Who Killed Garrett Phillips?

[biakbiak]

On Oct. 24, 2011, 12-year-old Garrett Phillips was murdered in his home in Potsdam, a small town in upstate New York. Police quickly zeroed in on a suspect in this unthinkable crime: Oral “Nick” Hillary, a black man in the mostly white community, who was a soccer coach at Clarkson University and the ex-boyfriend of Garrett’s mother, Tandy Cyrus.

From two-time Academy Award-nominee and Emmy-winner Liz Garbus (HBO’s A Dangerous Son and Nothing Left Unsaid: Gloria Vanderbilt & Anderson Cooper), the absorbing two-part documentary Who Killed Garrett Phillips? looks at the case from the initial investigation through the arrest and numerous legal twists and turns that culminated in Hillary’s trial for murder five years after the crime. The two-part documentary raises troubling questions of racial bias and issues surrounding policing and the criminal justice system.

Who Killed Garrett Phillips? begins with the 2011 murder of 12-year-old Garrett Phillips and subsequent trial for second-degree murder of Clarkson University soccer coach Nick Hillary, a black man living in mostly white Potsdam, NY. The documentary chronicles the five years following the murder, as Garrett’s grief-stricken family and community relentlessly seek justice, and Hillary desperately fights to prove his innocence.

Hillary, who has lost his job, tries to move forward with his life caring for his five children and files a civil case against the Potsdam police department. Mary Rain, the new district attorney, makes it her mission to put Garrett’s murderer behind bars, and Hillary is charged with second degree murder based on testimony given during his civil case. Despite holes in the prosecution’s case, both sides prepare for a bench trial without a jury, as national media attention raises important issues of race and bias in policing.

Through in-depth interviews with a variety of people linked to the case, as well as extensive police audio and video recordings and courtroom footage, Who Killed Garrett Phillips? is a gripping, eye-opening look at how justice is delivered or delayed.

Among those offering insights are: Nick Hillary and his children; lead investigator Mark Murray; Garrett’s uncle, Brian Phillips; Sheriff’s Deputy John Jones, Tandy Cyrus’ other ex-boyfriend; friends of Tandy Cyrus; Mani Tafari and Lisa Marcoccia, friends of Hillary’s, who were an early part of his legal defense team; district attorneys Mary Rain and William J. Fitzpatrick, who led the case against Hillary; lawyers Norman Siegel and Earl Ward, who joined the defense; Ian Fairlie, Hillary’s assistant soccer coach at Clarkson University; local journalists W.T. Eckert and Natasha Haverty, and Jesse McKinley of the New York Times, who followed the case from its inception; neighbors who lived in the same building as Garrett and Tandy Phillips; and many more.

The documentary seeks to uncover the truth behind the tragic murder of a young boy that traumatized a town, the vilification of a black man who was swept up in a quest for justice and the mysteries that remain.

Who Killed Garrett Phillips? is produced and directed by Liz Garbus; produced by Kimberly Launier; written and edited by Karen K.H. Sim; executive producer, Sheila Nevins; senior producer, Nancy Abraham; director of photography, Tony Hardmon; co-producer, Adrienne Collatos; line producer, Julie Gaither; original music by Thomas Rutishauser.

[biakbiak]

I had seen this case before on Dateline or 48 Hours and the interrogation scenes of both Nick and his assistant coach or so telling in the ways police set up the questioning environment they want Nick to think it’s a casual convo so it’s just some dudes sitting around in office desk and attempt to pretend that reading him Miranda doesn’t mean anything and even try to not do it the first time even though he is their only suspect. Cut to his assistant coach who is just an alibi witness they have backed up against the corner of an interrogation room with two officers sitting directly across from him and asking him super leading questions which he did not fall for!

The physically blocking him from leaving, taking his phone etc while trying to say he wasn’t in custody and the attempting to force him to define his sixth amendment rights as if if he wasn’t  entitled to him if he couldn’t illustrate just some of the ways that the cops can pressure people. I also noticed in that interview he did his best to keep both hands in his front hoodie pocket probably so he couldn’t be accused of being aggressive. 

One thing that the previous show left out was how the assistant coach was so sure about the time of 5:21 when Nick came over, they edited out the fact that he was there when Nick was told by the police of his death a few hours after it happened and lightly questioned probably searing it into his mind and that he had been on the phone with someone when Nick walked in so knew it because it was time stamped on his phone

The mark on Nick’s ankle didn’t look fresh but a scabbed over mark that parts had been rubbed raw by a shoe it’s right where that sort of thing happens on some of my tennis shoes.

There are things that I remember that haven’t come up yet and so won’t mention them until after the second part but I wanted to punch the detective when he said other people had been photographed naked and referenced the autopsy photos of Garrett. Fuck you that clearly wasn’t normal behavior and also not in this case.

Edited July 24, 2019 by biakbiak

[EtheltoTillie]

The first part was very good. I saw it on Dateline originally but don’t remember so many details. The images of the strip search were chilling. I will wait to finish part 2 before commenting further. 

[BeatLA24]

The physically blocking him from leaving a meeting they said he was free to go, and the strip search were infuriating.

The other part that made me furious, was the fact that Mary Rain used the emotions of this case to get elected. With the way she conducted herself in this case, I was not surprised that she has had her law license suspended for misconduct over her tenure.

[absnow54]

Mary Rain was so infuriating. My favorite part was when she was all incredulous that her friend had been selected for the jury and he would have made an honest and impartial choice, and then a few scenes later after Hillary requested a bench trial, the two lawyers were like "Of course he wasn't taking trial by jury, Mary Rain's friend was a juror for crying out loud!"

[blixie]

I am basically a Ball of Rage after watching this, even though I had seen the Dateline and remember it being shitty Dateline elided too much of the garbage police behavior and I don't recall if they covered how her ex boyfriend the sheriff was inappropriately/unethicaly involving him in the investigation from the start. 

I loved how they two asshole cops kept trying to convince his white friend/alibi witness to change his story: But WHAT IF, *maybe*, he wasn't really at your house at 5:21" they even said "we need every second" like to make a case for how he got there after killing the child. It utterly failing every time they tried it with him was great. They were baffled how he could choose the truth/black man over lying to vindicate a white child's death. RAGE

Edited July 25, 2019 by blixie

[meep.meep]

I never saw anything about the case before watching this.  Guess if I don't want to get arrested in India, I shouldn't want to get arrested in Potsdam either.

I was amazed at how Nick Hillary managed to control himself with the police and not give them any reason to escalate.  And then to have the balls to request a bench trial.  The man is my new hero.

However, the one thing the documentary neatly scooted around was what was said at the trial about any motive he might have had for killing the boy.  The uncle said something about discipline, but Hillary wasn't living with the kid anymore.  The prosecution must have presented a reason why Hillary would have at a minimum confronted the kid.

At the end I was left sad for Tandy - she has no closure at all.

[blixie]

The Prosecutions argument was that Tandy dumped him because her kids and Garrett specifically and especially hated him, and they showed several texts where she tells him they can't see each other because he's not getting along with her kids and they come first.  It's still a weak motive, compared to racist ex who was dumped for a black man, who actually threatened and harassed Tandy, and who an eye witness saw at the crime scene immediately prior to the murder. 

 

[biakbiak]

I thought it was interesting that Tandy didn’t participate in the documentary because she was on the Dateline. I remember her because she was wearing an unflattering orange shirt against a grey background so I assumed for a lot of the episode that she did it because I thought she looked like she was in prison!

Edited July 26, 2019 by biakbiak

[Soobs]

I want to hear more about these kids he didn't get along with. I could definitely see this as bullying/ horseplay taken too far. When I think back to my latchkey days we did a bunch of stuff where someone could have been seriously hurt or killed, especially at around 12 or 13. My brother and I once tried knife throwing using each other as targets and that's one of the tamer stories!

Another possibility is that there was already someone in the apartment who attacked Garrett when he walked in the door. A burglar or someone who was stalking Tandy, say a jealous ex like Jones.

Edited July 27, 2019 by Soobs

[hoodooznoodooz]

I think Jones killed him. Or paid someone to kill him.

So unnecessary:  Jones saying that Tandy didn’t write that letter because she doesn’t know what some of those words mean.

Would like to know, who is the mother of Hillary’s three young sons. 

[biakbiak]

On 7/28/2019 at 12:23 AM, hoodooznoodooz said:

Would like to know, who is the mother of Hillary’s three young sons. 

The same as his older children. They got back together or at least together enough to have more children. 

[outofbounds]

Every time I watch these types of documentaries that I know are going to show me the blatant misconduct of law enforcement I always think it won't upset me and I won't see anything new because I know it happens and nothing could piss me off more than the West Memphis 3 case.

And then I watch and I find myself wanting to scream while I'm at work because I was stupid enough to watch it there and I am infuriated.

I about came up out of my damn chair when they showed the video of him being questioned.  How he didn't get fucking crazy pissed off is a mystery to me and indicative of law enforcement overreach on an epic level.  I've seen videos time and time again of POC's asking why they've been arrested or detained and law enforcement refusing to answer and then when the POC gets shitty or frustrated it becomes a "OH!  Now you're resisting arrest.  We'll add that too." and it DRIVES me insane.  I was amazed at Nick's complete calm through the entire thing.  

Mary Rain should be in jail for the shit she pulled.  Along with the bitch from the Central Park Five case.  

And I'm sorry but any sympathy I had for Tandy was out the window when she sat in that interrogation room holding hands with John Jones knowing full well she'd written a letter saying he was scaring the shit out of her and still supports the bullshit story that Hillary did it.  Even when she's presented with the facts that there is no trace of him at that scene but doesn't believe Jones might've had something to do with it.  Whatever, lady.

[heatherchandler]

On 7/25/2019 at 3:44 PM, blixie said:

The Prosecutions argument was that Tandy dumped him because her kids and Garrett specifically and especially hated him, and they showed several texts where she tells him they can't see each other because he's not getting along with her kids and they come first.  It's still a weak motive, compared to racist ex who was dumped for a black man, who actually threatened and harassed Tandy, and who an eye witness saw at the crime scene immediately prior to the murder. 

 

I just wonder what kind of adult doesn't "get along" with kids?  The fact that Garrett didn't like him and vice versa told me a lot.  I know that sometimes kids don't like having a new person in their mom's life, but something doesn't smell right with this scenario.  Why didn't Hillary like Garrett? 

The fact that they broke up because of this animosity tells me a lot about an adult who can't get along with a kid.  There is more to that story.

Am I the only person on here who thinks Hillary was guilty?  Everyone I talk to in "real life" thinks he did it. 

[blixie]

Eh I just think Garrett overstepped and was strict with her kids and Garrett was like fuck off (rightfully really). I hardly think this indicates Hillary is a murderer. 

[biakbiak]

46 minutes ago, blixie said:

Eh I just think Garrett overstepped and was strict with her kids and Garrett was like fuck off (rightfully really). I hardly think this indicates Hillary is a murderer. 

Not to mention it didn’t seem like they were super serious and they were both clearly still close to their exes.

[IndianPaintbrush]

On 9/5/2019 at 12:15 PM, heatherchandler said:

Am I the only person on here who thinks Hillary was guilty?  Everyone I talk to in "real life" thinks he did it. 

No, you're not the only one who thinks he is guilty. The surveillance footage of him leaving the parking lot convinced me. But it's not enough to convict under a reasonable doubt standard.

Edited September 10, 2019 by IndianPaintbrush

[biakbiak]

13 minutes ago, IndianPaintbrush said:

No, you're not the only one who thinks he is guilty. The surveillance footage of him leaving the parking lot convinced me. But it's not enough to convict under a reasonable doubt standard.

and for me the fact that there were several other cameras that picked up Garret’s short walk home but never picked up his car again and did pick up the cop ex convinced me even more that it wasn’t him.

[heatherchandler]

3 hours ago, biakbiak said:

and for me the fact that there were several other cameras that picked up Garret’s short walk home but never picked up his car again and did pick up the cop ex convinced me even more that it wasn’t him.

The cop ex wasn't feuding with Garrett, though, was he?  Hillary hated Garrett and Garrett hated him.  I would think the killer is he person who is known to fight with and has shown anger toward.

I also can't reconcile Hillary's outward friendly, nice guy persona with the fact that he and a child did not get along.  The only adults I have known who feud with children are jerks, or hotheads.  Hillary presents himself one way, but we know there is another side to him.  

[biakbiak]

11 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

The cop ex wasn't feuding with Garrett, though, was he?  Hillary hated Garrett and Garrett hated him.  I would think the killer is he person who is known to fight with and has shown anger toward.

I also can't reconcile Hillary's outward friendly, nice guy persona with the fact that he and a child did not get along.  The only adults I have known who feud with children are jerks, or hotheads.  Hillary presents himself one way, but we know there is another side to him.  

We know nothing about Garrett’s relationship with the cop ex. There were also no real examples given of how this dislike manifested but it had never before gotten physical. I know plenty of people who haven’t been able to get along with the young children of the people they were dating because often kids act out in such situations. The two didn’t appear that serious so it seemed to be a situation where both of them thought the stress of it and not being that invested in the relationship so called it quits. 

Edited September 11, 2019 by biakbiak

[blixie]

Quote

Hillary hated Garrett

I never heard a single person say Hillary hated Garret. Not a one. The uncle says Nick is  overly strict with Garrett, therefore he MUST be the murderer. Solid logic!

[Rlb8031]

On ‎9‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 10:24 PM, biakbiak said:

We know nothing about Garrett’s relationship with the cop ex. There were also no real examples given of how this dislike manifested but it had never before gotten physical. I know plenty of people who haven’t been able to get along with the young children of the people they were dating because often kids act out in such situations. The two didn’t appear that serious so it seemed to be a situation where both of them thought the stress of it and not being that invested in the relationship so called it quits. 

I thought they said that Garrett also didn't get along with the ex, or at least that there was some animosity there as well.

[biakbiak]

6 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

I thought they said that Garrett also didn't get along with the ex, or at least that there was some animosity there as well.

Not sure if it was mentioned on this doc but it came up on one of the Datelines.

[blixie]

Which makes sense a LOT of kids don't like when their moms start dating, after a divorce or death. And I think that is another way the Uncle and family come off as racist. I can't believe the COP was less disciplinarian and over stepping than the soccer coach. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I had already seen a lot of this story too. While troubled with who else would have done this, I just never saw sufficient evidence against Hillary.  He may be guilty, but, there just isn't evidence, imo.  

 I thought the fake justification by the detective, as if it was no big deal, to allow Jones to sit by the victim's mother, in the police interview room, was pitiful.  What if there were things about Jones that she had wanted to reveal.....but, no, he's sitting there, in control of everything.  Who does that kind of thing? So unprofessional.  

After the acquittal, the defendant and his counsel really did have a lot of nerve. (They had the right to comment and show their relief, but, I would consider the risks.)  I would have gotten my asp out of there quick....like into a car with dark windows and far away, perhaps, out of state quickly.  They could have been shot, ambushed, etc.  Standing around for interviews, talking pictures??? Odd.  I bet that judge got out of there through a secret door, with privately hired security.  

[heatherchandler]

On 10/28/2019 at 1:59 PM, blixie said:

Which makes sense a LOT of kids don't like when their moms start dating, after a divorce or death. And I think that is another way the Uncle and family come off as racist. I can't believe the COP was less disciplinarian and over stepping than the soccer coach. 

What makes you say that? 

[Rlb8031]

2 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

What makes you say that? 

As a broad generalization law enforcement officers are not usually also permissive parents. They have a reputation for being stricter, as a group, whether it is with their own - or others - children.

Edited December 26, 2019 by Rlb8031

[heatherchandler]

1 hour ago, Rlb8031 said:

As a broad generalization law enforcement officers are not usually also permissive parents. They have a reputation for being stricter, as a group, whether it is with their own - or others - children.

I disagree with that, I've not heard that, and this is empirical - but I know a lot of police, and none of them are very strict.  Would say that are across the board, some strict, some easy-going, like any other people.

I still think Hillary is guilty - he is the only one who has a bad relationship with Garrett, and a reason to be angry with him, if he thinks his mom is not dating him because the kid doesn't like him.  And there is a lot of talk online about Hillary's temper. 

We know it wasn't random, since it was in the kid's house.  If it was the other guy, Jones, what does he have to gain by killing the kid?

[Rlb8031]

17 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

I disagree with that, I've not heard that, and this is empirical - but I know a lot of police, and none of them are very strict.  Would say that are across the board, some strict, some easy-going, like any other people.

I still think Hillary is guilty - he is the only one who has a bad relationship with Garrett, and a reason to be angry with him, if he thinks his mom is not dating him because the kid doesn't like him.  And there is a lot of talk online about Hillary's temper. 

We know it wasn't random, since it was in the kid's house.  If it was the other guy, Jones, what does he have to gain by killing the kid?

Same thing allegedly Hilary got out of it. Removing the kid from the equation. He was still seeing the mom after Garret died. Bottom line was he had just as much of a reason as Hilary - maybe more, because whomever killed him had to know that the mom's ex-boyfriend would be a suspect. And the cop also had a bad relationship with Garrett. 

[AncientNewbie]

I hate this is a thing, but I love to hear this discussion and speculation, having grown up there with a number of the people involved in the case and documentary. It's one of those things you don't discuss until you know which entrenched side the other local you are talking to is on. (Or you can be my mother that changes her opinion on a biweekly basis and offends everyone at some point.)

I still don't have any strong indication who did this terrible thing, though. When the first rumors hit, it was about kids and horseplay, and then that seemed to disappear fast. Neither Hillary or Jones fits a tight timetable being used which makes me wonder if that's a misleading bit of the story and if we look at a larger timeframe we might see something more. I can believe a neighbor next to a house with two tween boys in it might have been inexact on the thumps and noises given that it was probably a thing from them. 

[Queena]

On 9/5/2019 at 2:15 PM, heatherchandler said:

I just wonder what kind of adult doesn't "get along" with kids?  The fact that Garrett didn't like him and vice versa told me a lot.  I know that sometimes kids don't like having a new person in their mom's life, but something doesn't smell right with this scenario.  Why didn't Hillary like Garrett? 

The fact that they broke up because of this animosity tells me a lot about an adult who can't get along with a kid.  There is more to that story.

Am I the only person on here who thinks Hillary was guilty?  Everyone I talk to in "real life" thinks he did it. 

You've never heard of a teen hating someone who is their mom's boyfriend? Combine it with the teasing that he endured because his mom was dating a Black man and I can see why they didn't get along. 

[heatherchandler]

4 hours ago, Queena said:

You've never heard of a teen hating someone who is their mom's boyfriend? Combine it with the teasing that he endured because his mom was dating a Black man and I can see why they didn't get along. 

Of course I’ve heard of a teen hating someone, but an adult hating a teen?  No, that’s extremely messed up.  They said Hillary hated Garrett.  

[Queena]

On 4/8/2020 at 11:24 PM, heatherchandler said:

Of course I’ve heard of a teen hating someone, but an adult hating a teen?  No, that’s extremely messed up.  They said Hillary hated Garrett.  

There's been quite a few teens I didn't like. I won't say that I hate them, but dislike? Most certainly. I probably would hate them if they called me the N word or used racist rethoric towards me.