S03.E12: Looking for Mr. Goodbrain, Part 1

[Lady Calypso]

11 minutes ago, Ashand11 said:

I'm pretty sure Liv slept with Chase because 1. she didn't have to worry about turning him so it wasn't enough of a concern to overpower the brain and 2. she was probably always been attracted to him so it was harder to resist.  Either way I can't say Im bothered by it. I wish she would get with him for real mostly because I love Jason Dohring.

She cheated on her boyfriend, though. They just happened to define their relationship because Liv was afraid of being on these brains. I'd say that's a pretty shitty thing to do someone. She slept with him because she couldn't end up controlling the brain she was on, even though she had managed to resist when not knowing what was going on. Being on brains doesn't give her the excuse for sleeping with a man while dating someone else. Cheating is cheating. If this was Justin on promiscuous brains, sleeping with another woman, then I'd be rooting for Liv to break up with the guy. I can't imagine Justin sticking with Liv after what she's done. It's the first time I actually hated Liv. I'll forgive her eventually, but I am rightfully pissed at her. No matter who the other guy was, it's not cool and it's not ok. If Liv wants to be with Evil Guy Chase, then she can go be with him. Just leave poor, innocent Justin alone. 

[Ashand11]

40 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

She cheated on her boyfriend, though. They just happened to define their relationship because Liv was afraid of being on these brains. I'd say that's a pretty shitty thing to do someone. She slept with him because she couldn't end up controlling the brain she was on, even though she had managed to resist when not knowing what was going on. Being on brains doesn't give her the excuse for sleeping with a man while dating someone else. Cheating is cheating. If this was Justin on promiscuous brains, sleeping with another woman, then I'd be rooting for Liv to break up with the guy. I can't imagine Justin sticking with Liv after what she's done. It's the first time I actually hated Liv. I'll forgive her eventually, but I am rightfully pissed at her. No matter who the other guy was, it's not cool and it's not ok. If Liv wants to be with Evil Guy Chase, then she can go be with him. Just leave poor, innocent Justin alone. 

Jesus lol who the hell cares its a tv show. I didn't give an excuse, I gave a reason for why she did it. Because she's more attracted to Chase then boring plain Justin. Simple really.  I hope she does go be with him, he's quite interesting.

[dubbel zout]

22 minutes ago, Ashand11 said:

Because she's more attracted to Chase then boring plain Justin.

Liv hasn't said that. Before Chase came over to her table, we got her voiceover saying she didn't know why she'd returned to the bar. She knew she shouldn't be there. It was the brain, not some specific desire for Chase.

[Ashand11]

40 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

Liv hasn't said that. Before Chase came over to her table, we got her voiceover saying she didn't know why she'd returned to the bar. She knew she shouldn't be there. It was the brain, not some specific desire for Chase.

I think it was both. She had no problem fighting off the brain before. Or at least she was able to fight it off.  She was about to leave when he showed up but didn't. 

[Bort]

47 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

She cheated on her boyfriend, though. They just happened to define their relationship because Liv was afraid of being on these brains. I'd say that's a pretty shitty thing to do someone. She slept with him because she couldn't end up controlling the brain she was on, even though she had managed to resist when not knowing what was going on. Being on brains doesn't give her the excuse for sleeping with a man while dating someone else. Cheating is cheating. If this was Justin on promiscuous brains, sleeping with another woman, then I'd be rooting for Liv to break up with the guy. I can't imagine Justin sticking with Liv after what she's done. It's the first time I actually hated Liv. I'll forgive her eventually, but I am rightfully pissed at her. No matter who the other guy was, it's not cool and it's not ok. If Liv wants to be with Evil Guy Chase, then she can go be with him. Just leave poor, innocent Justin alone. 

And if there'd been any decent buildup with Justin, like there had been with Lowell and Drake, I might also be indignant but it seems like they rushed Liv and Justin to the finish line just so they could have this cheating plot point in the penultimate episode. I'm not invested enough (read: at all) to care either way.

 

21 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

Liv hasn't said that. Before Chase came over to her table, we got her voiceover saying she didn't know why she'd returned to the bar. She knew she shouldn't be there. It was the brain, not some specific desire for Chase.

Oh, the voiceover, you reminded me. That made me laugh so much. They've never done Liv voiceovers and suddenly, there one is, all echo-y like the heroine of a Lifetime movie.

[dubbel zout]

33 minutes ago, Ashand11 said:

I think it was both.

I agree, but it's not as if Liv decided on her own to go to the bar. That was definitely under the influence of the brain. She sucks for cheating on Justin, regardless of the reason.

[Ashand11]

41 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

I agree, but it's not as if Liv decided on her own to go to the bar. That was definitely under the influence of the brain. She sucks for cheating on Justin, regardless of the reason.

yes of course. Cant say I really care that she cheated though. I like Chase. Also, I only just started watching the show again because of Jason Dohring so I really don't know anything about Justin and was only just introduced to his character so hard for me to care about that.

Edited June 21, 2017 by Ashand11

[kieyra]

I'll put up with a fair amount of Jason Dohring stunt-casting if they keep giving me shirtless Major.

That said, if they shoehorn him into a major part/love triangle next season, I'll be hitting the FF button hard. His acting is painful at this point.

[Lady Calypso]

1 hour ago, Ashand11 said:

yes of course. Cant say I really care that she cheated though. I like Chase. Also, I only just started watching the show again because of Jason Dohring so I really don't know anything about Justin and was only just introduced to his character so hard for me to care about that.

True, if you tuned in for Jason Dohring, I totally understand! It's not like I love the Liv/Justin pairing myself; it's pretty boring and bland, and it hasn't really been touched on all that much, which is why I look at the individual character decisions and yes, Liv made the worst choice possible by sleeping with Chase Graves, who is all but confirmed as evil at this point (the post it note). It's like they're also trying to draw different parallels, and this is with Liv and Peyton's bad decisions this season (Peyton for sleeping with Blaine, who turned out to be faking his amnesia; at least with Liv, she had no idea and neither do we). Everyone has been handed the Worst card. Ravi for his many bad decisions; Major for jumping in with Shawna, the Chaos Killer enthusiast. The only one who hasn't made bad decisions is Clive. 

I do care about Liv cheating because that is now part of her character. She has made a morally bad decision for one guy. And all of it was really just for her to discover the post it note, along with breaking her and Justin up. Basically, all very pointless and will have very little impact for next season. Major/Liv seem to be the endgame couple still, as all of their relationships have been very temporary. Chase is a character that I don't know anything about, so I don't really care for him (and I haven't seen the actor's work, so no bias there). Just bad writing this season. Less about the character motivations, and more about plot motivations. 

[kieyra]

10 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

True, if you tuned in for Jason Dohring, I totally understand! It's not like I love the Liv/Justin pairing myself; it's pretty boring and bland, and it hasn't really been touched on all that much, which is why I look at the individual character decisions and yes, Liv made the worst choice possible by sleeping with Chase Graves, who is all but confirmed as evil at this point (the post it note). It's like they're also trying to draw different parallels, and this is with Liv and Peyton's bad decisions this season (Peyton for sleeping with Blaine, who turned out to be faking his amnesia; at least with Liv, she had no idea and neither do we). Everyone has been handed the Worst card. Ravi for his many bad decisions; Major for jumping in with Shawna, the Chaos Killer enthusiast. The only one who hasn't made bad decisions is Clive. 

I do care about Liv cheating because that is now part of her character. She has made a morally bad decision for one guy. And all of it was really just for her to discover the post it note, along with breaking her and Justin up. Basically, all very pointless and will have very little impact for next season. Major/Liv seem to be the endgame couple still, as all of their relationships have been very temporary. Chase is a character that I don't know anything about, so I don't really care for him (and I haven't seen the actor's work, so no bias there). Just bad writing this season. Less about the character motivations, and more about plot motivations. 

Well, and it seems JD's casting/hookup with female lead had the intended effect--brought in viewers who think he's hot and don't care much beyond that. I'm going to guess that audience segment doesn't care how evil the character is or how bad it makes Liv look. 

As you say though, bad writing, because we have no real basis to care about Justin *or* Chase with Liv. If they were going to go the bad boy route with her, they may as well have used Blaine. 

(I should admit I have my own biases here because the actor who plays Major is the very, very rare dude on television who actually does it for me (one of the others was Scott Speedman, so I obviously have a type)--but I think that's partially because the character has been so well developed, and I'm a sucker for the nice/noble guys who still have a sharp wit. The biceps don't hurt, either.)

Edited June 22, 2017 by kieyra

[Ashand11]

2 hours ago, kieyra said:

Well, and it seems JD's casting/hookup with female lead had the intended effect--brought in viewers who think he's hot and don't care much beyond that. I'm going to guess that audience segment doesn't care how evil the character is or how bad it makes Liv look. 

As you say though, bad writing, because we have no real basis to care about Justin *or* Chase with Liv. If they were going to go the bad boy route with her, they may as well have used Blaine. 

(I should admit I have my own biases here because the actor who plays Major is the very, very rare dude on television who actually does it for me (one of the others was Scott Speedman, so I obviously have a type)--but I think that's partially because the character has been so well developed, and I'm a sucker for the nice/noble guys who still have a sharp wit. The biceps don't hurt, either.)

I watched the show before but gave up on it because I lost interest.  Justin and Liv didn't seem that serious since they only defined the relationship this episode which yes was pretty bad of her to DTR and then cheat the next day.  also, we don't know he's evil yet it just seems to be heading that way.  Thats also Jasons character though, he always plays the misunderstood bad boy. A lot of people watching this show watched Veronica Mars and love JD because of that. Its not like Major's character is all that intriguing either.  The actor is always very bland and always plays the same one dimensional character.

2 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

True, if you tuned in for Jason Dohring, I totally understand! It's not like I love the Liv/Justin pairing myself; it's pretty boring and bland, and it hasn't really been touched on all that much, which is why I look at the individual character decisions and yes, Liv made the worst choice possible by sleeping with Chase Graves, who is all but confirmed as evil at this point (the post it note). It's like they're also trying to draw different parallels, and this is with Liv and Peyton's bad decisions this season (Peyton for sleeping with Blaine, who turned out to be faking his amnesia; at least with Liv, she had no idea and neither do we). Everyone has been handed the Worst card. Ravi for his many bad decisions; Major for jumping in with Shawna, the Chaos Killer enthusiast. The only one who hasn't made bad decisions is Clive. 

I do care about Liv cheating because that is now part of her character. She has made a morally bad decision for one guy. And all of it was really just for her to discover the post it note, along with breaking her and Justin up. Basically, all very pointless and will have very little impact for next season. Major/Liv seem to be the endgame couple still, as all of their relationships have been very temporary. Chase is a character that I don't know anything about, so I don't really care for him (and I haven't seen the actor's work, so no bias there). Just bad writing this season. Less about the character motivations, and more about plot motivations. 

Wasn't it a napkin? Also, how does that mean he's evil? That girl was meeting tons of guys at that bar. She probably gave her number to many of them.

[Lady Calypso]

8 minutes ago, Ashand11 said:

Wasn't it a napkin? Also, how does that mean he's evil? That girl was meeting tons of guys at that bar. She probably gave her number to many of them.

Right! A napkin! Well, if she did happen to sleep with Chase, then he would have turned her into a zombie, right? We obviously have to wait until next week's episode to really get a clear picture. I just think that Chase does have a lot more to him than meets the eye, but I'm not necessarily looking for Liv/Chase to be a couple if he's truly a bad guy. 

8 minutes ago, Ashand11 said:

Its not like Major's character is all that intriguing either.  The actor is always very bland and always plays the same one dimensional character.

Aww man, I love Major. He's the first male lead on this type of show that I've liked. Robert Buckley has a very charismatic presence for me, even when the writing for Major fails. He's actually gotten his funny moments! But obviously perspectives differ here. 

[Ashand11]

40 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

Right! A napkin! Well, if she did happen to sleep with Chase, then he would have turned her into a zombie, right? We obviously have to wait until next week's episode to really get a clear picture. I just think that Chase does have a lot more to him than meets the eye, but I'm not necessarily looking for Liv/Chase to be a couple if he's truly a bad guy. 

Aww man, I love Major. He's the first male lead on this type of show that I've liked. Robert Buckley has a very charismatic presence for me, even when the writing for Major fails. He's actually gotten his funny moments! But obviously perspectives differ here. 

For sure.  He has just not done anything for me in any of the shows he's been in. I find him very cringeworthy and dorky. Maybe its just the characters he plays.

41 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

Right! A napkin! Well, if she did happen to sleep with Chase, then he would have turned her into a zombie, right? We obviously have to wait until next week's episode to really get a clear picture. I just think that Chase does have a lot more to him than meets the eye, but I'm not necessarily looking for Liv/Chase to be a couple if he's truly a bad guy. 

Aww man, I love Major. He's the first male lead on this type of show that I've liked. Robert Buckley has a very charismatic presence for me, even when the writing for Major fails. He's actually gotten his funny moments! But obviously perspectives differ here. 

I think Liv and Ravi would have found out if she was a zombie during the autopsy though. I think there is a lot more to him too. Thats why I like the character, he's a mystery.

[CCTC]

1 minute ago, Lady Calypso said:

Aww man, I love Major. He's the first male lead on this type of show that I've liked. Robert Buckley has a very charismatic presence for me, even when the writing for Major fails. He's actually gotten his funny moments! But obviously perspectives differ here. 

I agree with this.  I actually think he is a pretty decent actor and can do comedy and drama.    I think he is more well-rounded than the typical boyfriend character.

[Lady Calypso]

Just now, Ashand11 said:

For sure.  He has just not done anything for me in any of the shows he's been in. I find him very cringeworthy and dorky. Maybe its just the characters he plays.

Fair enough! I respect that!

I'm just hoping that next season is much better. This season had potential and the stories they set up could have been great, but they failed with too much. This season turned the majority of them into assholes who made really bad and stupid decisions. Hopefully, next season isn't like that. 

[Ashand11]

41 minutes ago, CCTC said:

I agree with this.  I actually think he is a pretty decent actor and can do comedy and drama.    I think he is more well-rounded than the typical boyfriend character.

Maybe he just plays characters that don't allow him to have the kind of range that would display his acting because Ive seen him in quite a few things and he's usually the side piece hanger on boyfriend character and Ive just never really found his acting very good but to each their own. 

[Chicago Redshirt]

4 hours ago, Ashand11 said:

I think it was both. She had no problem fighting off the brain before. Or at least she was able to fight it off.  She was about to leave when he showed up but didn't. 

It could be easier/possible for Liv to fight off Katty-in-heat brain because she knew that actually having sex with normal humans would mean condemning them to zombiehood. It could be easier/possible for her to fend off the impulse of the first 2-3 times because they were first and finally her resistance broke down faced with the 3rd-4th opportunity. She could have been able to fend off the influence of the others because she had no real attraction to the first few people she saw, but she did to Chase. 

We're just guessing.

As far as I can recall, though, this is the first time when Liv was able to consciously able to reject the drives instilled by a brain. Can anyone else remember cases where she had been able to reject a brain's impulses?

4 hours ago, kariyaki said:

Oh, the voiceover, you reminded me. That made me laugh so much. They've never done Liv voiceovers and suddenly, there one is, all echo-y like the heroine of a Lifetime movie.

During the 1st season, Liv voice-overs as to the lesson she learned from being on whatever brain happened on the regular, as I recall.

[Paloma]

13 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

17. What's up with Natalie?

Well, we saw that she came back and apparently took the cure. She told us that she saved a lot of money, traveled the world and was about to do a 6 month stint in Italy. Taking all that at face value, there's still the question of how. When last we saw her, Natalie seemed to basically be a prisoner of a zombie with at least one henchman. He seemed the sort that might wonder where his chosen mistress ended up..

All great questions and possible answers, but this one raised another possible inconsistency for me. If Natalie was basically a forced zombie call girl and later forced mistress of a zombie, why would they have needed to pay her anything? I can see them keeping her in nice surroundings (as much for the clients' benefit as for hers), but she was presumably being kept prisoner and a sex slave by her need for brains, which is why she wanted to kill herself originally.  I just don't see them giving her enough money to save up and travel the world, even assuming she could escape.

[Ashand11]

42 minutes ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

It could be easier/possible for Liv to fight off Katty-in-heat brain because she knew that actually having sex with normal humans would mean condemning them to zombiehood. It could be easier/possible for her to fend off the impulse of the first 2-3 times because they were first and finally her resistance broke down faced with the 3rd-4th opportunity. She could have been able to fend off the influence of the others because she had no real attraction to the first few people she saw, but she did to Chase. 

We're just guessing.

As far as I can recall, though, this is the first time when Liv was able to consciously able to reject the drives instilled by a brain. Can anyone else remember cases where she had been able to reject a brain's impulses?

During the 1st season, Liv voice-overs as to the lesson she learned from being on whatever brain happened on the regular, as I recall.

Well exactly, thats just my guess on why. Also, yes I remember there being voice-overs in season 1.

[Lady Calypso]

Just now, Ashand11 said:

Maybe he just plays characters that don't allow him to have the kind of range that would display his acting because Ive seen him in quite a few things and he's usually the side piece hanger on boyfriend character and Ive just never really found his acting very good but to each their own. 

You know what moment in this series sold it to me? The season 1 finale, when he went and killed all those zombies at Meat Cute. That was when I saw a different side and went "Whoa, that was a badass moment. When did Major get so badass?" And that's when my perspective on him changed, because most shows leave the romantic male lead as a boring, bland guy while other guys who come in show much more promise (see: Lowell). So I just like that he not only gets to be a badass, he also gets to be funny. Like Clive got to be funny this season instead of just being the straight man as he has always been. 

I will say that I did see the chemistry between Chase and Liv. But because of the circumstances that went down that had her cheating on her boyfriend and not talking to him about the brain she was on, it just makes me super uncomfortable. I wish it didn't happen like this. I just don't want them to just excuse her because she was "under the influence of brains". It's a reason why her inhibitions were different, but she still made a choice. So hopefully, the finale can rectify the situation somehow. I'm sure Justin will break up with her, but I'm not sure what else they'll do. 

[Chicago Redshirt]

6 minutes ago, Paloma said:

All great questions and possible answers, but this one raised another possible inconsistency for me. If Natalie was basically a forced zombie call girl and later forced mistress of a zombie, why would they have needed to pay her anything? I can see them keeping her in nice surroundings (as much for the clients' benefit as for hers), but she was presumably being kept prisoner and a sex slave by her need for brains, which is why she wanted to kill herself originally.  I just don't see them giving her enough money to save up and travel the world, even assuming she could escape.

I think a possible explanation -- and it might have even been explicit in Natalie's prior appearance(s) -- is that when she was a mere human call girl, she had saved up a fairly decent amount. Not enough to retire immediately from that life, but a decent amount. She was still en route to saving enough to retire period when Blaine scratched her and basically changed the equation from sex for money to sex for brains. 

While she needed brains, she basically couldn't take the money she'd saved up and run away. 

But once she was human again, she was basically like, "Why worry about saving up for tomorrow when I can enjoy what I have today."

[Ashand11]

52 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

You know what moment in this series sold it to me? The season 1 finale, when he went and killed all those zombies at Meat Cute. That was when I saw a different side and went "Whoa, that was a badass moment. When did Major get so badass?" And that's when my perspective on him changed, because most shows leave the romantic male lead as a boring, bland guy while other guys who come in show much more promise (see: Lowell). So I just like that he not only gets to be a badass, he also gets to be funny. Like Clive got to be funny this season instead of just being the straight man as he has always been. 

I will say that I did see the chemistry between Chase and Liv. But because of the circumstances that went down that had her cheating on her boyfriend and not talking to him about the brain she was on, it just makes me super uncomfortable. I wish it didn't happen like this. I just don't want them to just excuse her because she was "under the influence of brains". It's a reason why her inhibitions were different, but she still made a choice. So hopefully, the finale can rectify the situation somehow. I'm sure Justin will break up with her, but I'm not sure what else they'll do. 

yes fair. Like i said I stopped watching around the time that Major and Liv were dating and he was hunting zombies.  I just didn't see them as a couple. It was boring and there was no chemistry. For me anyway, other people may have seen it differently. Its nice that he has his own story lines too though.

[luna1122]

I am not under the influence of slutty zombie brains, but I'da been all over Chase too. Jason dohring really does have chemistry with everyone. The scene in the restaurant was really sexy. And dayum, logan always looked great without his shirt, but his body is ridiculous now. Liv has superhuman willpower to have not joined him in that shower. More please. 

[GladysKravitz]

I apologize if this was discussed up thread and I somehow missed it, but what's up with that dog? Earlier in the episode, someone recounting who had been on the plane said something like "and that little dog." Then later, in Chase's hotel room, up pops a little dog. Is it the same dog? It has to tie in somehow.

[Ashand11]

1 hour ago, luna1122 said:

I am not under the influence of slutty zombie brains, but I'da been all over Chase too. Jason dohring really does have chemistry with everyone. The scene in the restaurant was really sexy. And dayum, logan always looked great without his shirt, but his body is ridiculous now. Liv has superhuman willpower to have not joined him in that shower. More please. 

lol we don't know she didn't.

47 minutes ago, GladysKravitz said:

I apologize if this was discussed up thread and I somehow missed it, but what's up with that dog? Earlier in the episode, someone recounting who had been on the plane said something like "and that little dog." Then later, in Chase's hotel room, up pops a little dog. Is it the same dog? It has to tie in somehow.

I definitely feel like there is some significance to that dog.

[Anela]

2 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

Right! A napkin! Well, if she did happen to sleep with Chase, then he would have turned her into a zombie, right? We obviously have to wait until next week's episode to really get a clear picture. I just think that Chase does have a lot more to him than meets the eye, but I'm not necessarily looking for Liv/Chase to be a couple if he's truly a bad guy. 

Aww man, I love Major. He's the first male lead on this type of show that I've liked. Robert Buckley has a very charismatic presence for me, even when the writing for Major fails. He's actually gotten his funny moments! But obviously perspectives differ here. 

I like Major, too.

[Richness]

16 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Seemed like a lot of people were carrying idiot balls.

A.

[...]

F.

I'd like to add item G. When knocking out Zombie Harley, they sent the human Major in to administer the tranquilizer. I know Major has turned into a bad ass, earning the respect of the FG troops, but Liv should of done that so as not to risk Major being scratched by Harley, and being turned back into a zombie.

15 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Although plotwise I am not happy about Liv sleeping with Chase, I still must say thank you to Rob Thomas for giving me Jason Dohring walking around mostly naked. Bonus: PUPPY!

Yeah, the spray tan scene last episode was hot, but I was able to resist his charms then. However, I totally succumbed like Liv did during the whole bathroom brush in boxers scene. There was one brief briefs view when the puppy was introduced that I may have watched a few times. I'm need me some gifs. I think Major is still sexier though, as Jason is a bit too slim for my tastes. However, I need to make a killer abs t-shirt to wear to Dragon Con. The Raiders of the Lost Ark reference was also cute.

 

That said, I too am upset with Liv for cheating on Justin, especially after they just finished discussing their relationship. However, I'm not perturbed by that relationship, and the speed that it came on. I continue to enjoy this show immensely.

[possibilities]

5 hours ago, kieyra said:

I'm going to guess that audience segment doesn't care how evil the character is or how bad it makes Liv look. 

Or how bad his diction is. I can't understand a word that issues from his peanut-butter-and-marble-filled mouth without closed captions to assist me.  We already have Major's abs, if we need some man candy. Dohring plays Chase, the military hard ass, the exact same way he played Logan, the woobie lost boy. I am immune to his charms.

It had not occurred to me that Natalie might still be a zombie, and it would call her character into question because up til now she's been portrayed as a genuinely decent and honest person. So I'd think she would explain herself to Major when they were catching up, if she hadn't taken the cure. And we already know he wouldn't have sex with her knowing she's a zombie, because that's what ended his romance with Liv.

However, the virtue of the Natalie is still a Zombie idea is that if she re-infected Major that would make it easier to integrate him into the ensemble again, and a little less tragic if she got blown up, because it would mean she wasn't as honest and likable as we'd thought. Major was kind of at a dead end. He can't get work, he can't hang out with zombies, he's hated by humans, he's lonely and directionless and had no where to go... the guy who cared about homeless teens, found a way to subvert the Max Rager "kill them" imperative... they need to give him something to do besides mope.

I can't get over Ravi spilling secrets it was not his place to spill to a woman he barely knew. And that's two strikes against him because I also couldn't stand how he was acting towards Peyton earlier this season. I don't know what they thought they were doing, or how they could make me like him again, and it's very disappointing because he used to be one of my favorites.

[jay741982]

16 hours ago, GenL said:

Ok, so this was my guess.  Ravi was shouting unsexy things to try to ....  ummm... last longer.  That was my impression.

That was my guess as well 

[jay741982]

Liv cheating on her boyfriend was shitty. I know they just became offical or whatever but seriously that was shitty. I know she was on a slutty brain but still.. I'm convinced Natalie was legit human again cause they refuse to let Major be happy. Sucks as I was starting to like her and She had Chem with Major. They won't let Liv be happy either hence her being shitty and screwing Chase. Knowing this show it possibly increased Justin's chance for survival since this show likes to kill anyone not named Major that Liv sleeps with 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I loved that Ravi called out that plane passenger on her blatant racism and ignorance. Sadly, not at all surprised that she was still completely oblivious.

I had to laugh when Chase pointed out that the blogger didn't even write a proper haiku. Like it's bad enough that she betrayed Major's confidence, but she can't even write a simple seventeen syllable poem which is something that elementary school kids do.

I also cracked up when Katty asked Ravi if he was okay (when Liv was hiding under his desk) and he said it was just an old quidditch injury.

[AllyB]

6 hours ago, Ashand11 said:

Maybe he just plays characters that don't allow him to have the kind of range that would display his acting because Ive seen him in quite a few things and he's usually the side piece hanger on boyfriend character and Ive just never really found his acting very good but to each their own. 

Considering that you didn't watch most of this show where Buckley got to do the exact opposite of what you are describing, you can't really say that. When IZombie started Major seemed like dead weight on the show, a bland former love interest of the lead with no real personality outside of that. Many posters called him Duncan 2.0 and felt the show would be improved by his departure. But by the season 1 finale that had begun to change as Major had some surprisingly entertaining moments where he was funny and smart. By early season 2 he grew into an enormously witty character who was a joy to watch on screen. Initially because he was paired frequently with Ravi at the point when Ravi was a truly fantastic character but as Buckley made the role his own, Major became a great character in his own right. Robert Buckley has done a marvellous job turning the boring ex into an utterly charming, witty character.

And as for JD always playing the misunderstood bad boy, that's not what's happening here. He's playing the military leader who Liv and co see as an ally and a good guy. But is in all likelihood a hero in his own head who believes the ends justify the means to the point where he is making decisions that make him the actual big bad of the season. That's the polar opposite of Logan Echolls. 

[AllyB]

4 hours ago, GladysKravitz said:

I apologize if this was discussed up thread and I somehow missed it, but what's up with that dog? Earlier in the episode, someone recounting who had been on the plane said something like "and that little dog." Then later, in Chase's hotel room, up pops a little dog. Is it the same dog? It has to tie in somehow.

Good catch. That probably will be integral to the story arc. This season hasn't been a fraction as clever as the first two seasons were in terms of how they introduced clues that all tied together so nicely in brilliantly executed reveals but the little dog is surely a deliberately placed important point.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

ITA that Major began as boring/bland deadweight at the beginning of S1 but he has become funny, sweet, and badass. I have been pleasantly surprised by how much I've grown to like him. In the first season, I used to dread his scenes because they were so dull and one note. Now I love seeing him with the other characters. I think one contributing factor is that I like him interacting with the other main characters, particularly his friendship with Ravi.

As for JD always playing a misunderstood bad boy, Logan is the only character I remember him playing that fits that particular description. I haven't watched everything he's been in, but I've seen him in several post-VM shows and he wasn't a misunderstood bad boy on Moonlight, The Originals, or Ringer. I know I also saw him when he guest starred on Lie to Me and Tomorrow People but I don't remember the specifics of those characters, but I'm 99% sure they weren't anything like Logan either. I don't see Chase as similar to obligatory psychotic jackass/woobie Logan. Chase has been portrayed as a hardass military leader who is committed to his mission and will do whatever it takes to protect his unit and achieve his goals. Logan was a smartass who mouthed off to authority figures and had no discernible goals beyond his weekend plans.

[enness2000]

Do we know how long the zombie scratch takes to work? The cutaway between the bomb reveal and the actual explosion leaves some wiggle room for "one of the FG soldiers was sharp enough to immediately scratch her", so you've still got 'Natalie's a zombie again' tragedy without the logistical issue of Major potentially being infected. It's a reach, though, and I'm inclined to think she's just dead (not like the show's been shy about killing off random love interests in the past). 

I cut Liv a lot of slack on the brain front, in that it's pretty well-established that she's barely aware of when the brains are taking over, and rarely able to control them. She's hurled herself into life-threatening danger under the control of 'superhero' brains and not been able to reason with herself, so I think cheating on someone is comparatively easy to see as being uncontrollable brain urge. And given that she didn't know when she spoke to Justin that she was on nympho brains, and by the time she knew what was going on she was already slipping back into Katty-mode, I'm inclined to sympathise with her (in the larger seasonal and series-long picture of her hating how much her personality changes and how little her 'real' self has control). Not saying that I'd expect Justin to see it that way, or would necessarily see it that way in his shoes, but just saying that I'm not as mad at Liv as others above seem to be.

Given the 'tiny dog' link, I guess we can assume Chase was on the same flight, potentially travelling under an assumed name (which would fit for an ex-military slightly-paranoid guy), and that's how Katty met him? And he killed her to cover up the potential zombie exposure? I don't think he's the full-on season big bad though - given that the Johns brothers were being set up as patsies, there's someone else who blew up Vivian's helicopter, killed an FG employee and his family, shot at Barracus, and set up the whole Weckler mess. A senior FG person is the obvious candidate (given there's any number of things Vivian, the army dude and a random FG employee could have been killed to cover up, and helping Barracus become Mayor is a big win for zombie-kind), so it's really between Chase and the other woman whose name escapes me. I kinda hope the latter, as having Chase blow in halfway through the season and be responsible for everything (even stuff that supposedly happened before he was around) is a bit lame. 

[kieyra]

9 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

You know what moment in this series sold it to me? The season 1 finale, when he went and killed all those zombies at Meat Cute. That was when I saw a different side and went "Whoa, that was a badass moment. When did Major get so badass?" And that's when my perspective on him changed, because most shows leave the romantic male lead as a boring, bland guy while other guys who come in show much more promise (see: Lowell). So I just like that he not only gets to be a badass, he also gets to be funny. Like Clive got to be funny this season instead of just being the straight man as he has always been. 

Yes, this was exactly it for me. I think I recall from your other posts you haven't seen Veronica Mars, but the show featured a "currently unavailable ex" who was bland as hell, and the obnoxious "bad boy" type of love interest to complete the triangle. It looked like Blaine was going to be the latter, so I automatically assumed Major was never going to get to do anything interesting and didn't pay much attention. So when it turned out he was a stealth badass at the end of season 1, I did the fastest 180 I've ever done on any fictional character, especially when I realized the s1 writing had set up his arc and I just hadn't been paying enough attention.

[Affogato]

9 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

While she needed brains, she basically couldn't take the money she'd saved up and run away. 

But once she was human again, she was basically like, "Why worry about saving up for tomorrow when I can enjoy what I have today."

the puppy dog was in the plane, there are no coincidences ? was pupper coming with carry, Natalie, someone we don'tchanged is Natalie connected to chase? I think possible, anyway, and that sending her in may be to find out about cure.

 

also, she was probably paid as whore, neither Blaine or fg ignoring bussing ness model.

Carey, not carry because phone.

[Chicago Redshirt]

21 hours ago, blugirlami21 said:

I thought we saw Blaine turn several people into zombies through sex in the first season.  I'm pretty sure she's not a zombie either way.  I was ambivalent to her character for the most part but I'm sad that she went out like that just when her life was starting again.  I will say I didn't understand why or how she was being held captive as a zombie?  She's a zombie why didn't she just rage out and leave?  I kind of zoned out during their scenes so I missed Major agreeing to go to Italy, that would have been an immediate red flag that Natalie was not going to be alive long enough for that to happen.  I kind of feel bad for Major and I kind of don't.  He makes stupid choices all the time.  He hasn't had a storyline not tied to being a love interest in a long time and he's better than that.  He was so awesome when he was a zombie killer in season one, I need more of that Major on the show and not this lovesick idiot we see week in and week out.
...

Ravi's character has taken a tumble this season and I too am disappointed that he like Major keeps making stupid choices over and over.  I will say good on him for telling the reporter off.  I'm not sure what she really thought was going to happen there??  You made him think that you were friends and made him trust you enough to tell you a huge secret but then you wrote a national article about it without his knowledge or permission.  Did you really think he was going to welcome you back with open arms?  

In fairness, in at least one scene from the first season, Blaine deliberately scratched the woman he slept with. It could be that the average zombie doesn't know that any zombie sex will infect a human. Our Heroes know, and Fillmore-Graves knows. I would presume Natalie would have known since basically she was recruited to be a zombie call girl in part because to keep zombies from infecting people, IIRC.

Natalie was a call girl for other zombies, so raging out would not necessarily work as they were likely as strong or stronger than her. Also, she needed brains to survive and wasn't enterprising or amoral enough to get them herself. Blaine, and then presumably her client(s), kept her supplied, which kept her tied down.

Major's storyline about joining FG and finding a home there is a non-love interest storyline, as was whether he could safely be cured.

 

19 hours ago, kariyaki said:

So Ravi is a selfish lover as well. His stock just keeps plummeting, doesn't it? Peyton should be considering herself luckier and luckier...

Ravi trying to last longer by thinking/saying unsexy things is more unselfish than selfish, IMO. 

16 hours ago, blugirlami21 said:

I thought the post it meant that he had her killed, no?  She was obviously getting to close to something he didn't want discovered.

Fairly sure the cocktail napkin is a red herring. It does raise the question as to why Chase kept it, though. If he's Katty's killer, it seems sloppy to keep something that connects him to her in his room. If he was into possibly hooking up with Katty, seems pretty scummy, knowing that he would zombify her. Which is not beyond Chase, but still. If he's not interested in possibly hooking up with Katty, then what's the point of keeping her room number?

Given the 'tiny dog' link, I guess we can assume Chase was on the same flight, potentially travelling under an assumed name (which would fit for an ex-military slightly-paranoid guy), and that's how Katty met him? And he killed her to cover up the potential zombie exposure? I don't think he's the full-on season big bad though - given that the Johns brothers were being set up as patsies, there's someone else who blew up Vivian's helicopter, killed an FG employee and his family, shot at Barracus, and set up the whole Weckler mess. A senior FG person is the obvious candidate (given there's any number of things Vivian, the army dude and a random FG employee could have been killed to cover up, and helping Barracus become Mayor is a big win for zombie-kind), so it's really between Chase and the other woman whose name escapes me. I kinda hope the latter, as having Chase blow in halfway through the season and be responsible for everything (even stuff that supposedly happened before he was around) is a bit lame.

Taking Chase at his word (a risky proposition, I realize), he has been staying at this hotel for a couple months or so since he got back from Tripoli. (Should we take this prolonged hotel stay as a shoutout to the Neptune Grand from Veronica Mars?) It doesn't make much sense that someone in his position with his obvious wealth would spend so much time at a hotel when he could just buy a place or stay on Zombie Island or what have you. Anyway, it seems more likely to me that Katty simply met Chase at the hotel bar. Katty seemed to reject out of hand that zombies were real when she visited with Ravi, so I don't think I'd buy that she had a complete change of beliefs a short while later and that required Chase to kill her.

One other unrelated thought: For the first time in a while, I got the connection between victim and meal. Liv turned Katty Cupps' brain into a brain cupcake.

[Affogato]

anyone know 30 days of night? Vamps not zombies, still Aleutian flu could come from previous out real of zombie ism.

[Bort]

6 minutes ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

Ravi trying to last longer by thinking/saying unsexy things is more unselfish than selfish, IMO. 

My point was that he shouldn't SAY them because then the woman goes nowhere either.

[Chicago Redshirt]

2 minutes ago, Affogato said:

the puppy dog was in the plane, there are no coincidences ? was pupper coming with carry, Natalie, someone we don'tchanged is Natalie connected to chase? I think possible, anyway, and that sending her in may be to find out about cure.

 

also, she was probably paid as whore, neither Blaine or fg ignoring bussing ness model.

Carey, not carry because phone.

It's weird to think that the dog was actually on the plane. AFAIK, most airlines would force non-service animals to be crated and transported separately.

This raises the question: are dogs potential transmitters of the zombie virus? Is unnamed pupper a zombie dog/virus carrier?

[Paloma]

9 hours ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

I think a possible explanation -- and it might have even been explicit in Natalie's prior appearance(s) -- is that when she was a mere human call girl, she had saved up a fairly decent amount.

I guess I missed (or forgot with all the millions of plot elements) that Natalie was a call girl before she was turned. I was under the impression that Blaine made her become a call girl, but you are probably right.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

2 minutes ago, Chicago Redshirt said:

It's weird to think that the dog was actually on the plane. AFAIK, most airlines would force non-service animals to be crated and transported separately.

In theory, yes, but these days everyone claims that their pets are therapy dogs so that they can take them on planes with them. Even before that was a popular way of breaking the rules, small dogs were allowed in the cabin as long as they were in a bag or other kind of cage that fit under the seat. I remember ten years ago, a girl I knew used to fly with her dog that way, but when she opened the cage door to pet the dog during the flight, the flight attendant said that if she opened the cage again she was going to get in trouble.

[Paloma]

Sorry if someone already suggested this upthread, but isn't it possible that the CDC is using "Aleutian flu" as a code name for investigating their suspicions of a zombie epidemic? If they had those suspicions, they would of course keep them secret to avoid creating panic.

[Chicago Redshirt]

46 minutes ago, Paloma said:

Sorry if someone already suggested this upthread, but isn't it possible that the CDC is using "Aleutian flu" as a code name for investigating their suspicions of a zombie epidemic? If they had those suspicions, they would of course keep them secret to avoid creating panic.

I Googled "Aleutian flu" but it doesn't seem to be a real thing. In the iZombieverse, though, former CDC person Ravi seems to recognize it as a thing that has happened.

I think we are supposed to take Katty at face value that she doesn't believe in zombies or the zombie virus. So although we know the actual disease is zombieism, Katty seemingly has it confused with Aleutian flu. 

Edited June 22, 2017 by Chicago Redshirt

[dubbel zout]

6 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

I had to laugh when Chase pointed out that the blogger didn't even write a proper haiku. Like it's bad enough that she betrayed Major's confidence, but she can't even write a simple seventeen syllable poem which is something that elementary school kids do.

I loved that, too. I always enjoy it when people in shows correct other people's bad grammar, too. Petty pedagoguery for the win!

[kieyra]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

I loved that, too. I always enjoy it when people in shows correct other people's bad grammar, too. Petty pedagoguery for the win!

I want to rip my hair out when television characters say "I'm going to lay low for a few days".  

And so many of them say it. 

[dubbel zout]

And the misuse of I? "He told John and I to meet him at the restaurant." AAAAAAGH.

[AllyB]

18 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

You know what moment in this series sold it to me? The season 1 finale, when he went and killed all those zombies at Meat Cute. That was when I saw a different side and went "Whoa, that was a badass moment. When did Major get so badass?" And that's when my perspective on him changed,

That was definitely his defining moment. He was captured by Blaine, heard Liv's brother show up and Blaine was psychologically torturing him by taunting him about Liv and physically torturing him with cold I didn't care. I was bored by Major just as I always had been. He was trapped in the freezer found a lighter and I was just wishing the action could get back to the entertaining characters like Liv and Ravi. But then he literally saved himself by pissing on the floor and was so gleeful and charmingly cocky about it that I couldn't help but be impressed. I still had reservations about him when it seemed like he was going to be a glum zombie, resentful of Liv for saving him the only way she could. But by being paired up with Ravi (and Minor) in season 2 it was easy to let go of the negative first impression from season 1. That said, I rewatched the first 2 seasons before this season and the actual moment I think Buckley really started making Major into a great character was in his scene with Ravi the morning before he checked himself into the mental hospital. He and Ravi have a great exchange as he's packing and Major plays along with Ravi's jokey bit.

(I also thought Buckley did a fun job as one of the Riddler's henchmen in the short lived Powerless.)

[dubbel zout]

10 minutes ago, AllyB said:

(I also thought Buckley did a fun job as one of the Riddler's henchmen in the short lived Powerless.)

He was very funny there. I think he's slightly underrated/underestimated as an actor because he's so screamingly good-looking, and that pigeonholes him a bit. I'm not saying he's Daniel Day-Lewis or anything, but he's not just a dumb hunk.

(Aside: I miss Powerless. I was sorry to see it go.)