The Human Beings Known as the Arnold-Klein Family

[Ohmo]

I have read that Texas has rejected Common Core and that it is a violation of state law for schools in Texas to adopt Common Core curriculum. Texas uses their own standards.

 

 

Just in case anyone is interested, starfire is correct.  I don't live in Texas, but I work in educational publishing.  Texas is not a Common Core state.  It did indeed pass a state law prohibiting the use of the Common Core in Texas.  Texas uses the TEKS---Texas Essential Knowledge and Skills.

[starfire]

I think Bill probably keeps the books and does other administrative tasks for the pet store.

[CousinAmy]

I volunteer at Head Start - half the time I call it "school" and the other half "preschool." Nothing misleading about that! It's just the word that pops into my head when I'm speaking. 

[Getaclue]

Well it did seem to mislead a few of us. And there are clarifications still being made about where they might go in Texas. If he meant preschool then say so.

He says 'they're going to school in the fall' and people are confused? Maybe they should have a public calendar?! Losing interest in this nonsense.

[Fostersmom]

Well, you know, he could have meant they enrolled Zoey in junior high or Will at Harvard. He needs to be specific on the education of a 2 and 4 year old. 

[xldb2004]

I hope this is appropriate but I don't understand the purpose of writing A Minor Consideration. Are they going to make Jen and Bill stop the show? If so wouldn't they have to do the same for all reality shows that feature minors? If not the Kliens have a slam dunk EEO case based on disability. If people believe Will and Zoey are being abused or neglected shouldn't they be reported to child protective services? If not I don't think anyone can tell them how to handle their own kids.

[starfire]

I agree that it's pretty clear that Bill meant preschool, because both kids are too young for kindergarten and it's quite possible Will might not be ready for kindergarten even if he was old enough. I think it will be really good for the kids and their development to be around kids their age and other authority figures every day, have to follow the rules of the preschool, have little assignments, and so on.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Please disagree politely. I feel like the tone is getting tenser and don't want to lose traction in this thread.

[Getaclue]

The negative attitudes being exhibited here and the accusatory nature of the comments is what's making it feel tense. Whilst some look into accusing Bill and Jen, maybe some of us can look into defamation, slander and legality of subpoenas being issued to know who's making these accusations so civil suits can be issued. Won't that be fun!

This might be better reading than that book written by some hack making money from the exploitation of the people she supposedly is trying to protect.

http://harvardjsel.com/2014/04/defamation-internet/

[JustAlison]

Once again, this forum has devolved into something I would be embarrassed to post in. 

 

Will is not overweight. He is a small child with a particular physicality you know nothing about. It's not okay to call toddlers and preschoolers 'overweight'. 

 

Ya'll go ahead and contact your congressmen or whatever. I'll be over reading the Walking Dead. 

 

What a shame. Again.

[wrestlesflamingos]

A post is not a devolution.  This thread is what we all collective make it.

[starfire]

I noticed there is an ignore feature under "settings" so people always have the option of ignoring certain posters if they get on their nerves.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Yes! Thank you for the reminder.  If you find a poster rubs you wrong or just isn't for you, please use the ignore feature.  Feel free to PM me or use the Report button.

[kb3]

Mods - if this is the wrong thread for this please move it.

 

I am a "normal" sized person of 5'2" with a tall body and "petite" length arms and legs. Reaching for things, sitting in non-adjustable chairs and buying long sleeves tops are annoying. And that's all it is.

 

As I watched this short film I gave my head a shake and thought about what others face as part of their lives. Hats off to the Arnold / Klein family for letting us into their world.  And yeah, I'll admit that I watch for the kids. Sometimes a person just needs to smile at the end of a day. Kids'll do that for you.

 

"Jonathan Novick is a dwarf; and every day, as he lives his life in New York City, he is gawked at, photographed by strangers, harassed and mocked.

Novick, who is 22 and has a type of dwarfism called achondroplasia, says he became so “fed up” with these countless negative encounters that he finally decided to do something about it.

“I wanted to stop telling people what happened to me and I wanted to start showing people what happened to me,” he said. “I wanted to show everyone what a day in my life was like.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/14/dwarf-hidden-camera-jonathan-novick_n_5676372.html?&ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000067

[JunebugTx]

The cut off date for kindergarten in Texas is September 1, so Will won't be old enough to start kindergarten until next year, assuming they decide to start him next year.  Technically, you don't have to be in school until you're 6 in Texas.  

 

I'm sure the kids will be in some kind of pre-K - most likely in a private school, since in Texas state-funded pre-K is for economically disadvantaged or ESL kids (not sure you could make a case ESL here, since English is spoken at home).  Or kids who qualify for PPCD as a student with a disability of some kind.  Will might qualify as a speech impaired kid, depending on what the actual severity of his language problems are.

[Fostersmom]

Not to get too far off topic, and I don't know what that kid's major is in college, but he has a voice made for some sort of broadcasting. Very, very strong voice. I'd image he could get voiceover work in a second, that's the kind of voice you hear narrating commercials or on the radio. 

 

Back on topic, there's all sorts of things to learn from this show, on various levels. I've watched the show since the beginning. When they went to India and got Zoey, I had dinner with my mom not too long after. She asked me if I ever watched the show. I don't know how long or if she watches regularly, but she and her boyfriend were watching one of the India episodes. She's 55 and the boyfriend is a year or two older. She told me he was amazed at how people had to live in India, asked her if that was "real" like he thought it was set up for the cameras. He truly had not really given it any thought as to how lucky he has it, and quite honestly, most of us, myself included, would consider his house well below an acceptable standard of living. It's a tiny foreclosed on house he bought for $25,000 that needs major work he's doing by himself. When he first bought it, it didn't have running water or heat. He was there for months before he had the gas turned on for hot water or heat other than a wood burning stove. And we live in Ohio in the snow belt. Granted he's basically living at my mom's house and has for a couple years now, even before he bought this house, so it's not like he doesn't have plenty of access to all that he needs, but if they were to break up tomorrow, it would be a long, cold, and miserable winter in his house since it wouldn't be exactly livable by the time the cold comes. She apparently told him that's how many people live and she thanks god daily for all she has in our cushy lives. I keep meaning to tell her that if he was shocked by the scenes in this show, she should make him watch Slumdog Millionaire. 

[Honey]

Bill Klein has a full time job.  He is raising his children.  If he were a woman, people wouldn't be saying he is unemployed.  In my opinion, it's sexist to say that he doesn't work.

Edited August 17, 2014 by Honey

[Fostersmom]

Plus, he owns the business with Judy. Yes, it appears Judy does the day to day in store stuff with the customers, but someone has to do orders, pay bills, pay employees, behind the scenes stuff. Unless Judy is working 90 hours a week, that's not a one person job. Bill has said that he's at the store daily, in his office working and the kids are with the nanny. Is he at the store 40 hours a week? Don't know, don't care, but between the store and the kids, he's certainly working. 

[xldb2004]

Per Bill's Facebook page Judy retired from the petshop 6/29/14

[EtheltoTillie]

Per Bill's Facebook page Judy retired from the petshop 6/29/14

You mean Bill had a pension plan?

[EtheltoTillie]

Mods - if this is the wrong thread for this please move it.

 

I am a "normal" sized person of 5'2" with a tall body and "petite" length arms and legs. Reaching for things, sitting in non-adjustable chairs and buying long sleeves tops are annoying. And that's all it is.

 

As I watched this short film I gave my head a shake and thought about what others face as part of their lives. Hats off to the Arnold / Klein family for letting us into their world.  And yeah, I'll admit that I watch for the kids. Sometimes a person just needs to smile at the end of a day. Kids'll do that for you.

 

"Jonathan Novick is a dwarf; and every day, as he lives his life in New York City, he is gawked at, photographed by strangers, harassed and mocked.

Novick, who is 22 and has a type of dwarfism called achondroplasia, says he became so “fed up” with these countless negative encounters that he finally decided to do something about it.

“I wanted to stop telling people what happened to me and I wanted to start showing people what happened to me,” he said. “I wanted to show everyone what a day in my life was like.”

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/14/dwarf-hidden-camera-jonathan-novick_n_5676372.html?&ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000067

Thank you for posting this video link.  It was filmed in various locations in Times Square, a place I walk through daily to get to my office.  It truly is the crossroads of the world, as there are hordes of tourists combined with ordinary working people.  You will see anything there, from the Naked Cowboy to those phony Elmo figures. 

Seeing a dwarf should not surprise anyone, but amazingly, people want to snap a picture.

 

In relation to the Kleins, I found it most interesting that the guy who sat down next to Jonathan was familiar with little people from the Roloffs' show.  Since the purpose of going on these shows is purportedly to educate people not to gawk at and sensationalize those who are different, it was fascinating to see that the show had the opposite effect, at least on him.  It made the guy more obnoxiously curious and entitled to say stupid stuff!  Something to think about.

[SassNGrass]

Happy Sunday !

    When does the new season start?   I wonder if Bill will add lowlights to his foo foo highlights?

     I like Jens hair short.

[EtheltoTillie]

BTW, I  know I posted earlier some negative things about Bill's misleading business descriptions, but frankly, he is entitled to be a stay-at-home dad, and I have no objection to that.  If Jen would just go back to full-time medical practice, she'd probably make a very good salary, and that would make financial sense for the family even without show salary.

[mbutterfly]

Do we know whether Jen is considered full time? Her position seems like one that would be full-time with some administrative pieces to it that might be done with 3 -12 hour days, perhaps. I really don't know what the case is right now, but I'm thinking she does have a very good salary now. 

[kb3]

 

GussieK

 

In relation to the Kleins, I found it most interesting that the guy who sat down next to Jonathan was familiar with little people from the Roloffs' show.  Since the purpose of going on these shows is purportedly to educate people not to gawk at and sensationalize those who are different, it was fascinating to see that the show had the opposite effect, at least on him.  It made the guy more obnoxiously curious and entitled to say stupid stuff!  Something to think about

 

That part made me sad.  That this person thought that all little people were like the Roloff family is indicative of people trusting the medium to deliver the one true message.  

 

Not all families with physical similarities (multiple children for example) are the same.  It could be argued that the Arnold / Klein family is the counterpoint to the Roloffs. And though the Roloff's program does show a real family with a great many warts they are not the only version of family, dwarf or not.

 

I had read somewhere a reference to the Cosby show being thought unrealistic - a black family with two professional working parents, children that went to school and didn't hang in the hood and all living in a really nice house. Maybe The Little Couple can show that people are people.

 

We all have challenges - physical, mental, economic, environmental.  The interesting  part is learning about how one deals with them, succeeds, overcomes and enjoys life.  

Edited August 18, 2014 by kb3

[jodo]

Will thinks it is real!!  Zoey giving him a WTF face because he is?  So cute!

 

  https://twitter.com/JenArnoldMD/status/500852599206060033/photo/1

[wrestlesflamingos]

It's somewhat curious to me how the TLC shows tend to gravitate to a singular narritive.  The trips and fluff shows.  It makes me wonder if the lack of substance in the show comes from TLC and not the Kleins.  I'd love an insider tell all that reveals how the shows are produced and what the goal is for the show.

[cassaundroll]

How do we know that they DON'T qualify for a special program through public schools?  I'd say, given the level of speech we've seen at their ages, that both are experiencing delays.  Of course, in Zoey's case - and particularly at tea parties - I suspect it's because she can't get a word in edgewise...  As for of-age little people "educating the public" by putting themselves out there, including Bill and Jen (assuming that's the primary motivation for continuing the show; I personally have my doubts) the difference is that they are of age and have the option of exercising their free will in the matter.  Will and Zoey are not and do not and, according to the typical TLC contract, "must perform."  Sadly, I believe the popularity of and emphasis on little people suggests that this is mere modern-day, high-tech gawking.  And Judy no longer works at the pet shop?  Interesting.  That money must be flowing in full stream by now!  Is she compensated by TLC for her appearances on the show?  I remember that was a sticky wicket with Aunt Jodi in the Gosselin train wreck...

Edited August 18, 2014 by cassaundroll

[jodo]

How do we know that they DON'T qualify for a special program through public schools?  I'd say, given the level of speech we've seen at their ages, that both are experiencing delays.  Of course, in Zoey's case -- and particularly at tea parties -- I suspect it's because she can't get a word in edgewise...

 

Because of their financial status maybe?  

[starfire]

It's somewhat curious to me how the TLC shows tend to gravitate to a singular narritive.  The trips and fluff shows.  It makes me wonder if the lack of substance in the show comes from TLC and not the Kleins.  I'd love an insider tell all that reveals how the shows are produced and what the goal is for the show.

 

It seems like after a "reality" show on TLC has somewhat of a fan base, there are certain themes they like to use, like vow renewals. They are very big on those. I am guessing it's because TLC has determined that is what brings in the ratings and what most viewers want to see, so the shows turn into be much more about ratings and money than any sort of reality. By then the stars/actors of the show are probably hooked on the money and fame, and want the show to go on, so they probably are willing to trade integrity for cash. Plus they are stuck in contracts that they agreed to back when the show ideas were likely less fluffy, but it does appear that many reality families change (for the worse)  right along with their increase in fame and money.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Because of their financial status maybe?  

 

Nope.  Public schools are responsible for providing resources according to the student's education needs and the resources of the district. The ability for the parent's to provide is not taken into consideration in most situations.  If a child has needs early in education there is usually a pre-K program that works to prepare children for school.  Usually, affluent parents will hire therapists on their own through medical insurance or direct payments bypassing the school districts offerings.

[Absolom]

There are evaluations to see if a child qualifies for district services.  Due to funding constraints usually only the most severe cases are put in special pre-school programs.  A speech problem that is helped with out patient therapy would not usually qualify a child for a school related program.  They are dealing with serious to severe developmental delays (mental disabilities), autism spectrum disorders, cerebral palsy, etc.  Head start type programs are normally income based.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Thanks @Absolom ! I didn't know about the income restrictions for HeadStart.

[cassaundroll]

I would guess that saying no recognizable words at age four despite speech therapy would qualify him?  But I'm no expert... 

[ginger90]

I would guess that saying no recognizable words at age four despite speech therapy would qualify him?  But I'm no expert... 

Has Will had speech therapy? I'm behind on episodes, but I think he has spoken actual "recognizable" words.

[Fostersmom]

He's receiving speech intervention. What, because the kid isn't progressing as fast as some total strangers watching on TV and with an axe to grind with his parents  think he should, that means he's not? I'd sure as hell my kid receive speech at Texas Children's than the local pre-K program where they get like 15 minutes every other week. But then, I'm sure as soon as Will started receiving services through the local public schools, of which I highly doubt he even qualifies for, people would complain that with all the money they are raking in from TLC, they could certainly afford private therapy and not take away money from the schools. 

[cassaundroll]

"What, because the kid isn't progressing as fast as some total strangers watching on TV and with an axe to grind with his parents think he should, that means he's not?"

What?

[starfire]

One thing I really dislike about TLC is that now they film so far in advance. We see Christmas in July and things like that. Aside from the annoyance of such long delays in airing, and watching holiday-themed episodes far from the actual holiday, we don't really get a current and accurate picture of what is going on with the kids.  Young kids could have made a lot of progress in 4-6 months, but the viewers will always be far behind the true "reality".

[ZoloftBlob]

I think the point is that that a) it's been stated on the show that Will is getting speech therapy so there's really no need to debate whether he's receiving help and b) just because he is receiving speech therapy, that doesn't mean he's going to be instantly better or that there will be constant demonstrable progress. That a child is not demonstrating progress is not an indicator that a parent isn't doing enough or providing enough.

[Absolom]

I think the point is that that a) it's been stated on the show that Will is getting speech therapy so there's really no need to debate whether he's receiving help and b) just because he is receiving speech therapy, that doesn't mean he's going to be instantly better or that there will be constant demonstrable progress. That a child is not demonstrating progress is not an indicator that a parent isn't doing enough or providing enough.

 

This is so true.  So many times children will go to therapy for several months without a lot of demonstrated progress and then it will click for them and they have a big leap forward.  Will has demonstrated understandable (at least to me) speech on the show and while it isn't what I'd expect from an average four year old, Will isn't an average four year old.  I think going to pre-school will be a great experience for Will and should help him increase his vocabulary from hearing and talking to other children his age. 

[David T. Cole]

Oh the wringing of the hands! Let's get this topic back on track please, @JustAlison is right, this is embarrassing. If it keeps up, I'm just going to start kicking bad players until sanity returns. I mean, damn.

[Honey]

I use the sites ignore feature and it works out well for me.  It would sadden this "average height" person if I didn't have a place to go where I know there are posters like me who like this family and feel like I do.

[wrestlesflamingos]

I tweaked the title to fit convention.  More people use Arnold-Klein rather than Klein.

[wrestlesflamingos]

So, I've always wondered about Jen/Bill's diets.  They have full sized organs that require an adult metoabolism but shorter muscles and bones, that would make keeping up with an adult diet difficult.  I'm somewhat new to the series, I know Jen cautions about weight often.  Have they ever shared nutritional challenges?

[Absolom]

They've talked about how little Jen is able to eat and the need to watch their weight due to dwarfism, but I don't recall any specific nutritional comments. 

 

When they cook at home, it seems to be reasonably healthy.  Due to the nature of reality shows, they are shown eating out quite a bit. 

[jodo]

Unfortunately eating out and bringing in take out and we have seen a lot of both are foods full of sugar/salt and fats to make them taste good but also to make them last....add to that the catering for the production crew=not healthy 80%+ of the time.   

[cassaundroll]

As I recall, they did a whole lot of both eating out and carrying in pre-adoption, and that probably continues now...  I'm not sure what that has to do with the nature of reality TV, exactly...  However, definitely add Chris Craft catering calories to the mix, in that case...

Edited August 19, 2014 by cassaundroll

[NausetGirl]

I imagine that Will and Zoey have either started school or will be starting school very soon as Texas begins school in August.  I wonder if it is a private school or a public school.  I tend to think it would be private as Will needs a teacher who is very patient with his behavior and speech problems.  Sometimes in public school, the teachers must move on with the lesson plans.  Although now, there is the "Common Core" in all schools.  I just hope Will is improving and that he is also potty trained as that could pose a problem in school.

 

I imagine Texas provides some version of pre-K education for four-year olds [Will] - but do they really have programs for twos [Zoey]?  No, I'm guessing Will and Zoey will both be taking part in educational activities come September.  But most likely private programs.  And very expensive.  Hopefully for the kids' sake it will not be filmed. 

[CousinAmy]

Isn't Zoey close to three now? At Head Start we start children at 18 months for a full-day, full-week program. Obviously they wouldn't be eligible, but it's very common now for two year olds to be in "day care" or at 3, preschool. And they probably wouldn't put Zoey into a full-time program since her parents don't need that much daytime childcare, but there are plenty of private preschools that have a few hours, a few times a week, just to get used to separating from Mommy and Daddy and socializing with other kids. 

 

I think they are very much on top of the childrens' needs and until the next season starts, we won't know how well she and Will are talking and if they are getting along with each other. 

 

And yes, I think the children are better off - even with cameras on them - with Jen and Bill than wasting away in orphanages for special needs children. 

[starfire]

I think Bill and Jen probably had good intentions when they first started filming the show, back before they had kids, but I agree that it cannot be good for any kids to be exploited on reality TV. It really makes me wonder how a children's doctor would think this is okay, and that she would even want to be in any way affiliated with a network well known for its exploitation of children.