The Soviet Union is No More: Casting News, Story Arc Info

[sistermagpie]

7 hours ago, scrb said:

Will they carry this plot through the end of the series or will it just be a side plot to show the ultimate fate of Oleg's character?

Seems like food's going to be a theme with everybody. Philip and Elizabeth are investigating it from the US end (thinking the US might be sabotaging the grain they send to the USSR, which is not feeding itself) and Oleg is doing stuff regarding it in the USSR. Plus we've got P&E's memories of famine after the war.

[Umbelina]

The episode titles for this season.

#501"Amber Waves"#508"Immersion"

#502"Pests"#509"IHOP"

#503"The Midges"#510"Darkroom"

#504"What's the Matter with Kansas?"#511"Dyatkovo"

#505"Lotus 1-2-3"#512"The World Council of Churches"

#506"Crossbreed"#513"The Soviet Division"

#507"The Committee on Human Rights"

#508"Immersion"

#509"IHOP"

#510"Darkroom"

#511"Dyatkovo"

#512"The World Council of Churches"

#513"The Soviet Division"

Speculation? 

#512

https://www.oikoumene.org/en/resources/documents/commissions/faith-and-order/x-other-documents-from-conferences-and-meetings/plenary-commission-meeting-crete-2009/directors-report

This one talks about a meeting in Crete in 1984, mostly about the Faith and Order Movement, which bored me silly, so I couldn't keep reading it.  https://www.oikoumene.org/en/resources/documents/commissions/faith-and-order/xii-essays/what-is-faith-and-order-mary-tanner

 

#511 is a city in Russia, known for glass works, and and administrative center, it was occupied by Nazi's in WWII.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyatkovo

[Umbelina]

Really don't think I have to tag these in a spoiler thread, but I know we have some very spoiler phobic posters who may click by accident, so I'm being careful.  Mods, feel free to remove the spoiler tags if needed, and apologies in advance.

Episode 9 / Production #509 – “IHOP” (Airs May 2, 10:00 pm e/p)

Spoiler

Philip and Elizabeth are thrown off balance when things with Tuan take an unexpected turn. Meanwhile, Henry makes a startling proposition and Stan has a disturbing encounter with Frank Gaad’s widow.

World Council of Churches

Spoiler

As Philip and Elizabeth grapple with a momentous decision, Tuan takes matters into his own hands in the Morozov operation. Back in Russia, Oleg’s investigation collides with the realities of the Soviet system. Written by Joel Fields and Joe Weisberg; directed by Nicole Kassell.

Episode 5.11 - Dyatkovo - Press Release

Spoiler

A surprise assignment from the Centre divides Philip and Elizabeth, forcing them into a moment of profound crisis. Stan gives Henry a tour of the FBI ‐‐ but will he see too much?

Episode 10 / Production #510 – “Darkroom” (Airs May 9, 10:00 pm e/p)
 

Spoiler

Paige’s snooping leads Philip and Elizabeth to make a choice that could shift the balance of their lives forever. Stan and Aderholt’s recruitment of Sofia suddenly bears fruit.

Episode 8 / Production #508 – “Immersion" (Airs April 25, 10:00 pm e/p) –

Spoiler

A secret brings Elizabeth and Paige together, while, in Moscow, Oleg’s own secrets put him under KGB suspicion. A new twist in the Morozov operation creates an opportunity that changes everything.

http://www.spoilertv.com/search/label/The Americans?max-results=20 

All from here, I don't see 11 or 12 listed, but the site design is slightly difficult.

Did Henry mention a friend named Chris?  If so, it's a she, and here she is for the last two episodes... http://www.imdb.com/name/nm6082858/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t14

Edited April 28, 2017 by Umbelina
kept trying to remove spoiler tags...didn't work

[Erin9]

Well it sure looks like things heat up. 

Spoiler

Don't tell me: Henry sees his parents on the wall of the FBI.  That would be something. What a way for him to find out the truth. Just as long as he doesn't tell Stan. We don't need a Paige repeat.

I wonder if P and E will be able to get back on the same page after the surprise assignment. I have to admit I don't have enthusiasm for an end game that has them working against each other over the last season.   That seems to defeat the purpose of the show. Their relationship is what invests me in this. Them and their family. 

And more Paige snooping. Figures. Lol  

I almost wish I hadn't read this. I want to know what happens now. Lol Episode 11 almost reads like a season finale. Makes me wonder what they have cooked up for the last 2 episodes. 

[Umbelina]

Yeah, I shouldn't have even spoiler tagged those.  If I could figure out how to remove them I would.

WARNING  I am not doing any more spoiler tags in the spoiler thread so, stop reading now if you don't want to risk being spoiled.

.

.

.

.

Gaad's story is back, or at least his widow is!  That would be a nice thing to tie up.

Is Chris the new girlfriend of Henry's?  We've heard that name right?  She could easily play younger.

Meanwhile the Russia story from IMBD cast lists (not always accurate) seems to focus on Oleg and some KGB agents that may be investigating him.

I also noticed from IMBD not much mention of Stan's suspicious girlfriend in further episodes, but that may just mean IMBD is wrong.  Still...

Henry goes to the FBI!  Yay!  I am interested in Henry, much more than Paige, I wonder if mom and dad know about this little field trip or if they are just out of town (again) and Stan figures they wouldn't mind?

Paige continuing to snoop, yawn...that girl should read up on the Soviet Union realities instead, unless of course she finds out that the wheat is good, which will make her parents bigger liars than ever.

New CIA security officer

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt6263012/?ref_=ttfc_fc_tt

Misha's BACK in The World Council of Churches!  IF IMBD is correct!  I hope so.

Edited April 22, 2017 by Umbelina

[Erin9]

Spoilers below:

 

 

I think Chris is the girl Henry likes. She may be his girlfriend by then- or now for all we know. Lol 

I'd like more Henry too. It's time. I get why Paige got more focus, but it's time to see more of him- and preferably let him spent time with his dad before this show ends. That would be nice. I'm going to give the writers major points for creativity if Henry gets the truth from those sketches AND doesn't let on to Stan. It sure would be different from how Paige found out and reacted.  

P and E's divisive crisis could pull them together in the end.  Maybe. I'm just not interested in watching them fall apart after the entire show has slowly brought them together. I didn't need to watch the show for them to actually get further apart than they were in the pilot. It would be pointless. Watching the Jennings family come together with Henry finally in the know. That I like. In the end, it should be about them. Not the US, USSR, the centre, ideals....but each other. 

I really don't want Paige to find out the wheat is good. She complains and is depressed enough without it. I don't need to see her given another reason to freak out. 

I think you're right about Oleg getting investigated. 

The only thing I've noticed is that Stan's girlfriend is in a couple more episodes. I hope she amounts to something. 

Speaking of imdb, if it is updated correctly, Misha is in episode 12. Interesting. 

Edited April 22, 2017 by Erin9

[Umbelina]

The other thing I wondered about is, since Philip is keeping an eye on Stan, will that out the Russian woman, Ms. Kovalenko, Stan's recruiting?  Philip reporting it could get her in a lot of trouble.

Edited April 22, 2017 by Umbelina

[Pickles]

If Henry sees sketches of his parents at the FBI, wouldn't Stan have also recognized P and E??

[Umbelina]

23 minutes ago, Pickles said:

If Henry sees sketches of his parents at the FBI, wouldn't Stan have also recognized P and E??

That may not be what Henry sees though.  It's really hard to know how much Henry may have stored away in his brain, or have overheard. 

I can't find the sketch from when Elizabeth beat up Gaad and Aderholt.

Dates might trigger something in math expert Henry though?

[TimWil]

Oleg's mention of the hockey player in the most recent episode is significant because the hockey player will actually appear in one of the final episodes of the season and may recur in the final season, too. I suspect he'll be visiting the US, be approached by Stan and Aderholt, let them think he would defect and then, being a "true believer" would figuratively stab them in the back. Or maybe he'll just f**k up Elizabeth (a kindred spirit) and Philip's marriage.

Edited April 23, 2017 by TimWil

[Umbelina]

They are digging up Hans?  Woo!

The CIA hasn't really given up on Oleg, Stan's stupid blackmail didn't actually work?  Double Woo!

Tuan becomes more interesting and perhaps a threat?  Woo some more!

Please let all of this be true and not bait and switch!

[kokapetl]

1 hour ago, Umbelina said:

They are digging up Hans?  Woo!

The CIA hasn't really given up on Oleg, Stan's stupid blackmail didn't actually work?  Double Woo!

Tuan becomes more interesting and perhaps a threat?  Woo some more!

Please let all of this be true and not bait and switch!

That looks like "previously on The Americans" episode footage of Phil and Liz digging up William. Hans' body also isn't squished in with him. I bet it's more "shocking" and "shattering" etc bait and switch. 

[Umbelina]

Well, rats. 

 

so to speak...  ;)

[Erin9]

3 hours ago, Umbelina said:

 

They are digging up Hans?  Woo!

The CIA hasn't really given up on Oleg, Stan's stupid blackmail didn't actually work?  Double Woo!

Tuan becomes more interesting and perhaps a threat?  Woo some more!

Please let all of this be true and not bait and switch!

Stan's blackmail shouldn't work long-term. The idea that it would is ridiculous to me. Sure- the government is just going to sit back and let Stan blackmail them. 

I hope this thing with Tuon goes somewhere. I mean, so far, they could've done this op without him. It would have been harder. Being friends with Pasha gave them an easy "in", but still. 

It sounds to me like the Soviets mishandled the virus sample they sent. It's exactly what everyone was afraid of. That'll really frustrate Philip. Probably Elizabeth too, but to a lesser extent. One more time, all these risks and deaths just for the centre to screw up. Again. 

[Umbelina]

http://www.spoilertv.com/2017/04/the-americans-episode-509-ihop-press.html'

Martha!

Looks like she has:

• a new puffy down warm coat at least
• possibly a telephone
• what looks like her own kitchen so perhaps she's not sharing an apartment? 
• sad new brown clothing
• a baked potato with what looks like sour cream on top
• a glass of water, guess the wine with dinner days are over
• golden yellow kitchen accesories
• some flat shoes, at least she got out of those heels, perhaps just slippers though
• lots of knives on the wall?
• a book

Edited April 28, 2017 by Umbelina

[Umbelina]

World Council of Churches:

Quote

 

As Philip and Elizabeth grapple with a momentous decision, Tuan takes matters into his own hands in the Morozov operation. Back in Russia, Oleg’s investigation collides with the realities of the Soviet system. Written by Joel Fields and Joe Weisberg; directed by Nicole Kassell.

So, now that we've seen Oleg's room searched, with this clue above it sure seems likely that the food shortage is connected to connected people in the government, and they don't like this investigation.  No wonder that poor guy they busted would rather go to a Russian Prison than name names?

Edited April 28, 2017 by Umbelina
fixed quote

[crgirl412]

2 hours ago, Umbelina said:

World Council of Churches:

So, now that we've seen Oleg's room searched, with this clue above it sure seems likely that the food shortage is connected to connected people in the government, and they don't like this investigation.  No wonder that poor guy they busted would rather go to a Russian Prison than name names?

What clue above? 

2 hours ago, Umbelina said:

Philip and Elizabeth are thrown off balance when things with Tuan take an unexpected turn. Meanwhile, Henry makes a startling proposition and Stan has a disturbing encounter with Frank Gaad’s widow. Written by Peter Ackerman; directed by Dan Attias.

Who directed Immersion?  If it's Dan Attias, I'll be ready for more melancholy in IHOP. 

[Erin9]

Hmmm- So I guess Gabriel is probably going to visit Martha.  I imagine that will make for a rather depressing visit. I'm not sure I'm super excited unless it contributes more than showing her unhappy. I'd basically know that without seeing her. 

 I think I'm one of the few that was content seeing her at the store though. I liked her story, but I never felt compelled to know more after she left. 

Edited April 27, 2017 by Erin9

[Moose135]

30 minutes ago, Erin9 said:

 I think I'm one of the few that was content seeing her at the store though. I liked her story, but I never felt compelled to know more after she left. 

Same here!

[Umbelina]

3 hours ago, crgirl412 said:

What clue above? 

Who directed Immersion?  If it's Dan Attias, I'll be ready for more melancholy in IHOP. 

This one, which I had wrong, so sorry.  Trying to take those quotes out of spoiler tags before screwed everything up!  Specifically, the bolded part:

As Philip and Elizabeth grapple with a momentous decision, Tuan takes matters into his own hands in the Morozov operation. Back in Russia, Oleg’s investigation collides with the realities of the Soviet system. Written by Joel Fields and Joe Weisberg; directed by Nicole Kassell.

2 hours ago, Erin9 said:

Hmmm- So I guess Gabriel is probably going to visit Martha.  I imagine that will make for a rather depressing visit. I'm not sure I'm super excited unless it contributes more than showing her unhappy. I'd basically know that without seeing her. 

 I think I'm one of the few that was content seeing her at the store though. I liked her story, but I never felt compelled to know more after she left. 

I want to see her!  Not only that, I want to see how someone privileged, but not as privileged and Oleg's family, lives.  I also want, very much, to see how an American adjusts to Soviet life, something Paige and Henry may experience soon.  Seeing Martha is like seeing what Philip and Elizabeth's semi-privileged life may be if they leave or are deported.  That is, if the KGB doesn't simply execute Philip because "he's seen too much."

We've seen average people as well, during Misha's run, and the shared kitchens/bathrooms.  Martha's got her own kitchen at least, but she may still be sharing a bathroom, we can't tell from those photos.  Whatever it is, it's quite a come down from her secretary's apartment in DC.

I don't know if Gabriel will visit her or not, that looks like a pretty solitary scene to me.  I could see him doing that though.  I have a feeling his experiences returning home will be as lonely as Claudia's.

[crgirl412]

1 hour ago, Umbelina said:

This one, which I had wrong, so sorry.  Trying to take those quotes out of spoiler tags before screwed everything up!  Specifically, the bolded part:

As Philip and Elizabeth grapple with a momentous decision, Tuan takes matters into his own hands in the Morozov operation. Back in Russia, Oleg’s investigation collides with the realities of the Soviet system. Written by Joel Fields and Joe Weisberg; directed by Nicole Kassell.

I want to see her!  Not only that, I want to see how someone privileged, but not as privileged and Oleg's family, lives.  I also want, very much, to see how an American adjusts to Soviet life, something Paige and Henry may experience soon.  Seeing Martha is like seeing what Philip and Elizabeth's semi-privileged life may be if they leave or are deported.  That is, if the KGB doesn't simply execute Philip because "he's seen too much."

We've seen average people as well, during Misha's run, and the shared kitchens/bathrooms.  Martha's got her own kitchen at least, but she may still be sharing a bathroom, we can't tell from those photos.  Whatever it is, it's quite a come down from her secretary's apartment in DC.

I don't know if Gabriel will visit her or not, that looks like a pretty solitary scene to me.  I could see him doing that though.  I have a feeling his experiences returning home will be as lonely as Claudia's.

Ah, that clue!! 

I want to see Martha too!!  I want to see everything!!  Where she lives, where she works, who she talks to, everything!! 

[kokapetl]

If Martha was living communally, it would make her seem less isolated. She probably lives in a 2 room apartment by herself. Her DC apartment was 2 rooms. 

[SunnyBeBe]

Martha's life may be mundane, dreary, etc., but, if she had turned herself in to the FBI, would she be in prison now or would she have been executed for treason? (Rosenburgs in 1953, but is that it?) Wouldn't long time prison be more likely.  

Edited April 28, 2017 by SunnyBeBe

[Umbelina]

Martha had a couple of opportunities to bail out, and probably not face jail time.

The first when she found out he wasn't really an internal investigations guy.  There was still time to catch Philip (Clark) then and she could have easily cut a deal, and/or act horrified and confess to her boss that she'd been duped, and is willing to cooperate.

She became quite an adept liar as well, so even if she wanted Clark to get away she could have phoned, left a message "RUN!", gone into the FBI and demanded safety for her parents, told them that Clark had threatened to have them killed after she found out he wasn't really IE, and was some kind of spy.  Cried, and I think the misogynistic sympathy for the duped new bride, and the legitimate fear for the lives of her parents, plus a hell of a good description of "Clark" would have probably guaranteed no or very little jail time.

Until the last night though, she thought Clark was going with her, and was still in her love haze.  By then it was too late.

I seriously doubt she would have been executed even if caught, spent a long time in jail?  Yes.

[kokapetl]

Gabriel mentioned that he was going to get Martha a job translating news. TASS is a news agency. TASS employ Sofia in D.C.. Stan is working Sofia. 

I wouldn't be surprised if Vasili was running TASS as well. 

[SunnyBeBe]

18 hours ago, Kokapetl said:

Gabriel mentioned that he was going to get Martha a job translating news. TASS is a news agency. TASS employ Sofia in D.C.. Stan is working Sofia. 

I wouldn't be surprised if Vasili was running TASS as well. 

Good catch.  Man, it's a small world.  If Martha does end up there, well....

[Umbelina]

There is no way Martha's Russian would be competent for translating for YEARS.  Not a chance.  Even with total immersion and studying daily for hours it would take her years to get there.

[Ellaria]

In the previews for episode 10, it looks there are scenes from previous episodes:

• Phillip working with the recording device on Kimmy's father's briefcase
• the two officers walking down a hallway in what looks like the prison that Oleg visited 
• someone dropping something burning into the snow (Oleg and the burning tape?)

And promo photos indicate that Tatiana is back: http://images.spoilertv.com/The Americans/Season 5/Promotional Episode Photos/Episode 5.10 - Darkroom/TheAmericans_SCN21_JN0309.jpg.php

[Moose135]

3 hours ago, Ellaria Sand said:

In the previews for episode 10, it looks there are scenes from previous episodes:

I noticed that too.  I don't know if it means those earlier events are going to play a role in the next episode(s) or if they didn't want to use new material because it would give away something big?  Or maybe it was just easier to recycle old scenes for the previews...

Edited May 6, 2017 by Moose135

[qtpye]

On ‎5‎/‎5‎/‎2016 at 5:04 PM, mattie0808 said:

 

More than Stan finding out about his neighbors, more than almost anything else, I just flat-out NEED to see Elizabeth's reaction to the collapse of the Soviet Union. They can send all of the characters through a wormhole to do it, or have the last defense contractor mark actually be creating a time machine instead of missile defense, I don't care. Wherever she is in her life and whatever she's doing at that point, I absolutely HAVE to see it, lol. Hell, do two jumps, to the beginning of the end of the Warsaw Pact with the Revolutions of 1989, and then to the dissolution of the Soviet Union itself in 1991.

 

On ‎5‎/‎5‎/‎2016 at 10:46 PM, crgirl412 said:

Me too!!  I want to see Gabriel's, Claudia's and especially Elizabeth's face.  I want to know IRL what the sleepers did when it happened.  I can't even imagine what they felt.  I wonder if anyone has written a book?  I'll so some research.

 

On ‎5‎/‎5‎/‎2016 at 11:12 PM, scrb said:

Yeah it sounds like the show runners have a specific endgame in mind.

Even before the fall, Gorbachev was a huge figure across the world.  How would they not have a strong opinion about him and the changes which were going on in the late '80s in their motherland?

Maybe they could have a montage like the ending of Six Feet Under, where you see them reacting.  Probably when the Berlin Wall came down, Elizabeth had a stroke, couldn't speak any more.

Oh, tv Gods, please make this happen.  I really need Elizabeth to own up that she has devoted her life to a sham.  I am sure she will still believe in the philosophy and just say the people executing it were corrupt (which is not exactly untrue).

[kokapetl]

Kerri Russell can only do backwards time travel. 

[SunnyBeBe]

I'm not that intent to seeing the look on E's face at the fall of the Soviet Union. I do wonder what she might have done about her job as an agent.  Putin says there is no such thing as "former" KGB.  So, would she and P keep working at all? Did The Center still exist or was it dismantled? Did P & E get any warning or instruction to return to Russia?  That would be amusing to know.  Perhaps, I should get some books about those actual people to see how they handled it.  

This  adds to my curiosity as to when next season will pickup on the family. How far in the future will they go?

[Umbelina]

Well, we still had embedded illegal spies here just a few years ago, so I don't think we should assume that Philip and Elizabeth would necessarily just be allowed to stop.

[sistermagpie]

I posted this link in the media thread: major spoilers for S6.

http://ew.com/tv/2017/12/08/the-americans-season-6-first-look-paige-spy/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

This is so not for me. Time jump of 3 years. Paige being trained for spying with Elizabeth (not to be another Elizabeth, as has been said before, but to be just somebody like a CIA agent who's passing secrets). Philip's retired so who knows what's going on with him. Maybe it's just the Elizabeth show now, with Philip allowed to be retired in the USA to keep Elizabeth and Paige happy (though if Paige is buying into this stuff in 1987 it probably doesn't take much to make her happy I guess). Elizabeth feels she's living the dream so I guess she's not burnt out on spying at all with Paige in the game. Of course, that might change and she might wind up regretting her decision, but it's been three years with no problem so whatever. Maybe she's somehow managed to avoid the kind of terrible things that previously came up weekly.

I just...this is like every fanfic I would not read. I'm honestly wondering if I should even watch it. Not saying anybody else should not watch it if it interests them (maybe it sounds more interesting than last season) but it's almost like they just sent me a note in my inbox saying maybe it's not for me anymore.

[Umbelina]

1 hour ago, sistermagpie said:

I posted this link in the media thread: major spoilers for S6.

http://ew.com/tv/2017/12/08/the-americans-season-6-first-look-paige-spy/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

This is so not for me. Time jump of 3 years. Paige being trained for spying with Elizabeth (not to be another Elizabeth, as has been said before, but to be just somebody like a CIA agent who's passing secrets). Philip's retired so who knows what's going on with him. Maybe it's just the Elizabeth show now, with Philip allowed to be retired in the USA to keep Elizabeth and Paige happy (though if Paige is buying into this stuff in 1987 it probably doesn't take much to make her happy I guess). Elizabeth feels she's living the dream so I guess she's not burnt out on spying at all with Paige in the game. Of course, that might change and she might wind up regretting her decision, but it's been three years with no problem so whatever. Maybe she's somehow managed to avoid the kind of terrible things that previously came up weekly.

I just...this is like every fanfic I would not read. I'm honestly wondering if I should even watch it. Not saying anybody else should not watch it if it interests them (maybe it sounds more interesting than last season) but it's almost like they just sent me a note in my inbox saying maybe it's not for me anymore.

Holy crap, the writing is going to get even worse than last season?

The Paige show?

Philip retiring makes sense to me though, as I've been saying for a while, he's a liability now, nice of them not to kill him.

[sistermagpie]

2 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

Holy crap, the writing is going to get even worse than last season?

The Paige show?

Philip retiring makes sense to me though, as I've been saying for a while, he's a liability now, nice of them not to kill him.

Yeah, it is quite nice for him! Though I wouldn't be surprised if him getting pulled back in would be part the story just because...who wants to watch Matthew Rhys just be a travel agent? Oh wait, I forgot, we'll get to watch Holly Taylor instead. Always riveting. 

It's funny, because in the past the show did a good job presenting some traitors whose reasons made them still interesting, but Paige just seems really stupid. She really seems to have no reason at all to actually buy into this stuff except her mom assures her it's awesome. 

[Umbelina]

The only thing I like is the time jump, nearly to perestroika, and we have Gorbachev, the nuclear arms agreement, and a better chance at seeing the collapse of the USSR by season's end.  Also, last season will disappear, never to be mentioned again hopefully.

yawn, Philip will die to save Liz or Paige, or Liz will.  Bets? 

Best outcome?  Probably Paige being stupid and accidentally giving them away during an op, to Stan, or in some way Stan discovers.

Edited December 8, 2017 by Umbelina

[sistermagpie]

36 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

Best outcome?  Probably Paige being stupid and accidentally giving them away during an op, to Stan, or in some way Stan discovers.

Maybe she'll recommend that Henry get sent to some sort of reeducation camp because he likes it in the US too much. (LOL - if Paige was insufferable when she was a new Christian she's got to be so much worse now trying to out-communist her mother. Maybe Henry will get half an episode when he's home from his Ivy-feeder school and argue with her.) 

40 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

Also, last season will disappear, never to be mentioned again hopefully.

Well, we got the most important thing we needed from that season. Mischa Junior met his uncle's family. So we can stop worrying about that!

[SusanSunflower]

gee ... that's grim ... I can only hope it's a fake-out ... 

[Umbelina]

5 hours ago, sistermagpie said:

Maybe she'll recommend that Henry get sent to some sort of reeducation camp because he likes it in the US too much. (LOL - if Paige was insufferable when she was a new Christian she's got to be so much worse now trying to out-communist her mother. Maybe Henry will get half an episode when he's home from his Ivy-feeder school and argue with her.) 

Well, we got the most important thing we needed from that season. Mischa Junior met his uncle's family. So we can stop worrying about that!

 

5 hours ago, SusanSunflower said:

gee ... that's grim ... I can only hope it's a fake-out ... 

I hated what they did with Misha.  HATED it. 

Hey!  Maybe they are going to kill off Paige early on!  That's why they got her in ops, she dies, the internet cheers, and we get a decent final season without the whining and they eyebrows!

[crgirl412]

A three year jump might be ok IF they show Glasnost and Perestroika, Philip still active and LESS Paige not more!!!  WTH????  I don't want it to end being a bad show! 

[mattie0808]

Yikes. :| This is...not good. Very disappointing. I don't mind the time-jump at all, I always wanted one to make sure we had the best chance to see P/E's reaction to everything that goes down with the Soviet Union. So, fine. BUT... everything else? Paige? Elizabeth? PHILIP?! COME ON.

I really thought the missteps of last season were mainly because they got lost in trying to get set-up for what they knew would be their final season, and eventually that getting to the end of their story would helpfully refocus them. Guess not. Sheesh.

I'm most upset about Philip. (I think.) I'm having such a hard time with the idea of P/E not working together as a team that I (almost) don't care that it's PAIGE she'll be working with. What is the $%&#-ing point?!

Edited December 9, 2017 by mattie0808

[Umbelina]

As I said, maybe a horrifying death, then  Philip and Liz deal with that, or Paige gets caught and they all get exposed.  I'm rooting for the horrifying death at the end of episode one.

[sistermagpie]

10 hours ago, mattie0808 said:

I'm most upset about Philip. (I think.) I'm having such a hard time with the idea of P/E not working together as a team that I (almost) don't care that it's PAIGE she'll be working with. What is the $%&#-ing point?!

IKR? Last season I already was very nervous about how it seemed like the show was happy to let Philip drift without us ever getting into the meat of exactly what makes the guy tick, while being endlessly fascinated with Paige exchanging one leader (Pastor Tim) for another (her mother) and Elizabeth, as ever, getting what she wants and another fangirl to boot. Now it almost seems like they think obviously Paige becoming Elizabeth's protegee has been everyone's interest all along and omg, it's so not. She'll just avoid human relationships entirely except for her mom.

Hopefully that set up will get blown up with Elizabeth getting what she wants and then having problems with it but it seems like the start of s3 all over again where Elizabeth just happily gets to be super Soviet mom while Philip goes along with whatever. Now he probably doesn't even have another kid at home in his retirement since Elizabeth and Paige were so enthusiastic about Henry leaving home. But again, one would hope that the reason the season starts when it does is because Philip is called out of retirement because for OF COURSE we want to see the two of them working together and not Elizabeth by herself or puppy Paige.

10 hours ago, Umbelina said:

As I said, maybe a horrifying death, then  Philip and Liz deal with that, or Paige gets caught and they all get exposed.  I'm rooting for the horrifying death at the end of episode one.

That would be pretty great.

I found myself thinking of a whole scenario where Philip was finally killed by the Centre and this led to Henry turning them in to make a stand for his father.

[kokapetl]

Is Paige gonna infiltrate Janet Jackson’s dance troupe or something?

[methodwriter85]

I'm honestly shocked they're skipping to late 1987. I thought this show was going to end with late 1985 or early 1986. Watch them completely not change the look or tone or fashion of the show even though fashion is completely different in 1987 as opposed to 1984. So Paige is now in college and helping her Mom spy? Elizabeth is living in deep, deep denial if she thinks Paige isn't going to be expected to be a honey pot. Especially if the time jump now means she's 20. Holly's now more or less playing her age now.

[sistermagpie]

15 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

So Paige is now in college and helping her Mom spy? Elizabeth is living in deep, deep denial if she thinks Paige isn't going to be expected to be a honey pot. Especially if the time jump now means she's 20. Holly's now more or less playing her age now.

I wonder if she'd actually care, really, if she was honeytrapping. Like maybe she says that early on to justify the first step, but once things get going she'd just see the reason for it because it was necessary. In the end she always has reason to put the Centre above everyone. Whatever the Centre thinks is necessary or best is what Elizabeth thinks. And so far she's received almost zero consequences for barrelling down that road.

Nothing about Henry, but he'd be playing his age too--16. Same age as Jared and way old enough for the Centre to take an interest, especially if he's the kind of superstar his father apparently was.  Will they keep him out of everything by being at school? Will Elizabeth already have started working on him too? Would Philip? Everyone on the show except Stan has always been more about Paige but by the end of last season Henry was the one actively interested in the kind of career Elizabeth seems to dream about for Paige.

Edited December 10, 2017 by sistermagpie

[methodwriter85]

This is my prediction that I wrote back in July about how the show ends, and I'm really leaning towards the idea that this is how the show will end given the way the producers have basically ignored any criticism of Paige:

After Elizabeth and Phil meet their ends, we get a flashforward to Paige in 1989, wearing a flashier outfit than she ever wore as a teenager. She's sitting at a bar chatting up a preppie lawyer type. We soon realize he's a mark, and Paige is now a spy doing the honeypot thing. Then we see the news of the Berlin wall flash on the t.v. at the bar, and Paige looks directly at the t.v. camera with a blank expression on her face. End credits.

Unless Paige gets killed off, I can't see the final moments of the show NOT having to do with Paige in a big way. That's been consistent with how the showrunners have been making Paige such a big focus since the second/third season.

[Dev F]

On 12/9/2017 at 10:05 PM, methodwriter85 said:

I'm honestly shocked they're skipping to late 1987. I thought this show was going to end with late 1985 or early 1986. Watch them completely not change the look or tone or fashion of the show even though fashion is completely different in 1987 as opposed to 1984.

Why on Earth would they not change the fashion or tone? I understand that folks are skeptical about such a dramatic change in direction, but there's enough to worry about without making up hypothetical problems to complain about!

Me, I'm not as gloom-and-doom as you guys, probably in large part because I thought season 5 was miles better than the general consensus hereabouts. It was frustratingly uneventful, yes, and a distinct step down from the previous seasons, but still rich in its portrayal of the main characters and the marital relationship that makes up the essential core of the series. If anything concerns me about these season 6 spoilers, it's that it doesn't seem like the logical next step after a season that was all about Elizabeth and Philip realizing that they only work as a team -- Liz accepting that she would've become cruel and inflexible like Tuan without her husband's sense of basic decency to lean on, Phil relying on his wife's strong sense of duty to overcome his persistent impulse to give in and give up. So it seems rather odd that next season would begin with them following different paths just as they realized how much they need to stay on the same path together.

But I suppose it doesn't have to be inconsistent, if the idea is that Phil has realized that being there for Elizabeth doesn't mean he has to be a kickass spy like her. Indeed, that was part of the point of last season, too -- Liz and Phil accepting that what makes them so ideally matched is how much they don't have in common and never will. If the situation is that Philip is "retired" from actual field work but Elizabeth still comes to him for advice and support, I could see it working pretty well.

[sistermagpie]

8 hours ago, Dev F said:

If the situation is that Philip is "retired" from actual field work but Elizabeth still comes to him for advice and support, I could see it working pretty well.

I would have to assume this was the case--if they were really separate that "Soviet Division" would be pretty complete. But still, this is the worst possible thing they could have thrown out to me, personally, as the one spoiler to sit on for months because I've already felt a bit resentful of how Elizabeth/Paige has dominated the family since season 1.

It quite possibly makes it sound like the show is going to be very different than it actually will be on screen, and I can see why the whole "Paige-possible" angle is the easiest thing to use as a surprise for the season while anything the other characters are doing is more complicated. (Especially if they think it sounds more action-y.) Also  if Elizabeth starts off living her dream (super spy with her mini-me daughter by her side) that ought to change. Season 3, for instance, started with Elizabeth smugly moving Paige along toward recruitment while Philip sadly looked on and ended with Paige ratting them out. But then, Elizabeth won out in the end there too. Paige didn't just naturally and coincidentally grow up to be exactly like her mother. Quite possibly because she feels it's her only choice.

All Philip's hopes for Paige to find her own way were easily steamrolled over even at a time (1987) where it's hard to imagine Paige joining this cause as anything other than her mother's fantasy (one that seems almost childish at this point for both of them) while Philip, who quit because he honestly doesn't think they're making the world better with what they do, doesn't seem to have done anything but let it happen. Paige seems kind of stunted in the ways Elizabeth is. And Henry may just barely be there, as if there's no place for him in the family. Basically Philip and Elizabeth have recreated the things in their childhood that previously seemed the best things to avoid. Elizabeth's given her daughter the impression that love=the cause and Henry has no idea who his father actually is. (And we still don't really get how Philip, who's always been the one putting family first, is the one with a living family from whom he seems both passively and irrecoverably estranged.)

While I was thinking about this a scene actually popped into my head. Back in S3, I think, Paige and Philip are talking about Pastor Tim's mission trip to build a school somewhere in Africa, maybe Ethiopia? And Henry asks, "Why?" He's not being dismissive or anything, he just naturally asks exactly what the situation is that Paige would be building a school for someone. And Paige impatiently answers, "I don't know. They need schools in Africa, I guess." It's just one of those little consistencies with Paige and Elizabeth just look to the authority to tell them what needs doing, while Philip and Henry question it. 

One other thing--there is definitely no reason to think the fashions won't be right. I actually had the time jump semi-spoiled for me a few weeks ago when the costume designer posted a picture of a dress she liked that she came upon in her research. It was from a magazine featuring the looks of 1987. I immediately asked her, "So, uh, big spoiler there?" And she covered by claiming stuff just came up and she didn't always look at the year.