catrice2

It started out with such promise...why couldn't they just have Harvey hire Mike and then make him go to law school? The show would have been just as enjoyable if the premise had been Mike being the first non Harvard lawyer to come in and do well. They could have still had a case of the week and drama....the "secret" ruined this show. The clothes are not even cutting it any more, and Gina Torres did something to her hair.

The Joe/Jenny kiss may have been even worse this week. I'm sorry, he is so bland and no eye candy. I also can't get over his being a demon and hurting people. I am in the minority because I see Abbie/Crane as good friends and I do not wish for anything romantic between them. Would love to know how Abbie kept looking like she had lip gloss on. I am unsure where the new agent will fit in. I agree about the Besty Ross flashbacks, they are very boring. I don't care for the new "big bad." Why couldn't Pandora be the bad guy on her own?

I"m sorry they have got to work on Barry's sex appeal. He has come across as a little boy with every woman, Linda, Patty and Iris. I don't want to see them together unless it is portrayed as a man with a woman...not a boy with a woman...whether it is Iris or anyone else. Why can't Cisco take the glasses that are on the same wave length or whatever of the twin that Zoom killed. Why would Zoom leave with Barry and not make sure the rest of them are dead?

Well that is 4 to 5 episodes too long for this mess. How many are left in the season? Since they always end in some dramatic cliff hanger, I wouldn't doubt that they "find each other" just in time for one of them to be in peril. I'm more concerned about Joe being killed.

Except that didn't they say that a new character is coming on as a potential love interest for Iris? That just means more angst and "will they or won't they" silliness. Barry will be encouraging to Iris about moving on, and Iris will keep encouraging Barry to purse Patty.

And here comes Trevor! I don't remember Scottie being mentioned in relation to the therapy, but I have been fast forwarding a lot. The clothes were nothing to write home about in this episode. I hate watching Gina Torres look worried. I don't know how she can stand to look at Harvey.

Did Cisco take the glasses off the dead guy? Was he really dead? I am the minority because I thought the clothes on Iris looked strange. I was still bored this episode.

By the way...Depp will always be hot to me because underneath the crazy...he has talent....that's hot.

After reading your comments I am so glad I missed the pigs. That would have freaked me out. Confused about why Ben had to mention AGAIN in his blog how "hard" he tried with Jubilee and Jen. Faithful watcher friend said he all but begged someone last night to tell him what was wrong, but didn't he criticize Jubilee for not "telling him what the issues were." Was he ever shown asking her other than the bathroom scene? Me thinks somebody got some not so nice comments on blogs, boards, etc. and is still feeling a little defensive, although he shouldn't. What's done is done, never explain, it always makes it worse. That was an ugly move to take the rose with him when going to talk to Olivia. Notice how when he does something suspect he is always "reeling"or upset...explaining away the insensitivity. Also sounds like Ben is smarting from the "perfect" comments. He is quick to distance himself from the adoration which makes me wonder just how bad //.he is going to be in the upcoming episodes since his blogs are always a set up to show him in the best light possible....you know, it is not ME it is them! Just as he was quick to point out how the women were against him. There is something wrong with me...both Amanda, Becca and Calia are probably very nice girls, but they are all annoying and boring....as well as the "front runner" Lauren B. Were it not for her awful hair and the other girls whining about her, I wouldn't even remember her...as with Emily the tattler.

Wow. Pilates and Supergirl. Came in just in time to see Olivia on a beach (what was the purpose of leaving her there while they rode off in the storm?) where it seemed no one was concerned for her safety. Not sure what happened with the other two girls, but I surmise from all of you someone was caught in a big lie? I personally do not get the Lauren B love. Her hair is terrible, I think she is skinny with no real body and she looks old. She has also been on the fringe of a lot of drama, quietly encouraging. Missed the team date, but it sounds like a bust. Saw somewhere else Ben took the rose with him when he dumped Olivia...what was the purpose of that? Why is Emily still there? Is there a rule about how many people they can cut in one episode? So someone got a classy walkout....my god if love is so hard at 24 where you have given up hope or are adopting cats, I can't image these girls at 30, or 44. It's hard out there for a Bachelor reject! The way some of them presented themselves on this show, they should get used to be alone and lonely. The previews were hilarious. The more I see of Ben, instead of being "intrigued" I am just annoyed. The crying and confusion does not bode well for the start of a relationship. All of the girls had a narrow escape. Lace and the other Lauren are looking like a genius right now. Can't wait to see the "spin" put on this episode.

I have nothing to compare it to, but I agree with your comments about the women this season from the episodes I've seen. I know everyone has said this year is younger, but it is like they found the most annoying random women ( and I am tempted to say girls, not just because of their age) and put them together. They have: - Sorority girl Lace, who clearly thought she was at a keg party Stepford wife Lauren H. ( and I am just learning them individually because they are all looking alike-but I am from Michigan and ashamed) Amanda- sweet as pie I want a man so bad I've left my children, but I am going to talk in a baby voice- does she have a job? JoJo- who seems like she has just hung out in too many bars and has no real personality - I can believe she is older than 30- Lauren B- the supposed "it girl" for Ben who only stands out to me because I cannot believe her hair is so terrible and she has no real shape Calia- I can only remember her hair is gorgeous and she was stupid enough to say she left her boyfriend for this show...after meeting him on the street Twins- who apparently still live with mommy in their high school rooms and just sit around mimicking and tattling Desperate girl- I can't even remember her name except she was old and had been on other shows--and her sidekick the one who apparently loves cats but was also forgettable - stand out because they also had terrible hair Becca- why would you do this show again, especially if you have a strong relationship with God? Please, you are an attention seeker Olivia - I thought she was crazy, but now I'm thinking she is one of the smarter ones on the show- I think she knows exactly what she wanted from this Jubilee- is either a great actress, or clearly had never watched the show -if her family is White her issue was not that she can't get along with White people...it is just that she can't get along with THESE white people...in a house with no other outlet- nor was she good at ego inflating, maybe she wanted someone to do that for her? Ben- apparently a fan favorite on another show who liked the limelight and started believing his own hype..and the ego inflation that is given. A very real young chap who sounds like a robot..you are amazing, impressive..I'm glad you all are here...this is hard, tough, I can see a future with you....we have a CONNECTION..until you don't play the game and worship me! So, I can surmise in this episode that Ben walked Jubilee out in front of everyone, when there was a back way and he could have given her some dignity, Haley/Emily turned on waterworks to try to make tattling look attractive. Amanda whined to Ben, Jo Jo sucked up to Ben and Lauren H has cute legs. I have yet to watch this episode (Hey, Supergirl is on, so sue me!) , but I did watch the Bachelor Live on a DVR at my friend's house last night, and I read Ben's blog. I saw it coming a few blogs ago, but all I can say is really? I'll take my comments on the live show to that thread, but something was going on with Ben and Chris Harrison. The whole Olivia and Jubilee thing was handled strangely and what was with those looks at each other when commenting on Jubilee? Then a song and montage? Huh? If Olivia's breath is bad, it has not prevented him from being all in her face. Are they actually pretending Ben writes the blogs on his own? There was not a "like" to be found...and there have clearly been agendas in his blogs. I can only speak for myself, but if I ever met one of the Bachelor contestants in real life as a single woman, I would reject him just for ever being on this show! Some of these people have made a career of it. I admire the doctor man for owning his mistake and distancing himself from it. It can't be contractually obligated because it does not sound like everyone attends every reunion, extra show, etc. Someone said these people even make personal appearances at bars, etc. Lord! In fact wasn't Chris Harrison making a joke about locating the first Bachelor?

Did Barry really just say "at the risk of Joe's daughter?" Wow, not Iris, or a person I love, or even a person I care about, but "Joe's daughter?"

The first season was must see TV. I could barely follow what was happening last night. I am the minority...I see no chemistry with Joe and Jenny....at all.

I think this is true. I saw an article by the man that is on the Doctors where he said that being on the show hurt him and that people did not take him seriously because of it.

I find it strange that Jubilee is criticized for her lack of confidence and Olivia is called a villian because she has confidence. It is like no one can win. I don't think anyone is suggesting that Ben should have kept Jubilee if he did not want her, I just think some people feel like it was seemingly such a departure from what he had said before, and he seemed to be willing to work more with others that he did not say he had a connection with. As I have said before, they knew what they signed up for, but these people are young. They probably thought they could handle it until they were in it. I have never said or thought Ben was extremely attractive. It seems like the Bachelor in the beginning was trying to sell a fantasy...a doctor, heir to a fortune, pilot, and it seems like they at least tried for attractive. You could almost forgive a girl for going on there and trying to find her prince charming.....now it is some plain guy that sells software. I'm not knocking an honest living, but we typically don't fantasize about marry the plain boy next door that sells software. I don't watch, so I don't know when it changed. I hope that it is not true that she wants to be the next Bachelorette. I personally hope all these women have had enough! I agree with the poster that said most are on here for exposure, free items and an ego boost. Sometimes when you lose you win, and this is one of them. As for as the race thing...I personally know very few Black people who care about the show and I don't think anyone was looking to it to solve racial equality or improve race relations. No one expects or wants anyone to feel guilty or sorry for Jubilee. If the previews are to be believed Ben can't express himself well enough to keep from stringing two people along,so I would say the women who left had a lucky escape. So I read a blog that said she was mean to Lauren B during cooking. What did she do? I suspect that was her real crime.

You seem to be as confused about the purpose of this board as Jubilee was about the premise of the show as stated by some. My goal is not to convince you or anyone else to "sign off" on anything. My sole purpose is to post what I think and feel from watching the show, as you are also entitled to do. I am not trying to change anyone's mind, just call it as I interpreted it and how it make me feel. I honestly admitted I have rarely watched the show, and didn't even watch this episode. I don't pretend to be an expert on the Bachelor, Ben, Jubilee or anything else. I am in my own opinion, however, capable of recognizing when I think there are agendas or manipulation at play. I believe I also stated she (and others) knew what they signed up for, and probably thought they could handle it. Clearly (assuming she is also not acting or has an agenda) she could not, but I also don't believe what we were shown was the sum total of her experience, or am I naive enough to believe that the ENTIRE time she never smiled, engaged in activities, jokes , etc. with the other women any more than I believe Amber? was so desperate, or Olivia is so crazy. Going back to the manipulation, however, if what we were shown was anywhere close to accurate, many people would pull away from women that acted they way they did in episode 3 with the things they were saying about her....if that "glimpse" of what we saw was anywhere close to what happened all the time I can see how ( not WHY) she became insecure as a 24 year old. If anything the whole experience just convinced me that they are all (including Ben) very young and inexperienced. And I also include the Olivia situation and the women's reaction to it in that statement. Happy watching!

My husband is from Indiana and he described himself as corn fed. I am not sure if it is supposed to be insulting or not.

I don't know, some people are saying he was kind and handled it with class, others are saying he was cold, etc. I guess it is all about perception. I don't know if I can make it through two hours to form my own opinion. Listen, I am all about silly shows. I watch all of the comic shows on television as old as I am...but I'd rather believe in Supergirl and Arrow than the feelings and sincerity of the people on the Bachelor. I still don't know if these girls get paid. I wonder if the fact that she is friends with a former Bachelor helped Jo Jo get on the show? I am also not surprised at reports that Ben seems to have two girls on the string at the end....he seems as if he is easily led and just leads people on by trying to be too much of "the nice guy." Now that I know about these spin offs, it reminds me of my sister watching the Real World and they would have all these competition spin offs and the same people would come on over and over again, even when they seemed to be 30 and had been on the Real World 10 years ago. I hope we don't see Jubilee and Olivia on Bachelor Pad or whatever the spin off is.

I actually did not watch tonight as I knew what was coming for both Jubilee and Olivia and I just can't stand to see women portrayed that way. I can piece together what happened from comments. Thank you that I was not the only one that saw what he was doing with his blogs. I honestly don't think they imagined that Jubilee would be so popular with fans, so his blogs have been all about damage control ( as were the edits) to show, "see, he is a nice, guy, but she did it to herself!" They have also been written in a manner to justify why he kept Olivia. I agree it is difficult for me to believe he honestly thought she had a chance, because when she expresses insecurity he gets rid of her instead of reassuring her, but keeps people he has barely been shown saying hello to. This, after he contradicts himself by telling her ( and Amber) that he LOVES the fact that she says what she feels......as long as it is not a criticism or questioning of him. Honestly, I think the blog will be more self serving.My guess is he won't say a lot about Jubilee and focus on the Olivia drama.

Just to say I hope that all of the women get what they want out of this show. From what I can tell, many of the "rejects" have managed to parlay their few minutes in the spotlight into business opportunities. I think maybe they should think about casting older people. The women, and Ben, just seem so young and so not ready for the "real" world. I think the most offensive thing that I found is that I read the twins lived at home in little girl rooms. I have to wonder about a man that would send grown women who have decent careers home, but keep someone still living with her mother like a little girl.That is what really has had me questioning Ben and his maturity....as well as this situation with Olivia. If this is "real" and producers are not making him keep her, then he is really not a perceptive person and just seems to be easily led.

I honestly don't know why this quote was attributed to me. I did not say that. If someone has to comment on Gomer Pyle, I can see why they did not like Jubilee. Clearly she and I have a similar sense of humor and a lot of people just don't get it! I personally don't care about people's personal business...I don't care any more about why she is a private than I would want to know how many times one girl took the bar, or what someone's grade point average was in college...it really is irrelevant to the qualifications of this show, or how or why people support one contestant over another. Outside of the social, class, gender and racial representation (or misrepresentation) I don't know why people get so worked up about this show. From what I have been able to gather, even the people who make it as a couple are so addicted to the artificial fandom they go on subsequent shows to try and milk it for all the attention (and prizes) they can. How sad!

Hmmm, I don't know, Gomer Pyle was in for quite some time and I don't recall him rising in the ranks, swiftly an he was sweet as pie! I know plenty of people in the military and for some reason, they seem to like and promote bad attitudes...in fact it seems to be admired.

Can't really comment on what is on Twitter. I don't know that people are upset that Ben sent Jubilee home because she is a "WOC" as someone put it, but people are probably upset that they are tired of the pretense that there is a chance for a "WOC." With that being said, those that come on the show know somewhat what they are signing up for. I would imagine that even the strongest of us think we can handle being away from real friends and family and living in this artificial world and being normal. The stress of "competing" for a man on top of the environmental conditions has got to be great, but unfortunately real or imagined, the producers decided for drama purposes to show an edit of Jubilee being treated unfairly by the other women....and Olivia too, however the portrayal of Olivia makes it seem more deserving. Because of the manipulative edit, some of the audience sees a girl that is different, who went on there with her hopes up, only to be treated poorly by the other women when she seems sincere. They are reacting to her story and to that. I am quite sure ( and some of the scenes not shown) that she was not as sulky, mopey and hard to get along with as she was shown, but I also believe that Olivia is not as crazy as she is being made out to be, and some of the others not as catty or sweet as they are being made to be. Just like the producers wanted to further the myth that black women are "abrupt, difficult to get along with, unstable, etc." posters want to foster the myth that the only reason people could like Jubilee or want her to stay is because she is a WOC, or that minority people feel entitled to things or like someone owes them something. I say kudos to her for realizing this was not for her, kudos to Ben for ending the farce. I cry foul, however, on casting, the producers (and probably Ben) for even pretending that she ever had a chance. If she had come on and been grinning from ear to ear ( and being GRATEFUL) for every glance, she still would not have made it far. Let's face it,anyone who wants to be the Bachelor also wants every girl there to be fawning over him , hanging on his every word and being happy to please him....with no criticism of him at all! If she was sincere about wanting to find someone, this is the best thing that could have happened to Jubilee, and she got two more trips out of it. I feel the same about the mathematician, lawyer, and the others that went home to real careers and some self esteem. To be shown gossiping, tattling, etc. is not a good look for anyone. Do they portray the men this way on the Bachelorette? I mean, what has she lost? Most of these people don't survive in a relationship for the very reasons I stated above....love, romance and attraction created under artificial circumstances rarely last when tested in the "real" world.

I am surprised that after only watching a little of the show how easy it was for me to start criticizing the women. Basically the people that I know who watch the show only watch to be able to see the crazy, or to talk about the women. I don't see my comments as catty, but just factual the way I see it. I can respect that some people think Becca? (I think the one that is from another show?) and Lauren are pretty, but I honestly don't thin any of them were extra special, but are they supposed to be? I thought the premise of the show was a regular nice guy is looking for the girl next door...not a model? I think these people have to know by now what happens when you come on this show..i.e., opening yourself up for ridicule and comment. I can't imagine being on here and then moving back home to a normal life. I am also ashamed that I started to think I could know people from 5 minutes on a television show. The clips I saw this week have made me incredibly sympathetic to Olivia. Most of the girls that have already gone home seemed to be very average, and only a few of the ones left are cute, but not beautiful. Lord, someone showed the twins without makeup and I thought how sad it was that they looked that bad makeup free in their early 20's.. I think this show should go more for late 20's or early thirties. Have they ever had older people? I don't know how they choose the Bachelor or Bachelorlette, but I would hope they will decide they have shamed themselves enough that they would not want to do it again. I guess the idea of being on television and getting these free trips, being in the media is appealing. Do they get paid, or do they have to take off work for this? They honestly did not show enough of anyone's talent other than the twins and Olivia to be able to tell if anyone else was fun or interesting. That's too bad. It is also too bad that someone spoils this show every year so that there is no suspense. Then the producers get to go back and edit, etc. to fit or push whatever narrative they've decided to push, and the Bachelor gets to make up all his blogs, etc. to support that. I can't see how women could be so emotional about someone they have known for a few days or weeks, and that they continually see kissing and complimenting some other woman.

Funny, I couldn't even watch the whole episode. I have been calling for them to deal with this for 3 seasons, and now that they have, I find I don't care. The idea of all the love interests coming back does not interest me. I missed the whole thing with Trevor, even when he came back last season. What is his story now? Jessica supported Mike for Harvey...it has always been terrible how Harvey put her at risk in the first place when she i so much for him, just because he was on a ego trip and thought it was amusing to have Mike around because he COULD. Trevor becomes important because he can testify that he told Jessica about Mike long ago.