Heartaches, Bromances, True Love and Team Arrow: the Relationships Thread

[pootlus]

Oh poor dumb Clark lol

 

Oy, don't you pollute my Clark Kent with that dumb unrecognisable lunk they had on Smallville. The real CK is smart!

 

Removing the emotional support: Could he do it on his own? I think so. I like the fact that Oliver is smart (ignoring the dumb ass plot device decisions) and certainly capable. I want to respect the hero's abilities and I respect Oliver's. I don't want a Clark situation were he needs his hand held and big flashing signs. However, he wouldn't be as effective or be able to maintain the mission on his own. I'm thinking of the number of times he has been hurt and the potential for more damage. He needs someone to watch his back (Diggle). He also needs resources (Felicity).

I watch the show for action and Team Arrow (I like Olicity, but it's not why I watch), so ITA with this. I like that Oliver leans on his teammates. One of the Superman tropes I like so much is that you have this guy who can basically do anything, but he sees so much crap that he needs emotional support (Lois Lane, thank you idiot Nu52, Diana has her own crap to deal with). 

I hope that the Season 3 pushing away of both Diggle and Felicity isn't done heavy-handed.

[BkWurm1]

Needing them to be competent? No. I can't buy it.

 

I don't think Arrow, Green or otherwise has ever been built to be the total package on his own.  He has his absolute skills where no one is better than him - all things archery - and that will take him pretty far but no where near as far as he gets with a team that can not only back him up in the field but also provide him with needed intel and electronic support.  Even in the comics, he has someone manning the computers and another person creating his weaponry. 

 

I think only Batman has ever been portrayed as not needing a team in order to be completely effective on his own (and even then he has Alfred) which is ironic given how many side kicks and partners he acquires over the years.  Still, for all his complete self sufficiency, Batman in the long run becomes a tragic and lonely figure.  He doesn't need anyone so often he has no one.   

 

I'm much happier watching Oliver Queen who will always be better with the influence of others. 

[statsgirl]

It all goes back to humanizing Oliver. Its funny people complain about romance in a show, but we grow to love characters based on their relationships. How they interact with each other, how they learn, change, laugh and cry together. Friend or Foe or Lover; It's all so important to the show narrative.

Humanizing Oliver is the five year arc of the show (first five years, hopefully).  It's what makes the TV show different from the previous comic book shows that failed. As present day Oliver grows more human, past Oliver becomes the cold killer he was in the premier.

 

In terms of the show itself, I think it makes sense to have a team because it's more interesting.  Oliver can bounce off of the characters on his team, being serious and learning with Diggle, being light and funny with Felicity, teaching Roy what to do and how to handle it emotionally, as he learned from Diggle.  Different interactions with different people, changing things up for the viewers, are what keep a show on the air.

Edited September 3, 2014 by statsgirl

[Ceylon5]

Essential...sure but what I mean is...Oliver not having Felicity shouldn't = him not being able to fight crime. Same if he didn't have Diggle.

 

Except that (in physical terms) he would have either ended up in jail or be dead (many times over) by now if he had persisted in his vigilante ways on his own (which, by the way, I wouldn't define as "fighting crime", anyway).  And if he'd somehow survived long enough to reach his emotional breaking point and give up (as he did at the end of both seasons), he would now be living back on his island, broken, alone and uninterested in Starling City and its criminals.  Plus, he would have remained purely a stone-cold vigilante killer, not a crime-fighter, if not for them and their non-PTSD view-points and resistance to killing as the go-to method of getting things done.  So IMO that makes them 100% essential to his ability to fight crime on any kind of long term basis, or even at all, and the show has shown us that repeatedly.  I would even go so far as to say that that's kind of the whole point of the story: how he was broken in the past; and how he's slowly gaining back his ability to function both as a normal person and as a fighter and a hero *through his relationships* in the present.

 

The story has clearly shown that these people are inter-dependent as a crime-fighting team.  IMO, the underlying premise is that Oliver cannot become a hero on his own.  Being able to shoot straight and do the salmon ladder does not a hero make.  It's a lot more subtle and complex than that, and his team is a crucial part of his emotional journey.  To imply that his mental and emotional states are not relevant to his overall ability to fight crime, be a hero, etc. is, again IMO, 100% wrong.  His beliefs (killing vs not killing), his emotional response to situations and ability to deal with setbacks, etc. are all critical aspects of who he is and what he can achieve as a crime fighter.  That's why cops who are involved in shootings are required to attend mandatory counselling sessions - mental health and emotional stability are paramount in the kind of high pressure, dangerous work that such people do.  Oliver needs other people (Felicity & Diggle in particular, because they're the ones who know him best and spend the most time with him) more than anyone else on this show.  He's a very damaged individual, and one of the most careful, well-written things the writers have done is show how much he needs the others, and his growing awareness and acknowledgement of that over the course of the last 2 seasons.

 

No-one is arguing that having them around makes him a better archer, any more than having Oliver and Dig around makes Felicity better on computers.  That is his skill and he is awesome at it with no help from them.  However, crime-fighting and "saving the city" is not a one-person job.  Even without Oliver's emotional brokenness and damage, a team of 3 is always going to be stronger and more effective and safer than a single person with no back-up or complementary skills or differing, grounding viewpoints.  Why would anyone want to do it on their own?  Felicity enables Oliver to fight crime in the same way Oliver enables Felicity to fight crime.  That's what it means to be a team.

 

ETA:

With the exception of Clark at times the rest could get shit done on their own. (See the times Buffy went on patrol all by her lonesome for example)

IIRC (which I might not), didn't Buffy die (repeatedly...) and have to be brought back to life by her team (repeatedly)?  The argument isn't that these individuals aren't kickass, awesome fighters, but rather that for a bigger mission that doesn't end with their early and untimely death/ incarceration/ other unpleasant outcome, people are better off doing this kind of dangerous stuff in teams rather than in lonely splendour.

Edited September 3, 2014 by Ceylon5

[Morrigan2575]

IIRC (which I might not), didn't Buffy die (repeatedly...) and have to be brought back to life by her team (repeatedly)?  The argument isn't that these individuals aren't kickass, awesome fighters, but rather that for a bigger mission that doesn't end with their early and untimely death/ incarceration/ other unpleasant outcome, people are better off doing this kind of dangerous stuff in teams rather than in lonely splendour.

 

3 times (sort of)  in S1 she was killed by the Master and saved by Xander, In AU "The Wish" she was killed by the Master but Giles broke Anya's charm which reversed the wish and brought everyone back to life and in S5 she sacrificed herself to save the world and was brought back from heaven by Willow.  

 

The show made a huge point in S2 and S7 (I think) about how Buffy was such a successful Slayer because of her team.  Up until Buffy, Slayers were short lived and disposable but unlike the other Slayers Buffy wasn't alone, she had a strong support system (emotionally, physically, magic-y) which is why she survived as long as she did.  It's been a long time since I watched and I wasn't a huge fan of S6/7 but IIRC the big point of making all the potential slayers into actual slayers was to share the power and responsibility, the Slayers were now taking control of their lives rather then being the servants of the Watchers.  Making all potential Slayers into actual Slayers gave the girls a team and support structure for what they had to face.

 

Seems to me that Arrow is basically doing the same thing Buffy and Angel did in the past, showing that while a hero's journey can be walked alone they do better when the hero has a team to support them and call them out on their BS. The hero finds that they can become more than they ever thought possible through their relationships with others.

Edited September 3, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[dtissagirl]

In those first 10 episodes of S2, there was an underlying motif to the new no-killing rule that was larger than honoring Tommy --  that "The Arrow" is more than just Oliver himself shooting arrows and taking down thugs, but also it was the start of the idea of what a hero can represent to the city. This is Superheroing 101, the figure in tights doing acrobatics across rooftops is the beacon of hope for the citizens. So in a way Team Arrow IS The Arrow because each person's skills complement each other and make everything work so that when Oliver puts on the uniform, can be that figure for Starling City.

 

And I think for both Dig and Felicity, it went past Oliver's reliance on them a long while ago. They haven't been on this mission just FOR Oliver anymore, pretty much since the Undertaking. I mean. Oliver legit quit after that and ran to a place he calls hell, and still Dig and Felicity kept working on the lair, and then went to the island to get Oliver back, because they already consider protecting the city their priority as much as Oliver's.

[calliope1975]

And I think for both Dig and Felicity, it went past Oliver's reliance on them a long while ago. They haven't been on this mission just FOR Oliver anymore, pretty much since the Undertaking. I mean. Oliver legit quit after that and ran to a place he calls hell, and still Dig and Felicity kept working on the lair, and then went to the island to get Oliver back, because they already consider protecting the city their priority as much as Oliver's.

 

And that's why for me, though I don't know if it's the show's intention, the hero's journey I'm watching is as much Diggle, Felicity. and Sara's as it is Oliver's. I'll even throw Roy in there, too. Each has a different motivation for sacrificing their lives for the greater good. I think this will be explored more in the upcoming season. I can't imagine how boring this show would be if it was just Oliver alone. Actually, I do know I wouldn't be watching the perpetual broody Batman-lite. 

[TanyaKay]

^^^^

 

Oliver is the one who dons the mask and leather but the whole Team Arrow represent the hero. It is all for one and one for all. For me, Team Arrow is still Diggle, Felicity and Oliver with Sara in guest appearance mode. I am not sure what to think of Roy because season 2 kinda skipped on team bonding moments with Roy. I will form my opinion about Roy as a full fledged Team Arrow member after watching season 3.

[tv echo]

Without Diggle and Felicity, Oliver would have died long ago - either he would have been killed by others or he would have gone so dark into himself that he might have killed himself.  After five horrible, nightmarish years away under that kind of torture, stress and pain, you just don't recover quickly or on your own if you're hiding yourself from everybody and not letting anyone in.  Having Team Arrow to share your burden and your pain to some extent probably saved him.

 

Other stuff I wanted to say about Team Arrow has already been said beautifully by others both here and in the Team Arrow: The Power of Three thread.  

[TanyaKay]

Looks like there is some serious bromance going on between Emily Bett Rickards and Charlotte Ross

 

 

[BkWurm1]

either he would have been killed by others or he would have gone so dark into himself that he might have killed himself

 

Taking to the Oliver thread.

[calliope1975]

I think the Olicity backlash is inevitable. TPTB have been steadily increasing how much they're promoted to the neglect of most other story lines. If you're not a shipper or more of a fan of the action/other characters, I can see how it would get annoying. And since TPTB know Felicity and Olicity gets social media buzzing, I don't think they're going to change their strategy. Which is going to cause more resentment.

 

I am a shipper and even with all the promo, based on the past two seasons, I don't think Olicity will take over the show. And I wouldn't want it to - for me, it's a key part of the show but not the whole of it. 

 

But yeah, I think the more they push it, the louder the naysayers are going to become.

[Velocity23]

With how season 2 finished i guess they felt they need to reassured the fans of O/F that is true, not a setup. I found it more annoying that Matt wanted to start crap with his comment. 

[NumberCruncher]

What a silly question. How many women has Oliver slept with on the show and nobody gave a rat's ass? Why is it only an issue now? I swear I'll never understand the complaints about shipping and relationships since the show has ALWAYS done them.

[SmallScreenDiva]

With how season 2 finished i guess they felt they need to reassured the fans of O/F that is true, not a setup. I found it more annoying that Matt wanted to start crap with his comment. 

 

That's what pissed me off. You can still ask questions and get the discussion going but the tenor of those questions just invited nastiness.

[Morrigan2575]

I would have to agree, his "discussion comment" was similar to striking a match.  I generally expect better from him, he's usually well above that kind of behavior (shipper baiting to get hits).

 

The irony is that if you go to spoiler.tv and read the 100+ comments about the promo there is 1 person bitching about Olicity taking over the show. Every other comment is squeeing over the action, team bonding, date, Sara, even a couple of OMG Laurel's kickass, comments.  So, I honestly wouldn't be surprised if any "backlash" on TV|Line is a direct result of the prompt.

[MsSchadenfreude]

I think backlash is pretty much inevitable.  Usually the more popular the couple or story, the louder and nastier the vitriol is from people who don't like them.  I doubt very much anything will change with the promotion for the show until the premiere because love or hate Oliver/Felicity that is all anybody (including TVline) can talk about.

[Chaser]

Its all marketing and what gets people talking. Anyone with a basic understanding of PR gets what they are doing. I'm disapointed he went there though. It wasn't the place for it.

 

The show is not turning into the Olicity show or becoming romance driven. And frankly, the people who say they hate romance on the show should be watching another network.

 

RE: Backlash is going to happen. But It's still a homerun for the network; the majority still seem in favor of the pairing and the naysayers won't shut up about it. Its better than the indifference of Oliver/Laurel.

 

I do wish the promotion was more even though.

Edited September 5, 2014 by 10Eleven12

[JJ928]

But what some people don't understand, is that by talking about hating that pairing, you're still giving it attention. At the end of the day, when they spend more time talking about how much they hate Olicity, and not how much they love L/O, they're just promoting Olicity more. It's counter productive.

Edited September 5, 2014 by JJ928

[Sakura12]

The way I look at it, is like this. On one hand I wish we'd get more information on every other character, but on the other hand I feel like there is nothing to be surprised by with Olictiy at least for episode 1. So it might be better to be surprised by what happened or is happening with everyone else when the episode actually airs. 

[Password]

Regardless of how you look at it, Olicity sells. Most of the spoilers are Olicity related because it gets buzz going like crazy. Doesn't mean the show will turn into Olicity. There's so much we don't know that's being kept under wraps about everyone else's arc in season 3. I don't mind it because I'll be surprised when it happens.

Even so, there's definitely something missing about Olicity that we don't know yet.

And I really think the reason there aren't that many Lauriver cries is because Lauriver isn't particularly pleasant on the palate.

Edited September 5, 2014 by ArrowLimbo

[catrox14]

He was baiting to drive the comments and visits to his page. 

[Chaser]

There is something they aren't telling us about Olicity, but Olicity isn't going to be their trump card for the episode. I think that will come of the form of Malcolm/Thea or LOA/Sara or Ray Palmer with all the build up for him. 

 

Reading the comments it feels like a war between Olicity vs. No Romance. Which is a losing batte, but I'm actually not seeing a lot of people bring up Oliver/Laurel.

[wonderwall]

I think Olicity will be the trump card for the premier, at least on an emotional level. It's going to be a key element to Oliver's emotional journey throughout the season. However, it most definitely will not be the trump card for the premier on a more physical level and plot-wise. I mean, the writers said that they're going to be setting up a mystery (as they did in season 1) in the first episode which will have a surprising conclusion in the midseason finale. So I think they'll focus more on that.

 

No one (other than the Lauriver shippers) have brought up Lauriver over the past few months. When it came to Oliver's relationships, it was all about Felicity (good and bad). Shows like Arrow need romance in order to keep it grounded. It not only enhances characterization, but it also adds a sense of realism to the show. I mean, how on earth can someone relate to Oliver if he were just an island? People relate to him through his relationships (platonic and non-platonic). 

 

As for the TVline article, I wasn't offended by it because the show has been teasing Olicity a LOT. I mean, A LOT. I just want Oliver and Felicity to either get together or be done with it because teasing only works for so long. And to be honest, I, along with the majority of the internet fandom WAS surprised by the date and the fact that they're going 'there' this fast. That being said, Matt was being a troll and baiting the shippers vs. non shippers. Why else do you think there are so many comments on the board? It's usually the shipper articles and Laurel articles that have the most comments for Arrow tbqh. It's a nasty trick, but I don't think it means anything or shows that Matt doesn't like Olicity. Clicker baiting is a real thing. 

Edited September 5, 2014 by wonderwall

[Iamsweetdee]

But what some people don't understand, is that by talking about hating that pairing, you're still giving it attention. At the end of the day, when they spend more time talking about how much they hate Olicity, and not how much they love L/O, they're just promoting Olicity more. It's counter productive.

 

If I may:  "But what some people don't understand is that by talking about hating [Laurel], you're still giving [Laurel] attention. At the end of the day, when they spend more time talking about how much they hate [Laurel], and not how much they love [O/F], they're just promoting [Laurel] more." See, it works both ways. Not trying to start a fight as I really don't care who gets rewarded with the douche's penis (and I can't stand Felicity on her own and both Laurel and Sarah have issues) but it really does work both ways.  Talking about "the others" doesn't make your group any more right.  Plus, it is so tiresome at this point. 

[wonderwall]

@iamsweetdee, lmao I love your username! It's always sunny is awesome! I now say "god dammit" as much as Sweet Dee says it to Charlie. Which is a lot

 

Also, I agree. It does work both ways. After Olicity, Laurel is probably the most talked about person on the show (and from what I've seen it's mostly negative). While the media is more apathetic towards Laurel, the comment sections are fueled with comments about Laurel. I think it's because Laurel is a very divisive character. 

 

And I don't think people think their opinion here is more 'right'. So I don't know where that claim came from. :/

Edited September 5, 2014 by wonderwall

[formerlyfreedom]

Just a gentle reminder to everyone, let's please be kind to each other in the forum. Everyone is entitled to have their own opinion, and you don't have to agree, but you DO have to be respectful of other posters.

 

Thanks!

[JJ928]

If I may:  "But what some people don't understand is that by talking about hating [Laurel], you're still giving [Laurel] attention. At the end of the day, when they spend more time talking about how much they hate [Laurel], and not how much they love [O/F], they're just promoting [Laurel] more." See, it works both ways. Not trying to start a fight as I really don't care who gets rewarded with the douche's penis (and I can't stand Felicity on her own and both Laurel and Sarah have issues) but it really does work both ways.  Talking about "the others" doesn't make your group any more right.  Plus, it is so tiresome at this point. Many things in this fandom have become tiresome for me as well, most of them being 

You're right, anytime you talk about something whether positive or negative, it creates buzz. I referenced O/F because we were discussing the ship baiting on the TVLine article, and how the comments were pretty divided in two. I never stated one was right or wrong. I have my preferences and I respect that people have theirs. I said hate was counter-productive, and it is no matter which side you argue. I don't hate anyone on the show, I find myself indifferent about Laurel, but I don't waste my time bashing her. There is no right opinion, and I never stated there was. 

[writersblock51]

Click baiting is what bloggers and columnists may have to do out of necessity - and I think Olicity is a big draw, whether the focus is Pro or Anti.  I think the TV Line article was blatantly click baiting.  And the author got precisely what he really wanted - clicks and comments on his page.  It's a cheap draw but I can understand it, I guess. 

 

I think the CW, WB and DC are loving the Olicity buzz - but the clips on that particular relationship also take up mere seconds out of the whole thing.  I think that's how the show operates, too.  For all the attention that relationship gets, the amount of actual screen time shown on it has never come close to 'taking over' any single episode.  I don't think the show will change the balance this season, either. 

 

SA is very open about his love of the action on the show.  Action and the stunt work.  I think that is still, fundamentally, the bread and butter of the show, at least for him.  The relationships of the characters are the threads that keep us watching and connected.  I can't imagine the show dropping romance, especially where Oliver is concerned.  I don't want them to do that either.  All of the romantic, familial and friendship relationships matter.  And the show will continue to play up some relationships in their clips as they see fit.  

[foreverevolving]

If I may:  "But what some people don't understand is that by talking about hating [Laurel], you're still giving [Laurel] attention. At the end of the day, when they spend more time talking about how much they hate [Laurel], and not how much they love [O/F], they're just promoting [Laurel] more." See, it works both ways. Not trying to start a fight as I really don't care who gets rewarded with the douche's penis (and I can't stand Felicity on her own and both Laurel and Sarah have issues) but it really does work both ways.  Talking about "the others" doesn't make your group any more right.  Plus, it is so tiresome at this point. 

it's funny i had the same thought last night. when i was compering at the number of pages on the Felicity Threat vs. the number on the laurel Thread. of course content is everything and the entire Laurel thread is pretty all anti Laurel and KC. (i swear i don't think i've ever watched a show that had a character so hated by the fans)

[catrox14]

Oh you should have been reading the Lori Grimes thread in the Walking Dean forum on TWOP and AV Club.

 

I think Laurel can be salvaged if they don't give her a hero arc.

Edited September 5, 2014 by catrox14

[foreverevolving]

Oh you should have been reading the Lori Grimes thread in the Walking Dean forum on TWOP and AV Club.

 

I think Laurel can be salvaged if they don't give her a hero arc

i agree on the Laurel can be salvaged, sadly in my personal opinion it involves recasting the character. i am 100% sure that with a different actress Laurel can be [almost] everything they wanted her to be (minus the love interest cause i'm waaaay too invested in olicity by now).

[Chaser]

I think they need to establish consistency with Laurel right now. Let her be an ADA (I refuse to say DA because that is an elected position and no one would vote her in) and train with Grant. Don't try and force her into Team Arrow. That is something that is going to take time. 

[Angel12d]

I find this sudden hate on Olicity getting a lot of promotion baffling because we all know the spoilers. Olicity is pretty much going to cool off for a while after 301 so popularity for that ship aside, I can kind of understand them giving us lots of good stuff before we go a long time without any. I don't think people have quite realized that it's going to be Olicity heaven for ONE episode before it goes to hell. So while I'd love to have some more spoilers about Digg and Quentin Lance and other characters, I don't mind getting wrapped up in Olicity goodness before we get nothing for half a dozen episodes. It's gonna happen. Just wait.

 

Besides, the more popular a ship becomes the more the haters come out, although I honestly don't see that much and when I do it's so inaccurate it's kind of comical. Haters seem to think Olicity fans only care about Olicity and it is so not the case. Sure, a romance is always going to get a lot of excitement but that doesn't mean we're not excited about other things. Best to just ignore them. 

[statsgirl]

What a silly question. How many women has Oliver slept with on the show and nobody gave a rat's ass? Why is it only an issue now? I swear I'll never understand the complaints about shipping and relationships since the show has ALWAYS done them.

For me, I hated how many women Oliver slept with.  Yeah, it showed that his relationships when he got back were kind of shallow (except for Sara) but two seasons of that is more than enough.  Even James Bond quit hitting everything in sight lately.

 

I think the CW, WB and DC are loving the Olicity buzz - but the clips on that particular relationship also take up mere seconds out of the whole thing.  I think that's how the show operates, too.  For all the attention that relationship gets, the amount of actual screen time shown on it has never come close to 'taking over' any single episode.  I don't think the show will change the balance this season, either. 

 

SA is very open about his love of the action on the show.  Action and the stunt work.  I think that is still, fundamentally, the bread and butter of the show, at least for him.  The relationships of the characters are the threads that keep us watching and connected.  I can't imagine the show dropping romance, especially where Oliver is concerned.  I don't want them to do that either.  All of the romantic, familial and friendship relationships matter.  And the show will continue to play up some relationships in their clips as they see fit.  

I agree, the stunt work, villains and action are the mainstay of the show. But it would get old fast if there were no character development, for the characters either individually or in relation to each other.

 

An example of it being done well was by David Zabel on ER when he was writing Luka and  Abby getting together. There was a ton of buzz and comment about the couple but in terms of airtime on the show, it was only two very brief scenes per episode.

Edited September 6, 2014 by statsgirl

[NumberCruncher]

 

Besides, the more popular a ship becomes the more the haters come out, although I honestly don't see that much and when I do it's so inaccurate it's kind of comical. Haters seem to think Olicity fans only care about Olicity and it is so not the case. Sure, a romance is always going to get a lot of excitement but that doesn't mean we're not excited about other things. Best to just ignore them.

Yes to this so much. Most shippers love multiple aspects/characters of the show. I love the action/stunts just as much as the romance. The two are not mutually exclusive. When I started watching the show I had zero expectation of romance--I love anything superhero-related so this seemed right up my alley. The relationships side of it all was just an added bonus.

For me, I hated how many women Oliver slept with.  Yeah, it showed that his relationships when he got back were kind of shallow (except for Sara) but two seasons of that is more than enough.  Even James Bond quit hitting everything in sight lately.

True, his bed hopping was a turn-off for some people, but you saw very few people complaining that his constant hook-ups were "ruining the show!!!eleventy1!" like you see happening lately with Olicity. It's not the negative response as much as the hyperbole that the 'shipping is somehow taking over the show which I find utterly ridiculous--especially since if you add up all the Olicity moments from the S3 promos they probably sum to a total of 20 seconds. For all we know, the romantic scenes in the premiere might not amount to much more than 5 minutes. People are making a mountain out of a molehill.

[Angel12d]

Yes to this so much. Most shippers love multiple aspects/characters of the show. I love the action/stunts just as much as the romance. The two are not mutually exclusive. When I started watching the show I had zero expectation of romance--I love anything superhero-related so this seemed right up my alley. The relationships side of it all was just an added bonus.

True, his bed hopping was a turn-off for some people, but you saw very few people complaining that his constant hook-ups were "ruining the show!!!eleventy1!" like you see happening lately with Olicity. It's not the negative response as much as the hyperbole that the 'shipping is somehow taking over the show which I find utterly ridiculous--especially since if you add up all the Olicity moments from the S3 promos they probably sum to a total of 20 seconds. For all we know, the romantic scenes in the premiere might not amount to much more than 5 minutes. People are making a mountain out of a molehill.

 

Exactly. While I get a great deal of enjoyment out of Olicity, I enjoy so much more than that pairing. I am in AWE of the stunts on this show, like sometimes I have rewound scenes just to study them they are so amazing. I loved Moira even though she was seriously questionable at times. Susanna Thompson was wonderful in every scene she was in. I am a big Quentin Lance fan which proves characters can be redeemed on this show because I disliked him in s1. And most of all I LOVE Team Arrow. Just all variants of it, I want it all. So when haters tarnish shippers with this 'ruining the show because of shipping' brush, I get so rage-y. 

 

And linking back into what I was saying before, I also think people forget that there is an audience out there that doesn't read spoilers or go online and talk like we do, so to a lot of casual fans they're really only going to see that one promo on TV with a couple of Olicity scenes, so I think this over promotion of Olicity thing is kinda unfair. Curse of the internet I suppose.

[Password]

Hehe you know I don't think there's any problem with loving a show for one aspect. Some love just the Canary, others just Oliver, and others still Diggle and Felicity. I don't think you need to have to defend why you love a show, it's your prerogative.

There will always be haters, it's inevitable. So what if you just love Olicity? Go with it. If people hate, let them.

[NumberCruncher]

Hehe you know I don't think there's any problem with loving a show for one aspect. Some love just the Canary, others just Oliver, and others still Diggle and Felicity. I don't think you need to have to defend why you love a show, it's your prerogative.

There will always be haters, it's inevitable. So what if you just love Olicity? Go with it. If people hate, let them.

Good point. I don't begrudge anyone who loves just one aspect of the show--whatever gets people watching. It's the ones who do get their panties in a twist over the 'shippers that make me roll my eyes. Shippers count towards ratings just as much as the non-shippers do. People should be happy the show has viewers period.

[apinknightmare]

Good point. I don't begrudge anyone who loves just one aspect of the show--whatever gets people watching. It's the ones who do get their panties in a twist over the 'shippers that make me roll my eyes. Shippers count towards ratings just as much as the non-shippers do. People should be happy the show has viewers period.

 

I agree. There's no right or wrong way to be entertained by a show. Some people watch for the whole product, some watch for the relationships, some watch for the action. No one reason is more important than the other - every single viewer = ratings and (hopefully) the continuation of that thing that we all enjoy for whatever reason we enjoy it.

[Velocity23]

So its ok if i just watch for shirtless Stephen and David? 

 

[willpwr]

I am actually really grateful towards the shippers, anything that gets people watching. I made the mistake where I had initially written off this show, not because I didn't like it, but because it was on the CW and I wasn't hearing much hype about it so I thought it would probably be canceled. I saw the first two episodes and then stopped, I didn't want to get attached and I saw a lot of potential. I was happy when season 2 started airing and I binge watched season 1 to catch up on everything. I enjoy the relationships, for the most part, on this show. I think the relationships are just as important, maybe more than the action sequences even though I really love those, they're a lot of fun and seriously impressive but Oliver's relationships help make him who he is, they deeply affect his actions, I like seeing how each person helps shape him and humanizes him. One of the reasons I wasn't opposed to Felicity is because even though it's not canon, it makes sense to me and I see her helping him grow as a person and as a hero, I felt that his previous bed hopping was stunting his growth and actually making him revert to his old ways.

[Chaser]

I had a similar experience. I watched the first episode but wasn't that impressed; Didn't hate it but didn't love it either. I ended up drifting in and out that first season. There were aspects I really enjoyed: the action, slamon ladder, Diggle, Moira, Felicity but I was really turned off by Laurel the love triangle. I used to watch TVD/OTH and I was just reaching my limit with those.

 

Some blogs I followed though started posting Arrow/Olicity so I decided to give it a shot again. I just loved Team Arrow and that whole dynimanc and coming in at the beginning of S2 was great because it was really highlighting what I did love on the show. If it wasn't for those blogs, I wouldn't have given it another shot.

Edited September 6, 2014 by 10Eleven12

[apinknightmare]

So its ok if i just watch for shirtless Stephen and David? 

 

Absolutely. And I think that as a fan you should demand more of your favorite content! ;)

[Velocity23]

i am also not opposed to seeing shirtless Deadshot! Or might have a wish of shirtless Deadshot and Diggle scene

 

 

[Velocity23]

 

How do people come up with these parallels. 

Edited September 8, 2014 by Velocity23

[Password]

 

How do people come up with these parallels.

I absolutely love it. It takes supreme observance and a healthy dose of watching Olicity scenes frequently. There's nothing more fun than watching tumblr explode after an Olicity spoiler.

[wonderwall]

So I've been making comparisons between Team Arrow and Team Intersect:

 

Chuck - Felicity: Quirky, smart, hackers, awkward, passionate, moral, the heart of the team, has a thing for a certain member of the team, tend to babble

Sarah - Oliver: hot (lmao it's true), athletic, grew from being stone cold killers to warm moral badasses, has a thing for quirky hackers, would kill for said quirky hacker

John - John: Calm and collected, history in the military, generally backup for missions, have a good sense of their goals/missions, the muscle ,not men of many words

 

They all have similar inputs to their respective team which is quite interesting!

Edited September 10, 2014 by wonderwall

[NumberCruncher]

Great comparison.  My endless love for Chuck is probably why I love Team Arrow so much.

 

ETA:  Don't forget Daniel Shaw/Ray Palmer as the love/professional rival...they didn't even bother recasting the role. ;)

Edited September 10, 2014 by NumberCruncher

[wonderwall]

I added a couple more stuff comparing the team dynamics :')

 

My response about Ray shall be posted in the spoilers tag!