apinknightmare

Maybe she found out that he was going to have to marry Nyssa thus adding a complication? Maybe because she was exhausted? I don't know - like I said, there are definite holes.

I'm trying to figure out a way in which he could be - like, maybe he was until Lyla was kidnapped. But if Oliver and Felicity were in touch then I'm not sure why Diggle wouldn't have known about it and/or gone along with it. I'm also not sure why they'd keep Diggle out of the loop, so there are definite holes to the theory. I'm wondering if this rift thing is being overstated though, just to sell what's happening now, in which case Diggle could be in on the plan. But then I can't imagine a world in which he'd be okay with baby Sara being left alone. Basically, I have nothing, haha.

I keep hoping that is a clue that Oliver and Felicity are in on a long con together and it wasn't just that she and the team thought there was something left of him and hoped he would listen, but that she knew he would. Not exactly sure how it would work though (did Felicity slip him some tech or something in NP that allows him to communicate with her or allows her to hear what's being said around him, IDK) or whether or not I think Diggle is in on it. I'm guessing he's not because of the whole rift thing. I know I need to stop trying to make this make sense, because it won't but here I am.

I love Katie Nolan so much. Her twitter entertains me no end.

I've missed the shirtless Oliver scenes too, but I can't really blame the show for that since SA asked for shirtless scenes to be relevant to the plot so he doesn't have to spend so much time preparing for them (both by working out AND by sitting in the makeup chair getting his scars applied). Clearly his idea of plot relevant and mine are INCREDIBLY DIFFERENT.

I'm one of those people who find the League outfit super hot. Especially when Oliver's all dead behind the eyes in it, I don't know why.

I think he said that just so he didn't tip his hand that it's a meaningless, plot-driven marriage that won't last. He can't very well say, "well...it basically only sticks for 45 minutes," haha.

Oh, see. I don't think there will be a lot of upset people, but I could be wrong. MG opened the door for speculation by mentioning the second wedding, but we know it's Nyssa Oliver's marrying now, because Ra's is going to make him do it. I understand that there will be some people who are upset there isn't a twist that winds up with him marrying Felicity, but the writing's on the wall now. There's not even a crumb of anything suggesting that Oliver and Felicity are going to get hitched at this point, apart from Felicity catching that stupid bouquet, and we know from MG that he just couldn't resist throwing that in there (because he is a hack). I think that if they even give a glimmer of hope about the two of them then I think most people, even the ones who were hoping for the twist, won't be all that upset about it.

I guess I just follow all the right people then, because the only person I've seen really pushing it is jbuffyangel. I think the reason some people are clinging to it is because it has been a super shitty season for Olicity and Oliver marrying someone else does sort of put a cherry on that shit sundae, but I would actually be surprised if a large amount of people were upset if it didn't happen. There are the heavily invested shippers, but I that is a relatively small number of people based on the whole. Yeah, I think it's just a way of people clinging to a little bit of hope there, especially since it seems like the general consensus at the beginning of the season was that Oliver would be fighting for his Oliver Queen identity by deciding he could be a hero and be in a relationship with Felicity and get his company back. No one imagined the craptastic left turn into LoA ridiculousness this season would take at the time. So I get holding onto the thought that it's been a rough ride for some reward, but I think that reward if it comes will be one or two minutes of not completely depressing interactions between Oliver and Felicity, if we get that at all. I can see why it would be nice for some people to think that they've sat through all this angst for something good.

^I actually don't think that many people want or expect Oliver and Felicity to get married. There are a few people clinging desperately, but I don't know that anyone will be all that upset with Oliver and Nyssa getting married, ship wise. I mean, it's gross for other reasons, but it means absolutely nothing as far as Oliver and Felicity's relationship is concerned.

In response to the post about this article over in the Starling City Times thread: To each their own about Olicity, honestly. I thought they did a really nice buildup between Oliver and Felicity over the past two seasons, so the not fake fake "I love you" didn't surprise me. Where they utterly failed was having Oliver's realization that he meant what he said and any interactions that showed that things were changing happen over the hiatus. So, I get why some people were gobsmacked by it - I don't think they were paying attention like I was, which is cool. Oliver and Felicity are one of the main reasons I watch - I actually probably wouldn't have hung on as long as I did if Felicity hadn't been introduced, and shipping Oliver and Felicity was what kept me invested when things started dragging. I don't think I would've stopped watching if they never got together though. The problem I have with most of the arguments like the ones in that article is that they're complaining about character development and illogical romance in the same breath that they complain about Olicity, when that is one of the most consistently written relationships on the show, and has done WORLDS to develop Oliver as a character (I don't think the relationship is as beneficial to Felicity, but.) and a hero. It makes me wonder how some of these guys date: are they all just instantly attracted to someone and start a relationship with the intention of being romantic? Have none of them ever started working with someone and grown closer to them over time? Basically, a lot of these arguments come off as "she's not a badass canon superhero and I don't think she's hot enough to be dating Oliver Queen, so this sucks and all you silly women who love it are ruining the show for me!!!!!" Which, I guess...well, that's probably what they are. There are valid arguments that there's a lot of manufactured relationship drama going on this year, but if you want to talk about anyone or anything ruining this show, I cannot take you seriously unless you point your finger squarely at Malcolm Merlyn. The pretzel twisting to bend everything to get him involved is the most nonsensical BS ever. Maybe they'll pull it out in the last two eps, but I don't think it'll ever make sense.

Taking this response to the Relationships thread.

People expected a sweet morning after scene because one of the reviewers who was at the early screening said there was (she said it was sweet, playful and intimate IIRC). Pretty sure she's the one who said there was a lot more to the sex scene than what we saw, too - and to be fair to her, there was. I'm not sure why anyone thinks that the shocking twist or whatever has anything at all to do with the wedding. It could, I guess, but I'm guessing the wedding takes place earlier in the episode - seems to me the shocking twist/cliffhanger is going to be us finding out that someone's not working for the side we think they are, or there's some other evil plot afoot. I seriously, seriously doubt that it's wedding related. I'd love it if they address in-show that the marriage is meaningless outside of Nanda Parbat (at some point this season, not necessarily this ep). I know MG said he wasn't sure if it would last into S4, but that's a troll answer if I've ever heard one.

Because the keeper of the cup brought it there, I guess.

Just the last sentence.

Is that...is that not what we were doing? You were arguing your perception and I was arguing mine? Was being the operative word because you're not going to change my opinion and I'm not going to change yours, so it's time for me to step back from this one. It was fun though. Thanks for pointing out that they're fictional characters!

Uh, I'll nitpick whatever I please. She does not serve him - Oliver has called Felicity his partner, in response to her referring to herself as his "employee." If Oliver himself elevates her beyond mere support services, what exactly is the argument (regardless of what a woman writer called her)?

Felicity isn't an office assistant though - unless you're belittling the work she does with Team Arrow as nothing more than secretarial? Diggle also swats Oliver's bonehead moves down as well - guess they must be polyamorous.

Double post.

See, I think he has plenty of friction with Felicity. She calls him out when he's being a moron, and I'm thankful for that, because he's a moron 85% of the time. They argue and aren't afraid to do that. And Felicity does have her own job and her own objectives. Is she not the VP of Palmer Technologies? She was only Oliver's assistant at QC because he made it that way, and wouldn't allow her to move back to the job that she wanted. Personally, I'm glad she's on his side and helping him - the very last thing this Oliver needs is another adversary, haha.

Felicity stayed in the foundry to make sure she was available to help Quentin cut off power to the earthquake machine during the Undertaking. She's in charge of logistics for Oliver's missions and makes sure he's where he needs to be and that she can find the criminals he's looking for. She put herself up as bait to catch a serial killer. She put herself up as bait AGAIN to get close enough to Slade to inject him with the Mirakuru cure (not to mention she got in contact with STAR Labs to get the Mirakuru cure made). These are clearly not qualities befitting a superhero's love interest! I'm guessing she's not hot enough maybe.

Yeah, I don't think Felicity's increased crying this season makes her less of a "bitch with wifi." Fundamentally she's still the same, but life just won't let up on these people. She's upset about things she should rightfully be upset about it's just that they NEVER. STOP. What a drag this season is, I can't wait for it to be over. I'm sure Felicity and the rest of Team Arrow can't wait either, so they can get their 5 month break where life is good before next season picks up and it's shitty again.

What do men do with their sisters where you're from?

Didn't he say "yeah"?

Diggle was there, in the "most sacred secret place of the LOA." He wasn't in an estate room.