Mary Margaret: Is Snow White Again?

[HoodlumSheep]

I almost want to start a twitter campaign to get them to call her Snow. Mary-Margaret is okay once in a while, but she really should be called Snow at least 90-95% of the time. But, would that make me an internet troll? Although, I wouldn't be tweeting Adam 6 dozen times a day. Operation #HerNameIsSnow needs to happen, though. It's insulting to think that we need help differentiating the time periods. For one, flashback Snow before the curse has long hair. That's quite the difference right there. And of course I'd love to petition for better official promo art (down with the photoshopping!). Sadly, I'm too afraid to really actually go through with either of these ideas.

[Souris]

I'd tweet that.

[HoodlumSheep]

^ maybe everytime someone calls her mary-margaret in the show (which happens quite a bit), we should tweet Adam & some of the writers the hashtag. :P although it might be too excessive depending on how often they call her that.

[Faemonic]

Nah, I think the show put its foot down on that since the We Are Both thing. They don't even want to call her just Mary, or Marge or Margie. I suspect the show might have thrown Johanna off a clock tower partially because she dared to insist that MM would "always be Snow to me." David uses it like a BDSM safeword (see how he breaks her silent treatment on him after the Echo Caves.)

[Mathius]

I'm sorry, I know it's not helping anything to whine about it, but I still cannot get over how much they've ruined the Snow-Emma relationship, even though it was one of the best and most focused-upon relationships for the first two and half seasons!  Some people have given her flak in 3A for the Echo Caves secret and being willing to leave Emma to stay with Charming on Neverland, but I thought those were perfectly fine, human reactions and they never detracted from it being crystal clear that Snow still loved Emma very much ("Going Home" showed this very well.)

 

I could possibly excuse the screw-ups in 3B since Snow was pregnant with another child at the moment and that arc actually started to finally give us a more solid Charming-Emma dynamic, but ever since "Bleeding Through" happened, Snow's more frequent female companion has been Regina, not Emma, which is infuriatingly stupid. What has happened between Snow and Emma since then?  Let's see...

• Snow shamed Emma for forgetting about them even though Emma literally had no choice.
• It was revealed that Snow only needed to get back to Emma so that Emma could be the Savior again.
• Snow didn't even concern herself with Emma almost freezing to death.
• Snow was afraid of Emma's powers and shamed her for accidentally endangering Charming with them. 
• When Emma was missing, Snow concerned herself more with Regina's relationship woes than finding her daughter.
• There was absolutely no working through the above two issues other than a quick hug.
• Snow, along with Charming, lied to Emma about their past with the QoD.
• It was revealed that Snow thought baby Emma was evil, and did something terrible to "ensure Emma's goodness".
• When confronted by Emma about this, she justified her actions, saying "it was worth it!"
• Snow risked her life to make things up to Maleficent, rather than to Emma.
• There was absolutely no working through the above four issues other than a quick hug.
• Snow did nothing to stop Emma's sacrifice, and majorly under-reacted to it.
• Snow tried to control Emma with the dagger.
• Snow spent more time preparing Regina for the ball than she did preparing Emma.
• Snow was perfectly fine with letting Emma's love die.
• Snow, along with Charming, never attempted to see Emma once she's a full-on Dark One.
• Snow risked her life to save Regina when she didn't to save Emma.
• Snow claimed there "may not be an Emma left", despite having not a shred of evidence for this.

 

How much more can they drag this relationship, and this character, through the mud?  I'm afraid to find out.

[FierceAfroChick]

I'm sorry, I know it's not helping anything to whine about it, but I still cannot get over how much they've ruined the Snow-Emma relationship, even though it was one of the best and most focused-upon relationships for the first two and half seasons!  Some people have given her flak in 3A for the Echo Caves secret and being willing to leave Emma to stay with Charming on Neverland, but I thought those were perfectly fine, human reactions and they never detracted from it being crystal clear that Snow still loved Emma very much ("Going Home" showed this very well.)

 

I could possibly excuse the screw-ups in 3B since Snow was pregnant with another child at the moment and that arc actually started to finally give us a more solid Charming-Emma dynamic, but ever since "Bleeding Through" happened, Snow's more frequent female companion has been Regina, not Emma, which is infuriatingly stupid. What has happened between Snow and Emma since then?  Let's see...

• Snow shamed Emma for forgetting about them even though Emma literally had no choice.
• It was revealed that Snow only needed to get back to Emma so that Emma could be the Savior again.
• Snow didn't even concern herself with Emma almost freezing to death.
• Snow was afraid of Emma's powers and shamed her for accidentally endangering Charming with them. 
• When Emma was missing, Snow concerned herself more with Regina's relationship woes than finding her daughter.
• There was absolutely no working through the above two issues other than a quick hug.
• Snow, along with Charming, lied to Emma about their past with the QoD.
• It was revealed that Snow thought baby Emma was evil, and did something terrible to "ensure Emma's goodness".
• When confronted by Emma about this, she justified her actions, saying "it was worth it!"
• Snow risked her life to make things up to Maleficent, rather than to Emma.
• There was absolutely no working through the above four issues other than a quick hug.
• Snow did nothing to stop Emma's sacrifice, and majorly under-reacted to it.
• Snow tried to control Emma with the dagger.
• Snow spent more time preparing Regina for the ball than she did preparing Emma.
• Snow was perfectly fine with letting Emma's love die.
• Snow, along with Charming, never attempted to see Emma once she's a full-on Dark One.
• Snow risked her life to save Regina when she didn't to save Emma.
• Snow claimed there "may not be an Emma left", despite having not a shred of evidence for this.

 

How much more can they drag this relationship, and this character, through the mud?  I'm afraid to find out.

 

As long as Regina's around, the Emma/Snow relationship will continue to suffer.  Judging by their comments, it's more important for the writers to explore Snow/Regina or Emma/Regina's growing friendship than it is to fix mother and daughter. 

[LizaD]

I don't think the writers saw it quite that way.

 

 

Snow shamed Emma for forgetting about them even though Emma literally had no choice.
It was revealed that Snow only needed to get back to Emma so that Emma could be the Savior again.

That "issue" ended with Emma admitting that her parents were right and she's been a cold bitch to her parents all of 3B because she was scared and her walls. Again.

 

 

Snow was afraid of Emma's powers and shamed her for accidentally endangering Charming with them.
When Emma was missing, Snow concerned herself more with Regina's relationship woes than finding her daughter.
There was absolutely no working through the above two issues other than a quick hug.

This "issue" ended because Emma finally learned to accept herself through Elsa's help. It wasn't Snow's problem, it was Emma's because she let Ingrid play on her insecurites. Again.

 

 

It was revealed that Snow thought baby Emma was evil, and did something terrible to "ensure Emma's goodness".
When confronted by Emma about this, she justified her actions, saying "it was worth it!"
Snow risked her life to make things up to Maleficent, rather than to Emma.

This one ended when Emma let go of her childish anger that was turning her EVIL and playing into Rump's hands.

 

 

Snow was perfectly fine with letting Emma's love die.

Snow risked her life to save Regina when she didn't to save Emma.

 

This is really the only 2 I have a problem with because it is slightly in character, going all the way back to S2 when Snow threw her kid and the entire EF realm under the bus to go save Woegina.

 

It's a shame because really S1 Snow fairybacks and Rump/Gold is what got me hooked on this show and I think Ginny is the strongest actor they've got outside of Robert. They've sytematically destroyed her character to the point that the Disney cartoon version is about 100x's better.

[Curio]

Operation #HerNameIsSnow needs to happen, though.

 

Here's another idea...how about we all really push to create a ship name for the Emma/Snow friendship? Think about it, if SwanQueen is boisterous enough to get journalists to talk about that "friendship," then why can't we do the same for Emma and Snow's friendship? You could argue that the writers wrote Season 4 because of the fandom influence of the SQ crowd, so we just need to make #SnowSwan a thing and make it known that the writers need to focus on those two again. 

[Delphi]

I totally just tweeted it because, why not?

[HoodlumSheep]

Let's do this, people!

* I tweeted #SnowSwan and #HerNameIsSnow at some of the writers. I feel so evil now.

Edited November 19, 2015 by HoodlumSheep

[FierceAfroChick]

I don't have a twitter account, but I'll high-five you on the idea...hope it takes off.

[Mathius]

See, that's a solution I've always thought should happen. Too many seem afraid to because they don't want to be like the SQers and other douches who incessantly attack the writers on Twitter, but I personally think that the loudest, most obnoxious voices on the internet get heard, if not by the writers then by the people at ABC whose jobs it is to observe the Internet reactions to shows. It's why Regina and Rumple got such an increase after Season 1, it's why Swan Queen pandering began happening in Season 4. If more people started demanding better writing for Snow and for her relationship with Emma, the show might make that happen.

[Camera One]

I don't think the numbers who want more Snow/Emma are there, sadly.  In addition, this sentiment doesn't align with the Writers' interests.  The Writers love Regina/Emma and Regina/Snow because it makes Regina looks good by having the "good guys" support her.  The screentime devoted to Snowing/Emma in 5A compared to Hook/Emma, Regina/Emma and AnyRandoms/Emma is extremely telling in terms of what the Writers really think about that relationship.  And the list above shows that they prefer to use the relationship between Snow and Emma to cause strife and conflict to fuel the plot, without devoting the time to really repair, develop and deepen the relationship.

Edited November 20, 2015 by Camera One

[YaddaYadda]

I guess the story is nothing like I expected it to go after hearing what the actors and the writers had to say in SDCC, and in some media outlets. I thought they were going to address some of the stuff that went down between Emma and Snow, and if there was ever a moment for this, it was Emma becoming Dark Swan.

 

I've been waiting for this since the Echo Caves, and it's clearly never happening, so I'm making the decision to move on. 

 

Regina and Snow are step-mother and step-daughter. If anything, Regina should be trying to be something of a mother figure for Snow, instead of the other way around. Considering everything, Regina is technically the matriarch of the family.

 

Snow mothers Regina, but if there's gossip, Snow is right there with Emma, like when she was trying to get information out of her about Hook without looking like she was trying to do that back in 4x01.

[Rumsy4]

I've been waiting for this since the Echo Caves, and it's clearly never happening, so I'm making the decision to move on. 

 

You know, this arc is when I finally gave up hoping for some focus on Emma & Snow's relationship. Her parents barely had two conversation with Emma in Camelot, and haven't even spoken to her in Storybrooke. They didn't even even attempt or see her until the last episode, apparently after Snow--sorry, Mary Margaret--decided that there was no Emma anymore.

 

I'm going to pretend that Snow and Charming have secretly been replaced with magical StepfordWives!clones by Regina. Regina's magic went a little awry, so the Snow!clone only responds to "Mary Margaret". They are also kinda dumb and wonky. If the clones interact with Emma more than a certain threshold, Emma will be able to tell these are not really her parents. Hence the limited interactions between them. There, that explains everything! ;-p

Edited November 20, 2015 by Rumsy4

[KingOfHearts]

 

You know, this arc is when I finally gave up hoping for some focus on Emma & Snow's relationship. Her parents barely had two conversation with Emma in Camelot, and haven't even spoken to her in Storybrooke. They didn't even even attempt or see her until the last episode, apparently after Snow--sorry, Mary Margaret--decided that there was no Emma anymore.

And they gave MM's only heart-to-heart thus far this season to Ruby, and it was only to explain away her absence. 

[Camera One]

It's only nine episodes in.  There's still HOPE, right?  

[KingOfHearts]

 

It's only nine episodes in.  There's still HOPE, right?

Yeah - this has all been setup for the ultimate confrontation between Emma and her parents. In the winter finale, we'll be addressing Snowing's choices regarding her infancy. We'll talk about how weird it is that Mary Margaret was Emma's roommate and try to resolve where their friendship stands now. Emma will lash out about how they only care about her Savior status. Snow will come to the realization that Emma's upbringing wasn't easy and learn that hope didn't always ring true for her. Yes, ladies and gentleman - all of 5A's events are leading up to 2A's payoff.

Edited November 20, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[InsertWordHere]

The glaring thing about Charming calling her Mary Margaret is that when Red introduced herself to Mulan, she said something like "My name's Ruby but my friends call me Red." So Charming doesn't call his wife, who he met before the curse, by her pre-curse name, but Ruby tells everyone she meets that they can call her either name? Ruby also tells Mulan that "Mary Margaret" is doing fine, so it can't be that Ruby doesn't think Mulan will understand their curse names. I can't remember how they referred to her during the team Princess arc, Emma obviously called her MM but I thought Aurora at least called her Snow. Mulan and Aurora obviously knew who she was.

Edited November 20, 2015 by InsertWordHere

[KAOS Agent]

Mulan calls her Snow. Both during the Team Princess adventure and she refers to her that way when Neal shows up in the S3 premiere. 

[snarkybelle]

I think in Neverland Snow gave up trying to be Emma's mother.  She never made good on her promise - "You were an orphan, it's my job to change that."  In that scene, Emma apologized for admitting she felt like an orphan, feeling the despair of not having anyone who loves her, feeling like a lost girl.  I think that's when Snow decided to have her do-over baby(Ginny's pregnancy helped with that plot).  It was too late for Emma to have a mother so she wanted to make it up to herself by having another child.  In a way, Regina and Snow are similar in that they mostly think about themselves which is why they are in so many scenes together. 

[KAOS Agent]

If you want to know what's really stupid about the Mary Margaret/Snow stuff, it's that the Mary Margaret name is what's confusing to a casual audience. I was watching this last year when I was home for a wedding and I gave a basic outline to my dad about how it's Snow White & Prince Charming and there was a curse and so on and he asked me who Mary Margaret was since I said that woman was Snow White.

 

I hold out zero hope for any meaningful Emma/Snow scenes this season. It's a shame that such a great relationship turned into Snow actually saying that there may not be an Emma anymore. I don't know how she could make that assessment without ever talking to her daughter, but there you go. The ever hopeful Snow never has any hope or faith in her daughter.

[KingOfHearts]

 

I hold out zero hope for any meaningful Emma/Snow scenes this season. It's a shame that such a great relationship turned into Snow actually saying that there may not be an Emma anymore. I don't know how she could make that assessment without ever talking to her daughter, but there you go. The ever hopeful Snow never has any hope or faith in her daughter.

For being the president of Hope Commission, she sure has been the downer for this arc. The writing concerning her urgency to save Emma has been very inconsistent. She really has no confidence in Emma unless she needs a Savior to pull a magic wombo-combo with Regina.

Edited November 20, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[YaddaYadda]

It's only nine episodes in.  There's still HOPE, right?  

I'll send you a quarter if it happens.

[Shanna Marie]

The weird thing about the firm Mary Margaret/Snow distinction is that it's so inconsistent with the rest of the characters. Granny has the same name in both worlds (well, she may have different given names, but she's always called Granny). Belle was Lacey in Storybrooke for a while, but now she's always just Belle. They use "Grumpy" and "Leroy" interchangeably in Storybrooke, and most of the rest of the dwarfs are generally called by their dwarf names in both worlds. Some people call Rumple "Gold" in Storybrooke, but Belle always calls him "Rumple." They may use "Evil Queen" for Regina in the Enchanted Forest in scripts, but the other characters call her "Regina" in both places. Then there are all the characters without curse identities who have the same name in both places, like Robin, Roland, Zelena, and Hook. So if viewers are able to keep things straight with all these other characters, why do they think we'll be confused if they don't draw a firm line between Mary Margaret and Snow White?

 

What's really odd is that she does seem to be the one who's most likely to also make clear distinctions about the other characters. David's actual name is "David" in both worlds, with "Charming" being her pet name for him, but she only uses her pet name for her husband in the Enchanted Forest and only calls him "David" in Storybrooke. So is it a Snow character thing, where she has to draw these clear lines in her head between identities and worlds?

[orza]

I see nothing weird about it. They are all individuals with their own preferences. It has been canon since season 2 that Snow prefers to be called Mary Margaret now. I wouldn't take Jane Espensen's remark about not confusing viewers seriously. People pester them with so many dumb questions it must be hard to resist giving the occasional snarky response in the spirit of "Ask a stupid question, you get a stupid answer."

[Camera One]

Why not just say Snow prefers to be called Mary Margaret then.  And if so, explain why.

[Curio]

I don't understand why someone would prefer to be called a 5-syllable name versus a 1-syllable name all the time.

[orza]

It has nothing to do with the number of syllables, it has to do with her identity and how she sees herself going forward. Snow embraced her life in Storybrook after the curse was broken and wanted to stay there and also wanted to keep the name associated with that life. She was looking forward to her future and not backward at the life she had in Fairytale land. There was enough exposition about this in season 2 that it doesn't really need to rehashed on twitter so why should Jane indulge those people who weren't paying attention when the relevant scenes aired.

[FormerMod-a1]

I see nothing weird about it. They are all individuals with their own preferences. It has been canon since season 2 that Snow prefers to be called Mary Margaret now. I wouldn't take Jane Espensen's remark about not confusing viewers seriously. People pester them with so many dumb questions it must be hard to resist giving the occasional snarky response in the spirit of "Ask a stupid question, you get a stupid answer."

Isn't JE one of the producers (and writer?) though, someone that would know/influence both the character's motivation behind the name and the writer's reasoning for it?  I don't see why that shouldn't be take seriously.  And it's not a new thing either.  I first read about it seasons ago.  I personally don't care what MM/Snow wants to be called, but I can see why it's an issue for some.  Especially since she does seem to have very different personalities with the names. 

[Camera One]

Shanna Marie raises a good point.  Snow is the only main character with a very different Cursed name.  That's why it's so glaring.

[orza]

Gold and Rumplestiltskin seem pretty different to me.

[Camera One]

Yeah, she pointed that out.   As she said, Belle tends to call him Rumple, while others use Gold and sometimes Rumple.  If that pattern held, then David should be using Snow.

 

Rumple/Gold wouldn't need to be differentiated by name.  Glittery Rumple looks immediately different from Mr. Suit Gold.  Though they already do the same thing with Long-haired Snow vs. Short-haired Mary Margaret.

Edited November 21, 2015 by Camera One

[Rumsy4]

No one came to watch the fairy tale of Prince Charming and Mary Margaret. This decision makes very little sense. Chandler voice: Could the name be any more boring? 

[Curio]

Chandler voice: Could the name be any more boring? 

 

Wouldn't it be: Could the name be and more boring? ;)

[orza]

In the early planning stages of the show Snow was originally supposed to be a nun in cursed Storybrook. Mary Margaret is a classic nun's name. Clearly they kept the name even though the character was changed to a school teacher. Mary Margaret is also a conservative, old-fashioned name, which, I think, suits Snow. She is a conservative, old-fashioned good-two-shoes rule follower. It is fitting that she has a name to match.

 

I think the notion that there has to be one iron-clad rule that applies to every character, be that names, behavior, redemption path,etc, would make for a very boring show. The variation in names gives us hints about the state of mind of the various characters. Snow knows who she wants to be going forward. Other characters like Red and Grumpy appear to be conflicted about who they want to be and whether they want to stay in Storybrook or not and the use of both names reflects that. David is very sure of his identity so he only needs one name. David also honors his wife's wishes by using the name she prefers. I suppose Belle likes the name  Rumple because in spite of all her bleating about wanting him to change she seems to like the bad boy who goes by the name Rumplestiltskin.

[Delphi]

I don't think it was ever established that Snow didn't want to go back to her kingdom ever ever. I was under the impression that to her, her family was much more important and since she didn't think Emma would want to go home nor want to make her choose that she decided on Storybrooke. As of season four Emma has come to see her family as her family completely. So there really should be a discussion there but nothing concerning Snow's identity.

Eta; after watching since depressing tv, I decided to watch some good Snow episodes. It doesn't fix current problems but watching Snow stand protectively in front of Emma during the Cora prison scene in Lady of the Lake does absolute wonders.

Edited November 21, 2015 by Delphi

[Camera One]

I have always been intrigued by the possibility of Mary Margaret being a nun.  Would you have preferred a storyline where Nun Mary Margaret was attracted to David rather than having David be married?  Now I'm imagining Blue singing "Climb Every Mountain" to Mary Margaret in Season 1.  

[Rumsy4]

Wouldn't it be: Could the name be and more boring? ;)

You are right, of course! ;-) I knew something was off when I typed it. heh

Now I'm imagining Blue singing "Climb Every Mountain" to Mary Margaret in Season 1.

LMAO! This will be followed by the Evil Queen singing, "How do you solve a problem like Mary-aaa", and the dwarf ensemble going "High on a hill was a lonely shepherd..."

Edited November 21, 2015 by Rumsy4

[Mathius]

I'm confused by orza's repeated writers defense/apologism.  Does s/he know more than we do about the whole behind-the-scenes process?  Does s/he have ABC connections?  It's really unclear.  If we had clear answers, I'd consider what s/he is saying more, but as it stands it just doesn't wash.  Calling Snow "Mary Margaret" all the time is dumb, period.

 

It has been canon since season 2 that Snow prefers to be called Mary Margaret now. 

 

But that came out of nowhere in 2x15.  Before that in Season 2, she was perfectly fine answering to Snow.

Edited November 21, 2015 by Mathius

[Curio]

I'm confused by orza's repeated writers defense/apologism. Does s/he know more than we do about the whole behind-the-scenes process?  Does s/he have ABC connections?

 

No, s/he just has a different opinion than some of the posters here. That's allowed.

[Faemonic]

I wouldn't take Jane Espensen's remark about not confusing viewers seriously.

I would, because I think that creative decision makes sense.

 

At the start of Season 2, they shook up the status quo so that everybody had their fairy tale memories back and were going "Red, I mean Ruby" or "Blue, I mean Mother Superior"; while David said "We Are Both" the tension between identities worked for the writers in the first season, and preserving the Storybrooke names in Storybrooke comes off to me like a good call. It would have been a better call for every character to have their own relationship with their names made deliberate even as the character's name preference changed, especially when Storybrooke itself didn't serve as strong a contrast to the Magic Worlds as once it did. (Storybrooke has magic beyond nullifying-magic magic, they're going off to Neverland or returning to the Enchanted Forest or grabbing a beer at Camelot wearing their Renaissance velvets anyway...)

 

Maybe that's what happened, but it feels more to me that they stray from the guideline when Johanna says, "You'll always be Snow White to me" or when David shouts "Snow!" to get Mary Margaret to talk to him in Neverland. I imagine that each writer is juggling names, with a general agreement to guidelines, with other writers' individual attitudes towards the names, and sometimes they'll drop a ball. This particular audience reaction (#HerNameIsSnow unless there was some heartfelt pillow talk with David about why she prefers Mary Margaret #ItHappenedOffscreen) considers the constant use of Mary Margaret a dropped ball.

 

Belle always saying Rumple might have been a special case: she didn't have a Storybrooke identity until Lacey, so Mr. Gold would be Rumple to her. Unlike Johanna who could have easily downloaded some memories of neglecting a bratty baby Mary Margaret played by Bailee Madison, if not, you know, understood how important a named identity was to someone who'd been cursed and not "deadnamed" her precious ward. Cora's henchman Hook referring to the Crocodile as "Gold" bugs me, but Watsonian and Doylist explanations both work: Hook is as shifty (adaptable) as he is shady, or the writer of that episode couldn't be arsed to balance guidelines with character justification or second-think and third-think the first name that got on the page that would come out of Hook's mouth.

 

I can accept Jane Espenson's remark as a logical reason, sharing part of the creative process honestly, that isn't even insulting. I can accept that reasoning.

 

But that they make that call and what they then do with it (or fail to do with it) just gives me a case of the "euurrrrghhh"s. Especially in Mary Margaret's case.

Edited November 23, 2015 by Faemonic

[Camera One]

In general, they don't put very much thought into what Snow says or does.  Look at how the writer gave her contradictory statements in "Birth".  They had her say out of the blue that there may not be any Emma left inside, with zero buildup, without devoting a single scene to Snowing/Dark Emma in present-day Storybrooke.  We can fanwank all we want, but it's all just conjecture.  True, she found out Dark Emma took out the heart of Henry's boyfriend, etc., but we got Regina stating that she told everyone, but no one got to react to it.  Regina actually AGREES to that line by Snow that there may be no Emma left, but then subsequently, in the same scene, says "We're going to get our Emma back".   So what was the reasoning behind the decision to have Regina say that latter line, and why would Regina contradict herself?   Then later in "Birth", in front of Dark Emma's house in Storybrooke, they had Snow adamantly telling Regina that she shall not hurt Dark Emma.  Does that mean she was fine with Dark Emma destroying light magic, as they thought she was going to do.  What exactly did Snowing plan to do to avert this disaster?  Why did the subsequent conversation involve mostly Emma and Regina while Snowing stood in the background gawking?

 

Basically, the writers have Snow and Charming in particular just following the more important characters, and then piping up to say either expositionary, or questions/prompts that allow other more knowledgeable characters like Regina to respond.  

 

I'm not even going to go into how the writers had Snowing flip-flop over the whole egg-napping fallout in 4B, to the point that I think the writers now USE these two characters rather than write for the characters.  When you ask "How did they grow from this plotline", the answer is always "not at all" versus the more "important" characters.

Edited November 21, 2015 by Camera One

[october]

I'm not even going to go into how the writers had Snowing flip-flop over the whole egg-napping fallout in 4B, to the point that I think the writers now USE these two characters rather than write for the characters.

 

I agree. During the opening scene to Nimue I noticed the contrast between the exposition-y line Charming gets about Excalibur and the dialogue Hook has right afterwards where he criticises Merlin's vagueness and expresses concern for Emma. Hook's behaviour felt more genuine and organic because we saw a coherent emotional build up throughout the arc. But with Snow and Charming you never really know where their heads are going to be at episode to episode until they open their mouths and say something that has little relation to what they said an episode or even a scene ago.

[Shanna Marie]

I think Snow is the only one who has stated a specific preference about what to be called in each place. Everyone calls David "Charming" in the Enchanted Forest, but he introduced himself to Rapunzel as "David." So, is that meant to be her compartmentalizing more than everyone else does rather than going with the "we are both" or is it just a thing? She actually corrects people, and I don't recall anyone else doing that.

 

It seems like the scripts make distinctions, with "Snow White" for her dialogue in flashbacks and "Mary Margaret" for the present, and ditto with a lot of the other characters. They're less consistent with how the characters talk to each other.

[KingOfHearts]

My problem with the Mary Margaret preference, besides the fact its not her actual name, is that it's usually illogical. Most people will know her as Snow White, unless they were friends with her during the curse. Unless they were going to Camelot covertly (which I doubt, since they were stupid enough to give Arthur all the information he needed), Snow's name could have been advantageous in getting closer to the higher-ups. 

 

Plus... why would she want to be affiliated with cursed MM anyway? Wouldn't it just remind her of the public scandal and being separated from her daughter? Wouldn't using her true name honor her parents, Joanna, etc.? What people find annoying I think is that Mary Margaret represents her retirement from being epic female bandit. She has rejected her heritage and past in more ways than just a name preference.

[Camera One]

If we're going to fanwank...

 

Maybe she was teased as a child about her weird name.  Snow falls!  Ha ha!  Snow drifts!  Ha ha!  Maybe she has always wanted to be called Margaret, which was the fake name she told Red.  Maybe since Emma thinks of her as Mary Margaret, she wants everyone to call her Mary Margaret, since she's odd like that.  Maybe after the Cora disaster, she went online and read the suggestion that Hail Marys could help and she took it literally.  Who knows.

[Mari]

Going back half a page--while Mary Margaret is a fairly nun-sounding name, I always thought she was named after Maria Sophia von Erthal and Margarete von Waldeck, who've been called the inspiration for the Snow White story.  Maria is a Latin variation of Mary, and Mary flows better into Margaret than Maria does.  And doesn't the Blanchard basically mean "white"?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snow_White

 

I've wondered if their reluctance to call her Snow is actually because they have trouble taking Snow seriously as a name.

 

(As for Rumple's name--I've always just assumed that he didn't have a last name, as a lot of peasants in many countries didn't for years and years, and that the curse just gave him a last name;  he was close to no one, apparently, and so most people would have called him Mr. Gold.)

Edited November 21, 2015 by Mari

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Yes, I thought Blanchard was clever since it does mean white.  Apparently, it's an obsolete term for "white horse".

[YaddaYadda]

Blanche means white. Snow White is Blanche Neige.

Blanchard means whitish/pale, which I guess the whole dark sport makes Mary Margaret sort of whitish?