Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes

[Velocity23]

The problem with Barry and Flashpoint is that its gonna impact two core members of team Arrow. And it will show consequences on Arrow. Dumbass Barry how he lives and breathes.

[apinknightmare]

30 minutes ago, Trini said:

I don't see how you "have to" talk about anything you don't want to talk about. (Have there been any Arrow spoilers that specifically mention Barry?) Plus, the Flash forum is there if you would rather not discuss him in the Arrow section.

  Reveal hidden contents

Barry got Iris flowers?! UGH he is clearly THE WORST.

Well, when talking about Flashpoint, the conversation tends to include him at times since, you know, he's the one who created it. Since that's

Spoiler

 

now part of Arrow, he comes up in the Arrow only spoiler discussion. Not sure why anyone would bring up Flashpoint's effects on Arrow in The Flash forum. 

And unless I missed it, I don't think anyone thinks Barry is "the worst" for getting Iris flowers. He's "the worst" for continuously doing selfish, dumb shit.

 

Edited August 4, 2016 by apinknightmare

[quarks]

38 minutes ago, Trini said:

I don't see how you "have to" talk about anything you don't want to talk about. (Have there been any Arrow spoilers that specifically mention Barry?) Plus, the Flash forum is there if you would rather not discuss him in the Arrow section.

  Hide contents

Barry got Iris flowers?! UGH he is clearly THE WORST.

 

I think the spoilers that Flashpoint - which Barry caused - will have some effect on Arrow sorta count as mentioning Barry.

[Guest]

I wish we didn't have to talk about Barry but the whole flashpoint thing kinda means it's impossible not to. Dammit, Barry! *shakes fist*

[lemotomato]

42 minutes ago, Trini said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Barry got Iris flowers?! UGH he is clearly THE WORST.

"I'm sorry for wiping out your life and that of everyone we know because I messed with time travel for my own selfish reasons"

Spoiler

Here is a nice flower arrangement, please love me.

[Velocity23]

[Starfish35]

Morgana is Lex's sister.  Oh the crossover potential. ;)

ETA: Here's the TVLine article.

Edited August 4, 2016 by Starfish35

[Velocity23]

[Trini]

1 hour ago, Angel12d said:

I wish we didn't have to talk about Barry but the whole flashpoint thing kinda means it's impossible not to. Dammit, Barry! *shakes fist*

Nah, you're right. Easier to gripe over here.

1 hour ago, lemotomato said:

"I'm sorry for wiping out your life and that of everyone we know because I messed with time travel for my own selfish reasons"

Since you do want to talk about him, I don't think it's selfish that he took the chance to prevent the wrongful murder of his parents. I'm sure others would do the same, except that they don't have the power. But Barry will learn his lesson; there will be ramifications, like all throughout last season.

I was really hoping someone from Legends could talk to Barry about time travel and consequences, but weirdly, that crossover never happened....

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Trini said:

Nah, you're right. Easier to gripe over here.

Is it? I wouldn't know because I don't visit The Flash boards. 

[Starfish35]

I think the griping is specific to Flashpoint changing things on Arrow.  I think most people here couldn't care less what Barry does on his own show.  

[apinknightmare]

8 minutes ago, Trini said:

Nah, you're right. Easier to gripe over here.

Since you do want to talk about him, I don't think it's selfish that he took the chance to prevent the wrongful murder of his parents. I'm sure others would do the same, except that they don't have the power. But Barry will learn his lesson; there will be ramifications, like all throughout last season.

I was really hoping someone from Legends could talk to Barry about time travel and consequences, but weirdly, that crossover never happened....

It's not just easier to gripe over here - over here is where the griping should be, since the person you originally responded to was talking about the conversation over in the Spoilers thread. Where we're talking about Flashpoint's effects on Arrow. Which wouldn't go over on The Flash board. If only the two shows COULD be separate! 

And fingers crossed he learns his time traveling lesson this time, since he didn't learn it the last time. 

[catrox14]

47 minutes ago, Trini said:

Since you do want to talk about him, I don't think it's selfish that he took the chance to prevent the wrongful murder of his parents. I'm sure others would do the same, except that they don't have the power. But Barry will learn his lesson; there will be ramifications, like all throughout last season

If Barry's choice was left in Barry's FLASHverse, I don't believe any Arrow fans would give a shit. But these shows are bound by Barry's decision. He made the decision but he's not the only one paying the consequences. Like if he truly believed it wouldn't affect other people, then he just did a stupid thing. But I'm pretty sure he knew it WOULD impact everyone other than himself and his family and he didn't care. 

[dtissagirl]

...Even this current discussion is Barry's fault.

[catrox14]

Is this like Schrodinger's Barry? He is both here and not here. Important and not important.

[Thundercatmary]

Maybe he'll run fast enough and erase himself lol

[scarynikki12]

A little backstory on me: I've loved going to the movies since middle school.  The summer of Independence Day and Batman Forever turned me into a fangirl.  I loved those movies so much that I devoured every magazine article I could find and watched every interview that was on tv.  It was worth it for those two movies as they were and are awesome (BF in spite of Schumacher's weird direction).  Now, I kept reading reviews and watching interviews for all other movies that I was interested in as a result of that summer.  That's a problem for someone like me because I am susceptible to the power of suggestion.  So, I would read a negative review, go see the movie, and let said review influence me.  Same with the positive ones.  About six or so years ago I realized I was doing this and stopped.  Ever since I've been able to enjoy movies for what they are just like when I first saw ID4 and Batman Forever.  I now do a personal embargo about a week or two before major releases and I only read reactions after I've formed my own.  Things still slip through, which is how I knew that Bats vs Supes was universally hated before it was released, and I have no issue with someone telling me in passing that they did or did not enjoy a movie I haven't seen as long as they leave it at that.

How is this relevant?  I just got back from Suicide Squad and I really enjoyed it.  My thoughts are going under the spoiler bar and I would advise anyone who is as susceptible as me to not read it.

Spoiler

There are some things I would have changed, yes, but I thought it was good.  The final fight scene didn't need to be slowed down or have schmaltzy music playing but I thought the rest worked.  Harley was great, they used Cara's limited acting abilities well, the soundtrack was AWESOME, the group felt like an emerging team and I thought Leto was a solid Joker (though I still hate his look).  No one can top Leger but he's worlds better than Nicholson.  I love Viola Davis and I love Amanda Waller and putting the two together was a stroke of genius and whoever had that idea better have gotten a raise.  I like our first look at Flash in his suit and I thought Bats was utilized very well.  I hope that this movie is as successful as it needs to get a sequel cause I want to see more Squad shenanigans.

I say that if the trailer made you want to see the movie then see it.  Don't worry about the reviews.

[kismet]

12 hours ago, looptab said:

I'm sorry but I just remembered ths scene and I want you to laugh with me:

I don't use my personal tragedies as an excuse to torture whoever pisses me off - I'd rather screw the whole universe up!

Seriously, one of my favorite scenes between the both of them ever. Explains why I love Arrow & find Flash slightly off putting.  Thanks for posting :)

[Delphi]

Ugh even before Barry became an ass that scene pissed me off,  basically it's Oliver listing tragedies and Barry just screams "I have one of those tragedies,  we're even! "  And then he nearly destroyed the universe.  Great job The Flash. 

[ruby24]

To be fair, I would argue that Season 1 of The Flash, especially at that point, purposely had a very different tone from Arrow and they obviously wanted the world of Central City to be "sunnier" and for all the characters, including Barry, to be lighthearted and far more cheery as a direct contrast to Arrow.

In Season 2, they devolved and decided to pile all this angst onto Barry constantly and force him to carry the "weight of the world" cliche, etc. They actually used those words at one point regarding him, which would never have happened in Season 1. I personally think they forgot what the tone of the show was striving for in the first season, and why Barry was so sweet and likable in the first place. I will never understand why they chose to turn him into Oliver-lite.

Seems like such an obvious mistake to me.

Edited August 5, 2016 by ruby24

[tv echo]

I love these tweets...

[tv echo]

Arrow spoilers that specifically mention Barry...

(ETA: The spoiler tag is probably not necessary since this whole thread is spoiler-tagged, but I added it just to be safe.)

 

-- The Flash Comic-Con 2016 Highlight Reel includes a quick shot of Felicity & Barry kissing. (SDCC, Jul. 23, 2016: CW_TheFlash tweet, page 41 of Spoilers thread)

-- On what mini-crossovers ("one-offs") they can announce, Flash EP Todd Helbing: "Yeah, Episode 2, uh, we're going to have a little Felicity on the show." On what she will be doing, Helbing: "Uh, she and Barry are -" Grant Gustin interrupted: "She's giving advice... Yeah, she's giving advice." Then they both laughed. (SDCC, Jul. 23, 2016: Video of collected footage from SDCC Flash, Arrow and LoT panels, page 41 of Spoilers thread)

-- Per Grant Gustin, Felicity will appear in episode 2 of The Flash to offer advice to Barry. (SDCC, Jul. 23, 2016: TVLine article, page 40 of Spoilers thread, and HiddenRemote article and iDigitalTimes article, page 41 of Spoilers thread)

-- Flash EPs Todd/Aaron Helbing: "Everything that happens in Flashpoint will have a ripple effect throughout the season" On whether it will affect the other shows and the other timelines, Helbing: "They're in the same universe and in the same world, you know, it's certainly possible that it would have a trickle down effect... I mean, there's a - you know, we have a little mini-crossover in episode 2 where we see Felicity and, uh, there'll be some of your questions answered there about that." (SDCC, Jul. 23, 2016: Video of WithAnAccentTV interview with Flash EPs, Todd & Aaron Helbing, page 41 of Spoilers thread)

-- On Flashpoint storyline, Flash's Todd Helbing: "This is something that is going to ripple throughout the whole season... Obviously Barry grew up with a different family. His parents were still alive, Cisco has gone on to make some money. One of the effects is [Arrow's] Diggle himself. You'll have to tune in to see exactly how." (Jul. 23, 2016 TV Guide article, page 41 of Spoilers thread)

-- Arrow EP Wendy Mericle talked about how they keep track of everything that's happening on all three shows.  They have people who monitor that stuff and they also have a big chalk board. WM: "For example, when Felicity goes over to Flash, we're going to have to know what she's doing on Flash cause it has a great impact on her - not necessarily her availability - what is she [unintelligible word] on Flash that she's going to be carrying with her into our stories." (SDCC, Jul. 23, 2016: VIdeo of The Fandom interview with WM, page 41 of Spoilers thread)

Edited August 5, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

GG and CP shooting a kissing scene (go to link for more pics of what looks like a Barry & Iris date)...

SHOOT: THE FLASH’s WestAllen (Candice Patton & Grant Gustin) on Vancouver’s False Creek Seawall
August 4, 2016 
http://yvrshoots.com/2016/08/shoot-the-flashs-westallen-grant-gustin-candice-patton-on-vancouvers-false-creek-seawall.html

[apinknightmare]

Can't wait to see what kind of BS angst TPTB toss at those two to break 'em up. 

[Velocity23]

Quote

Can't wait to see what kind of BS angst TPTB toss at those two to break 'em up.

Well depends if this is still Flashpoint or not. But i would say definetely a tragedy. Barry will need something to brood and feel guilty about during season 3.

[bijoux]

They have the perfect solution in Iris discovering Barry's dumbassery and freezing him out HARD because of it.

[lexicon]

13 minutes ago, bijoux said:

They have the perfect solution in Iris discovering Barry's dumbassery and freezing him out HARD because of it.

That would give Iris some agency and allow someone to finally call Barry on his boneheadedness so I can't see it happening.

Considering their MO over  on the Flash it's more likely that Barry gets everything he wants during the changed TL and then 'heroically' has to give it up for the greater good all while crying manfully and having a mighty case of the sadz. Then we're all supposed to bemoan the tragedy of poor Barry Allen who is forced to give up his ideal world, all because the dumb universe would implode - never mind the fact that it was his boneheadness and selfishness that unleashed the shitstorm in the first place.

Edited August 5, 2016 by lexicon

[dtissagirl]

I just need Iris to dump Barry for Draco Malfoy. That's all I ask, Flash writers. You can doooo eeet.

[apinknightmare]

1 minute ago, Velocity23 said:

Well depends if this is still Flashpoint or not. But i would say definetely a tragedy. Barry will need something to brood and feel guilty about during season 3.

Well, the people around him usually seem to be okay with the stuff he does. It'd be nice to see someone take him to task for it. Not sure how well Iris would fare in that situation with the way romantic conflict is written in this 'verse (and I don't have much hope that it'll be handled on The Flash MUCH better, but who knows?). 

[Velocity23]

From BTS pics it seems they are stuffing a lot of Westallen in a single episode. So tragedy is around the corner and will somehow connect to Iris.

[Sakura12]

Iris wouldn't do that, whatever Barry does is the right decision for the whole world. Then his friends, family and all of Central City will celebrate their brave hero for screwing with the time line then fixing it. 

As for the break up going by these writers track record. Iris will probably do something that Barry doesn't like, then break up with him, making everyone hate on Iris. 

[Velocity23]

Quote

Then his friends, family and all of Central City will celebrate their brave hero for screwing with the time line then fixing it. 

I would agree if it is in the original timeline. Not so sure about the FP one.

[apinknightmare]

5 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

I would agree if it is in the original timeline. Not so sure about the FP one.

Unfortunately Barry being the greatest is more of a writing issue, so I'm not sure that would change regardless of the timeline. I'd love to be wrong about that, though. 

[Velocity23]

Well according to the SDCC trailer

Spoiler

Joe doesnt know him, neither does Cisco and was Caitlin even there? So maybe his parents now take the role of  telling us how great he is. But not the former friends and family.

[apinknightmare]

I don't think his cheerleaders have to be any particular group of people-just that the general attitude of the writing staff and showrunners seems to be that he's the greatest, so...I wouldn't really expect people who don't know about Flashpoint to randomly praise him, but given the way his mistakes have been handled in the past, I also wouldn't expect the people who do eventually find out that he messed with the timeline to be all that upset about it. 

[Velocity23]

All i heard about the s3 Barry is some kind guilt he carries around, so maybe you right. I guess i am just counting on one person to spell it out for him. Maybe the speed force.

[Sakura12]

Barry is their precious. No one can ever say anything bad about him or tell him that he messed up. The only thing they can do is give him is 500 pep talks a day. 

The best we'll get his the villains telling him that. 

[tv echo]

I just came across this new article (reporting from the TCA summer press tour that's going on in L.A. right now)...

MARVEL AND ABC DISCUSSING SEVERAL POSSIBLE TV SHOWS
ERIC GOLDMAN / 4 AUG 2016
http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/08/04/marvel-and-abc-discussing-several-possible-tv-shows?abthid=57a3a93d06dc99504200000c

Quote

In May, ABC cancelled Marvel’s Agent Carter and passed on picking up Marvel’s Most Wanted as a new series, but at the TCA (Television Critics Association) press tour today, network president Channing Dungey made it clear ABC still has notable plans for new Marvel projects moving forward.

Dungey, who’s only a few months into her new position at ABC, revealed, “Since I’ve been in this role we’ve been in a number of really terrific conversations with the Marvel team.” She added that ABC was actually “sitting down [with Marvel] in two weeks to discuss our next steps.”
*  *  *
“We have a lot of enthusiasm and we’re very, very excited for the plans they have for Agents of SHIELD Season 4,” Dungey remarked.

Asked why Marvel’s Most Wanted, which would have focused on Agents of SHIELD’s Bobbi Morse/Mockingbird and Lance Hunter, was passed on, Dungey replied, “Marvel’s Most Wanted, at the end of the day, did not feel as strong as some of the other pilots that we shot. We talked about it with Marvel and we all came to an agreement that we wanted to figure out what the next show that we do together [is] and we all feel is as creatively strong as it can be.”
*  *  *
The Netflix/Marvel series (which ABC Studios co-produce) have a certain niche, focusing on street level heroes. Asked if they might look to find a unified feel for Marvel series on ABC moving forward, Dungey replied, “That’s an interesting question and we have talked about that, yes.”

In the past couple of years, other Marvel projects we’d heard were in development at ABC included the comedy Damage Control and a mystery project from the acclaimed John Ridley (12 Years a Slave, American Crime). Asked if those could still be in contention or the focus was entirely on new concepts, Dungey said, “We’re looking at a number of different things. Some of them are projects that we were working on before and some of them are totally new ideas and IP.”

Edited August 5, 2016 by tv echo

[looptab]

1 hour ago, bijoux said:

They have the perfect solution in Iris discovering Barry's dumbassery and freezing him out HARD because of it.

 

1 hour ago, apinknightmare said:

 Not sure how well Iris would fare in that situation with the way romantic conflict is written in this 'verse (and I don't have much hope that it'll be handled on The Flash MUCH better, but who knows?). 

Yeah, the minute Iris tries saying something you just know that there'll be cries of 'But he saved his mother!!!' Much like BM was 'The Mother of His Child!!!'

1 hour ago, Velocity23 said:

From BTS pics it seems they are stuffing a lot of Westallen in a single episode. So tragedy is around the corner and will somehow connect to Iris.

Sounds like The Calm. 

[Velocity23]

Quote

Sounds like The Calm. 

I always figured they gonna go the Olicity s3 for Iris/Barry. A special moment, tragedy strikes, Barry will be broody and feel guilty throughout the season.

[looptab]

2 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

I always figured they gonna go the Olicity s3 for Iris/Barry. A special moment, tragedy strikes, Barry will be broody and feel guilty throughout the season.

Yeah, they're only doing it in 303 because of FP, but the beats are all there. 

[wonderwall]

My guess is that Barry fixes all the Flashpoint stuff by early episode 3 and towards the end of the episode he takes Iris on a date without any plan of telling her what he did. And by the very end he feels to guilty to keep what he did from her because he loves her and blah blah blah. Then Iris will have her very own "I don't want to be a woman you love" cliffhanger moment. 

In a perfect world Eddie would still be alive and be with Iris... If not Eddie then Tommy would be alive and merwest would be a thing :') 

[looptab]

2 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

My guess is that Barry fixes all the Flashpoint stuff by early episode 3 and towards the end of the episode he takes Iris on a date without any plan of telling her what he did. And by the very end he feels to guilty to keep what he did from her because he loves her and blah blah blah. Then Iris will have her very own "I don't want to be a woman you love" cliffhanger moment. 

Nah, that's after Barry 'dies' and the kid speedsters have their 3episodes hero journey.

:p

[catrox14]

9 hours ago, kismet said:

Seriously, one of my favorite scenes between the both of them ever. Explains why I love Arrow & find Flash slightly off putting.  Thanks for posting :)

I love that scene so much. Can Oliver please remind Barry of this exchange and how Barry apparently totally forgot his own ideology? I miss that Arrow suit. I wish Oliver would wear that one again:(

[kismet]

4 hours ago, bijoux said:

They have the perfect solution in Iris discovering Barry's dumbassery and freezing him out HARD because of it.

I'm actually hoping for FS to do just that. Because in any universe FS would not put up with that dumbassery.

[kismet]

2 hours ago, wonderwall said:

In a perfect world Eddie would still be alive and be with Iris... If not Eddie then Tommy would be alive and merwest would be a thing :') 

If we have to put up with the obnoxiousness of FP, can't we at least get nice things?

I have a list of 3 wishes for FP (in no particular order).

• Bring back Eddie, Tommy & Moira. At least for one episode before they all return to that Happy Place I know they live in with endless beaches & yummy drinks - away from the crappy writing & gotcha plots of these writers.
• Bring back the Old Suit. This is a cost saving green measure and should really be looked into :)
• Erase BMD. And if they want to keep the kid, find another way to tell his story. There were tons of other far better story arcs & ways to tell that story. Find one, it shouldn't be that hard. It's like searching for a Starbucks or a Dunkin Donuts where I'm from. They are everywhere.

[Velocity23]

Quote

Do you have any scoop on the Arrow-Flash-Supergirl-Legends of Tomorrow crossover? — Bridget
It’s a bit early to reveal anything big just yet as Greg Berlanti tells me they’re just about to start breaking the crossover episodes. But the uber-producer did give me one tease to share with the masses: “I’m going to probably try to have one unifying threat, as opposed to different things on different ones, which is what the first year was,” Berlanti reveals. Who will be that threat? Share your theories in the comments!

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/08/05/spoiler-room-blindspot-arrow-greys-anatomy

[ruby24]

Not sure why everyone in here thinks those pics are from the FP storyline. From what I've read, FP is the premiere only, and after that there's just "effects" of FP on the restored timeline. Which I'm guessing means small changes, but not fundamental ones.

So I'm pretty sure this is Barry and Iris in the real timeline and they're finally putting them together.

[bijoux]

20 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/08/05/spoiler-room-blindspot-arrow-greys-anatomy

Because last year's crossover was so much better than the first. :/ Although it does make sense with Supergirl being involved. I just hope they can't create a lamer villain than VS.

[Velocity23]

Quote

Because last year's crossover was so much better than the first. :/ Although it does make sense with Supergirl being involved. I just hope they can't create a lamer villain than VS.

Is that possible?