Spoiler Discussion Thread

[wonderwall]

Thanks for going through all the interviews for this @lemotomato! It definitely makes me question her "all in" comment wrt Susan/Oliver. What does all in mean? It'll probably mean a couple of dates and kisses or whatever lol

Edited February 3, 2017 by wonderwall

[LeighAn]

Also Wendy:"Artemis is majorly important-she hugely impacts the team"

Marc:"Artemis is not that big a deal. Been there done that moving on"

[lemotomato]

17 minutes ago, wonderwall said:

Thanks for going through all the interviews for this @lemotomato! It definitely makes me question her "all in" comment wrt Susan/Oliver. What does all in mean? It'll probably mean a couple of dates and kisses or whatever lol

If the show keeps up with the season 3 parallels, I expect Oliver/Susan to follow in the footsteps of Felicity/Ray in that they're going to hook up, date for a while, and then break up before May sweeps.

But on the positive side, what caught my eye while going through those spoilers was actually her "maybe, I don't know when"comment about a new BC happening on the show. We saw what happened. Makes me hope that her earlier comment about "I don't know if we'll put Olicity back together this season" will turn out the same way.

Edited February 3, 2017 by lemotomato

[HighHopes]

I know there are parallels between season three and season five, but I find that season five is repeating season two too. 

In season two, Oliver met a "black canary" and bonded with her about their past/similar past. And then in the very next episode the team goes to Russia. And now in season five, Oliver met a "black canary" bonded with her, and in the next episode the team is going to Russia. 

[Cleanqueen]

So basically we should take everything she says with a grain of salt. Good to know.

[Cleanqueen]

13 minutes ago, HighHopes said:

I know there are parallels between season three and season five, but I find that season five is repeating season two too. 

In season two, Oliver met a "black canary" and bonded with her about their past/similar past. And then in the very next episode the team goes to Russia. And now in season five, Oliver met a "black canary" bonded with her, and in the next episode the team is going to Russia. 

except that black canary in season 2 didnt go to russia with the team and she didn't join the team until 2x14. Also that black canary had a history with Oliver, this one just has a similar but yet not really similar past with oliver.

[HighHopes]

6 minutes ago, Cleanqueen said:

except that black canary in season 2 didnt go to russia with the team and she didn't join the team until 2x14. Also that black canary had a history with Oliver, this one just has a similar but yet not really similar past with oliver.

Oh I know it's not an exact repeat, but the similarities are there still is all. The audience was introduced to a Black Canary via Oliver and then Team Arrow (and whoever is on it at that time) heads to Russia in the next episode. Just odd that the only time that Team Arrow has gone to Russia is directly after the episode where a Black Canary-type hero is introduced to the audience... 

[LeighAn]

Or the team are going to Russia because the season 5 flashbacks are about Russia ergo Russia ties into the thematic workings of the season and have nothing to do with or purely coincidental with repeating season 2 or Black Canary.

[Chaser]

1 hour ago, HighHopes said:

I know there are parallels between season three and season five, but I find that season five is repeating season two too. 

In season two, Oliver met a "black canary" and bonded with her about their past/similar past. And then in the very next episode the team goes to Russia. And now in season five, Oliver met a "black canary" bonded with her, and in the next episode the team is going to Russia. 

So huge important Olicity moment in 5x12? Awesome. I'll take that.

[BkWurm1]

2 hours ago, Chaser said:

So huge important Olicity moment in 5x12? Awesome. I'll take that.

Less awesome...Oliver sleeps with someone inappropriate?  

[HighHopes]

4 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Less awesome...Oliver sleeps with someone inappropriate?  

The current crack theory I've seen floating around is that Rory and Felicity sleep together in Russia with Oliver at the door when one of them leaves the room. 

[insomniadreams88]

I'm prepared for 512 to open or end with some sort of Oliver/Susan scene for the "all in." I'd prefer it to happen before she interviews Lance because after would just give me more reason to dislike Oliver right now. 

[Chaser]

I believe the only inappropriate person Oliver will be sleeping with is Reporter Stalker Snake.

I really don't believe Felicity will be sleeping with someone.

However, I am wondering if there is some type of reference to what happens in Russia stays in Russia. I don't think Olicity are sleeping together but possibly a moment.

Edited February 4, 2017 by Chaser

[insomniadreams88]

5 minutes ago, HighHopes said:

The current crack theory I've seen floating around is that Rory and Felicity sleep together in Russia with Oliver at the door when one of them leaves the room. 

I really don't think that will happen. But if it does, it would make me think Rory is definitely dying, not just leaving town. 

[HighHopes]

Just now, insomniadreams88 said:

I really don't think that will happen. But if it does, it would make me think Rory is definitely dying, not just leaving town. 

Oh I totally don't think it will happen. Maybe crack theory was the wrong phrase...joke? maybe? Completely not serious about it either way. 

[insomniadreams88]

I do have this bad feeling that Oliver is going to talk to Susan about how he just brought someone new in to his team, much like he told her about someone out there doing things differently when talking about Vigilante. I feel like with every conversation he has with her, he might as well be saying he's GA or he's at least not just the mayor. 

[MaisyDaisy]

Does anyone have a self cut off moment in their mind? 

I stepped back majorly after the BM drama, but my self mandated cut off was that I would stop watching if they ever went for Lauriver again. So that 100 episode (even though upon closer inspection wasn't particually kind to Lauriver) forced me further into retreat. But now it's if they go Tina/Oliver, if that happens I will be totally out. But I can't honastly rule out having a visceral reaction to the shady Susan sex and noping the fuck out.

With it seeming likely that Oliver will be 'all in' with Susan, and talk/gossip/theories about then trying BC/GA romance, does anyone have a set hard limit? Do you think either plot line will alienate more viewers?

i think that if Felicity's dark path plot line was overhyped and she is just sort of shuffled to the side, we will see more people reaching their limit.

[apinknightmare]

My temp cutoff is all-ins with Shady Susie. Oliver's a dumbass for being with her, and her idiotic Russian anvils coupled with her smug, punchable face makes that a no-go for me. I won't watch any of those eps but would tune right the hell in to any ep with a hint of comeuppance.

I would permanently tune out of BC/GA version 3.0. No thanks! Olicity pulled me into the show and made me love so many other things about it. Those things seem dead dead dead, and Oliver and Tinah pretty bird snuggling it up would be the end of the line for me. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by apinknightmare

[way2interested]

19 minutes ago, Chaser said:

However, I am wondering if there is some type of reference to what happens in Russia stays in Russia. I don't think Olicity are sleeping together but possibly a moment.

I asked SA a similar question at Wizard World and he joked back about how one would think that they'd reference that what happens in Russia stays in Russia, so I was thinking at least a throwaway line. 

[insomniadreams88]

Here's the craziest of all theories: Dinah's parents are Dinah (Laurel and Sara's mother) and Robert Queen. They had an affair all those years ago. Imagine the reactions to something like that. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by insomniadreams88

[MaisyDaisy]

Oh yeah, I would be there in my best frock waving a flag to watch some comeuppance. Also if Felicity's plot line is juicy, I will be all over that.

[thegirlsleuth]

37 minutes ago, HighHopes said:

The current crack theory I've seen floating around is that Rory and Felicity sleep together in Russia with Oliver at the door when one of them leaves the room. 

Ugh.  I know I said that Raglicity was my emergency backup ship, but I don't want anything to actually HAPPEN.

My line is if they ever bring back Katie Cassidy in some sort of permanent capacity, although if they move into romance territory with Oliver and Tina that's on the list, too.

[way2interested]

14 minutes ago, MaisyDaisy said:

Does anyone have a self cut off moment in their mind? 

I had cut-off moments at different parts of the series that ended up happening (s1, if Oliver-Laurel-Tommy love triangle became prominent; s2, if Sara became too prominent and if she Oliver slept together because I don't like the "new character Y is just like main character X except opposite gender...and then they sleep together!" trope; s3, if Oliver teamed up with Malcolm again; s4, if Felicity was actually in a wheelchair), but I kept going because, idk, they ended up not being as bad as I pictured them I guess? Or I just didn't care as much when it actually did happen (much like how 511 ended up for me).

Tbh, I'll probably reach a potential cut-off point again but by then they'll be something else that I'm interested in (Felicity's plot regardless if it matches EP hype, what Prometheus might do next, Lance being back, flashbacks, etc.) or I don't think it will end up being as bad (Tinah and Oliver's last scene in 511 wasn't as romance-y, Susan has been non-existent for the last 2 episodes, Felicity's bf was barely a thing, Rory and Curtis haven't been too forward in the plot, etc.). I think a bunch of things will play out pretty forward as they go on in the like/dislike category for me (Rory in 512 will probably be fun before he potentially leaves, Rene and Tinah will probably get better but not completely win me over, some other negative sweeps twist will happen but be couched in interactions or set-up that I do like, etc.)

[BkWurm1]

56 minutes ago, HighHopes said:

The current crack theory I've seen floating around is that Rory and Felicity sleep together in Russia with Oliver at the door when one of them leaves the room. 

Well, you know crack is wack, lol.  

 

37 minutes ago, MaisyDaisy said:

Does anyone have a self cut off moment in their mind? 

I stepped back majorly after the BM drama, but my self mandated cut off was that I would stop watching if they ever went for Lauriver again. So that 100 episode (even though upon closer inspection wasn't particually kind to Lauriver) forced me further into retreat. But now it's if they go Tina/Oliver, if that happens I will be totally out. But I can't honastly rule out having a visceral reaction to the shady Susan sex and noping the fuck out.

With it seeming likely that Oliver will be 'all in' with Susan, and talk/gossip/theories about then trying BC/GA romance, does anyone have a set hard limit? Do you think either plot line will alienate more viewers?

i think that if Felicity's dark path plot line was overhyped and she is just sort of shuffled to the side, we will see more people reaching their limit.

I'm not going to enjoy Oliver and Susan but it's such a temporary relationship that I know it won't be any kind of a cut off for me.  

If the show goes all in on Tina and Oliver, I'd be out.  All in though, isn't just a lunge like what happened with Sara.  Oddly, I might be better able to handle Oliver and Tina sleeping together more than them bonding and emotionally depending on each other, so if the emotional component happens before any kind of actual romantic moves, that would probably be my cut off moment.  Whereas some repeat of Oliver just wanting to be with someone and she's just kind of there and they mutually take advantage of that, I'd have to feel out the situation before I'd know if that was it for Olicity or not.     

[Trisha]

54 minutes ago, HighHopes said:

The current crack theory I've seen floating around is that Rory and Felicity sleep together in Russia with Oliver at the door when one of them leaves the room. 

I keep seeing people talk about this on Twitter. It's just wild spec and not from any credible source, right? It would make no sense (especially if it really is Rory's last episode - how many of her love interests can possibly die?)

[HighHopes]

Just now, Trisha said:

I keep seeing people talk about this on Twitter. It's just wild spec and not from any credible source, right? It would make no sense (especially if it really is Rory's last episode - how many of her love interests can possibly die?)

Oh just wild speculation. I really don't think anyone is serious about it happening. 

[BkWurm1]

Maybe Tina and Mad Dog can have a "what happens in Russia" moment and kick off their epic romance?  If they did that, I'd be willing to pretend I like Mad Dong.  

[insomniadreams88]

Rene isn't going to Russia. Remember, he's running interference for the Lance/Susan interview. 

[statsgirl]

I left after the pilot episode because the show bored me but then I was channel flipping and caught a glimpse of a blonde IT person and I was back in.

Oliver starting any kind of relationship, physical or emotional, with Tinah is my cut-off.  I've hated Felicity with Billy and my finger is on the fast forward button for Oliver/Rayporter but if he starts anything with Tinah, although I'll still hang out with your guys.  I'm not here for my OTP getting together in the last second of the last episode of the show.

3 hours ago, HighHopes said:

The current crack theory I've seen floating around is that Rory and Felicity sleep together in Russia with Oliver at the door when one of them leaves the room. 

I love it.  I don't want Rory and Felicity to actually sleep together, I just want Oliver to worry that they do.

3 hours ago, MaisyDaisy said:

i think that if Felicity's dark path plot line was overhyped and she is just sort of shuffled to the side, we will see more people reaching their limit.

After the last episode, where they hyped that she would get Diggle out of prison and she didn't have a single scene with him, I'm worried that her plot line was very over-hyped to keep Felicity fans from leaving.  Maybe if she were working with Vigilante as we were guessing it might be better, but I can't see them spending much time on her when she's involved with a group of unknown (female?) hackers when they're trying to sell WD, the new Black Canary and new! improved! Mr. Terrific along with the big bads.

The hacktivist storyline is such a weird one in today's 2017.  I'm sure the writers thought it was a great idea back in the summer -- Felicity is going back to her hacktivist roots and take down bad guys -- but today people just don't seem to care if they are shamed publicly even though you'd think they would with the "alternative facts"s (some of the creatives at #bowlinggreenmassacre are very funny) and taking from the public purse.  I really think Felicity's dark arc is going to be more of a meow than a roar.

Edited February 4, 2017 by statsgirl

[wonderwall]

From what I've seen at least, the 'crack theory' that's been spreading around in twitter is more people thinking of how ridiculous it is than anything else. TBH I tend to not believe the people who spoiled a 'sex scene' that didn't happen, thus making the fandom miserable for such a long time. (and no, the sex scene didn't happen according to SA and WM). 

[LeighAn]

1 minute ago, wonderwall said:

From what I've seen at least, the 'crack theory' that's been spreading around in twitter is more people thinking of how ridiculous it is than anything else. TBH I tend to not believe the people who spoiled a 'sex scene' that didn't happen, thus making the fandom miserable for such a long time. (and no, the sex scene didn't happen according to SA and WM). 

Didn't it start by someone mocking the people who claimed to have inside sources spoilers about 5x05 and the Oliver/Susan sex scenario that never happened. I saw some one making up random "spoilers" as a tongue in cheek way and I think Raglicity was one of them. 

But yeah Rory and Felicity are about as chemistry-less as Tinah and Oliver. They are practically incestuous IMO.

[wonderwall]

13 hours ago, LeighAn said:

Didn't it start by someone mocking the people who claimed to have inside sources spoilers about 5x05 and the Oliver/Susan sex scenario that never happened. I saw some one making up random "spoilers" as a tongue in cheek way and I think Raglicity was one of them. 

 

Basically the rumors were:

• Oliver would have sex with Susan after finding out about Felicity's boyfriend
• Oliver would also be drunk at the time
• Susan would be gone by episode 7

None of which happened...

So why believe these people who actively spread misery in the fandom for weeks for nothing? 

Who knows...

Edited February 4, 2017 by wonderwall

[Mellowyellow]

Anything between Oliver and Tina and I'm out, although I think you guys are awesome so I'd still read the forum (assuming there are any of you left!).

I'm going to vet all the episodes from now on though to see what the more positive members say before I watch! If they are raging I ain't watching!

I've got this feeling that s5 is a write off and nothing good will happen Felicity or Olicity wise. My hope is that it doesn’t descend into super super awfulness (Oliver and Tina bond emotionally or hook up). I'd read the forum to see what the goss is for S6 because I think if they want to repent for this season they'll do it in season 6. If s6 interviews and spoilers remain awful I think that's pretty much it. 

ETA: I hope that nice spoiler person comes back with spoilers because they are accurate  (minus the tone of the scene) and I want to be prepared for all the crap that's heading our way. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by Mellowyellow

[HighHopes]

nevermind. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by HighHopes

[kes0704]

3 hours ago, MaisyDaisy said:

Does anyone have a self cut off moment in their mind? 

I've had one foot out the door this season and even though I wasn't a fan of Felicity/Billy and I dislike the idea of Oliver/Susan going "all in" I can FFWD through without missing too much of the show and plot. 

But, an Oliver /Tinah romance would be the end of the line for me because I have no desire to watch Oliver and BC3.0.

[catrox14]

I don't have a cutoff point. It's really mostly I just stop caring about the characters  so I stop watching. I've always been here for Oliver but if they continue to destroy him, I'll be out.

[MaisyDaisy]

1 hour ago, statsgirl said:

I love it.  I don't want Rory and Felicity to actually sleep together, I just want Oliver to worry that they do.

That would be hilarious, we need a little romantic misunderstanding comedy on the show. Oliver being all passive aggressive toward a clueless Rory, giving Felicity speaking looks and she is all 'what the frack are you doing with your face right now Oliver?'.

Somebody should fic that!

[Velocity23]

5 hours ago, HighHopes said:

The current crack theory I've seen floating around is that Rory and Felicity sleep together in Russia with Oliver at the door when one of them leaves the room. 

that is the most ridiculous thing. Especially considering this might be Rorys last episode. And this is most likely the episode the prayer comes in place and they might touch Havenrock also. Especially since the same circle was wrong on several occasions not just the oliver and reporter hooking up in 5x05 after he finds out about Felicity's bf.  

 

I find it more believable that Oliver/reporter might have a lunge at the end of the episode 5x12. Since i dont see any indication reporter is in 5x13. 

 

There were more reliable spoilers posted on twitter. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by Velocity23

[LeighAn]

Right now I'm not at cut off point. I think quality overall has gone down and the show is less enjoyable and I don't care as much when character combinations I like aren't together in scenes or storylines and I'm not interested or think the show requires new characters. But I've still found elements to enjoy each episode so as long as I still have elements I can hang around a little longer in wait for the things I love to come back -Olicity OTA.

That being said if I get the impression they are getting rid of elements of the show I like the best OTA Olicity and replaced it for stuff that I'm really against then I'll be gone too. 

 I'm not a conspiracy theory person by nature and I feel like some mistake simple explanations for things happening in the show for elaborate unproven worst case conspiracy theories which causes a big Debbie Downer mood which does make it slightly harder to enjoy the show because I find myself feeling obligated to watch the show through that lense. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by LeighAn

[BkWurm1]

Quote

That being said if I get the impression they are getting rid of elements of the show I like the best OTA Olicity and replaced it for stuff that I'm really against then I'll be gone too.

Yeah, that's really the heart of it for me.  Sadly though, I feel like they have gotten rid of OTA on a regular basis going back to mid season two and only break it out every once and awhile.  (And less and less now)

Which IMO is a huge mistake.  They recognized that they had not just Oliver but a whole trio of popular characters on the team and instead of letting the winning formula continue, they tried to capitalize on the character's individual popularity, often splitting them off to prop other characters or to do their own unconnected storyline.  Which was fine if they remembered to always refresh the well of goodwill to these characters by going back to the original winning combo often enough so that it isn't just a fond but distant memory, but instead they keep pushing new people without revitalizing the bonds between the original characters.

I keep reading in certain places that the original cast members are feeling stale, but I swear it's because the new characters and plot lines suck the life from them and the show isn't recharging the characters by featuring the original relationships anymore that made me love the characters and show in the first place.  I feel like they've forgotten that they have to keep feeding these older, original relationships as well as servicing the newbies.  

And it would be soo easy just to slip in at least one OTA scene in each episode.  It doesn't have to be directly episode related even, just bonding moments so that I get recharged on my love of all the characters and then I'll more appreciate the new relationships and side plots the show wants them to prop.  

They could even include the newbies as long as they learn to mix character interactions up.  

Sigh.  Even if they waved a wand and put Oliver and Felicity back together next week, this show still won't have solved its problems. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by BkWurm1

[LeighAn]

@BkWurm1 I absolutely agree that Olicity together won't fix the show, because I don't think the shows problems begin and end with Olicitys status.

Abd one of the things I think the writers have been good about is always giving Olicity a moment every Ep between the two of them whether it be big or small to keep them alive within the show. I don't see why they couldn't do the same with OTA except that they gave Dig the prison storyline probably to free up room for the newbies and allow Olivers leadership to shine.

Something I will say is that call me bias but having Olicity together and OTA scenes makes it easier for me to enjoy the show while overlooking the flaws because they are just that magical together. Like I enjoyed season 3 regardless of the massive plotting problems simply because we got so much good Olicity story.

Im sort of cheap like that haha. I've accepted long ago that this show while having its moments of brilliance is never going to be Mad Men so Id much rather watch it with my ship making heart eyes at each other and my faves taking up all the screen time.

That being said I think the newbies will forever change the dynamics of the show and I believe stuff like OTA Delicity Doliver won't be the same again because newbies like Tinah and Wild Dong and Curtis will always butt in. I think Olicity will be more protected then OTA unfortunately.

[Chaser]

5 hours ago, Velocity23 said:

that is the most ridiculous thing. Especially considering this might be Rorys last episode. And this is most likely the episode the prayer comes in place and they might touch Havenrock also. Especially since the same circle was wrong on several occasions not just the oliver and reporter hooking up in 5x05 after he finds out about Felicity's bf.  

 

I find it more believable that Oliver/reporter might have a lunge at the end of the episode 5x12. Since i dont see any indication reporter is in 5x13. 

 

There were more reliable spoilers posted on twitter. 

Reliable spoilers?

I went around twitter and the only thing I found were people saying Tinah is everywhere in the next few episodes. She is bonding with Diggle in 5x13, Oliver is playing Mayor in 5x14 so she can get her costume, etc.

Im also seeing she is going to be in 6 episodes. Where is that number coming from?

Edited February 4, 2017 by Chaser

[Velocity23]

3 minutes ago, Chaser said:

I went around twitter and the only thing I found were people saying Tinah is everywhere in the next few episodes. She is bonding with Diggle in 5x13, Oliver is playing Mayor in 5x14 so she can get her costume, etc.

The bonding with Diggle was already confirmed by DR at HVFF in Atlanta. So everybody expected that. But yeah expect the things that were posted about Tinah to come true. 

[ComicFan777]

:( I would rather watch Delicity bonding instead of Diggle/Tina bonding any day of the week.

[Velocity23]

4 minutes ago, ComicFan777 said:

:( I would rather watch Delicity bonding instead of Diggle/Tina bonding any day of the week.

Basically a repeat of L/D bonding while Oliver and Felicity were in Ivy Town. 

Since we didnt even get a Delicity scene after 5x11 i am not expecting much. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by Velocity23

[LeighAn]

8 minutes ago, Velocity23 said:

The bonding with Diggle was already confirmed by DR at HVFF in Atlanta. So everybody expected that. But yeah expect the things that were posted about Tinah to come true. 

Then I can expect Tina and Oliver to make the sweet sweet love because that's mostly what Twitter freaks out over when talking about Tina :p

For real though I saw the "spoilers" that @Chaser was talking about and that was coming from the person who was making up stuff to mock others who claim to have spoiler sources. It was pretty tongue and cheek joke stuff.

I honestly am not sure anyone on Twitter knows anything credible.

[Velocity23]

9 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Then I can expect Tina and Oliver to make the sweet sweet love because that's mostly what Twitter freaks out over when talking about Tina :p

For real though I saw the "spoilers" that @Chaser was talking about and that was coming from the person who was making up stuff to mock others who claim to have spoiler sources. It was pretty tongue and cheek joke stuff.

I honestly am not sure anyone on Twitter knows anything credible.

Just wait and see. But i would rather trust that person than someone whose source was proven wrong on 2 occasions already. 

Edited February 4, 2017 by Velocity23

[Morrigan2575]

16 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Then I can expect Tina and Oliver to make the sweet sweet love because that's mostly what Twitter freaks out over when talking about Tina :p

For real though I saw the "spoilers" that @Chaser was talking about and that was coming from the person who was making up stuff to mock others who claim to have spoiler sources. It was pretty tongue and cheek joke stuff.

I honestly am not sure anyone on Twitter knows anything credible.

If you're talking about who/what I think, not made up.

[bijoux]

I'm at a loss here. Who said what that has happened or it's credible it will happen?

[LeighAn]

7 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

If you're talking about who/what I think, not made up.

Really? My bad.

I don't know, I'm not sure what the rules are on posting people's Twitter accounts in terms of privacy so I won't post.

But I just figured since the person was just having a conversation about people who claim to know spoilers on the internet re:5x05 and was joking about "sources who know sources who have spoilers recieved from other sources" before posting spoilers themselves I just assumed they were being tongue in cheek *shrug*

Edited February 4, 2017 by LeighAn