Sex And The City - General Discussion

[T Summer]

9 minutes ago, qtpye said:

The show has always kind of low key said that Miranda is the least attractive of the four women and sometimes likes to throw this in her face a little bit.

Yep. I guess that why they didn't give her real relationships until Steve. I'm actually hearing a little speech Miranda made in my head when Steve was still on her couch whilst looking for a place after they'd  broken up. She was taking messages for him! She said: It's amazing,  A 30-whatever unemployed bartender sleeping on someone's couch is considered a catch while an attorney with a great job  who owns her own apartment is spending Saturday nights alone. Something like that.

 

[RealHousewife]

2 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

That's an understatement.  They try to sell Steve on being a ladies man - he's slept with more than 60 women and he tells Miranda this as if she's stupid to be shocked: "I'm a bartender, and I'm cute."   Ugghhhhhhhhhh excuse me while I vomit.  With some men I could believe that sure, but Steve?  Steve?  STEVE?  Some writer obviously had the biggest crush on David Eigenberg for reasons I don't understand and notice how this actor has never had success in any other project?  (I'm just making this up.  If he has, I don't need to know about it.)

So many storylines are designed to humiliate Miranda.  That's why I mentioned that storyline about the guy across the hall who was actually cruising another man in Miranda's building.  When they go to a tantric sex class, the guy's (stuff) flies all the way across the room and of course lands on Miranda's face.  A child walks in on Miranda urinating (maybe even in the same episode).  Miranda tries to date a hot dog.  Miranda spends a night alone with a cake and then throws it in the garbage.  Miranda says she'll sleep with a construction worker and then HE rejects HER.  But of course. etc. etc. etc. ad nauseum.

To be honest, I can see Steve as a ladies man. I'm sure he met many ladies as a bartender, and I can see women finding Steve cute. Not saying he'd be the biggest panty dropper like Robert or Smith, but I'll buy ladies man it to a degree! lol

Btw, anyone else think David got cuter with age?

I'm with you all the way on Miranda! Wasn't she also surprised a man she met at the gym found her sexy? They wrote her like some poor sad woman who was lucky to get a date. I wonder if Miranda was supposed to be a physically unattractive woman and Cynthia was too attractive to play her. I hated how she was styled much of the time. I agree that the vast majority of men would find a lawyer with Miranda's looks a big catch. The "so obviously not a model" was a hella rude thing to say, and honestly, Miranda modeling at some point would not have been farfetched. She was tall, slender, and had a classically pretty face. It's like the writers wanted us to find Carrie the fashionable one, Charlotte the pretty one, Samantha the sexy one, and Miranda the plain one. 

[qtpye]

16 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

To be honest, I can see Steve as a ladies man. I'm sure he met many ladies as a bartender, and I can see women finding Steve cute. Not saying he'd be the biggest panty dropper like Robert or Smith, but I'll buy ladies man it to a degree! lol

Btw, anyone else think David got cuter with age?

I'm with you all the way on Miranda! Wasn't she also surprised a man she met at the gym found her sexy? They wrote her like some poor sad woman who was lucky to get a date. I wonder if Miranda was supposed to be a physically unattractive woman and Cynthia was too attractive to play her. I hated how she was styled much of the time. I agree that the vast majority of men would find a lawyer with Miranda's looks a big catch. The "so obviously not a model" was a hella rude thing to say, and honestly, Miranda modeling at some point would not have been farfetched. She was tall, slender, and had a classically pretty face. It's like the writers wanted us to find Carrie the fashionable one, Charlotte the pretty one, Samantha the sexy one, and Miranda the plain one. 

Seriously, if I was a man, I would take Miranda over Carrie any day of the week.

It's not just about her looks. I could not stand being with someone with no intellectual curiosity. 

There are a lot of fashionistas with interesting and high-level points of view. I felt Carrie was more the superficial type who just wanted to look cool. Again, there is nothing wrong with this but I would just find someone like Miranda way more interesting.

[LemonSoda]

21 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

To be honest, I can see Steve as a ladies man. I'm sure he met many ladies as a bartender, and I can see women finding Steve cute. Not saying he'd be the biggest panty dropper like Robert or Smith, but I'll buy ladies man it to a degree! lol

Btw, anyone else think David got cuter with age?

I'm with you all the way on Miranda! Wasn't she also surprised a man she met at the gym found her sexy? They wrote her like some poor sad woman who was lucky to get a date. I wonder if Miranda was supposed to be a physically unattractive woman and Cynthia was too attractive to play her. I hated how she was styled much of the time. I agree that the vast majority of men would find a lawyer with Miranda's looks a big catch. The "so obviously not a model" was a hella rude thing to say, and honestly, Miranda modeling at some point would not have been farfetched. She was tall, slender, and had a classically pretty face. It's like the writers wanted us to find Carrie the fashionable one, Charlotte the pretty one, Samantha the sexy one, and Miranda the plain one. 

David definitely got cuter with age. I’ll forever have a grudge against the writers for dumbing him down the way they did. Why couldn’t he stay the intelligent book loving bartender who calls Miranda out on her issues? Why did they have to turn him in to an insecure, cartoon watching skid mark tighty whitey wearing guy?

I also remember in the TWOP days many felt there’s no way a woman like Debbie would go out with Steve. Of course she would! I see Debbies with Steve’s daily. I also see a lot of Aidens or whoever you would consider a really hot guy with Miranda types. 
 

I agree. And they were so inconsistent with her style at times. In some S2 episodes she’s wearing Custo Barcelona tops or a Prada dress yet no hair or makeup. Cynthia is a beautiful woman and I never understood the need to make her frumpy. I love the episodes where she’s allowed to be the beautiful woman she is. 

[WendyCR72]

Well, as I have often said, I like Steve/Miranda together, and the Steve cheating shit was basic character assassination as Steve was gaga for her. And the movie did Miranda no favors, either.

Miranda having time for her friends' every burp but no time for her marriage...well, as I said, I do not condone Steve cheating, but I understood it. But then, as a whole, I generally could do without the movies - even if the first was slightly less repulsive than the second one.

I'm rather leery at what And Just Like That is going to do to these characters, based on the above history.

[RealHousewife]

4 minutes ago, qtpye said:

Seriously, if I was a man, I would take Miranda over Carrie any day of the week.

It's not just about her looks. I could not stand being with someone with no intellectual curiosity. 

There are a lot of fashionistas with interesting and high-level points of view. I felt Carrie was more the superficial type who just wanted to look cool. Again, there is nothing wrong with this but I would just find someone like Miranda way more interesting.

Me too. I also liked Miranda's sarcasm most of the time. lol 

So true! I hate that women who are super into fashion or just very feminine are stereotyped as ditzy. 

 

1 minute ago, LemonSoda said:

David definitely got cuter with age. I’ll forever have a grudge against the writers for dumbing him down the way they did. Why couldn’t he stay the intelligent book loving bartender who calls Miranda out on her issues? Why did they have to turn him in to an insecure, cartoon watching skid mark tighty whitey wearing guy?

I also remember in the TWOP days many felt there’s no way a woman like Debbie would go out with Steve. Of course she would! I see Debbies with Steve’s daily. I also see a lot of Aidens or whoever you would consider a really hot guy with Miranda types. 
 

I agree. And they were so inconsistent with her style at times. In some S2 episodes she’s wearing Custo Barcelona tops or a Prada dress yet no hair or makeup. Cynthia is a beautiful woman and I never understood the need to make her frumpy. I love the episodes where she’s allowed to be the beautiful woman she is. 

Exactly! Imo the writers were feeding into another stereotype. I had a coworker whose bartender son was the child he considered "the smart one." His other children were also smart and high achievers in terms of career. But his bartender son had the highest test scores and was a curious guy who had tons of knowledge about everything. Steve didn't need to be a goof ball. 

[T Summer]

33 minutes ago, WendyCR72 said:

Well, as I have often said, I like Steve/Miranda together, and the Steve cheating shit was basic character assassination as Steve was gaga for her. And the movie did Miranda no favors, either.

This is so true. The thing Steve had going for him is that he wanted  a lasting relationship with Miranda from the beginning. He was willing to meet her where she was... really wary of N.Y.  guys and give her time and space to come around.

Would I have like it better if they gave her a tall handsome fellow attorney or other professional husband? Sure.

[Scarlett45]

I don't think its that Cynthia Nixon/Miranda wasnt pretty or attractive by conventional standards (she certainly was), I think the issue is that Miranda wasnt "soft" (in an emotional sense, not a body fat percentage sense), nor was she the sexual adventurous one the way Samantha was, as such she was looked over by men a lot of the time. (in the universe of the show)

There is a reason Miranda got the "set up with a lesbian friend by her boss". The stereotype is a little better now in 2021, but from my own life experiences, if a woman isn't fawning over men or interested in meeting mens emotional needs people assume she is a lesbian. I am not surprised Miranda got that storyline in the late 90s. Likely in college and law school, she had a lot of "male friends" who were actual friends, but felt guys didnt like her, and didnt notice the guys that were interested in her romantically.

There's a phrase people say "very pretty, but doesnt have any sex appeal"- I have had people say that to me and my response is "okay, and ?"(people are who they are) I think that is what they were going for with Miranda. Remember when she got super drunk because that hot guy found her sexy and she was embarrassed? I might be putting two storylines together.

I feel personality wise I am most like Miranda (with a big piece of Charlotte and a tinge of Samantha), so I can see where the writers were going with her.

 

13 hours ago, WendyCR72 said:

Well, as I have often said, I like Steve/Miranda together, and the Steve cheating shit was basic character assassination as Steve was gaga for her. And the movie did Miranda no favors, either.

Miranda having time for her friends' every burp but no time for her marriage...well, as I said, I do not condone Steve cheating, but I understood it. But then, as a whole, I generally could do without the movies - even if the first was slightly less repulsive than the second one.

I'm rather leery at what And Just Like That is going to do to these characters, based on the above history.

We are on the same page.

[ifionlyknew]

7 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

 Steve didn't need to be a goof ball. 

I don't know why they wrote  him that way.  It didn't make him lovable. It made him annoying.

8 hours ago, LemonSoda said:

I also remember in the TWOP days many felt there’s no way a woman like Debbie would go out with Steve. Of course she would! I

Debbie and Steve made more sense than Miranda and Steve.

8 hours ago, qtpye said:

There are a lot of fashionistas with interesting and high-level points of view. I felt Carrie was more the superficial type who just wanted to look cool.

Yes Carrie dressed for attention.  A lot of times her clothes looked like costumes.

8 hours ago, qtpye said:

Seriously, if I was a man, I would take Miranda over Carrie any day of the week.

It's not just about her looks. I could not stand being with someone with no intellectual curiosity. 

Carrie might be fun for a couple dates but long term she would be exhausting.  Big even said as much.  He said it got so hard.  

8 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

It's like the writers wanted us to find Carrie the fashionable one, Charlotte the pretty one, Samantha the sexy one, and Miranda the plain one. 

I think that is how they thought viewers would see the women.  Which is insulting to the actresses and the viewers.  As if we can't see beyond appearances.

 

[RealHousewife]

5 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I don't think its that Cynthia Nixon/Miranda wasnt pretty or attractive by conventional standards (she certainly was), I think the issue is that Miranda wasnt "soft" (in an emotional sense, not a body fat percentage sense), nor was she the sexual adventurous one the way Samantha was, as such she was looked over by men a lot of the time. (in the universe of the show)

There is a reason Miranda got the "set up with a lesbian friend by her boss". The stereotype is a little better now in 2021, but from my own life experiences, if a woman isn't fawning over men or interested in meeting mens emotional needs people assume she is a lesbian. I am not surprised Miranda got that storyline in the late 90s. Likely in college and law school, she had a lot of "male friends" who were actual friends, but felt guys didnt like her, and didnt notice the guys that were interested in her romantically.

There's a phrase people say "very pretty, but doesnt have any sex appeal"- I have had people say that to me and my response is "okay, and ?"(people are who they are) I think that is what they were going for with Miranda. Remember when she got super drunk because that hot guy found her sexy and she was embarrassed? I might be putting two storylines together.

I feel personality wise I am most like Miranda (with a big piece of Charlotte and a tinge of Samantha), so I can see where the writers were going with her.

 

We are on the same page.

I know what you mean. There are so many things that affect how attractive you are beyond your face and body-your personality, style, your voice, etc. Even though I think Samantha was the prettiest, I don't think Charlotte was any less attractive. Her fashion and sweet demeanor had a lot to do with it though. Personal taste influences this too. A lot of men might be drawn to Charlotte's femininity and softness. As a woman, I love masculine, strong men. We're often attracted to our opposites, but others might find her prissy, immature and annoying. I still think Miranda would get hit on plenty IRL. An attractive lawyer wouldn't need to go around dressed like a doll or lead with sex.  I know a guy who said he'd watch the show for "the hot redhead." 

It's so rude someone would say you're very pretty but have no sex appeal! What the heck. You should have told them they have an eye for beauty but not sexiness!

 

Edited June 30, 2021 by RealHousewife

[Scarlett45]

1 hour ago, RealHousewife said:

I know what you mean. There are so many things that affect how attractive you are beyond your face and body-your personality, style, your voice, etc. Even though I think Samantha was the prettiest, I don't think Charlotte was any less attractive. Her fashion and sweet demeanor had a lot to do with it though. Personal taste influences this too. A lot of men might be drawn to Charlotte's femininity and softness. As a woman, I love masculine, strong men. We're often attracted to our opposites, but others might find her prissy, immature and annoying. I still think Miranda would get hit on plenty IRL. An attractive lawyer wouldn't need to go around dressed like a doll or lead with sex.  I know a guy who said he'd watch the show for "the hot redhead." 

It's so rude someone would say you're very pretty but have no sex appeal! What the heck. You should have told them they have an eye for beauty but not sexiness!

 

Ha! youre so sweet, its okay. People are weird, I wasn't offended at all.

Yes, so much determines how attractive someone is outside of how they physically look. And different people like different things. I think Miranda was supposed to be the woman with more masculine energy who needed an easy going guy to soften her up. Nothing wrong with that.

The more successful you are as a woman, the more likely you are to partner with a man that isnt as economically successful as you are, women tend to partner UP the socio-economic scale, men either partner across or down (for the most part), so being a woman at the top means pickings are slimmer. I see that being a big obstacle with Miranda dating. Samantha didnt care, she just wanted a good time, and although Miranda wasnt as prissy as Charlotte, she likely wanted a guy with her earning potential- especially with what happened to her and Steve the first go ground. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

I'm watching Season 3 and Miranda's hair and makeup are already vastly improved from before.  Of course, she's actually allowed to look GREAT in Season 6 and in the movies, but Season 3 is definitely a progression.

Season 1 and 2 they put her in the weirdest shit.  Overalls (not cute ones like Carrie gets in the country), hats over hoodies, huge enormous clothing and sweats.  LOL.  That's fine if it's your style, but it was almost like they deliberately wanted Miranda to look bad.

I went ahead and Googled "Miranda's worst outfits".  Google knows exactly who we mean, you don't even need to put her last name or the show.  She looks like she's in the Witness Protection Program.

Has anyone ever noticed they always give Miranda these grand declarative statements that sum up men?  I don't remember noticing it that much, but on THIS rewatch I notice it almost once an episode.  Sometimes they give it to Samantha, and Kim makes them sound hilarious, but Miranda's lines are so awkward it's like she's giving a TED talk on relationships.   There was one about how she owns real estate on her own, so people think it's tragic, and there was another one about how Steve lived on her couch, yet he's considered a catch.  These are all true, but they could make her dialogue sound more natural than always having that same cadence.  Samantha says one like, tell a man you love him, and he'll run, tell a man you hate him and you'll have the best sex of your life.  One of my all time favourites is when Sam says "You can't swing a Fendi purse without knocking over five losers."

Edited July 1, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[LemonSoda]

22 hours ago, qtpye said:

I am reading a book on pretty privilege, which I am not sure that I agree with but find it an interesting 

I’d love to read this too! May I have the title/author please? 

[T Summer]

Even when they gave Miranda a short lived relationship with Dr. Robert Leeds, they just had to have her notice him beaming while watching the 20 year old cheerleader with long blond hair shake it.

Then I remembered that scene where Carrie met someone she was seeing at a park and he had a friend with him. Miranda said something about being out of town on whatever day they were discussing and the friend made a guttural noise and said why would anyone want to leave the city. Miranda said I like the city, I also happen to like the country. Then he said something else off-putting and Miranda was off to feed her cat. The rude dude shook his head and dismissively said "Cat people".

All that to say they portrayed  Miranda as the one least likely to twist herself in knots to be liked by a man.

 

Samantha was just as unlikely to dim her light or give up any of her autonomy to be liked by   a man as I saw it,  yet they had her fawn all over those firemen and sailors etc. I had trouble reconciling that. And that time they had Samantha look around the restaurant where she was sitting alone and self-consciously pull her coal collar up around her neck and then dissolve into tears when the guy she was meeting was a no-show... I think she even said "everyone is looking" as the waiter cleaned up spilled wine? I wondered what aliens  came out of their pods and abducted the real writers that day.

 

 

[RealHousewife]

2 minutes ago, T Summer said:

Even when they gave Miranda a short lived relationship with Dr. Robert Leeds, they just had to have her notice him beaming while watching the 20 year old cheerleader with long blond hair shake it.

Shaking it and eye f***ing him! 

[qtpye]

1 hour ago, LemonSoda said:

I’d love to read this too! May I have the title/author please? 

It is stuck behind a paywall and I am not sure if it is worth recommending as of yet.

Here is a video that sums up the same points. I would like to say that the women who claim they do not have pretty privilege are not bitter or jealous of other women…just disappointed that, as women, a lot of hetro men can’t see beyond the exterior.

 

[LemonSoda]

12 minutes ago, qtpye said:

It is stuck behind a paywall and I am not sure if it is worth recommending as of yet.

Here is a video that sums up the same points. I would like to say that the women who claim they do not have pretty privilege are not bitter or jealous of other women…just disappointed that, as women, a lot of hetro men can’t see beyond the exterior.

 

This is a subject that fascinates me because I’ve seen bits and pieces of it discussed other places and I’ve seen situations in my own life/friendships where it might exist or doesn’t at all. 
 

Im a little confused by the video because I think she’s very pretty. 
 

Edited July 1, 2021 by LemonSoda
Added more

[T Summer]

On 6/30/2021 at 12:55 AM, WendyCR72 said:

I generally could do without the movies - even if the first was slightly less repulsive than the second one.

I'm rather leery at what And Just Like That is going to do to these characters, based on the above history.

Same here.  I Goggled and saw that Chris Noth will be in it. Maybe Carrie and Big's scenes will be mostly in a divorce lawyer's office? They certainly laid the groundwork for it with having married Carrie act like a cow from hell! Pointing to the take out bag (that he picked up so she didn't have to cook) and with that horrible tone asking "what's that?" Telling him he can't put his feet up on the couch. ...and then the freakout over the TV for the bedroom.

What was with all that? Over the years Carrie was financially irresponsible and went on and on to the girls about  Big (her weakness), but she was never such a bitch.  She was even unnecessarily nasty to Charlotte when she said I think you're playing with fire [meeting up with Aiden].

I know Kim Catrell has been unwilling to do this project from the first mention of it, I wonder if she refused to do even one scene? Like possibly they could have showed Sam and Smith married and living in L.A with her doing her publicist thing out there. If they explain Samantha's absence  by  her having passed from cancer, that would get things off to a rather depressing start.

Edited July 1, 2021 by T Summer
removed several inches of blank space

[ifionlyknew]

12 hours ago, T Summer said:

Samantha was just as unlikely to dim her light or give up any of her autonomy to be liked by   a man as I saw it,  yet they had her fawn all over those firemen and sailors etc. I had trouble reconciling that. And that time they had Samantha look around the restaurant where she was sitting alone and self-consciously pull her coal collar up around her neck and then dissolve into tears when the guy she was meeting was a no-show... I think she even said "everyone is looking" as the waiter cleaned up spilled wine? I wondered what aliens  came out of their pods and abducted the real writers that day.

I am a single woman and before the pandemic I went out to lunch every Saturday by myself. It didn't bother me at all.  I've went on vacation by myself.  Samantha is confident and secure enough that being stood up by a man would make her angry not embarrassed.  I was stood up once. I ordered lunch and texted the guy do not ever contact me again.

12 hours ago, T Summer said:

All that to say they portrayed  Miranda as the one least likely to twist herself in knots to be liked by a man.

This is why her having a relationship with a man who required so much care and attention seemed out of character.  

13 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

  Samantha says one like, tell a man you love him, and he'll run, tell a man you hate him and you'll have the best sex of your life. 

She isn't wrong.  LOL.  I once told a man I hated him and he said I know and.......

13 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

, but Miranda's lines are so awkward it's like she's giving a TED talk on relationships.

I think it took the writers awhile to find their groove with Miranda.  I think they wanted her to be the strong independent career woman and they eventually realized she could be fun as well.

 

[RealHousewife]

Pretty privilege is very much real. We all see those models who literally make livings off being hot. Beautiful women notoriously marry richer men. Pretty girls are more likely to get out of things like tickets. Men are less likely to see personality flaws in pretty women. I definitely think there are drawbacks though. Sometimes a pretty woman's entire existence revolves around her looks, and aging can be a bitch. You feel worse about your physical flaws than someone who's not wanted for her appearance. I think men and women who are attractive have a harder time not confusing lust and love. You're more prone to deal with creepers, stalkers and mean, jealous women. Men will pretend to care about you so they can be your shoulder to cry on. Women have a harder time feeling sympathy if they're jealous of your looks. That's not to say beauty isn't a gift or pretend we don't all want to be better looking. I beat myself up over my flaws, not my assets.

For example, someone like Charlotte would totally have men going gaga over her IRL. I think on SATC, she was a happy little princess and modeled when she was younger. She probably got a ton of attention from boys growing up. I'm sure she went on lots of dates, had an easier time getting jobs, getting out of trouble, etc. SATC did write realistic things about someone like Charlotte having body issues. She hated her thighs, she felt she couldn't compete with the supermodels running around NYC. When you're never the prettiest girl in the room, prettier women and extra lbs are no big deal. I also thought it was realistic Big would quickly "fall" for Natasha but quickly be over her too. I'm not saying Natasha had no depth. We didn't get to know her very well. But the relationship didn't have depth. He was an attractive older man who had lots of money. She was a sweet, young model gorgeous woman. Big thought with his lower head. 

Sadly, women are more likely to be wanted for their looks and youth. Men are more likely to be wanted for what they can provide. I've often thought being a man would be  less exhausting and scary getting older. Making money is easier than all the crap we do trying to be attractive. Things like Instagram have not helped with realistic standards of beauty. While Miranda was attractive, there's a saying that's often true. Something like a man would prefer a gorgeous waitress over an unattractive lawyer. 

 

[Scarlett45]

On 6/29/2021 at 8:05 PM, Ms Blue Jay said:

Right, actually Charlotte was mad at Carrie for doing the cheating, not at Big.  So I think Charlotte kind of takes a misogynistic viewpoint of cheating.  The woman is wrong no matter who is doing the cheating (Carrie and Miranda, instead of Big and Steve.). Like Miranda should have pleased Steve, so it's her fault, and Carrie should have respected Big and Natasha's marriage.

I dont think this is quite how Charlotte saw it.

I think Charlotte thought that Big was a jerk and wrong for cheating, "They took vows, vows he broke.....how would you feel if someone did this to me"; but Charlotte wasnt concerned as much with Big's moral currency- Big wasnt her friend, Carrie was. And Charlotte probably thinks "you should do unto others as you would like for them to do unto you", so as a woman she wouldn't want to put another woman in that position. I think she was more mad at Carrie for debasing her self and doing something against her emotional interests in being Big's "play thing".

Regarding Steve, I think Charlotte saw that Steve did want Miranda back and wanted to work on the marriage- and if Miranda was still in love with him, would she be open in giving him another chance. Charlotte seems more emotionally driven, so if Steve did want Miranda back, and didnt intend to make cheating a habit, would she consider it. For Charlotte the intention and the emotions behind the action were what mattered.

Edited to add- I think Charlotte would've had sympathy for the random woman Steve had sex with if she was just a random woman he met at the bar or something, didn't know he was married etc. But because Carrie KNEW Big was married to Natasha, and had a bunch of emotions wrapped up in it, Charlotte thought Carrie should know better. Also it wasn't just "one time", it was clear they were meeting up on the regular. Again, I am not saying I wouldve taken the stance Charlotte did, but I understand where she was coming from.

18 hours ago, T Summer said:

All that to say they portrayed  Miranda as the one least likely to twist herself in knots to be liked by a man.

 

Samantha was just as unlikely to dim her light or give up any of her autonomy to be liked by   a man as I saw it,  yet they had her fawn all over those firemen and sailors etc. I had trouble reconciling that. And that time they had Samantha look around the restaurant where she was sitting alone and self-consciously pull her coal collar up around her neck and then dissolve into tears when the guy she was meeting was a no-show... I think she even said "everyone is looking" as the waiter cleaned up spilled wine? I wondered what aliens  came out of their pods and abducted the real writers that day.

 

I dont think Samantha cared if men LIKED her, but she did care if they WANTED her. I dont think Miranda carried either way (outside of men she wanted specifically). I think Charlotte carried more if men LIKED her, and Carrie cared about both.

 

 

36 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

Pretty privilege is very much real. We all see those models who literally make livings off being hot. Beautiful women notoriously marry richer men. Pretty girls are more likely to get out of things like tickets. Men are less likely to see personality flaws in pretty women. I definitely think there are drawbacks though. Sometimes a pretty woman's entire existence revolves around her looks, and aging can be a bitch. You feel worse about your physical flaws than someone who's not wanted for her appearance. I think men and women who are attractive have a harder time not confusing lust and love. You're more prone to deal with creepers, stalkers and mean, jealous women. Men will pretend to care about you so they can be your shoulder to cry on. Women have a harder time feeling sympathy if they're jealous of your looks. That's not to say beauty isn't a gift or pretend we don't all want to be better looking. I beat myself up over my flaws, not my assets.

Totally- see my post several months back about what I call the "Halle Berry Syndrome". I think of all the characters Charlotte suffered from this the most. Because she was beautiful, she assumed (its not her fault, society told her this) and love and companionship etc would be hers- she didnt expect it to be so hard. So she was vastly disappointed. 

More attractive people get approached more, but humans are humans and life is complicated. 

[Scarlett45]

11 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

I've often thought being a man would be  less exhausting and scary getting older. Making money is easier than all the crap we do trying to be attractive. Things like Instagram have not helped with realistic standards of beauty. While Miranda was attractive, there's a saying that's often true. Something like a man would prefer a gorgeous waitress over an unattractive lawyer. 

I think this is why the more economic power women have, the less likely we care about being and staying attractive. Also the less likely we are to partner with men in the first place. If the man isn't offering you physical and emotional comfort, you wont bother, because you can take care of yourself financially. 

This is where Samantha was getting at with her first big speech in Season 1 I think. Even a generation or two prior, a woman in Samantha's position likely wouldve HAD to partner with a man, outside of very specific professional options (nursing, teaching, elder care, religions communities, domestic work etc) unless they had a family wealthy enough to support them. Samantha now could live how she wanted (sexually, economically, romantically) because she could support herself. 

A Charlotte type probably would've always wanted to partner and raise children, but would've wanted to pick her partner based in part on love/personality (not just community membership and status).

Miranda (like Samantha) wouldve been bored to death being just a "Mrs and a Mother" but the notion didnt go against the core of who she was.

I think Carrie wouldve made a great royal mistress PERSONALLY. 🤣

[RealHousewife]

4 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I dont think this is quite how Charlotte saw it.

I think Charlotte thought that Big was a jerk and wrong for cheating, "They took vows, vows he broke.....how would you feel if someone did this to me"; but Charlotte wasnt concerned as much with Big's moral currency- Big wasnt her friend, Carrie was. And Charlotte probably thinks "you should do unto others as you would like for them to do unto you", so as a woman she wouldn't want to put another woman in that position. I think she was more mad at Carrie for debasing her self and doing something against her emotional interests in being Big's "play thing".

Regarding Steve, I think Charlotte saw that Steve did want Miranda back and wanted to work on the marriage- and if Miranda was still in love with him, would she be open in giving him another chance. Charlotte seems more emotionally driven, so if Steve did want Miranda back, and didnt intend to make cheating a habit, would she consider it. For Charlotte the intention and the emotions behind the action were what mattered.

I dont think Samantha cared if men LIKED her, but she did care if they WANTED her. I dont think Miranda carried either way (outside of men she wanted specifically). I think Charlotte carried more if men LIKED her, and Carrie cared about both.

 

 

Totally- see my post several months back about what I call the "Halle Berry Syndrome". I think of all the characters Charlotte suffered from this the most. Because she was beautiful, she assumed (its not her fault, society told her this) and love and companionship etc would be hers- she didnt expect it to be so hard. So she was vastly disappointed. 

More attractive people get approached more, but humans are humans and life is complicated. 

I agree with you about Charlotte. I don't think she ever saw Big as innocent. He wasn't her friend to personally scold. I think a big part of the attitude toward Big and Steve had to due with the men's personalities. Big could be a big-time ass. Jilting Carrie at the altar was a messed up thing to do, but it wasn't shocking done by him. Steve wasn't perfect, but cheating was no not something you'd expect from him. It was out of character to do something so hurtful. 

Agree with you about Samantha too. She wanted to feel desired. She was Gucci not being loved. Carrie wanted passion and love. 

Oh yes! I remember that and agree. 

2 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I think this is why the more economic power women have, the less likely we care about being and staying attractive. Also the less likely we are to partner with men in the first place. If the man isn't offering you physical and emotional comfort, you wont bother, because you can take care of yourself financially. 

I think as women we always need to be able to take care of ourselves. I'm not saying that as a feminist who's against women who want to marry up or not work. I just think you need a plan so you're never stuck in an abusive or simply unhappy relationship. I won't lie. I like trying to look nice so I get attention. I like feeling desired. It's not about sex for me. I think it's knowing that attraction can lead to love. 

[Scarlett45]

4 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

I think as women we always need to be able to take care of ourselves. I'm not saying that as a feminist who's against women who want to marry up or not work. I just think you need a plan so you're never stuck in an abusive or simply unhappy relationship. I won't lie. I like trying to look nice so I get attention. I like feeling desired. It's not about sex for me. I think it's knowing that attraction can lead to love. 

Oh yeah, nothing is a guaranteed and I think EVERY capable adult needs to be able to financially support themselves best case scenario. 

But I have discovered at 35, if you are a woman who wants to have partnered sex with men, you dont need to work very hard to be attractive - the men will come! Nice ones, with JOBS, who will buy you food as well as have sex with you! Its amazing. The attention I pay to my appearance and style is for me and artistic expression- I don't think the men could care less outside of hygiene and having soft skin. And the older I get the more men show up, its amazing. LOL.

It is like that joke, "Men use love to get sex, women use sex to get love (Carrie and Charlotte definitely did this)."- I add, "I use money to buy pizza."(cause food is what matters here)

I dont think Samantha carried about love from men, but she did care about validation.

Of all the women, I think Miranda wouldve been the happiest if she never got into a relationship again. I think she wouldve found fulfillment in other things. I would see her and Samantha living together in their elder years Golden Girls style.

[Hiyo]

Quote

There is a reason Miranda got the "set up with a lesbian friend by her boss".

Also, the way she was styled at the time on the show. Back then in the late 90s, for a woman dressed that way it probably screamed b-curious to a few people.

[Scarlett45]

2 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

Also, the way she was styled at the time on the show. Back then in the late 90s, for a woman dressed that way it probably screamed b-curious to a few people.

Yeah- with the structured clothes (especially the shoulders), and shorter hair cut. I think these were all symbols to make Miranda seem less "soft".

 

[ifionlyknew]

23 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

. I would see her and Samantha living together in their elder years Golden Girls style.

My life goal is to live my senior years Golden Girls style. 

I do think Miranda and Samantha could have been happy never being in long term relationships.  Charlotte expected to be married.  It was just part of who she was.  Carrie wanted things a long term relationship could give her.  

39 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I think Carrie wouldve made a great royal mistress PERSONALLY. 🤣

You aren't wrong.  She wanted all the benefits of having a man but none of the drawbacks. She would have never wanted to wash Aidan's laundry like Miranda did with  Steve.  

[Hiyo]

Quote

Samantha is confident and secure enough that being stood up by a man would make her angry not embarrassed. 

I think her reaction wasn't that she was stood up, but that she was ghosted by the same guy twice. Even though she had planned on getting revenge on him, instead it backfired on her when she seemmed to get invested in that relationship again. That might explain her reaction.

Quote

Yeah- with the structured clothes (especially the shoulders), and shorter hair cut. I think these were all symbols to make Miranda seem less "soft".

Yeah, she definitely had a harder more butch look in the earlier seasons (especially when wearing suits).

[T Summer]

I'm watching Mario Cantone as a guest on The Wendy Williams Show and they mentioned "And Just Like That". They showed a photo takeb by SJP of the materials for the table read. No new info came out. WW just asked if they called him right away and he said yes and that he was excited about doing  it.

[T Summer]

21 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

I think her reaction wasn't that she was stood up, but that she was ghosted by the same guy twice. Even though she had planned on getting revenge on him, instead it backfired on her when she seemmed to get invested in that relationship again. That might explain her reaction.

While I can't remember now who she was supposed to meet, I didn't think it was the guy who dropped her that she was going to start up with again so she could drop him first...  but he announced he was getting back with his ex before she could, was it? I will have to pay more attention next time it airs. The episode I was referring to was also the one where she briefly thought of going home with the waiter who was so kind to her, but she didn't.

I still stand by my opinion that a man being a no show for a dinner date would not have Samantha react that way: tearing up, self-conscious about how others were looking at her,  doubting herself. She was never portrayed that way  before or after  that episode.

[Hiyo]

Quote

While I can't remember now who she was supposed to meet, I didn't think it was the guy who dropped her that she was going to start up with again so she could drop him first...  but he announced he was getting back with his ex before she could, was it? I will have to pay more attention next time it airs. The episode I was referring to was also the one where she briefly thought of going home with the waiter who was so kind to her, but she didn't.

This was the episode with Carrie doing the "35 and Fabulous?" or whatever cover. Sam ran into that guy while the girls were out partying the night before Carrie's photo shoot. She and the others exposit that he broke Sam's heart in the past, so she decides to hook up with him again and this time she dumps him. Except she kind of falls for him again (they were even getting a timeshare on a Hamptons house!) but then he doesn't show up for a dinner date of theirs. Thats when Sam meets the kind waiter that she doesn't go home with.

We later see her in Carrie's vocal round up throwing a drink in the guy's face, so I guess she got some type of revenge this time.

[RealHousewife]

51 minutes ago, ifionlyknew said:

My life goal is to live my senior years Golden Girls style. 

I do think Miranda and Samantha could have been happy never being in long term relationships.  Charlotte expected to be married.  It was just part of who she was.  Carrie wanted things a long term relationship could give her.  

You aren't wrong.  She wanted all the benefits of having a man but none of the drawbacks. She would have never wanted to wash Aidan's laundry like Miranda did with  Steve.  

I think so too. Both women seemed like they'd be having fun without a life partner.  Samantha would be that attractive older lady still enjoying men. Carrie definitely needed a man, but she didn't need a fairytale. Charlotte wanted marriage more than any of them. 

True! Carrie reminded me of Bill Burr's jokes about feminism, that women have this a la carte attitude. Equal rights yes, equal pay yes, paying for dinner and a movie, fuck that, I don't want that. lol

I think Charlotte had a vision of her Prince Charming "rescuing" her, paying the bills, and she'd love taking care of the household maintenance and her kids. She got overwhelmed even as a SAHM of two with a nanny. I'm sure that can happen, and in her defense, I can see her doing Harry's laundry, cooking dinner, all of that stuff.

Now Carrie, I wouldn't describe her as lazy, but it's hard for me to see her do anything other than be Carrie to have the benefits of having a man. I think she had more of a high energy, loved being social, exploring the city, shopping. That would make it difficult for her to be a Suzy Homemaker type. I'm kind of the same way. Even though I can spend a ton of time on here and work on my computer, my idea of fun isn't typically cooking, baking or sewing. They're more solitary hobbies, and you have to be still. Despite not being sporty or outdoorsy, I like being on my feet and out and about. 

1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:

It is like that joke, "Men use love to get sex, women use sex to get love (Carrie and Charlotte definitely did this)."- I add, "I use money to buy pizza."(cause food is what matters here)

I dont think Samantha carried about love from men, but she did care about validation.

That's a good quote! 

Yes. No pun intended, but I love that there were characters who weren't consumed by chasing love. I think it's a natural thing to want, but society expects all women to be Charlottes or like contestants on the Bachelor who are uber-thirsty for husbands and babies. I do want a family now I'm a lot older, but I genuinely wasn't that girl in my younger days. I also understand that some women never need romantic love. It doesn't mean anything is wrong with them or that their lives are tragic. 

[T Summer]

1 hour ago, Hiyo said:

This was the episode with Carrie doing the "35 and Fabulous?" or whatever cover. Sam ran into that guy while the girls were out partying the night before Carrie's photo shoot. She and the others exposit that he broke Sam's heart in the past, so she decides to hook up with him again and this time she dumps him. Except she kind of falls for him again (they were even getting a timeshare on a Hamptons house!) but then he doesn't show up for a dinner date of theirs. Thats when Sam meets the kind waiter that she doesn't go home with.

We later see her in Carrie's vocal round up throwing a drink in the guy's face, so I guess she got some type of revenge this time.

I believe William who Samantha was supposed to meet  up with for dinner after meeting him out at a nightspot for the first time in s2e4 they Shoot Single People Don't they? (the episode I referenced upthread where they had Samantha acting quite out of character at the restaurant when William was a no show)

https://bflix.watch/episode/sex-and-the-city-season-2-episode-4/

 

is different from the episode s2e11 "Evolution" where she got involved again with Dominic ,her ex who had dumped her for a super model... so she could dump him first this time. He beat her to the punch saying  she'd called and he was getting back with her. It was a name like Ivanka?, Anka? Something that ended with an A

 

https://bflix.watch/episode/sex-and-the-city-season-2-episode-11/

 

Edited July 1, 2021 by T Summer
added ep name

[Hiyo]

Ah, possibly. I think I might be confusing the two. Moving on! lol

[T Summer]

3 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I think this is why the more economic power women have, the less likely we care about being and staying attractive. Also the less likely we are to partner with men in the first place. If the man isn't offering you physical and emotional comfort, you wont bother, because you can take care of yourself financially. 

This is where Samantha was getting at with her first big speech in Season 1 I think. Even a generation or two prior, a woman in Samantha's position likely wouldve HAD to partner with a man, outside of very specific professional options (nursing, teaching, elder care, religions communities, domestic work etc) unless they had a family wealthy enough to support them. Samantha now could live how she wanted (sexually, economically, romantically) because she could support herself.

You've said a mouthtfull (lol...handfull?) here!

Do you know that in some quarters on the internet the debate still rages on about whether the women's rights movement  / feminism and women working outside the home will be responsible for the downfall of society? My advice, don't allow what is it called, autoplay? on You Tube or you may be watching a video about Tulsa, Ok. and Black Wall Street one minute and then  you'll  fall into "the manosphere" the next!!!

They seem to think women getting jobs/careers and the necessary education or training to do them is OPTIONAL in the 21st century!  That if you were "feminine" you'd find a husband and start making babies at 18-23 some say 18-25. You know who they blame for letting women "think they can live like men" besides Cosmopolitan magazine,  Sex And The City! and when they get more specific... Carrie Bradshaw! 🙄 It's a trip

 

[Ms Blue Jay]

3 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I dont think this is quite how Charlotte saw it.

None of this negates that Charlotte thought that Carrie was wrong in the Big/Carrie situation and that Charlotte thought Miranda was wrong in the Steve/Miranda situation.  I'm watching the "Running with Scissors" episode now and Charlotte really gives Carrie hell.  ("How could you do this.  You're my maid of honour.") 

Quote

It was a force bigger than me, like Niagara Falls or something, you know?
No, I don't know. He's married.
- I know he's married. - That makes you the other woman.
I'm not the other woman. I'm not. I mean...I know I am, but I am not that woman. Please, Charlotte, I feel bad enough already.
Good. You should feel bad. Do you ever think about how she'd feel if she found out?
I think about it all the time.
No, you don't. You think about what would happen to you if she found out, you don’t think about her. She's just the idiot wife. You don't know anything about her.
I'm gonna suffocate myself in this bubble wrap.
This isn't a joke, Carrie. They took vows. vows he broke. I'm getting married in three weeks. How would you feel if someone did this to me?
I would kill them.
How could you do this? You're my maid of honor.

I don't blame her, but for sure Charlotte is zero percent sympathetic to Carrie or on her side in this conflict.   It's about 95% Carrie did wrong and 5% one throwaway line about Big.  And I don't remember much sympathy for Charlotte towards Miranda when Miranda was cheated on either.  

Now for some reason this all gets reversed when Big jilts Carrie.  I don't know why THAT is the thing that made Charlotte so angry, but the other stuff Big and Steve did was okay.  I guess because somebody embarrassed Carrie and we can't have that.

I think Charlotte makes it clear throughout the show that she roots for Big and Steve no matter what they have done to her friends.  Which is why she felt so betrayed after Big jilted.  

Quote

I'm getting married in three weeks. How would you feel if someone did this to me?
I would kill them.
How could you do this? You're my maid of honor.

It's funny, I always interpreted the line "How would you feel if someone did this to me" was about Carrie's actions, not about Big's actions.

Edited July 1, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Scarlett45]

@Ms Blue Jay thanks for providing that dialogue! I appreciate it. 

Yeah- Charlotte here is identifying with Natasha, because Charlotte is about to be a wife, and Natasha is the wife (and the innocent party in this situation). Charlotte cares a lot about status and social rules- Carrie broke a social rule, and Charlotte is chastising her for it. And again, she makes it about her, and her soon to be status as a wife and that the marriage is the most important institution. (Not Carrie's feelings, or Big's feelings, but the institution of marriage) 

Also Carrie was full of it- she didnt care about how Natasha felt if she found out. Carrie barely carried about how her own boyfriend felt. Carrie wanted to do what Carrie wanted to do. If she had any sort of decorum she wouldn't have been in Natasha's house IN HER BED, eating her food. And if BIG had any sort of respect for his wife, he wouldn't have brought Carrie to their house into their bed and told her to stay! That was more foul than leaving Carrie at the alter! Natasha wouldve had every right to "kick Carrie's little buttocks" (figuratively, not literally) for being in HER BED and eating her food. BAD IDEA. I would be embarrassed for my friend!

I wouldn't have been on Carrie's side either- truthfully. Not so much about Big's marriage (although that's bad, that is on Big) but it is true that the "Other Woman' ALWAYS suffers the most socially AND emotionally from this stuff. Always. It is not the cheating man (the most wrong party), its the "other woman" who has tempted him away from his "virtuous wife". Carrie was being dumb, and putting her heart on the line, for what? I am glad Charlotte called her out on it, because it wasnt good for her (the first reason), and yeah wrong (second reason).

As far as Miranda and Steve goes- I think again Charlotte saw "the marriage" as the most important thing, and since Steve was willing to work on it (I dont think Steve ever said he wanted to leave Miranda, or that he was right to cheat, or he wanted to keep a long term woman on the side etc) Miranda should be open to it, and not let her pride end the relationship.

Again, I dont agree, but I see where Charlotte was coming from. In Miranda's position, I might have forgiven Steve- likely yes I wouldve forgiven Steve. I wouldve forgiven Steve before Big. Big was foul, Steve made a mistake.

[RealHousewife]

1 hour ago, T Summer said:

You've said a mouthtfull (lol...handfull?) here!

Do you know that in some quarters on the internet the debate still rages on about whether the women's rights movement  / feminism and women working outside the home will be responsible for the downfall of society? My advice, don't allow what is it called, autoplay? on You Tube or you may be watching a video about Tulsa, Ok. and Black Wall Street one minute and then  you'll  fall into "the manosphere" the next!!!

They seem to think women getting jobs/careers and the necessary education or training to do them is OPTIONAL in the 21st century!  That if you were "feminine" you'd find a husband and start making babies at 18-23 some say 18-25. You know who they blame for letting women "think they can live like men" besides Cosmopolitan magazine,  Sex And The City! and when they get more specific... Carrie Bradshaw! 🙄 It's a trip

 

Oh yes! Some people blame feminists for everything, like if it weren't for those damn feminists, women would all be happy at home, comfortable living under one income.

I've heard tons of blame on SATC too, everything from "my wife wouldn't have cheated and left me for a younger man if it weren't for SATC" to "I wasted my young years being single and going on tons of dates trying to be like the SATC ladies."

 

1 hour ago, Scarlett45 said:

@Ms Blue Jay thanks for providing that dialogue! I appreciate it. 

Yeah- Charlotte here is identifying with Natasha, because Charlotte is about to be a wife, and Natasha is the wife (and the innocent party in this situation). Charlotte cares a lot about status and social rules- Carrie broke a social rule, and Charlotte is chastising her for it. And again, she makes it about her, and her soon to be status as a wife and that the marriage is the most important institution. (Not Carrie's feelings, or Big's feelings, but the institution of marriage) 

Also Carrie was full of it- she didnt care about how Natasha felt if she found out. Carrie barely carried about how her own boyfriend felt. Carrie wanted to do what Carrie wanted to do. If she had any sort of decorum she wouldn't have been in Natasha's house IN HER BED, eating her food. And if BIG had any sort of respect for his wife, he wouldn't have brought Carrie to their house into their bed and told her to stay! That was more foul than leaving Carrie at the alter! Natasha wouldve had every right to "kick Carrie's little buttocks" (figuratively, not literally) for being in HER BED and eating her food. BAD IDEA. I would be embarrassed for my friend!

I wouldn't have been on Carrie's side either- truthfully. Not so much about Big's marriage (although that's bad, that is on Big) but it is true that the "Other Woman' ALWAYS suffers the most socially AND emotionally from this stuff. Always. It is not the cheating man (the most wrong party), its the "other woman" who has tempted him away from his "virtuous wife". Carrie was being dumb, and putting her heart on the line, for what? I am glad Charlotte called her out on it, because it wasnt good for her (the first reason), and yeah wrong (second reason).

As far as Miranda and Steve goes- I think again Charlotte saw "the marriage" as the most important thing, and since Steve was willing to work on it (I dont think Steve ever said he wanted to leave Miranda, or that he was right to cheat, or he wanted to keep a long term woman on the side etc) Miranda should be open to it, and not let her pride end the relationship.

Again, I dont agree, but I see where Charlotte was coming from. In Miranda's position, I might have forgiven Steve- likely yes I wouldve forgiven Steve. I wouldve forgiven Steve before Big. Big was foul, Steve made a mistake.

Charlotte definitely cared a lot about how everything looked and was pro marriage. I do somewhat see her side regarding Big and Steve though. 

When someone is your friend, you want to support them, but you're also going to be more disappointed in them when they screw up. Charlotte loved Carrie. You don't make just anyone your maid of honor. It's the woman you're closer to than anyone. Big was merely her friend's ex. Just like I appreciate Miranda being straightforward, I also liked that Charlotte didn't bs Carrie like her actions were no big deal. Carrie and Big were both wrong. Natasha should have been more furious with Big since he was the one she married. He took vows to be faithful to her. I always found it weird when women are more angry toward "the other woman" than the man who supposedly loves them. But I don't expect Charlotte to be focused on him in this situation. I also agree that cheating itself and being the other women are gross enough, but the way Big and Carrie carried on in Natasha's own home made it even disgusting. Carrie didn't care how much she was hurting this innocent woman. Charlotte was right on that too.

I know we've discussed Steve cheating a lot, but I can't remember if the women had sympathy for Miranda there or not. It's been awhile since I watched the movie. I totally understand not hating Steve though. I see where you all are coming from with much of the Miranda and Steve story, but there was a sweetness to him. He wasn't a sleazy guy either. I'd expect Big to cheat. I wouldn't expect Steve to. Cheating is a personal dealbreaker for me, but I totally know people who can forgive a one-time thing that wouldn't happen again. I'd also forgive Steve before I'd forgive Big for the same reason as Scarlett posted. 

Edited July 2, 2021 by RealHousewife

[Ms Blue Jay]

Watching "Don't Ask, Don't Tell".  I can't believe Charlotte didn't even want Sam to be a bridesmaid.  She just pitied her and asked her so she wouldn't be left out.  That's so harsh.

Miranda is amazing at lying about being a flight attendant.  I guess that's her lawyerly skills coming out.

[RealHousewife]

1 minute ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Watching "Don't Ask, Don't Tell".  I can't believe Charlotte didn't even want Sam to be a bridesmaid.  She just pitied her and asked her so she wouldn't be left out.  That's so harsh.

Miranda is amazing at lying about being a flight attendant.  I guess that's her lawyerly skills coming out.

Oh, that I remember! Yes, it's so crazy, poor Sam.

Haha! I remember that too.  

[Scarlett45]

19 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

I always found it weird when women are more angry toward "the other woman" than the man who supposedly loves them. 

Yeah I think that’s weird too. Unless the “other woman” is showing up at your house/work etc threatening you, I would have no animosity toward them, only my spouse who took the vows. Natasha only yelled at Carrie cause she was IN HER HOUSE (that’s shocking), and when Carrie showed up at the restaurant she was a class act.

 

But I think it’s easier emotionally to hate the “stranger” than the person that you have positive associations and likely a deep love for. Also add in a good dose of sexism that men are ALWAYS up for sex and women need to “keep them at bay” to keep the social rules in place. Which is a bunch of hogwash of course. 

[qtpye]

1 hour ago, T Summer said:

You've said a mouthtfull (lol...handfull?) here!

Do you know that in some quarters on the internet the debate still rages on about whether the women's rights movement  / feminism and women working outside the home will be responsible for the downfall of society? My advice, don't allow what is it called, autoplay? on You Tube or you may be watching a video about Tulsa, Ok. and Black Wall Street one minute and then  you'll  fall into "the manosphere" the next!!!

They seem to think women getting jobs/careers and the necessary education or training to do them is OPTIONAL in the 21st century!  That if you were "feminine" you'd find a husband and start making babies at 18-23 some say 18-25. You know who they blame for letting women "think they can live like men" besides Cosmopolitan magazine,  Sex And The City! and when they get more specific... Carrie Bradshaw! 🙄 It's a trip

 

Lord, do not go into the MAGA or Red Pill corners of the internet. These guys will call all women whores and then complain about how no woman wants to fuck them.

I also think these guys hate competing with women in the job market and losing jobs to them.

Only hot young fuckable women are worthy and the rest are leftovers. These guys feel like society will be mourning them opting out but I am just happy they are out of the gene pool.

5 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

Pretty privilege is very much real. We all see those models who literally make livings off being hot. Beautiful women notoriously marry richer men. Pretty girls are more likely to get out of things like tickets. Men are less likely to see personality flaws in pretty women. I definitely think there are drawbacks though. Sometimes a pretty woman's entire existence revolves around her looks, and aging can be a bitch. You feel worse about your physical flaws than someone who's not wanted for her appearance. I think men and women who are attractive have a harder time not confusing lust and love. You're more prone to deal with creepers, stalkers and mean, jealous women. Men will pretend to care about you so they can be your shoulder to cry on. Women have a harder time feeling sympathy if they're jealous of your looks. That's not to say beauty isn't a gift or pretend we don't all want to be better looking. I beat myself up over my flaws, not my assets.

For example, someone like Charlotte would totally have men going gaga over her IRL. I think on SATC, she was a happy little princess and modeled when she was younger. She probably got a ton of attention from boys growing up. I'm sure she went on lots of dates, had an easier time getting jobs, getting out of trouble, etc. SATC did write realistic things about someone like Charlotte having body issues. She hated her thighs, she felt she couldn't compete with the supermodels running around NYC. When you're never the prettiest girl in the room, prettier women and extra lbs are no big deal. I also thought it was realistic Big would quickly "fall" for Natasha but quickly be over her too. I'm not saying Natasha had no depth. We didn't get to know her very well. But the relationship didn't have depth. He was an attractive older man who had lots of money. She was a sweet, young model gorgeous woman. Big thought with his lower head. 

Sadly, women are more likely to be wanted for their looks and youth. Men are more likely to be wanted for what they can provide. I've often thought being a man would be  less exhausting and scary getting older. Making money is easier than all the crap we do trying to be attractive. Things like Instagram have not helped with realistic standards of beauty. While Miranda was attractive, there's a saying that's often true. Something like a man would prefer a gorgeous waitress over an unattractive lawyer. 

 

When I was in law school, there was this place that would host a nice end-of-year party for the local law and medical school graduates. It was open to anyone but law and med school students got in for free and everyone else had to pay.

We used to dress up in our suits and nice clothes. Without fail, every law med guy would be 5 beautiful girls deep (nonlaw/med student girls). No guys would ever show up for us ladies. We girls would just sit at some table together and have a good laugh about how society treats men and women differently when it comes to their jobs and careers. What is attractive for a man can be off-putting or intimidating on a woman. This was in the mid-aughts so things might have changed by now.

5 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

Watching "Don't Ask, Don't Tell".  I can't believe Charlotte didn't even want Sam to be a bridesmaid.  She just pitied her and asked her so she wouldn't be left out.  That's so harsh.

Miranda is amazing at lying about being a flight attendant.  I guess that's her lawyerly skills coming out.

I sometimes wonder if Sam and Charlotte would have been friends in real life. They were both cool in their own way but totally different in their approach to life.

[Ms Blue Jay]

Carrie is a really good friend when she offers to take Charlotte out of her wedding to Trey when she thinks Charlotte's unsure.  "We'll just have to get a cab, and these people will have to get over it."
I am also glad that even though she broke up with Aidan, she didn't tell anyone at the wedding before it happened and let Charlotte have the moment she wanted.

Charlotte:  It's my week.
Miranda:  You get a DAY.  Not a WEEK.  😁

I have a friend who celebrates his birthday the entire month.  🙄 😁

I actually teared up at the end of this episode (Charlotte's wedding).  It was a good one!

Edited July 2, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Ms Blue Jay]

59 minutes ago, qtpye said:

I sometimes wonder if Sam and Charlotte would have been friends in real life. They were both cool in their own way but totally different in their approach to life.

If they attended the same college/were dormmates,  I could totally see it happening as I have friend groups that include both Charlottes and Samanthas.  However, making friends in adulthood might be a lot harder.  We tolerate a lot less in women, I think, as we get older.  

[Scarlett45]

35 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

If they attended the same college/were dormmates,  I could totally see it happening as I have friend groups that include both Charlottes and Samanthas.  However, making friends in adulthood might be a lot harder.  We tolerate a lot less in women, I think, as we get older.  

I also think we have less time to make new friends as we get older. 
 

I could see Charlotte and Samantha being friends IRL because they were such opposites they would have skill sets and fun traits the other one would lack. IRL they would have to really appreciate the other ones differences. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

Matthew McConaughey is so damn funny on the show.  No wonder I love the movie "Failure to Launch", I love these two together

 

[RealHousewife]

^ I loved that movie too! Matthew said she was a crush of his when he was younger. They have great chemistry together. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

2 minutes ago, RealHousewife said:

^ I loved that movie too! Matthew said she was a crush of his when he was younger. They have great chemistry together. 

It is such a funny scene. Matthew is so wacky and Carrie's reactions to him are priceless.  I'm glad they found a movie to do together.

[LemonSoda]

2 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

If they attended the same college/were dormmates,  I could totally see it happening as I have friend groups that include both Charlottes and Samanthas.  However, making friends in adulthood might be a lot harder.  We tolerate a lot less in women, I think, as we get older.  

Truth! It’s been hard for me. I definitely tolerate a lot less and with the internet/social media that’s how so many prefer to communicate instead of getting together for lunch unless it’s an Instagram friendly place 

[Ms Blue Jay]

Matthew Mc:  "THAT'S BULLSHIT CARRIE, AND YOU KNOW IT!"

😄

This LA trip is weird.  

After Matthew Mc. freaks out Carrie too much, she bails on her next meeting with producers about her book/movie.  

But then, the women just stay in LA hanging out. They even stay long enough for Charlotte to join them!  And they only have 2 bedrooms between the 4 of them!  

Charlotte:  Could you have MORE condoms?
Sam (smiling):  I did, yes!

Vince Vaughn and Carrie Fisher are really funny on the show too!  And Sarah Michelle Gellar!

I'm really falling for Carrie's apartment this time around.  She has so much space for books.  I like how imperfect it is.  She has so many useless furniture pieces, and hardly anything up on the walls.  She has a decent sized kitchen for someone who doesn't cook.

Edited July 2, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay