GH In The News: The PC Press Club

[Aurora2]

This soap blog was just brought to my attention.  I'm putting it here because much of it echoes thoughts I have had, particularly about the character Valerie in the past few weeks.  Now my thinking did not focus on the "diversity" issue raised by this author.  However, many of the points voiced here are mine as well. 

 

http://www.soaphub.com/2015/04/26/daytime-kills-diversity/

Edited May 2, 2015 by Aurora2

[Oracle42]

Eh. I think she missed the wider point. The plot point writing is a problem for every single character and for every single relationship. One of the reasons the minority characters are being hit especially hard is, in part, because the were created by a HW who hasn't been very good at creating new characters. I mean, they also get much less screen time than all of his other new characters (looking at you, Plywood) which was an issue that the author spent less time on than was spent discussing the character of Elizabeth...

Edited May 2, 2015 by Oracle42

[Aurora2]

Eh. I think she missed the wider point. The plot point writing is a problem every single character and for every single relationship. One of the reasons the minority characters are being hit especially hard is, in part, because the were created by a HW who hasn't been very good at creating new characters. I mean, they also get much less screen time than all of his other new characters (looking at you, Plywood) which was an issue that the author spent less time on than was spent discussing the character of Elizabeth...

 

Yes, I agree that plot point writing affects all characters - no question about that.  And my issue with the lengthy Valerie example she uses is not the diversity issue.  Nor is it that Valerie (and Jordan, Shawn and TJ) are unique in suffering from plot-point writing and limited development.

 

However, sometimes I hit a wall with the obvious creation of disposable characters to create story for existing characters.  And the current use of Valerie is one of those times. 

[Oracle42]

I'm actually hoping that her removal to Windemere indicates that the character will not be disposable. She won't be written well because none of the characters are - but she might have a chance to escape being ground into Lulu/Dante angst fodder

However, sometimes I hit a wall with the obvious creation of disposable characters to create story for existing characters.  And the current use of Valerie is one of those times.

I don't mind disposable characters used to create story for existing characters when they're written well and they have some depth. I DO mind if the disposable character is an actual family member one of the core soap families and one of the few minorities (poor Justus) Edited May 2, 2015 by Oracle42

[Chairperson Meow]

I'm glad the blogger saw the Jordan/Julian spark too. I so wish Ron would give up on his stubborn hold on media bullshit, but I guess NLG is a big part of that blame too. Wasn't she campaigning about Julexis online forever? Now it's effectively kinda ruined things. It's moments like these that make me appreciate Roger Howarth and his complete silence to the press or Billy Miller's aversion to social media. Fans can assess the characters without lame campaigning by actors. Though, I'm sure neither Roger nor Billy would be pro-Franco or Jake right now.

[FilmTVGeek80]

 

I'm glad the blogger saw the Jordan/Julian spark too. I so wish Ron would give up on his stubborn hold on media bullshit, but I guess NLG is a big part of that blame too. Wasn't she campaigning about Julexis online forever? Now it's effectively kinda ruined things. It's moments like these that make me appreciate Roger Howarth and his complete silence to the press or Billy Miller's aversion to social media. Fans can assess the characters without lame campaigning by actors.

 

Honestly, I thought the whole Jordan/Julian chemistry was overblown. I never thought they had that much, so I'm not sure exactly what's been ruined. But chemistry is subjective. And yeah, on Twitter NLG is very pro-Julexis. But, so what? Actors are allowed to have preferences same as anybody else. She's probably shared those views with her bosses, but this regime doesn't really seem to care that much what actor's preferences are anyway, unless you have a certain clout like AG, which I don't think NLG has. I highly doubt NLG stomped her foot and whined and threatened to knee cap the actress that plays Jordan, if Jordan was paired with Julian instead. NLG hasn't had a really successful pairing in a long time. She's an actress of a certain age in an industry where they don't always get prominent roles or get to be in sexy pairings. I don't blame her one bit, for riding the popularity of Julexis and being protective of it. 

 

Fans can definitely assess the characters and pairings without actors campaigning. But NLG's "lame campaigning" doesn't really have anything to do with Julexis's popularity. I think they'd be popular whether she spoke up about it or not. Her "campaigning" wasn't the cause of it.

[Chairperson Meow]

I don't dislike NLG. And hey, opinions are great, but sometimes, imo, it's nicer to have the days of mystery when you didn't know which stories the actors preferred. Perhaps we could have had a really great triangle of Alexis/Julian/Jordan. Or Jordan/Julian could have taken off. Sometimes I find that fans do get influenced by the actors expressing their very strong opinions. It's when they have the very strong opinions that it's a problem. It's like if Bob worked at a restaurant and was your server, and he tells you the steak is terrible and to order the fish. After he leaves, you'll be thinking.... hmm he works here, so he must know something I don't. You'll most likely order what your server had the strong opinion about.

[Pete Martell]

Eh. I think she missed the wider point. The plot point writing is a problem for every single character and for every single relationship. One of the reasons the minority characters are being hit especially hard is, in part, because the were created by a HW who hasn't been very good at creating new characters. I mean, they also get much less screen time than all of his other new characters (looking at you, Plywood) which was an issue that the author spent less time on than was spent discussing the character of Elizabeth...

 

I agree that it's a problem for all characters, but I can't help comparing the treatment of other insta-relatives, who get lots of time spent on this supposed family bond or attempts at viewer pity (the Obrecht/Nina/Nathan/etc. mess, Franco as a Quartermaine, then as Scott and Heather's son), while Valerie is immediately cast as an interloper bringing burdens onto poor Luke and poor Lulu.

[Pete Martell]

I don't dislike NLG. And hey, opinions are great, but sometimes, imo, it's nicer to have the days of mystery when you didn't know which stories the actors preferred. Perhaps we could have had a really great triangle of Alexis/Julian/Jordan. Or Jordan/Julian could have taken off. Sometimes I find that fans do get influenced by the actors expressing their very strong opinions. It's when they have the very strong opinions that it's a problem. It's like if Bob worked at a restaurant and was your server, and he tells you the steak is terrible and to order the fish. After he leaves, you'll be thinking.... hmm he works here, so he must know something I don't. You'll most likely order what your server had the strong opinion about.

 

I'm not a fan of Julian/Alexis, I've always thought it was forced, I just don't buy Julian as any type of sexual or romantic figure, I don't think that role suits Alexis, and I've always been more than a little put out by the constant push that they are so sexy and wild and hot and we should love them because it's so hot to see an older couple getting down (it makes them sound like they're about 80 years old), but I don't think NLG's tweets really influence them.

 

In nearly 10 years as a headwriter, Ron has never put a black woman with a leading man on one of his soaps. The closest he's gotten is this Valerie/Dante garbage, which, if it happens, is likely just to get pity points for Lulu and to create an obstacle to "Lante," with Valerie being treated as completely meaningless. 

 

Ron tends to write material that essentially keeps POC characters in their place - segregated or in supporting roles. I doubt that will ever change. 

[Chairperson Meow]

It's really messed up because GH is on a channel with two highly rated primetime dramas with black female leads that a black female created and runs. The other show the same woman created is set in a hospital with a female lead and has been a longtime hit. On all of Shonda Rhimes's shows there are developed characters of different races and sexes. It's not no male POV (a huge problem imo with GH) or no POV of certain races (another GH problem ). Ron also tweets that he watches Empire. The breakout star of that show is Taraji P Henderson, a strong black woman. Watching it, you don't cheer for Cookie because she's black. I'm white with different races mixed and I cheer for her because I feel the writing and performance. I get that she loves her sons and wants the best for them. One of the Empire showrunners is white, I believe, so it can be done. Imo Ron just doesn't want to do it. That's why he needs a co writer. We as fans deserve more than campy caricatures on the show.

Am I the only one who remembers when soaps had real characters on them? I'm not that old, so I can't be.

[TeeVee329]

In nearly 10 years as a headwriter, Ron has never put a black woman with a leading man on one of his soaps.

 

But, to play devil's advocate, what other US soap has in the last 10 years?  It's not like GH was a haven of interracial relationships under Guza before Ron rolled in.

Edited May 2, 2015 by TeeVee329

[Oracle42]

Y&R is better at it. In fact, most of the other black people I know who watch a soap watch Y&R because the minorities have actual stories

I think diversity is an issue, I just don't think that particular article addressed it very well

Edited May 2, 2015 by Oracle42

[HeatLifer]

Ron is back to trolling and posted a pic of JT/KeMo filming the NB with the caption: "Jake, Shmake! This one's mine!"

And all I could think about is how much I WISH Patrick was actually being written in a "she's mine and fuck Jakeson!" way. The story would be far more interesting than the mannequin Patrick has become.

[Oracle42]

I wish he'd spend less time trolling social media and more time trying to come up with interesting, soapy coherent stories

[Chairperson Meow]

GH is the only soap where twitter is better than the actual show.

[Pete Martell]

But, to play devil's advocate, what other US soap has in the last 10 years?  It's not like GH was a haven of interracial relationships under Guza before Ron rolled in.

 

The main difference is that Ron has consistently been praised for being so "daring" and so "different" than other headwriters, yet even a relationship like Tom/Simone would be too much for him.

 

I'd never praise B&B for progressive storytelling, but even they took the risk with Rick and Maya. 

[dubbel zout]

I guess NLG is a big part of that blame too. Wasn't she campaigning about Julexis online forever?

 

She was, but I also think she was desperate for any sort of love interest. I'm glad they're showing an older couple being hot for each other, even if the actors overdo it. 

 

It's not like GH was a haven of interracial relationships under Guza before Ron rolled in.

And he certainly didn't treat the POC characters much better. Look at Lainey and Kelly Lee: Worst doctors ever. Lainey allowed herself to be nearly seduced by Sonny (!!!!!), and Kelly was fooled by Pillowena (!!!!!!!!!!!). And of course, Justus.

[Pete Martell]

And he certainly didn't treat the POC characters much better. Look at Lainey and Kelly Lee: Worst doctors ever. Lainey allowed herself to be nearly seduced by Sonny (!!!!!), and Kelly was fooled by Pillowena (!!!!!!!!!!!). And of course, Justus.

 

I don't think anyone believes GH was a haven of diversity and inclusion before Ron. It's just that since Guza is gone (and good riddance) and it seemed like for an eternity there was talk of how superior Ron's GH was in every way, I can't handwave his own segregated, demeaning writing because Guza was no better.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

It's really messed up because GH is on a channel with two highly rated primetime dramas with black female leads that a black female created and runs. The other show the same woman created is set in a hospital with a female lead and has been a longtime hit. On all of Shonda Rhimes's shows there are developed characters of different races and sexes

 

FWIW, I don't really think Shonda Rimes' example is one everyone should follow. I endured Grey's Anatomy because my housemates watched it, but all the stuff with McDreamy/McSteamy/McGMAFB nearly put me into a coma. Scandal is better, but Shonda can be really hit or miss.

[Chairperson Meow]

Well yeah, but compared to Ron, my three year old neighbor is a better tv writer.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Oh, well, sure. but hell, my dog is a better writer than Ron. Maybe my dog and your three year old neighbor should write this show. XD

[Chairperson Meow]

Oh, well, sure. but hell, my dog is a better writer than Ron. Maybe my dog and your three year old neighbor should write this show. XD

This afternoon I was returning from getting lunch and she showed me a story she wrote. I'm not going to give the plot away, but let's just say it blew the whole Fluke bs out of the water. And the kid makes amazing lemonade. She had a stand out today. She's a future mogul.

[Aurora2]

I agree that it's a problem for all characters, but I can't help comparing the treatment of other insta-relatives, who get lots of time spent on this supposed family bond or attempts at viewer pity (the Obrecht/Nina/Nathan/etc. mess, Franco as a Quartermaine, then as Scott and Heather's son), while Valerie is immediately cast as an interloper bringing burdens onto poor Luke and poor Lulu.

 

These are good examples because, regardess of her race or ethnicity, Valerie's story appears to be being rushed at high speed under the favorite character/couple bus.   For me, this excess speed contributes considerably to my issues with the writing for Valerie and with this story arc in general.

 

But my greatest reservations come from agreeing with the blogger that Valerie comes on the scene with "baggage."  There is a ready-made story here for a writer who might choose, and have the talent, to explore a character - rather than use the character so quickly and so obviously as a prop for others. 

 

What makes the rush-to-plot-point even more obvious is that Valerie's introduction was in story with a heavy family focus and, at its climactic point, with scenes of family support, love and togetherness in the present and over the years.  Where is that overall love and togetherness now?

Edited May 3, 2015 by Aurora2

[Tiger]

Where is that overall love and togetherness now?

Did you check Ron's Twitter, Scott Sickles' family newsletter, Liz Korte's diary, and Andrea Archer Compton's grocery list?

[KarenB]

New Entertainment Weekly recap: Nurses Ball and Bombshells

 

http://community.ew.com/2015/05/03/general-hospital-nurses-ball-2015/

[dubbel zout]

My favorite parts:

 

Kiki and Morgan aren’t seen at the Nurses’ Ball, so maybe their punishment is being grounded?

 

If [Carly] had spent as much time disciplining her kids as she does trying to take down people who wronged her friends, the first three paragraphs of this recap wouldn’t even exist.

[SlovakPrincess]

I'm behind in my viewing of The Americans, but an episode that aired last month had Paige watching an '80s episode of GH. I'm a huge dork, so I recognized the GH snippet they used as part of the lead up to the Susan Moore (Jason's bio mom) murder. Also featured Scott Baldwin in his bearded days.

I wonder how much FX had to pay to use the video...

Edited May 3, 2015 by SlovakPrincess

[jsbt]

Yeah, I saw that. It was a kick.

[ulkis]

lol

 

Nathan Varni ‏@nathanvarni 1h1 hour ago
#gh fan feb results poll announced! The proof

 

Nathan Varni ‏@nathanvarni 2m2 minutes ago
@Becca_play_time well I kept getting many people asking if we rigged it which we did not so we had to post! :)

 

http://abc.go.com/shows/general-hospital/news/gh-news/150504-gh-fan-february-winner-courtney-matthews

 

ETA: because I forgot to write the "lol" the first time

Edited May 5, 2015 by ulkis

[BestestAuntEver]

Nathan Varni ‏@nathanvarni 1h1 hour ago

#gh fan feb results poll announced! The proof

Nathan Varni ‏@nathanvarni 2m2 minutes ago

@Becca_play_time well I kept getting many people asking if we rigged it which we did not so we had to post! :)

http://abc.go.com/shows/general-hospital/news/gh-news/150504-gh-fan-february-winner-courtney-matthews

I don't believe any of these fools. They are having to show the results of this alleged real non-rigged poll because these idiot asshats hid the numbers while the poll was actually occurring. There wasn't any reason to hid the results unless they wanted to rig this pathetc poll in order to give Spencer more F'in story.

Someone has already pointed out how they didn't even lay the groundwork for any of the other past characters to return. No mentions or remembrances And in the case of Scotty and Lucy no storyline or POV.

So yeah, I cry foul on their stupid poll and I'm giving their protests a serious side eye.

Edited May 5, 2015 by BestestAuntEver

[KerleyQ]

What?  You don't believe that totally scientific, unimpeachable screenshot put together by the network?  

Edited May 5, 2015 by KerleyQ

[TeeVee329]

Oh Nathan Varni, me thinks thou doth protest too much.

[Chairperson Meow]

Omg this is exactly like American Idol all over again.....

[ulkis]

What?  You don't believe that totally scientific, unimpeachable screenshot put together by the network?  

 

Honestly, I do think she probably won fair and square. I love me some Stefan but he hasn't been on in 12 years. Meanwhile, Courtney's fans were probably more of the demographic likely to vote in a poll.

 

That said, I think even if she hadn't won fair and square, we'd still be getting her.

[TeeVee329]

Meanwhile, what about Tyler Christopher's shit-eating grin in that picture?  "I finally got what I wanted!".  Blech.

[dubbel zout]

There wasn't any reason to hid the results unless they wanted to rig this pathetc poll in order to give Spencer more F'in story.

 

Stefan is also related to Spencer, but Stefan wouldn't indulge Spencer's whining and self-pity, and we can't have that.

[Box305]

So SID's editor said that Spencer needs help and that his story isn't funny anymore and NB's mom tweets, "Don't say that! You'll bring out all the crazies!" I'm paraphrasing but still, shut up lady. Your son plays an annoying character. Deal with it. 

[ulkis]

Stefan is also related to Spencer, but Stefan wouldn't indulge Spencer's whining and self-pity, and we can't have that.

 

this reminds me of when Nik was mouthing off to Stefan in the hospital (for legitimate reasons), and Stefan made him get out of bed and poor Nikolas was limping on crutches and Stefan goes, "make haste!" lol. Spencer needs a dose of that. 

[dubbel zout]

So SID's editor said that Spencer needs help and that his story isn't funny anymore and NB's mom tweets, "Don't say that! You'll bring out all the crazies!" I'm paraphrasing but still, shut up lady. Your son plays an annoying character. Deal with it.

 

I have a certain sympathy for NB's mom on that point, but she should stay off social media if she doesn't want to deal with it. You have to take the good with the bad, even if the bad can get wildly out of hand.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

So SID's editor said that Spencer needs help and that his story isn't funny anymore and NB's mom tweets, "Don't say that! You'll bring out all the crazies!" I'm paraphrasing but still, shut up lady. Your son plays an annoying character. Deal with it. 

 

To play devil's advocate for a minute, Nicholas Bechtel has drawn some of the crazies out. There were apparently quite a few Twitter posts about how he should die in a fire. Not the character, the actor, and there was a fairly heated discussion back on TWOP about what should and shouldn't be allowed when it comes to social media and how far people should be allowed to go before its a problem. Yes, Spencer is very annoying, but since Twitter is pretty much the cradle of idiocy, there's a lot of crazy to bring out.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Cobalt Stargazer

[Harmony233]

I miss when parents acually parented their kid on GH.I remeber no way in heck when anna and rober would ground robin for lying ect.

[ulkis]

 

To play devil's advocate for a minute, Nicholas Bechtel has drawn some of the crazies out. There were apparently quite a few Twitter posts about how he should die in a fire. Not the character, the actor, and there was a fairly heated discussion back on TWOP about what should and shouldn't be allowed when it comes to social media and how far people should be allowed to go before its a problem. Yes, Spencer is very annoying, but since Twitter is pretty much the cradle of idiocy, there's a lot of crazy to bring out.

 

Definitely, but I'm pretty sure she thinks crazy = anyone who doesn't think Spencer is just the cutest little tyke ever. Maybe I'm wrong though.

[Tiger]

I think NB's mom is the crazy one; she confuses criticism of "Spencer Cassadine" fo criticism of her son.

That said, my criticism of "Spencer" aside, I think NB is a bad actor, and allowing him to ask a grown woman about her breast implants and name is instagram 'Nicky is Boss' is awful parenting.

I wish NB, his mother, BC, his mother, KT and Tony would all just go away.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Tiger

[Box305]

To play devil's advocate for a minute, Nicholas Bechtel has drawn some of the crazies out. There were apparently quite a few Twitter posts about how he should die in a fire. Not the character, the actor, and there was a fairly heated discussion back on TWOP about what should and shouldn't be allowed when it comes to social media and how far people should be allowed to go before its a problem. Yes, Spencer is very annoying, but since Twitter is pretty much the cradle of idiocy, there's a lot of crazy to bring out.

 

Crazy people will always be crazy, social media just makes it a lot easier for them to be crazy.

 

Maybe mom should talk to the head writer and ask him to stop writing her son's character as if he's a 35 year old man having a psychotic break because it's not cute. Or better yet, maybe she shouldn't be on Twitter. There's an age restriction for a reason, and while I realize she's the one running the account, it's his name and likeness being put out there. It's not a requirement to be on Twitter if you're on TV and maybe it would be better for him and for her to avoid stuff like this for a little while especially while the character is being written like this. 

Edited May 5, 2015 by Box305

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Crazy people will always be crazy, social media just makes it a lot easier for them to be crazy.

 

Maybe mom should talk to the head writer and ask him to stop writing her son's character as if he's a 35 year old man having a psychotic break because it's not cute. Or better yet, maybe she shouldn't be on Twitter. There's an age restriction for a reason, and while I realize she's the one running the account, it's his name and likeness being put out there. It's not a requirement to be on Twitter if you're on TV and maybe it would be better for him and for her to avoid stuff like this for a little while especially while the character is being written like this. 

 

One last thing, and then I'll be quiet as its not about just GH but social media in general.

 

I don't agree that only some people should have to police themselves. It absolutely isn't a requirement to be on Twitter just because you're in show business, but it also isn't a requirement to be, to put it mildly, a raging asshole to people who are in show business just because they're in show business. It isn't Nicholas' fault that Spencer is being written this way, and the idea that MoRon would listen to the kid's mother about cutting it out just makes me shake my head, if not snort with derision. Should she say something? Sure, probably, but it seems like the equivalent of pissing into the wind, especially since Ron doesn't even listen to other adults about what he writes. (Hi, Sean Kanan!) Regardless, if you want to look at it a certain way, maybe its the fault of the people who wanted Nicholas to die in a fire that Spencer is doing this Phantom of the Opera schtick now. So if they're the ones who brought us to this, maybe they should cease and damn desist.

[ulkis]

One last thing, and then I'll be quiet as its not about just GH but social media in general.

 

I don't agree that only some people should have to police themselves. It absolutely isn't a requirement to be on Twitter just because you're in show business, but it also isn't a requirement to be, to put it mildly, a raging asshole to people who are in show business just because they're in show business. It isn't Nicholas' fault that Spencer is being written this way, and the idea that MoRon would listen to the kid's mother about cutting it out just makes me shake my head, if not snort with derision. Should she say something? Sure, probably, but it seems like the equivalent of pissing into the wind, especially since Ron doesn't even listen to other adults about what he writes. (Hi, Sean Kanan!) 

 

The thing is, the kid is on recurring. He doesn't have to do anything if his mom doesn't want him to. They can walk away.

 

but with the appearance of Courtney, maybe this is the turning point for less horrible material for Spencer.

[dubbel zout]

but with the appearance of Courtney, maybe this is the turning point for less horrible material for Spencer.

 

Oh, ulkis, you eternal optimist, you!

[KerleyQ]

So SID's editor said that Spencer needs help and that his story isn't funny anymore and NB's mom tweets, "Don't say that! You'll bring out all the crazies!" I'm paraphrasing but still, shut up lady. Your son plays an annoying character. Deal with it. 

 

I think if she was really worried about bringing the crazies out, rather than secretly loving the attention (vicariously through her son), she could have just as easily sent a private message with the same point.  Because, if anything, her publicly stating that is what will really bring the crazies out.  And she has to know that by now.  

 

Any chance someone can start a Morgan vs. Spencer fan war so we can watch Mama Bechtel and Mama Craig go at each other? 

[Box305]

One last thing, and then I'll be quiet as its not about just GH but social media in general.

 

I don't agree that only some people should have to police themselves. It absolutely isn't a requirement to be on Twitter just because you're in show business, but it also isn't a requirement to be, to put it mildly, a raging asshole to people who are in show business just because they're in show business. It isn't Nicholas' fault that Spencer is being written this way, and the idea that MoRon would listen to the kid's mother about cutting it out just makes me shake my head, if not snort with derision. Should she say something? Sure, probably, but it seems like the equivalent of pissing into the wind, especially since Ron doesn't even listen to other adults about what he writes. (Hi, Sean Kanan!) Regardless, if you want to look at it a certain way, maybe its the fault of the people who wanted Nicholas to die in a fire that Spencer is doing this Phantom of the Opera schtick now. So if they're the ones who brought us to this, maybe they should cease and damn desist.

 

Oh, I know Ron won't do anything. I'm not naive. I've seen what he's done to people who have dared to speak up about his shitty writing. And, to this point, mom doesn't seem to really give a shit about how her child looks on TV because he's bringing home a paycheck. I also agree it's gross that people wanted the child to die in a fire though to be fair, I joked that I wanted the character launched into the sun but I say that about every character I can't stand regardless of age. I'm also not actually hoping that NB will be strapped to a rocket and launched into space. 

 

Again, it may not be fair, but it's how things are on social media, people are idiots and have an easier time being idiots thanks to the internet so either Mama B should take a break from Twitter for a while if she doesn't want to deal with them or just use her damn block button like I do when people are being jackasses. 

 

I think if she was really worried about bringing the crazies out, rather than secretly loving the attention (vicariously through her son), she could have just as easily sent a private message with the same point.  Because, if anything, her publicly stating that is what will really bring the crazies out.  And she has to know that by now.  

 

This. She could have easily sent him a DM saying the same thing. 

Edited May 5, 2015 by Box305

[HeatLifer]

I think I need protection from the crazy after her son asked Iggy Azalea about her boob job. But ok.