catrice2

Oh, I was seriously bored. I will have to watch the DVR and comment tomorrow. I tried really hard to like Patty, but didn't. Has nothing to do with Iris...just can they get back to action and the bad guy of the week? I don't know what has happened to Joe, Iris or Barry this season. I could do without the rest of the West clan. Oh, I was seriously bored. I will have to watch the DVR and comment tomorrow. I tried really hard to like Patty, but didn't. Has nothing to do with Iris...just can they get back to action and the bad guy of the week? I don't know what has happened to Joe, Iris or Barry this season. I could do without the rest of the West clan.

I actually don't think that any of these women are over the top gorgeous. I am not sure of the back story of Becca, but if she was a fan favorite and front runner before I would never know why. So far I have thought they were all pretty strange. Some have gorgeous smiles, hair, or are in good physical shape, but none are drop dead gorgeous. I guess that is not a requirement since they are "real" people and not models, etc. Did the twins really live at home? I am not sure what could be gained by going on a show like this twice, or even three times. I have never watched the Bacherlorette, so I don't know what they are looking for. If they want a minority Caila would be a good choice. I hope Jubilee runs far, far away from the Bachelor world. Lauren B looks a mess to me, although many think she is cute. I honestly don't see off the charts chemistry with Ben and any of the women. Kissing people does not make chemistry. I think they all would be great friends to him and I feel like he is trying to force something because it is expected. JoJo just looks hard to me, and way older than 24. Amanda sadly does give off a teen mom vibe. The soccer mom girl...I have no idea why she is here. To me, she looks more out of place than Jubilee. I can' t remember many of the other girls. Caila comes off as desperate and if she is the one that broke up with her boyfriend after watching the Bachelor on tv, I have no respect for her. Oliva, oddly was pretty to me at first glance, but she looks strange the longer you look at her. Jubilee is pretty, but makes strange faces all the time, the two with the crazy hair are gone, and the twins need to sleep in makeup. I am going to follow the forums until the end of the show. Now that I've seen an episode and snippets and blogs, I am curious to see which one of these bland women he will end up with. I can actually see him marrying one because it is "the thing to do." He actually gives off a vibe of someone who SHOULD be way to smart to be on one off these shows, but here he is in the middle of all the crazy! I saw his blog from this episode and he is already setting up next week. He gets the privilege of being able to think about blogs and set up episodes in a way that will make him look good, explain his actions, or try to redeem himself because he already can look back to what happened. Do they have the talent show anywhere? I would love to see a Riverdance...and did Jubilee actually play a cello when everyone else was being cute and silly? Are they continuing to give her the mopey, poor me edit so that they can say Ben was really into her, but she was just too darn insecure? This, after he is keeping a woman that is concerned about her cankles!

And the most important reason for not crying....I've never seen anyone that cries pretty...it's always an ugly cry....so why do that on television? That may be someone I would envy...someone who could cry pretty....maybe they can teach me? Do the women get a clothing budget? Do they have hair and makeup staff ? The Daily Beast had an interesting article from three minority contestants from previous seasons. They all correctly said Jubilee has no chance, but my goodness based upon comments and calls if Olivia doesn't go with her, then I don't know about fairness! It would really be terrible to have to go home and wait to see your crazy play out on national television....and stress out about how other people will react to it. What if you were interviewing for a job or something?

Imagine my surprise when I taped it last week and realized it was two hours? I watched a match and almost another full one and realized the Bachelor was still on. Surely it is not crying for two hours? It's like, "I agreed to come on the show and compete for a man and watch him date and kiss other women, but then I'm sad when it happens?" If you are insecure, this is NOT the show for you! Surely the girls that go on the show watch the previous episodes? It reminds me of the court shows where the people always say, "I watch EVERY episode," and then you wonder why they don't have a contract, a promissary note, a receipt video or SOMETHING. If they are fans of the Bachelor surely they know what not to do....unless crying and needing constant reassurance from someone that just KISSED someone else has proved successful for other winners. Was hoping Jubilee would go out with dignity....but I knew better!

Tennis is on and my first priority, but did the girl with the overprocessed hair go home? Why are so many people crying on this show? Is that usual? I just want to scream to the tv "have some self respect and confidence!"

See I disagree. I think Ben said all the right things, but ultimately it is a producers show. When they sign on they know what outcome the show runners want, and dealing with the ins and outs that come from any relationship where people are too different is not it. The Bachelor wants that "we meet and you are my prince and I am your princesses and we just CLICK," thing, so that the women (and men) who watch this can keep believing in the idea that when you meet "the one," it is easy breezy. You can just tell by the voiceovers on many of the women that they already set up the "reason" why he will dump some of them, and they set up Jubilee's reason (according to my Bachelor expert friend) and have continued the theme. The edit I get from Jubilee is that the show runners want the audience to believe that she has a chance for their own reasons, but that although they have some attraction to each other, both Ben and Jubilee know that long term it won't work on this show. Ben knows he does not have enough time to get to know someone with that much of a history (and that it would be work) and deep down if she watches the show Jubilee knows the type of fairytale outcome that the show wants...and she knows that it is the "cheerleader" type that she is not, and the show does not want to show two people working on a relationship, just the easiness of getting to know someone and wow, now we are getting married on television! Our families are the same, our values are the same,...and it doesn't hurt that you are good looking! That's another reason I know he won't choose the girl with the two kids, but I predict she gets far so that again, the producers can pretend that they were OPEN to that, but it just didn't happen. By the way, my husband said he thinks she looks a little like Kerry Washington....does anyone else see it? I don't, but I don't watch Scandal and have only seen some pictures of her. Maybe at a certain angle?

Good Lord...Emily Post wrote a lot of those "rules" a long time ago. Certainly it was probably before people were aware that there were allergens in food that could lead to immediate death, or serious discomfort. By that reasoning someone allergic to nuts or shellfish (my hubby recently had seafood in a salad that he was unaware of) would put in in their mouth, be told or recognize what it was) and just continue to swallow it for POLITENESS sake? It has always been my observation that people who quote etiquette are typically selective. My best friend is like that. She picks and chooses which rules are worth following and cheerfully ignores the ones that she violates! I am not sure why it is an issue. I blame the editors for including it to portray her as "low brow" or maybe they thought it was funny? I can see how some people would think it was gross and others would think it was not a big deal. Of all the things that went on in this episode I cannot believe this is a focal. I also blame editing on Olivia. Perhaps she thought focusing on something as insignificant as her cankles would lighten the mood and divert Ben's attention. In general she is probably a nice girl, but I can see those producers meddling. Just like with Jubilee...can't you just imagine a producer saying, 'Ben told you that he likes massages, don't you think it would be a good idea for him to have one now?" Of course, they had spent all day listening to all of the Jubilee hate, so they thought..."let's get her to do something that will REALLY drive the women crazy!" ARGH! Lord, after one episode I think I have posted more than I have on the shows that I watch! I tend to stay away from "reality tv" because I think it is manipulative. I stopped after Top Chef when they tried to shave someone's hair..and Top Chef started to move away from the food and the challenges to fights, disagreements, etc. I can't fall into the trap!! You can't, however, avoid it because they report on it in mainstream media. Even channels like CNN, MSNBC might have some show with a segment about what is going on in the reality world. I didn't, however, know there was such a thing as Bachelor in Paradise, and I have never seen a second of The Bachelorette.

At this stage, I will be happy when Jubilee is eliminated so that all the blogs, etc.can stop dissecting her life and everything she does. The Bachelor is not going to be the show to solve racial issues or promote inter racial romance. I don't watch regularly, but if you Google you can see all kinds of blogs, tweets, articles, etc. on this episode, what it means, if there were racial overtones, is Jubilee crazy, rude, immoral, disgusting, ugly,gross etc.etc. These women live in a pressure cooker for days trying to compete for some man in an unconventional way. They embarrass themselves, shame their families and many have nothing to hold on to except coming home and being able to go to any Bachelor related events and parties and talk about the experience with their friends. I'm sure for some it is their claim to fame. I can only imagine the outrage when she is eliminated (like what 15 or 20 other women this season will be? ) and the speculation about what happened, and why it happened, or how people who were supporting her will turn against her if she ends up doing something crazy (that black eye has not been shown) or saying something crazy (Jamie??!!). I can see headlines about how she brought it on herself by being "difficult to get along with," I disagree with an earlier post. There was a snippet of the first blonde date (LB?) participating in the gossip. All of them did to some degree. It seems to me that after Ben told them about his day,a few had the sense to be ashamed of being so petty earlier and drew back (hence Caila?'s comment about being unfair and ganging up) and others just kept engaging in the drama, but overall at some point in that day they were all shown saying something or sitting in a group co signing on what was being said. No one got a good edit in this show, including Jubilee. I realized too that initially I was falling for the editing. I initially stated I thought she had issues the show was trying to exploit, but who am I to say that? Again, the editing was done in such a way to invoke emotion. I think if anything Jubilee is realizing that this show is just not for her as she thought. Or at least I hope she is regretting taking part in this social experiment. Is she a model or trying for an entertainment career? I can't think of anything other than trying to use this show as a stepping stone as a reason to go on. If it is true that there are videos of them doing fun things and getting along with her interacting with the others, then that makes what was shown even more baffling. It is also crazy when people speculate she can't get along with Caucasian women when her mother is Caucasian, and she possibly has white siblings. My understanding is that the end has already been spoiled. You would think the network would be able to have better control, but I guess with social medial, camera phones, etc. there is no way to film this without spoilers leaking. Chris whomever has a strange mouth, and a lot of the other former Bachelor pictures I looked at the men just looked like boozers. Ben is an attractive man...I'm so old he just seems like a nice boy...ha, ha! But overall, if the show is just boring and I can't believe they stretch it to 2 hours! The girls are bland and boring and everything just seems so generic. If it is like this every year it is hard for me to see how people watch. By now every girl knows how to go on and say the right things, how to get camera attention, etc. I'm sure the Bachelors say the same thing over and over to the women as well. These girls are not looking for love, they are looking for fame and the attention of diamond and wedding paid for by someone else. I disagree. Sometimes people don't realize an allergen is in the food until AFTER they take a bite. My sister has severe allergies and carries an Epi Pen. There have been numerous times when she bites into something and realizes it has nuts or something else in it (from the taste or crunch) that she was unaware of. I believe the poster was talking about those times, not when you eat something and discover later that you had an allergy to it.

Did she say her all that? I know I fast forwarded a lot, but really?? I know a lot of people did not take to her, but it is foolish for any of us to think that we know any of these women from what the editors so selectively show. I'm sure that they all get together and sit back and laugh at how silly they look once the show gets finished clipping and snipping...and getting angry at how easily they were manipulated. Caviar is not very appealing to me either, but I'm sure she should have been GRATEFUL for the experience. So, from what I read the girl Amber has been on the show twice before? My goodness, I've been to Chicago...it can't be that hard to find a man....but then again, isn't she one of the ones whose hair I was curious about? I know it is shallow, but men do pay attention to hair. Not so invested, but are the Bachelor's ever really handsome? Sean, Shawn, whatever, lives locally so they showed him in the paper, and when I went back through a few pictures online I could only wonder WHY the women would be fighting or competing for those men. Do they get to know who the Bachelor is before they sign up for the show?

I would hate for it to be Diggle in the grave, but at this point the show is so boring and misdirected that I hope he does leave. What has happened to Arrrow?

Do the women have access to tools for their hair? I know this is shallow, but I think Amber? And Jaimie? Their hair looked terrible. Also, the girl that Ben had the first date with. She needs a different color in her hair. She looks washed out. She also looks like someone in the entertainment world that I can't put my finger on. Caila (sp) has gorgeous hair. Is the show always this young? The girls just seem so young, and so does Ben. I can see why not too many get married. It is very hard to know yourself at that age these days.

Last year there was a lot of buzz about the show, this year, not so much.

I am gratified to know that it is not just me. I have tried to watch the entire episode 3 times now and it can't hold my attention. Only with Sleepy Hollow did my attention diminish in a show this fast. I am still trying to put my finger on why I don't like this season. Patty, Harry, wasted potential with Jay. I am bored with Wally, hated the "I lied about my dead wife," just so many things. Not looking forward to Iris' new love interest. Was this episode slow because it was about Turtle? I don't even know what happened. Oddly, it is the same over on Arrow...both used to be must see television, but I can't make it through the episodes.

Jubilee goes home because Charles Barkley says so: They’ve got no chance,” he said. “They’re like the black girl on the Bachelor — they’ve got no chance.”

First I want to address the main reason why this show has always disturbed me. The idea that any woman should be "grateful" for a date from a man is unsettling. You can be happy, elated, excited, but I have never felt GRATEFUL for a date from anyone, and the idea that a group, not just one, but a GROUP of women feel that gratitude is the emotion you should feel when a man asks you on a date, speaks volumes to me. Should she have fallen on the floor and kissed his shoes, or wrote an essay thanking him in 1000 ways? Similarly I was annoyed with Jubilee sitting around moping about why he wouldn't choose her. I watched this show today and parts of another episode to be able to comment fairly from my own perspective. From what I have read here and elsewhere, I can see why they have never had a minority in the franchise. People's emotions and experiences are just so different and it is obviously hard for people to, with something Jubillee herself said, "understand what they don't know, or what is different, or whatever she said. Something about being afraid of what they don't know. Only those girls know what is really in their mind or hearts, but I think a lot of what was said and done comes from being young and not having a lot of experience, not from being racist. It also came from a place of insecurity because they have put themselves in this crazy position and are not getting attention. For some, yes, I do think there was an element of "how could he possibly be attracted to HER," but that could be because of the tattoos, her perceived attitude, or her race. I find it sad, however, that there appeared to be not ONE girl that didn't engage in that to some degree, if not Jubilee then Olivia. Unfortunately for Ben, I would hope he would have a more mature woman to choose from because he seems to be mature to a degree, or as mature as you can be at that age. I do, however, think the producers were involved in stirring the pot, and in making sure that it was the other minority contestants that appeared to be the most aggressive for fear of it being perceived as coming from a place of racism. The problem with these type of shows is that they edit things to provoke feelings from fans, and then people feel as if they know things they don't. It was hard to say if Jubilee was pulling away from the group, or if she was just wisely feeling the vibes and opting not to engage. I don't know if Jubilee had not interacted with the others in previous episodes. My friend said she was sociable, but I did not see for myself. But then again, everyone has their own definition of that as well. When Ben sends her home, I hope people can fairly see that it is just because the attraction was not as strong as it was for others, or that the manufactured situation didn't allow them to connect. If you agree to be the Bachelor, you've already agreed to representing the franchise in a way that they guide or dictate. When they cast the minority contestants they know enough about the Bachelor and the women to know if they are casting someone that has a serious chance. Complicated or not, many of these women are just not emotionally mature enough to handle this type of exposure. I blame the casting people, because it is clear that Jubilee is dealing with something and was not a "good fit," for the type of show that this is. I have no doubt, however, that the producers will give it some crazy edit, or maybe she will snap from the pressure and do something crazy that leaves him no choice. I hope that she has the sense that Lace did but I doubt seriously they will let her go out with dignity. That being said, we all are different and see different things. I can't compare seasons or previous dates, but I saw the real awkwardness that sometimes comes with first dates, but to me that does not mean that it was a better or worse date than the one that he had before. As others said I did get a vibe that some of it was producer driven, but he said something about continuing a previous conversation, so maybe not. Some people saw awkward and uncomfortable, I saw tentative and a "feeling out" of each other. I would imagine being in the military it is possible that she has interacted more with men than women, and that can be problematic in this type of situation. Some women that are with men a lot have a hard time relating to a group of women. Although I would love for a show on television to honestly show an interracial romance in a positive light, the Bachelor is not that show. People are there for a fairytale and the idea of having a "dream" wedding or romance on television. To that degree, Jubilee is correct, Ben, or more importantly, the franchise,doesn't want "complex," they want a fictionalized idea of true love, with the end being a white dress and the perfect parents, siblings, hometown, etc. So people say why are you watching? Because I will admit I was intrigued by the idea that after all these years they would show a Bachelor openly expressing more than a passing interest in a "token" contestant. After seeing the drama that ensued, I know for sure that she won't last, but it will be done in a way that makes her look bad and him still look like a "nice guy." I will say too that I looked at some of the previous Bachelors and I KNOW people are only watching this for entertainment, as many of them were no great prize! I felt sad because from what I saw there was not ONE of those women that conducted themselves well. If he is a sincere person (as much as you can be on this type of show) then he is just going to settle for the romance and idea of it all, because none of those women seemed genuine, confident or mature. I don't know many decent men that want to be with a woman who sits around gossiping with other women and being mean and insecure. I just hope that if some of the women came on the show for fame or exposure that they get what they wanted out of it.

Oh my. This was once must see tv for me, and tonight I could barely stay awake. I'm sure Patty will be popping up again. So strange to see Iris encouraging Barry t tell Patty....and I could care less about Wally....

Gosh. I thought I would be able to keep up based upon the posts. One of my friends is obsessed with the show and she called me, so I came here to find out what happened. I have no idea, but it is highly unlikely that Jubilee will make it far. My guess would be that she goes out on some type of drama. Sounds like the drama already started tonight. As predicted, everything that she does/did will be viewed through a different microscope. My friend said she want on a date and the other women thought she was being "conceited, cocky," something. Of course, I'm sure no one else in the history of this show ever felt more relaxed after getting a one on one. She also said the other women were talking behind her back, walking away when she made a comment to them, but then said she was being remote. I can't imagine that it would be easy to be a house full of people that you don't know, all wanting the same thing, and it be comfortable! I didn't watch, but so far I have not seen anything posted here that sounds as if she was bragging or deliberately being mean to the other women, so why were they mean to her? Anybody? I did see the previews for the season and I predict it has something to do with her when the Bachelor is saying something about wanting the person to know his feelings were real, or something, something that looks dramatic! Maybe she is the one that hits somebody? My friend is not the most reliable when recapping something,but if she was correct about the way they were coming after her then I might want to hit somebody too!

Yes, but you can only speak for yourself and the experience you have had watching the show. The friends I know who watch the show and I guess the boards, or Facebook or whatever have already shared some choice comments, and I found a few without even looking. I totally get that they had one or two Latina leads, but you know in America when people start talking about diversity on television, for whatever reason they are typically talking Black people. I also mentioned Asian and Hispanic, and they would more than likely go with a certain physical type of Hispanic. I don't watch the show, but I am confident that you are correct about the racial tension... but then again, why would there be racial tension when there are no, or very few black contestants that are eliminated early? I am also sure that the girls don't have tension because they don't see those contestants as serious competition, and the minority girls themselves probably don't either, they are using it as some exposure as a stepping stone to something else. I also think there was something in the news one year on the Bachelorette? where one of the male contestants did say something racial to the black contestant...but someone else would have to verify that. As I think about it, I see them going with a Black female Bachelorette before I do a male Bachelor. You are correct, it becomes complicated when you are casting for the show because either the people are not sincere and are just trying to be on tv, or you are searching for a large pool of people who are willing to date a minority and have that play out on television. That is a toss up though, as they risk offending Caucasian males who don't want to see a Black man with "their" women, Black women who feel like a "good black man is going to another Caucasian girl, etc. I think they would think a Black Bachelorette would be less threatening to the wider audience, but black men are more inclined to date outside of their race than black women. It is a difficult situation, and I am curious to see what UnReal does on their show. I see your point about the ratio of the contestants as well. Who knows? Personally I think the idea of dating a man (or woman) that is dating several people at the same time and having that play out on television frightening, so props to any of them that have the courage to expose themselves that way. Although I would like to say "people are just people," based upon the history of television and the media, I know that if Jubilee or anyone that comes after her turns out to be crazy, etc. that is going to be looked at through a different lens than the other Caucasian contestants that have done the same or worse. People don't have to agree with me, but I know it is true. I don't know where Ben is from, but i would think you are more likely to find a man willing to date another race that has grown up in a city around diversity than a small town person. With that being said, I am in a mixed race relationship, my husband is from a small town in Indiana, and his family couldn't have been more amazing about it . We, however, did not live there or meet there and I often wonder if the experience would have been the same if we had. I've always believed our issues are more regionally, etc. based than racial..he is a product of divorce, my parents have been together for 40 years...differences like that. I love country music, he detests it. He will listen to rap, and I tolerate it on a limited basis. It will be interesting to see what happens if this contestant does go far. I hope you have a fun time watching this season, and as with many shows, I will be reading the boards to keep up with what is happening.

I have never watched the Bachelor, but of course I know about it from following pop culture, etc. Are you kidding? NO way this franchise will allow a black woman to win, or to be the next Bachelorette? (as suggested by another poster). In fact I fully expect them to create unreal drama around Jubilee to further reinforce why the interracial thing doesn't work, or why the Black people don't go far on this program. Already on different boards I have heard her called too aggressive, too sexual, too "street" (tatoos?), unintelligent, having nothing to offer but sex, leading with sex and physical attraction, and just being too "different" than Ben. I saw a post on the previous page about her big lips and nostrils...and someone saying she is clingy....aren't they all? I think the negative publicity made them cast someone and actually show them going on a date in the previews (and maybe even a kiss, but I'd bet it was from the side, or more her kissing him than the other way around) just so that they can say "see, we are not discriminating!" I am also sure that they have had several very successful minority women apply that had a certain "look," (i.e., no "offensive" tattoos, etc.) and they did not progress or were not chosen, but the one that they are going to manufacture (because no way do I think this show is real) has to have a flaw. When I say minority, I would bet over the years we have not seen an abundance of Asian or Hispanic potential partners either. If he does show her some attention I can't imagine the pressure she would feel in the house with the rest of the women. I will certainly monitor this season to see if I am wrong, but I doubt it! I find it interesting that the show "UnReal" will have their season be about a dating show...where the Bachelor is black! They can do it on a fictional show on a cable channel, but not in real life.

Can't say how disappointed I was that it looks like Niecy will be staying around. Dare I hope that this is the beginning of maturity for Mary Jane/ Sorry, the CeCe story just annoyed me. There never seemed to be a good reason why she was dealing with her in the first place. Loretta Devine was over the top,and was she flirting with the woman by saying she would look her up, or threatening her? Bizarre! I don't think we got resolution on Mark. I am torn about Kara, I like her, but she should have handled it differently with Marisol. Odd how Mary Jane gets a problem off her back and now Kara is in trouble. I really don't want to see her lose her job and struggle, but if the show is renewed if this is a way to write Lisa Vidal out, that is a loss for them. I think the whole story about Mary Jane and "white guy," was poorly written from the start, so it was no surprise to me that the ending was mishandled. I don't even know why they bothered. The guy that played him actually looks decent with his hair a different way and facial hair, but he just looked awkward and unattractive to me...but then again I don't think any of her love interests have been all that attractive. Unless I missed an episode they didn't care enough to even try to give him a backstory so that she could decide if he was worth the "hassle" outside of judging him for what he looks like, and how others would view her for seeing him. It is a shame that she is still so insecure at her age, but again, if she knew it was not want she wanted it was growth to show her not wasting her time...which means that Cuddy Buddy should also go. I agree with whomever posted above that there is no guarantee that a black man would understand her problems. My father always told me not to make the mistake of thinking that everyone who looks like you is FOR you, and understands you and that someone who doesn't look like you won't be for you and relate to you. He always said you never know where you help will come from. I have found that so very true. The biggest problem for me was the whole "The Real" discussion. I literally had to leave the room. I have no idea how that show is successful...but I don't like the View or the Talk either.

Gosh I'm glad I discovered this thread. I don't even know where to start with the things that have disappointed me: Killing Moria- not having her husband stay around as a guiding force for her children Working with Malcolm Moving away from having Oliver kill people and turning him into "the nice guy" Dropping the Russian mob persona Too many people on Team Arrow- when it was just Oliver/ Diggle and even Felicity it was great, now I can't even keep up with who is doing what in the fight scenes Too much focus on the romantic relationship- Oliver shouldn't need a romance to define him or to make him want to be a better person The propping of LOT The introduction of Sara, and bringing her back Oliver's relationship with Sara- unnecessary Moving away from having a new and different threat each week to the "big bad" of the season Suspension of belief that everyone would not know who the Arrow is just by looking at his supporting characters Lazarus pit Wasted season with Rah Al Ghul, or however you want to say it or spell it, they couldn't even make up their mind Flashbacks....please can we get rid of them Oliver/Felicity romance drama Taking away the Queen money and power-it is always nicer to see the hero have unlimited means-I mean I love Batman Overall, I liked the dark and complicated Oliver Queen fighting against the underworld of the city. Now with people with mystical powers and fighting a big threat while he is trying to be a domestic goddess, they have weakened him and made him less interesting. I haven't kept up with comic book Batman in a while, but the thing that makes him my favorite superhero is that until the recon with these movies, Batman was never sitting around pining over a woman. Yes there was Talia and the attraction with Catwoman, Vicki Vale etc., but he is not always sitting around taking their advice and pouring out his feelings to them.

Lord, I totally agree about Barry not being allowed to show how smart he is, and the lack of the need for a "Team Flash."

I'm hoping Marc comes back married and continues to be a good friend to Mary Jane. I agree with someone..the smartest thing this show did was get Lisa Vidal and make her Mary Jane's friend...one that also has her own issues as being a woman balancing a life and career, a mother, and a minority in that type of business. My best friend hates Kara, but I think she is one of the best characters on the show.

I think the problem with the whole romance of Barry and Iris is that they didn't deal on screen with what would have been a logical scene. It should have been shown that both Barry and Iris acknowledged that they have feelings for each other and Iris could have said something like "with all due respect I don't think I can explore those feelings while I am still conflicted about Eddie's death." I am also not clear on whether or not they are spinning it that Barry is not pursuing Iris because he feels like Eddie sacrificed himself and it would not be right. If that is the case, then that also needs to be acknowledged. I mean, after all before Barry turned back time it was evident that Iris was ready to move forward with him in some way in spite of Eddie, is he supposed to forget that? It would be logical for Joe, who was "friends" with Eddie to have a talk with one or both of them to say, "hey, I don't know what happened but it was obvious you two had feelings that you need to explore. If you choose not to, I respect that, but just know that Eddie was so in love with Iris that he would want her to be happy. He knew full well that that happiness might involve Barry, but made the choice anyway, so don't let Eddie be the obstacle after Iris has some time to get herself together." The fact that EVERYONE in team Flash was aware of how Barry felt, and/or saw the "future" that stated they were together, yet no one has tried to find out what happened to that is not realistic. Cisco can make comments to Jay and Caitlyn, but has not said anything to Barry about Iris? It is also not realistic that they can believe in Earth two, etc. but cannot believe what the computer (what happened to the computer, I can't remember the name) foretold, or what Barry himself experienced in the episode where Iris kisses him. If they decided to drop Barry and Iris, fine, but they needed some type of logical closure. I still feel as if Barry needs to "man up." In the scene where Iris sees him with Patty he puts his hands in his pocket like a little boy....I mean if they were high school age some of the stuff they have Barry do would be cute, but even a geekly adult would not do some of the stuff he does...ditto with Cisco. I mean really, who would date him? I find it odd also that the writers write any chemistry or "spark" with Barry only when he is the Flash. As I type that, however, I do admit I did see glimpses of it with Barry and Iris last year when he wasn't the Flash. I am open to different things and I can't figure out if the reason I am not warming to Patty and Barry is because they have made her too "perfect" for him, or if it is still the way he is portrayed. As it stands, if they kill Patty and then put Barry and Iris together It will feel like she is second choice. Adding another love interest for her is just unwise. I think the writers read blogs, etc. I noted that last year everyone was up in arms about Iris showing interest in Barry after Linda, so this year he has a new love interest and she is all but buying Patty lingerie because she is cheering for them so much...I mean she is SO HAPPY for them. There have also been comments about her being attracted to Caucasian men ( Barry, Eddie, her comments about Oliver), so in walks the new boss/possible love interest.....

I didn't see how CeCe was introduced to the show. I don't expect the Mary Jane character to be perfect, just not stupid. Why would she let her in her home around her co workers? At least Kara was honest about why she was with her husband. I find it ironic that the one person who finally made a plan for Niecy ( i mean sending her to cosmetology school was a no brainer) is about to go to prison or doesn't have his own stuff together. He is counseling her about her druggie father when he used to sell drugs? Dare I hope my NIecy problem is about to be solved? I fast forwarded through the Patrick and principal scenes because I got mad about being right that they would bring her back. The really telegraphed that in their first scene. Am I to understand that he told her about the drug use? Good to see Mary Jane working with her team. I looked up pictures of the guy playing her new toy. He looks really good in some pictures, I don't know why he looks so bad on this show. Maybe it is the hair?