes and got the kids back.  The website goes into great detail on that front.  The kids were going to school dirty, in dirty clothes, and absolutely reeking.  They would be covered with bug bites.  A teacher reported them.  When the authorities arrived at their house (a singlewide - and no judgment because I live in one too), they found a horror show.  No working plumbing.  Clothing and junk/trash knee deep.  Walls missing.  No running water.  The floor in the bathroom had rotted, and the bathtub had fallen through.  Bucket after bucket of feces were just sitting around.  In the kitchen, they found a gigantic bowl of what looked like Beefaroni that had several forks in it that the kids had been eating out of.  I wanted to vomit.  And in the middle of it was Billy's computer set up, looking the most organized out of anything else there.  They got the kids back when their church helped  them find a new place to live and it passed inspection.  There are photos of the new house in there.  And photos of the crime scene, a few short years later, where the house is well on it's way to looking like the old one - and Billy's computer setup is once again front and center, and about the only organized thing there.

 

Billy admitted to the cops he'd been up on his computer looking at adult websites.  He claims that he "accidentally" clicked on a link, and got lost in looking at them.  Dateline admits this.  What they didn't say is that while the police and paramedics are trying to remove his daughters dead body, he's sitting at his computer, deleting files.  He is told to stop more than once, but he does not comply.  Ultimately, his computer is seized.  Under his bed, they find an "adult toy".  His wife denies knowing anything about it and says she does not like them and it is not hers.  Unfortunately, they didn't notice it was there immediately, and when they went back for it, to see what DNA was on it, it's conveniently gone.  Dateline doesn't discuss that either.  He mentions that he assaulted his daughter with a broom handle in one of the confessions, and the autopsy said that's very likely.  The autopsy also says this poor girl shows a long history of abuse of that nature - exams of her sisters showed they were receiving abuse too.  Something else Dateline doesn't mention.

 

In the years since that special airs, his remaining two daughters have come forward a number of times to talk about how pervy their dad was, and how they would frequently be beaten by him, and worse.  One claims to have seen him before with the rapist who left his DNA, but I'm not sure on that.  I think (just my opinion) that one of two things happened:

 

1)  She was assaulted by the rapist first.  Her dad was a heavy sleeper with an older style CPAP machine, and he didn't hear what was going on (he has asserted many times that he slept through anything that happened to her).  She went to him for help when it was over, and he killed her, possibly because he was upset someone else "had" her, or maybe he thought she was lying and had a boy over to the house - hard to say.  The autopsy showed that she had marks and bruises and injuries that could be consistent with someone very large putting pressure on her.

 

2)  Her dad was involved in some sick thing with other people and kiddie porn, or worse, and that could be how he met the rapist - online.  It was commented on many times that they didn't have running water at times, but always had money for internet, and an expensive computer setup.  Perhaps the rapist came over - perhaps without Billy's knowledge - did what he did, and left, and Billy killed her, and there are a few good reasons why, including her threatening to turn him in - CPS had been called again very shortly before the murder because a teacher saw roaches on their clothes, and running out of their backpacks.  Him sitting at his computer - more concerned with it than his dead daughter - deleting files even after being told more than once to stop - easily lends to that theory.

 

I can't completely pin this on the rapist.  That man was a long-term serial rapist, but he never killed someone - ever.  And it seemed odd that he'd pick that moment to step up his game.  And if Billy had asked him to kill her, I'm sure he would have said that in court.  Somehow, they're both involved.  And Dateline left SO MUCH out of that story that they should be ashamed.  Thankfully, Billy Cope took his case to the Supreme Court, and was denied, pretty much ensuring he'll live the rest of his miserable life on death row.

 

Sorry for the book.  It just really bothered me how much they left out.  And I know that so many of the people out there clamoring for his release haven't read the documents on the other website (but they know it's there - they call it "pathetic"), or they might be singing a different tune.

 

[ari333]

The one that always sticks with me is Mystery In Rock Hill.  I can't remember when it originally aired, but the transcript online says it was "updated" in 2010.

 

It was one of the strangest and bizarre cases I'd ever seen, and one of the saddest.  And it ignited a fury of supporters that I hadn't seen since a certain case that I will not mention (because I don't want to turn this into a discussion on that case) that has been in the news recently.  Billy Wayne Cope was a big dude - very heavy.  He claimed he had a nightmare about the rapture of the church, and got up to check on his kids, and found one of them dead.  He does a bizarre 911 call in which he tells them his daughter is dead, and declines to do any CPR or render any aid, saying she is "with Jesus" or something similar.  He confesses 3 different times to killing her, changing his story each time.  He even confesses on video, standing in her bedroom.  At some point, they test DNA found on the daughter (she had been assaulted) and discover it belongs to someone else - a convicted rapist who had recently been out on bail.  But the prosecution contends Billy knew the rapist, and offered his daughter to him, so they convict both of them.  Billy's wife worked nights, and he "worked" days.  There was also a letter he allegedly wrote to a family friend saying he was guilty.  That letter was later found to be forged by said friend.  In a bizarre twist, said friend was watching his wife after she had gallbladder surgery, and she died in that friend's care.  And that friend had several other people die under her care.  But no one ever looked into her.

 

The whole thing was extremely strange, and initially, I was pretty outraged myself.  I couldn't comprehend how this guy was in jail when DNA clearly showed it wasn't him.  I was in the process of looking for further info about the case when I came across a website that was put up by the prosecution, in direct response to the Dateline ep.  It listed the full transcripts, evidence photos (all of them), and went over what they thought the episode glossed over, or missed completely.  And there was a LOT.

 

It did mention that Billy and his wife had their kids taken away once before.  Because they kept a "messy" house.  But that they'd gone to classes and got the kids back.  The website goes into great detail on that front.  The kids were going to school dirty, in dirty clothes, and absolutely reeking.  They would be covered with bug bites.  A teacher reported them.  When the authorities arrived at their house (a singlewide - and no judgment because I live in one too), they found a horror show.  No working plumbing.  Clothing and junk/trash knee deep.  Walls missing.  No running water.  The floor in the bathroom had rotted, and the bathtub had fallen through.  Bucket after bucket of feces were just sitting around.  In the kitchen, they found a gigantic bowl of what looked like Beefaroni that had several forks in it that the kids had been eating out of.  I wanted to vomit.  And in the middle of it was Billy's computer set up, looking the most organized out of anything else there.  They got the kids back when their church helped  them find a new place to live and it passed inspection.  There are photos of the new house in there.  And photos of the crime scene, a few short years later, where the house is well on it's way to looking like the old one - and Billy's computer setup is once again front and center, and about the only organized thing there.

 

Billy admitted to the cops he'd been up on his computer looking at adult websites.  He claims that he "accidentally" clicked on a link, and got lost in looking at them.  Dateline admits this.  What they didn't say is that while the police and paramedics are trying to remove his daughters dead body, he's sitting at his computer, deleting files.  He is told to stop more than once, but he does not comply.  Ultimately, his computer is seized.  Under his bed, they find an "adult toy".  His wife denies knowing anything about it and says she does not like them and it is not hers.  Unfortunately, they didn't notice it was there immediately, and when they went back for it, to see what DNA was on it, it's conveniently gone.  Dateline doesn't discuss that either.  He mentions that he assaulted his daughter with a broom handle in one of the confessions, and the autopsy said that's very likely.  The autopsy also says this poor girl shows a long history of abuse of that nature - exams of her sisters showed they were receiving abuse too.  Something else Dateline doesn't mention.

 

In the years since that special airs, his remaining two daughters have come forward a number of times to talk about how pervy their dad was, and how they would frequently be beaten by him, and worse.  One claims to have seen him before with the rapist who left his DNA, but I'm not sure on that.  I think (just my opinion) that one of two things happened:

 

1)  She was assaulted by the rapist first.  Her dad was a heavy sleeper with an older style CPAP machine, and he didn't hear what was going on (he has asserted many times that he slept through anything that happened to her).  She went to him for help when it was over, and he killed her, possibly because he was upset someone else "had" her, or maybe he thought she was lying and had a boy over to the house - hard to say.  The autopsy showed that she had marks and bruises and injuries that could be consistent with someone very large putting pressure on her.

 

2)  Her dad was involved in some sick thing with other people and kiddie porn, or worse, and that could be how he met the rapist - online.  It was commented on many times that they didn't have running water at times, but always had money for internet, and an expensive computer setup.  Perhaps the rapist came over - perhaps without Billy's knowledge - did what he did, and left, and Billy killed her, and there are a few good reasons why, including her threatening to turn him in - CPS had been called again very shortly before the murder because a teacher saw roaches on their clothes, and running out of their backpacks.  Him sitting at his computer - more concerned with it than his dead daughter - deleting files even after being told more than once to stop - easily lends to that theory.

 

I can't completely pin this on the rapist.  That man was a long-term serial rapist, but he never killed someone - ever.  And it seemed odd that he'd pick that moment to step up his game.  And if Billy had asked him to kill her, I'm sure he would have said that in court.  Somehow, they're both involved.  And Dateline left SO MUCH out of that story that they should be ashamed.  Thankfully, Billy Cope took his case to the Supreme Court, and was denied, pretty much ensuring he'll live the rest of his miserable life on death row.

 

Sorry for the book.  It just really bothered me how much they left out.  And I know that so many of the people out there clamoring for his release haven't read the documents on the other website (but they know it's there - they call it "pathetic"), or they might be singing a different tune.

 

I missed this one. Is "Mystery at Rock Hill" the title? Maybe I can find it on On Demand.

[funky-rat]

I missed this one. Is "Mystery at Rock Hill" the title? Maybe I can find it on On Demand.

"The Mystery In Rock Hill".  Here's the transcript:

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/38060491/ns/dateline_nbc-crime_reports/t/mystery-rock-hill/

 

Not sure if the video link is still good:

http://www.nbcnews.com/video/dateline/38151755

 

Take this one with a grain of salt.  I feel it's extremely one-sided.  And it leaves a LOT out.  And if you have the stomach after watching it, this is the link to the site that the prosecutor started that gives the in-depth background to their prior charges of neglect (including vomit inducing photos of their living conditions), and some pretty horrible crime scene photos (thankfully, we're spared any view of the young victim), autopsy reports, etc:

http://billywaynecope.com/

I don't have all of the answers in this one, but Billy Cope had a number of reasons that could cause him to kill his daughter, including that Children & Youth had been called....again...and he was afraid she'd talk.  I think the serial rapist in this case showed up before he killed her, and may be just a "wild card".

 

ETA:  Poor Amanda Cope looks so sad in most photos I see of her - especially ones taken at home.  Her teachers and others who knew her said she was a bright and friendly girl.

Also ETA: interview that quotes her younger sisters, now adults:

http://www.heraldonline.com/news/local/news-columns-blogs/andrew-dys/article12312026.html

 

Edited April 8, 2016 by funky-rat

[ari333]

Wife dies in a fishy fire, ... but there are gunshot wounds.

[walnutqueen]

Shocker - the husband did it,

[partofme]

The shocking thing about this episode is that the husband confessed.

[patty1h]

It pissed me off that the husband couldn't/wouldn't explain why he decided to kill his wife.  He gave the bullshit answer that he doesn't know why he did it.  He must have at least had an inkling of his motivation during his 6 hour roundtrip drive.  Did he just have the impulse "gotta kill my wife" and got behind the wheel?  And he just didn't think of getting a divorce?  So, murder is better, dude? Didn't the voiceover say that they were churchgoing people?  And trying to make himself look better by saying he drove over the speed limit hoping that he'd get caught.  If you want to get caught so badly, walk into the nearest police station, don't lie to your sons and everyone else.  What a hypocrite.

 

I'm thinking he's ashamed to say it was for sex.  He's not getting out of jail, so why can't he just come clean?

[teebax]

What pissed me off was hearing their gay son lament that he never had time to fully reconnect with his mother because that jackass took it away from him. Once again, a super conservative, so-called religious person has a problem with gay people but has no problem pursuing another woman and soliciting sex outside of marriage. The hypocrisy pisses me off so much.

My parents didn't speak to me for months after I came out. I'm glad we did get the chance to repair our relationship. Later in life I found out my father had numerous affairs behind my mother's back. Yet my sexuality was a problem for him because of our religion. Whatever. Anyway, my heart breaks for their son, and I hope he never gives his father the forgiveness he seeks. Fuck that guy.

[Cherrio]

What pissed me off was hearing their gay son lament that he never had time to fully reconnect with his mother because that jackass took it away from him. Once again, a super conservative, so-called religious person has a problem with gay people but has no problem pursuing another woman and soliciting sex outside of marriage. The hypocrisy pisses me off so much.

My parents didn't speak to me for months after I came out. I'm glad we did get the chance to repair our relationship. Later in life I found out my father had numerous affairs behind my mother's back. Yet my sexuality was a problem for him because of our religion. Whatever. Anyway, my heart breaks for their son, and I hope he never gives his father the forgiveness he seeks. Fuck that guy.

Great post !         So many of these killers hide behind their zealot beliefs. Makes me sick.   I was happy to see the sons and daughter in law came together at the end.    

[Ohmo]

Dateline skipped over the fact that there was a mistrial last year.

 

Juror Describes Discussion That Prompted Mistrial

 

Now I will have to re-watch because I'm now confused.  Did he accept a deal or are they waiting to try him again?  I can't find anything to indicate that either a deal happened or a second trial happened.

I'm glad that animal cruelty was added to the charges.  What he did was horrific.  What he did to Julie was also horrific, but domesticated animals (like children) are at the complete mercy of others.  We don't know, but Julie, as an adult, might have tried to reason with Keith or fight, but was unsuccessful.  Animals wouldn't know enough to be afraid of their trusted owner.  That is evil.

[walnutqueen]

Dateline made it sound like he accepted a plea deal after being caught trying to have the investigating officer offed.  The terms of his plea deal probably had him confess to the crime upon sentencing.

 

Anyone who would allow his animals to burn alive?  Deserves full punishment (and much, much worse).  At least he killed the wife before setting the fire.

[teebax]

OMG. No one is saying it's not murder. Good grief.

I don't know how anyone could think she wasn't abused, but unfortunately people who are often aren't believed. She seemed like a classic case to me, minus her killing him in the end. Most of us suffer in silence or finally get up the courage to leave.

Edited April 9, 2016 by teebax

[Ohmo]

Dateline made it sound like he accepted a plea deal after being caught trying to have the investigating officer offed.  The terms of his plea deal prob

 

That made a lot more sense upon the second viewing. Somehow I totally missed that.  Must have been distracted and wasn't paying attention.

[Calamity Jane]

Dateline skipped over the fact that there was a mistrial last year.

 

Juror Describes Discussion That Prompted Mistrial

 

Now I will have to re-watch because I'm now confused.  Did he accept a deal or are they waiting to try him again?  I can't find anything to indicate that either a deal happened or a second trial happened.

I'm glad that animal cruelty was added to the charges.  What he did was horrific.  What he did to Julie was also horrific, but domesticated animals (like children) are at the complete mercy of others.  We don't know, but Julie, as an adult, might have tried to reason with Keith or fight, but was unsuccessful.  Animals wouldn't know enough to be afraid of their trusted owner.  That is evil.

So agree about killing the pets.  I had to sever a friendship with a colleague when her then-boyfriend (later husband) got drunk and angry at his daughter and fixed things by shooting all her pet rabbits and dogs.  Friend forgave him, but I never could.  

[walnutqueen]

So agree about killing the pets.  I had to sever a friendship with a colleague when her then-boyfriend (later husband) got drunk and angry at his daughter and fixed things by shooting all her pet rabbits and dogs.  Friend forgave him, but I never could.  

 

I'm with you, Calamity Jane - I could never excuse such heinous behavior. 

[emoxie]

I had an inking the husband was the culprit when they mentioned him having weight loss surgery and improving his appearance. Why the new and improved spouse thinks killing the other is a better plan than divorce I will never understand.

Agree with everyone else on the religious hypocrisy.

[saber5055]

I don't know how anyone could think she wasn't abused, but unfortunately people who are often aren't believed.

 

Especially since people who are suffering from spousal abuse often hide it to present "the perfect couple in love" face to the public. Because if they tell anyone, that person will say: JUST LEAVE. So often there is nowhere to turn, no one who will believe you -- not even people in an online chat room. Those who flippantly say JUST LEAVE haven't walked the walk, yet it's so easy for them to talk the talk. There but for the grace of god ...

[Jpxfactor]

For the love of God..it wasn't self defence ..she is where she belongs..u don't know my life and what I've been through.

[walnutqueen]

Believing she was abused and believing she's a murderess are not incompatible.  Trying to suggest that people who think she's guilty just don't understand an abused woman's perspective or options is dismissive and an assumption that has little basis in reality.  Many of us have real and personal experience with this sort of thing.

 

I've been in situations where leaving was just not an option.  When my life was in danger, it took enormous time, effort, fortitude and guile to extricate myself at great personal cost, but no one lost their life.  It isn't easy, but unless you are very, very good at setting up an iron-clad self defense scenario, you'd better start looking at other options.  Thank goodness there are more resources available these days than when my Mum or I were going through it.

[saber5055]

Nearly every "born again" person I know has been "born again" with birth defects. Just because one has some religious beliefs doesn't make that person any better (or worse) that someone with opposing beliefs. A bigot is a bigot, a liar a liar, a killer a killer, regardless of how many Bible quotes they can recite.

 

I actually liked that the husband couldn't come up with any reason for killing his wife. That way I didn't have to listen to any of his BS. I always get a kick out of interviewers asking the arrested person, "Did you kill your wife/husband?" Of course they aren't going to confess on camera or anywhere else. Those questions are so stupid. So for this guy to say, "Yeah, I did it," is refreshing to me. I don't need to know why. The fact he wanted to so did is enough for me.

 

Gotta love all those CC that are everywhere now. Makes it so much harder for bad guys to come up with alibis. i was wondering if the police went to those bars/strip clubs where the killer said he was when he was really murdering his wife. Dateline always leaves out things I'd like to know.

[Ina123]

Ohmo

Found this on a Bing search. It was an update box inside a story dated April 8, 2016. The story was about the Dateline episode which was to be shown. He pled guilty and got 30 years.

http://www.inquisitr.com/2974222/julie-griffith-keith-griffith-dateline-nbc-airs-kentucky-murder-case-of-wife-found-dead-in-burning-blaze/

Scroll down to the inserted update.

[patty1h]

Another one with a man offing his wife.  Ralph Candelario just couldn't stop giving out information - he felt compelled to write a multi page letter to his local newspaper, detailing the facts of the murder.  Big mistake.  He kept changing the story, to the point that detectives and even his daughter-in-law

started to question things.  The weirdest thing he said is that he was sexually assaulted during the home invasion/murder.  What was that about? I was waiting for it to be revealed that he was hiding a gay past and had a secret boyfriend.  I also wondered how he beat himself up so severely.

 

This guy was trouble - he had a mistress; he had a first wife that just disappeared.  I felt bad for his son - since it happened when he was young, he never got full facts on his mothers fate.  Poor kid started going into caves in the area hoping to find his moms body.   

Edited April 16, 2016 by patty1h

[walnutqueen]

Death before divorce for yet another "devout" spouse.

[Ohmo]

It was actually her daughter, not his.  I felt badly for the two kids.  They were on the verge of getting married and then...bam.  Their parents got married to each other.  That had to be part of some perverse plan on his part.

 

It may seem strange, but I got the distinct sense that the two kids still love each other, but as he sad, their situation was always in the back of their minds.  I even felt sorry for the woman's ex-husband.  He came across as a decent guy.

 

We use the term a lot, but Ralph really is a monster.  He killed two women (I think it's Captain Obvious that he murdered his first wife), and he inflicted fatal psychological damage on two marriages.

 

I think Dateline needs to consider a title change: Why the Husband/Wife/Partner/Significant Other Did It

[ari333]

This was billed as "High Desert Mystery " on the DVR., but was actually "Tangled."  Weird.

 

It seems to me that people who are truly moral and decent, good folks, don't need to advertise their "holiness." (Imo) 

 

I wonder if homeschooling stunts a kid's social development somehow. Not really knocking it and it works for some kids; just wondering.