S03.E07: Precise Graphix

[Tara Ariano]

A Pennsylvania firm that specializes in graphic design, fabrication and installation is losing money even though it generates millions of dollars in sales.

[Primetimer]

And other Tinder Questions about the latest The Profit. Now with bonus Lemonis-trolling!

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[Gregg247]

This was an excellent episode.  I felt like I really learned something from watching how Marcus turned the kind-of directionless business into a superstar (plus, he got some discounted work done on his other businesses!). 

 

This was one of those companies where I was really rooting for them to succeed, to the point that I felt deflated when Marcus started finding faults with their work at Camping World (he was right, though--it looked good from across the room, but shabby up-close).  Side note--it seems to me that an RV company should have better colors than Blockbuster Video-style blue and gold.  Maybe some greens/olives/browns/tans instead to go with the outdoor feel.

 

I liked Dean, but wasn't sure why he was responsible for EVERYTHING, not just the design.  If he designs well, but the fabricators do a poor job, should that be his fault, too?  Marcus wanted to fire him at one point, but all I kept thinking was, "Go hire a QC guy to be the go-between for Dean and fabrication/installation."

 

Anyway, I think this is my favorite episode so far.  Nice people who need help, get that help from Marcus, and succeed, while we at home learn some useful business lessons.

[Amarsir]

My favorite episode as well. I can't believe it was only an hour long because of how much process we got to see.

 

I also enjoyed Marcus walking through the valuation like that. I did think a 3x Earnings multiplier was low considering the revenue and potential to improve margins and grow, but when his actual offer was closer to 6x ($270k for 1/3) that seemed fair.  I doubt Marcus could simply spend $450,000 and that little time and get a going business as good as what he ended up with here.

 

ASL guy from last year must be kicking himself for being so obtuse with Marcus. All he had to do was play along and say "No Marcus, I value your partnership way more than your purchases!" and these multi-million dollar contracts would have been his.  There certainly wasn't a "no leadership" problem there.  (Though I do think the 3d signs are much more interesting than anything ASL did.)

 

I liked Dean, but wasn't sure why he was responsible for EVERYTHING, not just the design.  If he designs well, but the fabricators do a poor job, should that be his fault, too?  Marcus wanted to fire him at one point, but all I kept thinking was, "Go hire a QC guy to be the go-between for Dean and fabrication/installation."

I could see it going either way. Yes, there could be an intermediary to check this stuff. On the other hand, some problems start before that like bad seam placement. And since "Is this what you asked for?" would require a lot of Dean's input anyway, and he's a partner, and they were trying to split up all oversight between the brothers, it made sense to put QC on him.

[eddy]

I agree - it's a good episode.  And no murals!

I think Dean got more criticism than he deserved.  He's obviously got the ability to come up with great concepts.  With the right software those concepts can be turned into manufacturing drawings that show exactly how everything fits together.  It was as if the workers were going strictly off the concept drawings for Camping World.

The two "tests" to show their abilities before getting the check was a new twist for this show.  Reminded me of the Apprentice a little bit.

[selhars]

I agree with what's been said so far. Good episode. Great people. No one was biplar. No DEEP emotional issues, no MAJOR dysfunction that I saw. (I came in half way through the episode) Marcus was fine for the most part.

 

And I also thought Dean got too much heat for bad fabrication. Fabricators need to THINK also. Sort of...if I told you to jump off a bridge would you do that too? I mean we're not designers OR fabricators. But I'm sure WE know you don't want a SEAM in the middle of a word sign!!!! THAT is one mistake...that's so basic I don't even see how it happened. Why would it even be cut that way? 

 

Now, the tree poles....was that an issue of the choice of the material they chose to use to make it? ....OR design itself. THe DESIGN looked "OK" -- the fabrication looked off. Example: the leaves and branches being chintzy....I suppose that's on Dean because maybe he didn't put enough on the tree. But who doesn't know a tree with four branches....is not as full as a tree with 12 branches? And the tree bark....that looked as if it just wasn't wrapped correctly. If it was the design -- couldn't you just LOOK at the draft and see...maybe we should fill in the tree top....If it was the fabrication....(meaning the design is good you just choice the wrong material to use, the wrong mil of plastic, or the wrong fabric for the tree bark, etc).....well then that's a quality control check WOULD have or SHOULD have caught that.

 

As for hiring a QC person....I think they're going to need another liaison anyway, because if they get as busy as Marcus is planning for Dean won't physically be able to design AND oversee fabrication. There just won't be enough time in the day...to meet with clients, research, plan, come up with a design, meet again tweak various designs in the pipe line, get approvals...AND oversee EVERY step of fabrication. He going to HAVE to have a right-hand person.

 

Now as for the designs...personally I thought they were TOO BUSY. I don't need all that hitting me in the face when I walk into a store.

Camping World....I get the displays. Great. Wonderful. Granted, I've never been to a CE store, so MAYBE I'd "get it" if I went in, in person. I was trying to think of a store that has THAT much going on...with signage THAT big and THAT bold. All I could think of was sports Authority or REI.....and I dont' remember being so assaulted right from the door. That's all.

 

Same for the AutoMax design. He told the Athans Motors guy in season one he had too much design going on. And this AutoMax design was an assault on the senses. I mean cars on the wall, tire designs around the poles, naming the offices....Let's just say that wouldn't be my kind of car dealership.

 

I prefer a more tailored, classic style of retail design. I'd be afraid to see what he'd do for Courage b, or Crumbs, or heaven help us, Pete's candy.

But I do think Dean is a talented designer ...so if "over the top" is your style, he's your man.

[Amarsir]

Same for the AutoMax design. He told the Athans Motors guy in season one he had too much design going on. And this AutoMax design was an assault on the senses. I mean cars on the wall, tire designs around the poles, naming the offices....Let's just say that wouldn't be my kind of car dealership.

I was really hoping Dean's design would look something like this:

 

It just would have been too amusing to go putting a sky back on the ceiling.

[eddy]

I tend to agree that some designs are over the top.  I think there is a fine line between an attractive store environment and one that is overwhelming.

 

The danger of having too much "flash" is that customers realize the store overhead is embedded in the product pricing.  That's why so many people shop at the mall and check for lower prices on Amazon, while in the store, before buying.  It's why customers are willing to shop in a warehouse - I suspect Costco goes out of their way to look barebones to promote the idea their product markup is minimal.

 

I enjoyed this episode, but it  was another "Watch Marcus build an empire" story.  He was obviously looking for a company like this to support his other businesses.  If you're going to spend money on remodeling multiple businesses, may as well keep it in the family.

 

We've had two episodes in a row with sane owners.  But looking at the previews for next week, I think it's back to crazy town.

[Jesse]

I'm glad Marcus finally got his signage business! But I do wonder if all of his businesses have to be blue and yellow??

[rehoboth]

I, too, really enjoyed this episode.  I found myself rooting for the brothers at Camping World and was disappointed when the errors were found.  It was really great to go through the process with them and to see how Marcus pushed them both.  Marcus didn't come in and re-do the warehouse or bring in a fancy printer and call it a day.  All in all, very satisfying.

 

I was very glad to hear the younger brother talking a lot near the end of the show - something he wasn't doing earlier on.  And the older brother seemed to take charge.  Two good shows about (very different) brothers this year.

[Lola16]

I wonder if Dean got a lot of heat for the production because previously he had his hand in everything and wasn't doing it well.  While I agree that Dean should be responsible for the execution (he's the designer in a small shop, he has to be sure that what he designs, the team can produce), I think the fabricators and installers need to step up as well.  If something looks crappy (like the sparse trees) or if there's a seam in a bad place (like the middle of a word and that word is the first thing customers see), they need to speak up.  Perhaps they did and were shot down many times before?  We didn't get much drama this episode (thankfully) so hard to know.

 

While there were no graffiti murals, the auto shop looked like sticker murals with the columns.  Way over done.  And the half car jutting out of a wall?  Too much.  Just as ugly and tacky as the original design.  I like the idea of the rooms being named after cars.  Hopefully those are cars that they do carry (when they have stock). 

 

Color wise - yea, it did look like Blockbuster. 

[Lola16]

Sarah - the tests felt very Apprentice like which is where I first 'met' Marcus. And Dean needed his feet held to the fire as a designer because he's also a co-owner and he shouldn't design stuff his people can't make. That said, if these workers have been there as long as it seemed, they should know better than to produce sub-par product.

Edited July 2, 2015 by Lola16

[sarthaz]

Great episode!  I hope the show continues in this direction.

 

As for Dean getting too much heat, I disagree.  His job was to be in charge of the whole design team.  That means not just creating the designs but ensuring they're properly executed from start to finish.  If a fabricator isn't doing his job, he needs to be re-trained or replaced by Dean.  Or Dean needs to reevaluate how he communicates his needs to the fabricator.  Ultimately, it's his responsibility.  You can't own a third of the company and be head of the design department (for a design company!) and not be responsible for the failures of your employees.  I don't think Marcus would have "fired" him per se, but he would have had to demote him to just a designer (not a department head), reduce his salary, and hire him a supervisor.  Depending on how Dean handled the demotion, it may have been just as good as firing him.

[attica]

One thing this ep really hammered home for me is that it is a very good thing my own living does not depend on visual design. I do not have the eye for it, nor the patience to eradicate every sign's seams.  But you know what? Separation of labor is what makes human civilization even possible. 

 

I did notice and wonder at the atchety awning on the PG storefront. Tens of thousands for new equipment, and you can't patch or replace the awning?

[selhars]

 

While there were no graffiti murals, the auto shop looked like sticker murals with the columns.  Way over done.  And the half car jutting out of a wall?  Too much.  Just as ugly and tacky as the original design.  I like the idea of the rooms being named after cars.

 

^^ Yes naming the rooms after cars would be fine...(as dean said you could say we'll meet in XYZ room)...but that AND all the rest? Too much.

 

And yes I'm still stuck on the seam in the middle of the first big, major sign people would see when they walk in the door. Still can't believe that.

 

IF the company grows like Marcus (and they) want eventually Dean WON'T be able to do it all. It just won't be possible. He'll either have to hire more designers (and still over see and approve the final design) ....and concentrate more on the fabrication....OR.....still personally do the designs....and get a fabrication manager for day to day building...and just approve fabrication at various stages. (to make sure is stay true to the design) I'm forseeeing a fabrication manager that would be Deans right hand person.

Edited July 2, 2015 by selhars

[nobodyyoucare]

 

Same for the AutoMax design. He told the Athans Motors guy in season one he had too much design going on. And this AutoMax design was an assault on the senses. I mean cars on the wall, tire designs around the poles, naming the offices....Let's just say that wouldn't be my kind of car dealership.

The problem was that the design on Athans Motors was wasting space. It didn't make you think you were walking into a car dealership but a car club. Pete Athans didn't get that when people buy a car they want it to be quick and painless. Not a place to chill and talk about cars.

 

Marcus's Automatch under Prescise matches more of the lines of dealerships that want a unique look. Do a search and you will find similar. For example. http://www.bmwblog.com/2011/05/28/dedicated-mini-dealership-features-dramatic-design-and-fun/ 

 

For camping world Marcus wanted something different that empathisized elements of the camping lifestyle rather then look like every other chain that sold camping supplies. 

[clod]

so he's in charge of design. and he's responsible for fabrication, so he must be in charge of that, too. and he's responsible for installation, so he must be in charge of that, too. ?

was the manager-brother put in charge because he had less experience?????

the manager looked like he was giving a rehearsed speech at the meeting near the end of the show. he started the show by not wanting to seek out new business. really. I wonder if he saw the clips of his early self, and decided to fake it near the end so he would look good.

the car dealership design looked too busy, IMO.

[Endeavour]

What struck me was how similar the designs for the camping store and auto store were. If I'm remembering correctly, both had the large circular design element when you first enter, both had something jutting out of a wall (car and RV) and both had the poles wrapped with some design element. I can't remember if each place had a pamphlet stand/display in the entry and if the color schemes were the same.

I agree with those who think the designs were too busy. Some good elements but they could be toned down a bit. Though, it's probably difficult to get a feel for that without actually being in the stores.

Glad they were able to pull it off. Looked like the employees were a hardworking good group of people.

[rehoboth]

What struck me was how similar the designs for the camping store and auto store were. If I'm remembering correctly, both had the large circular design element when you first enter, both had something jutting out of a wall (car and RV) and both had the poles wrapped with some design element. I can't remember if each place had a pamphlet stand/display in the entry and if the color schemes were the same.

I agree with those who think the designs were too busy. Some good elements but they could be toned down a bit. Though, it's probably difficult to get a feel for that without actually being in the stores.

Glad they were able to pull it off. Looked like the employees were a hardworking good group of people.

 

To be fair to the designer (Dean/Keith?), everything he does is presented to the customer for approval before it is fabricated.  They may have given him direction to have it that "busy".  At least, everyone seemed to like it at the store.

 

It's always nice to leave the Profit with deserving people getting a hand up.

[mojito]

Since The Profit is known to many, it's nice that we can skip all the "who contacted Marcus?" and the character who refuses to accept change and spend more time on what is making these companies improve. We get zeroed into the problems and the solutions and have less personal drama. 

[Process]

While watching the episode I thought that Dean was taking too much of a beating, that it was too much of a one person blame vesus a process focus.  However, I believe that Lemonis helped Dean out immensely by blaming him.  It was undoubtably great pressure, but in the end Lemonis was gracious in his judgement.  He said that he would not do the deal if Camping World was not done correctly.  Well, Camping World wasn't done correctly but a deal was made in the end.  Lemonis was using motivation techniques on both brothers and motivation techniques always feel forced to me.  The biggest problem with PG was the leadership/people vacuum.  All the pieces were there.  They did not really need Lemonis' money, but they needed help in leadership development.

 

Someone else here already said that Lemonis was able to get far more out of his deal if he could get the brothers to lead.  Money for new equipment, that is pretty easy.  Getting people to change their behavior, that is much more difficult.

 

We haven't seen Lemonis do this so forcefully before, because the situations were different.  Mr. Anthony and Mr. FuelF never qualified to get some of Lemonis' tough love.  Others did not need it.

[rehoboth]

While watching the episode I thought that Dean was taking too much of a beating, that it was too much of a one person blame vesus a process focus.  However, I believe that Lemonis helped Dean out immensely by blaming him.  It was undoubtably great pressure, but in the end Lemonis was gracious in his judgement.  He said that he would not do the deal if Camping World was not done correctly.  Well, Camping World wasn't done correctly but a deal was made in the end.  Lemonis was using motivation techniques on both brothers and motivation techniques always feel forced to me.  The biggest problem with PG was the leadership/people vacuum.  All the pieces were there.  They did not really need Lemonis' money, but they needed help in leadership development.

 

Someone else here already said that Lemonis was able to get far more out of his deal if he could get the brothers to lead.  Money for new equipment, that is pretty easy.  Getting people to change their behavior, that is much more difficult.

 

We haven't seen Lemonis do this so forcefully before, because the situations were different.  Mr. Anthony and Mr. FuelF never qualified to get some of Lemonis' tough love.  Others did not need it.

 

I almost totally agree.  I do think the brothers knew how to run the business but they didn't know how to grow the business.  It seems that they got to a certain point in their original growth and then quality issues set in.  The one brother was loathe to expand because he could see the end result going down.  The designer brother probably got stuck in a rut doing the same ol', same ol' day in and day out for supermarkets.  Loved the 'tough love' from Marcus.

 

This is one of my shows that I have gotten my husband to start watching.  He says the same thing after most of them - "Marcus really knows how to handle people."  I think my husband is watching and secretly taking notes.

[Process]

Rehoboth said "I do think the brothers knew how to run the business but they didn't know how to grow the business."

 

I was going to disagree with you on the basis that the business as it existed before Lemonis arrived was only earning 4% on sales and did not have up-to-date equipment.

 

But the brothers did take $160,000 and turn it into a business valued between $540,000 and $810,000* after 11 years.  This is a compound annual growth rate of between 11.3% and 15.6%.  That's a great return assuming that they have been paid a salary every year.  If they were not able to draw a salary, then this CAGR is less impressive because they were subsidizing it and their actual investment is higher than $160,000.

 

*$810,000 from Lemonis' offer of $270,000 for 1/3 of the company.  $540,000 just to provide a lower range of value assuming that Lemonis' final offer was somehow generous ($540k is not that far off Lemonis' initial valuation of $160k to pay back Keith & Tina plus $270 for the company).