S04.E07: Brotherhood

[GirlvsTV]

Nobody on Team Arrow, or Lance think it's a setup that Darhk would just leave a note with an address laying out?  Darhk's playing them to get Andy in their base, and destroy them.

THIS.

It thought it was pretty obvious, so now DD knows Lance is working with the Arrow so he can feed them all kinds of wrong info.

[Ann Mack]

Definitely going to sit through this one again. This episode just didn't seem balanced. It was a lot of pieces to a puzzle but none of them fit together perfectly to give you a finished picture. I'm not sure what was going on with the fight scenes in this one but they felt slow and not to coordinated or at least not in a cohesive way. I liked David's acting he really got to show some of his emotional range. Felicity and Ray scenes were good and flowed naturally so they didn't seemed forced or that there was anything else other than friendship happening. Not enough Oliver and Felicity but I appreciated what I got. They really need to start using Damien more.

 

The best part for me was Damien's interactions with Thea. My curiosity did get peeked when he touched her and his own magical mojo backfired and starting sucking the life out of him instead. So I'm sure Thea will be part of the equation that takes down the "Big Bad" this season.

 

Other than that I'll save any further comments to after I watch it again but 2 by the ways:

 

BTW:

1. Why the hell is this show subjecting us to the boringness that is this Cave Girl non-acting ass and the whole island flashback. I really have no f*cks to give about what is going on with Oliver and this island shit right now.

 

2. WTF is up with Laurel standing around smirking while fighting is going on? I'm not big into comics so is this something that the actual BC does, because Laurel looks extremely stupid and makes her have no situational awareness at all!

 

Island Flashbacks/Laurel Smirkiness:

Edited November 19, 2015 by Ann Mack

[NumberCruncher]

WTH was with the shaky cam during that storage container fight scene? I felt like I was in a Michael Bay movie. Go back to coordinating the stunts, not filming them, Bam-Bam.

[AyChihuahua]

You want to show me Island Oliver 2.0 is well on his way to Dark/Mission Oriented/S1 Oliver? Have him kill Poppy in order to protect/complete his mission

You know what, that would work like WHOA.  Have her show some badness, not a whole lot, and really jeopardize his mission, preferably after he's shown how important it is.  Then have him have to kill her, but bury her by his father, Yao Fei, and Shado.  PERFECT levels of darkness.

[apinknightmare]

Funny, I thought it was more about Laurel being killed than Lance but I know you're 100% certain it's Lance and I'm 50/50 that it could be either.

 

Could be!

 

I just feel like they're trying to be sneaky but not completely out-of-the-blue, and between Felicity saying that Quentin was "dead wrong" in the premiere, Laurel mentioning the "almost dead police department," and what DD said to QL, I think they're laying out hints. I guess we'll find out in way too many episodes, haha.

[AyChihuahua]

The direction was so bad though. It really took me out of the moment.

It really was. 

 

 

But hey. this episode actually highlighted everyone's on-going story arc for the season:

Oliver: Mayoral campaign, figuring out how to defeat DD

Diggle: Andy + HIVE

Felicity: Palmer Tech

Thea: Bloodlust

Quentin: Double agent for Team Arrow with DD

Laurel:

STAHP getting my hopes up!!!

[apinknightmare]

So, now that we know Vlad was Poppy's brother, is it possible that his is the other grave on the island, and that she and Oliver bond over the burial or something? Or is his corpse adrift at sea now? I honestly don't know what happened.

Edited November 19, 2015 by apinknightmare

[wonderwall]

I know this is sacrilege... But I miss the flashback wig :p

[catrox14]

 

I felt like I was in a Michael Bay movie.

 

YES! Exactly. I almost said the same thing! IMO camera movement needs to happen in more static scenes but not in action scenes. And if you have to use shaky cam to accentuate/mimic action then you need to rethink the stunts. It just makes me sad thinking back to how awesome the action and fights were until like the end of s2 :(

[Guest]

They are going to need to shake things up at some point because I'm a little bored with the episodes opening with a truck getting broken into or whatever. I'm kind of bored seeing Quentin do the same walk up to DD's desk. And I'm tired of Oliver standing around while Laurel and Thea get focus out in the field. He's the goddamn Green Arrow and this is his show FFS. 

Edited November 19, 2015 by Guest

[catrox14]

I know this is sacrilege... But I miss the flashback wig :p

 

It's wrong to miss it, I don't wanna be right.

[Guest]

And yeah, sorry but Bam Bam sucks at directing. Maybe he should just go back to his day job and try and work on topping stunts from s2 because that's basically the last time they were any good.

 

It makes me so mad that everyone was promoting him and then we had a great female director with some truly great cinematography and she got nothing. BADLY DONE. 

[Primal Slayer]

It was an ok episode. I really wanted to see more of the whole crew in their fancy get-ups though and was hoping they would get attacked and have to fight fancy.

 

Good thing that Speedy isn't a publicly known name for the woman in red or else connecting those dots would be not so hard...but I enjoyed Theas storyline the most, she probably has the best one out of everyone this season. Her showdown with Darhk was nice even though she didn't really get to do anything except run away.

 

The fight scenes were cool though not much outside the usual. Though I feel like they need to put more time into them, I rather have scenes where they let the actual actors do as much work as they can instead of doing one big continuous shot with just the stunt doubles.

 

Not really understanding why Darhk is letting Oliver get as far as he is in his campaign when he shut Jessica down real fast. Oliver seems to be an easier target since he has more public connections with Thea/Felicity/Laurel. And I don't know why he keeps threatening Laurels life but doesn't send any messages, simply putting a soft hit out on her that puts her in the hospital would be enough to show Lance that he means business.  And when will Laurel find out that she not only has a target on her back but that her father is a double agent?

[Lantern7]

Good episode. Barrowman got called out of hibernation to have Merlyn/Ra's try and feed his daughter a pedophile. That's considerate, in a warped sort of way. And nobody stays dead on this show . . . except Tommy. And Moira.

 

We should have more Diggle-intensive episodes. Should be interesting to see if Andy is a good or bad guy. At the very least, he's entered the Six Months Later deadpool,albeit as a longshot.

 

Damn, how can Thea not get into trouble for decimating a guy? I'm not complaining, but I'm just concerned.

 

ETA: Episodes like this make me glad to be an only child. Just sayin'.

[BunsenBurner]

My brother loves Thea and calls her his 65 pounds wonder of thunder. She was his most favorite character tonight. Did say however that the high roundhouse kicks are not too smart because all the bad guy needs to do is grab her leg and throw her down.

BC jumping off the metal units obviously being lowered to the ground definitely not jumping. Not impressed by her fighting. Too obvious when going from stunt girl to KC.

I know nothing of psychological medications or magic but IMO Andy Diggle would still be under the influence for a while and not be able to be normal within a few hours. It has been 8 years after all.

[popgoesculture]

Well, that was... mediocre. I kept waiting for the action happen and/or to stop feeling like I'm on a terrible amusement park ride (that said, I'm currently on meds that make me dizzy, so all the fight scenes were SUPER fun to watch... sigh). 

 

The flashbacks need to STOP. Does ANYONE like them? Do the writers LIKE them?? It doesn't seem like it! 

 

The pacing and the dialogue this ep were just frustrating and very "the same" in each scene, at least as related to the Andy problem. Yes, Diggle, we get it, you don't feel the same about family. But writers, can we expand on that? I feel like they don't give the same depth/thought to his development that some others have been lucky enough to get. David Ramsey tried his best, but the actual writing fell flat for me. 

 

My favorite scenes were between DD and Thea, and then Felicity and Ray (their friendship is great and helps me forget the terribleness of last season). (Also, Diggle's thanking of "even you, Palmer" made me laugh... did Ray learn how to throw a punch while tiny? I guess he had nothing else to do. Maybe DD put on some youtube vids for him to learn from...)

 

And the direction? Everyone's commented on the terrible filming of the fight scenes, but even the way they showed Thea beating that dude (who I guess Malcolm sent to bother her...?) made me first go "Oh, this is a dream sequence because this looks surreal and odd." So overall the episode didn't infuriate me, so much as make me go "Meh." Except for the flashbacks, bc those made me leave the room. 

[AyChihuahua]

 

My favorite scenes were between...Felicity and Ray (their friendship is great and helps me forget the terribleness of last season).

#NEVERFORGIVE

[Delphi]

Oh I wanted to mention the black canary leap of what should lead to broken ankles!!

Instead I'll stay positive and say that I enjoyed Oliver and Digs two man mission. I really hope they learn, after the crossover, that they don't need to utilize every mask in every episode. That's the good part of a team. Laurel or Thea could take a night off. John aND Lula get a movie night. Ollie and Felicity get a dinner night. Come on show.

[popgoesculture]

 

 

#NEVERFORGIVE

Forget, not forgive ;) 

 

With Sara back, Oliver and Felicity together, and Ray just a friend... it's like Season 3 never happened. Or that's what I pretend, and also why I can keep watching the show!

[apinknightmare]

I wonder if touching Damien or whatever only worked for quelling Thea's bloodlust because he's a mass murderer? Otherwise there's a huge plot hole because Sara and Thea could just hug each other all the damn time. Problem solved.

[Guest]

I wonder if touching Damien or whatever only worked for quelling Thea's bloodlust because he's a mass murderer? Otherwise there's a huge plot hole because Sara and Thea could just hug each other all the damn time. Problem solved.

 

Maybe DD's power only works on people who haven't been in the LP? 

[dtissagirl]

I thought that instead of draining the life out of her, he drained the bloodlust. Which was icky for him, but good for Thea.

[calliope1975]

I have to agree that the directing was...not good. I think the tracking shots during the fighting scenes were supposed to be cool, but it broke up the action in a weird way. The editing was also really bad. That cut to Laurel smirking from her stunt double was awful. I admit I typically ignore any and all Laurel scenes, so maybe the cuts between the double and KC are always that bad. And I am down for a lot of dumb and dumb looking stuff, but the Canary Cry is beyond stupid looking. Your actress looks like an idiot. Is that what TIIIC are going for? Because that's what I'm seeing. 

 

DR and SA in tuxes - yes, please. More of DR in general. 

 

At least, I pre-ordered my Felicity Pop Funko so I had one good Arrow experience today.

[Menrva]

Color me underwhelmed. It was meh at best. The stunts were boring and if the elevator fight scene was meant to be their equivalent of Daredevil's hallway long take fight scene…I'll take Daredevil. Sorry, Speedy.

 

Liked Thea's interaction with DD and his "That usually works." His surprise made me chuckle.

 

Laurel, you have the emotional range and empathy of a grapefruit. Shut up. Stop mining your ill-conceived, selfish and reckless resurrection of Sara and subsequent fuck-ups for your little words of wisdom. Wheelhouse, my ass. I really wanted Diggle to say, "Shut up, Laurel."

 

I like Alex for some reason. Not sure why. Hate Poppy. I know why I hate her…

[apinknightmare]

I thought that instead of draining the life out of her, he drained the bloodlust. Which was icky for him, but good for Thea.

Yeah, I hadn't thought of it that way. And now DD either knows or is gonna find out that he's dealing with the LoA, and how far of a leap is it to figure out she's MM's daughter?

[Primal Slayer]

It is going to be weird if Thea doesn't try to contact Sara that she found a possible cure.

[hogwash]

So Oliver was kinda/totally talking about himself during that fight with Diggle, right? "I need to know we can come back from that darkness." I hope that means he's gonna start do murdery/evil stuff in the flashbacks.  I want my nutty, closed-off spree killer Oliver, you worthless flashbacks. I'll take any hint these flashbacks are going somewhere. Though I'm kinda enjoying no one believing that dude whose name I forgot trying to out Oliver as a shady spy even though it's super freaking obvious he's right. 

 

I think Diggle's issues got as much focus as Felicity's did in 406 but for some reason it wasn't very engaging. Though the entire episode wasn't very engaging. I did like the Oliver and Lyla being supportive. Thea had the most interesting parts. Felicity rocked her parts. Andy in the lair is gonna backfire hard...

[Morrigan2575]

Yeah, I hadn't thought of it that way. And now DD either knows or is gonna find out that he's dealing with the LoA, and how far of a leap is it to figure out she's MM's daughter?

Or he thinks Thea is Sara? Goes after Thea to punish Lance?

[Guest]

I thought that instead of draining the life out of her, he drained the bloodlust. Which was icky for him, but good for Thea.

 

I totally didn't think of it like that but yes. Makes sense. So basically Thea has more bloodlust in her than…life?

[apinknightmare]

Or he thinks Thea is Sara? Goes after Thea to punish Lance?

 

That could be it, too.

[dtissagirl]

I don't know how they're gonna link all of the mystical crap in a way that makes any sort of sense, but what I got from this is that whatever ancient artifact that gives DD his powers doesn't like it when he tries to drain the life out of someone who was in the LP. It backfires, and he drains the bloodlust instead. So maybe the artifact can help Thea? But then it also makes it so DD isn't LPing the Ghosts, because he drained that one in 401 just fine,

[Chaser]

So that was the best episode of the season?…..okay.

[Guest]

So that was the best episode of the season?…..okay.

 

It's the same every year. The one episode they hype and hype and it ends up being…um…not great. But this was saved for me by DR and Diggle. He was awesome. And I feel like we learned a lot about Diggle tonight and I can't fault that. But the hype for Bam Bam and the stunts? Massive letdown. 

Edited November 19, 2015 by Guest

[Carrie Ann]

Ray's little crisis doesn't make any sense to me. Why wouldn't he want to save his company? Was it going under before he died or something? Is that why he thinks his work is worthless? 

 

Bad idea jeans spokesperson Laurel counseling Diggle on bringing his brother back? A+ LOLS.

 

Poppy, well...honestly, she's a terrible actress.

 

Ray's reasons for leaving were just as weak as Sara's (and Henry's on TF). This shouldn't be this hard for them. I don't know why the writers can't come up with something just a little better.

 

Laurel's insistence that Dig must be willing to do anything for his brother the way she was for her sister may have just been kind of funny in an "oh, Laurel" way instead of being obnoxious, if KC could have--just for one minute--dropped the sneer. She can keep her arched-back, profile pose stance and the arms crossed at all times, but if she would just do away with that contemptuous tone of voice and facial expression, I would be so grateful.

 

I had to watch the FBs tonight and I'm NOT pleased about it. Poppy is really terrible. I wonder if the EPs are changing their plans for the rest of the season, because she's failing so spectacularly (actress and character).

 

I don't think any father would consider his own death or torture to be worse than the death of his child. Worse than killing Laurel (for Lance), IMO, would be turning Laurel into a Ghost.

 

That would be kind of cool, if DD got someone on the inside of the team. And it would give LL a story for the rest of the season, now that Sara's gone.

 

So Oliver was kinda/totally talking about himself during that fight with Diggle, right? "I need to know we can come back from that darkness." 

 

Yeah, I think it was that, and also the part about Andy choosing to stay away from his family for eight years. I don't think Dig (or maybe anyone) knows yet that Oliver could have come back to Starling after Hong Kong and chose not to.

 

Funnily, after being less enthused than most about the previous few episodes, I enjoyed this one, though I can't really defend it. I thought the direction for the most part was juvenile and unnecessarily flashy/jerky, and the fight scenes went on too long for my taste, but then I was expecting both of those things so they didn't really bother me. The dialog was also not great--the awkwardly-worded lines that were revealed in advance were indicative of the overall sloppiness of the script.

 

And yet...there was so much John Diggle. SO MUCH John Diggle. And there were John Diggle tears, and David Ramsey cry-face, and my BroTP was in full effect, and Oliver/Felicity were adorable again. I can't ask for a whole lot more.

 

Except some Diggle/Felicity scenes for the LOVE of God, what kind of goat do I need to sacrifice to see them be friends???

Edited November 19, 2015 by Carrie Ann

[calliope1975]

I think Diggle's issues got as much focus as Felicity's did in 406 but for some reason it wasn't very engaging. Though the entire episode wasn't very engaging. 

 

That's exactly how I feel. Digg and Andy's story should have been great, and while DR was great, the rest of the episode just got a big ehhhh from me. 

 

I don't know if I'm impressed or insulted that an evil, criminal organization conducts meetings outside where anyone can spy upon them. This show has skewed my ability to form appropriate opinions. So, what's in the yellow pills? 

 

I agree with the person upthread who said the actions scenes were based off Asian action flicks. Sadly, Bam Bam should have watched The Raid 1 and 2 about 6,000 more times. Even shitty Asian actions flicks I've seen had better scenes than this ep. 

 

The flashbacks still suck, and I don't even have Karl Yune or Rila Fukushima to look at. Poppy sucks. There was a look on Oliver's face after he told Poppy her brother was dead that I think was aiming for "I've messed up" but SA actually hit "what am I even doing in these flashback; I don't even know why I'm here." 

 

AyChihuahua will hate me, but I didn't hate Ray. I know! I don't know what to tell you, other than, I'm sorry.

 

Not getting any chemistry between Thea and Alex. She had more chem with CH. I am intrigued by DD/Thea connection that I'm assuming is through the LP. 

[ottoDbusdriver]

It's the same every year. The one episode they hype and hype and it ends up being…um…not great. But this was saved for me by DR and Diggle. He was awesome. And I feel like we learned a lot about Diggle tonight and I can't fault that. But the hype for Bam Bam and the stunts? Massive letdown. 

 

A lot of the fighting really came off as very obvious "acting".  And there were multiple incidents of ghosts with guns pointed directly at a Team Arrow member and not bothering to shoot, but instead waiting to be attacked. And Black Canary's scream and clunky fighting style were particularly bad.

[WaitandHope]

So that was my least favorite ep of the season so far, but it was still better than a lot of Season 3 for me.

And it's annoying we never get to see the daily confabs between Digg and Felicity where they discuss Oliver's latest terrible plan. But I appreciate the ongoing references to the fact that Felicity/Digg often discuss O's stupid ideas off camera and flip coins (my head canon) for who's going to try to talk him out of the latest one...

I really want Dig-centric episodes to be good, but like 3.17 this was disappointing. Absolutely not DRs fault. I find him consistently fantastic. The entire episode lacked flow and urgency. I guess that's direction, but it also feels like writing. I rarely like the Keto Shimizu episodes- though I enjoyed Speed Weed's first script- just not really this one.

For those who have been complaining that LOT set up is the problem, I think this episode showed that not necessarily. I actually have been liking the LOT set up and missed it here. I never disliked Ray (I feel like I need to apologize to AyChihuahua and feminism), but I liked him tonight in this limited capacity quite a bit. I liked Thea too.

The episode never really congealed - and it should have. I think the terrible flashbacks are a large part of the problem. They take us out of the story too much. I even dislike them more than season 3 FBs.

I also find it unfortunate that Felicity (like Laurel) talks in her loud voice in public places about vigilantism. However funny that scene was.

I love the crossovers, so I'm hoping for the best in two weeks. Onward!

Edited November 19, 2015 by WaitandHope

[apinknightmare]

Yeah, I think it was that, and also the part about Andy choosing to stay away from his family for eight years. I don't think Dig (or maybe anyone) knows yet that Oliver could have come back to Starling after Hong Kong and chose not to.

 

Yeah, I thought Oliver was doing a little projecting there, since he let his family believe he was dead long after he had any reason to.

[Guest]

I actually forgot about the Ray scenes LOL but he wasn't terrible. Just goes to show what happens when you don't force a romance between characters where it doesn't belong. His excuse for not going back to the company was lame though. They're painting Ray and Sara to be two lost souls, both not really sure what they're doing with their lives now. The set-up is so damn predictable.

[bethy]

Overall, I was more bored by this episode than anything else.

 

I loved DR because he is awesome, but Diggle's whole "My brother is EVOL and I will not be convinced otherwise!" spiel got old quick for me.

 

Laurel and Diggle scenes - I'm sorry. It still doesn't make me like her. And it tempts me to fast-forward over scenes with Diggle, which is not acceptable.

 

More Lyla! She is awesome and I'm put out that they are not making better use of her.

 

I'm liking Ray. I think they're doing a much better job with him this season. 

 

I did like Oliver's little speech to Digg about needing to believe you could move back into the light no matter how bad things got. Poor boy.

 

Oliver's stare down at the end with Dahrk was great. 

[AyChihuahua]

 

AyChihuahua will hate me, but I didn't hate Ray. I know! I don't know what to tell you, other than, I'm sorry.

My problem with Ray isn't based on this season, or even the last couple eps of last season.  3.23 Cane Toad was fine.  But I judge both people and characters by their actions, over the time that I know of those actions, and the Cane Toad was utter scum again and again and again, while he, and Felicity, and the writers, and even Oliver were saying he was cool.  If he'd been introduced and stayed as he is now, I'd be fine with him.  I'd still think he's an old-looking bug-eyed/pink-eyed weirdo, but I wouldn't actually hate him.  

[Actionmage]

Thea and her not-obviously-stamped-"Hero" love interests.  I am still thinking that Damien is bankrolling Alex, or at least controlling him.  Otherwise, it might have been Malcolm calling Alex to leave Thea alone for Pervo to saunter up and ooze at her. Yeah, it could have been just a plain call, but why would he walk away to take it if it was just business or his family? Alex's business is Oliver and the mayorship.  My crack theory, but I'd be perfectly happy if he walked away to tell off a bill collector.

 

I love Dig so much and loved David Ramsey owning every scene he got.

 

I like Ray being introspective, but I dislike him thinking that everything before was "worthless." Not 100% needed to live day-to-day? Depends on the item he made: the Fauxbit watch? Not necessary, but fun. Some machines he designed that can be used in medical applications, like his nanobots? Not worthless. Glad Felicity pushed back on that.  Looking-at-the-Big-Picture Ray, I like, as long as he doesn't go mopey or depressed. I love Big Kid Ray, but Introspective Ray isn't a bad look for now.

 

To echo everyone else: how did Lance, much less Oliver, think that was straight intel?  Lance even told Oliver that he was thought of as less than loyal and that he noticed a note that just happened to be on the top of Mr. Damien's desk. I hate Idiot Balls.

 

I hope that Oliver can bring Andy back to Dig. It's what brothers do for each other.  I understand that a sharper, more realistic story would be Andy not wanting to be "good" like John wants, but  if we can make sure that Andy's at least not Darhk's man, I'd be okay with that. Maybe he can go work for the Suicide Squad?

[AyChihuahua]

Now James Bamford blocked me.  I swear, these people are so sensitive.

[Delphi]

You know, now that I think about it. I was under the impression that Palmer Technologies in Starling was a secondary or subsidiary company to all the other companies Ray had, specifically the main company he owned. Why because the Star company was in the shitter was Ray's whole life meaningless? The other not Star city businesses should be doing fine.

[AyChihuahua]

You know, now that I think about it. I was under the impression that Palmer Technologies in Starling was a secondary or subsidiary company to all the other companies Ray had, specifically the main company he owned. Why because the Star company was in the shitter was Ray's whole life meaningless? The other not Star city businesses should be doing fine.

Trying to figure out Ray the Cane Toad's psyche is like trying to explain blue to a duck.

[Delphi]

I was more curious about the business than Ray. :)

I'm also really sick of Oliver and Thea being poor, by the way. It makes no sense first of all, but secondly really Oliver, you don't have one tux? The fake bank didn't want your custom tailored tuxes.

[thuganomics85]

As with most Diggle-centric episodes, David Ramsey pretty much killed it and I continue to think he is one of the strongest actors on this show.  I just wish he would get better material, because it was obvious that they were going to save Andy in the end, so all of his protests that Andy was too far gone was going to mean shit to the rest of Team Arrow.  Just accept it, Diggle.  And now that they captured him, Andy is still acting all bad, so I guess the question is if he's telling the truth, or if Damien's pills are that damn good.

 

Yeah, for a fight, stunt-heavy episode, the action scenes were shot very poorly.  I don't what happened: they were really got at this in S1-S2, but they've really seem to have dropped in that department lately.  I usually try to avoid the obvious comparisons, but it really showed that Daredevil is way ahead of them on that front.  Hell, even Agents of Shield has up their game.  Are budget cuts effecting them?  Stunt coordinators going elsewhere?  Losing the actors who have more fight scene experience like Manu Bennett, Caity Lotz, and Katrina Law?

 

Ha!  Oliver considering working for Damien "undercover" style was back to the classic Dumbass Oliver I know and admittedly love on some levels.  He wouldn't be Oliver Queen if he didn't briefly consider the plan that would no doubt put himself and everyone around him in danger, and risk getting to close to the bad guy.  But I just love how both Felicity and Diggle were like "Dude, come on!" and it's already been resolved.  Classic Dumbass Oliver!

 

Parker Young's character really didn't see that stunned that Thea almost killed a guy.  Then again, no one really did.  Star City really has gotten soft, or maybe they just don't care anymore.

 

The flashbacks continue to suck hard.  They just need to end that aspect of the series, because they clearly don't know what they are doing there.

 

Did Damien say that if Oliver didn't comply with his demand, he would no longer run unopposed?  So, is Damien going to bring out his own candidate or something?  I really can't see him running himself.  Who will be the lucky guy or gal?!

 

Ray is now gone too.  Basically another variation of the "I have to go find myself" excuse.  At this point, I feel like the Legends of Tomorrow spin-off will start with Ray, Sara, Snart, and Martin Stein backpacking in Europe or something.  Just being one with nature!

 

Not as boring as episode four, but a pretty dull episode.  Feels like it was treading water and saving it's best for the big-ass crossover happening in a few weeks.

Edited November 19, 2015 by thuganomics85

[Guest]

I'm also really sick of Oliver and Thea being poor, by the way. It makes no sense first of all, but secondly really Oliver, you don't have one tux? The fake bank didn't want your custom tailored tuxes.

 

I'm also not sure how Thea is poor? Doesn't she have all of Malcolm's money or something? He did buy that loft for her, and the club. It doesn't make sense.

[Primal Slayer]

Yeah, for a fight, stunt-heavy episode, the action scenes were shot very poorly.  I don't what happened: they were really got at this in S1-S2, but they've really seem to have dropped in that department lately.  I usually try to avoid the obvious comparisons, but it really showed that Daredevil is way ahead of them on that front.  Hell, even Agents of Shield has up their game.  Are budget cuts effecting them?  coordinates going elsewhere?  Losing the actors who have more fight scene experience like Manu Bennett, Caity Lotz, and Katrina Law?

 

 

I think it has more to do with them not spending enough time on the fight scenes, they rely way to much on the stunt doubles and don't take time on each characters technique. 

[Chaser]

They need to bring in a new stunt dude. Sorry BamBam.