Convince An 'Angel' Newbie To Pick It Up

[Tara Ariano]

I watched all of Buffy. Should I give Angel a shot? Tell me why!

[Lisin]

Hard question. I binged Angel a few years ago at the same time as a Buffy rewatch (I synched up so I was watching them in order once Angel left Buffy) and I liked it. I didn't LOVE it the way I loved Buffy. It's a very different show. The first season is VERY procedural for a while. I once commented to my husband that an Angel episode was like watching a video game, like this: Something bad is happening in LA, Angel investigates, Angel fights several low level baddies, Angel finds the "Big Boss" and they fight, Angel triumphs (spoiler!) rinse and repeat for a few episodes. There are overarching storylines and they lean towards the batshit insane. It's a fun show to watch, but it's a bit of a mess. It's more fantasy than Buffy was, and I don't know if that would bother you. Like, if Clem the wrinkly kitten betting demon from Buffy was a main character instead of just a side character would that have bugged you? Did the Dawn storyline make you crazy (and not just because she was a pill)?

That being said I would recommend it. I almost want to say it's more fun than Buffy. I'm not sure I'm putting it right, because it's definitely still full of strife, it is a Joss show after all. Also if you DO watch it, check out some great "before they were famous" roles by the likes of Josh Holloway (I think that's in the pilot, and it's a blink and you'll miss it role) or Jeremy Renner in a fairly large role in one episode. Fun!

[Chip]

For a while when they were both on the air, I enjoyed Angel more than Buffy. Some of my favorite Joss characters were either from Angel or were former Buffy characters who moved over to Angel. I've never done a re-watch, but I imagine it would hold up pretty well.

[Sheena]

While I still prefer Buffy to Angel personally (unless we're counting the seventh season, which I don't, because the urge to kill needs to remain in check), I found that Angel was overall of more consistent quality. Others may disagree there, which I can understand, but I'd say that while Buffy at its best was better than Angel at its best, Angel at its worst was miles better than Buffy at its worst. Like, I can watch season four which, I felt, was the low-point of Angel, without too much difficulty, but Buffy... has to stop at the end of season six for me to remain sane. 

Apart from that, the two big reasons I'd say Angel is well worth watching are Cordy and Wesley. If you only see them on Buffy, you're really missing out on the complex, wacky and often surprisingly moving places they take those characters. Wesley is probably my favourite Whedon show character of all time, and by the end of the series, he's unrecognizably different from how he was when he turned up in the third season of Buffy.

If you do choose to watch it, I hope you enjoy it! :)

[formerlyfreedom]

Others may disagree there, which I can understand, but I'd say that while Buffy at its best was better than Angel at its best, Angel at its worst was miles better than Buffy at its worst.

Well-said.

Apart from that, the two big reasons I'd say Angel is well worth watching are Cordy and Wesley. If you only see them on Buffy, you're really missing out on the complex, wacky and often surprisingly moving places they take those characters. Wesley is probably my favourite Whedon show character of all time, and by the end of the series, he's unrecognizably different from how he was when he turned up in the third season of Buffy.

Yes, there was definitely growth in these two characters that I feel are vital to the canon of Whedon characters. I wouldn't even remember Wesley if season three of Buffy was all I knew about him. And Cordy in the first few seasons of Angel really improved upon the 'mean girl' stereotype that she started Buffy in.

Personally, I think that the fifth season of Angel was awesome, and I was pretty devastated when they cancelled it. They seemed to find their footing that year, and did a lot of exciting things, that I can't really talk about for fear of "Spoilers Ahoy!" Now I might have to do a rewatch of this now, after I finish Veronica Mars...

[Tara Ariano]

Would it make sense to jump in later, once it gets past its procedural-y phase?

Also, I used to edit the Angel recaps on TWoP, so I already know about most of the plot stuff.

[Lisin]

Would it make sense to jump in later, once it gets past its procedural-y phase?

I don't think it would hurt... you could watch the pilot and maybe the second episode and then jump ahead in season 1? Someone who's watched it more or better than I did would probably give better advise but I believe there are several episodes where if you skipped them it wouldn't hurt your understanding of the story, and would alleviate some of the "every episode is the same" that I personally felt. I think it really picked up in season 2 but that's not to say nothing in season 1 is worth watching.

[Aquarius212]

This thread's a bit old so I'm not sure if you've made your decision yet or not, but I'm a huge fan of watching things in meticulous order from beginning to end so nothing is missed...might be a bit compulsive, but I'd say start at the beginning if you really want to immerse yourself. Some of the things that seem unimportant to other people may be what make the show for you, ya know? So while the first season *was* a bit procedural-y, and while it probably wouldn't hurt your actual understanding of the story to skip it, I think it's essential to getting into the groove :)

Plus it's got Glen and his cool, completely natural Irish accent xD

[stopthestatic]

Cordelia. Enough said.

[mjforty]

Yeah, i don't know if you've made your decision yet, Tara, but I think you'll miss some great episodes if you jump ahead.  "Room With a View" (which actually introduces a running gag throughout the rest of the series), "I Will Remember You," and "Hero" as some of my favorite episodes of the show.  There's also the Faith cross-over episode and "To Shan-shu in LA" (the season finale) contains some important information although if you edited the recaps, you probably know what it is.  Still, there are some great moments of the characters bonding and becoming more of a team that I think you'll miss if you skip over them.

[millennium]

Angel was an amazing series.   In fact, I watched virtually the entire run without ever having seen an episode of Buffy.   It used to be shown late night/early morning on TNT, after Star Trek the Next Generation, usually about 5 am. (this was in the days before Hulu and Netflix).   When at last I got around to watching Buffy on Hulu, that show seemed silly by comparison.

 

I found the camaraderie among Angel's team more credible than the Scoobies.   So when the betrayal storylines came along (and there were a couple of them, but i don't want to spoil anything), you felt it.   When characters died, you missed them.   I never got that from Buffy. 

 

The transformation of Wesley Wyndham Price was also something to behold.   What a great character and a great job by Alexis Denisof.  

 

Ditto for Lorne.   The late, great Andy Hallett (who died needlessly from complications of an abscess tooth) somehow took the insane concept of a demonic lounge-lizard nightclub owner who can read the innermost thoughts of karaoke singers, and turned it into perhaps the most memorable character of the series (aside from Angel).

 

The show never feared being silly either.   As time went on, David Boreanis's comic timing improved and the writers continued to push the envelope, culminating in the utter stroke of genius known as "Smile Time."   But don't just leap ahead to "Smile Time."  To truly appreciate it, you have to work up to it.

 

Many Buffy characters were humanized on Angel and given greater backstories until they all become tragic characters: Darla, Drusilla, Spike, Wesley, and of course Angel himself.   You learn what a bastard Angelus truly was and how he ruined the lives of everyone he touched.  

 

"Angel" also introduces a new Big Bad -- the corporate firm of Wolfram & Hart, which made for plenty of good storylines. 

 

My sole complaint about the show is the storyline about Angel's son, Connor.   Part of it was that Vincent Kartheiser was so annoying as the character (so irritating that I almost didn't watch Mad Men when I learned he was part of the cast), but the plot was poorly written and handled.   The writers managed to turn it into lemonade by the final episode, but still ...

 

Speaking of the final episode ... frustrating as hell.   But it will never be forgotten.

 

Angel's story is concluded in a canonical comic book.  It's not the same, but better than nothing I suppose.  

 

The longer I think about this, the more "Buffy" seems as flat as a storyboard compared to Angel. He wasn't just the vampire with a soul.  

 

He was the vampire with a heart.

[catrox14]

I could write a dissertation on why you should watch Angel but I'll just say that it's one of best shows I've ever watched and has one or if not the most satisfying finale of any show I've seen (and I watch entirely too much TV).  I think Wesley has one of the best character arcs I've ever seen in any show. 

 

Angel remains in my top five favorite shows of all time. 

Edited June 8, 2014 by catrox14

[publius]

I have to chime in to agree 100% that even after all these year I miss Angel more than any other show I have watched in the last 40 years.  Buffy would work well on ABC Family in comparison to Angel, it just felt so mature and well developed, outside of the stupid Connor/Cordy stuff. How many shows have the main actor be such a broken nature, but Angel always tried to do the "right" thing. In some ways he is the anti House, similar messed up personalities, but Angel had so many redeeming factors.

Edited June 8, 2014 by publius

[catrox14]

That's a really great way of measuring how much I enjoyed a show is whether I still miss it.  And I do miss it so much.  Like when I watch an episode here and there on Netflix, I'm just reminded how much I miss it. 

 

I watch Grimm which is from David Greenwalt and every now and then I get an Angel flutter in the dialogue and the banter reminds me of Angel and the warped humor with the creatures, at least s1 Grimm had a lot of that.  I also find some of the warped Angel humour in some episodes of Supernatural which of course that makes sense because Ben Edlund wrote some of the most outstanding episodes of Angel and Supernatural. 

[Kalliste]

I prefer Angel over Buffy, I like the darker tone of it a lot more and I'd never suggest skipping season 1 because Doyle! I can't imagine an Angel where there was no Doyle :(

 

It's also great to see the evolution of Wesley as a character as well as the other supporting characters that come along.

 

really disliked Connor/Cordy storyline but found Season 1 and Season 5 so good that I could overlook it. And you know, Fred! I can't believe this thread exists and no one mentioned Fred or Gunn.. I really enjoyed both their characters. I also really love Fred's first episode.

[funandfitpt]

I finally broke down and watched the whole series on Netflix. Not sure why I didn't watch it when it was on TV because I love Buffy and loved Angel on the show.

I enjoyed the series, but have to admit I like Buffy still much better. I could watch Buffy over and over again, but I don't see me watching Angel again.

[Jediknight]

Many Buffy characters were humanized on Angel and given greater backstories until they all become tragic characters: Darla, Drusilla, Spike, Wesley, and of course Angel himself.   You learn what a bastard Angelus truly was and how he ruined the lives of everyone he touched.  

Don't forget Faith.  The Angel writers did amazing work with her and her road to redemption.  Redemption is a reason why I'd say it's better than Buffy.  On Buffy someone does something evil, feels bad for a little bit, and it's all good.  On Angel, it actually showed the toll that redemption took on the characters.  Wesley does something in season 3, that is 100% understandable, but he's completely changed after that.  He lives with it, and it took a toll on him.

 

The character progression on Angel was much better, and you believed that at the end, they were still a family.

[millennium]

 Redemption is a reason why I'd say it's better than Buffy.  On Buffy someone does something evil, feels bad for a little bit, and it's all good.  On Angel, it actually showed the toll that redemption took on the characters. 

 

 

I liked the philosophy of redemption on Angel:  No apologies for the past.   What's done is done.   We can only try to do better now.   It didn't matter who you were, what you did, or how bad it was: the Angel team was willing to give you another chance and to help you along the way, as long as you were serious about changing.

 

I still need to the get the final canonical four-issue arc of the Angel comic book, entitled "The Wolf, the Ram and the Hart."   There was also a Lorne special issue that wraps up his story.

Edited June 14, 2014 by millennium

[Jeezaloo]

It's action adventure with horror undertones that has the balls not only to find the humor in the darkness, but to humanize the inhuman.

 

It also freely recognizes that humans have earned our place in the pantheon of monsters. We belong, shoulder to shoulder, with the vampires and the other horrors lurking in the night. We are capable of things so terrible and violent that demons fear us as much as we fear them. It's an interesting take on the horror genre, where humans are usually portrayed only as Monster Kibbles.

 

EDIT: Because grammar am good!

Edited June 21, 2014 by Jeezaloo

[Chairman Meow]

I know the OP has probably long since made a decision... but in case anyone else wanders along who wonders if they should watch.  I feel like all the best arguments for why have already been answered... so I have to throw in my two cents on the question of if you need to start from the very beginning.  I give you a resounding no!  

 

My husband, for some unfathomable reason, has an unreasonably virulent aversion to BtVS.  Due to that, he was adamantly opposed to watching Angel when I started a rewatch several years ago.  I was deep into season two when I noticed that he was taking more and more frequent trips into the living room while I was watching.  By the beginning of season three, he was asking questions like "who is the green guy again?"  His first full episode was episode 16 of season three.  We finished out the rest of the series from there... and then he made me start it over again so he could see the show from the beginning. 

 

So while I think it's possible to jump into the show at any point (accepting that you might be confused about some things along the way), you'll probably wind up wanting to go back and see what you missed so you might as well start from the beginning if you can. 

[millennium]

I agree that it's okay to jump in at any point.   I had little choice back in the dark ages when reruns on TNT were the only way you could catch past episodes.   Unless you could pinpoint the day and time when the late-night rotation brought the series back to the beginning, your only option was to jump right in.   

 

This may sound like heresy, but I never cared for Doyle.  He just didn't fit, IMHO.  I never sensed any chemistry between him and Angel.   Wesley and Cordelia were a vast improvement.    It is interesting that in a show where so much of the storyline harkens to the past, even the recent past, no one ever mentions Doyle again after his departure.

[catrox14]

 

It is interesting that in a show where so much of the storyline harkens to the past, even the recent past, no one ever mentions Doyle again after his departure.

 

He appeared in Birthday and  "You're Welcome" via archival footage.

[millennium]

I stand corrected.   But, there's always redemption!  :)

[serenity5x5]

I've got a question: I'm currently doing a Buffy rewatch with a newbie, and I'd like to eventually do a rewatch of Angel as well. Would it be better to watch Buffy and Angel together as they were intended (i.e. one episode of Buffy S4 followed by one episode of Angel S1 etc), or should we just finish Buffy and then watch Angel separately afterwards? I know that there are a few crossover eps, like I Will Remember You and Five By Five that might benefit from watching Buffy/Angel back to back for the full emotional effect. Is it worth it though? I kind of think Angel is such a tonal contrast from Buffy that it might be better to watch Angel separately to really be immersed in the show. Opinions?

[catrox14]

I watched Angel before I watched Buffy. I really didn't think I missed anything by doing it that way

[Kalliste]

When I do a rewatch, as I have it on DVD I usually alternate between disks of buffy and angel, the most recent time we watched a season of Buffy and then a season of Angel.

 

If I had it in digital format I'd probably watch episode for episode, as it was aired originally.

[Tararayne]

If I were recommending where to start for a newbie, I would say start at the episode where Wesley comes in, which I believe is the 10th episode of Season 1. I personally could take or leave Doyle, and I really don't see the point of getting invested in a character who gets killed off so soon and hardly ever mentioned again.

 

I do think that, even from the first episode, Angel is an easier "sell" to a newbie than Buffy. Buffy's first season is so low-budget looking, B movie cheesy and campy. And while I don't mind that at all, I can see how that could put some people off.

Edited October 28, 2014 by Tararayne

[Macbeth]

Love Angel.   Adore it.  Didn't start watching until the Zombie episode in S4 (I will watch anything with zombies) - and just watched it all the way through till I was back to the Zombie episode.

 

Started watching Buffy after I saw Angel.  Didn't really work for me.  I liked it but didn't get past S4.

 

I think Angel will age better than Buffy.  They were very smart in making the big bad a law firm.  Limit the special effects - they didn't have the money for it.  Buffy's monsters suffered from the lack of money to do them properly - and we suffered along with them.

 

The characters were very well written, and the show had 2 of the best actors in Whedon's universe - Amy Ackerling and Alex Denisof. 

 

And it was clear the cast was having fun doing the show.  There are many shots where the actors are trying to hold their laughter in.

 

And they were never afraid to shake things up.  Procedurals not working - bring in longer story arcs.  And S5 was awesome.  Let Angel's team be in charge of the big bad.

 

Completely awesome.

Edited December 13, 2014 by Macbeth

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎19‎/‎02‎/‎2014 at 5:23 PM, Tara Ariano said:

I watched all of Buffy. Should I give Angel a shot? Tell me why!

1. It's full of insanely attractive people

2. If you liked Buffy then it expands the 'verse'.

3. You can spot some famous faces before they were famous.

4. It's funny when you don't expect it to be

5. It bends the cliche

6. It give superb action

7. No character ends as they began

8. The twists knock you for six. 

9. Great music

10. It features the phrase 'Turgid supernatural soap opera'

11. We have an ep with puppets!

12.  It's ending will amaze you. 

On ‎20‎/‎02‎/‎2014 at 4:03 AM, Lisin said:

Hard question. I binged Angel a few years ago at the same time as a Buffy rewatch (I synched up so I was watching them in order once Angel left Buffy) and I liked it. I didn't LOVE it the way I loved Buffy. It's a very different show. The first season is VERY procedural for a while. I once commented to my husband that an Angel episode was like watching a video game, like this: Something bad is happening in LA, Angel investigates, Angel fights several low level baddies, Angel finds the "Big Boss" and they fight, Angel triumphs (spoiler!) rinse and repeat for a few episodes. There are overarching storylines and they lean towards the batshit insane. It's a fun show to watch, but it's a bit of a mess. It's more fantasy than Buffy was, and I don't know if that would bother you. Like, if Clem the wrinkly kitten betting demon from Buffy was a main character instead of just a side character would that have bugged you? Did the Dawn storyline make you crazy (and not just because she was a pill)?

That being said I would recommend it. I almost want to say it's more fun than Buffy. I'm not sure I'm putting it right, because it's definitely still full of strife, it is a Joss show after all. Also if you DO watch it, check out some great "before they were famous" roles by the likes of Josh Holloway (I think that's in the pilot, and it's a blink and you'll miss it role) or Jeremy Renner in a fairly large role in one episode. Fun!

Personally I would say Angel surpasses Buffy in season 3&4? And I love Dawnie. 

On ‎28‎/‎03‎/‎2014 at 4:50 AM, Aquarius212 said:

This thread's a bit old so I'm not sure if you've made your decision yet or not, but I'm a huge fan of watching things in meticulous order from beginning to end so nothing is missed...might be a bit compulsive, but I'd say start at the beginning if you really want to immerse yourself. Some of the things that seem unimportant to other people may be what make the show for you, ya know? So while the first season *was* a bit procedural-y, and while it probably wouldn't hurt your actual understanding of the story to skip it, I think it's essential to getting into the groove :)

Plus it's got Glen and his cool, completely natural Irish accent xD

Better than DBs, that's for sure. 

On ‎20‎/‎02‎/‎2014 at 9:20 PM, Chip said:

For a while when they were both on the air, I enjoyed Angel more than Buffy. Some of my favorite Joss characters were either from Angel or were former Buffy characters who moved over to Angel. I've never done a re-watch, but I imagine it would hold up pretty well.

Yeah, always a shame we never had any original Angel characters on Buffy?

On ‎30‎/‎03‎/‎2014 at 12:13 AM, stopthestatic said:

Cordelia. Enough said.

Seconded. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎21‎/‎02‎/‎2014 at 1:11 AM, Sheena said:

While I still prefer Buffy to Angel personally (unless we're counting the seventh season, which I don't, because the urge to kill needs to remain in check), I found that Angel was overall of more consistent quality. Others may disagree there, which I can understand, but I'd say that while Buffy at its best was better than Angel at its best, Angel at its worst was miles better than Buffy at its worst. Like, I can watch season four which, I felt, was the low-point of Angel, without too much difficulty, but Buffy... has to stop at the end of season six for me to remain sane. 

Apart from that, the two big reasons I'd say Angel is well worth watching are Cordy and Wesley. If you only see them on Buffy, you're really missing out on the complex, wacky and often surprisingly moving places they take those characters. Wesley is probably my favourite Whedon show character of all time, and by the end of the series, he's unrecognizably different from how he was when he turned up in the third season of Buffy.

If you do choose to watch it, I hope you enjoy it! :)

That's a great way of putting it, Buffy at its' best was better than Angel at its' best but Angel would occasionally surpass Buffy. 

On ‎21‎/‎02‎/‎2014 at 3:15 PM, Lisin said:

I don't think it would hurt... you could watch the pilot and maybe the second episode and then jump ahead in season 1? Someone who's watched it more or better than I did would probably give better advise but I believe there are several episodes where if you skipped them it wouldn't hurt your understanding of the story, and would alleviate some of the "every episode is the same" that I personally felt. I think it really picked up in season 2 but that's not to say nothing in season 1 is worth watching.

No, you should watch every ep, even the weaker season 1 eps otherwise you lose much of the nuance. 

On ‎05‎/‎04‎/‎2014 at 1:23 AM, mjforty said:

Yeah, i don't know if you've made your decision yet, Tara, but I think you'll miss some great episodes if you jump ahead.  "Room With a View" (which actually introduces a running gag throughout the rest of the series), "I Will Remember You," and "Hero" as some of my favorite episodes of the show.  There's also the Faith cross-over episode and "To Shan-shu in LA" (the season finale) contains some important information although if you edited the recaps, you probably know what it is.  Still, there are some great moments of the characters bonding and becoming more of a team that I think you'll miss if you skip over them.

All the Faith eps are my all time favourites, especially Orpheus. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎08‎/‎06‎/‎2014 at 1:29 AM, millennium said:

Angel was an amazing series.   In fact, I watched virtually the entire run without ever having seen an episode of Buffy.   It used to be shown late night/early morning on TNT, after Star Trek the Next Generation, usually about 5 am. (this was in the days before Hulu and Netflix).   When at last I got around to watching Buffy on Hulu, that show seemed silly by comparison.

 

I found the camaraderie among Angel's team more credible than the Scoobies.   So when the betrayal storylines came along (and there were a couple of them, but i don't want to spoil anything), you felt it.   When characters died, you missed them.   I never got that from Buffy. 

 

The transformation of Wesley Wyndham Price was also something to behold.   What a great character and a great job by Alexis Denisof.  

 

Ditto for Lorne.   The late, great Andy Hallett (who died needlessly from complications of an abscess tooth) somehow took the insane concept of a demonic lounge-lizard nightclub owner who can read the innermost thoughts of karaoke singers, and turned it into perhaps the most memorable character of the series (aside from Angel).

 

The show never feared being silly either.   As time went on, David Boreanis's comic timing improved and the writers continued to push the envelope, culminating in the utter stroke of genius known as "Smile Time."   But don't just leap ahead to "Smile Time."  To truly appreciate it, you have to work up to it.

 

Many Buffy characters were humanized on Angel and given greater backstories until they all become tragic characters: Darla, Drusilla, Spike, Wesley, and of course Angel himself.   You learn what a bastard Angelus truly was and how he ruined the lives of everyone he touched.  

 

"Angel" also introduces a new Big Bad -- the corporate firm of Wolfram & Hart, which made for plenty of good storylines. 

 

My sole complaint about the show is the storyline about Angel's son, Connor.   Part of it was that Vincent Kartheiser was so annoying as the character (so irritating that I almost didn't watch Mad Men when I learned he was part of the cast), but the plot was poorly written and handled.   The writers managed to turn it into lemonade by the final episode, but still ...

 

Speaking of the final episode ... frustrating as hell.   But it will never be forgotten.

 

Angel's story is concluded in a canonical comic book.  It's not the same, but better than nothing I suppose.  

 

The longer I think about this, the more "Buffy" seems as flat as a storyboard compared to Angel. He wasn't just the vampire with a soul.  

 

He was the vampire with a heart.

I didn't like Connor either but you're right, by s5 he undergoes a remarkable redemption in my eyes. Much like Riley he's more likeable in small doses. 

On ‎08‎/‎06‎/‎2014 at 9:48 PM, publius said:

I have to chime in to agree 100% that even after all these year I miss Angel more than any other show I have watched in the last 40 years.  Buffy would work well on ABC Family in comparison to Angel, it just felt so mature and well developed, outside of the stupid Connor/Cordy stuff. How many shows have the main actor be such a broken nature, but Angel always tried to do the "right" thing. In some ways he is the anti House, similar messed up personalities, but Angel had so many redeeming factors.

Interesting comparison, I must admit I only ever watched House when MT and MB guested, to most Britons Hugh Laurie is still a comedian. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎14‎/‎06‎/‎2014 at 8:15 AM, Jediknight said:

Don't forget Faith.  The Angel writers did amazing work with her and her road to redemption.  Redemption is a reason why I'd say it's better than Buffy.  On Buffy someone does something evil, feels bad for a little bit, and it's all good.  On Angel, it actually showed the toll that redemption took on the characters.  Wesley does something in season 3, that is 100% understandable, but he's completely changed after that.  He lives with it, and it took a toll on him.

 

The character progression on Angel was much better, and you believed that at the end, they were still a family.

Absolutely, whilst Buffy was intense at times Angel takes it to a whole new level

On ‎14‎/‎06‎/‎2014 at 8:58 AM, millennium said:

 

I liked the philosophy of redemption on Angel:  No apologies for the past.   What's done is done.   We can only try to do better now.   It didn't matter who you were, what you did, or how bad it was: the Angel team was willing to give you another chance and to help you along the way, as long as you were serious about changing.

 

I still need to the get the final canonical four-issue arc of the Angel comic book, entitled "The Wolf, the Ram and the Hart."   There was also a Lorne special issue that wraps up his story.

It's nice they did that, give Andy a nice send off, I wonder they didn't do the same with Glenn?

On ‎16‎/‎06‎/‎2014 at 3:13 AM, Jeezaloo said:

It's action adventure with horror undertones that has the balls not only to find the humor in the darkness, but to humanize the inhuman.

 

It also freely recognizes that humans have earned our place in the pantheon of monsters. We belong, shoulder to shoulder, with the vampires and the other horrors lurking in the night. We are capable of things so terrible and violent that demons fear us as much as we fear them. It's an interesting take on the horror genre, where humans are usually portrayed only as Monster Kibbles.

 

EDIT: Because grammar am good!

Quite true, in Angel sometimes the humans are infinitely worse.  

On ‎20‎/‎06‎/‎2014 at 2:11 PM, Chairman Meow said:

I know the OP has probably long since made a decision... but in case anyone else wanders along who wonders if they should watch.  I feel like all the best arguments for why have already been answered... so I have to throw in my two cents on the question of if you need to start from the very beginning.  I give you a resounding no!  

 

My husband, for some unfathomable reason, has an unreasonably virulent aversion to BtVS.  Due to that, he was adamantly opposed to watching Angel when I started a rewatch several years ago.  I was deep into season two when I noticed that he was taking more and more frequent trips into the living room while I was watching.  By the beginning of season three, he was asking questions like "who is the green guy again?"  His first full episode was episode 16 of season three.  We finished out the rest of the series from there... and then he made me start it over again so he could see the show from the beginning. 

 

So while I think it's possible to jump into the show at any point (accepting that you might be confused about some things along the way), you'll probably wind up wanting to go back and see what you missed so you might as well start from the beginning if you can. 

You need a new husband, he is obviously a man of low character and you could do so much better. 

[Joe Hellandback]

On ‎20‎/‎06‎/‎2014 at 9:46 PM, millennium said:

I agree that it's okay to jump in at any point.   I had little choice back in the dark ages when reruns on TNT were the only way you could catch past episodes.   Unless you could pinpoint the day and time when the late-night rotation brought the series back to the beginning, your only option was to jump right in.   

 

This may sound like heresy, but I never cared for Doyle.  He just didn't fit, IMHO.  I never sensed any chemistry between him and Angel.   Wesley and Cordelia were a vast improvement.    It is interesting that in a show where so much of the storyline harkens to the past, even the recent past, no one ever mentions Doyle again after his departure.

We never really got enough time with Doyle, he was just starting to grow on us as he did CC. Also due to Quinn's problems they gave him less and less screentime. 

On ‎14‎/‎07‎/‎2014 at 7:03 PM, serenity5x5 said:

I've got a question: I'm currently doing a Buffy rewatch with a newbie, and I'd like to eventually do a rewatch of Angel as well. Would it be better to watch Buffy and Angel together as they were intended (i.e. one episode of Buffy S4 followed by one episode of Angel S1 etc), or should we just finish Buffy and then watch Angel separately afterwards? I know that there are a few crossover eps, like I Will Remember You and Five By Five that might benefit from watching Buffy/Angel back to back for the full emotional effect. Is it worth it though? I kind of think Angel is such a tonal contrast from Buffy that it might be better to watch Angel separately to really be immersed in the show. Opinions?

It's designed to be watched Buffy first, Angel 2nd, truly does work best that way. 

On ‎28‎/‎10‎/‎2014 at 5:54 PM, Tararayne said:

If I were recommending where to start for a newbie, I would say start at the episode where Wesley comes in, which I believe is the 10th episode of Season 1. I personally could take or leave Doyle, and I really don't see the point of getting invested in a character who gets killed off so soon and hardly ever mentioned again.

 

I do think that, even from the first episode, Angel is an easier "sell" to a newbie than Buffy. Buffy's first season is so low-budget looking, B movie cheesy and campy. And while I don't mind that at all, I can see how that could put some people off.

No, you should watch the first eps, for CC alone it's worth it. 

On ‎13‎/‎12‎/‎2014 at 3:53 AM, Macbeth said:

Love Angel.   Adore it.  Didn't start watching until the Zombie episode in S4 (I will watch anything with zombies) - and just watched it all the way through till I was back to the Zombie episode.

 

Started watching Buffy after I saw Angel.  Didn't really work for me.  I liked it but didn't get past S4.

 

I think Angel will age better than Buffy.  They were very smart in making the big bad a law firm.  Limit the special effects - they didn't have the money for it.  Buffy's monsters suffered from the lack of money to do them properly - and we suffered along with them.

 

The characters were very well written, and the show had 2 of the best actors in Whedon's universe - Amy Ackerling and Alex Denisof. 

 

And it was clear the cast was having fun doing the show.  There are many shots where the actors are trying to hold their laughter in.

 

And they were never afraid to shake things up.  Procedurals not working - bring in longer story arcs.  And S5 was awesome.  Let Angel's team be in charge of the big bad.

 

Completely awesome.

Just can't get that, not watch Buffy past s4? You missed so many great things! Don't think I've ever talked to anyone who started with Angel and then watched Buffy?

[millennium]

1 hour ago, Joe Hellandback said:

Don't think I've ever talked to anyone who started with Angel and then watched Buffy?

That's how I did it, thanks to TNT programming in the 90s.   Angel every weekday at 5 am.   After 3-4 hours of Star Trek Next Generation.

To see Buffy, I had to borrow DVD sets from my local library.

[illdoc]

Why I like Angel better than Buffy---it has a faster pace. Take, for example Season 7 of Buffy. The major threat happens in the last half dozen episodes. During that same year on Angel, yes, the major threat seems to happen during those half dozen episodes. The difference is that the rest of S7 Buffy seems to be "filler", whereas there's a lot of other storylines going on in the rest of the Angel episodes. I've watched an episode of Angel and think "well, there's maybe 10 min left", only to discover I'm only about 15 min into the episode. I've thought "there's only 4 episodes (one disk) left to the season" and then thinking "OMG how can there be only 4 episodes left in the season?!! They have to do this, and this, and this, still!".  They pack a lot into the episodes on Angel. 

[Joe Hellandback]

21 hours ago, millennium said:

That's how I did it, thanks to TNT programming in the 90s.   Angel every weekday at 5 am.   After 3-4 hours of Star Trek Next Generation.

To see Buffy, I had to borrow DVD sets from my local library.

So weird they'd show one without the other?

7 hours ago, nosleepforme said:

I generally don't think Angel is better, but season four of Angel is miles ahead of season seven of Buffy, even with all the Cordelia stuff. There are twists and turns at every corner and there's always something suspenseful going on. Season 7 of Buffy meanwhile is a lot of girls, sitting around in the Summers house, either listening to speeches or waiting to get killed off. A reason why Caleb works so well at the end is that he shakes things up and that there is an imminent threat. The First was kind of just there.

Now I really like season 7 and the Potentials but Angel s4 is the series at its' peak and Angel s3 beats Buffy s6 largely because 6 is one of the weaker Buffy seasons. Caleb certainly was needed to build things up to the finale but then so was Faith.