Spoiler Discussion Thread

[kismet]

I hadn't thought about Felicity in a hood but...since back when she first entered the foundry and picked up Oliver's bow and then later in S-2 custom ordered him one...............  I have been watching for her to be an archer with a nice shot that saves the day at the right moment.  If Oliver grinned when she impressed on the Dollmaker info, he would go full blown face pride at a Felicity bullseye.

I have mentioned something along these lines in another thread somewhere, can't remember now - probably the felicity thread. I seriously believe that in Felicity's backstory she has some connection to archery. I hope that its true, and it be revealed in a few seasons, because I think it would be cool. I mean if you look at her apartment there are signs that she has some interest in robin hood and archery, so the easter eggs are there. Her in the hood, that would just be good tv moment if they could write it in somehow. Felicity as a secret archery aficionado would be something that would be interesting character reveal later on.

[Proteus]

Has Willa Holland been seen filming? I'm afraid they are killing Thea.

[Morrigan2575]

There goes our desperate attempt to make Felicity relevant to Oliver again.  :-(

 

He's got one with Karl Yune too so I guess Maseo is still around.

I've always cared more about Felicity than Olicity so her dying or getting injured just to get an Olicity reaction out of Oliver has never appealed to me.  That stuff belongs in fanfiction, IMO.

 

As for the rest, the DR/SA/BR pic is in PI so it looks like they're all filming a scene together on the PI set. No idea where the pic with Karl Yune was taken.

[AyChihuahua]

I guess I don't see why cast pictures on-set mean characters aren't dying and getting LPd.  In my spec, she's dead for like 8 hours in-show, maybe half an episode.  Most of these sets are not on location...they're probably about 20 feet from each other. 

  

I think she's dying somewhat to throw Olicity lovers a bone, somewhat to parallel Malcolm, and somewhat to use the LP and get Oliver to say yes to Ra's.  Plus, that could set up some more relationship angst, as she could be messed up from dying or could come back temporarily nutty. 

 

ETA: At least in movies, they don't film scenes in the same order as the final product.  So even if EBR is on the PI set today, that doesn't mean Felicity is at Palmer's office in the beginning of the episode.  They could also be trying to be a bit sneakier now and pull back now that they've dropped enough hints, which wouldn't be hard to do...BR just asks the actors to walk 20 feet to the other set to promote his coffee thing, that he wanted to do anyway. 

 

I really, really don't think they're killing Thea, at least not permanently.  Not when they're just getting her close to their favorite thing: a mask.  She could be the one getting LPd, though. 

Edited March 5, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[Sunshine]

I will be surprised if they use the Lazarus Pits on anyone but Ra's.

 

I think JB's run with the show is done.  I think that is the only reason they have attempted to redeem Malcolm is so he can die at least semi-heroically.  After watching him beg Ra's in Nanda Parbat, I personally don't consider him to be much of a badass anymore.    

[BunsenBurner]

Well I think it is still Barrowman or Katie who are going to die or leave.  

 

Think about it.  LL became BC she has reached her goal she can now gracefully exit stage right and go on to more important things like movies. Hasn't MG already said that some of the characters would not reach their comic canon or something?  This could be her.

 

MM has definitely spent too much time on Arrow and now has another show developing. He could go for a season or two and come back because somehow I don't believe that TPTB want to get rid of JB.

Edited March 5, 2015 by BunsenBurner

[KirkB]

Bur Laurel already HAS met her comic destiny. She's the Black Canary. They said some will and some won't, though so far the only one of the main characters who hasn't, ironically enough, is Oliver.

[Morrigan2575]

Bur Laurel already HAS met her comic destiny. She's the Black Canary. They said some will and some won't, though so far the only one of the main characters who hasn't, ironically enough, is Oliver.

Thea hasn't yet.  But given that she's getting fitted for a mask, I assume she'll be Speedy by 323.

[Guest]

I want to see Felicity in the hood. I don't care how; I just want to see it. And I want Oliver to see it. 

 

She can wear it after their sexy times, when she gets up in the middle of the night and she's cold. I mean, they do like to write their trope-y fan fiction, right? Haha.

[statsgirl]

When Thea gets her mask, everyone will have met their comic destiny, with possibly the exception of Roy because he still has two arms and Felicity isn't married to Ed Raymond.  So the EPs were trolling us? 

 

Willa tweeting pix of being fitted for her mask is why I'm not worried about her at all.  If it were only temporary, she wouldn't be tweeting it.

 

I've always cared more about Felicity than Olicity so her dying or getting injured just to get an Olicity reaction out of Oliver has never appealed to me.  That stuff belongs in fanfiction, IMO.

I have no desire to see Felicity hurt but Oliver's dismissal of her this season is seriously bugging me. Rather than his "Am I Oliver Queen or am I The Arrow?" identity crises, what I'm seeing is Oliver trying to save everyone around him except for Felicity to whom he's acting like a jackass.  Get tech from her, he's there but as soon as he no longer needs her doing tech, she's out the door with Laurel and Roy while he talks to Diggle and Thea.

[Danny Franks]

I have no desire to see Felicity hurt but Oliver's dismissal of her this season is seriously bugging me. Rather than his "Am I Oliver Queen or am I The Arrow?" identity crises, what I'm seeing is Oliver trying to save everyone around him except for Felicity to whom he's acting like a jackass.  Get tech from her, he's there but as soon as he no longer needs her doing tech, she's out the door with Laurel and Roy while he talks to Diggle and Thea.

 

It sounds like they're all set on hurting each other, so I don't see why Oliver is being blamed. From what I can tell, Felicity doesn't want much to do with him either. Did he start it? Doesn't really matter, does it? If they're being dicks to each other for love triangle reasons, isn't it better if they're not in many scenes together?

 

I've never really understood why characters are expected to be nice to someone who has hurt them. Oliver hurt Felicity, so she's not happy with him, Felicity hurt Oliver so he's not happy with her. That seems about the only realistic thing going on in this show.

[Starfish35]

When Thea gets her mask, everyone will have met their comic destiny, with possibly the exception of Roy because he still has two arms and Felicity isn't married to Ed Raymond. So the EPs were trolling us?

Unless they've restated this since Sara's death, I really think they were talking about Sara. I know it doesn't quite fit since she wasn't a comics canon character, but with Thea getting her mask and Laurel suiting up, there really isn't anyone else it could have been.

[Morrigan2575]

Unless they've restated this since Sara's death, I really think they were talking about Sara. I know it doesn't quite fit since she wasn't a comics canon character, but with Thea getting her mask and Laurel suiting up, there really isn't anyone else it could have been.

Yeah, I argued against it back in May 2014 because Sara obviously didn't have a comicbook destiny.  However, in retrospect and having just posted the quote here last week, it seems that Sara might be the person who didn't make her comicbook destiny.  At the same time the quote is clearly talking about S3 and clearly talking about the Identity theme, so it's possible that they changed their mind or perhaps Thea is the person who isn't going to make their comicbook destiny because instead of becoming Speedy she becomes Artemis or Cheshire or Dark Archer 2.  In any case the way it's worded they're talking about masks/alter egos not losing arms or getting married, etc.

Edited March 5, 2015 by Morrigan2575

[Danny Franks]

Yeah, I argued against it back in May 2014 because Sara obviously didn't have a comicbook destiny.  However, in retrospect and having just posted the quote here last week, it seems obvious that Sara is probably the only person who didn't make her comicbook destiny.  At the same time the quote is clearly talking about S3 and clearly talking about the Identity theme, so it's possible that they changed their mind or perhaps Thea is the person who isn't going to make their comicbook destiny because instead of becoming Speedy she becomes Artemis or Cheshire or Dark Archer2

 

Well Thea's comic book destiny is no more canon than Sara's, because Thea has never existed in the DC comic book universe either. Thea Queen is a new invention for this show, and doesn't have much more similarity to Mia Dearden than a rhyming name and a history of adolescent troublemaking.

[statsgirl]

Isn't it cheating when everyone gets their comic book destiny except for those who are not in the comic books?  Yeah, not surprised.

 

reply to the Oliver/Felicity stuff in the relationship thread

[Morrigan2575]

Well Thea's comic book destiny is no more canon than Sara's, because Thea has never existed in the DC comic book universe either. Thea Queen is a new invention for this show, and doesn't have much more similarity to Mia Dearden than a rhyming name and a history of adolescent troublemaking.

Very true, Thea doesn't exist in the comics but she's clearly set up to be a version of Mia Dearden.  She's been called Speedy from the pilot, her middle name is Dearden and in 304 she was going by Mia in Corto Maltese.  

[AyChihuahua]

Think about it.  LL became BC she has reached her goal she can now gracefully exit stage right and go on to more important things like movies. Hasn't MG already said that some of the characters would not reach their comic canon or something?  This could be her.

It's not LL.  I think if those episodes had tanked it might be, but the post-death episodes have done fine, to my eternal chagrin.  I suppose it's possible something is going on with the actress, but I think the EPs will do what they need to to keep her.

 

Some non-Ra's person is getting LPd.  It's a major comic thing and the next episode looks LP-heavy.  It's not just Ra's, because we've already seen him totally chilling in it at least twice...no drama there.  It's not Tommy because that actor booked another gig.  And something has to push Oliver to accept the offer.  His life is somewhat starting to look up...he's going to be Diggle's best man and he and Thea are the best they've ever been.  I don't think Oliver would be that devastated about Felicity dating Ray, as he wants her to be happy.  I am pretty comfortable the scene three years in the making with Paul Blackthorne is them making up after acknowledging OQ is the Arrow, so I don't think the whole city will hate him, at least not for long.  He shouldn't be willing to become the head of a league of murderers because he's feeling unappreciated and mopey anyway...that is a villain's origin story, not a hero's.  And the OQ we knew, at least prior to this season, wouldn't become Ra's because Ra's threatens his friends and family...he'd raze the LOA to the ground.

[Danny Franks]

If it's Felicity who gets killed, then I'd assume Oliver will be offered the Lazarus Pit in exchange for him becoming Ra's Ollie Ghul. I doubt it'll get more complicated than that, and that sort of cheap angst is right in the wheelhouse of these writers.

 

'I can save Felicity, but then I have to let her go and leave my life behind.' Just the sort of honourable rot that they have Oliver thinking all the time, isn't it? As has been pointed out, he'll probably already be in 'I'm so noble I have to wallow in woobieness and let Felicity be happy in the sunshine with her creepy stalker boyfriend' anyway. This would just be one more thing for him to write angsty doom poetry about.

Edited March 5, 2015 by Danny Franks

[AyChihuahua]

This would just be one more thing for him to write angsty doom poetry about.

I really, really want to read Oliver Queen's angsty doom poetry.

[Scribbles]

I don't think Laurel has reached the comic book destiny of Black Canary.  She may have the name via Daddy Lance an episode or so ago, but the black clad flailing figure who faught Malcolm this past episode aint no Black Canary,  They really could let her drift away for a while (half a season or even a couple of seasons) and it not be odd.  It is not only fighting skills, Laurel is not in a heroic space as a human.  She is still lying (sure didn't see her go tell Dad she knew who killed Sara or that Malcolm is alive on the streets of Starling).  She isn't really thinking about the greater good yet, she is barely coming to terms with anything like grief. 

[statsgirl]

I don't think their thinking goes that deep, Scribbles.  Laurel is wearing the black leather, the wig and the mask.  She fighting bad guys and being called the Black Canary.  She's there.

 

But even if she does spend half a season flailing around before nailing the fighting moves, she will still reach her comic book destiny. The EPs said that some characters in their Who Am I list will reach their comic destinies and other won't.  I can't see Laurel not reaching hers.

 

 

I really, really want to read Oliver Queen's angsty doom poetry.

I have the feeling it will be awful.

[calliope1975]

I really, really want to read Oliver Queen's angsty doom poetry.

 

I have a feeling it would be like Batman's song in The Lego Movie. Hard, intense, rock music in the background. All about the island, his dead parents, no girl. Sadness. 

 

In short - amazing.

[Password]

Oh my word I would never want to read Oliver's inner ramblings or see what happens in his mind. We see his actions, imagine how messed up his head would be.

[Sakura12]

I was totally thinking of Lego Batman's song. 

[Scribbles]

Oh my word I would never want to read Oliver's inner ramblings or see what happens in his mind. We see his actions, imagine how messed up his head would be.

Everytime I see Oliver conflicted I hear Kermit the Frog saying:  "It aint easy being green"

[Danny Franks]

I have a feeling it would be like Batman's song in The Lego Movie. Hard, intense, rock music in the background. All about the island, his dead parents, no girl. Sadness. 

 

In short - amazing.

 

Yeah, so now I really want to read that poetry. He'd have way more ammunition that Batman, who really leaned on the dead parents thing heavily at times. But I've always kind of enjoyed the ridiculous, theatrical melodramatic tendencies that Batman has. This is a guy who has cars and phones and computers shaped like bats, he's that into his secret identity.

 

Seeing Oliver have some of that pathological drive to be even more arrowy and green than ever would probably make him a lot more fun to watch. "Hey guys, you think I could work the front end of my bike into a sort of arrow shape? I've been watching some American Chopper, and it looks doable." And it'd give him a break from all that poetry.

[Sakura12]

If these writers ever let Oliver have some fun he can do things like that. But they are determined to keep him in a constant state of doom and gloom.

 

If he was a cartoon he'd have a rain cloud over his head to be complete. 

Edited March 5, 2015 by Sakura12

[ban1o]

Mmm I keep flip flopping but now I'm leaning on the "It's not Roy dying" side. I actually agree with the theory someone posted earlier of Stephen and Colton's tweets being a little unrelated.The death could be Akio.  I assume for the next few episodes Oliver will be spending a lot of alone time with him.  

 

And I definitely don't think Felicity is dying lol. 

The "for the last time" thing Stephen posted about on facebook I think was referring to Laurel, especially since Katie hasn't been filming much. I don't think she dies but I think she goes away to do something temporarily.  

Edited March 5, 2015 by ban1o

[dtissagirl]

'Broken Arrow' in military parlance refers to a missile gone astray. I don't think it refers to that though.

OH MY GOD, Amanda Waller is gonna throw a missile at someone, and Crazy Eyed ATOM will make it like Tony Stark and intercept it. Avengers ripoff achieved! Or maybe he'll try to intercept it and fail. Cue explosion. Isn't 319 the Palmer centric soft pilot? Isn't something going boom?

Plus, if Palmer feels responsible for putting Felicity in the hospital, they can have him and Oliver play who has the largest manpain.

Sorry for derailing the death guessing game, you guys, please continue. :)

[Morrigan2575]

OH MY GOD, Amanda Waller is gonna throw a missile at someone, and Crazy Eyed ATOM will make it like Tony Stark and intercept it. Avengers ripoff achieved! Or maybe he'll try to intercept it and fail. Cue explosion. Isn't 319 the Palmer centric soft pilot? Isn't something going boom?

Plus, if Palmer feels responsible for putting Felicity in the hospital, they can have him and Oliver play who has the largest manpain.

Sorry for derailing the death guessing game, you guys, please continue. :)

No, no, no. Malcolm is going to highjack a plane with. Nuclear missile as it's payload and then demand SC pay a randsom to avoid being nuked. He'll ham it up on a train before Arrow and Arsenal finally save the day.

[catrox14]

No, no, no. Malcolm is going to highjack a plane with. Nuclear missile as it's payload and then demand SC pay a randsom to avoid being nuked. He'll ham it up on a train before Arrow and Arsenal finally save the day.

 

It won't be one plane. He'll have redundant backups.  He's no dummy. 

[ban1o]

No, no, no. Malcolm is going to highjack a plane with. Nuclear missile as it's payload and then demand SC pay a randsom to avoid being nuked. He'll ham it up on a train before Arrow and Arsenal finally save the day.

 

It won't be one plane. He'll have redundant backups.  He's no dummy. 

lol 

[apinknightmare]

Regarding the ep 17 summary: Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) and Ray hit a rough patch.

That didn't take long.

[SmallScreenDiva]

OK, jumping on the "who dies" game. I'm with the folks who think Stephen's and Colton's tweets are unrelated. I think the death coming soon is Akio (I think Malcolm will die, too, probably in finale). It's the direction given to the actor: "When Stephen looks at you, go limp," or something like that. Sounds like something you tell a young actor. As much as I wish the death is that of a character I don't have any use for, I don't think that's ever, ever gonna happen. I'd be extremely happy to be proved wrong.

Regarding the ep 17 summary: Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) and Ray hit a rough patch.


That didn't take long.

 

Bet they'll make up by the end of the episode. *rme* And I bet this is the ep where Laurel will give Felicity a pep talk about romance or something *rme* ... They're repeating the O/S beats from last season. *i can't roll my eyes anymore, they might fall off*

[ban1o]

Regarding the ep 17 summary: Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) and Ray hit a rough patch.

That didn't take long.

I wouldn't believe it if I were you lol :P 

Edited March 5, 2015 by ban1o

[Ang]

Regarding the ep 17 summary: Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) and Ray hit a rough patch.

That didn't take long.

Oh for the...can they not give this girl a bleeding break?! Oliver breaks up with her after half a date, now she's, what, 24 hours to a week into a new relationship and "hitting a rough patch"? Gah.

[AyChihuahua]

 

Regarding the ep 17 summary: Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) and Ray hit a rough patch.

Maybe Felicity doesn't dig butter in her morning coffee.

[apinknightmare]

I wouldn't believe it if I were you lol :P

Oh, I don't think they're breaking up, I just thought the honeymoon period would last longer than one ep.

[statsgirl]

If Diggle didn't hate Deadshot before, he will now, breaking up his honeymoon.

 

Is there a TV rule that the role of seedy diplomat goes either to Steven Culp or Tim Webber?

 

Bet they'll make up by the end of the episode. *rme* And I bet this is the ep where Laurel will give Felicity a pep talk about romance or something *rme* ... They're repeating the O/S beats from last season. *i can't roll my eyes anymore, they might fall off*

Way, way too fast to break up, unless the EPs decided already that it was a fail.

 

I'll be delighted if the pep talk Laurel give Felicity is about Ray and not about Oliver.

Edited March 6, 2015 by statsgirl

[apinknightmare]

I'll be delighted if the pep talk Laurel give Felicity is about Ray and not about Oliver.

IIRC, the question on Tumblr MG responded to about the talk with Laurel was if Felicity would have someone to talk to about her feelings about Oliver, so I think it's probably about him, unfortunately.

[ban1o]

Oh, I don't think they're breaking up, I just thought the honeymoon period would last longer than one ep.

haha true. I wonder if it will be over something stupid or big. 

[apinknightmare]

haha true. I wonder if it will be over something stupid or big.

I wonder if this is the Arrow vs. Atom issue where Felicity gets caught in the middle or if it's really about Felicity and Ray.

[Scribbles]

Oh for the...can they not give this girl a bleeding break?! Oliver breaks up with her after half a date, now she's, what, 24 hours to a week into a new relationship and "hitting a rough patch"? Gah.

The key to a rough patch is really about Oliver and Ray meeting up again.  Oliver and Ray have not been face to face since like ep.1 and the synopsis noted Oliver would find out about Ray's suit in the episode.  The thing about Felicity having this long stretch of just her with Ray is that she hasn't had to see him in the rest of her own world.  Ray meeting team Arrow is darned close to bringing a guy home to meet the parents and oh by the way the ex-boyfriend drops by.

[statsgirl]

IIRC, the question on Tumblr MG responded to about the talk with Laurel was if Felicity would have someone to talk to about her feelings about Oliver, so I think it's probably about him, unfortunately.

Way to depress me, apinknightmare.

 

Is Laurel going to share how hard it is to get over Oliver?  Or what a mistake it is to keep hanging on to him and how much she regrets not going all in with Tommy when she had the chance?  (I fear it's another Laurel/Felicity scene I'm going to have to mute.)

[wonderwall]

haha true. I wonder if it will be over something stupid or big. 

 

Maybe Felicity sides with Oliver when he and Ray have a big blowout about Ray's 'extracurricular activities'? 

 

IDK though, that will have to consist of Oliver making sense for once this season and I think the chances of that happening are slim to none. 

[Scribbles]

IIRC, the question on Tumblr MG responded to about the talk with Laurel was if Felicity would have someone to talk to about her feelings about Oliver, so I think it's probably about him, unfortunately.

If that scene works....someone used super glue and helium.

[Guest]

Felicity and Ray hit a rough patch? Yawn. They'll be solid by the end of the episode. Raylicity 4EVA! *Vomits*

 

I swear to god though, if Ray ends up besting Oliver in this 'heated standoff' I'mma throw something. It'll be just another way to knock him when he's down. UGH. DO NOT WANT. NO. STOP. 

[Password]

A rough patch? Ep 17 just got so much more interesting now.

...then I realised they'd probably work it out by the end of the episode and I'm back to apathy.

[Guest]

It has to be related to the Arrow, presumably the fact that Felicity hasn't told Ray that she both knows and works with him. Yeah, that's a real great relationship. 

 

Is it over yet?

[ban1o]

oh yeah I totally think the rough patch is Ray finds out what she does in all her free time with the Arrow and that she been "lying to him" it will be worked out by the end of the episode though lol.