Spoiler Discussion Thread

[Primal Slayer]

Lol of course BTS antics is the real reason for Willa's potential departure. She seems bored and unhappy with what they've done with her character. But to me, Olicity being married + a kid = Oliver has a happy family, and since Thea being his family has always been a big aspect of the character and them not being interested in exploring her as Speedy, they don't mind losing the character.

14 episodes a season is still plenty to work with but even when they had her full time in S4 they didn't use her to her max potential. 

[Midnight Lullaby]

Maybe they mind but since it’s a tv show in theory no character is essential. They could write Oliver off and bring Connor over if Stephen wanted to leave and the network wanted them to keep going.

I can’t share the POV because those three people aren’t interchangeable..a sister, a wife and a son are three different relationships all important..Thea knows Oliver in a way Felicity and Willaim don’t..showing her relationship with Oliver gives him more depth because it’s different from any other.

[Primal Slayer]

I agree but I don't think these writers have the ability or interest to deal with both. 

[lemotomato]

They did both in season 4, but ok.

[Primal Slayer]

Oliver wasn't married or with full time child so they havent.

[WindofChange]

I think the fact that William gets so little to do on the show tells me that he really isn't a substitute for Thea. 

Also add to the fact that they did fine with balancing olicity and thea/Oliver in season 4 shows me that's not it either. And I don't think marriage changes this much. Their relationship is essentially still very similar they just added the legal aspect to it

[lemotomato]

7 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Oliver wasn't married or with full time child so they havent.

Oliver was in a committed, stable relationship, living with his significant other for most of season 4. In that season, in addition to her role as Oliver's sister, Thea was working on his mayoral campaign and was his teammate. She also had the bloodlust storyline and relationships with Malcolm Merlyn and a love interest. Thea being written off the show has nothing to do with Olicity and everything to do with the writers not wanting to write for Thea for whatever reason. By saying Thea was "just Oliver's sister" diminishes her actual impact during her time on the show.

Edited December 13, 2017 by lemotomato

[Midnight Lullaby]

I have a really low opinion of the writers but in this situation I can’t really judge what they would do in a normal situation because there’s BTS stuff involved..my feeling from the way they’ve always written Thea and Oliver’s relationship is that they would have kept Thea. It’s not as if Oliver’s happy ending with Felicity is something they only thought about lately..they knew they were going to end up like this and still have always talked about how Thea is the last member of his family..and she still is the last member of the family he was born into.

Edited December 13, 2017 by Midnight Lullaby

[tangerine95]

Married olicity is basically the same as season 4A olicity imo,like living together and being happy and stable only this time with rings.And Thea and Oliver had a ton of scenes during that time as well as Thea having a lot of her own stuff too.William is the only difference but I doubt that's such a big one considering they can't really do that much with him that would displace Thea.Like I can't imagine any of the scenes Thea and Oliver had replaced with William because they write the kid incredibly shallow.The one thing he could take away from her would be the role of the kidnapped victim for Oliver to save but that's not really a great role for a character anyway so not much of a loss imo.

[Primal Slayer]

Thea had a love interest? They spent all of 5 mins together? And like I said, there was always the possibility of Olicity breaking up, that card is off the floor now with them. And also like I said, Thea's bloodlust was half assed. I simply think they don't really care about losing her as much as they did in the past when Oliver wasn't a full fledged family man. 

[apinknightmare]

I get it - Oliver being the main character, it's important that he has a familial connection (especially since we saw both of his parents die on the show). Ever since Moira died, Thea's filled that spot. Now that he has a wife and son, they can transfer that connection over to them, and write off the person who doesn't seem to be all that into it anymore. 

[strikera0]

26 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Thea had a love interest? They spent all of 5 mins together? And like I said, there was always the possibility of Olicity breaking up, that card is off the floor now with them. And also like I said, Thea's bloodlust was half assed. I simply think they don't really care about losing her as much as they did in the past when Oliver wasn't a full fledged family man. 

I agree. Thea's storylines were always half assed and more about the men in her life than Thea herself. And besides, do I have to remind people of the end of season 3 or episodes like 4x09 where Thea's relationship with Oliver was essentially ignored so that Olicity could take the spotlight? On these CW shows, romantic relationships always come before familial ones. That's simply the reality of the situation. 

Edited December 13, 2017 by strikera0

[SmallScreenDiva]

Just now, strikera0 said:

And besides, do I have to remind people of the end of season 3 or episodes like 4x09 where Thea's relationship with Oliver was essentially ignored so that Olicity could take the spotlight?

Yes, please do remind me. I can't seem to recall this. 

[lemotomato]

8 minutes ago, strikera0 said:

And besides, do I have to remind people of the end of season 3 or episodes like 4x09 where Thea's relationship with Oliver was essentially ignored so that Olicity could take the spotlight?

End of season 3 when Oliver gave up his life so Thea could be revived in the Lazarus Pit? After he had fought a duel earlier in the season to save her life from the LoA? As for 409, I seem to recall that the Olicity proposal was a big plot point in that episode so.... it made sense for Olicity to be in the spotlight?

Edited December 13, 2017 by lemotomato

[Midnight Lullaby]

Obviously one relationship can’t be the focus of every single episode. It doesn’t mean it can’t be important. Oliver and Thea’s relationship was given a lot of importance until season 5 but if Oliver’s relationship with his sister was written as being the most important thing in his life in every single episode he would risk to come off as obsessed with his sister and that’s just creepy.

[insomniadreams88]

Honestly, for me, Oliver and Thea's relationship just isn't the same after last season, just between the whole Susan nonsense (it's like they try to pretend to forget how that "reporter" was introduced before Oliver even met her) and the fact that Thea called Oliver after he was captured and tortured for a week. 

Really, the best thing they can do is give us some good Oliver/Thea moments the rest of the time she's around, not have stupid reasons for her absence and then give her and Roy a happy send-off and at the very least mention her every so often as a "hey, I heard from Thea, she and Roy are..." or really anything that tells us that she's still alive and part of Oliver's life even if they don't live in the same city. 

[strikera0]

10 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

End of season 3 when Oliver gave up his life so Thea could be revived in the Lazarus Pit? After he had fought a dual earlier in the season to save her life from the LoA? As for 409, I seem to recall that the Olicity proposal was a big plot point in that episode so.... not sure why it would be odd for Olicity to take the spotlight in that one.

Nope, when Oliver chose to leave Starling City with Felicity when Thea had just come back from the dead and he was aware that "resurrection via LP" comes with heavy side-effects. IMO, he should have stayed put and made sure she was okay. And wasn't 4x09 the gas chamber episode? Damian Dhark had abducted Felicity, Thea and Diggle and was about to kill them all, but with the way Oliver and the episode were written, it was as if only Felicity mattered. Thea and Diggle were total afterthoughts throughout - from Damian granting Oliver one final conversation with Felicity to Oliver carrying her out of the chamber bridal style.     

Edited December 14, 2017 by strikera0

[Midnight Lullaby]

3 minutes ago, strikera0 said:

Nope, when Oliver chose to leave Starling City with Felicity when Thea had just come back from the dead and he was aware that "resurrection via LP" comes with heavy side-effects. IMO, he should have stayed put and made sure she was okay. 

This wasn’t about Felicity at all though. Oliver didn’t want to be the Arrow anymore, he said he wanted to find out who he was without the mask and asked Felicity to come with him. It’s not like he did it for her, he did it for himself. Turns out Felicity didn’t even want to leave the team. At best we can say he could have asked Thea to go with him but that’s just plain weird.

[Guest]

Why should Oliver stay behind at the end of s3 when he had already sacrificed so much for Thea during that season? IDK, I think that's a little unfair tbh. IIRC, Thea seemed pretty okay at that point so I can see why Oliver felt he could leave and do something for himself for a change. And like @lemotomato already said, 409 was the Olicity proposal episode so it makes sense why they were the focus in that. Just like Thea and Oliver's relationship had been a focus in other episodes. 

I guess I just don't see why Olicity's relationship gets the blame for literally everything. It's crazy! Haha. 

[lemotomato]

21 minutes ago, strikera0 said:

Nope, when Oliver chose to leave Starling City with Felicity when Thea had just come back from the dead and he was aware that "resurrection via LP" comes with heavy side-effects. IMO, he should have stayed put and made sure she was okay. And wasn't 4x09 the gas chamber episode? Damian Dhark had abducted Felicity, Thea and Diggle and was about to kill them all, but with the way Oliver and the episode were written, it was as if only Felicity mattered. Thea and Diggle were total afterthoughts throughout - from Damian granting Oliver one final conversation with Felicity to Oliver carrying her out of the chamber bridal style.     

Oliver had just given his life up, twice, to save Thea's. She was physically fine enough to fight him while he was with the LoA and to defend the city when the LoA attacked in 323. He actually didn't know what the side affects were from coming out of the pit. (Remember in 401 when Oliver was concerned about Thea's behavior and didn't know what was wrong with her?) Malcolm mentioned there would be consequences, but not anything specific. As far as Oliver knew, she was fine. So no, I don't begrudge him going on vacation after everything he did.

And DD allowed Felicity to talk to Oliver in the cell because the episode was Olicity-centric. Because their relationship was an issue being addressed in the episode and they had to discuss it at some point in order to get to the proposal moment in the end? I have no idea why Oliver's relationship with Thea is supposed to be focused on here.

Edited December 14, 2017 by lemotomato

[SmallScreenDiva]

7 minutes ago, strikera0 said:

Nope, when Oliver chose to leave Starling City with Felicity when Thea had just come back from the dead and he was aware that "resurrection via LP" comes with heavy side-effects. IMO, he should have stayed put and made sure she was okay. And wasn't 4x09 the gas chamber episode? Damian Dhark had abducted Felicity, Thea and Diggle and was about to kill them all, but with the way Oliver and the episode were written, it was as if only Felicity mattered. Thea and Diggle were total afterthoughts throughout - from Damian granting Oliver one final conversation with Felicity to Oliver carrying her out of the chamber bridal style.     

Ahhh, well, that is the episode where everything was leading up to Oliver's proposal so it would have been rather awkward if his relationship with his sister had been the focus. It was not too long ago when people were thinking about Queencest after all, LOL!

Also, Oliver never carried Felicity out of the chamber bridal style. I know because I would have totally squealed. Alas, he just hugged the stuffing out of her (and maybe called her "baby.")

I'm still not seeing why Olicity or even Felicity is being blamed for the possibility of Thea leaving. It seems like a lot of this stems from BTS stuff with Willa. 

Going back to the Roy discussion ... I'm seeing spec on Twitter that Roy might be involved in trying to get Oliver off from being prosecuted yet again. I just can't see how that's gonna happen seeing as he's supposed to be dead. Any thoughts?

[apinknightmare]

3 minutes ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

Going back to the Roy discussion ... I'm seeing spec on Twitter that Roy might be involved in trying to get Oliver off from being prosecuted yet again. I just can't see how that's gonna happen seeing as he's supposed to be dead. Any thoughts?

I figured that Cayden James would've found him out and exposed that he's still alive - and that Roy would've gotten a call from Samanda Watson - who is otherwise terrible at her job - to testify that Oliver was the Arrow as well as the Green Arrow and that he took the fall for him the first time around. The wording of the spoiler is kind of weird - I don't know whether his return is good for the team or bad.

[Primal Slayer]

I forget...Roy is still considered "dead" right? Either way I am tired of them bringing back "dead" characters and then never really reintroducing them back to the public. 

[Mary0360]

37 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

 

guess I just don't see why Olicity's relationship gets the blame for literally everything. It's crazy! Haha. 

 

They have been a scape goat for three years now from a segment of an unhappy fandom. From Laurel no longer being the love interest, to Laurel dying, to the fact that the stunts sucked in season 4, to Oliver not killing or being a bad ass, to the ratings declining, to the quality of the writing or story telling- even though the explanations for all those things had nothing to do with either Olicity or Felicity as a concept, character or relationship. Felicity and Olicity's overall popularity and attention makes them an easier target for dissatisfaction and jealous resentment.  It's the tall poppy syndrome.

 

Thea being written out Im sure has more to do with the fact that Willa supposedly had asked for less episodes last season and this season and probably wants to move on and do something else and the writers are respecting that choice and giving Thea the best possible exit. Much like they wrote Roy out of the show out of respect for Coltons choice to leave. Four relationships have been given consistent respect growth and focus on this show and that's Oliver/Felicity Oliver/Diggle Oliver/Quentin and Oliver/Thea. I don't believe the show would decide now that Thea is no longer important simply because of Felicity or William.  

[thegirlsleuth]

In my opinion, Olicity didn't ruin Thea's story lines and character development. Malcolm Merlyn (post season 1) ruined Thea's story lines and character development.  This includes his taking away her choices and brainwashing her to murder Sara;  how her defining characteristic was that she was Malcolm's daughter (instead of Moira's, which would have been interesting); and the bloodlust storyline--which could have been so good--which turned into a "how can Malcolm keep the League?" storyline.  So many blown opportunities.  Season 5 is a chicken and egg situation.  Did Willa get sidelined as a vigilante and have her role at the mayor's office turned into Rene's because Willa wanted out, or did Willa want out because they sidelined her as a vigilante (to bring in the comic canon newbies)  and took away her mayor storyline?  I know the official story is that she wanted out, but based on comments at cons it didn't seem to be her choice.

To be fair, I also think Malcolm Merlyn hanging around damaged a lot of characters as so many of them had the means, opportunity, and most importantly the motive to kill him off and still let him live.

[SmallScreenDiva]

Wasn't the official story when Colton stepped away seasons ago that he was only signed up for 2 years? And then it came out, after he'd opened up about his anxiety issues, that it was because of that? So far the official story on Willa is that she asked for fewer episodes. Wonder what when or if the truth will come out about this. 

One of the problems with Thea is she was not quite allowed to be her own character. She was either the daughter (of Moira or Malcolm or Robert) or the sister of Oliver. They could have had her form separate relationships with Felicity & Diggle — Willa has very good chemistry with both EBR and David — and yet the show just kept her with the same people all the time: Lance, Oliver in S5. 

Edited December 14, 2017 by SmallScreenDiva

[catrox14]

4 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

Thea's importance to Oliver has always been that she is his family and his own family member, now that he is married and has a full time son, he has a new family to lean on when times get tough. The writers don't need to keep Thea around to give that sense of family anymore. 

Any person who is Oliver's chosen family, doesn't have a place by that reasoning. People do keep their relationships with siblings when they marry unless they don't get along necessarily, and that isn't the case at all.

[BkWurm1]

5 hours ago, thegirlsleuth said:

In my opinion, Olicity didn't ruin Thea's story lines and character development. Malcolm Merlyn (post season 1) ruined Thea's story lines and character development.  This includes his taking away her choices and brainwashing her to murder Sara;  how her defining characteristic was that she was Malcolm's daughter (instead of Moira's, which would have been interesting); and the bloodlust storyline--which could have been so good--which turned into a "how can Malcolm keep the League?" storyline.  So many blown opportunities.  Season 5 is a chicken and egg situation.  Did Willa get sidelined as a vigilante and have her role at the mayor's office turned into Rene's because Willa wanted out, or did Willa want out because they sidelined her as a vigilante (to bring in the comic canon newbies)  and took away her mayor storyline?  I know the official story is that she wanted out, but based on comments at cons it didn't seem to be her choice.

To be fair, I also think Malcolm Merlyn hanging around damaged a lot of characters as so many of them had the means, opportunity, and most importantly the motive to kill him off and still let him live.

 

I agree that ultimately Thea's storylines were squandered to serve other characters rather than actually do justice to and resolution to Thea's own stories.    But it's hard to know if it's bad writing because they failed the character or bad writing because they had to rework originally planned storylines.  I mean, like season 4 and DD's reaction to using his power on Thea, would ANYONE have guessed that would never be addressed ever again? 

It had to be a big change to the original plan for her blood lust issues to go from something right in the middle of the action to Thea sitting quietly on a couch looking ill while her father and her brother and everyone they knew faced off on the street. 

So add to the two options bolded, the question of if they sidelined her as a vigilante because they HAD to for some problematic behind the scenes reason which only led to further dissatisfaction from Willa. 

Really want that tell all book.  

Edited December 14, 2017 by BkWurm1

[Featherhat]

7 hours ago, SmallScreenDiva said:

I'm still not seeing why Olicity or even Felicity is being blamed for the possibility of Thea leaving. It seems like a lot of this stems from BTS stuff with Willa. 

Some people still blame Olicity for Sara dying (well that time she died in 301 not all the other times) because that's the ep Olicity went on a date and Sara was Oliver's ex and important to him. Never mind that they'd been amicably broken up for months, Sara was back with the LOA and Sara crashed into a dumpster and fell at a character's feet who was decidedly NOT Felicity. 

The minute Oliver attacked Thea over the stupid Susan Williams thing, a woman he barely knew, where she'd already sold Thea out once and was acting decidedly shady, I knew something was going on BTS and it's most likely to do with that, not ongoing storylines. 

Yes it's been very annoying over the years that many of Thea's storylines have been about the reaction and plotlines of the men in her life (and yes Oliver looses IQ points he can't afford to everytime MM comes within 100 meters of him or Thea) but there has been a dramatic shift in what she's been doing the last couple of seasons that has nothing to do with any of Oliver's other relationships (though might have something to do with noobs) and yes we don't know how this Chicken and Egg situation came about. 

Quote

One of the problems with Thea is she was not quite allowed to be her own character. She was either the daughter (of Moira or Malcolm or Robert) or the sister of Oliver. They could have had her form separate relationships with Felicity & Diggle — Willa has very good chemistry with both EBR and David — and yet the show just kept her with the same people all the time: Lance, Oliver in S5. 

Yeah it's kind of ridiculous that Felicity has/had been dating Oliver since the end of S3 and one of the only scenes they've actually talked to each other was 5.23 a brief scene about their supervillain Dad's. Likewise her best scenes with Dig (which were good) was when Oliver had him tailing her after Roy was injected with Mirakuru and that was in S2. And we are supposed to think she does like these characters and is way happy Olicity got married and there's barely a connection there. I'll also be forever bitter there was no follow up with her and Sara after Sara was resurrected. Though I know scheduling played a part there. 

Edited December 14, 2017 by Featherhat

[tv echo]

Things we haven't gotten yet...

• 610 episode synopsis
• Title pages for any episode after 610*

(* Without the shooting schedules, it makes it difficult to determine which filming spoilers belong to which episodes.)

We know that 611 director is Wendey Stanzler (per MG tweet) and that 612 director is Mairsee Almas (per JBam instagram post).

Now, according to IMDb, 613 director is J.J. Makaro...
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt6493680/?ref_=tt_ep_nx

Edited December 14, 2017 by tv echo

[way2interested]

12 minutes ago, tv echo said:

 

Things we haven't gotten yet...

• 610 episode synopsis
• Title pages for any episode after 610*

(* Without the shooting schedules, it makes it difficult to determine which filming spoilers belong to which episodes.)

 

610's description shouldn't be out until the 28th anyway at the earliest, but it is weird that we didn't get the title pages yet for 611, 612, and 613 even though we already know the titles of at least 611 and 612 (it might be because MG was MIA on twitter for the last month but oh well).

[Morrigan2575]

35 minutes ago, tv echo said:

Things we haven't gotten yet...

• 610 episode synopsis
• Title pages for any episode after 610*

(* Without the shooting schedules, it makes it difficult to determine which filming spoilers belong to which episodes.)

We know that 611 director is Wendey Stanzler (per MG tweet) and that 612 director is Mairsee Almas (per JBam instagram post).

Now, according to IMDb, 613 director is J.J. Makaro...
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt6493680/?ref_=tt_ep_nx

They shoot 8 days per episode unless there is a Canadian or Big US Holiday. You can just count up from 11/7 (end date of 610).  Should be around 613 this week.

Edited December 14, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[statsgirl]

I'm wondering if Roy comes back because NTA is still estranged from Oliver, and OTA needs help fighting the Cayden James team,  And when it gets resolved, maybe with only two of the three coming back, Roy goes back to the life he was living and Thea decides to go with him.

20 hours ago, Featherhat said:

Yes it's been very annoying over the years that many of Thea's storylines have been about the reaction and plotlines of the men in her life (and yes Oliver looses IQ points he can't afford to everytime MM comes within 100 meters of him or Thea) but there has been a dramatic shift in what she's been doing the last couple of seasons that has nothing to do with any of Oliver's other relationships (though might have something to do with noobs) and yes we don't know how this Chicken and Egg situation came about.

My money on the "why is Thea leaving?" sweepstakes goes to a combination of BTS and the fact that post season 2, they never really wanted to write for the character.

Over the past three seasons there have been a number of possible plots for her suggested here but the EPs have chosen to focus on her relationships with the men in her life (Oliver, Malcolm or the blink-and-you'll-miss-them love interests) rather than stories about Thea herself.  My favourite opportunities lost were her mysterious effect on DD's magic powers in s4 and Mini Moira in s5 but the writers weren't interested in stories for Thea.  With Rene, Dinah and Curtis stepping back, it would be the perfect time to have Thea suit up again after she's recovered from the coma.  I'm not holding my breath.

They could write for Thea in spite of Oliver being married now and in spite of the n00bs.  They just choose not to.

[leopardprint]

14 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Should be around 613 this week.

This reminds me, has there been any more news about the BLM/very special episode? Did they say it was going to be the 13th episode again? I really hope they just dropped it. 

Edited December 15, 2017 by leopardprint

[tv echo]

Is anyone else concerned that MG will passive-aggressively retaliate against EBR for her calling him out on his "reverse sexism" tweet, by cutting back on her storyline and/or screen time, or make Felicity look bad in some way, in the back half of this season?

[way2interested]

4 minutes ago, tv echo said:

Is anyone else concerned that MG will passive-aggressively retaliate against EBR for her calling him out on his "reverse sexism" tweet, by cutting back on her storyline and/or screen time, or make Felicity look bad in some way, in the back half of this season?

No, the article alleged that they do that right before she posted, so it would be really bad optics at that point if they did, plus Felicity's way too big of a character (EBR knew exactly when/what she was doing). Then again, people are always going to say something makes Felicity look bad or that she'll have less to do so that can't be helped, but from how MG talked about how seriously they take Felicity's character in that interview right before s5 started (or even as recently as him mentioning they decided to keep her as "Felicity Smoak" rather than changing her name), I can't imagine them throwing it all away even if say they all hated EBR. 

[tv echo]

Like others here, I am also concerned that the writers will resolve the team split by having Oliver apologize to the newbies (ugh!).

Arrow season 6: Will the team actually stay disbanded?
by Alex Hodgson  December 14, 2017
https://bamsmackpow.com/2017/12/14/arrow-season-6-will-team-actually-stay-disbanded/

Quote

While it seems that we’ve been here before (not least, season 5, episode 8 “Disbanded”), this time around there are a few more interesting possibilities that arise. For one, there’s the chance that Rene, Curtis and Dinah could form their own vigilante team. They’ve all proven themselves in the field and Curtis could certainly provide useful tech support. If they did, it’d be interesting to see them as direct competition to Team Arrow; former colleagues would cross paths and not necessarily get along. Not only this, they’d be able to prove themselves to Ollie, to show him that he needs them.

Another interesting consequence of the team disbanding is that we’re left with the original Team Arrow. This was possibly the idea of the writers in that it brought the show back to basics, much like Season 5’s return to the darker tone proved successful in breathing new life into the show. Seeing Ollie, Diggle and Felicity working together again will show just how much they’ve grown as a unit, or it’ll show just how much they relied on the new team.

Edited December 15, 2017 by tv echo

[way2interested]

To be fair, at some point OTA would have to rely on the newbies just for the sake of how their lives are going (Oliver, Diggle, and Felicity are now all married and there are children involved, not to mention Oliver and Felicity having pretty public jobs and Diggle being the oldest in the group in general and Oliver having gone through over a decade now of this stressed/active lifestyle), but that doesn't necessarily mean that they'll portray them as wrong or put all of the forgiving onto Oliver. Oliver already pseudo apologized to Rene in the way of giving him (and Dinah) second chances but they rejected him. At this point idk what he'd even apologize for since the show blatantly stated why he didn't trust them, there's nothing much more for him to learn/develop from except maybe giving 3rd/4th/5th chances because he can't keep being a vigilante forever. Even then, Diggle and Felicity still sided with him at the end of the day, so they'd have to apologize for things they shouldn't have to apologize for anyway as well (Diggle: "I'm sorry I didn't defend you Dinah after you hounded me for keeping secrets" Felicity: "I'm sorry I spied on you Curtis after you already spied on me when you were wondering what I was doing").

Since 610 hasn't come out yet idk what angle they are going to take, but to go further with the premise they already set up, they'd have to have both sides make a revelation (like 519/520 which had a very similar set-up to the plot we have now) like Oliver/OTA acknowledging why he jumped the gun or was ready to cut the newbies loose or something and the newbies acknowledging that they weren't as team-oriented as they thought they were (or even as Oliver,Diggle, and Felicity, who have all given up personal aspects of their lives multiple times for the team, are). They'll probably show how both sides need each other and then have some situation that needs them to team up again and address those issues, and it'll be more about the characters addressing the plots they have rather than parts of the team having issues with other parts of the team, making it less of a "right/wrong, black/white" situation and more of a "hey, at the end of the day we both made decisions based on heightened emotions towards the people we love, let's solve those problems."

[Velocity23]

Then i am gonna need Curtis to apologise for ruining the wedding reception day for Felicity/Oliver also. 

[lemotomato]

Given the show's history of siding with Oliver and justifying his decisions even when they've been questionable or outright wrong-- aligning with Merlyn, gong undercover with the LoA, the whole BMD plotline, trusting Susan-- there's a good chance this will play out the same way, as in Oliver being the one in the right.

[BkWurm1]

26 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

Given the show's history of siding with Oliver and justifying his decisions even when they've been questionable or outright wrong-- aligning with Merlyn, gong undercover with the LoA, the whole BMD plotline, trusting Susan-- there's a good chance this will play out the same way, as in Oliver being the one in the right.

Let that for once finally work in favor of a plot I want him to be proved right on.  Though now I'm afraid they might frame Oliver as right but toss Diggle and Felicity under the bus somehow for siding with him, lol.  

[strikera0]

I have found a a new interview with Michael Emerson. I'm just copy-pasting the Cayden James-related parts:

Quote

 

Melissa Parker (Smashing Interviews Magazine): Michael, you’re a very busy man these days! Let’s discussArrow first. Why were you interested in the role of Cayden James?

Michael Emerson: Those producers, I think, had seen me on other shows, and they thought I might make a good fit as a villain on their show. We’ve talked a couple of times over the last couple of years, and I said that if the timing was right, I was available. They were willing, so I started my commutes to my job in Vancouver. It has been good though. It’s a really nice company. I’ve got to say that Canadians are, on average, really pleasant people. They’re very nice.

Melissa Parker (Smashing Interviews Magazine): You play a computer genius similar to the character of Harold Finch from Person of Interest, but Cayden James is a bad guy.

Michael Emerson: Yeah. He’s the bad side of a Mr. Finch coin, you know. He’s like Mr. Finch’s evil twin.

Melissa Parker (Smashing Interviews Magazine): Does Cayden James have any redeeming qualities?

Michael Emerson: Sure (laughs). Like all good villains, he’s brilliant, persistent, and has a sense of humor. He’s just completely amoral and has no empathy for humankind. Other than that, he’s good company. Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln (laughs).

Melissa Parker (Smashing Interviews Magazine): He has already tried to destroy the Internet. What can you say about his future plots to take over the world?

Michael Emerson: His personal mission, I believe, is more than just electronic. I think he means revenge on Oliver Queen whom he holds personally responsible for the death of his child.

Melissa Parker (Smashing Interviews Magazine): Will there be a cliffhanger for the midseason finale airing December 7?

Michael Emerson: Oh, there’s what I would call a kind of a semi-cliffhanger, which is probably appropriate for the middle of the season. But it’s not the end of Cayden James. He goes on into the second part of the season. I guess episode nine is the one you mean. Honestly, I cannot remember what we did in episode nine. It’s terrible. But I go in and play these scenes and stuff, and then I sort of erase it from my memory and get ready to play the next ones that are coming down the pike toward me.

...

Melissa Parker (Smashing Interviews Magazine): Anything else coming up for you?

Michael Emerson:  I have heavy work on Arrow between now and Christmas. But after Christmas, I’ll have an open schedule and a chance to do some reading and look at some scripts, I guess. I’m really looking forward to going down to New Orleans because Claws starts filming the first week of January. Carrie will be living down there, so I thought I would just go on down and be her personal assistant for a little while.

 

[tv echo]

Source link for above Smashing Interviews Magazine interview with Michael Emerson:
http://smashinginterviews.com/interviews/actors/michael-emerson-interview-emmy-award-winning-actor-talks-arrow-and-mozart-in-the-jungle 

[way2interested]

So is he not on Arrow anymore beyond 613?

[leopardprint]

5 hours ago, strikera0 said:

Melissa Parker (Smashing Interviews Magazine): Does Cayden James have any redeeming qualities?

Michael Emerson: Sure (laughs). Like all good villains, he’s brilliant, persistent, and has a sense of humor. He’s just completely amoral and has no empathy for humankind. Other than that, he’s good company. Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln (laughs).

It's kind of refreshing to hear an actor playing a villain say "nope just a really smart bad guy with jokes". (also see the actress who plays Rose in Get Out)

Not refreshing to hear that his motivation is another Myson. Please Arrow stop with the revenge on Oliver because of assorted dead girlfriend/dad/son/puppy/plate glass window storylines. 

[Morrigan2575]

2 hours ago, way2interested said:

So is he not on Arrow anymore beyond 613?

He might go off to offscreenville until the final episodes which film in April.

[way2interested]

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

He might go off to offscreenville until the final episodes which film in April.

Yeah, after thinking about it that's what I started figuring, although it's kind of weird that he wouldn't be involved more in 615 when the latter part of the plot usually kicks in. Would that also kind of indicate that they might take an Olympic break around 613 like they did in s2 I guess?

[Primal Slayer]

Team Arrow does seem to make some leeway by 6x13 since it looks like Black Siren may end up detained depending on how that bts KC posted goes. 

[Velocity23]

42 minutes ago, way2interested said:

Yeah, after thinking about it that's what I started figuring, although it's kind of weird that he wouldn't be involved more in 615 when the latter part of the plot usually kicks in. Would that also kind of indicate that they might take an Olympic break around 613 like they did in s2 I guess?

Well 615 is the episode Roy returns. So i am guessing that episode and however long the arc lasts are gonna be Thea exist episodes

[Simba122504]

On 12/13/2017 at 5:01 PM, Midnight Lullaby said:

Maybe they mind but since it’s a tv show in theory no character is essential. They could write Oliver off and bring Connor over if Stephen wanted to leave and the network wanted them to keep going.

I can’t share the POV because those three people aren’t interchangeable..a sister, a wife and a son are three different relationships all important..Thea knows Oliver in a way Felicity and Willaim don’t..showing her relationship with Oliver gives him more depth because it’s different from any other.

This show is dead without Amell. Dead, deceased, pushing up daisies. It cannot go on without Oliver Queen since it's about his journey, he's the lead. It started with him and it will end with him. The CW and the series creators would end the show if SA left. Same with the Flash. Grant is the Flash. He is the lead and it's about his journey first and foremost. I don't watch "Grey's Anatomy" but it's the kind of show that usually can survive without the lead, but Shonda Rhimes says the show is dead whenever Ellen Pompeo says no more. She's ready to move on.

Edited December 16, 2017 by Simba122504