Danielle and Mohamed: The Original Mess

[RedBaron]

12 minutes ago, Trace said:

I'm no Mo fan, but it pisses me off that everyone on the show conveniently forgot that it was Dani who brought up the hygiene problems.  Mo said it was very personal and didn't want to talk about it. Then they pile on him like that?  I personally can't stand Mel.  I think she's a total bitch.

Yes, Danielle brought it up first but I wonder if she was afraid he was going to so she beat him to the punch.  She's not that bright. 

The reason they all jumped on him was because of the way he shouted right at her that "no one would want to have sex with her."  That's what they were rightfully saying was mean and way out-of-line.  His hostility and anger was palpable and his outright disdain was pretty disturbing.  He showed his true colors and it was not a good look. 

7 minutes ago, Virtually Me said:

None of that negates the determination that he entered the marriage legitimately.  Also, love is not required for a K1 marriage. USCIS doesn't have a way of measuring it and they don't try. 

I never said love was required.  But some sort of actual affection is obviously needed or they wouldn't require that couples actually have spent some time together and have an actual relationship.  Otherwise, if he said he cared for her and wanted to spend the rest of his life with her but was actually lying in order to get a way into the country, it would be fraud.   That would indeed be grounds for an annulment.

Edited November 14, 2016 by RedBaron

[Virtually Me]

Why shouldn't he be hostile? Why is it ok for Dani to be hostile, but, not Mo?

Edited November 14, 2016 by Virtually Me

[DangerousMinds]

57 minutes ago, lallalla said:

I have tears for Danielle tonight.

I have read all kinds of crazy from all sides the last year, but Mo just took it there, poor Danielle, this is just too much, Mo, you are wrong, beyond wrong, nothing can excuse this.

I have had tons of anger at Danielle for the things she has done, mostly that have caused neglect toward her daughters, but I had literal tears for her tonight. My anger for her in the past was separate and apart from anything to do with Mo, my issues with, that's just something else. But tonight, I have cried for Danielle.

Danielle, you have made many poor choice. You have sacrificed your children time and again. You have taken criminal actions. You have been overly selfish, This just scratches the surfaces. But tonight, tonight my heart breaks for you. I am sorry for what you experienced, you didn't deserve this, not from a man down the road and not from a man you brought here. Please start focusing on your girls, yourself, on anything but other people and men (of course, focus on others in so much as we all need to in order to be good, kind members of our communities).

My god, no one deserves what she just went through!

I agree with al of your posts! Mo is sociopathic trash.

[RedBaron]

1 minute ago, Virtually Me said:

Why shouldn't he be hostile? 

Because he's not an innocent party in this by any stretch of the imagination.  The fact that he blames her for everything is ridiculous.

[Virtually Me]

3 minutes ago, RedBaron said:

Because he's not an innocent party in this by any stretch of the imagination.  The fact that he blames her for everything is ridiculous.

She blames him for everything and she's pretty hostile, too. Yet, she's not innocent. So, she must be sociopathic trash.

Edited November 14, 2016 by Virtually Me

[DangerousMinds]

He doesn't deserve to stay in this country. Maybe some changes are coming to the immigration process. And yes, he is trash. He should be paying Danielle back for all she spent getting him here, his visa, etc. Man up, asshole.

[RedBaron]

1 minute ago, DangerousMinds said:

He doesn't deserve to stay in this country. Maybe some changes are coming to the immigration process. And yes, he is trash. He should be paying Danielle back for all she spent getting him here, his visa, etc. Man up, asshole.

According to poor Mo, she owes HIM.  <<<Rolls eyes>>>.

And, yes, I agree he is trash and needs to go.

[Virtually Me]

24 minutes ago, RedBaron said:

I never said love was required.  But some sort of actual affection is obviously needed or they wouldn't require that couples actually have spent some time together and have an actual relationship.  Otherwise, if he said he cared for her and wanted to spend the rest of his life with her but was actually lying in order to get a way into the country, it would be fraud.   That would indeed be grounds for an annulment.

Love. Affection. A distinction without a difference.  Making promises about caring and staying forever are more romantic notions that USCIS doesn't measure. 

If his failed (assumed) promises to care and make a life with her would be grounds for deportation, then, her (legally binding) promises to be stable and financially responsible would be grounds for him to stay.

[RedBaron]

1 minute ago, Virtually Me said:

Love. Affection. A distinction without a difference.  Making promises about caring and staying forever are more romantic notions that USCIS doesn't measure. 

If his failed (assumed) promises to care and make a life with her would be grounds for deportation, then, her (legally binding) promises to be stable and financially responsible would be grounds for him to stay.

I understand that you believe that very strongly.  I also have stated my position numerous times and it remains unchanged.  I'm happy to let the courts decide.  

I don't agree with your last sentence but you seem to be stating that two wrongs somehow make a right.  To me, it's all the more reason that their marriage was a total sham based on fraud and should be annulled.

[Virtually Me]

I'm speaking more about the grounds for deportation at USCIS. An annulment, if she gets it, won't have much influence on that because of her failure to uphold the agreement she has with the feds.

[Adeejay]

49 minutes ago, Trace said:

I'm no Mo fan, but it pisses me off that everyone on the show conveniently forgot that it was Dani who brought up the hygiene problems.  Mo said it was very personal and didn't want to talk about it. Then they pile on him like that?  I personally can't stand Mel.  I think she's a total bitch.

Shauna was the one who kept pushing Mohamed about why he stop sleeping with Danielle.  When Mohamed said it was personal, Dani blurted out that he posted on social media that she smells.  Mo came across as a real ahole.  He has a self righteous air that I've never noticed before and has a habit of saying he is being disrespected. 

[RedBaron]

7 minutes ago, Virtually Me said:

I'm speaking more about the grounds for deportation at USCIS. An annulment, if she gets it, won't have much influence on that because of her failure to uphold the agreement she has with the feds.

Well, if the Feds could deport both of them, I'd be fine with that but Danielle is a citizen and he's not so ....bye MO!  The feds could charge Danielle if they actually felt she wasn't truthful in the process about her financial situation (I truly doubt it, though)  AND deport Mo for his blatant fraud in the marriage. Win win!

[Virtually Me]

9 minutes ago, RedBaron said:

. . . deport Mo for his blatant fraud in the marriage. Win win!

USCIS has had at least three bites at the apple, and, I've also heard of a fourth. Their first bite was their investgation prior to issuing the visa. The next was the routine check prior to issuing the gc. They had a Stokes interview and passed. If it's true that family and friends also approached USCIS wirh no success, that would be the fourth. 

Of course, there will be a new check next year when Mo is up for AOS. If he has legal counsel, he will sail through that, anulment or no annulment. 

[Christina]

Speaking for myself, and certainly not because others also think it, I don't think Dani is innocent; I think she is as big of a scammer as Mo; and that neither of them entered this marriage for legitimate purposes. I also think he should be deported. It would be nice if any future K-1 she submits is automatically denied, but as sure as I am that she will do this again (once current beau leaves), I'm pretty sure she won't be automatically denied.

None of her issues or failures excuse Mohamed's use of her to get into America. There is enough outrage to go around. No, he shouldn't have to stay married to her. He also should not get to marry a woman he had no plans to make a future with and stay in this country, which was his ultimate goal. He never had any plan to stay with Danielle. Not just once he realized that she was worse off then he knew, but at no time did he ever plan to stay married to her. He tried to get her friend to drive him to his family in Canada almost immediately. 

They were both using each other. There is no penalty we can wish for Dani, but we can for Mo. I will feel the same way if Narkiya brings Lowo here, and he leaves her immediately, too. Maybe USCIS has made their determination and Danielle's insistence that it was a real relationship will allow him to stay here. It doesn't mean that I have to think it is right. There is nothing in the whole Dani/Mo saga to support any theory that Mo wanted a real marriage with her. There is support for the theory that he didn't realize how bad off she really was or how emotionally disturbed she turned out to be, and no one should be forced to live like that, but he should have picked his mark better. He swung and missed, and doesn't deserve a "reward" which is what the Green Card seems to be to him.

My opinions are my own, and not part of a tribe mentality. I am, however, fully in the camp of send Mohamed packing.

[Celia Rubenstein]

1 minute ago, Virtually Me said:

I think the Dani is a victim and Mo is an asshole is a tribal thing, a kind of how dare he come to our country and not be compliant and grateful to his benefactor. That's the only thing that makes sense to me since there is not one person I've discussed this with who would want their worst enemy to be married to Dani. A lot of people maybe see it as a sentence he must serve to stay with her or leave. Just an observation.

I haven't read any posts that suggest Mohamed should have to stay married to Danielle in order to remain in the US.  

The question is whether he is entitled to remain in the US after they split.  And there has been plenty of material shown on the program (and available online) to justify the opinion that Mohamed never had any intention of participating in a real marriage with Danielle .... that he was acting fraudulently, only wanted a green card, etc. and he doesn't deserve to stay in the country.  

I really don't think the opinions being expressed about the matter have a thing to do with the kind of "tribal" expectations of subservience that you suggest it does. In fact, the idea is actually a bit insulting.

[Real Eyes]

3 hours ago, Virtually Me said:

It's true, though. Dani was bad mouthing Mo all over the net. I remember when she posted on at least two facebook pages about how women need to stop sending him money and what a scammer he was. She posted about his mistresses and all kinds of personal info.

Well that was accurate, wasn't it?

If he is not deported, I wonder how he'll make money once he's no longer on the TLC/fame gravy train.  

[Virtually Me]

49 minutes ago, Real Eyes said:

Well that was accurate, wasn't it?

If he is not deported, I wonder how he'll make money once he's no longer on the TLC/fame gravy train.  

She was pissed coz no one was sending her money. She posted screen shots of her demanding money from one woman in an attempt to get sympathy. She didn't really care who she was sleeping with. She offered to sell him for $30,000. That's true love to someone with fraud charges on their record. 

I wonder if she claimed all the dough they got on her income taxes. "No" could mean tax fraud.

[Real Eyes]

Whether she was pissed is irrelevant.  Mohamed was scamming women with his "poor me" routine.

[Virtually Me]

1 hour ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

I haven't read any posts that suggest Mohamed should have to stay married to Danielle in order to remain in the US.  

The question is whether he is entitled to remain in the US after they split.  And there has been plenty of material shown on the program (and available online) to justify the opinion that Mohamed never had any intention of participating in a real marriage with Danielle .... that he was acting fraudulently, only wanted a green card, etc. and he doesn't deserve to stay in the country.  

I really don't think the opinions being expressed about the matter have a thing to do with the kind of "tribal" expectations of subservience that you suggest it does. In fact, the idea is actually a bit insulting.

Of course people have been saying he had to stay married to stay in the US (and, he had to be sufficiently affectionate, deferential,  grateful, supportive and providing financially). That's been the mantra since 2014. 

The show is not evidence. It's not reality, is heavily influenced by production and heavily edited. It shows a mere fraction of the story.

I do see it as tribal, and my observations are not at all limited to posts on PTV.  

6 minutes ago, Real Eyes said:

Whether she was pissed is irrelevant.  Mohamed was scamming women with his "poor me" routine.

And, she was trying hard to "scam" them, too. Her poor me routine seems to work better on viewers, though.

Frankly, if strangers willingly send you money for nothing, more power to you.

[Real Eyes]

No, I don't think most people would say he has to be sufficiently deferential, grateful, etc.  But people know a scam when they see one.

I married a foreigner.  We've been married over 32 years.  I never expected him to be deferential to me when he emigrated (nor was he, he is strong willed), or grateful (I was grateful to have him in my life  and vice versa).  Yes, I expected him to be affectionate (though not in public, but having sex was never a problem for us, HAHA), and supportive, as I was supportive of him.  That is what marriage is.  

I think what people object to here is that it is so obvious that Mohamed had no intention of making a life with Danielle.  For him, she was a means to an end.  That doesn't mean Danielle is blameless in all of this, she is not.  But it does make a mockery of the K1 visa system when someone can play it so easily with no consequences.

I take into account there is editing, and probably goading to do certain things for television drama.  That doesn't change the fact that everything Mohamed spouts is for the benefit of Mohamed.  He is a user and probably a sociopath. 

[GracieK]

3 hours ago, Virtually Me said:

I think the Dani is a victim and Mo is an asshole is a tribal thing, a kind of how dare he come to our country and not be compliant and grateful to his benefactor. That's the only thing that makes sense to me since there is not one person I've discussed this with who would want their worst enemy to be married to Dani. A lot of people maybe see it as a sentence he must serve to stay with her or leave. Just an observation.

Right so why did Mo marry her? Oh right.. for a green card.

[Virtually Me]

Ok, one thing that's repeated often is that it's so obvious that Mo used Dani for a green card. What makes it so obvious?

[CoachWristletJen]

12 hours ago, lallalla said:

Yes, I didn't even touch on so much of this, like her filing again...but still, her agreeing..let alone him having the gall to ask her to agree to just be "friends", as if he's brought anything at all to the table to warrant that?! It's so...degrading, it is just so..it's SO! I can't even! I mean "accept me as "friend" while I do what I want, treat you like shit, and be happy I even give you this..."

 

Now she is a destructive ass brat, but really?! WTF? Who thinks their "friendship" alone, when they are an utter shit, is enough to warrant anything?!
A guy who is beyond a cocky pric, that's who!

I call her a destructive brat for not letting it alone. She admitted on national television that she filed the annulment, used the legal system to force him to travel back to Ohio to talk about a marriage that he had no interest in working on. 

He wanted to leave. He told her he wanted to leave. And she wouldn't let him leave. She literally sat down and blocked the doorway.

He may be an arrogant a$$hole, but at least he's not the type of guy who will manhandle her and try to forcibly remove her from the doorway. (Although desperate Dani probably would have loved it and been all like, "Ooooooh, Moooo! You finally read 50 Shades of Greeeey!!!" 

He didn't want to be her friend. All he wanted was to be free, and he was willing to say whatever he needed to say to be free.

Friendship is a thin illusion at this point. (Although if she had behaved, he would have probably offered her the occasional kind word to help her make it through. I really do think he would have been kinder to her. But she's not behaving at all. She wants her pound of flesh! So of course he doesn't want to pay her back!) 

And at this point, she just needs to let him go!

I think BOTH of these people need to quit hurting each other! Mo seems to be in favor of that. Dani does not. She wants to hurt Mo through the legal system. And, if she keeps bashing into him, he will hurt her in return. He won't hit her back. He won't throw stuff back at her. But he will bitchfight. 

[CoachWristletJen]

51 minutes ago, Virtually Me said:

Ok, one thing that's repeated often is that it's so obvious that Mo used Dani for a green card. What makes it so obvious?

She's hideous to him. He can't even bear the sight of her. He doesn't seem to enjoy looking at her or even talking to her, and he never did.  

It makes no sense that he would give up this good life in Qatar to come be with a broke woman whom he can't stand and lies constantly. 

To me, the questions he asked at the attorney's office on his wedding day were very revealing. He was STUNNED that it would take him two years to get his green card because in Canada he could just trot off as soon as he was married. His plan was to ditch Danielle two weeks after the wedding. 

I think he may have entertained the thought of living with her for the free rent and food, but it was obvious to him that she couldn't keep a roof over his head and she wasn't going to stop pawing at him. She was going to insist on having a "marriage."

Personally, I'm in favor of him staying in the country at this point. And, I think she needs to leave him alone and quit harassing him.

He was a good looking 27-year-old, and she was a very old looking 42-year-old who looked 50. She was ridiculous and vain to think he was interested in her.

In my opinion, everything he said and did, and his body language especially, indicated to me that to him she was the most repulsive thing on two feet. He tried to blame his cold behavior on his culture but it went well beyond that.

[CoachWristletJen]

6 hours ago, Adeejay said:

Shauna was the one who kept pushing Mohamed about why he stop sleeping with Danielle.  When Mohamed said it was personal, Dani blurted out that he posted on social media that she smells.  Mo came across as a real ahole.  He has a self righteous air that I've never noticed before and has a habit of saying he is being disrespected. 

The worst part was when they met as a group again and she asked the entire group what was the most shocking thing revealed in Mohamed and Danielle's conversation? OF COURSE it was going to come up again!

So far, Danielle has had zero shame in anything. Nothing has seemed to embarrass her at all. (Although I'm sure it has embarrassed her daughters a LOT.)

Danielle demonstrated a Mama June like resilience in that capacity.  Nothing fazed her.

Someone here mentioned that a raving narcissist will do ANYTHING for pity, and Danielle demonstrated that with the whole pee thing. At first, in the earlier stages of the interview process her eyes lit up when the panel members were saying, "How could you say that to a woman?" She soaked the sympathy up like a sponge!

I don't think she walked off that stage because she was embarrassed.  After all, she had just told a national audience explicitly what the problem was! And, Mo was still referring to it in vague terms.  The problem was, Danielle had no excuse for not seeing a doctor about her problem.  After all, if she loved him, she would have taken care of herself for him, right? She would have fixed that problem, or at least attempted to, right? But, she didn't have an answer for that and she couldn't figure out an excuse so she decided to play the pity card and she got up and walked out so that everyone would say this poor woman.

It's really sad, though.  WHY didn't she do anything about it when they were married? Seems like sex was at the top of her list. Let's face it, sex was the reason she married him, filled out the forms, paid all that money, neglected her daughters, etc.  So, why wouldn't she visit a doctor and try a few things in order to fix the issue? Like take that pill they advertise on television? The one with the lady who walks around holding her little pink bladder by the hand? Why didn't she do anything about it? You drag a man halfway across the world to get your rocks off but you won't at least try a pill?

You know if she had tried anything at all she would have been telling us about it, but she had no answer.  If she really loved this man, she would have attempted to take some responsibility for herself!  If she had visited doctors and they had tried everything and couldn't help her that would be one thing, but this woman didn't even TRY and she still expected this young man to have sex with her.  I'm sorry but that's inexcusable.  

It's also very sad that all of this came up, but remember Dani brought it up herself in an attempt to gain pity and hurt Mohamed.

I will add this. The way Mo talked to her was rotten. He's a jerk. Apparently nobody taught him how to talk to a woman when he was growing up in Tunisia.  

Edited November 14, 2016 by CoachWristletJen

[CoachWristletJen]

5 hours ago, Virtually Me said:

USCIS has had at least three bites at the apple, and, I've also heard of a fourth. Their first bite was their investgation prior to issuing the visa. The next was the routine check prior to issuing the gc. They had a Stokes interview and passed. If it's true that family and friends also approached USCIS wirh no success, that would be the fourth. 

Of course, there will be a new check next year when Mo is up for AOS. If he has legal counsel, he will sail through that, anulment or no annulment. 

Mohamed will be able to stay IF he has legal counsel.

It would be incredibly foolish of him to drop the ball at the last minute by being too cheap to hire an attorney.

After all he's been through to get here and stay here, it's hard to believe anyone would ignore the advice to hire an attorney, but considering the fact that he ignored everything his attorney told him to do, Mo just might.

Hopefully he will get himself an attorney, and keep that attorney, but he just might decide to do his own thing. For example, he just might decide he needs a fancy new pair of sneakers even more.

In which case he will be wearing said sneakers back to Tunisia.

It's such a wait and see thing with him.

Edited November 14, 2016 by CoachWristletJen

[escapetoreality]

Okay so Danielle gave a one-on-one interview on a podcast that came out last night: Episode 189 of Bring Me Your Torch.  It was not exactly penetrating -- she was asked the simplest of questions in a very mild way and her answers comprised lots of giggling interspersed with some brief, grammatically challenged mumbles. Not a lot new -- Mo hasn't been served with the annulment yet (good luck with that).  She tried to justify the insistence on keeping in touch with Mo based on the financial responsibility that she and the co-sponsor share for him -- and I was like wait name the co-sponsor!! But that was not asked. She was not asked when the tell-all was filmed but did say Mo has reached out to her re: annulment number 2 -- well did she respond??? we don't know. She said she had counseled Nicole and Azan and told them to take things slowly (idiot). She was asked if she had ever screamed demanding sex and she said she had never SCREAMED plus the door was 3 feet away and the lock was on the inside ... suggesting a potential hostage situation ...? Others can add more but as always with Danielle she managed to come across as really dim -- oh the kicker was she is starting in college in January for her R.N. (would that by chance be sleazy for-profit institution?0 

[lallalla]

Wasn't Mo actually planning to use the US as a stepping stone to get to Canada to be with his brother? Only, once he got here, he realized Canada/US aren't Schengen, like exists between some EU members.

[DangerousMinds]

6 hours ago, Christina said:

Speaking for myself, and certainly not because others also think it, I don't think Dani is innocent; I think she is as big of a scammer as Mo; and that neither of them entered this marriage for legitimate purposes. I also think he should be deported. It would be nice if any future K-1 she submits is automatically denied, but as sure as I am that she will do this again (once current beau leaves), I'm pretty sure she won't be automatically denied.

None of her issues or failures excuse Mohamed's use of her to get into America. There is enough outrage to go around. No, he shouldn't have to stay married to her. He also should not get to marry a woman he had no plans to make a future with and stay in this country, which was his ultimate goal. He never had any plan to stay with Danielle. Not just once he realized that she was worse off then he knew, but at no time did he ever plan to stay married to her. He tried to get her friend to drive him to his family in Canada almost immediately. 

They were both using each other. There is no penalty we can wish for Dani, but we can for Mo. I will feel the same way if Narkiya brings Lowo here, and he leaves her immediately, too. Maybe USCIS has made their determination and Danielle's insistence that it was a real relationship will allow him to stay here. It doesn't mean that I have to think it is right. There is nothing in the whole Dani/Mo saga to support any theory that Mo wanted a real marriage with her. There is support for the theory that he didn't realize how bad off she really was or how emotionally disturbed she turned out to be, and no one should be forced to live like that, but he should have picked his mark better. He swung and missed, and doesn't deserve a "reward" which is what the Green Card seems to be to him.

My opinions are my own, and not part of a tribe mentality. I am, however, fully in the camp of send Mohamed packing.

Yes! I cosign this post wholeheartedly.

[DangerousMinds]

4 hours ago, Real Eyes said:

No, I don't think most people would say he has to be sufficiently deferential, grateful, etc.  But people know a scam when they see one.

I married a foreigner.  We've been married over 32 years.  I never expected him to be deferential to me when he emigrated (nor was he, he is strong willed), or grateful (I was grateful to have him in my life  and vice versa).  Yes, I expected him to be affectionate (though not in public, but having sex was never a problem for us, HAHA), and supportive, as I was supportive of him.  That is what marriage is.  

I think what people object to here is that it is so obvious that Mohamed had no intention of making a life with Danielle.  For him, she was a means to an end.  That doesn't mean Danielle is blameless in all of this, she is not.  But it does make a mockery of the K1 visa system when someone can play it so easily with no consequences.

I take into account there is editing, and probably goading to do certain things for television drama.  That doesn't change the fact that everything Mohamed spouts is for the benefit of Mohamed.  He is a user and probably a sociopath. 

As a guest in someone else's home, AND as a guest of this country, I personally would be grateful and polite. ESPECIALLY if I was living in someone else's home rent-free, and that person also supported me 100% with food and everything else. AND they had just spent thousands to get me into the country legally. If I could not do so, I would return home. Period.

4 hours ago, GracieK said:

Right so why did Mo marry her? Oh right.. for a green card.

And he absolutely knew about her living and financial situation BEFORE he married her. No excuses there.

[DangerousMinds]

2 hours ago, CoachWristletJen said:

It's really sad, though.  WHY didn't she do anything about it when they were married? Seems like sex was at the top of her list. Let's face it, sex was the reason she married him, filled out the forms, paid all that money, neglected her daughters, etc.  So, why wouldn't she visit a doctor and try a few things in order to fix the issue? Like take that pill they advertise on television? The one with the lady who walks around holding her little pink bladder by the hand? Why didn't she do anything about it? You drag a man halfway across the world to get your rocks off but you won't at least try a pill?

You know if she had tried anything at all she would have been telling us about it, but she had no answer.  If she really loved this man, she would have attempted to take some responsibility for herself!  If she had visited doctors and they had tried everything and couldn't help her that would be one thing, but this woman didn't even TRY and she still expected this young man to have sex with her.  I'm sorry but that's inexcusable.  

It's also very sad that all of this came up, but remember Dani brought it up herself in an attempt to gain pity and hurt Mohamed.

I will add this. The way Mo talked to her was rotten. He's a jerk. Apparently nobody taught him how to talk to a woman when he was growing up in Tunisia.  

Danielle may have no insurance, or insurance with a very high deductible/copay. Getting treatment can be very costly and there may not be the appropriate medical experts in her area. It is not always easy to get medical care in this country. And when it is, it is very very costly.

[Drogo]

There are no tribes here, but some individuals are very close to Beating Dead Horse territory.  Make your point, move on.

Don't forget that not every post requires a response. 

[Arwen Evenstar]

5 hours ago, Virtually Me said:

Ok, one thing that's repeated often is that it's so obvious that Mo used Dani for a green card. What makes it so obvious?

I think most of us here would say that by the way he treats her, it's obvious he was scamming her.  From your posts, you sound like an immigration attorney, so your expertise and perspective is very interesting.

I get it that more marriages are arranged or for the sake of purity preservation, courtships are brief. In arranged marriages, people may already like one another. Like deepens to respect and respect deepens to love. Consummation isn't usually immediate. I have worked with many people who married like this and enjoy a long and very happy marriage, though it doesn't always work out.

We can say whatever we choose to believe about Mo or Dani, but from your standpoint, it makes sense that though you believe Mo to be an ass, BUT the legal definitions and requirements to prove a bona fide marriage were met. 

Dani had plenty of chances to speak to the contrary and chose not to. It would make sense to me that THAT is the bottom line.

[Virtually Me]

Thanks, but, I don't think he's an ass. I'm glad he stood up for himself.  I'm vehemently against poor people importing people they met on the Internet whom they barely know. That's not what the visa was intended for.  If there is one thing the host got right, it's that Dani didn't take the K1 process seriously. I put the onus on the petitioner; they have every advantage.  

[Arwen Evenstar]

1 hour ago, DangerousMinds said:

Danielle may have no insurance, or insurance with a very high deductible/copay. Getting treatment can be very costly and there may not be the appropriate medical experts in her area. It is not always easy to get medical care in this country. And when it is, it is very very costly.

This is also possible, particularly in states where governors refused to accept the federal subsidy, premiums are much higher.  The benefit of it is that people no longer have to be excluded for preexisting conditions which left them even unable to get it no matter how much money  they had.  That is HUGe. And it pays for physical, well woman, and routine cancer screenings, BUT, they still will get billed for lab work, pathology reports, etc.  

Many people are paying upwards of 10 k a year for premiums and are STILL paying several thousand more to meet these deductibles. For all they're spending, hands are still out...most people who subscribe are unemployed, underemployed and they happen to be middle aged with higher risk of being sick. It's not cheap, depending on where you live and your own circumstances. Even wher I live, it's still cheaper than COBRA.

Edited November 14, 2016 by Arwen Evenstar

[DangerousMinds]

26 minutes ago, Virtually Me said:

Thanks, but, I don't think he's an ass. I'm glad he stood up for himself.  I'm vehemently against poor people importing people they met on the Internet whom they barely know. That's not what the visa was intended for.  If there is one thing the host got right, it's that Dani didn't take the K1 process seriously. I put the onus on the petitioner; they have every advantage.  

I think it's just as wrong when a rich person does this. 

[Virtually Me]

3 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

I think it's just as wrong when a rich person does this. 

True, but, when you can't afford your new boy toy, you're the problem.

[mytmo]

On Thursday, November 10, 2016 at 4:53 PM, Trace said:

One caveat. Dani is banned from being deported south of the Ohio River.  This is non-negotiable .

Why do we have to keep her in Northern Ohio? Isn't having a perpetually losing football team in the NFL punishment enough?

Edited November 14, 2016 by mytmo

[CoachWristletJen]

4 hours ago, lallalla said:

Wasn't Mo actually planning to use the US as a stepping stone to get to Canada to be with his brother? Only, once he got here, he realized Canada/US aren't Schengen, like exists between some EU members.

Yes. That's something about this story that needs more emphasis! I think Mo was planning to bolt almost immediately after the wedding ~ no explanation, nada.  

It was only after meeting with the attorney that he discovered he would be stuck with Danielle for two years. I think that that's why he had trouble making the decision to marry her.  He had to decide whether to stay in the mess he was in or to go home and start over from scratch with a Canadian woman. (Frankly, I think after having done the show, he could have used his fame to find himself a Canadian woman or at least a more compatible one from the U.S., but Mo doesn't always make very good decisions.)  

I think Mohamed deeply regretted not doing his homework before coming to the U.S.  And, he was very depressed on his wedding day as a result. Danielle was oblivious to this as she was always oblivious to his feelings.

Kind of bizarre. He gets hit with the worst news ever and his spouse doesn't even notice. AND, the news pertains to his spouse!

So much weirdness!

[Arwen Evenstar]

Dani seems to be oblivious to just about darn near everything. At one time, she would have been described as having no social skills.

 

3 hours ago, Virtually Me said:

Thanks, but, I don't think he's an ass. I'm glad he stood up for himself.  I'm vehemently against poor people importing people they met on the Internet whom they barely know. That's not what the visa was intended for.  If there is one thing the host got right, it's that Dani didn't take the K1 process seriously. I put the onus on the petitioner; they have every advantage.  

Totally agree with you that Mo had every right to stand up for himself when Dani was behaving the way she was about certain things. No one deserves to be bullied, and you're right that the petitioner has most of the power.

They can always threaten the spouse with deportation, because if the petioning spouse dies or divorces before the time period, the other spouse has to go home, and may be arrested in their own country simply for being deported. 

Though I didn't think that Mo or Anfisa or any of them should have to grovel before their petitioners to show their gratitude. But being nice most of the time or at least respectful and help out a bit would make us all think better of them.  Even if things don't work out, just be nice.

[Celia Rubenstein]

I posted

Quote

...  there has been plenty of material shown on the program (and available online) to justify the opinion that Mohamed never had any intention of participating in a real marriage with Danielle .... that he was acting fraudulently, only wanted a green card, etc. and he doesn't deserve to stay in the country.  

 

10 hours ago, Virtually Me said:

The show is not evidence. It's not reality, is heavily influenced by production and heavily edited. It shows a mere fraction of the story.

Of course I was not referring to the show being used as legal evidence, that would be preposterous (which is why I used the word "material" instead).  I realize the show is edited, producer-manipulated, and even borderline scripted.  But as a viewer, what they choose to show me on TV is largely what I have to go by in making a judgement about the validity of the marriage between Mohamed and Danielle.  I am not among those people who have become personally involved in supporting Mohammed or warring with Danielle.  I have no "inside" information.  I watch the show and read the posts here and occasionally a story linked, and that is what my opinion is based on. 

That being said, I don't understand why the material from the show or posted here is sufficient for you to make the determination that their marriage is valid, but when it comes to other people watching and reading the same things and reaching the conclusion the marriage is invalid, suddenly it not enough to rely on to make that determination.  

Do you know things not show on TV or posted here that makes you sure the marriage is valid?   I would think that you must, otherwise that would be extremely inconsistent reasoning.  I would be curious to know what you know beyond the "fraction of the story" that makes you feel so strongly you are right and other people are wrong. 

Edited November 14, 2016 by Celia Rubenstein
to remove giant blank spaces

[Virtually Me]

8 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

I posted

 

Of course I was not referring to the show being used as legal evidence, that would be preposterous (which is why I used the word "material" instead).  I realize the show is edited, producer-manipulated, and even borderline scripted.  But as a viewer, what they choose to show me on TV is largely what I have to go by in making a judgement about the validity of the marriage between Mohamed and Danielle.  I am not among those people who have become personally involved in supporting Mohammed or warring with Danielle.  I have no "inside" information.  I watch the show and read the posts here and occasionally a story linked, and that is what my opinion is based on. 

That being said, I don't understand why the material from the show or posted here is sufficient for you to make the determination that their marriage is valid, but when it comes to other people watching and reading the same things and reaching the conclusion the marriage is invalid, suddenly it not enough to rely on to make that determination.  

Do you know things not show on TV or posted here that makes you sure the marriage is valid?   I would think that you must, otherwise that would be extremely inconsistent reasoning.  I would be curious to know what you know beyond the "fraction of the story" that makes you feel so strongly you are right and other people are wrong. 

Thank you for asking. I do want to say that it's not a matter of right and wrong, but, of not substituting one's opinion for what the law requires. In addition, I'm one of those folks who have gone above and beyond the show, even before the show. Dani and Mo came to my attention in 2013 when they were seeking advice online re their K1.

For the purpose of creating drama, the show woefully creates an incorrect impression of the K1 process.  That's unfair, not only to the cast, but, also, to rhe audience and, to those who have actual experience with the visa process. I have 15 years experience with immigration law.

It's disturbing to anyone who works with immigrants to see the kind of misconceptions and vitriol stirred up by the show for the purpose of entertainment, especially in the anti-immigrant atmosphere being ginned up in the last 10 years. I know I'm outnumbered and not so amusing. Like everyone else, I'm adding my voice to the mix.

[Celia Rubenstein]

16 minutes ago, Virtually Me said:

Thank you for asking. I do want to say that it's not a matter of right and wrong, but, of not substituting one's opinion for what the law requires.

Well, to be fair, people here are just gathering to snark on a TV show.  It's not a court of law.  And to repeatedly challenge the opinion that Mohamed is a schemer who should be deported because there hasn't been enough legally admissible evidence to support that conclusion is setting the bar for a snark thread pretty high.  JMHO/YMMV

I guess I just look at this show as a soap opera, not an primer on the K-1 process. So the misconceptions and misrepresentations involved don't bother me.  If anyone is really serious about a fiance' visa and is relying on this show for information, well.  I think they will find out pretty quickly it is a complicated process and TLC is not the place to learn how to go about it.  I don't think 90 Day Fiance is really doing that much harm.

To the extent that immigrants are being singled out and made to look bad, I can't agree.  Not all of them come off as great people, but many of them do.  And many of the Americans involved come off looking as bad as any immigrant has ever been made to look. I feel like the shame is being spread fairly evenly.   We have our Marks and Nicoles and Danielles, but also our Kyles and Joshs. There are Mohameds and Lowos but also Allas and Noons.  I agree there has been a lot of hostility toward immigrants recently and that is unfortunate.  But I am not sensing there is an imbalance in how immigrants are being represented on this show. 

[Virtually Me]

Well, we just don't agree on everything, but, where's the fun in that?. I try to inject a little snark into my comments on occasion, but, the real people with real legalities are rather distracting. It's an occupational hazard.

[Celia Rubenstein]

Quote

Well, we just don't agree on everything, but, where's the fun in that?. I try to inject a little snark into my comments on occasion, but, the real people with real legalities are rather distracting. It's an occupational hazard.

Just curious, what exactly is your occupation?  Are you an attorney?

Edited November 14, 2016 by Celia Rubenstein
to add quote since my post ended up on a new page

[Virtually Me]

32 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

Just curious, what exactly is your occupation?  Are you an attorney?

Law school is a requirement for my profession.

[Real Eyes]

Just for clarification as it has come up a few times, in Canada now, an immigrant spouse no longer gets permanent residence automatically.  The law changed as a result of marriage fraud.  I believe there is a three year waiting period now, though I may be wrong on that, it could be two years.  

In addition, Canadian embassies interview the spouse, and they have a wide latitude to deny a claim for a spouse to enter Canada, even if the couple is already married.  I know the US does as well, but it seems to be rubber stamped more.  One case of fraud was detected in the embassy in India, and the spouse denied a visa.  His Canadian wife fought that through her Member of Parliament, so her husband received a visa.  He left her within a week of landing in Canada (that was when spouses obtained permanent residence immediately).

It was immigrant communities in Toronto, particularly the South Asian community, that lobbied for the change in the legislation.  I believe the reason was because spouses are on the hook for any social benefits paid anywhere in the country to the absconding spouse.

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

Mohammed's pearl clutching  indignance (you're all drunk!) and arrogance ( I will say whatever I want to!) is scary. He is so conservative and self righteous and I can't stand it. This is America, jackass. He needs to go. He came here on good faith in a marriage and for whatever reason, her fault his fault, he hasn't earned enough of on his own merit to stay. There's no good reason we should be stuck with him. 

I also think he is woefully naive, uneducated and inexperienced with the opposite sex. He doesn't know a yeast infection or pee leak or understand what problem she might have and he is repulsed. He'll even her period probably repulsed him, he's so immature and unprepared. 

[CoachWristletJen]

I know this might be an easy shot but THERE'S NO  R AT THE END OF DOHA!!!!!!!!!!!

FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE, YOU FLEW ACROSS THE WORLD AND STAYED IN THE PLACE AND YOU STILL DON'T KNOW WHAT TO CALL IT!

DO YOU EVEN KNOW HOW TO SPELL IT? DID YOU SEE IT PRINTED ON YOUR PLANE TICKET? D-O-H-A.  DOHA!

WHEN YOU GOT THERE, DID YOU HEAR OTHER PEOPLE SAY IT? DID YOU HEAR MOHAMED SAY IT?

DID MOHAMED EVER TELL YOU WHERE HE LIVED? DID YOU PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT HE SAID, LIKE, EVER?

IT'S THE FINALE OF THE SHOW, DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY OPPORTUNITIES YOU'VE HAD TO GET THIS RIGHT?

DOHA.  DOHA.  DOHA.

DANIELLE, LOOK DOWN HERE AT THIS VIDEO SO YOU WILL NEVER BE CONFUSED ON THIS POINT AGAIN.

DOHA. 

IT'S DOHA.

 

[Virtually Me]

That's the spirit, Jen! hehe