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Athena
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Putting this here since it's technically a movie and quoting myself because I posted it in the Batman: The Animated Series

On 4/4/2017 at 9:47 PM, GHScorpiosRule said:

Me: SQUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!

This summer, a Batman movie with Kevin Fucking! Conroy as Bats, Loren Lester as Nightwing!!!! In the B:TAS animated style!!!!????????????

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/news/batman-harley-quinn-exclusive-big-bang-theory-melissa-rauch-voicing-harley/?sf67673405=1%2F/

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20 minutes ago, DisneyBoy said:

*loses his mind*

 

Bummer we aren't getting the original VA's for Harley and Ivy though. :( :(

Yeah. Arlene Sorkin will always be Harley for me! No one can say "Mr. J" or "Puddin' " like she can!

I sure hope we also get Hamill as Joker! That would be ICING!!!

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From the trailer it looks like Harley and Nightwing get into some kind of sexual relationship...which would really bum me out. I had a hard enough time believing he would knowingly flirt with Catwoman in the TNBA episode You Scratch My Back. Thankfully, that was all just a ruse at the time. I definitely don't want to see him legitimately involved with Harley. That just feels like fanfiction.

I'm cautiously optimistic, but after being burned by Brainiac Attacks and Mystery of the Batwoman I'm going to hold off on getting really excited just because they are using the old character designs.

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Quote

I was around at the time, and I believe I voted to kill him (although I didn't vote thousands of times).  He was indeed resoundingly disliked as I recall (although in those days you pretty much had the letters columns, Amazing Heroes and CBG to go by unless you were on Usenet); particularly post-Crisis, when his introduction to us involved him stealing the tires off the Batmobile, he was a miserable little pill with a bad attitude.  I've avoided anything and everything to do with "Under the Red Hood" because I have no interest in the little puke being anything but dead.

Interesting to hear the perspective of someone who was there at the time. I only started reading some of the post-crisis Jason's issues in the last few years, and I actually found him to be really refreshing as Robin. I like that he had his own mind and challenged Batman and was passionate enough to be impulsive rather than some perky subordinate. I guess this goes more into a discussion of the comics than this thread would allow, but the stand-alone issue where Jason encounters a serial rapist who is the son of a delegate and therefore immune from prosecution and decides to take matters into his own hands is really chilling and compelling. I think it would have been a much more satisfying storyline if they had actually fleshed-out that idea over the course of another two years worth of issues and had Batman and Robin kind of be at odds, with Batman wondering how to reign-in Jason's impulses to take matters into his own hands. Instead, it seems like they just wrote Jason off within the next year and heavily publicized it to give people a chance to knee-jerk react to this new take on the character. If they'd had confidence in their idea of a dangerous Robin on the brink of total vigilantism while still wanting to do good, they could have built up the stakes higher before offering people the chance to decide if he should die.

I think it speaks volumes that they eventually did bring him back as the Red Hood even though they swore up and down they never would. Jason had character. I'm glad he wasn't part of the DC Animated Universe because he only would have made it dark and soap opera-esque, but he's a character I still would like to spend more time with. A shame the comic books kind of went crazy the last few years.

I also completely understand that DC needed to listen to the fans after shaking everything up so drastically with the Crisis. Maybe keeping Jason Todd around for too long would have hurt sales, but it's interesting how valuable a character he's become to the overall mythology of Batman by virtue of the fact that he didn't tow the line the way Dick Grayson did.

But back to the discussion of the movies! I love Burton's everything. He got so much of it right it's easy to overlook the few missteps. Yes, I wish Gordon had had a young daughter who was a redhead and that he had more of a relationship with Batman, but thankfully the Animated Series made up for that. Batman Returns is just brilliant in my mind and I love it more and more with every passing year. Talk about differentiating from the comics but somehow getting it all right in spite of the differences. Don't get too hung up on the cats in the alley - as far as I'm concerned it was the awnings that slowed Selina's descent and saved her life.

Burton's Penguin is a grotesque thing of beauty and probably one of my favorite if not the favorite character he ever created. It all makes so much more sense to me then the preppy polished guy who happens to waddle and loves umbrellas. I completely agree that he makes me uncomfortable and I can understand why other people can't stand him, but Danny DeVito's performance is brilliant and heartbreaking and campy and creepy and does as much for the movie as anything else. Michelle Pfeiffer is obviously the scene stealer, but I don't think the Penguin has ever been as interesting a person as he was in that film. The fact that they conceived of him as Max Shreck's brother at one point just put everything into perspective. He's basically an alternate version of Bruce Wayne, but I just love the way the characters each reflect aspects of each other and how they're all the victims of misfortune and corruption. You can tell they thought through everything very carefully and I really appreciate and respect that.

Since we are also discussing animated films, I'm curious to know people's thoughts on Return of the Joker. I remember thinking it would be a bomb when it was first being discussed - I even remember the first rumor being that something would cause the Joker to physically crawl out of his grave like a zombie - but it now stands as one of the most daring films Warner Brothers put out with Batman in the title. I found the flashback sequence very hard to watch and a little difficult to reconcile with the more subtle tone of the Animated Series... but it is smartly written. I never completely loved Batman Beyond as a series but I really enjoy the production design in the movie, which is filled with great colors and set pieces. The new Jokerz are memorable, but the overall story structure of the film...leaves me... dissatisfied? I guess I'm still uncertain about it.

My favorite of the animated Batman films is still Sub-Zero, which has a straightforward story, yes, but takes its time establishing the characters and making you care about their relationships (Dick & Babs anyone?) You don't feel like you jumped into the middle of a story and all the producers want is to excite you with explosions. They set it all up for you nicely. I found the film moving and gorgeously animated. Great score too. It's a shame it often gets overlooked in favor of more high-octane Batman movies.

I gave up on the Nolan films after The Dark Knight. Way too serious and self-important.

Jack Nicholson is and forever more will be the Joker. If I could somehow combine Jack and Mark Hamill into one Joker, that would be the ideal package for me. I love Michael Keaton and Kevin Conroy equally, which is kind of amazing considering I'm usually an either-or person. I can't just choose one over the other this time.

Edited by DisneyBoy
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Quoting myself because I forgot we could post these here!?

23 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

WAHOO!!!! Kevin Conroy and Loren Lester back together again!!!! And the B:TAS ANIMATION STYLE!!! And heeeeere's the first trailer!??

http://m.ign.com/articles/2017/05/30/batman-and-harley-quinn-animated-movie-blu-ray-images-and-release-info

 

August 29th CANNOT get here soon enough!!!!???

I wonder if we'll get this in the movie theatres before the release?

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I dont know if this is the right place to post this, but I just watched "Batman and Bill" on Hulu, its a documentary on the co-creater of Batman. I literally cried through the last fifteen minutes. I want to show clips of it now when I teach citations to my students. Who knew Batman could be used in the classroom?

Did anyone else watch it?

Edited by SnoGirl
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On 6/1/2017 at 11:25 PM, SnoGirl said:

I dont know if this is the right place to post this, but I just watched "Batman and Bill" on Hulu, its a documentary on the co-creater of Batman. I literally cried through the last fifteen minutes. I want to show clips of it now when I teach citations to my students. Who knew Batman could be used in the classroom?

Did anyone else watch it?

I did.    It made me ashamed of Bob Kane.   An ego-maniac, a cheat, a liar, a thief.   He only admitted the truth after Bill Finger was safely dead.

What do you do when you finally find the best Batman yet?   Retire him.

Ben Affleck's Batman Future in Doubt as Warner Bros. Plots Franchise

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OMG!!! I don't think I've ever laughed so hard and so much at a B: TAS episode, let alone a movie!!!????????

This was Hilarious, had great action and so very nostalgic, too!!!

Since it hasn't been released yet, and though it's not spoilery at all, I'm going to tag it because there might be people who don't want to know anything.

Harley: "Do you know what I really am?"

Bats: "My punishment for dropping out of medical school."

Me:????????????

I can't wait until my bluray arrives!!!

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YES!!! Loren Lester FINALLY gets to talk about his role as Robin and Nightwing in the special features!!!
And the movie is just as hilarious the second time around!??????
I will never see the song "Don't Pull Your Love" the same way ever again!!!????????
?????

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You were right, I'll never hear that song the same way again.????? Bless you Rob Paulsen.

Boy, Harley is a lot more fun when she's not the Joker's hanger-on.

I so cannot believe

 

Nighwing and Harley got it on. But LOL at Nightwing sassing Batman's disapproval:"Like you've never made out with a super villain."

Edited by Spartan Girl
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51 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

You were right, I'll never hear that song the same way again.????? Bless you Rob Paulsen.

Boy, Harley is a lot more fun when she's not the Joker's hanger-on.

I so cannot believe

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Nighwing and Harley got it on. But LOL at Nightwing sassing Batman's disapproval:"Like you've never made out with a super villain."

You're welcome! Now I wish I'd seen it both nights at the theatre!??

I, along with the full-packed theatre, ???at that A.R.G.U.S. agent's line to Bats about therapy. I need to go back and get the exact line.

Regarding Nightwing, since he said what he did about making out, that means to me

there was NO SEX!

That's my theory and I'm sticking to it!???

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Soooo, did anyone watch this?

I never read the graphic novel, but based on the reviews, apparently the movie changed who "Jack" was. I saw it last night, and I really enjoy the look of the animation--very similar to B:TAS; sort of.

I would have enjoyed it so much better if Kevin!FUCKING!CONROY!!! had voiced Bats! Just what is the issue for WB? Is Conroy too expensive? Contrary to what Romano said about what the suits say, about wanting to have different actors for each movie, they've decided that Jason fucking O'Mara is their vision of Batman. Which, no. NONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONOOOOOOOOOO.

I understand that Jack killed prostitutes, but him killing Sister Leslie and Strange made no sense. Strange was the red herring. And I know the movie wanted to do a GOTCHA! and make you think that Jack was Dent, but ended up being GORDON!, but I don't buy it. Why? Because the body type of Jack, when he fought Bats earlier, didn't match up; the hair color of Jack, didn't match up. And yes, I am anal retentive about this kind of stuff. The way it was set up, I thought for sure that Jack would end up being Dent, because of the way he set Bruce up. And the out of nowhere hatred he had for Bruce, when it was clearly stated that they were very good friends. That smirk he had when the judge agreed that Bruce should be denied bail.

And oooh, apparently the guys (based on their names and reviews) just loooooved the language used here: you know, like whore, slut, whatever did I see in a whore like you? I'm assuming, of course, because that is the only language that is different from any of the other movies.

 

I did giggle at the three orphans being the stand-ins for Dick, Jason and Tim(?). One was Dickie, the other, Jason. But the youngest, I don't know if we got his name.

And then having Barbara suddenly go cray-cray? Yeah, riiiiiight. When Bats discovered Gordon's sekrit room.

Selina was just stupid and it nearly cost her

Frankly, I thought Batman and Harley Quinn was SO.MUCH.BETTER. I don't understand why so many hated it or disliked it so much.

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I would be embarrassed at how many times I've watched Gaslight but I'm not because I love it. 

Leslie and Strange worked for me because Jack was "cleaning up" Gotham across the board.  Leslie was helping the poor and Strange was going to help Bruce figure out Jack's identity.  I don't think Strange actually knew, but Jack may have thought he did, or at least would figure it out after teaming with Bruce, so it was about self preservation.

I don't mind it getting changed to Gordon, as the actor and animators did a great job with the sequence at the World's Fair, but I do wish that the set up were more obvious during rewatches.  They have a few things that, knowing it's Gordon, hint at the reveal, but not as many as I'd prefer. 

I will say that, if left up to me, I'd have kept it simple and made Harvey the villain.  They hinted at a Big Bad Harv kind of duality when he drinks, and we haven't had a good Bats vs Two-Face story in a while.

I don't think Selina was stupid but she was reckless and I was legit concerned that she'd get killed off.  The final scene of her, Bats, and the Robins (including Tim, who's called "Little Tim" by Jason) in the carriage as Alfred takes everyone home gave me a big smile.  I can totally see them regrouping and working on the next case.  And, since Gaslight had a follow up comic, they could always continue with this group if they wanted.

Kevin Conroy is doing a lot of voiceover work so he's not available for every Bat project.  From what I've read, voiceover scheduling can be a major pain so that's also a factor.  Warner Bros animation has a better handle on that than most but they can't stretch him too thin or just wait for him to be available when there are others who can do the job. 

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2 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I would be embarrassed at how many times I've watched Gaslight but I'm not because I love it. 

I know my post made it seem like I didn't like it--I did. But I thought Bats and Harley was better. And I love all things historical, so this was really ingenuous and I loved seeing my favorite hero in this setting.

 

3 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

Leslie and Strange worked for me because Jack was "cleaning up" Gotham across the board.  Leslie was helping the poor and Strange was going to help Bruce figure out Jack's identity.

Ah, okay, I can see why now. It was just bugging me, like, okay, he's killing all the prostitutes, but why Sister Leslie? 

4 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I don't mind it getting changed to Gordon, as the actor and animators did a great job with the sequence at the World's Fair, but I do wish that the set up were more obvious during rewatches.  They have a few things that, knowing it's Gordon, hint at the reveal, but not as many as I'd prefer. 

I will say that, if left up to me, I'd have kept it simple and made Harvey the villain.  They hinted at a Big Bad Harv kind of duality when he drinks, and we haven't had a good Bats vs Two-Face story in a while.

See, I didn't read the novel, so I don't know who the killer was in the graphic novel; just read in reviews (Amazon) that the movie changed who it was. And the way Gordon was drawn/animated, he's more...broader than the image of Jack we saw as he killed and fought Bats. That Jack was slimmer, and the hair! It was Harvey's hair color! Plus, the misdirect with Gordon having a nightmare of Barbara becoming a victim. In hindsight, maybe it was his fear he'd kill her?

And I was thinking it was Harvey, thinking, okay, this is where he gets his "Two-face" moniker during the Victorian Era. The Jekyll and Hyde.

 

8 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I don't think Selina was stupid but she was reckless and I was legit concerned that she'd get killed off.  The final scene of her, Bats, and the Robins (including Tim, who's called "Little Tim" by Jason) in the carriage as Alfred takes everyone home gave me a big smile.  I can totally see them regrouping and working on the next case.  And, since Gaslight had a follow up comic, they could always continue with this group if they wanted.

Okay, stupid was too harsh. I like your word better.  And did I forget to mention I was giggling and had a huuuge smile as well, seeing the wee Robins?

10 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

Kevin Conroy is doing a lot of voiceover work so he's not available for every Bat project.  From what I've read, voiceover scheduling can be a major pain so that's also a factor.  Warner Bros animation has a better handle on that than most but they can't stretch him too thin or just wait for him to be available when there are others who can do the job. 

??????v????LALALALALALALALALALALALALAAAAAAALALALALALALALALALAA!????????? I can't hearrrrr youuuuuu!!!!!!

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I watched it about a month ago, and really enjoyed it.  I didn't expect to, as I haven't been impressed with the DCAU's past few films.  But the story, the animation, the characters, they all worked for me in this one.  This version of Selina Kyle is the first that didn't annoy me immensely, probably because she wasn't Bruce/Batman's antagonist in the villainous sense.  Jennifer Carpenter's voice work was fantastic. 

On 3/12/2018 at 11:55 AM, scarynikki12 said:

I don't mind it getting changed to Gordon, as the actor and animators did a great job with the sequence at the World's Fair, but I do wish that the set up were more obvious during rewatches.  They have a few things that, knowing it's Gordon, hint at the reveal, but not as many as I'd prefer. 

I will say that, if left up to me, I'd have kept it simple and made Harvey the villain.  They hinted at a Big Bad Harv kind of duality when he drinks, and we haven't had a good Bats vs Two-Face story in a while.

When I watched it the first time, I was multi-tasking as I didn't expect to get into the film.  But I distinctly remembered that early on, a man said, with emphasis, "I plan to clean up Gotham, and I do mean all of it."  I thought it was the Harvey Dent character who said it (and thus I assumed he was Jack until Bruce leaves Selina and a drunk Dent at the club), but when I watched it again, it was Gordon. It was something about the way he said that line that immediately tipped me off, but I had the character wrong.  Watching it a second time, I thought there were definitely some interesting clues.   Scott Patterson did a great job with balancing menace and false virtue with Gordon's voice. Plus, I gave Gordon the benefit of the doubt because the previous versions of the character were those of integrity (at least regarding police work).  I thought the film's upending of traditional Batman villains was cleverly done, although I can see the "Dent made more sense as Jack" perspective. 

It took the 2nd viewing to really understand Gordon's..."logic," especially regarding Sister Leslie, but I got it.     

I'm normally ambivalent to Bruce Greenwood's voice work (he was kind of terrible in otherwise great Under the Red Hood), but he worked for me here.          

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Hope this link works. My thought? NOTHING will ever TOP the AWESOMENESS that is BATMAN: MASK OF THE PHANTASM

Bruce talking to his parents

And if I may add, Gotham by Gaslight had a similar scene, which one could say was ripped from Phantasm--When Selena shows up and tells Bruce to get in her carriage so he can escape the police; Andrea pulled up in her car near the alley and told Bruce to "get in" her car and helped him escape the cops. And of course, they had a reunion! Considering how tall Bruce was, his shirt should have fallen to Andrea's knees and not just below her butt.

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On 9/10/2016 at 12:01 AM, MarkHB said:

So, there's yet another Batman animated movie coming out... The Return of the Caped Crusaders, with the voices of Adam West, Burt Ward, and Julie Newmar!  And, like Killing Joke, this one will have a one-night-only showing in theaters, on the evening of October 10 (Columbus Day in the US).  Tickets are here.

Here's the trailer...

 

 

I finally got around to watching this last night.    It had moments of brilliance and sly humor but the flat, generic style of animation gave it an overall impersonal and "empty" feel.   The absence of a William Dozier voiceover in the beginning and at crucial moments in the film was a glaring and curious omission -- curious because the producers did have a decent William Dozier voice impersonator (the announcer voice for the "Gotham Plaza").   Anyone who truly respected the original show would have insisted on its inclusion.

High points, in no particular order:
 

Spoiler

 

The bat-fight that included nearly every single villain who appeared in the original series.

The camera man filming it who switches his lens to "fight scene" and the lens tilts to the side.

The Cesar Romero voice impersonation.   You couldn't ask for better.   Ditto for the William Dozier voice.

Burt Ward's voice -- you wouldn't know a day has passed since 1966.

Dick Grayson practicing ballet, complaining "I feel ridiculous in these tights."

Catwoman lampooning the ending of "The Dark Knight Rises."

Batman deadpanning Chief O'Hara's "Begorrah."

Aunt Harriet's remark about her being brought into the Wayne household to cast suspicion off Bruce and Dick -- an inside joke about how some claim that Aunt Harriet was introduced to fend off claims of an inappropriate relationship between Bruce Wayne and his youthful ward.  

 

 

The bittersweet:

The elderly rasp in Adam West's mahogany voice.

Adam West playing the character as the Batman/Adam West mash-up persona he created in the years after the show.   His original Batman played it straight all the way, never once letting on that it was all for laughs.   He never would have boasted that Catwoman caused a stirring in his utility belt (as Adam West liked to joke on talk shows, etc. over the years) (and there was a risque one-liner in this movie along this line).  As time went on, West started doing the character as if he himself was impersonating Adam West as Batman.   It became too earnest, too hokey, too meta.   That's the Batman you get in this movie.   It's not the classic performance.   The same thing happened to Shatner regarding his portrayal of Captain Kirk in the show vs. the movies.   The original James Kirk was a tough but humane officer with a sense of humor and a strong sense of duty.   IMO, that character vanished after Star Trek the Motion Picture.  By Star Trek II: Wrath of Khan, classic Kirk had been replaced by some fatherly/grandfatherly impostor who was more William Shatner than James Kirk.   And the Shatnering of Kirk only continued with each successive film.  By "Generations," Shatner had completely eclipsed Kirk. 

Julie Newmar's bland performance.  I know she's advanced in years, and I will always love her, but the feline flirtatiousness that characterized Catwoman -- the breathy voice, the inflections, the playfulness -- just isn't present in this movie.

The best:

The credits.  As the credits scroll, accompanied by an extended version of the Bat-theme, cartoon Batman does a standalone performance of the Batusi … followed up by Catwoman doing a go-go dance on the opposite side of the screen.  It goes back and forth, like a dance-off, interspersed with scenes of Batman running back and forth with bombs (a la the original series movie) and concludes with Catwoman falling into Batman's arms.   More than any other scene in the movie, this little bit captured the magic and zaniness of the original series and why it will always have a place in my heart.  I don't know why, maybe because life is very stressful right now, but it was all so silly and innocent that I was choked up by the time it ended. 

Edited by millennium
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6 hours ago, millennium said:

The credits.  As the credits scroll, accompanied by an extended version of the Bat-theme, cartoon Batman does a standalone performance of the Batusi … followed up by Catwoman doing a go-go dance on the opposite side of the screen.  It goes back and forth, like a dance-off, interspersed with scenes of Batman running back and forth with bombs (a la the original series movie) and concludes with Catwoman falling into Batman's arms.   More than any other scene in the movie, this little bit captured the magic and zaniness of the original series and why it will always have a place in my heart.  I don't know why, maybe because life is very stressful right now, but it was all so silly and innocent that I was choked up by the time it ended. 

Please allow me to recommend the sequel, Batman vs Two-Face.

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1 minute ago, VCRTracking said:

I saw it in IMAX at the Metreon in 2008 and it was a pretty fantastic experience. That opening shot and the truck and Batpod chase on that five story screen was spectacular.

Rub it in, why'n'tcha?

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I just remembered I saw this movie five times! First time was in IMAX! And you're abofreakinlutely right about the experience--opening, truck, Batpod...

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On 8/31/2017 at 9:44 PM, GHScorpiosRule said:

YES!!! Loren Lester FINALLY gets to talk about his role as Robin and Nightwing in the special features!!!
And the movie is just as hilarious the second time around!??????
I will never see the song "Don't Pull Your Love" the same way ever again!!!????????
?????

Quoting myself because I watched this again last night and it's STILL HILARIOUS!!!! I 🤣😂at the opening credits. I wish Timm would make more movies like this.

But I still don't like Rauch's take on Harley's voice. Arleen Sorkin's Harley had the New York, but it was very subtle. Rauch's is too annoying.

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I watched Mystery of the Batwoman for the first time in many many many years. For the life of me, I cannot understand Bruce Timm's weird insistence that Barbara and Bruce had a sexual relationship and his need to shoe horn it into this film where it absolutely didn't belong.

Batwoman appears on the scene. People wonder if it's Batgirl in a new costume. Barbara calls Bruce, confirming that she's not Batwoman, and asking if Bruce knows who the Batwoman is. That should be the end of the scene, but Bruce asks her how she likes college, which kind of implies that this is her first year in college. Because it's kind of rare for someone to ask a college junior or senior "how they like college." You'd probably ask about their classes, the decisions they made about choosing a major, or job prospects. So it makes it seem like Barbara is a college freshman, which ugh. Barbara starts flirting outrageously with Bruce and hinting that she'll be back for spring break so they can fight crime and have sex. It's all so weird, gross, and unnecessary. The latter half of the conversation could have been cut with no loss to the narrative of the film.

Bruce is a solid 15 years older than Barbara. She's his surrogate son's ex-girlfriend. Bruce is also her mentor and he was in one of his more authoritarian periods where he thought the mission was more important than anything when he started sleeping with Barbara. It's all so messy and wildly out of character. It just doesn't seem like Bruce would chance permanently screwing up the team dynamic to get some. It's so obviously lacking in Batman's hallmark self-control. It makes zero sense to me.

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So, it seems there's a book on the way: "Batman: The Definitive History of the Dark Knight in Comics, Film, and Beyond."

Preface by Denny O'Neil

Foreword by Michael Keaton

Introduction by Kevin Conroy

I am not getting any recompense for this plug.

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3 minutes ago, MarkHB said:

So, it seems there's a book on the way: "Batman: The Definitive History of the Dark Knight in Comics, Film, and Beyond."

Preface by Denny O'Neil

Foreword by Michael Keaton

Introduction by Kevin Conroy

I am not getting any recompense for this plug.

I got so excited I clicked on the link to get updates; then nearly lost my lunch when I saw ASSfleck's Fatman as its handle picture. They should use Conroy's BATMAN! blech, blech, blech!

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