Little House On The Prairie - General Discussion

[debraran]

11 hours ago, Blergh said:

I'm beginning to wonder if it's possible that MG may have threatened at least some of the surviving cast mates with a freeze (as in 'I'll never go to another reunion/con/meet-and-greet with you') if they openly said what may have happened to JG.

She sure seemed rather  . .. detached when mentioning how he amscrayed from the family when he became an adult in her autobio with more of 'never wanted him around in the first place so good riddance' tude than anything else!

I don't claim any 'inside info' and the above is pure speculation but I can't help but wonder if it could be possible. 

Melissa was jealous when he came but I would hope she outgrew that.  I just know that he wanted to leave it all, took his money and took off and no one is really "gone" with a SS number and working. But all they say is lies, someone on a LHOP site, said he couldn't say much but everyone is quiet and Melissa just says she called police early on which didn't make sense and Alison will make up things that are funny like "monk" or acting in plays or the poor guy who is always said to be the wall street "Jon" who isn't him. He didn't go to that college, the other guy did. Just sad. Richard was the closest I think in saying he wasn't happy at home and left. Melissa Sue and one of the Carrie twins said they kept in touch a short time, Melissa Sue I think it was she knew someone who knew him. Melissa G said she has seen him twice in all those years if I remember right but the silence speaks more than the words. Oddly I noted he didn't seem to keep in touch with his step sister either.

In the book, the author gave Katherine the most time (of course) but I am glad they gave him kudos when others tried to make fun of him or say he wasn't professional when he was just 6 or so.  He did fine as much as his part would give him. I noticed he wasn't interviewed then either as the girls were. I just hope he's okay and living his best life.

Four actors from Little House on the Prairie:
- Karen Grassle (Caroline Ingalls), 14 pages
- Katherine MacGregor (Harriet Oleson), 21 pages.
- Richard Bull (Nels Oleson), 14 pages
- Dabbs Greer (Reverend Alden), 14 pages
The interviews with Richard Bull, Dabbs Greer and katherine MacGregor were made shortly before their passing.

All pictures published in the magazine are courtesy of the actors. Most of them are very rare and previously unpublished.

Edited December 25, 2023 by debraran

[Blergh]

I get that MG seemed rather jealous (and, as per her longstanding beefs with Melissa Sue Anderson and Shannen Doherty) VERY capable of holding grudges long after the initial schism's causes had been over.

However,  it's puzzling that every other surviving cast member seems to have adopted a code of silence- barely acknowledging JG having been present during the production- much less being candid re whether they have knowledge of his  fate after adulthood.

Hence, all I can think of is that since many of the cast members (especially those up in years) are depending more and more on nostalgic reunions, meet-and-greets,etc.  for the a good part of their current livelihood, it's possible that MG may have subtly if not overtly threatened the above over the issue of JG's fate.

Now, that you mention it, it's puzzling that none of the interviewers not only haven't thusfar interviewed him but don't even claim to have attempted to seek him out- much less asked others to level about him.

I'm wondering if he may have changed his entire name to his original birth name when he and the extended Gilbert family parted ways!

Again, I stress the above is speculation and NOT claiming any kind of 'inside scoop' on my part.

[Zella]

15 minutes ago, Blergh said:

I get that MG seemed rather jealous (and, as per her longstanding beefs with Melissa Sue Anderson and Shannen Doherty) VERY capable of holding grudges long after the initial schism's causes had been over.

However,  it's puzzling that every other surviving cast member seems to have adopted a code of silence- barely acknowledging JG having been present during the production- much less being candid re whether they have knowledge of his  fate after adulthood.

Hence, all I can think of is that since many of the cast members (especially those up in years) are depending more and more on nostalgic reunions, meet-and-greets,etc.  for the a good part of their current livelihood, it's possible that MG may have subtly if not overtly threatened the above over the issue of JG's fate.

Now, that you mention it, it's puzzling that none of the interviewers not only haven't thusfar interviewed him but don't even claim to have attempted to seek him out- much less asked others to level about him.

I've thought some of that could simply be respect for his wishes. He doesn't seem to want to be found or bothered with press, so I think the kindest thing to do would be to honor that. And honestly some of it could be embarrassment too. It does appear something was very off with the way he was treated in his family, and it may be easier for the rest of the cast to not talk about it rather than acknowledge it. 

[Blergh]

Let's keep in mind, as best anyone knows, being left be by the press was JG's wishes at the time of JG's parting ways with the extended Gilbert but if anyone knows what his current wishes/MO are at age 56, no one is saying! However,  I agree that it's likely that it would be easier for the cast to not talk about or acknowledge the extended Gilberts' dealings with him during his youth/LHOTP production. Of course, I think that the late Mr. Bull and Miss MacGregor each had been starving performers long enough in their youths not to let anyone else bully them- including relating positive anecdotes re JG . Moreover, it's also possible that JG may have kept in touch with one or both of them until their own passings- more confident of their discretion than other cast members.

One odd omission that no one has seemed to address is how ML dealt with JG much less  whether he attempted to become a new father to him (as he did MG) after their adoptive but, at the time, non-custodial father's early death!

[debraran]

I know Mike helped a lot of the kids and interacted with Alison a lot but Jon? He must have, they had a lot of scenes together and he gave him more work later with a wife. She'll be at reunion, do I dare ask how they ended up...just bye or did he keep in touch. They probably already warned her though...no talking about him.

A guy on another LHOP forum, just said he knew someone who worked on the set and no pictures of Jon after 20 were real. Most were obvious but it's funny how no one on LHOP would say "That's not Jon" They just ignored it. Melissa knows her brother. She said she saw him twice since he left but it's been a long time I think.  If was he homeless, abused, changed name, not a big deal. They can say he moved on, hates get togethers and is fine. Why lie?  It wasn't just his sister, it was family. I agree, Mike had bad press but not that bad. Some hated him, some put up with him, some loved him. Jon was small potatoes, they aren't protecting him. . It seems Melissa and Alison picked on Jon and others on the set (maybe why Melissa lSue liked him and Carrie had a crush on him) Just my take, it's more about them than him.

If he is in the US and didn't lose hair or gain 300 pounds, and was Jon Gilbert, someone would see that "Willie" smile over 50 years and think "is that who I think it is?

Very odd and after reading the interviews, they were so honest and I wondered if the author left some things out. He didn't answer that.

Edited December 26, 2023 by debraran

[Blergh]

@debraran,

I guess you could ask the performer if you could ask her about JG who briefly played her husband. The worst she could do is say that she couldn't/wouldn't talk about him.

[Blergh]

Happy New Year, Everybody!

 Now that I think of it, this was one holiday ML made no attempt to acknowledge on the show! Could it have been that ML didn't want to pin the show down to any specific year/s or would he have been hardpressed to have had a 19th century New Year's celebration depicted if Charles stayed stone cold sober (despite ML's actual habits)?

Then again, I don't recall any Valentine's Day  episodes. ..

[Mr. Sparkle]

I'm watching an episode of "The Twilight Zone" and who's on playing an astronaut? None other than Kevin "Doc Baker" Hagen. 

[jason88cubs]

16 hours ago, Blergh said:

Happy New Year, Everybody!

 Now that I think of it, this was one holiday ML made no attempt to acknowledge on the show! Could it have been that ML didn't want to pin the show down to any specific year/s or would he have been hardpressed to have had a 19th century New Year's celebration depicted if Charles stayed stone cold sober (despite ML's actual habits)?

Then again, I don't recall any Valentine's Day  episodes. ..

Can you imagine the New Year's resolutions

 

Charles-Only Cash on a barrel , take in some orphans, flaunt manly chest some more

 

Laura-do things that Mary would get in trouble for but not Laura

 

Harriet- Prove Charles is worthless

 

Nels- Not get busted speaking negative things about Harriet in front of her

[Blergh]

4 hours ago, jason88cubs said:

Can you imagine the New Year's resolutions

 

Charles-Only Cash on a barrel , take in some orphans, flaunt manly chest some more

 

Laura-do things that Mary would get in trouble for but not Laura

 

Harriet- Prove Charles is worthless

 

Nels- Not get busted speaking negative things about Harriet in front of her

It seemed Nels only rarely got busted in front of Harriet- which makes me think she opted to only hear what she wanted. . .

[jason88cubs]

Oh "The Stranger" is on HALLMARK DRAMA. Love this one

[Mr. Sparkle]

Are you quite sure you like it? 

[jason88cubs]

20 minutes ago, Superclam said:

Are you quite sure you like it? 

yes. I think it's a good episode

[Mr. Sparkle]

Bro! Remember the kid says "quite sure!" about everything? 

I do like the episode, but it's a classic "Charles solves the problem in 3 days" episode. I can think of a few more like it. 

• Joe Kagan
• The kid who punches his grandpa
• The family he buys the horses from

 

[jason88cubs]

7 minutes ago, Superclam said:

Bro! Remember the kid says "quite sure!" about everything? 

I do like the episode, but it's a classic "Charles solves the problem in 3 days" episode. I can think of a few more like it. 

• Joe Kagan
• The kid who punches his grandpa
• The family he buys the horses from

 

hahaha I get it now. I was busy eating and didn't get the hint lol

[jason88cubs]

been sick all day so been watching LHOP

[Blergh]

Amazing how Charles could 'solve things' in three days time for unrelated folks but he never solved the problem of the tiny house with more people and no known chamber pots!

[Zella]

4 hours ago, Blergh said:

Amazing how Charles could 'solve things' in three days time for unrelated folks but he never solved the problem of the tiny house with more people and no known chamber pots!

Charles threw himself into other people's problems as a means of avoiding confronting the chamber pot conundrum at home.😂

[jason88cubs]

My daughter sneaks out at night and that's no problem but your nephew doesn't know hard work? Send him here!

[debraran]

Did Laura ever get punished in the TV show? She did  lot of things and was threatened but I don't recall anything. She took off at night to do things and Charles was upset, she bothered the guy in the old house and he got upset and she did other things to people but only had to apologize. She ran away and caused them great angst over baby Charles and then made Albert miserable so he left because she didn't learn the world didn't rotate around her. She thought selling fake medicine to people was a good idea and just had to apologize. If Mary did anything wrong, even once, she was punished. If Laura did the fire in the barn, she'd be yelled and that would be it. If Mary stole the music box, she'd still be grounded. lol  It's okay to steal and break something because the person you took it from isn't nice. All those speeches from Pa never took hold and lying got her another apology and Nellie getting in trouble. (I realize she was mean and Nellie should just have told Charles but then Charles would have to punish Laura) That could not happen!

Edited January 13 by debraran

[Blergh]

On 1/10/2024 at 11:43 AM, jason88cubs said:

My daughter sneaks out at night and that's no problem but your nephew doesn't know hard work? Send him here!

Or, better yet we could have your nephew and that thug who beat up his frail grandfather for waking him early see if they might clash enough to both get 'tude adjustments and. . .

Oh, my bad- they're several seasons apart.

[Zella]

3 hours ago, debraran said:

Did Laura ever get punished in the TV show? She did  lot of things and was threatened but I don't recall anything. She took off at night to do things and Charles was upset, she bothered the guy in the old house and he got upset and she did other things to people but only had to apologize. She ran away and caused them great angst over baby Charles and then made Albert miserable so he left because she didn't learn the world didn't rotate around her. She thought selling fake medicine to people was a good idea and just had to apologize. If Mary did anything wrong, even once, she was punished. If Laura did the fire in the barn, she'd be yelled and that would be it. If Mary stole the music box, she'd still be grounded. lol  It's okay to steal and break something because the person you took it from isn't nice. All those speeches from Pa never took hold and lying got her another apology and Nellie getting in trouble. (I realize she was mean and Nellie should just have told Charles but then Charles would have to punish Laura) That could not happen!

I've never gotten over her shouting at the old guy in Gold Country while she is trespassing on HIS property. I never could like her after that, though several other later episodes considerably lowered my opinion. What an insufferable brat. 

[Mr. Sparkle]

34 minutes ago, Zella said:

I've never gotten over her shouting at the old guy in Gold Country while she is trespassing on HIS property. I never could like her after that, though several other later episodes considerably lowered my opinion. What an insufferable brat. 

How dare you yell at me for stealing one of your apples off of your porch???? 

[Mr. Sparkle]

BTW, guess what's up next on the Roku channel? 

[jason88cubs]

If I recall she got off in the episode where she stole Nellie's toy doll or whatever that was. Because Nellie made Laura not let that one girl in the group. Charles let Nels hand out the punishment and Nels said "sounds like to me you've been punished enough" and Charles was all "Welp off to school ya go!"

 

 

[debraran]

19 hours ago, Superclam said:

How dare you yell at me for stealing one of your apples off of your porch???? 

Didn't Laura let out he had gold under his wife's grave, someone stole it and he kills himself. Charles lies to her but Caroline knows? So sad. Was she crazy to do that?

 

Edited January 14 by debraran

[Blergh]

Laura was supposedly 'innocent' and 'naive' to have blabbed about the gold beneath the miner's late wife's remains but I can't help but think she told the story he'd told her( in confidence) to make herself popular and cool with her new schoolmates- not thinking about the inevitability  of at least one schoolmate ALSO telling it to her greedy father!

[Mr. Sparkle]

A few takeaways from watching Gold Rush yesterday:

1. That bad guy was obviously a bad guy because he had dark hair and a mustache. 
2. What the hell was up with his wife? 
3. That Italian family couldn't be more stereotyped. 
4. Zachariah (Uncle Jed, St. Peter, the guy who almost buys the farm) really overacts in his last scene! 

[crazy8s]

I watched Country Girls the other day. Things that were interesting.

They have supposedly lived in Walnut Grove how long since ep 1?  The girls were in town for Harvest of Friends.

But in Country Girls Caroline has not met the Olesons or Miss Beadle, so Caroline hasn't been to town or church yet? Really??

Caroline takes eggs to sell at the mercantile for the first time, but some how amasses enough credit from selling eggs to buy the expensive yard goods for a dress? (minus any days she sold the brown eggs to the invisible men at the mill)

Ma sews not one, but two smaller dresses in the evenings and no one notices the smaller size?

 

 

[debraran]

I think it was a sweet episode (again Ma gets nothing) but not being a seamstress at all, can you make 2 long girl dresses from one adult? I know Ma was a whiz, but hand sewing 2 dresses and all the trim in one evening, well a little LHOP magic.

I admit though, I know little, since I'd be wearing burlap sacks being all thumbs with a needle and thread : )

Mike wasn't great with any consistency and seemed to forget what was written before. Having shows a week apart and reruns only in the summer or holiday's helped some not notice.

I was laughing at "cash on the barrel" Ingalls always forgot that when he wanted too and then saw this on Reddit. Might be a laugh for some of you. I laughed outloud at the the comments about poor Harriet not being moved enough to give Charles credit, "I guess the tight pants didn't do it for her"

 

Edited January 15 by debraran

[Mr. Sparkle]

Controversial opinion: other than the cringey dream sequences, "The Godsister" is a decent episode. The telephone line construction storyline is pretty good. 

[Blergh]

48 minutes ago, Superclam said:

Controversial opinion: other than the cringey dream sequences, "The Godsister" is a decent episode. The telephone line construction storyline is pretty good. 

Though, I somewhat call into question Miss MacGregor's later claim that she ad libbed Harriet SHOUTING 'WALNUT GRO-OH_OVE!!! at the top of her lungs which caused the poor lineman to fall off the tall telephone pole.

I mean, if it hadn't been scripted (and he wasn't supposed to fall off), what would the point of having had a stunt person climb up to the top of the telephone pole have been with the camera rolling?

 Maybe they had him climb the pole and fall off after deciding to keep Miss MacGregor's alleged ad-lib but I have my doubts.

[The Wild Sow]

I CAN'T be the only one who noticed the irony of Home Again airing back-to-back with Once Upon A Time!

Laura's "writer's integrity" causing her to refuse her publisher's instruction to include more drama and excitement in her books - to the extent that they end up not being published for another 40 years.

Followed by Laura's entirely fictional, non-existent adoptive brother (added to the show for drama!) - causing all sorts of excitement with his entirely fictional, non-existent morphine addiction!

[debraran]

5 hours ago, Superclam said:

Controversial opinion: other than the cringey dream sequences, "The Godsister" is a decent episode. The telephone line construction storyline is pretty good. 

The subplot was fine, I felt bad for the Greenbush twins when I read (maybe falsely) that ML did that 90 minute show to hush up their parents who wanted a little more air time. I thought it odd to do 90 but then was reminded that they weren't shown often, I hardly ever see them in the rotations. He knew they wouldn't rerun a 90 min show on summer time when the slot was 60. If that is true, it's not nice and the script was horrible for Carrie, Someone wrote that dribble. They also had Ma and the girls unusually angry with Carrie. I'm not a writer but I think any of us could have written her script better. The twins also said in an interview they were proud he only did one take for some scenes, he said they didn't need to do more. Was that to make it bad?. Was it her age? I think as you said, the show is made worse than it was.

That said, I do believe Katherine had the idea for the phone, she gave Michael ideas ALL the time. She pushed others to do the same, although they did it usually only once. (Charlotte Stewart, Hersha and Karen were 3) She had some good ideas, like falling in the stream with the blind children and other things. I don't think it happened all at once, but rehearsing she might have thrown it in even if he nixed it before. I so wish I could read her bio. ; )

Edited January 15 by debraran

[jason88cubs]

On 1/14/2024 at 2:46 PM, crazy8s said:

I watched Country Girls the other day. Things that were interesting.

They have supposedly lived in Walnut Grove how long since ep 1?  The girls were in town for Harvest of Friends.

But in Country Girls Caroline has not met the Olesons or Miss Beadle, so Caroline hasn't been to town or church yet? Really??

Caroline takes eggs to sell at the mercantile for the first time, but some how amasses enough credit from selling eggs to buy the expensive yard goods for a dress? (minus any days she sold the brown eggs to the invisible men at the mill)

Ma sews not one, but two smaller dresses in the evenings and no one notices the smaller size?

 

 

good catch!

[jason88cubs]

Also regarding the comment above about Caroline not meeting  miss Beadle wouldn't she have gone to the school to introduce Laura and Mary to Miss Bedale before their first day?

 

I can't imagine they just sent Luara and Mary off to school without telling anyone they would be going there

 

(in walks Mary and Laura)

Miss beadle: who are you

kids: i'm mary and i'm laura we just moved here after Pa traveled us all over the place

miss beadle: oh ok well come on in

 

laura: my pa believes in cash  on a barrell!

 

miss beadle: oh does he now!!!

mary: and my ma makes some mean apple fritters

miss beadle: OH WELL I HOPE TO TRY THEM!!!

 

[crazy8s]

They did actually apparently send them off on their own.

When the are hanging in the back Miss Beadle says "do come in" and then you must be the new girls who live by Plum Creek. (possible she says Ingalls girls)

Laura and Mary go to the desk and give their names to be written in the school book. They tell her Ma has been teaching them. Mary "But I can read!",  Laura "I can't, but know my abc's".  They show her Ma's books.

Also I expect had the Ingalls parents met Miss Beadle ahead, they would have known the girls needed a slate and slate pencil before day one of school.😂

Also Laura goes into much detail describing Miss Beadle to her parents. It doesn't seem like either had met her.

I just found it interesting that Caroline, who's biggest things while crossing the prairie were wanting to go to town and see people, the Sabbath and to have the girls in school. But in the whole time Pa worked two jobs in town, built an entire house, broke his ribs and saw doc Baker etc, Ma had apparently not been to town even for church services where she would have met the Olesons and Miss Beadle. 😀

I have seen the episode many times and never thought about any of that until I saw it last week.

 

 

Edited January 17 by crazy8s

[jason88cubs]

wow

 

I can't imagine parents not at least meeting the teacher before sending them to school

[Blergh]

FWIW, I think it's possible Miss MacGregor might have suggested Harriet screaming' WALNUT GROAH_OHVE!! ' into the switchboard mouthpiece before the actual filming (and ML agreed it would have helped the scenes and added it in) but not so much ad-libbing  during the actual filming as both the lineman falling off the telephone pole and the switchboard installer's actions and dialogue wouldn't have fit Harriet's scream had their dialogue/directions not been previously altered to have their reactions to it match.

[jason88cubs]

I can't help but laugh everytime I think of Charles walking into the mercantile asking for stuff with no cash and Nels has a perfectly good reason why he can't help Charles without cash and Charles storms out of the store lol

 

:I UNDERSTAND!!!!" (THROWS OPEN THE DOOR)

[CountryGirl]

Not "Cash on the Barrel Charles!"

[crazy8s]

No plow and seed for 10 acres on credit for you Pa.

Then the very next episode has his child in same store saying "Pa always says cash on the barrel", over a penny slate pencil. 😂

Edited January 17 by crazy8s

[Egg McMuffin]

I really think they should have renamed the show something flashier when Charles and family decamped to Burr Oak. And not that “New Beginning” crap - how boring. How about:

• The Dark Secrets of Walnut Grove
• Laura Ingalls Wilder’s Place
• Laura Loves Manly

[debraran]

13 hours ago, crazy8s said:

No plow and seed for 10 acres on credit for you Pa.

Then the very next episode has his child in same store saying "Pa always says cash on the barrel", over a penny slate pencil. 😂

Hard to believe the first episode had the girls getting a penny and then soon after they are so poor they can't afford a pencil. Something I noticed years ago was just about every other person in Walnut Grove was better off. They were always buying things at the store, widows especially, but Charles working (sadly) as a farmer, working at the mill, being able to fix wheels and build cupboards and all that. It seemed they lived on Ma's brown eggs sometimes.   Luckily the other well off people in WG could buy them. : )

I didn't mind the "little house" it wss the focus of the show for many years but it was odd as he added kids etc. that everyone else's home was nicer and bigger and had "rooms". The Garvey's had doors to their room too! Mrs Whipple's home was nice and she kept that up with just sewing. The Sanderson's had a nice home, just about everyone but Mr Edwards. lol  The very rich had the homes like the Widow Thurman or Harriet but even the pig farmer had a nice house.

I know there were taxes to pay , but they grew a lot of their food or caught it, they needed money for fabric and yarn, Charles needed his coffee, animals but their level of poverty seemed odd compared to others. Maybe if he made it more even.

Edited January 18 by debraran

[Zella]

5 hours ago, debraran said:

Hard to believe the first episode had the girls getting a penny and then soon after they are so poor they can't afford a pencil. Something I noticed years ago was just about every other person in Walnut Grove was better off. They were always buying things at the store, widows especially, but Charles working (sadly) as a farmer, working at the mill, being able to fix wheels and build cupboards and all that. It seemed they lived on Ma's brown eggs sometimes.   Luckily the other well off people in WG could buy them. : )

I didn't mind the "little house" it wss the focus of the show for many years but it was odd as he added kids etc. that everyone else's home was nicer and bigger and had "rooms". The Garvey's had doors to their room too! Mrs Whipple's home was nice and she kept that up with just sewing. The Sanderson's had a nice home, just about everyone but Mr Edwards. lol  The very rich had the homes like the Widow Thurman or Harriet but even the pig farmer had a nice house.

I know there were taxes to pay , but they grew a lot of their food or caught it, they needed money for fabric and yarn, Charles needed his coffee, animals but their level of poverty seemed odd compared to others. Maybe if he made it more even.

I think it makes sense within the context of the real Pa apparently making a lot of poor financial decisions, to the point he wasn't above fleeing in the middle of the night to avoid paying debts. It would have been an interesting facet to explore of Pa being a beloved husband and father by his family but, as to quote my Granny, "unable to manage a setting hen." 

I don't think Landon was interested in depicting that, though, because it would have made him less of an idol. So, we get the consequences of his bad decisions while skirting around the causes. 

[jason88cubs]

I never understood the whole adding on to the house for  a kitchen but couldn't make a extra bed for Laura or Mary?

[CountryGirl]

20 hours ago, jason88cubs said:

I never understood the whole adding on to the house for  a kitchen but couldn't make a extra bed for Laura or Mary?

Priorities.

Ma needed more room to make Pa's meals and coffee and popcorn.

[Blergh]

10 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

Priorities.

Ma needed more room to make Pa's meals and coffee and popcorn.

Where? That kitchen looked barely big enough to singe a Pop Tart!

[debraran]

9 hours ago, Blergh said:

Where? That kitchen looked barely big enough to singe a Pop Tart!

Well didn't Chris get cut off from finishing? He would have designed Ma a much better kitchen for sure. ; )  While he was at it, probably would have added an additional room for the many guests that stop by the Ingall's.

[Blergh]

On 1/17/2024 at 9:59 PM, Egg McMuffin said:

I really think they should have renamed the show something flashier when Charles and family decamped to Burr Oak. And not that “New Beginning” crap - how boring. How about:

• The Dark Secrets of Walnut Grove
• Laura Ingalls Wilder’s Place
• Laura Loves Manly

How about  other titles such as:

Walnut Grove Makes Peyton Place Look Like Walton's Mountain

Laura Ingalls Wilder's  Even Wilder Bunch

Laura Loathes Manly [Who Wonders If He'd Been Better Off Giving Nellie His Robe  Instead of 'Beth']

 

Edited January 20 by Blergh