Fandom and Viewer Issues: "Fan" Is Short for "Fanatic"

[OnceUponAJen]

What message board is that from? Is there a place these crazies hang out that I don't know about?

I was wondering the same thing. I want to laugh about this, I mean it's soooo stupid. But it's hard to considering what an impact something like this could have on your life and livelihood.

[Souris]

However, I have to say I agree with the people saying it would have been better for Lana to simply post "I've heard of these allegations and they're not true" without reposting a screencap where all the details are spelled out. 

 

That was a TERRIBLE move on her part to post that screencap. Tons of her followers would have had no idea what the rumor was about. She has hundreds of thousands of followers, and now they know all the details. Bad, bad, bad.

 

These people need social media training.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Souris

[mjgchick]

Lana was so extra about denying the rumors when all she had to say was "That's not true." lol

[Rumsy4]

That was a TERRIBLE move on her part to post that screencap. Tons of her followers would have had no idea what the rumor was about. She has hundreds of thousands of followers, and now they know all the details. 

 

Said followers include actors and other people from the TV/movie industry + journalists. Jeez. These people definitely need PR and Social Media training. 

[Curio]

Honestly, I'm just glad Lana spoke up. Technically, she didn't even have to. I don't think we should be too harsh on her for how she went about supporting her friend.

[Serena]

I'm not saying she wasn't trying to do the right thing, she was. But like Rumsy and Souris said, posting the screencap made sure that lots of people who didn't KNOW all the gory details are now aware. Which is why when Adam spoke up, it was like "No nasty rumors about Sean were true, he's a great dude!" and not "Sean totes didn't sexually assault anyone!"

Like, I've actually seen some of the people spreading the rumor feeling vindicated by the way Lana did it. "Sure, she denied it [because her evil bosses made her], but see how she did it by posting all the details for her followers? Wink wink."

Again, I believe she meant well, but when things are this serious, she should have consulted a professional about how to go about it.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Serena

[sharky]

I think this is definitely just me, but I feel like Lana seems to always find a way to make it about her. Why deny it when you can deny it and post a screen cap of someone attacking her? I don't know. JMo talks about her relationships with Ginny and Colin. Josh, Colon and Sean always talk about getting along -- especially the last two. Lana just seems to be in her own Lana world sometimes. (And yes I know I'm speculating and being gossipy. So be it.)

[Curio]

I see this as a no-win situation. If Lana is too vague in her tweet, then she risks the scenario where her fans don't even know which rumor she's talking about, and then Natalie Abrams doesn't realize what she's referencing and incorrectly quotes her in an EW article. That also allows Lana's bad apple fans room to wiggle out of trouble because they could convince themselves that Lana was just talking about Robin's death rumor or something vague like that. But by being too specific, she also risks exposing the rumor to people who didn't know about it, but at least her fans know exactly what she's shutting down. And if she said nothing at all, then her silence could have been interpreted as supporting the rumor.

 

I'm just upset that the fandom is getting away with this without any repercussions. Certain people need to be directly called out, and that's not going to happen unfortunately.

[Shanna Marie]

On the other hand, doing it this way allowed her to directly address a specific accusation, whereas if she'd just said "rumors aren't true," then there could have been some question as to which rumors. Basically, this is a no-win situation for her, but while this did further show the accusations, she was able to shut down a specific accusation (that also made her look bad) in context instead of being vague about it, which might have looked like a wimpy response.

[tri4335]

I think she had to speak up and include the screen-cap to be clear on what she was denying. That screen-cap states that Lana was the first person told about the "sexual harassment" and encouraged the victim to report it. I don't know how "stars" are considered on an employee org chart but in most organizations if you are in "management" you are mandated by policy to report it to your HR if someone informs you that you are harassed (I could see the Department of Labor considering a star to have a management position in relation to other staff).  Furthermore, it then goes on to say that Lana was instrumental in getting Sean "fired".  This rumor was stating that Lana was aware of the problem and then took action. This is not just her being on the sidelines hearing a rumor secondhand.

 

Granted not everyone of her followers were aware of what was going on but I think she wanted to be clear that she had no knowledge of any wrongdoing nor did she get a co-worker fired.  Already in Adam's feed, people are accusing him of a cover up.  If Lana said no this didn't happen and wasn't clear on what she was referring to then it just adds weight to the cover up story. This makes it very clear that she is stating that none of what this person posted is true.  I believe Lana is supporting Sean but she is also making sure people are not attributing actions to her that are not true.

 

This is not just a rumor but an accusation that is taken (or should be taken) very seriously by an organization.  It is also a publicity nightmare for all those involved.  It harms Sean, the make up artist, Lana, A & E and ABC.  And as the old saying goes, where there is smoke there is fire.  They're will be fall out for Sean as some people will always believe that there is some truth to this accusation. There will be fall out for Lana that some co-workers and future co-workers may judge her by the actions of her fans or think she was invloved somehow.  People may think the makeup artist made up the story and is backtracking.  A & E may have people think cover up for inappropriate behavior and don't provide a safe work environment.

Edited March 17, 2016 by tri4335

[Camera One]

This is libel plain and simple. The person who made it up should face consequences for spreading lies.

[InsertWordHere]

I am more bothered by the "sorry." Sorry to whom? The twitter followers who have to read this drama? The people who thought LP was going to back up their story? Sean Maguire? I hope it's the latter but it almost reads as if she's apologizing to the people who were trying to get her coworker fired.

[Rumsy4]

This is libel plain and simple. The person who made it up should face consequences for spreading lies.

 

I agree. But one would have to trace the IP addresses of the person who posted this in the forum, and it might be really hard to convince the forum owner to agree, or get the cops involved. 

 

At the very least, Adam and other people involved in the Show need to stop trying to placate rabid shippers. It's not one single incident that led up to this. This has been building on for years and years. Sean has been cyber-bullied for ages (even William Shatner spoke up for him one or two times). This act is escalation. Aside from the repercussions on Sean and Lana's careers, it might make actors wary of joining the cast in the future

at least in certain roles

.

Edited March 17, 2016 by Rumsy4

[CheshireCat]

tri4335, on 17 Mar 2016 - 3:17 PM, said:

This is not just a rumor but an accusation that is taken (or should be taken) very seriously by an organization.  It is also a publicity nightmare for all those involved.  It harms Sean, the make up artist, Lana, A & E and ABC.  And as the old saying goes, where there is smoke there is fire. 

 

I think that is the biggest problem,

especially if Maguire really is off the show.

Which is also why I'm not sure if what they are doing is enough. LP seemed a bit confused in her tweet, as in wondering if this was really serious. The point, the actual accusation seems a lot more elaborate than the denials and this sounds like something they'd need to at least explore legal actions in and also something that maybe needs an official ABC press release/statement. For both actors' sake.

And another thing which is appalling - not only does this have repercussions for both actors, but false accusations make it so much harder for real victims to be taken seriously. Especially if it's someone with influence who is accused.

I just can't stop shaking my head. It's insane to fabricate such a story!

[sharky]

The person who posted on the forum isn't the person they should go after. This all seemed to start with that Crazy Night gossip site. Then add to that that it would be very hard to prove libel -- Sean would essentially have to prove that someone turned him down for a role specifically because of the rumor and only then could the records of that gossip site be subpoenaed to see where the blind item originated from. It would be a tough slough.

 

And of course you have all these SQers and Evil Regals or whatever coming all out of the woodwork saying, "Why does everyone blame us?" Gee, I wonder why. Take that lame rumor and then trace it back to a bunch of SQ fans tweeting Adam about it and there you go.

[tri4335]

I think that is the biggest problem,

especially if Maguire really is off the show.

Which is also why I'm not sure if what they are doing is enough. LP seemed a bit confused in her tweet, as in wondering if this was really serious. The point, the actual accusation seems a lot more elaborate than the denials and this sounds like something they'd need to at least explore legal actions in and also something that maybe needs an official ABC press release/statement. For both actors' sake.

And another thing which is appalling - not only does this have repercussions for both actors, but false accusations make it so much harder for real victims to be taken seriously. Especially if it's someone with influence who is accused.

I just can't stop shaking my head. It's insane to fabricate such a story!

 

I agree!  I think they've been trying to downplay it but that is the wrong approach. I think they need to release a press statement and get off of Twitter about it. And in that statement they should be clear that while they believe that this was a "false" rumor started by the internet, they take sexual harassment seriously and support their employees and provide a safe working environment.

[Souris]

The person who posted on the forum isn't the person they should go after. This all seemed to start with that Crazy Night gossip site. 

 

It was going around for days before the post on the Crazy Days & Nights gossip site. That just gave it a higher visibility. Then Adam gave it even higher visibility by commenting so much about it -- and in doing so, directly linked Sean's name to that blind item. Then Lana gave it even HIGHER visibility by posting that cap. This is like Class 101 in what NOT to do in social media scandal management.

[CheshireCat]

Souris, on 17 Mar 2016 - 4:22 PM, said:Souris, on 17 Mar 2016 - 4:22 PM, said:

It was going around for days before the post on the Crazy Days & Nights gossip site. That just gave it a higher visibility. Then Adam gave it even higher visibility by commenting so much about it -- and in doing so, directly linked Sean's name to that blind item. Then Lana gave it even HIGHER visibility by posting that cap. This is like Class 101 in what NOT to do in social media scandal management.

 

That is why I thought networks had PR department... But I guess it also shows that they really don't take this seriously (not sexual harrassment itself but the accusations). They seem to think it'll be done with a few tweets.

Edited March 17, 2016 by CheshireCat

[mjgchick]

Wait, someone implicated that Lana knew about the sexual harassment and she told the alleged victim to come forward? Well now it makes sense why she did the screen cap.

[sharky]

It's the Streisand Effect and the more people talk about it with more tweets or a press release or whatever, the worse it will get. Frankly, what's done is done and now everyone associated with the show needs to STFU.

[Faemonic]

That was a TERRIBLE move on her part to post that screencap. Tons of her followers would have had no idea what the rumor was about. She has hundreds of thousands of followers, and now they know all the details. Bad, bad, bad.

 

These people need social media training.

I respectfully disagree, I believe the screencap was necessary because this was Lana herself putting a spotlight on someone's authoritative-sounding, extensive, and completely untrue statement about what Lana herself had witnessed and enacted. That shouldn't have been okay even if someone were claiming something so innocent as Lana being vegan because she declined a canape that never existed, at some swanky convention that never happened, that the claimant never offered, that Lana never declined.

 

People wouldn't have the time to shoot down all the rumors on par with Lana being vegan, but I believe if people are going to use their free speech to make any untrue claims, then everyone at every level (except the government, which makes the definition of free speech) should use their free speech to call out something that claims to be fact--not opinion, but fact--that is not a fact. Because what's true is the absolute baseline for what's right!

 

And this isn't a matter of non-vegan canapes, this is about an alleged crime or civil suit. Lana isn't a bureaucrat, lawyer, or even a reporter. She was perfectly positioned to shut this down to the Underworld, and in my opinion she stepped up and handled it pretty much perfectly.

[Serena]

But the problem is, by shutting it down, she repeated the rumor. Now all the people who weren't even aware there was such a rumor, know about it. Lana's job isn't to think about these PR repercussions, and I don't blame her that she didn't - she probably saw a friend being attacked and reacted. 

However, if she had instead posted a selfie with Sean, and wrote "Sean is a great guy, a true friend, and a real gentleman. Anyone who says otherwise is maliciously lying.", that would have sent a clear message to people who were aware of the rumor, without letting the others in on the gossip. It's the Streisand effect, exactly like sharky said.

[Selina K]

I am torn.  I agree that she repeated the rumor and put it out there for people who didn't know it.  However, the rumor specifically cited her and attributed actions to her and I am sure from her perspective it's as much saying "I did not do this" as it is "Sean is a great guy."  There is a certain aspect of the fandom that has more or less deified Lana, and they ascribe motivation and support for their cause to Lana that simply in reality doesn't exist.  One would think after the "sisters" comment earlier this year, and then this flat out 'this isn't true' that this part of the fandom would get a clue and relax.  I don't think or know if she realized how deeply committed to their vision this subset of the fandom is and now she is trying to reign it in a bit, but it may be too little too late.  Could she have been more elegant and said something more veiled? Sure, but even in 2016, people react and don't run through scenarios analysis before they post something.  If she saw that and was unaware and legitimately horrified by it, I can absolutely see the quick reply all of - sorry crazy people, but this is bullshit.

[Faemonic]

But the problem is, by shutting it down, she repeated the rumor

(...)

if she had instead posted a selfie with Sean, and wrote "Sean is a great guy, a true friend, and a real gentleman. Anyone who says otherwise is maliciously lying.", that would have sent a clear message to people who were aware of the rumor, without letting the others in on the gossip.

The rumors would have repeated anyway, but if even one repeat shuts it down, then it's worth repeating if the shutdown becomes part of what repeats. If someone who hadn't been let in on the gossip caught wind of it later, they might think, "Oh, but I thought I remembered Lana's selfie with Sean saying anyone who says Sean isn't a gentleman is lying? That must have been before this incident that I am now hearing about." Instead, maybe people in and out of the loop now see that even pompously authoritative-sounding rumormongers can be dead wrong, or at least challenged, and be willing to double-think or challenge what they read from others--no matter how much some random internet person or gossip columnist seems to know what they're saying.

 

Not all bullying stops when people ignore it. Sometimes, willful ignorance is precisely what gives rumors the strength to lay waste to someone's reputation--even someone who should have been too good for that, because even bystanders who knew the truth were too good to fight for that truth. Sometimes, there's a call to address the most preposterous rumors.

 

We'll just agree to disagree whether this was one of those times.

 

(The convention incident rumor passed on by Dothraki citation, though--that can vanish in a CGI cloud of satire.)

[mjgchick]

Nah after seeing that they put Lana's name in the rumor I don't blame her one bit for how she reacted. That's just not cool for Sean, his family, Lana and the alleged victim. These people need to get their heads checked. I love how every one of them who commented on the situation cries innocent on their fandom even after Lana used receipts to defend herself and Sean.

They love to say the other fandom should try to police the BAs but time and time again its mostly their BAs who start stuff. After falsely accusing the CS fandom in deleting someone's tumblr and it turns out it was one of their guys I'm no longer surprised by anything they do.

[sharky]

They love to say the other fandom should try to police the BAs but time and time again its mostly their BAs who start stuff. After falsely accusing the CS fandom in deleting someone's tumblr and it turns out it was one of their guys I'm no longer surprised by anything they do.

That's the one I always go back to. But there have been plenty since then. Fans saying that JMo specifically called them out for being BAs when no one has any proof is another one that bugged me. Like I said, someday I may have time to dig through this thread and make a timeline of all the crap the SQ BAs have pulled.

[Faemonic]

Next time something like that happens let's all just say, "It's just Ethan hacking herself again!"

 

Fans saying that JMo specifically called them out for being BAs when no one has any proof is another one that bugged me.

Like I said, Dothraki Citation. [ 1 ] It is known. [ 2 ]

 

[ 2 ] It is known.

 

...wish I knew how to do subscript and superscript here.

 

Like I said, someday I may have time to dig through this thread and make a timeline of all the crap the SQ BAs have pulled.

 

This thread is basically a compilation of Evil Regal receipts. Can't the Snowing shippers troll a little louder once in a while, or ever? Variety is the spouse of life.

[Curio]

This thread is basically a compilation of Evil Regal receipts.

 

You mean like this? 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35. (Those are just some of the bad apple responses to Adam's tweets about the rumor incident. I'm sure there might be more.)

[Rumsy4]

I'm... speechless.

[Delphi]

They handle this shit show so much better than I would. I would be putting these people on blast until ABC stepped in and told me to stop.

[sharky]

What. The. Underworld. Is that? Just wow. I hate those people that get on their high horse like that. I wonder if the tone has changed since Lana said something. Because all that was ridiculous. +1 to Curio for being brave enough to sort through that nonsense. I have a SQ tumblr or two that I lurk on for a bit before I can't take it anymore.

 

Of course, this then makes me wonder why they put so much effort into Twitter instead of other places. I feel like message boards and even tumblr can lead to better discourse and community than Twitter. By a long shot.

[Curio]

Of course, this then makes me wonder why they put so much effort into Twitter instead of other places. I feel like message boards and even tumblr can lead to better discourse and community than Twitter. By a long shot.

 

That's the thing, they don't want intelligent discourse and community. They just want to spread hate and complain about men trying to mansplain things to them.

[sharky]

But then why don't people like Adam and Eddy pay less attention to Twitter and maybe put more attention on places like this or tumblr where they could reblog fan art and support the fan community in a better way? I get that they like interacting with the fans, but I would rather read the reaction to fans here -- good or bad -- after an episode than go to Twitter. (hmm...now I'm wondering if Adam and Eddy ever do come here, but I doubt it. Their reactions to fans about things make me think they are more plugged in to a place like Twitter than a place like this.)

[Souris]

I'm guessing they stick to Twitter because Adam doesn't want/have time to get into anything deeper than the level of what 140 characters will allow.

[Curio]

But then why don't people like Adam and Eddy pay less attention to Twitter and maybe put more attention on places like this or tumblr where they could reblog fan art and support the fan community in a better way?

 

Honestly, I think they're probably a little social media illiterate and don't have much time. I doubt they'd even know how to work a Tumblr or ever heard of this site. At least Eddy avoids Twitter altogether. I'd rather have that than what Adam does. 

 

I wish they could be like Alex Hirsch from Gravity Falls where he'd interact with fans on Tumblr and Twitter and he'd actually post some really interesting behind-the-scenes stuff about the writing and art process.

[maryle]

I have to rant about the infamous rumor!

The hypocrisy of some B.A  are a sky level now.

Now they play the victim card again and qgain but I am sorry to tell those fragile souls that every little bit of the rumor about Sean I heard was coming from one corner of the fandom only.

 At first the narrative I saw from them was that they already heard of some rumor about misbehavior at  convention from two once men and so people should take the victim seriously blah blah... when Adam denied the  rumor and said that the and said that the only victim was Sean I saw a  lot of them went mute or begin to say how hurt they are that people blame them for the rumor to begin with.

But I saw no one of them said; Sorry Sean maybe we judge to fast about something we were not as Well  inform we thought to be.

Instead they felt sorry themselves!

That's why I do believe they had to address the rumor because some B.A wanted the rumor staying at the fringe to play with it and whisper about it in  obscur corner of the internet until it become more and more and about more men too.

 Now They can't do it so easily and freely without be judge.

[Writing Wrongs]

Does anyone know why Adam is always tweeting "Badgers covered" and what it means?

[Curio]

Does anyone know why Adam is always tweeting "Badgers covered" and what it means?

 

Wisconsin Badgers. Right now, he's talking about March Madness basketball. If he tweets it in the fall/winter, he's talking about college football.

 

Adam & Eddy both went to UW Madison for their undergrad. 

[Writing Wrongs]

Ahhh, thanks.

[Souris]

Does anyone know why Adam is always tweeting "Badgers covered" and what it means?

 

It's referring to sports betting. If a team "covers the spread" then the people who bet on them get paid. He seems to be using it just in a win/loss way, though.

[sharky]

OK, should we start taking bets on which fans will get all bent out of shape by this in light of the recent rumors?

[Mari]

In 5 . . .4. . .3. . .2. . .

 

Which is incredibly sad--because as worthwhile charities go, shelters for victims of abuse are up there on the "good" list.

[YaddaYadda]

If anyone finds something negative to say about this, then there's really nothing left to say.

 

These are two guys giving back to the community that has been nothing but welcoming. It shows how integrated they are, and good for them for wanting to make a difference.

[Curio]

If anyone finds something negative to say about this, then there's really nothing left to say.

 

Right? I'd like to think there's one thing that the entire fandom can agree to not shit on. I hope this is it.

 

I also thought this tweet by Shatner was interesting.

Edited March 19, 2016 by Curio

[Serena]

I'm pretty sure someone is looking up an email address/Twitter account for the shelter right now to tell them not to accept donations from a rapist. Wait for it...

[mjgchick]

Remember when Sean did the NOHate photo and they had something awful to say about that? I'm sure they will be bored enough to do the same here.

[Curio]

Born a Wisconsinite, I feel like I know a lot about beers... but can someone please tell me what the hell a Bohemian Pilsner is? Is it closer to a Blonde Ale, a Pale Ale, a Farmhouse Ale? I now need to plan a trip to Canada to try this thing out.

Edited March 20, 2016 by Curio

[orza]

It is a somewhat bitter, malty Pilsener with a nice head typical of Czech beer brewed in and around Pilsen. It has nothing to do with the tasteless, watery stuff brewed in the US.

Edited March 20, 2016 by orza

[Curio]

It is a somewhat bitter, malty Pilsener with a nice head typical of Czech beer brewed in and around Pilsen. It has nothing to do with the tasteless, watery stuff brewed in the US.

 

The beer sounds lovely, I wonder why Colin and Sean chose to brew this particular style. You should also expand your palette and try some Wisconsin craft beers sometime...you might be pleasantly surprised.

[OnceUponAJen]

I hope I can get my hands on some of this. I'm afraid I don't know the laws about selling alcohol across borders. I'll at least buy a T-shirt, though!