Spoiler Discussion Thread

[bijoux]

You can see long dark hair flying when Tinah is tackled so I still think it's supposed to be Evelyn, only it's a stunt person, not MM.

[calliope1975]

So Oliver pushes his team away for safety in the next ep, but for whatever reasons, maybe Bratva, they reteam at the end? Or TA just shows up to help out OQ whether he likes it or not. Maybe Digg convinces him they are stronger together. Meanwhile, Felicity's gone off on her own to Helix to help in the only way she knows, but gets in too deep leading to the next ep of TA vs TF. (I'm Team Felicity by the way, forever and always.) Then, something something, stuck in the bunker, sexy flashback, maybe sexy present, and we've hit the last 3 eps of the season. 

[Sunshine]

Is it Team Arrow vs Team Felicity in a race to get Prometheus or Team Arrow trying to stop whatever Team Felicity is doing? I assumed it was them going after Prometheus different ways. Now I'm just confused.

[tv echo]

^^^
-- On how Oliver will respond to the mess that Felicity's getting into with Helix, SA: "Yeah, there's a scene - there's an episode coming up - I think it's episode 19 - which - I've forgotten the name of it right now, but it really could be called 'Team Felicity versus Team Arrow.' Um, they're both after the same thing - spoiler alert, it's Chase - but she's going about it via Helix, and Team Arrow's going about it via not Helix. And Felicity's running point for her side and Oliver's running point for his side. And it sets up - uh, it sets up a very, very interesting dynamic that we really haven't seen from them all year. Uh, and it starts to - it starts to bring a lot of the stuff that - I don't know that people have been waiting for, but - a lot of the reasons they've been very regimented towards one another is starting to come to the surface in that episode." Also, on whether Oliver & Felicity will have a better understanding of each other when all is said and done, SA: "I think Oliver and Felicity have a very good understanding of each other right now. I think that the viewers get a better understanding of why they are the way that they are." (PaleyFest, Mar. 18, 2017: KSITE TV video, page 56 of Spoilers thread, and Mar. 22, 2017 GreenArrowTV article, page 1435 of Spoiler Discussion thread)

-- Michael Ausiello: "Though Oliver has bigger fish to fry for the foreseeable future, Stephen Amell had this to say about Oliver’s take on Felicity’s recent secret-keeping: 'Look, he does trust her, but that doesn’t mean he has to agree with her.' That distinction will be put to the test in Episode 19, which is officially titled 'Dangerous Liaisons' but 'you could almost call it "Team Arrow vs. Team Felicity,”' Amell shared. Felicity and her Helix hackers and Oliver’s associates 'are both after the same objective, but after it in different ways. And that pushes us into a real exploration of why Oliver and Felicity have been behaving the way that they’ve been behaving this year.'” (Mar. 22, 2017 TVLine article, page 56 of Spoilers thread)

[calliope1975]

Do you think we're supposed to see TA as the right way versus TF as the wrong way?

[Sunshine]

I hope it's just different and neither way is better.

Thanks @tv echo

Edited March 23, 2017 by Sunshine

[finnaire]

So, I guess whatever their difference in viewpoint is, is the reason Felicity hasn't told him what she's doing?  Season 4 ended with just the two of them (and Curtis). Season 5 started with her pushing him to get a team because things weren't going back to the way they used to be. I still can't fathom what would have happened to set them at odds over how they operate. It seems like it has more to do with a change in Felicity? I would think Oliver would welcome all the help he could get and not care how/who hacked it.

Edited March 23, 2017 by finnaire

[Cleanqueen]

I think it'll be both options have pros and cons type of situation. Forget who is right or wrong, I am waiting for that Oliver and Felicity heated discussion. Give me FIRE please.

[theOAfc]

If they really go with the "oliver enjoys killing people" story they kill the character for good. Not once in the years of watching the show have i felt that Oliver liked killing people. On the contrary based on the story they told since the start but also on SA's performance i think he hated it and did it as a way to punish himself and prove to himself that he is dark and a bad person(that he doesnt deserve happiness). Him being extra harsh and violently killing villains in s1 was perceived by many as him thinking it was the only way to protect the city or the only way to right his fathers wrongs. It was in his mind the only way because in his mind he had to avenge them because based on flahsbacks thats what he was taught to do. Not once did the show imply that he liked it. In s4 oliver didnt struggle at all not killing people. And he was on the best time of his life. In season 3 he had a burden by killing Ras. In s4 Felicity seemed more willing to kill Damian than Oliver,who based on story,felt like he had to kill him. If you want to sell that someone deep down enjoys killing then you gotta actually sell it from early on and not come here 5 years later and go "whatever you saw and believed forget it,oliver is chanelling Dexter".

I feel like these writers are trying too hard to prove Arrow is dark ,edgy and ruthless and mature this season. Too much to the point of retconning the lead character's "journey". 

Edited March 23, 2017 by theOAfc

[BkWurm1]

1 hour ago, Sunshine said:

I hope it's just different and neither way is better.

Thanks @tv echo

My hope is we'll clearly see how much both sides would have done better had they worked together.  Not terribly unique but still satisfying.

Edited March 23, 2017 by BkWurm1

[BkWurm1]

32 minutes ago, theOAfc said:

If you want to sell that someone deep down enjoys killing then you gotta actually sell it from early on and not come here 5 years later and go "whatever you saw and believed forget it,oliver is chanelling Dexter".

I feel like these writers are trying too hard to prove Arrow is dark ,edgy and ruthless and mature this season. Too much to the point of retconning the lead character's "journey". 

Edited 25 minutes ago by theOAfc.

There's no way they can sell me that he is a Dexter, but sure, at the height of his trauma he went kill happy.  Per MG what the show is selling isn't anything new, just that understanding how far gone he'd been is new to Oliver.  Just not the audience.  So he's no different than who WE thought?

[statsgirl]

I wonder if Oliver is opposed to Felicity running Team Helix because 1. he's worried it's something unknown and dangerous and 2. it's something he can't control. Oliver, before this episode, was a control freak.

44 minutes ago, theOAfc said:

On the contrary based on the story they told since the start but also on SA's performance i think he hated it and did it as a way to punish himself and prove to himself that he is dark and a bad person(that he doesnt deserve happiness).

That's still possible to pull out of it, and I hope they do.  He hates who he is, a monster, but the killing is a way to confirm who he is and that's why he goes with it and accepts it as a justification of who he now is,  as opposed to genuinely likes it.  He's said a number of times he can't be with someone because of who he is and at the start of s4, he told Amanda Waller that he couldn't return to Starling City and his family because of who he had become.   But maybe that's too complex for these writers.

[Midnight Lullaby]

3 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

There's no way they can sell me that he is a Dexter, but sure, at the height of his trauma he went kill happy.  Per MG what the show is selling isn't anything new, just that understanding how far gone he'd been is new to Oliver.  Just not the audience.  So he's no different than who WE thought?

The problem is did you think he was enjoying killing in season 1? Because that's what MG was implying. That the audience knows Oliver used to be a serial killer (I don't agree on the term but I'm using it here because it was used in the tweet he replied to) when he was in the Bratva and during season 1 but Oliver didn't. If I have to take MG's idea as good then Oliver is different from who I thought he was. I don't think they were writing season 1 with that in mind so I did not see it. I could try to buy it about the FBs of the last episode but because this year they are writing with it in mind even if it's still a struggle. I can try to say Oliver was in such pain that he wanted to hurt bad people but in season 1 they didn't show it imo. So it's new to me.

[Morrigan2575]

26 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

There's no way they can sell me that he is a Dexter, but sure, at the height of his trauma he went kill happy.  Per MG what the show is selling isn't anything new, just that understanding how far gone he'd been is new to Oliver.  Just not the audience.  So he's no different than who WE thought?

I think the basic premise is that at one point Oliver liked killing, maybe it gave him satisfaction to take down a bad guy, maybe it was power, maybe it was the knowledge that each person he defeated meant he was alive. However, in the years of being back in SC he's moved beyond that. Yet, Oliver deep down fears that he's still (at his core) that kill happy person.

I don't think this retcons anything really. Oliver's defining trait is self loathing. Oliver has always viewed himself as unworthy and carried a lot of guilt. All this does, IMO is give some extra depth to the self loathing and guilt. 

BTW we also kind of got a glimpse of this Oliver in S2 Flashback,  when Oliver went crazy on the guy that Shado, even Slade and Shado were taken aback by his crazy.

Edited March 23, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[leopardprint]

58 minutes ago, theOAfc said:

I feel like these writers are trying too hard to prove Arrow is dark ,edgy and ruthless and mature this season. Too much to the point of retconning the lead character's "journey". 

To me, it really feels like someone on the production team binge watched Hannibal and S2 Daredevil (The Punisher) and then CW'd it (badly).

Also, are we supposed to draw the conclusion that Oliver actually did enjoy killing all this time? Oliver liked it pre S1/S1 but now feels bad about it? Oliver never really felt bad about it and he stopped because why? This show doesn't have the time or skill to grapple with these sorts of conveniently placed moral questions and it's annoying when they do. (Re: gun control episode)

I'm left thinking how this ties into a possible identity reveal and going into S6. I kind of think we might be done with GA for the rest of the season and he's going to have take down Chase as Oliver. Another thought I had is maybe it's the team that takes Chase down due to Oliver's legacy and a metaphor of Oliver defeating the monster within with the help of his family around him.

Edited March 23, 2017 by leopardprint

[Cleanqueen]

It'll be interesting to rewatch season 1 with this new thought in mind and see the show from a different perspective.

Although it is hard to say if he truly deep down enjoyed it or not, one thing that is certain is that Oliver didn't intentionally try to find a different way, he thought killing was the only option. And without Felicity and Diggle helping him find that way would he be the man that he is today, most definitely not. 5 years later we can now see that Oliver has been used as a weapon and it got him to the point where he was actively killing people to right some type of wrong. What we see in season 1 is he has some sort of control because he's the one making the final decisions but there was still some form of that feeling of being satisfied with a kill that existed inside of him. He had to mold himself and had to find a way to shut it because those around him were convincing him that he was more than that and that a light existed inside of him. But Oliver has never been able to truly experience those demons out in the open and that is what Chase did to him. Chase broke him and made him raw, it isn't the complete truth but some part of him still feels that Chase was probably right. 

Edited March 23, 2017 by Cleanqueen

[theOAfc]

1 hour ago, leopardprint said:

To me, it really feels like someone on the production team binge watched Hannibal and S2 Daredevil (The Punisher) and then CW'd it (badly).

Also, are we supposed to draw the conclusion that Oliver actually did enjoy killing all this time? Oliver liked it pre S1/S1 but now feels bad about it? Oliver never really felt bad about it and he stopped because why? This show doesn't have the time or skill to grapple with these sorts of conveniently placed moral questions and it's annoying when they do. (Re: gun control episode)

I'm left thinking how this ties into a possible identity reveal and going into S6. I kind of think we might be done with GA for the rest of the season and he's going to have take down Chase as Oliver. Another thought I had is maybe it's the team that takes Chase down due to Oliver's legacy and a metaphor of Oliver defeating the monster within with the help of his family around him.

It feels to me that they are basically telling the same story again and again and each time they come up with something different to present it in order to make the story seem different. In season 1 he was afraid he was just a ruthless killer then Dig and Felicity showed to him theres another way and he gained a somehow heroic purpose. In season 3 he couldnt be happy because deep down he thought he was a ruthless killer with him eventually proving to himself that he deserves happiness and embracing the fact that he is not just the Arrow,a ruthless killer vigilante but a person that loves,hopes and makes connections with people(the first three seasons did provide more development for him ,like whether or not he can be romantically involved with someone he really loves despite the danger surrounding him,whether or not he can trust other people etc). In season 4 he couldnt figure out whether or not he had light inside him because he was still deep down a killer(in season 4 i didnt even get the feeling by the season finale that they had an legit plan about his season journey),in season 5 he fears he likes killing because he is a ruthless killer. So,really to me it looks like they always come back to the same question: is he just a killer or a hero? They just try to come up with "game changing" "epic" and "never seen before" issues that they never really explore but only use to basically have oliver fear that he is just a ruthless killer. I dont really see these stories giving a real development to the character especially with how they always find something else to come up each season in order for oliver to think he is just a killer. Its an endless back and forth with the show basically wording differently on script the same story. 

It just seems to me that if they now indeed try to pull the "he enjoys killing people" storyline in order to once again have him think he is just a ruthless killer , they will open up issues with the character and the show that are beyond their skills, issues that will eventually ruin the character for good. Cause you cant just come out in the 5th season and imply he actually likes killing people as if we are supposed to believe he was suppressing his urge to get his bow and kill every random thief just cause he could,back in s3 and s4. I personally never thought of the character that way. I even thought he hated killing people but he was taught to be violent. So i truly hope Guggie is overselling this to make it look more than it actually is. 

 

Also implying oliver likes killing people is different that implying killing is his second nature. The latter one implies he is just very good at it ,because he spent a lot of time being used like this,that doesnt mean he ever really enjoyed it. So personally ,i think the show shouldnt come out on the 5th season and suddenly change the way the story was written from the start,especially since i havent seen the show implying anything like that since the pilot. Its weird. 

Edited March 23, 2017 by theOAfc

[BkWurm1]

1 hour ago, leopardprint said:

To me, it really feels like someone on the production team binge watched Hannibal and S2 Daredevil (The Punisher) and then CW'd it (badly).

Also, are we supposed to draw the conclusion that Oliver actually did enjoy killing all this time? Oliver liked it pre S1/S1 but now feels bad about it? Oliver never really felt bad about it and he stopped because why? This show doesn't have the time or skill to grapple with these sorts of conveniently placed moral questions and it's annoying when they do. (Re: gun control episode)

I'm left thinking how this ties into a possible identity reveal and going into S6. I kind of think we might be done with GA for the rest of the season and he's going to have take down Chase as Oliver. Another thought I had is maybe it's the team that takes Chase down due to Oliver's legacy and a metaphor of Oliver defeating the monster within with the help of his family around him.

I think we are supposed to think Oliver let himself think that the darkness inside of him was just something he let out in order to fight the bad guys but now he realizes he was fighting the bad guys as a way to let the darkness (aka the part that found satisfaction in the kill) out.  For me the distinction is too blurred (think chicken / egg territory) but Chase has convinced Oliver to buy into his definition rather than a more nuanced explanation. Oliver was never JUST a killer.  He was always trying to accomplish something.

Edited March 23, 2017 by BkWurm1

[calliope1975]

Since this last episode was characterized by stating that Chase was trying to "sell" Oliver something, which he eventually bought, I hope the rest of the season is finding the return receipt on that mindset. We just had Digg telling Oliver that he, Felicity, and Oliver make each other better people, and that can't be just lip service. 

He has to, at the very least, come to the realization that may be where he was, but that's not where he is now, whereas Chase is a crazypants murderer.

[catrox14]

1 hour ago, Cleanqueen said:

It'll be interesting to rewatch season 1 with this new thought in mind and see the show from a different perspective.

I actually decided to rewatch the pilot last night because I was so upset about this. I rewatched all of s1 about 3 weeks ago so it's in my mind. Even with this new "revelation" it doesn't change anything about how Oliver was in s1.  IMO he never played a layer of added 'darkness' that somehow he was enjoying or taking "pleasure" in a kill.  I mean the whole point of him stopping killing is because of Tommy. If Oliver had that darkness in him all along, seems to me that no matter if Diggle and Felicity were there to help him, he wouldn't have stopped.  I am so aggravated with this whole thing. Honestly, this is worse than a Flashpoint reset.

Oliver Queen is not Dexter Morgan, Stephen. I don't care what you try to claim now. It's a retcon. 

[BkWurm1]

I also think Oliver's "revelation" has to do with how he separated himself from how far he'd go under the hood.  So even if he knew that guy was pleased with his work, Oliver had felt he really wasn't that guy.  But now he's accepted that there is no distinction.  

I do feel that part, that he's only now realized he is responsible for all his actions and for all that he felt while doing them, that part is retconning because that revelation happened in season one when Tommy confronted him about being a killer. And again at the start of season 4 when he wasn't sure he knew how to fight the darkness without becoming the monster.  But here we are again, letting him relearn lessons.  

My biggest concern is that he will decide the only way to end the separation of man and monster is by losing the mask and exposing his secret so that he is always held accountable for his actions. Still think that makes no effing sense for all the reasons we've said before, but it feels like that's where the narrative is building toward.w

Edited March 23, 2017 by BkWurm1

[BkWurm1]

20 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I actually decided to rewatch the pilot last night because I was so upset about this. I rewatched all of s1 about 3 weeks ago so it's in my mind. Even with this new "revelation" it doesn't change anything about how Oliver was in s1.  IMO he never played a layer of added 'darkness' that somehow he was enjoying or taking "pleasure" in a kill.  I mean the whole point of him stopping killing is because of Tommy. If Oliver had that darkness in him all along, seems to me that no matter if Diggle and Felicity were there to help him, he wouldn't have stopped.  I am so aggravated with this whole thing. Honestly, this is worse than a Flashpoint reset.

Oliver Queen is not Dexter Morgan, Stephen. I don't care what you try to claim now. It's a retcon. 

I don't accept that the show is selling that Oliver is like Dexter.  And I think MG only endorsed that way of thinking cause he's an idiot when it comes to explaining the characters and Twitter is not known for nuanced discussion.

In show I think all we have is Oliver realizing he was closer to losing his humanity that he'd realized and that he'd deceived himself about the purity of his motives in the beginning when using killing to get the job done.  

I think of it like what we saw with Sara in season two.  She HATED the killing but she also found that once she was released from the LoA, she couldn't turn that part of her off so easily.   She even eventually found a way to be at peace with returning to the LoA.  I absolutely believe that part of the reason it was hard for her to stop was because killing was a solution that came with instant gratification.  The person is the problem so when they are dead end of problem.  

I think Oliver too liked taking care of business and after all his trauma, it was probably addictive to take control.  So in returning to Starling, he set circumstances in which he could keep feeding the habit...while ALSO addressing his father's list.  That's the only level of "liking" killing I'm accepting.  And so far I don't think the show has told me anything different.

[leopardprint]

19 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

My biggest concern is that he will decide the only way to end the separation of man and monster is by losing the mask and exposing his secret so that he is always held accountable for his actions. Still think that makes no effing sense for all the reasons we've said before, but it feels like that's were the narrative is building to.

Yes, the only way to be held accountable for killing dozens (hundreds?) of people is to go to prison for the rest of his life. So it's either killing is ok if they are bad people and you feel bad about it but not ok if they are bad people and you don't feel bad about it or ok if it makes a super cool action sequence? Show, pick a lane! 

[Hiveminder]

Referring to the quote from someone (MG? I'm pretty sure.) about how they hope we'll have a different view of Oliver's killing by the end of the season, is it possible that was directed, at least in part, to those viewers who were so excited to see Oliver go back to killing people like he did in season one. Like, maybe he's hoping some of the audience will come to the conclusion that, yeah, killing people at the drop of a hat is bad no matter how cool and badass you think it makes the character look?

[Morrigan2575]

Kojo Sledgehammer looks so much like Amy Acker, creepy.

Oh and I'm loving Felicity's "edgier" wardrobe.

[BkWurm1]

So we have Oliver as Mayor and Chase still in his face as well as what looks like Oliver giving Susan bad news.  

[insomniadreams88]

Please let that be the quickest break-up ever. 

Excited for more of Felicity at Helix. (But also a bit worried.)

Definitely looking forward to Lance vs. Chase in Oliver's office. Although, I also don't want Lance to end up on Chase's hit list, so be careful, Lance. Be very careful. 

[Guest]

Ew, Susan's in this? Haha. I wonder if he's gonna break up with her because it's not safe to be with him. Not what I wanted tbh. But seeing as they're still on that "Susan's a good person" nonsense, he obviously won't end things because she's horrible. He should but he won't.

Nice to see Quentin again. I kind of like that they all have to act like everything's normal and Chase isn't a sociopath. 

Edited March 24, 2017 by Guest

[BkWurm1]

9 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Kojo Sledgehammer looks so much like Amy Acker, creepy.

Oh and I'm loving Felicity's "edgier" wardrobe.

When she brings out the leather jacket, she's taking it personally.

[way2interested]

Quote

Will Felicity’s walk on the morally iffy side only push a greater wedge between her and Oliver, or possibly bring the ex-lovers closer? “It’s funny,” Guggenheim answers, “when you say it [like that], my inclination is to say: Why not both?”

A rare moment where something MG says actually gets me excited/interested.

[Mellowyellow]

Ugh why is he holding pantry moth's hand. Ick ick ick

[Mrs. de Winter]

"I realized as Chase listed the people I care about you weren't on the list.  Toodles." 

If this were a different show I would assume Snoozen would try and expose Oliver's Bravta ties and would use the tattoo as "proof".  Of course it is now gone so she would look stupid and leave for good.

Although really I don't care why she goes - just that she goes quickly (and doesn't come back). 

[LeighAn]

1 minute ago, way2interested said:

A rare moment where something MG says actually gets me excited/interested.

I'm definitely thinking we may get the passionate arguing and subtext on their relationship before we get to the talking out their feelings reunion part in 5x20 or beyond and I for one am all for it since they really skipped the angry venting part and had the politest cordial breakup ever. So bring your worst Guggie!

As for the photos- yeah stop trying to make me feel bad for Oliver and Susan when they basically only been dating for like two weeks.

[leopardprint]

19 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

 

Ew, Susan's in this? Haha. I wonder if he's gonna break up with her because it's not safe to be with him. Not what I wanted tbh. But seeing as they're still on that "Susan's a good person" nonsense, he obviously won't end things because she's horrible. He should but he won't.

 

 

"Susan, I recently discovered that I enjoy killing people and yet, you are still too awful for me."

"Susan, I was recently tortured for days and yet, that was more enjoyable than a night spent with you.

"Susan, I disappeared for days and you didn't use your investigating skills and all knowing PI to find out where I was."

Edited March 24, 2017 by leopardprint

[Guest]

I'm still waiting for Susan to feel betrayed by Oliver tbh. Or will it happen after he breaks up with her? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Just now, leopardprint said:

"Susan, I recently discovered that I enjoy killing people and yet, you are still too awful for me.

"Susan, I was recently tortured for days and yet, that was more enjoyable than a night spent with you.

"Susan, I disappeared for days and you didn't ask use your investigating skills and all knowing PI to find out where I was."

I WISH! It'll probably be more like "I'm not good enough for you." Or "You saw what happened to you. It's not safe to be with me. You deserve better."

*vomits*

[insomniadreams88]

2 minutes ago, leopardprint said:

"Susan, I recently discovered that I enjoy killing people and yet, you are still too awful for me.

"Susan, I was recently tortured for days and yet, that was more enjoyable than a night spent with you.

"Susan, I disappeared for days and you didn't ask use your investigating skills and all knowing PI to find out where I was."

"Susan, I was more worried when Chase had Felicity's glasses than when he was threatening to kill you." 

"Susan, my days of torture made me realize how idiotic it is for the mayor to date a reporter who said she'd expose him."

[Morrigan2575]

Still says, she's going to dump him, Oliver never dumps women. 

[Guest]

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

Still says, she's going to dump him, Oliver never dumps women. 

I thought the same at first but the promo pic looks the opposite? IDK.

[lemotomato]

I don't really care how or who does the dumping, I just want them done. The earlier in the episode, the better. Then she can GTFO the screen.

[insomniadreams88]

Just now, lemotomato said:

I don't really care how or who does the dumping, I just want them done. The earlier in the episode, the better. Then she can GTFO the screen.

Yep. But remember, isn't she in 519 too? UGH. 

[catrox14]

SWERVE: "Oliver, you made my boyfriend kill his wife. I can't live with that. I'll see you in Hell." /marches into Chase's office

[leopardprint]

11 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

Then she can GTFO the screen.

Sorry, she's still got some 'portin to do. 

But seriously, I don't see how Oliver doesn't dump her without looking like a dumb(er) jerk. He knows Chase already went after her because of their relationship so he cares so little he can't even bother to break up with her. Ok actually I can see it. 

ETA: Haha, catrox14, I wish she was Chase's secret girlfriend but she's too busy being a good person and a good reporter to be interesting. 

Edited March 24, 2017 by leopardprint

[Morrigan2575]

5 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

I thought the same at first but the promo pic looks the opposite? IDK.

Yeah, I don't know, history shows is on Oliver being the dumpee. In any case, I have no doubt the precious Susan will be as "good" even though no one will buy it.

[LeighAn]

1 minute ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Still says, she's going to dump him, Oliver never dumps women. 

Hmm I don't know Chase whole "You're the worst Oliver" torture porn fantasy play makes me think that Oliver is either going to let her down gently or actively get her to hate him/push her away as a way to show Oliver has believed Chase... and then he'll try and do the same to Dig and Felicity and they won't let him push them away.

[Morrigan2575]

Just now, LeighAn said:

Hmm I don't know Chase whole "You're the worst Oliver" torture porn fantasy play makes me think that Oliver is either going to let her down gently or actively get her to hate him/push her away as a way to show Oliver has believed Chase... and then he'll try and do the same to Dig and Felicity and they won't let him push them away.

Hah! Wouldn't it be hysterical of she turns on him after he dumps her (for her own safety)

[Mrs. de Winter]

11 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Still says, she's going to dump him, Oliver never dumps women. 

Agree. There is a WM quote floating around twitter (no source or I would share) about how she doesn't know how Susan overcomes the kidnapping.  Susan is still there and they (WM and who knows who else) love her and CP but Susan can trace the trauma to Oliver and that is a "hard tough thing to come back from."

Poor, poor Susan.  Good riddance.   

[LeighAn]

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

Hah! Wouldn't it be hysterical of she turns on him after he dumps her (for her own safety)

Anything that makes Oliver see and accept she is the worst I approve of!

[insomniadreams88]

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

Hah! Wouldn't it be hysterical of she turns on him after he dumps her (for her own safety)

Maybe that's why she's around in 519? So then she can use the information she gathered on him when the show was portraying her as this shady reporter, but they'll say, "Well, this wouldn't have happened if he didn't dump her. She's still a good person!" 

Where's a GIF of Thea's vomit line when I need one? 

[lemotomato]

3 minutes ago, Mrs. de Winter said:

Agree. There is a WM quote floating around twitter (no source or I would share) about how she doesn't know how Susan overcomes the kidnapping.  Susan is still there and they (WM and who knows who else) love her and CP but Susan can trace the trauma to Oliver and that is a "hard tough thing to come back from."

That's part of the article with the promo stills at tvline

[Morrigan2575]

7 minutes ago, Mrs. de Winter said:

Agree. There is a WM quote floating around twitter (no source or I would share) about how she doesn't know how Susan overcomes the kidnapping.  Susan is still there and they (WM and who knows who else) love her and CP but Susan can trace the trauma to Oliver and that is a "hard tough thing to come back from."

Poor, poor Susan.  Good riddance.   

Yeah, I saw that quote, it's what makes me think she dumps him.

Edited March 24, 2017 by Morrigan2575