Spoiler Discussion Thread

[Proteus]

Isn't Diggle going over to The Flash for that Suicide Squad episode? Diggle/Lyla tracking down Sharkman?

Flash should be ahead of Arrow filming wise, they're probably starting 415 tomorrow, so DR may have gone for the table read. Shouldn't the secret already be out by 414? 415 seems to late to be called mid-season, even 414 is rather late.

What Suicide Squad episode?

[apinknightmare]

What Suicide Squad episode?

 

David Ramsey said during the Heroes & Villains fan fest that he'd be over on The Flash hunting down a member of the Suicide Squad (King Shark). It seems like he insinuated (or maybe people just interpreted it this way) that it would be during the Flarrow crossover, but obviously it wasn't. Not sure if there was some kind of misunderstanding, or if it got moved to a different episode or what. 

[way2interested]

Cite for reference!

http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/king-shark-may-appear-in-flasharrow-crossover-event

 

They thought it meant the 208/408 crossover, but it really probably meant a general crossover. I assumed he meant later as well.

[kismet]

Could Sharkman have been the Shark that bite OQ?!?

 

It might be completely unrelated, but part of me wonders if it all could be related. Maybe Amanda sent in Sharkman to help or sabotage OQ's mission. Or maybe something went terribly wrong on the island which is how Sharkman came to be.

 

OOh, my head its floating with potential plots now. It all feels a little bit too coincidental and yet destined at the same time. Plus at least it would be something interesting to come out of the flashbacks.

Edited January 5, 2016 by kismet

[lemotomato]

Pretty sure it was always meant to be a different episode because by that time, the crossover was filmed already and the episode descriptions had been released. DR talked about Diggle (and Lyla) crossing over to Flash for Sharkman like it was still being planned out.

[Morrigan2575]

I think people just got confused. It seemed to me that DR wasn't talking about the Flarrow episode since we knew pretty much knew what was going on

[way2interested]

Regarding the SA tweet in the Spoilers only thread. Was Stephen referring to Tommy finding out his identity in 116, or is he referring to someone else for 416? I assumed he meant 116 because he was replying to someone who was watching s1, but even if not, I could picture Malcolm spilling the secret to Darhk, since he is the only "important" person left to find out at this point. Regardless, how will Darhk actually find out that Oliver is GA, since I'm assuming he'll find out at some point?

[apinknightmare]

Regarding the SA tweet in the Spoilers only thread. Was Stephen referring to Tommy finding out his identity in 116, or is he referring to someone else for 416? 

 

He's talking about Tommy in 1x16.

[Proteus]

Thanks for the info everyone.

[AyChihuahua]

I really think the whole Baby Mama bullshit is going to be framed in a way to make Felicity look bad. I mean, I learned recently that being angry/disappointed with Oliver's objectively bad behavior is reason to be consigned to the 9th Circle of Dante's Inferno. A good amount of the audience's Olicity love seems to be mostly Oliver love, with Felicity thrown in as helpmeet/light to his dark/prop/political wife standing idly by with a strained smile while politician admits to patronizing hookers. If she refuses to accept that role in this utter debacle, it is likely to get ugly. 

 

Also, Oliver's behavior is shit, and I continue to be immune to the heart eyes. Imagine Dennis Franz, who played a rather similar role on NYPD Blue for years, in the role of Oliver instead of SA.  

 

This is Dennis Franz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Franz#/media/File:Dennis_Franz_(1994).jpg

 

He is an excellent actor, won a ton of Emmys for playing Detective Andy Sipowicz, a rather bad man making a definite and concerted effort to become a better man, just like Oliver...and is not at all attractive. Soooo, that dude makes heart eyes at Felicity...are all his lies forgiven?

I'm guessing Digg's going over to The Flash to find out about Oliver's souper seekrit love child? Or maybe going to check in on him since Oliver would have to be an even bigger moron than we think he is to make that trip with DD after him. 

Speak for yourself re Oliver's IQ! Ever since S3 I've considered him to be a paste-eater. (Sarcasm directed at Oliver and the writers, not you.)

Edited January 5, 2016 by AyChihuahua

[jay741982]

I don't know I've seen plenty of people online who hate Oliver's lie and Love Felicity apart from Oliver. I mean they love Olicity as well as loving her and wanting a storyline for her that's not all about Him

[AyChihuahua]

I don't know I've seen plenty of people online who hate Oliver's lie and Love Felicity apart from Oliver. I mean they love Olicity as well as loving her and wanting a storyline for her that's not all about Him

I promise you if you go on Twitter and @ some of the biggest Olicity fans, saying that Oliver's behavior in lying to Felicity about the kid is totally terrible and any fallout is on him, not on her, you will not receive a positive response. (Don't do it, it'll ruin your day.) 

[jay741982]

I promise you if you go on Twitter and @ some of the biggest Olicity fans, saying that Oliver's behavior in lying to Felicity about the kid is totally terrible and any fallout is on him, not on her, you will not receive a positive response. (Don't do it, it'll ruin your day.)

I follow some big Olicity fans and I've seen People rightfully putting the blame on him. I know no blame is being put on Felicity.

I don't get why any blame would be put on Felicity it's not her fault

[way2interested]

I follow some big Olicity fans and I've seen People rightfully putting the blame on him. I know no blame is being put on Felicity.

I don't get why any blame would be put on Felicity it's not her fault

Yep, most people I've seen actually blame both of them (but, still overall, blame the writers). Oliver should get most of the blame, because it is his actions, or lack of action of telling Felicity something, that is going to cause the drama, but even then I can't completely blame him for what's coming to him. I'm not placing this blame on Felicity, but on the situation that Baby Mama put him in.

The most blame I've seen on Felicity was anger at her somewhat over exaggerated reaction in 408. She completely had the right to be mad, but making a below the belt comment like "You don't trust me" kind of came out of left field to me, in addition to the fact that Oliver did only have a very short time to react to his position. But Felicity has done this before, so this is an actual character flaw that does have some traction to blaming her for her own reaction, but not to blame her for her side of the argument (as in, you can blame her for what she said, but not blame her for what she feels).

However, when it comes to when the actual secret will come out, I hope they do make sure that the blame is not too one-sided to level too much sympathy towards Oliver. He is in a difficult position, but Felicity gave him an out at the end of 408 and he clearly did not take it. I believe that the fallout will still be different from 408 just so they won't have to repeat scenes, like I think that Felicity will probably lay down her feelings towards this whole thing and tell him that she won't marry him or be with him with what just happened.

[AyChihuahua]

She completely had the right to be mad, but making a below the belt comment like "You don't trust me" kind of came out of left field to me, in addition to the fact that Oliver did only have a very short time to react to his position. But Felicity has done this before, so this is an actual character flaw that does have some traction to blaming her for her own reaction, but not to blame her for her side of the argument (as in, you can blame her for what she said, but not blame her for what she feels).

I don't understand that AT ALL. The whole end of S3 was about him not having trusted her or Diggle, his partners, with his plan, but instead trusting Malcolm Merlyn of all people. Like it was a whole arc for the end of the season, that was called back when Diggle told him "You don't love; you don't trust." She has every reason to be incredibly upset for him falling back into behavior he was six months past and had nearly resulted in the deaths of everyone, more or less, including all of Starling City.

 

Trust isn't just about knowing the person won't give you to the bad guys. It's also about believing your partners can handle whatever is thrown at them. He didn't trust Felicity or Diggle to be able to deal with what he thought he had to do, to make their own decisions about what risk they were able to accept, not to give up when it got tough. It's about respecting and trusting the ability of adults to make their own decisions. Not telling Felicity about the kid is a failure of trust in so many ways, but includes his failure to trust in her and in their love (and that she's not an ass, because if he seriously thinks she'd leave him for having a kid he didn't know about, he doesn't think much of her at all), that their relationship will survive the things that are put on it. This is a total breakdown of trust, which is a complete repeat of all his BS at the end of S3 that she forgave him for, almost instantly, and then drove off with him. Forgiving doesn't mean forgetting, though, and when he falls back on the behavior that nearly killed...everyone, and nearly broke them up permanently, she has every right to be enraged. He's basically a heroin addict who just took another hit after being sober for six months.

Edited January 5, 2016 by AyChihuahua

[AyChihuahua]

I follow some big Olicity fans and I've seen People rightfully putting the blame on him. I know no blame is being put on Felicity.

I don't get why any blame would be put on Felicity it's not her fault

See the post below your post, for example. If you haven't seen anyone putting blame on Felicity, you haven't looked very hard. 

[way2interested]

I don't understand that AT ALL. The whole end of S3 was about him not having trusted her or Diggle, his partners, with his plan, but instead trusting Malcolm Merlyn of all people. Like it was a whole arc for the end of the season, that was called back when Diggle told him "You don't love; you don't trust." She has every reason to be incredibly upset for him falling back into behavior he was six months past and had nearly resulted in the deaths of everyone, more or less, including all of Starling City.

Trust isn't just about knowing the person won't give you to the bad guys. It's also about believing your partners can handle whatever is thrown at them. He didn't trust Felicity or Diggle to be able to deal with what he thought he had to do, to make their own decisions about what risk they were able to accept, not to give up when it got tough. It's about respecting and trusting the ability of adults to make their own decisions. Not telling Felicity about the kid is a failure of trust in so many ways, but includes his failure to trust in her and in their love (and that she's not an ass, because if he seriously thinks she'd leave him for having a kid he didn't know about, he doesn't think much of her at all), that their relationship will survive the things that are put on it. This is a total breakdown of trust, which is a complete repeat of all his BS at the end of S3 that she forgave him for, almost instantly, and then drove off with him. Forgiving doesn't mean forgetting, though, and when he falls back on the behavior that nearly killed...everyone, and nearly broke them up permanently, she has every right to be enraged. He's basically a heroin addict who just took another hit.

She does have every right to be angry at him. People have the right to feel whatever they want, but it's the actions that come out of emotions that can come under scrutiny. Diggle was angry at Oliver, so he accused him of not being able to trust or love, which was below the belt. Felicity has done the same thing before (302 telling Oliver that he didn't have feelings, 312 in telling him that they way he loved Sara and Thea was deplorable, 406 in closing him off rudely and insinuating that he couldn't help), so what I was saying is that she has the right to be mad, but her comments, like Diggle's, hurt him and mean to hurt him and to excuse them of purposefully hurting someone excuses them of their faults and gives them free reign to hurt Oliver if he hurts them first. It's not about protecting Oliver's fragile emotional state or anything, but the idea of an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.

The problem that I had with her comment was that I felt, like Diggle's comment, that it negates everything they've been through. Yes, he did screw up in s3, and I hope that Oliver and Felicity's fallout does bring up those unresolved issues, but s1-2 had dozens of moments when Oliver showed complete trust in both of them, and for Felicity to completely dismiss everything they've been through for seemingly one moment of mistrust under duress (I only say seemingly because the show itself hasn't shown Felicity to have any unresolved issues about s3 even though she should) kind of goes too far.

I don't have a solid argument for the trust issue between Oliver and Felicity that I can elaborate on my phone in the few minutes that I've got, so sorry that I might have a confusing argument, especially since you spelled out yours pretty well, but my main issue wasn't the trust issue, but that Felicity brought it up broadly only to hurt Oliver because she was upset. She has every right to be, but love the sinner hate the sin and all that.

See the post below your post, for example. If you haven't seen anyone putting blame on Felicity, you haven't looked very hard.

Putting blame also kind of has a negative connotation. I have the blame at like 95/5 Oliver, but still some blame on Felicity.

[bijoux]

I promise you if you go on Twitter and @ some of the biggest Olicity fans, saying that Oliver's behavior in lying to Felicity about the kid is totally terrible and any fallout is on him, not on her, you will not receive a positive response. (Don't do it, it'll ruin your day.)

In the end, why would you care? This isn't the writers and producers we're talking about. It's not people shaping the show. So if another viewer has a different perception of things, it's just that, the way they percieve things. There are people who think Felicity made Oliver hang up the hood at the end of last season, but that doesn't color the way I see things. Which is completely the opposite.

About the filiming notice posted in Spoilers Only, I really hope it's not Oliver and/or his nearest and dearest in that limo.

[AyChihuahua]

In the end, why would you care? This isn't the writers and producers we're talking about. It's not people shaping the show. So if another viewer has a different perception of things, it's just that, the way they percieve things. There are people who think Felicity made Oliver hang up the hood at the end of last season, but that doesn't color the way I see things. Which is completely the opposite.

About the filiming notice posted in Spoilers Only, I really hope it's not Oliver and/or his nearest and dearest in that limo.

To some extent the audience can shape the show. When things are huge failures with the audience, they're likely to show them less (Lauriver), and when things are huge successes, we're likely to see more (Olicity). If the audience for some reason ended up totally hating Felicity, permanently, I'm sure she'd be in the show less.  Primarily, though, I just don't understand why people have to be so rude nowadays. 

[theacostov]

Putting blame also kind of has a negative connotation. I have the blame at like 95/5 Oliver, but still some blame on Felicity.

Sorry to butt into your convo but I'm just curious what you put the 5% of the blame on Felicity for? What do you think she has done wrong so far in this situation or is this based on spoilers or something?

[way2interested]

Sorry to butt into your convo but I'm just curious what you put the 5% of the blame on Felicity for? What do you think she has done wrong so far in this situation or is this based on spoilers or something?

I wasn't really thinking the situation currently, of which at this point Oliver is to blame, since he's the only one who did anything bad at this point (keeping something important from Felicity). I was just speaking of 408 specifically, which was erased, and hypothetically if the fallout is exactly like 408, which I hope it isn't. To me, Felicity's quickness to state "You don't trust me" and to basically break them up without hearing Oliver's side was somewhat emotionally driven with the intent just to hurt Oliver. Like in 312 where Oliver felt strangely dependent on Malcolm. I didn't think Oliver was right, but Oliver did, and, instead of listening to Oliver's side of what was going on, Felicity shut him down by negating his feelings of love towards Sara and his sister and stating "I don't want to be a woman that you love." Felicity was still mostly in the right in that argument as well (her argument towards Oliver that she thought he was dead for weeks, and the first thing that he says when he comes back is that he is going to work with Malcolm, who caused all of these problems in the first place), but her final words were made to purposefully hurt him.and dehumanize his feelings without giving him a chance to explain, which is why I didn't necessarily give Felicity a full pass on what she said (although I did give her a pass on her right to say it).

 

Similarly, in 408, Felicity found out that Oliver was keeping something from her and made her argument about it, but ended it with statements meant to hurt Oliver without giving Oliver a chance to explain his situation. Her argument is still mostly right, but she's cutting him off again because of her own anger. She has every right to be angry, but using her anger to stop from dealing with the problem at hand (berating Oliver's ability to trust without figuring out why Oliver can't seem to trust) doesn't solve anything.

 

Basically, what I'm saying is that she hasn't done anything wrong at this point, but in 408, and if the fallout becomes a really large blow-out, that fighting and saying words to hurt others doesn't solve problems and shows faults in characters and in arguments. By "blame," I mean that Felicity telling Oliver that he doesn't trust her (which is not 100% true) doesn't help anything or get the problem solved. Fighting is fighting, even if one person is right, and by not trying to find the solution, you only become part of the problem. I still think that Felicity is going to be right and shouldn't be blamed for probably breaking up with Oliver, but any purposeful hurtful words said by her during any possible fight are still her own fault and shouldn't be totally excused because he deserves it. So 5% just comes from anything purposefully hurtful that she might say to Oliver or if she completely cuts Oliver off from his own side.

 

I know now that this seems to be a very unpopular opinion, so I'm just going to bow out now. Sorry for causing any confusion, I didn't mean for it to seem like I think that Felicity is to blame for Oliver's decision to keep the kid a secret, I just meant that any break-up or argument between them still has about 5% of the blame on Felicity since an argument is a two-way street. It's just my opinion, and I'm sure that I said something wrong, so sorry once again.

 

About the filiming notice posted in Spoilers Only, I really hope it's not Oliver and/or his nearest and dearest in that limo.

 

Hopefully we'll find out something more later this week when they film that scene, but I would hope they invest on bullet-proof limos at that point!

[Morrigan2575]

Maybe we could take the arguments about pasted relationship issues to the relationship or character threads?  This discussion isn't really about Spoiler or even Spoiler Speculation at this point.

[Genki]

No need to apologise @way2intrested, I think what you stated is fine. 

 

For myself I want to enjoy Olicity in Arrow and I don't think Oliver has outright lied yet, to Felicity, so if there is an "out" story-wise, to the the Baby Mama Drama that does not blow-up Olicity, then I will be happy to take it.

 

I don't need to see Oliver punished even more, but like many others I really hated 4.08 secret-keeping and had a negative reaction to the whole episode for many, many reasons. But my biggest issue is that it will create unnecessary negative Drama for Olicity. My expectations include trauma to Felicity (paralysis or *bleh!* miscarriage which will postpone the truth causing even more fighting/hurt when revealed), most likely the truth will be revealed by Calculator to show Felicity that Oliver is no better than he, probably a break-up in 4.14, then episodes of tension and hurt looks, like so much of S3, which I do not want to experience again.

 

When my biggest reasons for my negative reaction is Meta rather than character driven, then I don't feel like assigning blame until I see the actual fall-out on screen. I was enjoying S4 so much and basically want to get back to that as soon as possible. So I'm OK if TPTB pull a Laurel and minimise repercussions on the BM drama.

[AyChihuahua]

Maybe we could take the arguments about pasted relationship issues to the relationship or character threads?  This discussion isn't really about Spoiler or even Spoiler Speculation at this point.

The discussion includes elements of a breakup and/or someone else finding out before Felicity and/or someone else being the one to tell Felicity. So it needs to be here or a lot of spoiler bars will be required.

 

I think just not wanting to watch this idiotic storyline play out is totally understandable, but having Felicity bygones it because that keeps Olicity trucking along nicely doesn't honor Felicity as a character at all. If she's just there to be half of Olicity, then she could be any character played by an actress who has great chemistry with SA. It reduces Felicity to part of a ship and nothing else. We know from spoilers that it's not going to come to a head for several episodes yet, meaning the secret-keeping and lying is continuing, and we know that Oliver won't be the one to tell Felicity. So if Felicity matters as her own character, rather than as just part of a ship, she has to be allowed to have an actual human reaction, which would include, in any remotely realistic relationship, a lot of anger and broken trust. It's not going to be fun to watch, but that is on the writers and Oliver, not Felicity.

 

Re Oliver being punished, I don't want to see that either. It's tired. I want to see him learn. I want him really and truly to internalize a very important lesson: STOP LYING TO AND KEEPING SECRETS FROM THE PEOPLE YOU LOVE. He does this every single season, it inevitably turns out badly, and then he does it again the next season. I also don't want to see FELICITY punished for Oliver's wrongdoing. Part of the problem is that sure, Oliver always feels the consequences of his crap, but so do all the people around him, when they haven't done anything wrong. Not just Felicity...every single person he loves has been screwed over by his lies and secrets and one time or another. If the consequences only fell on him, then whatevs, write him off as a weirdo masochist and continue on with my day. But his crap always hurts other people. Felicity is going to be heartbroken by this, and she is completely innocent in it (as is the kid, for the record, who is also being screwed by all this). 

Edited January 5, 2016 by AyChihuahua

[BkWurm1]

So if Felicity matters as her own character, rather than as just part of a ship, she has to be allowed to have an actual human reaction, which would include, in any remotely realistic relationship, a lot of anger and broken trust.

 

But who is the arbiter of what is the acceptable  "actual human reaction"?  

 

We know the first time around how Felicity reacted, but the circumstances of her finding out won't be the same, they can't be.   They won't be in a strange place trying to protect new friends from an immortal and seemingly unstoppable power.  There will be new stress I'm sure, but who knows the specific thoughts and triggers that might have been planted in her head the first time around because of what they were doing right that moment?  For all we know, Felicity could have been awake for too long again which we know makes it harder for her (everyone actually) to remain calm.  And in the midst of that, Oliver is running off having Barry run secret tests that he hides when just a little while ago he'd promised to tell her about and then comes back and bold face lies right before he faces a mission against a another seemingly unstoppable enemy? 

 

Just saying that if this time around Felicity doesn't react in a similar manner, it's perfectly reasonable.

 

She is going to be hurt and she is going to be angry and we know this because we know her character but how are those emotions going to come out?  Would anger be the top note in a confrontation this time or would sorrow or disappointment or just plain weariness?  Or perhaps there will be all that AND a surety that they will work it out. 

 

Every new experience shapes us and something as traumatic as being shot up and likely for a while paralyzed is absolutely going to influence her viewpoint and how she reacts.  I'm not sure if the extra on going challenges in her life would make her quicker or slower to anger but I feel confident that there is a whole range of realistic human reactions other than rage and walking away. 

 

Maybe the betrayal of not being told will cut deeper or maybe the trials they'd just went through allow her to see a broader picture.  Her injuries might have brought them closer and make it impossible for her not to first hear from Oliver why he felt he had to act the way he acted.  She doesn't have to agree that he made a good choice, but intentions do matter.  

 

They need to address why Oliver would chose to give his honesty to someone above her but he might first have to be shown that is what he did.  What's so crystal clear to one person, might not have even crossed another's mind and the very thing that is cutting the deepest might not have even factored into their actions. 

 

As other have said, I will have to see how this plays out before I'll judge anyone, but I do know that the show doesn't have to make Felicity walk away for me to believe she is not a doormat or "just" a love interest. 

 

But AyChiuahua,  I do agree that Oliver IS lying to her right now, so I can give you that solidarity.  :D

[Chaser]

I'm guessing Revenge applies to both Felicity/DD and Thea/Anarchy. That would explain why Oliver leaves the hospital. If someone is targeting Thea, I cant imagine him not being there. Esp if the other option is him sitting on his hands in a waiting room.

Edited January 5, 2016 by 10Eleven12

[wonderwall]

I can only see Felicity being a doormat if she just accepts Oliver lying to her and moves on without giving him a hard time about it and actually being angry. She was a doormat to Palmer last year in 317 (ugh) when she just accepted his actions and apologized to him. But I doubt we'll see her do the same with Oliver. With Oliver Felicity actually cares enough to fight with him, to make him see that keeping secrets especially one this big is wrong and that there could've been another way. 
 
I can see Felicity being hurt and disappointed in Oliver and letting him know that. 
 
IMO That's not what being a doormat is. That's Felicity letting herself feel whatever she feels. And if she doesn't walk away from Oliver because of his secret, that's her right. Doesn't make her a doormat especially if she doesn't accept Oliver lying to her.

Edited January 5, 2016 by wonderwall

[kismet]

It is warranted that OQ gets some blame for his lying. As for how much blame is placed on FS for the fallout is all speculation because we have not seen how she has responded. Her reaction in 408, I think was a little extreme & out of line, certainly only deserving a very small fraction of blame. However, I did think she deserved a sliver of it. Overall though, I think was done on purpose for DRAMA because they knew they were reversing it anyway. But we have not seen her do anything about the the truth revelation, so I will just hold my opinion until I actually have something to analyze. 

 

Back to the SPOILERS:

 

Do we think the filming scene is perhaps a celebration of his mayoral victory? They often are in large places and ballrooms, I wonder if the lobby or theater is conducive to that scene? I would imagine that DD would probably want to ruin that. As for the limo.... seriously, how can OQ ever want to ride in a limo so close to the recent trauma. And if he is not in the limo, than who?

[tarotx]

Oliver has kept so may secrets that not telling someone else's secret when it's a demand could believably seem like the right option for Oliver.  What Oliver has to see is why that shouldn't apply to the woman he loves and wants to marry. Oliver has to tell Felicity the important things that affect his life. Everything that affects Oliver's life affects felicity. This is a different issue then keeping his own secrets. Though just barely. The Trust issue is going to be something that is always there under the surface. I don't think this is a trust issue with Oliver. He Trust Felicity. This is dealing with what right other people have to keep secrets that affect other people. This is of course a trust issue with Felicity but probably goes deeper. This is a character issue concerning Oliver. What do you do with a man whose first instinct is to go along with a secret. It goes into the very core of what team Arrow does for a living.  But also what they are already trying to deal with as Oliver runs for Mayor. Removing the secrets and fighting living loving,in the light of day.

Edited January 6, 2016 by tarotx

[kismet]

Sometimes you have to keep secrets to keep the people you love safe in the line of work that they have all chosen to do. I can see how there might be an internal debate in OQ's mind about what he needs to do. Compartmentalization is what has kept OQ alive for so many years.

 

It's not a trust issue for me, because he has not explicitly lied to her yet. He trusts FS, but that has no bearing on why he has not told her about BM or William - his hands are being tied under the threat of protecting his relationship with his son. But, It is something they definitely need to talk about and something he needs to work on. Because William is not the first, only or last secret or compromising intel he is keeping from FS for valid or at least reasons he believe are valid. As much as I know its going to hurt FS. I can also see her working through it and prioritizing their love and trying to find a way to make OQ understand how to handle situations like this in future.

 

OQ is already fighting in and for the light this season ~ the writers needed to give something for FS to have her annual pep talk for the last third of the season :) I guess we all know what the lesson plan is going to contain. "Oliver we love & trust each other, you have to find a different way than keeping everything from me" "OK Felicity, I will try" or maybe he'll just flash some sad eyes with some shoulder rubbing &/or nuzzling and a definite chest hit from FS.  And then some major EPIC fighting with bad guys and a sappy ending where OQ officially meets the objective of the lesson plan. Until next seasons big drama.

Edited January 5, 2016 by kismet

[chaos is welcome]

I'm guessing Revenge applies to both Felicity/DD and Thea/Anarchy. That would explain why Oliver leaves the hospital. If someone is targeting Thea, I cant imagine him not being there. Esp if the other option is him sitting on his hands in a waiting room.

Yup I completely agree with this. It could actually make for good tv, I am k looking forward to it for the first time in ages (which is probably dangerous)

[way2interested]

I would think it would be a cool parallel with Anarky, but is he in 410? Nothing except the promo really hints that he's in 410, and even then the promo could have just used shots of him from 411, if he's in that one instead. Since the plot description didn't even mention him, I just assumed he was in 411 instead, but thinking about it, it could probably balance out the other characters, like Thea, Lance, and maybe Laurel?, and give them something to do before what looks like their big team-up at Darhk's house in 410.

[MuuMuuChainsmoker]

Hi Team Arrow

 

While there is pretty wide latitude to discuss things in the Spoiler thread as long as they are actually about Arrow and aren't nasty or discussing fan reaction rather than the show itself, I'd like to gentle suggest that you self monitor a bit when it comes to using this thread to rehash discussions/arguments about plot lines that have already happened unless they directly relate to spoilers.  

 

I take the point that some discussions mix both past and future spoiler information but before you post in the Spoiler Discussion thread, consider whether it really belongs here. 

 

And, as always, you don't have to convince anyone that your opinion is the right one--basking in the private knowledge of your own rightness is all you need for a happy and prosperous new year. 

[Morrigan2575]

Posting this here because it's not really a spoiler (since it's pretty much the same promo they aired after 409)

 

https://twitter.com/CW_Arrow/status/684802073485938688

 

#Arrow returns in TWO WEEKS with a new priority: take out Damien Darhk.

Edited January 6, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[bijoux]

It's such a silly way to phrase it. Oh, now it's the team's priority? As opposed to being ranked 7th on their to do list so far this season?

Edited January 6, 2016 by bijoux

[Belinea]

I have to say that even though I like the actor and I think Darkh is better than the villain last season at this point I am still not sold really. I really want to know sooner than later what his overall motivation is. At least with MM and Slade it was revenge and you were part of the build-up. At some point I'd actually like to have a slight idea in which direction it is going other than take him out for being a bad guy.

[Guest]

I thought taking down Damien Darhk was always their priority... (Whoever does CW promo is just clueless.)

 

Because he's the big bad of the season we automatically know DD doesn't get taken out until the end. I'm finding it hard to find any real 'Yeah get him!' enthusiasm. Next season they should have 2 big bads and then play a kind of cat and mouse game of not knowing who will get it in the end.

Edited January 6, 2016 by Guest

[bijoux]

 

This is from Bamford's Instagram. Is it the same venue where Jessica Danforth made her candidacy announcement? I know it's not the spot of the announcement, but I seem to recall Oliver chasing Anarky through an auditorium. Maybe they'll finally hold the election.

[Velocity23]

Is that the same place they had the Moira vs Sebastian debatte?

[Morrigan2575]

no idea but i wouldn't be surprised, they reuse venues/locations/sets

[tarotx]

I think the biggest spoiler bit is that SA is going to be both Oliver and the Green Arrow at this location?

[Morrigan2575]

Wonder how he's going to manage that?  Does he have his green suit on under the Armani?  LOL 

[apinknightmare]

Wonder how he's going to manage that? Does he have his green suit on under the Armani? LOL

If the date night in 3x01 is anything to go by, he has the Armani on under the green suit. :)

[tv echo]

I'm tired of the promos for 410 including the gravesite scene, making it appear as if that scene is part of the next episode.  I kept seeing that promo on The CW last night.

[way2interested]

I'm tired of the promos for 410 including the gravesite scene, making it appear as if that scene is part of the next episode. I kept seeing that promo on The CW last night.

Another thing is that the one on the CW deletes the last two shots of Thea telling Oliver that Felicity's out of surgery (confirming she's alive) and of Oliver going to talk to a depressed-looking Donna. CW is really trying to sell the idea that Felicity's dead to the general audience, it seems.

[AyChihuahua]

It'd be hilarious if the promos did their jobs too well and ratings totally tanked because the general audience really does think she's dead and therefore quits watching en masse.

[kismet]

If the date night in 3x01 is anything to go by, he has the Armani on under the green suit. :)

Well the new shoulder pads can accommodate the Armani well. I can't imagine those GA shoulder pads fitting under anything flattering. :(

 

Tear for the old suit. :'(

 

I actually wonder if they will pull a RH/MM-like moment where someone else is wearing the suit. It seems more likely they would copy that moment than the date night unzipping.

[apinknightmare]

I actually wonder if they will pull a RH/MM-like moment where someone else is wearing the suit. It seems more likely they would copy that moment than the date night unzipping.

Doubtful, since SA is wearing the eyeblack for the mask in that Facebook video he posted from the theater. Edited January 7, 2016 by apinknightmare

[Morrigan2575]

This was brought up in the Spoiler Only Thread.  For the record 

 

Corpsing is British theatrical slang for unintentionally breaking character by laughing.[1] In North American TV and film this is commonly referred to as breaking and is generally categorized as a blooper. The origin of the term corpsing is unclear, but may come from (provoking an actor into) breaking character by laughing while portraying a corpse.[2]

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpsing

[Velocity23]

So its a mayoral debate

 

 

https://twitter.com/BethEveson/status/685177414440189952