ReadMeLattice

Generally I thought the groom himself paid for the honeymoon.

She's calling herself and Amber white trash. And is proud of it. Wow, Nova will be so proud to see her mother's behavior when she gets older! Bragging about assault!

People who work in food service have to undergo background checks...she's a felon. No way in hell McDonald's is letting her work anywhere. Taking a tip from Jenelle?

Absolutely. Cate is jealous because she knows full well her "man" likes strippers and likely porn stars more than he's ever been attracted to her. Amber is jealous because she knows full well HER man would have chosen Farrah before her but she was the only one who said yes to his advances. And Maci is jealous because she wants to be a "star" and Farrah makes more money and gets more publicity than her. So what's the easiest thing to insult? "She's a ho." They ALL have disgusting attitudes, self righteous worldviews and bad family relationships, especially Cate and Amber. Why would they care about Farrah's? They've never cared about Farrah's many actual flaws until Farrah gave them reasons to be jealous. Typical trash.

Dr. Drew is super sexist. He makes that clear every time he's on stage.

On likability I agree. But in terms of violence/direct harm to others/criminality, I think Amber has the most chance to do harm. She is really scary. I just remember her kicking Gary and how hard she used to hit him. If cameras hadn't been there, she'd have battered somebody at the reunion. I used to find Amber a little likable, I haven't seen that in a long time. The Matt connection has made me really lose any hope for her. Who doesn't care that somebody abandoned 5+ children? Makes me think she can just fake it a little better. Cate, too. I used to have a lot more hope for her. She's turned into somebody really disgusting. But I do think she has a better heart than all the others. I don't like Farrah at all. But the other cast members and their uppity attitudes are making it difficult not to point out their many flaws.

Definitely agree there. Farrah was not the one acting out at the reunion and doesn't deserve to be assaulted or sexually harassed. Pointing that out doesn't mean she doesn't suck or that she is not a generally messed up person. Amber is the one who started the comparisons..."She was selling her VAGINA while I was in jail." Um, yeah. How does that make YOU look good?!?! Sex toys are perfectly legal and used by many people. Spousal abuse, child neglect and drug use are not. Not to mention that she took care of her daughter high, which in my opinion is abuse. This seems to be a common theme in their trashy circles, though...Leah, Cate, and Amber all subscribe to it. It's ok to be abusive, high, starting Mauryesque fights, drinking while pregnant, going to jail, endangering others with your driving, abandoning your kids, etc., as long as you 1) have a man 2) refer to that man constantly as "my man" 3) harass that man into marriage/engagement and 4) don't strip or make porn, both of which that man has likely consumed (and let's be honest, if they were more attractive they'd consider it). I do not get those values. I definitely think that overall, Amber is by far the worst, though. It really speaks to our society's values that she can still be considered a good mom by leghumpers even though she's an abusive, violent deadbeat who doesn't work and is marrying another abusive deadbeat. Because she isn't a stripper or something, and claims to be sober. I do think that is really fucked up.

I think so too. I always hope not for the sake of the kids, though.

I don't think Farrah is so much better, though I was surprised that she didn't let Amber's Jerry Springer act get her going. But the other girls sure do seem to think so and shove that narrative at every turn. They must see their lives very differently than we do. My hatred has definitely shifted. I had hope for Amber after her prison time, but now it's clear she's by far the least likely to change. She is truly a criminal and physical abuser at heart. Also, can we talk about how Ryan was pretty unapologetically like "yeah, why would I work?" Lol!

That's true. I was absolutely disgusted by Debra's behavior in that scene.

She should have been arrested for that. Just like Amber and Matt should have been arrested. I don't know if they have no case when it's on camera.

No amount of bitchiness could ever make me take joy in what looks like sexual assault/nonconsensual touching or at least the beginnings of it. I've been sexually assaulted and I sure as hell am not perfect. But I definitely didn't deserve it and absolutely nobody does, no matter how bitchy. This is what rape culture is...somehow it's the victim's fault. @SPLAIN love your post re: rape culture, thanks for that. 100% agree. Ironically she's the only one who won't cop to a mental disorder, but she's the only one I believe has sexual trauma in her childhood. JMO.

And calling someone retarded, like Cate did, is just oh so classy!! How quickly they forget. @shelley1005, Amber took a swing at Farrah, which in CA at least counts as assault. Any attempt to physically harm, threat, etc. Definitely illegal. Matt should have been arrested for far more.

Sure, she's disgusting. That's pretty indisputable. But I actually think Cate & Amber were the ones at this particular reunion who acted "better" than her and called her trashy, and they are both trashy and abusive too. I don't think they're all the same, though. Amber is far worse than all the others in terms of abusiveness imo and in the opinion of the law. She beat her ex and is clearly still a violent felon. The other three have all also been abusive but she's the only one I would honestly fear on a criminal level. I understand Maci feeling a little superior but I honestly don't get who Cate and Amber think they are. Queens of virtue? (Btw I mentioned the porn because that's why THEY think they're better than her. That's why they call her a "trashy bitch". It's not because she's a jerk to her family or pretentious, or batshit insane or the other real complaints that someone could have about her. It's because even though they do nothing but drugs and neglect their kids, she did porn and that makes them better). I'm only talking about this reunion: Honestly, Amber and Matt should have been arrested. That was not legal.

What is in the water? Jenelle and Farrah have been the less gross ones recently. Wtf.

Damn this show for making me DEFEND FARRAH. I've said it before and I'll say it again...at least she's got hustle. I don't give a shit if someone does porn. It doesn't hurt anybody, it's legal and most people watch it. So Taylor, Tyler and Matt have never watched porn, I suppose? If people didn't watch it, nobody would make it. She hasn't popped out babies to get a man. She doesn't sit around eating Fritos, drinking while pregnant, endangering people with her stoned driving and complaining about her fake illnesses. She's actually started companies and followed through. The girl works. Cate, Amber, and Maci all had to beg guys to be with them. Two of them had to get pregnant more than once to entice said guys to marry them. Another one overlooks the many abandoned children in her fiance's wake. Cate and Amber don't work at all. I'm sorry, who's the trashy one here?

Not according to her, their family or their religion. They don't consider legal marriage to be real in any way. They were married in the temple and, according to them, "sealed for eternity." Saying that she's not legitimately married is like saying I'm not because I didn't have a proper Hindu wedding. Well, I'm not Hindu, so that's not a requirement. They are married in their eyes.

I have no doubt she had to listen to them have phone sex or some other equally embarrassing thing.

Meri threw her under the bus on television, too (and they're the ones who put her on TV and who allow supposedly private conversations with their kids to be filmed). She sent sexts and simulated BJ photos that ended up all over the internet while still telling her adult daughter it was a "friendship." That's the part that would offend me most, if I was Mariah. She STILL maintains it was a friendship?!?!?! I honestly thought by now she'd at least admitted it was an emotional affair. How mind numbingly dumb does she think her daughter, husband and everyone around her are? Come on, just own the fuck up to it.

Holy shit, Jenelle was mature in that conversation about David's mother. It was like she was a different person. I almost felt like I saw a real personality that we've only had glimpses of before. Maybe off the meds/drugs??

Are you serious? I never want to see Nathan's face again. But it should be fun.

The bolded is very true. He is totally the type of person to say something like, "how can you even think of not being on my side, how can you be such a hater," etc., and MUCH worse, if Amber ever mentions his wrongdoings. My husband caught his ex cheating on him when he looked at her email. Her response was "how is what I did worse than you snooping through my email?" Matt is totally that type of person.

@Marigold, Caleb is not LDS. Fundamentalist Mormon sects actually tend to be less strict on alcohol than the LDS church, weirdly. It's not a big "good" thing but depending on the sect, it's also not 100% a no no. Very weird. The reason I think the Mormon Church is gross about this is because 1) polygamy is still in their doctrine, they just ignore it, even though their Scriptures technically still say that you must be polygamous to get to the highest level of heaven, and even though men can still be sealed to more than one woman (say, after divorce or death), while women cannot, so actually they still believe in polygamy in the afterlife, and 2) they are very exploitative of and degrading to women, and their "prophet" Joseph Smith was married to very young children (as young as 13-14) he forced into marriage, and they are scared that they will continue to be associated with that and that will curb conversions, which bring in quite a bit of $ because their religion is essentially run as a corporation. Tithing is required, 10% for everyone, and there is evidence that that money is used for the mall and other businesses they run, the profits of which likely go to the church leaders while local leaders and workers are all unpaid. Even janitors, child care providers, changing room attendants, and receptionists are unpaid if Mormon. As well as full time local clergy. So I just don't trust it. Both the FLDS and the LDS churches are highly exploitative, degrading to women, shady and secretive, and boys' clubs that build up men's egos. I see where Kody gets it.

They weren't famous like the Browns unfortunately are and the polygamous family had already left the FLDS church and denounced it. They only remained in polygamy because that was all they knew. They no longer believed the tenets. The Browns seem much more adamant that their kids express open support of their family structure. Also, they have a Supreme Court case in Utah about legalizing polygamy.

In the AUB, you cannot enter heaven without being polygamous. It is a major spiritual tenet. I assume the LDS church feels comforting to them because the doctrine is essentially the same but without polygamy.