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Fandom and Viewer Issues: "Fan" Is Short for "Fanatic"


Emma
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Found the link in my history, so here's the article.
 
Something that's not in the article but gets mentioned in the comments is that one of the authors in question came out of the Harry Potter fandom and was the kind of person who had entire threads in fandomwank about her before she even sold a novel, so I suspect some of the drama came with her out of that. Her books were also apparently "repurposed" Harry Potter fanfic -- new stories with a different twist on the characters, then names, settings, etc., changed to make it "original" vs. an AU rewrite of the same story, a la 50 Shades/Twilight -- and I think some of the fandom was imported from Harry Potter, so it's not so much her characters the fans freak out about as it is the HP characters they're based on. That's going to amplify the crazy. From what I understand, her main hero was Draco in the fanfic version, so she got the legions of Draco fans, which sound a lot like Evil Regals.

 

But the whole thing does remind me of some of the hate some of the actors on Once get, even when they're part of the pairing certain fans are into. I may be critical of a lot of writing on the show, but I can't imagine going into personal attack mode, especially in person. I think if I met A&E, I might ask them leading questions to get into their mindset about why they've made some of the choices they've made, but I don't think I'd launch into the "you suck!" approach because it's not going to accomplish anything.

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(edited)

But the whole thing does remind me of some of the hate some of the actors on Once get, even when they're part of the pairing certain fans are into. I may be critical of a lot of writing on the show, but I can't imagine going into personal attack mode, especially in person. I think if I met A&E, I might ask them leading questions to get into their mindset about why they've made some of the choices they've made, but I don't think I'd launch into the "you suck!" approach because it's not going to accomplish anything.

I just can't get that worked up over a TV show. If something made me that miserable/hostile, I'd have to walk away. I have given up on at least one show that disappointed me. I'd just go into "call me if they ever fix this" mode.

Edited by OnceUponAJen
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From the Media thread:

 

How's this for an awful, crazy fan encounter? Colin told a fan in Paris that a fan once broke the window of the car he was in to touch him! How scary and insane is THAT?

 

 

Holy hell.  What in the name of all that's holy is wrong with some people?   These actors are saints for putting up with crap like that, especially scary, whacked-out crap like that!

Edited by legaleagle53
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That is super scary! But it takes a lot to break a window in a car, so they would have had to use something to smash it with, and then glass would have flown everywhere. It sounds a bit absurd, but if it's true... *shakes head*

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Wanted to bring this over here instead of the Media thread as responses from this weekend's con. Overall, it sounds like everyone got along, which is good and happily surprising considering the drama before that. But a theory someone mentioned in the media thread was that Swan Queen fans see Emma as just Regina's plus-one -- in other words, they are fans of Lana and Swan Queen and JMo is just the tag along to make it work. To support that, here's a tumblr post with a fan's tweets from the convention about meeting JMo. Essentially, she's saying that JMo "slammed" her at the meet and greet. She asked about Emma sacrificing herself for Regina and Jennifer responded with "Let me stop you right there" and then apparently proceeded to explain that Emma sacrificed herself for the whole town. The last tweet in the thread said, "And even the official ouat account said it was a sacrifice for Regina. I don't know what her problem is. :(" I can't even get into all the wrong things about this. First, I think Jennifer knows her character better than a random fan at a con. Second, I think Jennifer knows her character better than the intern at ABC who is running the social media feeds this summer, which is where this "the official account" nonsense came from. And third, you don't know what her problem is? She cancelled her photos with Colin because SQers harassed the event organizers. She gets harassed on Twitter anytime she mentions Captain Swan or Emma and Hook. SQ fans went after her for referring to Emma and Regina as "Savior Queen" instead of "Swan Queen." Oh, and now SQers apparently have a new term called SwanTown, which is apparently everyone else's wrong interpretation of that scene -- including Jennifer's -- when all the SQ fans know Emma really was only sacrificing herself for Regina. After ALL of that, you wonder why JMo would bristle as you asking that question? Really?

Edited by sharky
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What I love about this situation is how the official account is taken as the gospel truth when it's something they like but the second there's something they don't, the official account is "disgusting" and "gross." The official account is run by an intern or group of interns who probably also run a few of the other official accounts for other shows. It's an advertizing tool, plain and simple.

 

Emma did not sacrifice herself solely for Regina. Regina was part of it, but Emma's sacrifice is so much bigger than any one person. (Hell, it's even bigger than the town, since the Apprentice said that the darkness was previously going to "consume the realms," which suggests its destruction wasn't going to be localized to any one spot.) Suggesting otherwise cheapens it and I'm glad Jen addressed it.

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Exactly! And I think the bigger problem I have with this Swan Town nonsense is that they've essentially turned JMo's legitimate answer into some meme for all of them to laugh at. It blatantly diminishes Jennifer's answer to nothing more than an inside joke among them. And again, they'll wonder why Jennifer happily talks about Emma's relationship with Hook being true love while ignoring the overzealous Swan Queen fans.

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To be honest, no one can blame people interpreting the scene as Emma sacrificing herself for Regina. I is the culmination of the Regina/Emma friendship arc of S4. Emma saved everyone with her sacrifice, but clearly, the writers wanted to highlight the part where Emma is concerned for Regina's HE. It wasn't meant as a ship moment by A&E, but they do think thar highly of Regina, lbr.

So, for fans to disagree with JMo's interpretation is fine, IMO. However, what is not fine is the nasty slamming of JMo in the process. I don't always agrer with Lana's interpretation of Regina's actions, for example, but I'm not going to slam/mock her for it on twitter. That shows their pettiness.

Edited by Rumsy4
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I think the most hilarious thing about the "Emma sacrifices herself for Regina / no, it was the town! / no, it was Regina!" debate is when SQers went "fine, if her sacrifice was for the whole town, then the 'I love you' was for the whole town too! She loves everyone, not just Hook!". 

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I think the most hilarious thing about the "Emma sacrifices herself for Regina / no, it was the town! / no, it was Regina!" debate is when SQers went "fine, if her sacrifice was for the whole town, then the 'I love you' was for the whole town too! She loves everyone, not just Hook!".

Oh my. Yes, let's just pretend that whole, "I watched the man I love die and I never told him that I loved him, not once" moment never happened, shall we?

Edited by OnceUponAJen
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I think the most hilarious thing about the "Emma sacrifices herself for Regina / no, it was the town! / no, it was Regina!" debate is when SQers went "fine, if her sacrifice was for the whole town, then the 'I love you' was for the whole town too! She loves everyone, not just Hook!". 

And that seems to be what this Swan Town trend is about. "It's all for the town! The sacrifice, the dagger, the LUUUUUVVVVVV! Ha ha, snerk snerk, wink wink, we're so funny." Seriously? Yea, the scene wasn't written well. It can easily be spun by Regina stans. But SQ fans seem to focus on the Regina thing and not EVERYTHING ELSE! I'm all for shipping your ship and I don't mind Swan Queen fans in general. It's just not my catnip. But to dismiss all the characters and the writers who write them and the cast who play them and focus just on Regina and Lana is ridiculous. A few weeks ago, Jennifer posted pictures of herself in the rare books room at the New York Public Library doing research on Dark Emma. I think she has a better idea of who her character is and what her character's motivations are than some fan who's swan feathers got ruffled the wrong way.

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I don't have a problem with the SQ shippers seeing Emma's sacrifice as being only for Regina. In fact, I think A&E made the scene ambiguous enough so everyone could see there whatever they wanted. But to dismiss the interpretation of the actress playing the scene because it doesn't fit yours is so rude and ridiculous.

Edited by RadioGirl27
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I think the most hilarious thing about the "Emma sacrifices herself for Regina / no, it was the town! / no, it was Regina!" debate is when SQers went "fine, if her sacrifice was for the whole town, then the 'I love you' was for the whole town too! She loves everyone, not just Hook!". 

That gave me a nice chuckle I have to admit. The lengths people will go to get the last word in kills me every time.

 

Once AU Regina sacrificed her life for a strange boy we didn't see Emma even take a look at the woman so I don't even know how they came to that conclusion. It's still hilarious though and maybe that's why A&E wrote the scene that way. I'm convinced they are just trolling at this point.

Edited by mjgchick
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That is super scary! But it takes a lot to break a window in a car, so they would have had to use something to smash it with, and then glass would have flown everywhere. It sounds a bit absurd, but if it's true... *shakes head*

 

Maybe it was a bit of hyperbole & the fan just cracked the glass or something.

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I don't have a problem with the SQ shippers seeing Emma's sacrifice as being only for Regina. In fact, I think A&E made the scene ambiguous enough so everyone could see there whatever they wanted. But to dismiss the interpretation of the actress playing the scene because it doesn't fit yours is so rude and ridiculous.

 

As long as they aren't directly tweeting at Jen about it, I don't really have a problem with it. Think whatever you like. I do hope that Jen having to make repeated assertions about it being a sacrifice for everyone does make it to the writers so that they actually make it very clear in dialogue that that's what Emma was doing. A lot of fans were very confused about that scene because they just couldn't help themselves from somehow making it all about Regina in that moment. One little tweak to the dialogue like adding "or it will destroy everyone in all the realms" to Emma's comment that they need to do what the Apprentice said and it would have been clear. You could still keep in all the Regina stuff as long as it was clear that it wasn't going to stop with her. 

 

I have to compliment the fandom on being so nice this weekend considering the nastiness that went before it. Evil Regals were pleased with Lana and her friendliness, Captain Swan fans got lots of love and everyone seemed to enjoy themselves. Isn't it nice when everyone stops whining about whatever and is just happy with talking & meeting their favorites?

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SQ fans went after her for referring to Emma and Regina as "Savior Queen" instead of "Swan Queen." Oh, and now SQers apparently have a new term called SwanTown, which is apparently everyone else's wrong interpretation of that scene -- including Jennifer's -- when all the SQ fans know Emma really was only sacrificing herself for Regina.

Ah, I'll let them have it. If Emma is only Regina's plus one in the SQ sphere, then that's already too much attention to Emma alone than the bad apples would be willing to keep for long.

 

(Am I allowed to ship Savior Town?)

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My issue isn't so much the interpretation of canon as it is the lack of respect. People are obviously free to interpret what transpired onscreen however they want, but here you have the actress playing the character explaining what was going on in the character's head at the time and how big this sacrifice actually is, and she's getting mocked for it. And I bet you any sum of money that if Lana had been the one to say that Emma made the sacrifice for everyone, not just Regina, we wouldn't have this Savior Town nonsense at all.

 

They don't respect the character or the actress, and really, that's fine. But keep that shit to yourself. You (a group, general you, here) are not allowed to harass someone for months and years and then cry "I don't know what her problem is" when she tries to clarify a huge, important, and impactful moment in her character's story arc.

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This is my formal declaration that I will not post anything else about Swan Town on my tumblr. I answered some user who tried to insist the response was because of the ABC post and not JMo's answer. So I answered her with all the responses saying it was about JMo. And now I'm just going to mic drop and walk away. Because really, don't bash her and then try and say you aren't bashing her.

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I have to side-eye that the twitter user said JMO 'slammed' her. To me it sounds as if Jen was actually being considerate, not mean or difficult. She could've ignored the fan singling out Regina, but she respected that fan enough to be honest with her about what was going on on set and how she played the scene. I know fans are going to see what they want to see at the end of the day. But I can respect Jen for setting the record straight instead of remaining silent and tacitly encouraging expectations that she knows the show has no intention of satisfying. That takes integrity, especially considering she knows how some fans will react to her contradicting pro-SQ rhetoric.

Edited by october
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I'm curious to know if anyone asked Lana the question about Emma's sacrifice.  That thing would have obliterated Regina and everyone in the town (a town that includes Henry).  

 

I have to say that I'm happy with the way things went down.  This is really a cast of good people and if abusers and bullies don't realize that, then it's their loss, really.

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Well, first I want to thanks all the people who post video.. I really liked it

The curiosity got the best of me and looked the swan town stuff and I found it offensive toward Jen maybe if that was the only time they make fun of her or undermine what she said I will found it funny but when I consider the ongoing bullying she is getting every time. It become a pattern and the joke for me is not fun anymore.

I also saw SQ picture where she appear inconfortable and I just found the SQ bad apple just laughed at Sean too.

I will stay away from this part of the fandom now. It is not healthy!!

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Hi so I was at the con at the w/end and it was great - the Q&A sessions were really fun and you could see all the actors were having a good time and that they all really get on well together. I was in the M&G with Jen where she clarified again that Emma's sacrifice was for everyone and not just Regina - I thought Jen was being very firm about it but I didn't think she was being rude or disrespectful and after she finished what she had to say she asked the fan to finish her question. Jen also said she gets confused about why people think the sacrifice was just for Regina... All in all I think she handled the questions well

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I have to side-eye that the twitter user said JMO 'slammed' her. To me it sounds as if Jen was actually being considerate, not mean or difficult. She could've ignored the fan singling out Regina, but she respected that fan enough to be honest with her about what was going on on set and how she played the scene. I know fans are going to see what they want to see at the end of the day. But I can respect Jen for setting the record straight instead of remaining silent and tacitly encouraging expectations that she knows the show has no intention of satisfying. That takes integrity, especially considering she knows how some fans will react to her contradicting pro-SQ rhetoric.

Well, I remember some SQer last year swearing Lana had dissed her (at the same French con) because she had "looked at her wrong" (who knows what kind of shit they had been yelling at her?), so maybe some French SQers are especially prone to martryrdom.

Edited by Serena
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Jen also said she gets confused about why people think the sacrifice was just for Regina.

I personally agree with Jen about the interpretation of the scene, but this one I can't even blame on over-zealous fans. When the writers introduce a season-long plot where Emma seeks out Regina in the premiere and promises to give her a happy ending behind a closed door, seeks out her friendship after being yelled at for an entire episode, ditches her boyfriend (who nearly died) to go have shots with her, promises to help her with Operation Mongoose, brings her kale salad and root beer, freaks out when Regina goes missing for an hour, and brings up the fact that she promised to help her find her happy ending in the finale during the alternate universe... the SQ fans really don't have to reach that hard when they're interpreting that final scene.

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But the end shot was Emma talking to her parents and Hook because she knew they'd be able to get her out of the situation she's put herself in. Why did the last shot not be of her looking at Regina once like at all. The last person she looked at was Killian right? I still think it's a lot of reaching for them to think she did it for just Regina. I get that line she said about Regina's happy ending but did no one remember what the Apprentice said about the curse taking over the whole town? No one wants another Regina goes evil plot now do we? Maybe if I shipped it I'd be in agreement but even when I hardcore ship a couple I don't see myself reaching as hard as this fandom sometimes do.

 

I remember when the spoilers first came out and people were saying she did it for Regina. I rolled my eyes but then when I actually saw it on screen I actually felt like a fool for thinking that scene would be about Regina when it was really about how Emma went from not trusting anyone to trusting her parents and Hook to save her.

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Saw that. How the hell did that start? Is it just a rumor or is some SQ fan just twisting his words?

A person was making fun of him for submitting himself in the lead actor Emmy race. Someone showed his wife the tweet, and Sean responded to it. He denied he had anything to do with the Emmy submission thing because he was in the hospital and then called the person an #ass.

Edited by Stuffy
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Yeah, they especially hate Sean (and not, for example, Colin, even though I'm sure they aren't his biggest fans) because he responds and stands up to them all the time. And, to be fair, he also tells off OQ fans when they're being awful to the actress playing Marian. On one hand, I admire that he's not letting them get away with it; on the other hand, those aren't rational people, so responding to them is pretty useless and only fuels their victim complex.

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I had a few extra minutes so thought I'd take a look at this thread, as I'd never perused it. I gotta, I'm a little bumfuzzled at everything I've just learned (and not sure I needed to know). I bet you could put together a heck of a sociology class about this phenomenon. I think I'd have to go all Banksy if I was creating a popular genre work.

 

I bet Ginnifer Goodwin and Josh Dallas are grateful that Snow and Charming's relationship is a bit immune to Fandom Hysteria Disorder.

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(edited)

The responses to his tweet are utterly ridiculous. These people throw around social justice terms like "rape culture" "triggering" and "problematic" to justify their hate, but act as though they have no clue how to be decent human beings themselves.

 

Perhaps Sean should have not have responded to that person directly, as the original poster had not tagged Sean. Why stir up a hornet's nest? 

Edited by Rumsy4
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I bet Ginnifer Goodwin and Josh Dallas are grateful that Snow and Charming's relationship is a bit immune to Fandom Hysteria Disorder.

I guess you haven't seen the "Ugly" and "Fat" tweets Ginny use to get. I'm not sure she still gets them because she haven't been on twitter in a while but I also remember how the SQers went ham on her mentions just because she didn't agree with them as well.

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I guess you haven't seen the "Ugly" and "Fat" tweets Ginny use to get. I'm not sure she still gets them because she haven't been on twitter in a while but I also remember how the SQers went ham on her mentions just because she didn't agree with them as well.

 

I also seem to recall that she caught hell over the fact that David and Mary Margaret were having an affair despite the fact that David was married to Kathryn while everyone was still under the first curse.  It hit a nerve with Ginny because she and Josh had actually started dating before his divorce from his previous wife was final.

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I am now fully convinced these people don't have the slightest fucking clue how the world actually works.

 

The actors promote their canon material on their Twitter accounts. Because this is their job. This is their livelihood. This is what pays their bills. Even if any of the actors found their storyline to be problematic, they could not and would not say so on Twitter. You don't bite the hand that feeds you in a public forum like that. If you do, you risk not only your job but your entire career. Everyone has to toe the company line, actors included. If any of the actors had a serious issue with a storyline, I bet you dollars to doughnuts we would never hear about it because those are the kinds of things that get discussed in private and behind closed doors.

 

As for Sean being submitted for an Emmy, pretty much everyone who has a speaking role on a show gets submitted for an Emmy, usually by the actor's team. It's basically a marketing move for the actor. That's how the industry works.

 

Also, some of them really need lessons on separating fantasy and reality. Hate Robin Hood and Outlaw Queen all you want, but Sean Maguire is just a guy doing his job.

Edited by Dani-Ellie
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Ugh. Saw that as well. Lana is so problematic sometimes and it really does make you wonder what rules were set by the people in JMo's camp for the convention in terms of who she would take photos with or sit on a panel with. Her interactions with Lana are nothing like her interactions with anyone else in the cast, especially Colin. I mean, I know, canon vs. fanon, but Lana doesn't always seem to see it that way. It will be quite interesting to see how fans react to the con this weekend with her taking pictures and sitting on panels with Sean.

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This is such a FML moment that video.  Why in the world, knowing the shit storm that happened before the convention?  Wasn't waving at the fans enough?  She could have said "I love you, fans", she would have had the crowd cheering anyway.  

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Yikes, usually I wouldn't care but all this will do is make that fandom hate JMo (while wanting her character to be Regina's bitch.) while claiming Lana as their Queen. Whatever, I don't even think Lana could stop them from acting the way they do. Any fandom with bad apples will act like they are entitled to something. Their is something about this show that brings out the crazies in all the fandoms.

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Lana plays to the SQers because most of them seem to worship Regina/her and treat Emma/JMo as mostly a self-insert. How dare Emma/JMo not want their Queen? Lana loves the attention and adulation.

 

This Twitter has some nice (well, illustrative, since they're very much not nice) screencaps showing the awful behavior. Some of them are breathtakingly hateful. These posts are actually hypocritical in an amusing way. The rest are just vile.

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(edited)

For real.  Especially the rather loathsome exchange among SQers who were insisting that Lana's marriage is a sham and her husband is just her "beard."  I mean, seriously?  It's stuff like that that gives the gay community a bad name!

Edited by legaleagle53
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Ha, that's great. Good for her. And just in case she's "forced" to take that tweet down, here it is:

 

yvette nicole brown @YNB
As with all things in my life: Be nice or leave. And here's a refresher for those who desperately need it: #YourShipIsNotCanon. Mmkay? Okay.
Edited by Curio
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I knew Yvette wouldn't let us down!! LOL, and she's not taking anything down. She didn't last fall when they last tried it, and she won't now. She'll just block them.

 

She also replied to a (nice) fan, saying she'll ask the question about where's the LGBT representation Adam promised two years ago, which I think is fair. He promised non-SQ LGBT and he's been proven a big fat liar (not just about this, admittedly) so let's see someone take him to task.

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That is a legitimate question. I'm still bitter at how they teased us Mulan fans like that. It's funny how those same ones clamoring for representation doesn't fight for Mulan. Not only is she a lgbtq character but she's a WOC but sure let's fight for two characters whose ever only found men attractive. How dull.

Yvette Nichole Brown is just another line of guest stars who has nothing but nice things to say about the cast and is pretty much smitten by Captain Hook. In other news water is wet, Red had nothing to do with the food.

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All hell is breaking loose on Adam's twitter over YNB victimizing SQ. Adam consoled them as usual. And ABC Network's twitter put out an Emma/Regina picture for Women Crush Wednesday. #WCW

 

And I'm off to a five-course beer dinner so I can't watch the fireworks.

Edited by Souris
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You know, I think I'm starting to become morbidly fascinated by these fans. I've been in and around online fandoms for a long time, and I've never seen such an interesting mix of self-victimization, entitlement and bullying. It's like every argument can be summed up as,  "How dare you trigger my anxieties, you homophobic rapist, now make my ship canon!!!"

 

Seriously, if they want to enjoy SwanQueen and read fanfic, what's stopping them? Like I can enjoy CaptainCharming smut if I want (not that I'm interested, but..is there any out there?) ;)

 

I'm starting to wish I actually got my Master's in Digital Communications, because this would make a juicy thesis.

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