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The Starling City Times: News and Media about Arrow

Grammaeryn

By Grammaeryn
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Morrigan2575
Morrigan2575

I always find it odd when people blame the writing for LLs failure. I'll give them that for Lauiver because of the whole cheating thing but, let's be honest if SA/KC had the chemistry that SA/EBR had,

lemotomato
lemotomato

Sorry, that argument rings really hollow when the show has had a history of killing off/mistreating other female characters without a peep of protest from those same "concerned" people. Moira Queen, S

ComicFan777
ComicFan777

I know that this is supposed to be Felicity's dark arc, but...Felicity desperately doing whatever she can to save people (damn the consequences down the road) doesn't make me think that she's losing w

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Carrie Ann

Carrie Ann

(edited)
Oliver was kind of in a relationship with Mckenna hall in season 1 and Kind of in a relationship with Sara in season 2. Season 3 was the only season he wasn't in a relationship and well that was the not a fun season at all. Oliver was in a relationship with Felicity in season 4 and except for the BMD it was nice. And I'm saying that being not an "Only Olicity" shipper. I like seeing Oliver happy and he has been pretty happy since Felicity agreed to travel with him at the end of last season.

 

 

I counted Sara in my tally (so, 15 with Felicity, 5 with Sara), but not McKenna because I didn't feel like they'd moved to "relationship" status before she left town (despite Oliver's bizarro offer to move to Coast City with her) (oh, S1 Oliver, you sure were an unformed ball of Play-Doh). I also didn't count Helena for the same reasons, but even if you count both of those, we're up to maybe 25 episodes out of 85? I think Mr. No-Love-For-Serious-Superheroes up there should be satisfied with that figure.

Edited by Carrie Ann
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tv echo

tv echo

Short review but great point...

 

Arrow Made One Great Decision and One Big Mistake
Esther Inglis-Arkell  35 minutes ago
http://io9.gizmodo.com/arrow-made-one-great-decision-and-one-big-mistake-1761258689

...  Darhk has a totem from which he gains strength, and when the team break the totem he’s depowered. This last is a great plot development. We were all sick of seeing the Arrow team rush out to fight Darhk and immediately be defeated by magic over and over. (Even Darhk remarked how repetitive it was.) Now we don’t know what will happen next, and it’s exciting.
 

But Arrow makes one mistake—not with the story but with the directing. Here is the first scene of the episode.
[embedded video clip of Felicity struggling to walk in therapy]
 

And here is the last.
[embedded video clip of the last 5 minutes of the episode]
 

This episode is, in many ways, Felicity’s story. It’s Felicity who goes from happily trusting her fiancé to realizing she can’t be married to this man, it’s her struggle to walk that bookends the episode, and it’s her face we should have seen as she walks out. I don’t know why missing that shot was so important, but it is. We should have looked at her.

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tv echo

tv echo

Two Examiner reviews of 415 by two different critics...

 

'Arrow' recap: Space and sacrifice
Meredith Jacobs  February 24, 2016
http://www.examiner.com/article/arrow-recap-space-and-sacrifice

As stated above, Oliver needed to face consequences the moment he made the decision to lie to Felicity about William. Every time he went to Central City, it was another lie, and it's even worse that he lets her think that no one knows until it comes out who does one by one. (Is this why Felicity's not returning Barry's calls as he mentioned on this week's episode of "The Flash"?) Hopefully this will also allow them to spend some more time on storylines that were rushed. Yes, Felicity's walking again, only a handful of episodes after being told she wouldn't, but her feelings about her paralysis were barely addressed, other than when it came to how she felt about her place on the team. Her father came back into her life after 18 years, and the conversation after she gave him over to the police quickly turned to one about Malcolm and another proposal from Oliver. And as already mentioned, Oliver has to learn what it means to be in a relationship before he and Felicity can get married. They both admitted in "Lost Souls" that it's new to them, and hopefully this makes them stronger together in the end.

 

'Arrow' 4x15 'Taken' Review: Vixen drops by
Allison Nichols  February 24, 2016
http://www.examiner.com/review/arrow-4x15-taken-review-vixen-drops-by

Honestly, it’s a little hard to decide how to feel about this hour, mainly because the baby mama drama was so ridiculous to begin with that it should have never happened. Everyone had a different opinion on the lie and on William, and it’s hard to decide who was completely right.
 

The main point that the baby mama drama served was to break up Oliver and Felicity. That’s it. We didn’t see Oliver develop any kind of relationship with William, so it’s not like Oliver grew as a human being once he became a father. He didn’t learn anything from being a father, which is a shame because it could have been an interesting way to have Oliver reevaluate his life and his complicated relationship with the truth.

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(edited)

411mania's negative review of 415 - rated it a 6.5 (I thought that Oliver never talked to Felicity about whether he should be in his son's life?)...

 

Arrow 4.15 Review – ‘Taken’
February 24, 2016 | Posted by Anthony Falco
http://411mania.com/movies/arrow-4-15-review-taken/

At the same time, one has to really feel for Felicity: she finally has something good going for her – even if it is not moving along so quickly – and she has this thrown in her lap. This fact is made worse when she finds out that almost everyone knew except her: Barry, Merlyn and Thea were all able to previously guess it....
*  *  *
... Either way, this sends Samantha, aka William’s mother into a panic: she starts wrongfully blaming Queen for everything – the character basically does nothing else this entire episode, even when Oliver is legitimately the only person who could help. However, he gets her to stop yelling in this scene by coming out with the truth and saying that he is the Arrow.
*  *  *
... Now, I do not have a problem with Megalyn Echikunwoke per se, but both the character’s intro and the manifestation of her powers instantly reminds you that this is an under-budgeted comic book show. Her “like a woman” line should be empowering, yet it comes off as awkward: there is just a better way to write it and deliver it. And honestly, the way her powers look is really bad, even for Arrow’s standards....
*  *  *
On top of this, Laurel talks to her dad about Oliver cheating – when Queen brings Samantha to the lair, she admits that William was conceived when him and Laurel were still together. The result is her sort of breaking down in front of Quentin: now, this could have been an interesting dynamic for the show to explore, however, it appears like it is just thrown in there to give Laurel something to do. It does not move the character forward and kind of makes her appear weak: again, if properly explored, it could have worked, yet it fails thanks to the cheap writing....
*  *  *
So this all leads to one of the worst actions sequences of the show: I honestly think ‘Taken’ establishes a new low for Arrow’s set pieces. The choreography and editing is just downright clumsy: with the latter, sometimes shots come in too early, resulting in the heroes appearing motionless. There is simply no flow to the fights. And do they even care about hiding the stunt doubles? I have complained about this in the past, but tonight you could see Darhk’s double’s wig falling off.
*  *  *
After this, he chats with Vixen and Felicity about whether he should be in his son’s life. Felicity, along with Diggle, believes that even with all the craziness, he needs to be there for his child. On the other hand, Vixen thinks that he should give William a normal childhood and stay out of it. Now, one would assume that he will listen to his fiancé, but he takes Vixen’s advice to heart: something that will blow up in his face by the end of tonight’s episode.
*  *  *
This scene is by far the best part of tonight: Amell does a really good job of portraying the impact of this sacrifice. However, this all leads to a massive fight between him and Felicity, who calls off the wedding. She is not disgusted about him keeping his son a secret, but that he was making another decision on his own. Basically, she thinks that he is not ready for marriage and she does have a point. ..
*  *  *
The 411: ‘Taken’ is certainly one of the weaker aspects of the fourth season. Felicity and Oliver are definitely the best portion of tonight, but nothing about William’s kidnapping seemed urgent – even with the threat of a character death looming over it all. Also with several episodes left, everyone knows that there is no way that this ends the Darhk storyline: so there is no tension in the conflict. Worst of all, after losing to Damien the entire season, how they succeed ultimately comes across cheap – and he is not even that good of an antagonist. With a few weeks off, let’s hope that Arrow can regroup and finish off strong.
Edited by tv echo
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‘Arrow’ 4×15 review: Pulling a Liam Neeson
BY CAITLIN KELLY   9:54 pm, February 24, 2016
http://www.hypable.com/arrow-4x15-review/

Marriage, Felicity tells Oliver once William has been saved, is about leaning on your partner. Oliver, however, doesn’t know how to do that. And Felicity isn’t ready to commit to a life with someone who pushes her away when he needs her most. She returns her ring and asks for some space. It’s pretty predictable — as is the fact that Felicity is eventually going to come around sooner rather than later.
 

Perhaps the most startling part of the episode comes when Felicity, who previously attended physical therapy to see if Curtis’ spinal implant worked, feels her leg move. She slowly rises from her chair in shock and stumbles out of the apartment. While I understand Felicity asked for space, Oliver should probably have followed her out since there is no telling how long those effects would last. She could collapse just outside the door, and he’d never know.
*  *  *
The one thing that rang false for me with her [Mari] in this episode was her speech to Oliver about pushing William away so he could keep his childhood. This is too much along the lines of the way male heroes treat their love interests in comic book stories, taking their agency away by making decisions about what they get to know and when. William may be a child, but when he gets Oliver’s video as an adult, I have to imagine he’s going to be incredibly resentful.
 

Diggle offers a counterpart to her advice, saying he’s able to balance being a father and a vigilante by being with his daughter every night. Diggle and Lyla are heroes in their own rights with dangerous lives, but they do their best to balance their lives in the dark with being loving parents to baby Sara. That seems like a far healthier approach for everyone involved.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

DC Comics tweeted a link to this guy's review of 415 (what a surprise, the guy loved the episode and doesn't like Olicity)...

 

-- Says that Felicity later understands Oliver was right to keep his son a secret from her.

-- Thinks Laurel still has feelings for Oliver (references Laurel's realization that Oliver got this girl pregnant when he was dating her, and Laurel's prior reaction to Oliver & Felicity's engagement).
-- Doesn't understand why Oliver puts so much trust in Malcolm.
-- Thinks Felicity walking again so soon was ridiculous.
-- Doesn't like Oliver & Felicity's relationship on the show.
-- Thought episode was really good overall (8 or 8-1/2 out of 10).

 

Edited by tv echo
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Ann Mack

Ann Mack

(edited)

DC Comics tweeted a link to this guy's review of 415 (what a surprise, the guy loved the episode and doesn't like Olicity)...

 

-- Says that Felicity later understands Oliver was right to keep his son a secret from her.

-- Thinks Laurel still has feelings for Oliver (references Laurel's realization that Oliver got this girl pregnant when he was dating her, and Laurel's prior reaction to Oliver & Felicity's engagement).

-- Doesn't understand why Oliver puts so much trust in Malcolm.

-- Thinks Felicity walking again so soon was ridiculous.

-- Doesn't like Oliver & Felicity's relationship on the show.

-- Thought episode was really good overall (8 or 8-1/2 out of 10).

 

These are the low brain cell count individuals the writers generally tailor their testosterone story lines too. I tried to make it through I think theStreamTV broadcast and  just had to stop (after skipping around through some of their comments) when the Jack Hind guy commented the women were driven by too much emotion in the episode when actually Oliver was way more emotional than anyone else other than the mother last night IMO. IMO it was the women who were making shit happen lol! Also, the male host made the comment of "I thought Felicity was finally going to come around to the right side in seeing Oliver had no choice". So yeah this fool above is probably of the same male demographic who thinks like those other 2 and the dangerous part is they ALL have a microphone and a means to spew their ignorance IMO!

Edited by Ann Mack
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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

I just read a review (not posting link because I don't want to give the site any hits) where the guy thought Felicity was being childish and unreasonable for walking out on Oliver just because he was forced to keep his son a secret from her.  The guy said that, even though he (the guy) wasn't married, he didn't think Felicity was being a supportive spouse.  Huh?!

 

When I read comments like that, I can't help wondering how the guy would feel if he was engaged and his fiancee didn't tell him about a secret child.

Edited by tv echo
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NumberCruncher

NumberCruncher

I tried to make it through I think theStreamTV broadcast and  just had to stop (after skipping around through some of their comments) when the Jack Hind guy commented the women were driven by too much emotion in the episode when actually Oliver was way more emotional than anyone else other than the mother last night IMO.

Not surprising. It's an inherent problem across all male-led superhero shows. They alone are allowed to be emotional and cry and it's considered good drama, but the second a female character does it she's being "too emotional". No one need look further than Barry on "The Flash" as a prime example since he cries more than any male TV character I've ever seen. And Oliver definitely cried more this episode than Felicity did but since she's a girl, it's most definitely not allowed.

I just read a review (not posting link because I don't want to give the site any hits) where the guy thought Felicity was being childish and unreasonable for walking out on Oliver just because he was forced to keep his son a secret from her.  The guy said that, even though he (the guy) wasn't married, he didn't think Felicity was being a supportive spouse.  Huh?!

I saw lots of tweets last night to that effect--especially saying that Oliver had no obligation to tell Felicity at all about the kid...ever. Sadly, I think that kind of thinking is more telling about how some people view supposed committed relationships than about the show, but I digress... Never mind that I think it all misses the point completely since the show basically went out its way to highlight that everyone and their brother other than Felicity already knew about the kid.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Los Angeles Times reviewer thought that Oliver & Felicity were both right and both wrong, and that 415 was an "above-average chapter of Arrow" - he also wrote a comment that made me want to stand up and cheer (my use of the word "cheer" is a clue!)...

 

Ollicity no more! Oliver trades one headache for another in 'Arrow's' 'Taken'
By James Queally  FEBRUARY 25, 2016
http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/herocomplex/la-et-hc-arrow-taken-recap-20160224-story.html

Felicity's decision to break off their marriage, for the moment, works beautifully because it's really hard to pick a side here. You can understand Felicity's sense of betrayal over Oliver's decision to hide William's existence just as easily as you can defend Oliver's reasons for doing so. They're both right, they're both wrong, they're both hurting and they both love each other in a way that jumps off the screen.
 

You have to cheer for these two to get back together (unless you share Darhk's stone-cold heart, of course, you jerk), and that's how you make a viewer care about a relationship storyline in a show that's mostly about people in masks punching each other.
 

It doesn't hurt that Stephen Amell and Emily Bett Rickards brought their A-game to the dramatic scenes this week. Rickards more or less bored a hole through Oliver as she realized how many people knew about William, and it was hard to watch Amell tear up twice over as he gave up his son only to immediately lose Felicity seconds later.
*  *  *
The show's actions sequences have been less than thrilling to me this year, to the point that I have started to wonder if each episode is using random stock footage of Team Arrow pummeling Ghost soldiers that were shot in the same weekend. This would be less noticeable if the clashes with Darhk weren't "rinse, repeat" (as the bad guy put it) images of Oliver, Thea and others being force choked to near-death over and over again.
*  *  *
Megalyn Echikunwoke is a solid addition to the ever-expanding hero roster as Vixen, though I have to question the decision to hinge such a pivotal season-long plot point to a character who might be unknown to a large part of the audience. Maybe I missed the boat here, but I couldn't be the only one who had to look up the CW "Seed" Web series to reorient myself...
*  *  *
There were flashbacks. Nothing happened. Check back next week.

Edited by tv echo
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tv echo

(edited)

Three If By Space's generally positive review of 415 (rated it 8/10)...

 

Arrow 415 Review: “Taken” Features Fatherhood, Sacrifice, and Vixen
By: Alisha Bjorklund February 25, 2016
http://www.threeifbyspace.net/2016/02/arrow-415-review-taken-features-fatherhood-sacrifice-and-vixen/#.VtBflPkrLIU

Her most interesting contribution to the episode was the advice she gave to Oliver. At face value, her message was a good one. She encouraged Oliver to let his son have a normal life away from the craziness that is Oliver’s life. But that advice is a double-edged sword. What is supposed to be sacrifice for a child’s greater good is also comparable to abandonment, and Oliver ends up making an impossible choice.
*  *  *
As we all knew it would, the reveal that Oliver had a son – revealed by Damien Darhk, no less – caused a lot of trouble for Oliver and Felicity’s relationship. Oliver, as usual, was caught in a no-win situation, and like he said, he’s trying his damnedest to do the right thing. But Felicity is in a justifiable position, too, and it’s no surprise she told Oliver she needs space. We first saw her reaction in this year’s crossover event, when she first found out about William (and then conveniently forgot thanks to Barry’s time traveling).
 

This was the biggest test to Olicity yet, and even though they’ve in essence broken up, I have no doubt that this is the end of Arrow‘s exploration of their relationship. As much as their scenes were dramatic and entertaining, I can’t help but criticize the ending. Felicity suddenly standing (after minimal on-screen physically therapy) and literally walking out on Oliver was incredibly cheesy and unbelievable. It left me more than befuddled; it left me feeling insulted for both the treatment of her character and for the treatment of me as a viewer.
*  *  *
The flashbacks this week finally starting incorporating the magic that has been dominating this season’s present-day plot lines. Unfortunately, it didn’t make the flashbacks all that interesting. Other than Conklin’s ghost showing up animal-spirit style (gotta make the tie-in to Vixen, I suppose), the flashbacks didn’t do much. So that’s all I’ll say on the matter. Let’s move on!

Edited by tv echo
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looptab

looptab

(edited)

Here's another consequence to having ten thousands masks and having to devote time to showcase them and their fights: what should be pivotal battles become an afterthought, cause they use up the time on everybody else's rather than on the ones that should matter a tad more. Case in point: this week's final round with Darhk and the 30 seconds duel with Merlyn.

Edited by looptab
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tv echo

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(edited)

TV Equals review of 415 - ITA with everything Jessica Breaux wrote in this article...

 

Arrow “Taken” Review (Season 4, Episode 15)
Jessica Breaux   February 25, 2016
http://www.tvequals.com/2016/02/25/arrow-taken-review-season-4-episode-15/

To paraphrase Dr. Albert Einstein, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing, the same way, and expecting different results. By that definition, I’m pretty sure Oliver is insane. I don’t know why he continues to lie to the people closest to him in the name of protecting them when it never works out well. Ever. This time, Felicity was the victim of Oliver’s lies. The thing is, and I believe Felicity even said it, it’s not that Oliver has a son that’s the problem. It’s the fact that he didn’t tell her he had a son. He had his reasons for not telling her, and in his mind they’re perfectly legitimate reasons. However, at the end of the day, you cannot say that you love someone if you’re unwilling to be honest with them. Additionally, Oliver makes too many unilateral decisions that aren’t his to make. He and Felicity are supposed to be in a relationship. When you’re in a relationship, you have to consider how your actions (or inactions) are going to affect the other person. The only way you can do that is by talking with them; letting them know what you’re thinking so they can weigh in on it. Ultimately, the decision may still have fallen on Oliver’s shoulders, but whatever decision he made also affects Felicity. He should have shown her the respect of allowing her to have input. As much as I love and want Olicity to be a thing, Felicity was right to walk away. She was angry and hurt, and Oliver is going to have a lot of begging to do. He also needs to grow up and realize that he can’t keep treating people he professes to love the way he has been.
*  *  *
... Samantha was just as young and stupid as Oliver. Maybe even moreso because she knew Oliver was dating Laurel when she slept with him. But all of that is in the past. In the years since, she’s grown up and changed. Is she the only one allowed to do that? How is it she can see that she’s grown up and change, but can’t see the same is true of Oliver. I don’t really get it. Samantha was all about how William is HER son, so she’s the one who gets to dictate terms. But when it came to a choice between going to the meet and saving William or getting Darhk’s totem and saving the entire city, she suddenly acted as if Oliver had a say in what to do about William. Uh…what? So he’s YOUR son when lives aren’t at stake, but he’s OUR son when lives are at stake? Go sit down somewhere, Samantha.
*  *  *
Then there’s Thea and Malcolm. I’m pretty much just done. I don’t know why Thea keeps acting like Malcolm Merlyn is anything other than a monster. Like, I don’t know why she even bothered asking him whether he’s the one who turned William over to Darhk. Of course he’s the one who did it, and I don’t know why Thea is even surprised at this point. How many times does Malcolm have to show her that he’s a cold, selfish crazy person before she believes him? I just had to roll my eyes when she talked about how sorry she is that she denounced Robert Queen as her father because that never made sense to me. Being a father is more than just biology....
Edited by tv echo
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tv echo

4YourExcitement review of 415 - ITA with everything that's quoted here (but not with everything in the article)...

 

OLIVER ENLISTS THE HELP OF VIXEN TO BRING BACK HIS SON IN THIS WEEK’S ARROW
Verena Cote | February 25, 2016
http://www.4ye.co.uk/2016/02/oliver-enlists-the-help-of-vixen-to-bring-back-his-son-in-this-weeks-arrow/

One thing that keeps upsetting us is the fact that Oliver uses Samantha’s ultimatum to justify his lies. Sure, she told him not to tell anyone about the child, not even Felicity, but the Oliver Queen we met in the first couple of seasons would have found another way, he always did. He should have remembered that there are no secrets between them, that Felicity told him about Thea being Malcolm’s daughter and she didn’t even think twice about it. Oliver made the conscious choice to keep William from Felicity, while plenty of other people knew about his son’s existence, and he should have been held responsible for it, too. People should have been more upset with him, especially Laurel, as Oliver had cheated on her back then and it would be more than reasonable for her to be angry, and Diggle because he has always been the voice of reason, the one who would guide Oliver on the right path. Oliver’s excuses shouldn’t have just been accepted the way they were.
*  *  *
Episode #4.15 ends with Oliver having lost everything he thought he would be able to protect by lying. He not only lost his son, but also his fiancé. He surely won’t go down without a fight, but to see him so completely broken is a stark contrast to the practically giddy man we met in the season four premiere....
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"Additionally, Oliver makes too many unilateral decisions that aren’t his to make."

I love this quote because it applies not only to Felicity but THEA. Oh my gosh Oliver has made decision after decision for Thea, and he really needs to learn to either talk it out or let her make her own choices.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

I'm really surprised that media reviewers aren't commenting on the fact that Oliver quickly revealed to Samantha the secret identites of himself and his entire team (without their consent), as well as the secret location of the Arrowcave.  Samantha is a woman that he hasn't seen for 10 years, who deceived him for 10 years, and who made an unreasonable demand on him - yet he trusts her with such deep secrets?

Edited by tv echo
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(edited)

Two WhatCulture articles on 415...

 

Arrow Season 4: 18 WTF Moments From ‘Taken’
Andrew Pollard   26 Feb 2016
http://whatculture.com/tv/arrow-season-4-18-wtf-moments-from-taken.php

Poor Felicity.
Not only has she now found out that her hubby-to-be has in fact got a secret son, she also finds out that other people already knew about this.
First Thea reveals that she already knew about William, then it comes out that Barry Allen also knows about Ollie’s son, and then it’s let out that even Malcolm Merlyn was in on the secret.
At least Felicity can take some solace in the fact that Diggle and Laurel were also in the dark on this one.
*  *  *
Ooh, talk about awkward…
With Samantha having been brought into the Arrowcave and introduced to the members of Team Arrow by Oliver, we got to see Samantha speak to Laurel Lance for the first time in years. After all, the pair already know each from years and years ago, when Laurel and Ollie were an item. It’s just a tad awkward, though, as during this time, Samantha was one of Oliver’s many ‘other women’.
Still, Laurel was cordial enough with Samantha, which is an upgrade on the usual d*ckish reactions of the Laurel Lance character.
*  *  *
Laurel Lance is totally over it. Totally over the fact that Oliver cheated on her multiple times years ago. Honest.
In a surprising WTF moment, we got to see Laurel actually totally not over the problems of dating Oliver Queen all of those years ago. In an emotional moment, she shares an embrace with her dear old dad, Quentin, as the reappearance of Samantha has seemingly brought back old memories.

 

Arrow Season 4: 13 Questions We’re Asking After Taken
James Hunt   26 Feb 2016
http://whatculture.com/tv/arrow-season-4-13-questions-were-asking-after-taken.php

Unfortunately we don’t get to see Stephen Amell go full Liam Neeson (though perhaps that’s something only he himself should ever attempt), but nonetheless, he will find you, he won’t actually be able to hurt you, and he definitely won’t kill you… yet.
*  *  *
Damien Darhk: supervillain, evil genius, capable of planning kidnapping, various intricate attacks on Star City and its people, and oh, yes, potentially destroying the world. Also, apparently, a bit of an idiot.

He comes into contact with both Oliver Queen and Green Arrow in this episode, and then actually calls Ollie up to tell him about “his friend’s” visit. Somehow, Darhk hasn’t managed to connect the dots that Oliver and Green Arrow are one and the same. Sure, part of that will come from Merlyn disguising himself as Green Arrow while Oliver was there, but still, the clues keep on stacking up.
*  *  *
Well, half of Arrow’s fanbase is going to be celebrating at the end of this episode, and another half left weeping. Oliver and Felicity – Olicity – is over. For now.
*  *  *
Are they done for good? They certainly are for a while, since she’s not wearing her wedding ring in the flashforward, but what about beyond that? Felicity is a very popular character, but can you go back to having her around if her and Oliver aren’t together? I’m not so sure how well that dynamic will work, but also it’d be a huge call to not have her on the show (and, frankly, a terrible one).
 

The other thing to note here is how upset Laurel is after meeting Samantha – was that deliberately hinting she might still have feelings for Oliver? One of the complaints about Olicity is that it gets in the way of the true Green Arrow romance, so the way could be paved for that to properly happen (a problem there being just how unlikable Laurel’s character has generally been on this show). Another thing that draws complaints about Oliver and Felicity’s relationship is how much it can dominate the show. It may be over, but don’t expect that drama to end anytime soon.

Edited by tv echo
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KenyaJ

KenyaJ

(edited)

Another thing that draws complaints about Oliver and Felicity’s relationship is how much it can dominate the show. It may be over, but don’t expect that drama to end anytime soon.

 

Sorry, but this is super annoying, Mr. Reviewer. Oliver and Felicity's relationship doesn't dominate the show in any way, shape or form. It dominates the chatter about the show, but that's a different matter entirely. 

Edited by KenyaJ
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Ann Mack

Ann Mack

(edited)

Sorry, but this is super annoying, Mr. Reviewer. Oliver and Felicity's relationship doesn't dominate the show in any way, shape or form. It dominates the chatter about the show, but that's a different matter entirely. 

I also loved how he said 1/2 of the fan base would be celebrating and the other 1/2 would be weeping. I don't think he knows the full force of those who like having Oliver and Felicity together (Olicity Forever lol). So IMO I think a few is the estimate of the overall Arrow fandom are opposed to Oliver and Felicity and the majority of those nay sayers are probably due to the comic books.

Edited by Ann Mack
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Ann Mack

Ann Mack

(edited)

Go sit down somewhere Samantha is really my feelings about her entire story.

Well she pissed me off the whole episode but when those damn writers tried to give her a Felicity-like moment with that bullshit she spewed to Oliver this is not verbatim but "go get our son and stop that son of a bitch" I wanted to burn her garbage ass at the stake. She is not worthy to ever try to utter inspiration to Oliver that is reserved for Felicity and sometimes Diggle but mostly Felicity lol. It really made me RME into a mini migraine. So glad this BS story, her and her kid are gone!

Edited by Ann Mack
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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

As previously posted, Laura Hurley (Examiner, CinemaBlend, WhatCulture) is co-hosting a panel on superheroes and shipping this weekend at Wizard World's Cleveland Comic Con (hope someone records and posts on youtube)...

SATURDAY, FEBRUARY 27TH
*  *  *
11:00 – 11:45AM SHOT THROUGH THE HEART: SUPERHEROES AND SHIPPING IN A SOCIAL MEDIA AGE (ROOM 26A)
To ship or not to ship? That is the question that faces many superhero fans when it comes to social media. Television journalist Laura Hurley and social media maestra Corinne Huntley will tackle everything from the online vocabulary of shipping to why wanting a little love along with the action isn't a bad thing for superhero series.

http://wizardworld.com/comiccon/cleveland/programming-cleveland.html

 

I wonder if she'll still have time to write her usual in-depth review of 415?  I hope so.

Edited by tv echo
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JenMD

JenMD

Am I missing stuff that might have been posted in the Spoiler thread, or was Emily's interview with EOnline the only post-ep interview?  I feel like we usually hear more from EPs/actors after an ep where so many big things happen.

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

After this, he chats with Vixen and Felicity about whether he should be in his son’s life. Felicity, along with Diggle, believes that even with all the craziness, he needs to be there for his child. On the other hand, Vixen thinks that he should give William a normal childhood and stay out of it. Now, one would assume that he will listen to his fiancé, but he takes Vixen’s advice to heart: something that will blow up in his face by the end of tonight’s episode.

*  *  *

This scene is by far the best part of tonight: Amell does a really good job of portraying the impact of this sacrifice. However, this all leads to a massive fight between him and Felicity, who calls off the wedding.

 

This was quoted a page back from a review and I think it is misleading.  Oliver does tell Felicity at some point that he hoped Samantha would change her mind about him not telling her and he did express the desire to have her in his son's life and Felicity may have said it's important to be in the kids life ( I honestly don't remember details) but it was part of an interrupted conversation that never reached a discussion level, just an acknowledgment that Samantha had taken the blame for why Oliver wasn't supposed to tell her.  She wasn't commenting on what Oliver should do at all.  She mostly just listened to Oliver (who didn't say much).

 

And while the end result was a break up, there was no massive fight.  It was very quiet and short.  So yeah, a very weirdly worded review. 

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bijoux

bijoux

It's more of a rewrite than a review. I don't remember Felicity giving any comment on whether Oliver should be a part of the kid's life or not. All there was was her giving a smile after Oliver said that he wanted the opportunity for her to be in William's life as well.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Craig Wack (Pajiba) and Tatiana Torres talk about Arrow 415 (starts at 1:40:40, you can drag cursor forward and audio will pick right up)...

 

Agents of GEEK podcast Episode 17
Posted on 02/26/2016
http://agentsofgeekpodcast.com/wordpress/

 

-- Craig said it was another episode that "just laid there until the last 2 or 3 minutes."

-- Tatiana said there was some good stuff but some "horrible stuff".  She is also "so done with the island."
-- Tatiana: "It was almost kinda silly how fast her legs worked."
-- Craig was surprised at how quickly they broke up Oliver & Felicity considering how well they portrayed the couple, but now fears they will now go back to "the depths of season 3" when Felicity was completely defined by her relationship with Oliver.

Edited by tv echo
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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Another Den of Geek review of 415 - this time written by Caroline Preece...

 

Arrow season 4 episode 15 review: Taken
Caroline Preece 29 Feb 2016 - 13:00
http://www.denofgeek.com/tv/arrow/39140/arrow-season-4-episode-15-review-taken

Heroes can't be happy, especially if they're the 'dark', 'avengey' type of hero. Television just can't cope with happy couples and, in addition, audiences for superhero shows expect a certain amount of drama. Forbidden love, girls in refrigerators or other insurmountable obstacles, whatever the writers come up with we can be sure that, if the main character is happy for even five minutes, it all has to come crashing down.
*  *  *
The difference on Arrow is that the hero's unhappiness is almost totally his doing. For the most part, the show's writers have done a great job writing Oliver in that his negative actions (excluding season three's Ra's storyline) always feel in character. He's guarded and damaged and imbued with a sense of purpose larger than his own personal contentment. He's also dumb, and that's never been more clear.
*  *  *
Insanity is doing things over and over again and expecting a different result, as Felicity says, and at some point this interesting character work that's only occasionally annoying to watch is going to become always annoying to watch, with no other redeeming features.
*  *  *
So Felicity and Oliver have broken up, at least for the time being. She has a valid point, especially after walking in on her husband-to-be making a huge life decision without even mentioning it to her first, but at the same time it's hard not to feel a little bit sorry for Oliver. He's not just keeping William at a distance by pretending to be 'mommy's friend', but sending him away for the better part of a decade just to keep him safe.
 

But is this break-up compelling to watch? For the Olicity fans out there, I'm sure this is as involving as the show will ever get but, for everyone else, it's a complication thrown in for the sake of it. Worse, it's one that we watched play out weeks ago, and knew would play out again. Surely the more interesting thing to do would be to have Oliver learn from that experience and lead events towards an entirely different outcome?
 

But that's not the show Arrow wants to be, and the instinct to keep Oliver in emotional stasis is making less and less sense as we go on. He doesn't have to be likeable, but he should be allowed to grow.

Edited by tv echo
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tv echo

tv echo

'Arrow' Season 4: 3 Reasons Oliver And Felicity Should Stay Separated Until Season 5 [VOTE]
Peter Anthony Feb, 27, 2016, 02:00 PM
http://www.designntrend.com/articles/70946/20160227/arrow-season-4-3-reasons-oliver-and-felicity-should-stay-separated-until-season-5-vote.htm

1. It will enhance the soap opera drama

Felicity and Oliver finally getting married would undoubtedly make "Arrow" cuter than ever, but it would sap some of the show's drama. Married couples are cool, but then there might be a sense of complacency with both of them. What more is there to gain from each other after they've tied the knot? Maybe Oliver will argue about how crime fighting is too dangerous for his new wife, but like ... she's just in front of a computer.

Oliver and Felicity's relationship being once again being on shaky ground will give us something to be frustrated by, indulging our base soap opera-loving instincts. Why stop the fun now?
 

2. It would make sense

On a practical level, Oliver and Felicity being together just doesn't make sense. Oliver kept his son a secret from Felicity for a pretty long time, and that's not something she should be able to get over in just a few months. She was basically about to become a step-mom, and he she had absolutely no idea. She and Oliver have a lot to talk about, and it shouldn't be too pretty.
 

3. There's not enough time for a wedding this season

Felicity and Oliver deserve a grand wedding, and with Damien Darhk hovering around, we don't think there's enough time for that this season. Oliver and Felicity should defeat Darhk first so they can have peace of mind for their special day!

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

This is an interesting article (for more than just the CW show discussion)...

 

What the Winter TCA's and Birth of a Nation Revealed About Netflix and the Future of Television
By Abbey White  |  February 28, 2016  |  12:36pm
http://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2016/02/what-the-winter-tcas-and-birth-of-a-nation-reveale.html

Unfortunately, Pedowitz’s praise may have been premature. While the shows are geared towards a wider audience, the network is still drowning. Its highest rated series is The Flash, which is averaging a 1.4 in the demo. Translated, that’s 1.4% of the over 125,000,000 adults in the 18-49 viewer demographic. The second highest? Arrow with a 1.0. The CW’s two Golden Globe winners Jane the Virgin and Crazy Ex-Girlfriend bring in around 0.3 in the demo and 1 million viewers weekly. To put it nicely, the network isn’t even really a small threat.
 

While The CW is the easiest illustration of traditional TV’s rather rapid decline at the hands of emerging media technology, it’s not the only one affected. This is exactly why NBC came out swinging during the TCA’s. And though it’s easy to see why broadcast would so ferociously fight to stay relevant, frankly the entire debacle felt… well, a little childish. More importantly, the way the data was presented felt intentionally misleading.

Edited by tv echo
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looptab

looptab

(edited)

 

Oliver will argue about how crime fighting is too dangerous for his new wife, but like ... she's just in front of a computer

I don't understand how can people still make this argument after 4 season, after Felicity has been a part of the team since S1, after she shut off any concerns about her security that they don't even raise them anymore in show.

Edited by looptab
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SmallScreenDiva

SmallScreenDiva

Asking for a friend ... not kidding. I tried to help her but I couldn't find the article. It's the one where Stephen Amell says something about talking to the writers or maybe EPs about going back to or remembering what made people fall in love with Arrow ... or words to that effect. Anybody recognize this interview and have the link?

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Chasity

Chasity

Asking for a friend ... not kidding. I tried to help her but I couldn't find the article. It's the one where Stephen Amell says something about talking to the writers or maybe EPs about going back to or remembering what made people fall in love with Arrow ... or words to that effect. Anybody recognize this interview and have the link?

Is it this quote here: 

 

And the most important thing, something that I’ve been hammering this year and I think that we’re going to see a lot in the latter part of this season, is let’s not forget our roots. Let’s not, in the interest of trying new things, forget what people loved about this show in the first place.

If it is: http://www.tvinsider.com/article/75098/arrows-stephen-amell-opens-up-about-olivers-secret-and-his-favorite-episode/?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=TVI

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Guest

Guest

is let’s not forget our roots. Let’s not, in the interest of trying new things, forget what people loved about this show in the first place.

 

 

What does that mean though? OTA? Oliver killing people and having more time in the field and badass stunts? 

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ComicFan777

ComicFan777

(edited)

What does that mean though? OTA? Oliver killing people and having more time in the field and badass stunts? 

 

I am guessing he means OTA since it led to the subsequent question about Oliver and Felicity...which I hope means that the last part of the season will be OTA-heavy.

 

Edited by ComicFan777
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kismet

kismet

I think SA power is at a dangerous level right now... He's at the point where he can give the writers suggestions and they actually consider it. The problem is the writers then take the ideas and run with it in their own directions which is probably no where near what SA initially wanted for the storyline. If he had no power, than all his suggestions would be passed over. If he had actual power, he might be able to fix when the writers crappify on his ideas. The problem is he has the power to suggest, but very little power to change stuff. So we're left with ideas like OQ's fatherhood that then gets manipulated into one of the stupidest and soapiest plot points on ARROW. But he then double downs on defending the storyline because one little part of it is because of him. Ego is such a fascinating thing.

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Guest
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