One is the Loneliest Number: Unpopular GG Opinions

[readster]

10 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

That would have been a great idea. Lorelai has always wanted to do it alone without accept help from anyone especially her parents. Finding out in the pilot despite all of her hard work she couldn't swing the money herself would have been a huge hit. I really hate when they make Lorelai dumb on stuff she would already know because she lived in that world for seventeen or eighteen years or how dumb money works in the common man world because she's lived in that world for fifteen years. I would have loved if Lorelai got a scene similar to the Rory got after she wrote the article about the rich which Logan pointed out that she was part of it. Lorelai needed that every bit as much as Rory. 

Another thing and this was brought up in the final episode of the revival when Rory confronts Christopher over all the bullshit he did their entire life. How Chris said that Lorelai wanted to always do things "her way" and no matter what she was never going to change that. It was right there where the line should have been: "Your grandparents, me, my parents wanted to keep remaindering her what her life had "been like" and that screwed things up for everyone". That's what the Ps seemed to screw up, keep saying that Lorelai couldn't truly escape where she came from despite everything. However... everyone went about it such a stupid way from: "what would our friends thing" to "but I walked away from that life" and never once just went: "You know what, things are what they are" but then in the show runners thought process that would have made things boring. 

[junienmomo]

I’ve been rethinking my belief that Lorelai wanted to do everything by herself. 

Hartford help was all strings, and she was treated as an incompetent failure who ruined Christopher’s life and nearly destroyed her parents’ position in the social order.

Who wouldn’t reject that “help?”

She happily and gratefully took a lot of assistance from Mia, so much that it would have been reasonable for her co-workers to feel they were treated badly.

There’s a cloud about how the rest of the townies helped, but it’s easy to believe that she got more help than just free food and home repairs from Luke.

What she desperately needed was basic household finance and lessons in not spending your small income on crap.

[Guest]

Re the Sookie stuff, she had some business sense about running the hotel in Season 3 when they went to the meeting at the hotel.  After that though, they seemed to act like her contribution was just cooking - she hired too many staff, she wasted money when she couldn't accept they should cut lunch, Lorelai didn't include her on information like being far behind on paying Tom, etc.  They were not good partners.  I think it would have made more sense storywise for them to have had Lorelai own the inn and then maybe have Sookie be an employee or a minority partner - like 20% or so.

[andromeda331]

6 hours ago, deaja said:

Re the Sookie stuff, she had some business sense about running the hotel in Season 3 when they went to the meeting at the hotel.  After that though, they seemed to act like her contribution was just cooking - she hired too many staff, she wasted money when she couldn't accept they should cut lunch, Lorelai didn't include her on information like being far behind on paying Tom, etc.  They were not good partners.  I think it would have made more sense storywise for them to have had Lorelai own the inn and then maybe have Sookie be an employee or a minority partner - like 20% or so.

She doesn't seem to remember she was a partner in Always A Godmother but Never a God episode when she didn't want Jackson's family to stay with them for the christening. Lorelai has to remind her of that when suggesting they stay at the inn.

[readster]

16 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

She doesn't seem to remember she was a partner in Always A Godmother but Never a God episode when she didn't want Jackson's family to stay with them for the christening. Lorelai has to remind her of that when suggesting they stay at the inn.

They did just some major odd things with Sookie at times. I also remember when they had their first kid and the "mean nanny" was just along the lines of: "Who in their right mind, new parent or not, would hire this type of person." Hell, I still don't get why the Gilmores didn't have a spot where NO MAID would want to work with them. I'm sorry, but word gets out about places you SHOULDN'T WORK FOR. The "mean nanny" was gone one episode later where it looked like she was about to move in and kick Jackson to the street. Same goes with the Lord of the Rings birthday party that Sookie was in charge of and then goes into a panic about: "I'm not going to be a good mother" moment. Which you can understand, but the way Sookie went, you were on Lorelai's side with: "Kids are not going to eat this, what are you thinking?" "You are better than this." 

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, readster said:

They did just some major odd things with Sookie at times. I also remember when they had their first kid and the "mean nanny" was just along the lines of: "Who in their right mind, new parent or not, would hire this type of person." Hell, I still don't get why the Gilmores didn't have a spot where NO MAID would want to work with them. I'm sorry, but word gets out about places you SHOULDN'T WORK FOR. The "mean nanny" was gone one episode later where it looked like she was about to move in and kick Jackson to the street. Same goes with the Lord of the Rings birthday party that Sookie was in charge of and then goes into a panic about: "I'm not going to be a good mother" moment. Which you can understand, but the way Sookie went, you were on Lorelai's side with: "Kids are not going to eat this, what are you thinking?" "You are better than this." 

Right? I don't know what the hell Sookie was thinking with that menu. The green mac and cheese? You don't need to be parent to know that no kid in his or right mind would touch that with a ten foot pole. And rum cake WTF?

[readster]

50 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Right? I don't know what the hell Sookie was thinking with that menu. The green mac and cheese? You don't need to be parent to know that no kid in his or right mind would touch that with a ten foot pole. And rum cake WTF?

The rum cake was what put it over the edge. I could get the green mac & cheese, but the run cake? Seriously? 

[Katy M]

5 hours ago, readster said:

Same goes with the Lord of the Rings birthday party that Sookie was in charge of and then goes into a panic about: "I'm not going to be a good mother" moment. Which you can understand, but the way Sookie went, you were on Lorelai's side with: "Kids are not going to eat this, what are you thinking?" "You are better than this." 

And it really made no sense.  Lorelai pointed out that the reason that she knew this was because she had an 8 year old not that long ago.  I got the impression that Lorelai and Sookie have been friends for years, ergo she either knew what an 8 year old would eat because most people do, or she tried to feed Rory some of that stuff and would have known that way.

[peacheslatour]

26 minutes ago, Katy M said:

And it really made no sense.  Lorelai pointed out that the reason that she knew this was because she had an 8 year old not that long ago.  I got the impression that Lorelai and Sookie have been friends for years, ergo she either knew what an 8 year old would eat because most people do, or she tried to feed Rory some of that stuff and would have known that way.

And all of us were kids at some point. That stuff she was serving was crazy. She got that gig, she planned the menu, she knew who she would be feeding and she had to be delusional to think that would be a good plan.

[chessiegal]

Plus Lorelai told her what food to bring - popcorn balls, pigs in a blanket and so on. When Lorelai pointed that out to Sookie, her response was she thought Lorelai was kidding.

[peacheslatour]

2 hours ago, chessiegal said:

Plus Lorelai told her what food to bring - popcorn balls, pigs in a blanket and so on. When Lorelai pointed that out to Sookie, her response was she thought Lorelai was kidding.

That's right. I forgot about that. I was watching the other day and Sookie was having cravings for weird food while preggers. Jackson made Lorelai go into the store because he was hiding during his Selectman era. They brought home all this stuff and she didn't want it, she wanted a whole other slew of weird ass food and she went on and on listing all the things. TIIC played it like it was the funniest thing ever. It was really just incredibly irritating.

[Crs97]

I hated when Sookie was on bed rest and Luke had to leave his diner to help at the inn.  When she got her employees to sneak food and called him to complain that the food wasn’t made exactly the way she would have done it, I wanted Luke to leave.  I also remember when the kitchen at the inn was unusable, and she just marched in and took over his diner.  Lorelai wimped our both times and just expected Luke to take it.  He was way too kind to them both.

[readster]

1 hour ago, Crs97 said:

I hated when Sookie was on bed rest and Luke had to leave his diner to help at the inn.  When she got her employees to sneak food and called him to complain that the food wasn’t made exactly the way she would have done it, I wanted Luke to leave.  I also remember when the kitchen at the inn was unusable, and she just marched in and took over his diner.  Lorelai wimped our both times and just expected Luke to take it.  He was way too kind to them both.

Jackson also came off as a complete asshole too in that episode. I'm sorry, do you want to deal with the fact your wife and your unborn child could die or have sever complications or just go: "Well, Lorelai, you and Luke just don't get Sookie at all!" I mean even when you hear Sookie going: "Jackson stop with the bumps, baby doesn't like that." My mom who was watching at the time went: "Good, I hope you have the damn kid there you dumb bitch!" My mother was never afraid to yell at stupid writing on tv. 

[Taryn74]

23 hours ago, chessiegal said:

Plus Lorelai told her what food to bring - popcorn balls, pigs in a blanket and so on. When Lorelai pointed that out to Sookie, her response was she thought Lorelai was kidding.

I think I've commented this before when we were discussing this episode, but while Sookie certainly should have thought of some more kid-friendly foods, if I were a parent who had paid who knows how much money to have my kid's birthday party catered, there sure as hell had better be something other than heat 'n eat food from the freezer section of the local supermarket there.

[peacheslatour]

23 minutes ago, Taryn74 said:

I think I've commented this before when we were discussing this episode, but while Sookie certainly should have thought of some more kid-friendly foods, if I were a parent who had paid who knows how much money to have my kid's birthday party catered, there sure as hell had better be something other than heat 'n eat food from the freezer section of the local supermarket there.

Sookie apparently made awesome popcorn balls and she could have done some thing super creative with hot dogs, hamburgers and pizza. And the cake she was supposed to have made could have been a show stopper. She could have taken ideas from the books with Lembas bread, honey cakes and "ale". I can think of dozens of ideas just off the top of my head and I'm not even a chef.

[Guest]

That whole birthday party was such a mess. Who is going to hire a fancy chef and party planner for what looked to be a pretty generic kids' party? And what party for 10 year olds features watching a 3 hour movie?  Unless it's a sleepover, 3 hours is most of the party time!

[Katy M]

On ‎9‎/‎8‎/‎2019 at 4:20 PM, Taryn74 said:

I think I've commented this before when we were discussing this episode, but while Sookie certainly should have thought of some more kid-friendly foods, if I were a parent who had paid who knows how much money to have my kid's birthday party catered, there sure as hell had better be something other than heat 'n eat food from the freezer section of the local supermarket there.

What's worse is that they ended up with their own frozen food IIRC.

[chessiegal]

Lorelai still sent one of the staff to Doose's for food and Weston's for cupcakes.

[peacheslatour]

11 minutes ago, chessiegal said:

Lorelai still sent one of the staff to Doose's for food and Weston's for cupcakes.

She had to. there was no way she could serve what Sookie had made. If Sookie had made the proper food in the first place. Lorelai wouldn't have had to do that.

[andromeda331]

11 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

She had to. there was no way she could serve what Sookie had made. If Sookie had made the proper food in the first place. Lorelai wouldn't have had to do that.

Exactly. Sookie made nothing that the kids would eat. She made she made brie with lavender honey and bourbon sugared pecans, crudites, lemon garlic aioli for the blanched veggies, that big salmon, mac and cheese with a jalapeno chipotle cream sauce and chocolate cake with a rum raisin tropical fruit ganache. What kid is going to eat any of that? What's crazy is way back in season one she knew what to make she made a bunch of stuff for Rory's birthday party. Suddenly now Sookie has no idea what kids eat and is shocked and gets mad at Lorelai who keeps pointing out kids aren't going to eat any of that. I can't decide if she forgot everything from season one or if its once again Sookie making what she wants to make no matter what the client is going to want and blowing a lot of money on food they aren't going to use. 

[peacheslatour]

Quote

once again Sookie making what she wants to make no matter what the client is going to want and blowing a lot of money on food they aren't going to use. 

It's like when the Inn was first operating, Anne advised them to cut out lunches for a while and Sookie went ballistic. She whined and cried like a baby and refused to drop lunch. Sh had half a dozen staffers and piles and piles of food all over the kitchen for no customers. I'm surprised they didn't go tits up in the first month.

[andromeda331]

7 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

It's like when the Inn was first operating, Anne advised them to cut out lunches for a while and Sookie went ballistic. She whined and cried like a baby and refused to drop lunch. Sh had half a dozen staffers and piles and piles of food all over the kitchen for no customers. I'm surprised they didn't go tits up in the first month.

I'm surprise they didn't either. Sookie's lucky that she worked with her best friend. Any other inn or restaurant would have fired her early on for all the money she wasted on no customers, suddenly changing menus, or trying to convince Lorelai to ban vegetarians or let her sneak some meat into their food. 

[readster]

On 9/11/2019 at 2:03 PM, andromeda331 said:

I'm surprise they didn't either. Sookie's lucky that she worked with her best friend. Any other inn or restaurant would have fired her early on for all the money she wasted on no customers, suddenly changing menus, or trying to convince Lorelai to ban vegetarians or let her sneak some meat into their food. 

No kidding. Sookie just threw money away and then when things weren't to her liking. She bashed them all with: "You just don't get my excellent skills." To the point where should could have gone into labor early and put her and her unborn child in danger. Yet we are suppose to go: "Well, she is an excellent chef who just wants what is best." NO, she was not.

[Katy M]

On 9/11/2019 at 3:03 PM, andromeda331 said:

I'm surprise they didn't either. Sookie's lucky that she worked with her best friend. Any other inn or restaurant would have fired her early on for all the money she wasted on no customers, suddenly changing menus, or trying to convince Lorelai to ban vegetarians or let her sneak some meat into their food. 

I'm not 100% convinced that inviting the entire town for a free soft opening night was the best financial decision.  And maybe wait until you've made some money before getting horses.  I love horses, but they're expensive and not that many people are going to want to rent them out for trail rides during the winter.  I don't think they were a wise investment for when they're just starting out.

[scarynikki12]

7 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I'm not 100% convinced that inviting the entire town for a free soft opening night was the best financial decision.  And maybe wait until you've made some money before getting horses.  I love horses, but they're expensive and not that many people are going to want to rent them out for trail rides during the winter.  I don't think they were a wise investment for when they're just starting out.

I thought the test run was a good idea since it was about making sure the final kinks would be seen and taken care of but I agree that the horses were a poor investment. If Lorelai'd worked out a deal with a local stable for horseback rides for her guests, and had a policy where the rides were pre-paid and non-refundable (with something else waiting in the wings in the event of bad weather), then I could understand. The way it played out it seemed like they got horses because Lorelai wanted to ride them herself (which we never saw her do and I don't remember getting confirmation that she and Rory actually took the inaugural ride together) and that's a terrible way to do business.

If she was going to spend that money then they should have written it so that Lorelai had Tom include turning the barn into a proper events venue during the renovation. Her general focus, and for that first year in particular, should have been on getting the Dragonfly to take the Independence's place as a major player in Stars Hollow/the surrounding area for both events and a world class meal. The way it played out you could a few select things (go horseback riding, have a nice meal, and relax in your room) but not much else. Not one part of the Dragonfly looked big enough to host even that charity fashion show from season 2 and, now that I'm thinking about it, that could have been used by Sookie when she argued against getting rid of lunch. She wouldn't have been right, as the numbers showed they were losing money, but if she'd argued that her world class chef skills were the only real selling point for the inn at that time she'd at least have had a point. The Dragonfly had only, what, twelve regular rooms and the suite where Emily and Richard stayed? Unless Lorelai was charging all the money that wouldn't be bringing in all that much profit so having a killer restaurant run by an outstanding chef would be a great hook to bring in extra money. Their dining room was big enough to host business meetings and lunches so they could have explored that angle. Oh! They could have used that while Richard and Emily were separated. Each learns that lunch has been cut until it's financially beneficial and, in an effort to show up the other, start making reservations for various things. Emily could have her DAR and charity board meetings gather for lunch while Richard starts bringing his clients for out of office business meals. It would drive Lorelai crazy but it would help her out while providing comedy potential before it was time for Emily and Richard to get back together. Instead we got Sookie wasting so much money that the Dragonfly should have imploded almost immediately.

[chessiegal]

On 9/11/2019 at 2:16 PM, peacheslatour said:

She had to. there was no way she could serve what Sookie had made. If Sookie had made the proper food in the first place. Lorelai wouldn't have had to do that.

Yes, but there was a post that Lorelai was using food from the host's kitchen, which she did - but that wasn't enough.

[chessiegal]

I think the Dragonfly had horses as a nod to Lauren Graham. She loves horses and riding. And one of the horses showing up in the dining room was a hoot. You can see how comfortable Lauren is around the horses.

[peacheslatour]

Quote

The way it played out it seemed like they got horses because Lorelai wanted to ride them herself (which we never saw her do and I don't remember getting confirmation that she and Rory actually took the inaugural ride together) and that's a terrible way to do business.

It was mentioned at one point that Rory was afraid of horses. So, yeah she's gonna be an embedded reporter in war zones like Christiane Amanpour but she's scared of horsies. Right.

[Katy M]

2 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

It was mentioned at one point that Rory was afraid of horses. So, yeah she's gonna be an embedded reporter in war zones like Christiane Amanpour but she's scared of horsies. Right.

She was also afraid of wet grass:).  Seriously, though, I think her innate shyness is more of a bar to any kind of journalistic career than her fear of horses. And I say that as a shy person. Not everyone can do every job.  And that's OK.  Like I said elsewhere, she would probably be a good editor, or novelist, or from what we saw with the DAR and internship a great personal assistant or event planner.  I don't know how she got so stuck on journalism. It's not a good fit with her personality.  I'm sure if I put my mind to it, I could even come up with careers that involve a lot of travel if that's what she wants.  

[Crs97]

13 minutes ago, Katy M said:

Seriously, though, I think her innate shyness is more of a bar to any kind of journalistic career than her fear of horses.

Totally agree with this, which was cemented when she balked at meeting Christianne because she was still in pajamas.  A true reporter would have grabbed the opportunity with both hands.  Rory had to be pushed from behind by her mother, who then did all the talking.  It’s also why Christianne offering to read her stuff rang so false to me.  Rory barely spoke or even looked at her; she was a definite candidate for the polite smile and, “Good luck!” quip, not the “WOW! I want to read your stuff and help you any way I can!” conversation that ensued.

[peacheslatour]

34 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

Totally agree with this, which was cemented when she balked at meeting Christianne because she was still in pajamas.  A true reporter would have grabbed the opportunity with both hands.  Rory had to be pushed from behind by her mother, who then did all the talking.  It’s also why Christianne offering to read her stuff rang so false to me.  Rory barely spoke or even looked at her; she was a definite candidate for the polite smile and, “Good luck!” quip, not the “WOW! I want to read your stuff and help you any way I can!” conversation that ensued.

I hate that I agree with Mitchum but she really didn't have "it". I don't know why TIIC decided she would aspire to be a journalist. As Katy M said there were many other things she could have been good at. She had excellent organizational skills and tons of energy. She would have made a great campaign chairman for some Democratic candidate. In fact I'd be surprised that she didn't take over Barack Obama's campaign.

[chessiegal]

I think ASP picked journalism so Rory would ultimately fail. As the series goes on, including the Revival, it seems to me that was Amy's plan all along.

[Taryn74]

Many times over the years I've wondered why ASP kept pushing this narrative version of Rory that was supposedly so edgy and in-your-face and ready to take on the world when that is not even REMOTELY what we saw on screen. I can understand Lorelai seeing her through such rose-colored glasses that she was never willing to face that Rory wasn't who she made her out to be (and that's not necessarily a bad thing, a mother's love is a mother's love after all) but we, the viewers, never saw that Rory. We perhaps saw glimpses that Rory might be in there way underneath the surface (like when she stood up to Headmaster Charleston after the Puff's ringing of the bell incident) but overall, she was the complete opposite of what we were told she was.

Paris, yes. Rory, absolutely not.

[clack]

I don't think that ASP gave any thought at all to what Rory aspired to.

The obsession with Harvard stood in for Rory's academic ambition, but had to be dropped as the show went along because Rory needed to be within Stars Hollow commuting distance for plot reasons. If ASP had thought ahead, she would have had Rory obsessed with Yale.

Same thing with Christine Amanpour. She was meant to represent a glamorous, adventurous, pioneering role for a young feminist to aspire to, never mind that it made no sense for Rory's personality. ASP didn't think ahead to Rory actually having to find a career.

[Katy M]

1 hour ago, clack said:

The obsession with Harvard stood in for Rory's academic ambition, but had to be dropped as the show went along because Rory needed to be within Stars Hollow commuting distance for plot reasons. If ASP had thought ahead, she would have had Rory obsessed with Yale.

I actually think that worked well, or at least fine.  No two year old gets obsessed with Harvard on her own. It was obviously Lorelai's dream.  Rory took it on as her own.   As it came closer to reality, she realized it wouldn't work for her and went with Yale.  If we had some back story that Lorelai had wanted to be a journalist, or that she wanted Rory to be  Christian Anampour because reasons, well, that would make a lot more sense to me also.

[clack]

38 minutes ago, Katy M said:

I actually think that worked well, or at least fine.  No two year old gets obsessed with Harvard on her own. It was obviously Lorelai's dream.  Rory took it on as her own.   As it came closer to reality, she realized it wouldn't work for her and went with Yale.  If we had some back story that Lorelai had wanted to be a journalist, or that she wanted Rory to be  Christian Anampour because reasons, well, that would make a lot more sense to me also.

 I don't know. Rory struck me as an academic self-starter. Rory has her own taste in literature, for instance -- I don't see Lorelai reading Tolstoy, Faulkner and James Joyce. Or even reading the New Yorker, for that matter. 'People' seems more in her wheelhouse. 

I think it more likely that Harvard would have been Rory's precocious idea, and only then reinforced by her proud mother.

But again, a Yale ambition would have made cleaner story-telling. Yale is in-state, the Gilmores have a history there -- it fits the story better. I think ASP chose Harvard quickly, without giving it much thought as to how it would play out.

[Katy M]

25 minutes ago, clack said:

I don't know. Rory struck me as an academic self-starter. Rory has her own taste in literature, for instance -- I don't see Lorelai reading Tolstoy, Faulkner and James Joyce. Or even reading the New Yorker, for that matter. 'People' seems more in her wheelhouse. 

But, they specifically said that Rory had been wanting to go to Harvard since either the age of 2 or 4.  I don't remember which, but I remember it was one of them.  It may have just been because Harvard was Yale's rival, but at that age Lorelai, or someone, had to put the idea in her head.  She wasn't browsing college brochures on her own at that age.

[Taryn74]

1 minute ago, Katy M said:

But, they specifically said that Rory had been wanting to go to Harvard since either the age of 2 or 4.  I don't remember which, but I remember it was one of them.  It may have just been because Harvard was Yale's rival, but at that age Lorelai, or someone, had to put the idea in her head.  She wasn't browsing college brochures on her own at that age.

I 100% believe Lorelai pushed the idea of Harvard onto Rory at a young age because it was Yale's rival. Lucky for her, Rory was academically minded enough that she picked it up and ran with it so they could pretend it was really Rory's dream all along.

Honestly though, it probably would have made more sense if they had reversed the schools -  have Richard be a Harvard alumni and Lorelai pushed Yale - because then Lorelai could at least use the excuse that they were interested in Yale because Rory could still live close to home, while maintaining the argument that it was still an Ivy League school so was the equal of Harvard, etc. That would at least give her a position to stand on beyond I HATE ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING THAT MAKES MY PARENTS HAPPY, which is what the whole thing feels like.

[andromeda331]

I don't mind Rory dreaming of being a journalist and being Christiane Amanpour growing up. That makes a lot of sense. She's a shy kid growing up in a small town who loved to read about adventure and different places. Its not surprising she'd dream of traveling the world covering various stories. What doesn't make sense is her still having that dream towards the end of high school and all of college when it comes very clear doesn't have anything she would need to be a journalist. She has zero drive, she won't really hunt for stories and its hard to imagine Rory interviewing anyone let alone being in a warzone. She seems really good at being organized, research, and event planning. She would make a great assistant, researcher, a reviewer, and maybe editor. It comes so clear to everyone but Rory, Lorelai, Richard, Emily and the Palladrinos that Rory isn't cut out to be a reporter. From high school to college Rory becomes less and less of a hard worker, she doesn't take advantage or join any or the other clubs, it never occurred to her to go out for student council until Paris talked to her. Somehow despite being told more the once that she needs to do more Rory thinks all she needs to do is be handed a story, preferably one she likes, do research and write a story. That's it. Mitchum was right Rory didn't have it.  Had they had Rory realize this in college that would have been fine. It would have been great. Watching Rory try to figure out what she really wants to do could have a been a good story. It would have been fun to see Rory trying a few different jobs, switch her major a few times and really exploring what she wanted to do. Maybe she would have realized she wanted to be an author and write books. Maybe she would have realized how great she is at organization maybe goes from the DAR to other charity organizations. 

[andromeda331]

I go back and forth on whether Lorelai influenced Rory or not on Harvard. It makes sense that she did or that Rory heard her mother talking about Harvard a lot growing up and wanted it because of that. Its really unlikely that Rory picked Harvard at two or three. Plus Rory probably grew up knowing her mother wanted to go to Harvard and would have except for Rory. I can see her wanting it for herself and for her mother, she knows how much her mother gave up for her. But later as she grows up it would make more sense that Rory wants Harvard. Rory's really into books, learning and school. Its easy to see her wanting to go Harvard.  I do like Lorelai wondering in the Deer Hunters if it really was Rory wanting Harvard or if it really Lorelai wanting it. Rory does insist she does and that.

[Kohola3]

3 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Its really unlikely that Rory picked Harvard at two or three.

True this.  And I tend to think it's Lorelai's penchant for hyperbole that makes it a story she likes to tell but isn't the least bit true.

[clack]

The way in which ASP worked out the Harvard/Yale arc seemed to me to be contrived.

Three seasons of Rory is special -- she has ambitions of going to Harvard! Only for the showrunners to realize, as the time came, that Yale would work better for their story needs, so let's cook up some implausible plotline of Richard doing some last minute string-pulling, etc.

If ASP wasn't, at the time, so committed to her concept of Rory being the most special girl ever, ASP could have more simply resolved the matter by having Harvard reject Rory.

A Harvard rejection, besides being a simpler and more plausible resolution, would have had the bonus feature of introducing some character complications that GG would later go on to develop anyways. Such as, Rory can fail! A person sometimes has to adjust her goals. Etc.

[blueray]

9 hours ago, clack said:

The way in which ASP worked out the Harvard/Yale arc seemed to me to be contrived.

Three seasons of Rory is special -- she has ambitions of going to Harvard! Only for the showrunners to realize, as the time came, that Yale would work better for their story needs, so let's cook up some implausible plotline of Richard doing some last minute string-pulling, etc.

If ASP wasn't, at the time, so committed to her concept of Rory being the most special girl ever, ASP could have more simply resolved the matter by having Harvard reject Rory.

A Harvard rejection, besides being a simpler and more plausible resolution, would have had the bonus feature of introducing some character complications that GG would later go on to develop anyways. Such as, Rory can fail! A person sometimes has to adjust her goals. Etc.

While I'm okay with how she picked Yale. Having her not get in to Harvard would have improved the story. In that episode where they are doing the speeches, Paris makes a comment about how Rory will get in as she is a virgin of course she'll get in. I think having Rory be rejected (or even wait-listed) would have led to a great scene later with her talking to Paris (which she does in next episode).  Rory comforts Paris and admits she wasn't admitted either. This shows that Rory isn't as perfect as she appears to be and the two girls bond over being rejected by the end of the scene.

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Edited September 15, 2019 by blueray

[Katy M]

9 hours ago, clack said:

A Harvard rejection, besides being a simpler and more plausible resolution, would have had the bonus feature of introducing some character complications that GG would later go on to develop anyways. Such as, Rory can fail! A person sometimes has to adjust her goals. Etc.

I get what you're saying, but I kind of liked that she went in so confident and then was told by a professor that she wasn't all that great.  Not his words, of course.  If she had first been rejected by Harvard, she wouldn't have been as confident, IMO.  I also like that she owned the choice.  It showed that she could actually choose for herself and not just go along with what her mother wanted.

[Guest]

On 9/14/2019 at 5:10 PM, Taryn74 said:

I 100% believe Lorelai pushed the idea of Harvard onto Rory at a young age because it was Yale's rival. Lucky for her, Rory was academically minded enough that she picked it up and ran with it so they could pretend it was really Rory's dream all along.

Honestly though, it probably would have made more sense if they had reversed the schools -  have Richard be a Harvard alumni and Lorelai pushed Yale - because then Lorelai could at least use the excuse that they were interested in Yale because Rory could still live close to home, while maintaining the argument that it was still an Ivy League school so was the equal of Harvard, etc. That would at least give her a position to stand on beyond I HATE ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING THAT MAKES MY PARENTS HAPPY, which is what the whole thing feels like.

The problem then is that we would have missed the interactions of R&E with Rory at Yale.  I think the way they did it was kinda perfect - they had her obsessed with Harvard (which ties into Lorelai pushing it because no way is she going to push Yale) realizing Yale makes more sense for a lot of reasons and then ultimately going to Yale. 

[andromeda331]

Watching Cinnamon's Wake today I was annoyed by Sookie during the scene at Luke's where she goes down adding stuff to people's orders. She added salt to one man's and told another she added lemon and cayenne pepper. Its probably suppose to be cute or just Sookie being Sookie but she doesn't know nor does she ask either one before doing it. What if they don't want anything added because they ordered it exactly the way they wanted it (if the guy wanted more salt he could have added it) or if they have any health, allergy or diets that they shouldn't have extra or any salt, lemon or cayenne pepper. My dad can't have anything citrus because of some of the medication he takes even the smallest amounts causes him problems which was who I thought of when Sookie told the man she added lemon to the customer's food without asking. Had a waitress or non-employee of a diner had done that to my dad's plate he would have to get a new plate of food. I have to stick to specific diet due to a stomach problem or I get sick. A lot of other people have diets or health problems Sookie doesn't think about any of that or even if the customers want it before adding in her touch.

[Crs97]

Sookie seems like the type to think people who ask for nut-free or gluten-free cuisines are just being divas who won’t notice when she slips it in their meals.

[peacheslatour]

10 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

Sookie seems like the type to think people who ask for nut-free or gluten-free cuisines are just being divas who won’t notice when she slips it in their meals.

I can't stand that. I'm surprised Luke didn't ban her from Luke's for life.

[andromeda331]

23 minutes ago, Crs97 said:

Sookie seems like the type to think people who ask for nut-free or gluten-free cuisines are just being divas who won’t notice when she slips it in their meals.

She really does seem to think that. She doesn't care or discounts whatever reason people have and will be "fine" if she slips stuff into their food. Or meat into a vegetarian's meal. Even though she could totally get sued for doing so. She's Sookie and she's going to do what she wants and put whatever food she wants into her meals or other people's meals. When someone kills over because she put salt in their food and their not suppose to have any salt or have an allergic reaction. Or get completely pissed off at finding out meat was added to their plate when their a vegetarian. I have research restaurants before we get food from anywhere their menus to see if there's anything I can eat and often have to call the restaurants if they don't list what kind of bread and flour they use. A lot of other people have to as well for their dietary or allergy needs. My dad is careful to avoid anything with anything citrus in it. All Sookie had to do in the scene was ask the customers before she added anything. 

12 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I can't stand that. I'm surprised Luke didn't ban her from Luke's for life.

That could have gotten Luke into serious trouble if one of his customers had a heart attack, allergy out break or whatever because someone who doesn't work there slipped in something they weren't suppose to have. That customer or his family would own everything Luke had.

[Taryn74]

34 minutes ago, andromeda331 said:

That could have gotten Luke into serious trouble if one of his customers had a heart attack, allergy out break or whatever because someone who doesn't work there slipped in something they weren't suppose to have. That customer or his family would own everything Luke had.

IRL, certainly. But this is the same show which had Luke physically throwing people out the door of the diner (I think one guy actually fell down) because he was upset over breaking up with Lorelai. It's ALL played for comedy, nothing more.