The Last Kingdom - General Discussion

[Anothermi]

OK. I didn't view it that way.... but now that you point it out!

There is a lot of humour in these scripts. It might be worth a second viewing just to catch them.

[Razzberry]

You probably viewed it the correct way, Anothermi.  But I noticed a softening in Aelswith,  who positively glows around Alfred, at least in this episode.  I can't blame her.

 

Love the York brothers with the shaved tattooed heads that were all the rage back then, apparently ;)

 

The Moonlight Madness Slave Sale, where they locate Guthred in one of the pens.

Edited May 7, 2017 by Razzberry

[Razzberry]

Nothing firm, but there's hope for a 3rd series.

Writer Bernard Cornwell breaks silence on recommission

In an exclusive interview with Express.co.uk, the 73-year-old writer said: “They’re on the fourth one and there are six more if they want them. I think there is a third season proposed, so that’s great. I will certainly be writing at least another couple, so we’ll see.”

[Razzberry]

Loved the stink-eye stare-down with  Abbott "I had a dream" Eadred.  I think he chose Guthred specifically because he knew how dumb and easily manipulated he could be.  

 

Mucho decapitation, even for this show.  A useful skill for anyone's resume at the time.  Sister Hild boning up.

 

These negotiation scenes kill me.  Seigfrid and Erik dodge an ax, and will obviously make Guthred regret it.

Seigfrid's horse wears a fur hat.

Edited May 9, 2017 by Razzberry

[Anothermi]

Looks like Eric's is wearing some form of fur hat as well. Not sure what the value of  a facial merkin is for a horse. Those Danes!

Edited May 9, 2017 by Anothermi
clarity

[John Potts]

From what I've read, Vikings were quite fastidious about grooming their hair (suspiciously often as far as the Christians were concerned) - maybe Erik didn't want his horse to feel left out!

I take it this has now aired Stateside, so the "Unaired in USA" tag should probably go.

[TaurusRose]

I love this show.  Thoroughly enjoyed the season and cast.  It was great to see Tony Regbo on screen again even if his character was a dick.  LOL 

[Razzberry]

Fiske does a head count before adding his own -

[Clawdette]

Currently, this is my favorite show - at least until Game of Thrones returns in July.  The writing is sharp, characters are well-defined, and performances are adroit.  Now enters my spring of withdrawal.

[Captanne]

It's getting too soapy for me but I'm still hanging in! 

[skyways]

Fantastic! Loved it and laughed in parts. Agreed about the dialogue. So much flair and flow. I did not want it to end.

[Megan]

Uhtred's shoulder length hair bothers me so much.

Thyra raising puppies then Kjarten killing them reminds me of the Unsullied from ASOIAF ASOS,  I wonder if Cornwell borrowed that idea.

 

I really enjoy this show, it's fun but so much time passes between episodes. In episode 5 Gisela and Uthred have two kids all of the sudden?

Edited May 13, 2017 by Megan

[Anothermi]

1 hour ago, Megan said:

I really enjoy this show, it's fun but so much time passes between episodes. In episode 5 Gisela and Uthred have two kids all of the sudden?

One of my (and other's) biggest criticisms of the 1st season was not knowing how much time had passed. Not so much this season. I can't remember exactly, but I thought they made it clear that the Lords of the North issue was cleared up, and Uhtred talked it over with Gesela and agreed to settle for his reward - his own place (which was no Bebbenburg, but it was homey.) ;-)

Pretty sure the two kids were part of signaling that quite a few years had passed when the events of episode 5 take place.

[Captanne]

Oh this was good.  A bit too soapy for me in the second season but everything else was top notch.  Very enjoyable.

[dbell1]

Started Friday night and binged all day today. What a great second season! 

Was worried there would be too much of Abbot Billy Bob Thornton (forgot the character's name) and king useless dream. Cried over the slave ship. Bye Halig, poor guy. 

Alfred is totally annoying. Some newbie whispers that Uhtred is untrustworthy, so he thinks he is. But hooray for sending Ragnar Jr. to look for him.

Ranger Jr. killing Kjarten was so satisfying. Poor Thyra. Looked like she gave up sun for years. Bit jarring to see a priest get married, but those two crazy kids were all kinds of awesome together.

And Princess Stockholm Syndrome falling for cute brother? Saw it a mile away. Hoping king pig's arse will treat her better now. She's more of a warrior than he can ever dreAm of being.

Downside to binging? No more episodes for a long time. :(

[Anothermi]

Other downside to binging? is that it stifles discussion (my fave part) as everything blends together.

[dbell1]

I agree, but there wasn't an individual episode thread here. Would have loved to see everyone's episode by episode thoughts, but I didn't want to get spoiled.

[Razzberry]

Just finished ep.3

[skyways]

That scene was just funny. The way he collapsed over his ale........

[Razzberry]

I loved it.  Aethelwold was even cracking up.

 

RIP Halig, who went out strapped to the slave-ship's bow.

 

Uhtred wins the final stare-down handily.

Edited May 17, 2017 by Razzberry

[Razzberry]

Ep.4    Mission accomplished, sister rescued, and bloodfeud ends in spectacular fashion.  Loved seeing the Alfred jewel, or a reasonable facsimile, make an appearance!

 

Kjartan ends up a bloody pulp, and Ragnar gets to take over the fort.

Edited May 18, 2017 by Razzberry

[Auntie Anxiety]

Finished binge-watching the second season today. Really enjoyed the show. For some reason, it was easier for me to follow the action and to figure out which team was which. I don't know much about English history, so I don't question the plot lines. Beocca and Thyra make an incredible, if unlikely, partnership. Glad she survived the onslaught brought on by the evil bros. Uthred is a Danish-Saxon superhero.

From now on, I will be asking my kids to call me Lady Mother.

[Razzberry]

I finally managed to binge episodes 5 & 6, and things are really cooking.  Enjoyed Uhtred's little excursion to see Bjorn the Undead, which of course lands him in trouble with Albert.  I think those two need to sit down and go over exactly what is expected when one is "pledged", as there seems to be a communication breakdown more than anything else.

I've gotta say, Uhtred's arrogance has started to grate on me in these episodes. I don't know if it's the actor or the way he's written, but he's become insufferably smug, so I actually enjoyed seeing him brought down a bit. David Dawson just dominates these scenes, and pretty much every scene he's in.

And dear Aethelflaed, married to that cruel fool, appears to be captured at episode's end.  LOVED the scene of their camp being attacked.  From Thyra's frantic "Death is coming!" cries to the race to the woods, it represented utter chaos and terror in a very realistic way. Even the sound was excellent, going in and out as it would if you were being knocked around.  Really frightening and well done!

Some highlights -

Edited May 29, 2017 by Razzberry

[Razzberry]

Ep. 6

[Anothermi]

You're in good form Razzberry. :-D

Edited May 31, 2017 by Anothermi

[Razzberry]

I'd love to have a sea battle.  I found the following passage interesting from an Alfred biography that takes place around the same time as we are in the show.   It seems Guthrum did break his treaty with Alfred for a bit.

 

"Already, in 882, Alfred had “fared out to sea with ships,” to fight “four shiploads of Danish men.” He had taken two of the enemy’s vessels, and slain their crews, and had forced the remaining two to surrender. It is probable that Guthrum-Athelstan was in league with the invaders, for in this year he broke his peace with Alfred, and as soon as Rochester was safe, the West-Saxon fleet sailed for East Anglia. They encountered sixteen Viking ships, and, after a sharp fight, slew the crews, and captured the boats. As they returned with their booty, however, they were met by a “great fleet of Vikings,” and were, in their turn, defeated.

The document known as the Treaty of Alfred and Guthrum probably marks the conclusion of this struggle, and its provisions are sufficiently favourable to the West-Saxons to justify the assumption that the East-Anglian Danes felt themselves beaten. It lays down the boundaries between the kingdoms of East Anglia and Wessex. Alfred gained the remainder of Bedfordshire and Hertfordshire, Buckinghamshire, and, above all, Middlesex, with London. 

Henceforward Mercia ceases to be an independent English kingdom, though the great Mercian ealdormanry had its own witan, and retained a large measure of autonomy under Ethelred, who is sometimes even called rex, and his wife, Alfred’s daughter, Ethelflæd, the “Lady of the Mercians.”[65] 

The further clauses of the treaty between Alfred and Guthrum regulate the relations between the adjacent West-Saxon and Anglo-Danish populations. It is a formal treaty, sworn by King Alfred and the English witan on the one part, and by King Guthrum and the people in East Anglia[66] on the other, for themselves and for their descendants."

Lees, Beatrice Adelaide. Alfred the Great: The Truth Teller, Maker of England, 848-899 (Kindle Locations 2258-2260). Albion Press. Kindle Edition. 

[John Potts]

13 hours ago, Razzberry said:

I'd love to have a sea battle.

I think that's pretty unlikely. Although the books do feature a few sea battles (Alfred is sometimes credited with realising the importance of a royal navy), filming at sea is notoriously expensive, even with (presumably) extensive CGI. They probably struggle to budget for the land battles they get.

[Razzberry]

Oh well.  I'd rather have another season, so whatever it takes to make that happen, I'm good.    While not really a battle,  that scene where Aethelflaed was taken was outstanding.  She's another fascinating character, ahead of her time.  

[jackjill89]

Just binged season 2. Alfred's wife is stealth. Her braids make me laugh. I don't know why, but I expect something a little more elegant for a queen -- like Gisela's side braid. 

I though Erik and Ethel -- whatever her name is -- were sweet together. Very soapy, but very sweet. I also dug the priest and Ulthred son of Ulthred's sister. Hild is all kinds of awesome. Her friendship with Ulthred son of Ulthred is lovely.

Where did the uncle get the name Osbert? I don't remember that from the first season. Can someone explain? 

[skyways]

Aethelflaed. It's written differently. Then her husband is Aethelred. Soo many vowels.....

[John Potts]

Pretty sure "Aethel" just means "Royal", like calling somebody in the House of Lords "Lord X". It's why the newly created King of Northumberland changed his name after he was crowned. I presume "Alfred" would actually be "Aethelfred", it's just they've used his modernised name as people are more familiar with it.

(I'm surmising, I don't know anything definitive here).

[Which Tyler]

1 hour ago, John Potts said:

Pretty sure "Aethel" just means "Royal", like calling somebody in the House of Lords "Lord X". It's why the newly created King of Northumberland changed his name after he was crowned. I presume "Alfred" would actually be "Aethelfred", it's just they've used his modernised name as people are more familiar with it.

(I'm surmising, I don't know anything definitive here).

You surmise correctly on almost all counts ("Lord Xxxx" is a title given on top of their name, whilst "Aethelxxx" is part of their given name, to demonstrate their royalty)

Edited June 6, 2017 by Which Tyler

[jastar14]

Hello everyone,

I finally found the soundtrack of uhtred's son death that you've all been asking for in High Quality. Please spread the word with your friends as much as you can, i can't reach all the ones who asked me about the soundtrack. You'll find it in my channel in the link below, i'll try to upload a couple more. Thanks for you support&love.

[Anothermi]

Great find jastar14. I subscribed as you have a lot of good sound tracks!

[iMonrey]

Overall I felt like the second season ended with less closure than the first. The first season certainly left the door open for further adventures but it also had a nice ending that could have served as a satisfying series finale. This season ended more on a "to be continued" vibe, and I'm not altogether confident about the chances of a third season. I don't really see a lot of buzz about this show anywhere and I'm sure it's not cheap to produce.

I'm ready for Uhtred to just go complete Viking on Alfred's ass and his bitch wife and run them through. It's really frustrating seeing him get knocked down again and again; the episode where he's sold into slavery was excruciating to watch. I don't know why the author/show felt the need to knock him down to square one after he'd gained so much and I'm not a big fan of that. He should kill Guthred too and take over Northumbria. It's kind of getting depressing to see him lose time after time, it's like the Starks all over again. He gains nothing by being the loyal one.

I hope if there's a third season we finally get to see him reclaim his home in Babbenburgh (or whatever it is). Knowing how many books there are, I can guess that's probably a long way off, but I'd be fine if they took a shortcut there.

[Anothermi]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I don't know why the author/show felt the need to knock him down to square one after he'd gained so much and I'm not a big fan of that.

I feel your pain, iMonrey, but seeing as Uhtred exists as a fictional character in real history (that is so far distant that not much in the way of the show's level of detail exists), and is being presented as an un-recorded but major factor in Alfred's victories, they've got to keep him around somehow. I might try to think of it as a particularly difficult video game quest he's on where the (ever changing) challenges of level 1 add to his abilities which will finally allow him to achieve his goal - reclaiming his birthright, Bebbenburgh, and being an equal, or better, lord than his father was. His father was also an honorable man I recall, but wiser than Uhtred currently is.  ;-)

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

He gains nothing by being the loyal one.

I don't see him as the "loyal one" exactly. He is honorable. He keeps his word, even if he is tricked manipulated into giving it. I'm hoping he gets a little more savvy each time Alfred pulls one over on him, but he's a complex mix of naivete in political situations and adept planning in military situations so I don't know what to expect. OK, it's his non-military conflicts that seem to knock him back to level 1 so I'll watch to see if he gets wiser as he gets older.  

Given the set up: that Alfred needs Uhtred to unite England; and we know that Alfred succeeded; I find Alfred a believable character. He can't trust Uhtred because he doesn't subscribe to Alfred's moral world view (Christianity) but Alfred understands that you keep your friends close and your enemies closer. Uhtred is more Dane than Saxon at this point. If he were to achieve is own goal (Bebbenburgh) too early, what would be his reason to assist Alfred?

[iMonrey]

Eh - I don't think it's essential to the continuation of the story that Uhtred remains under Alfred's thumb, nor do I believe he has to be torn down repeatedly only to be built back up. In fact that sort of pattern means the story is just spinning its wheels without ever going anywhere. There's nothing to say that if Uhtred gains a measure of self governance his interests wouldn't align with Alfred's from time to time. And while Alfred is indeed a historical character, most people know next to nothing of his contemporaries - who remembers Guthred? Is he really a historical figure? The various Vikings are certainly fictitious, at least most of them. I don't really see a problem with incorporating an elevated Uhtred as - say - Elderman of Bebbenburgh or even King of Northumbria into the historical framework.

[Razzberry]

Uhtred is loyal to himself and he's his own worst enemy.  Sure, he grudgingly does what Alfred wants, mostly,  but both he and Aethelwold have a sense of entitlement that is unearned, as of yet.  I know he's supposed to be some Super Warrior, and Alfred became the Great thanks to Uhtred {!} apparently, but he's still the King.   Uhtred could benefit greatly with an attitude adjustment, but he acts like an asshat most of the time., imo.

I've only read the first one, but I think the main premise of the books is about Uhtred's journey and the obstacles he faces, though I don't know if it's always Alfred.   I hope so because I really enjoy the acting.  Destiny is all.

[John Potts]

1 hour ago, Razzberry said:

I've only read the first one, but I think the main premise of the books is about Uhtred's journey and the obstacles he faces, though I don't know if it's always Alfred.   I hope so because I really enjoy the acting.  Destiny is all.

Since this involves book (and possibly show) spoilers, I'll answer that under spoiler tags:

Spoiler

Alfred extends his sphere of influence but doesn't live to see England united: his son Edward inherits Wessex while Aethelflaed's husband rules Mercia. Aethlflaed asserts her own authority within Mercia leading to a highly strained marriage with her husband, but he never has the authority to disown/divorce her (partly out of fear of Wessex retribution, partly because he's just weak), so the fact that they have no children means Edward's son (Aethelstan) is set to inherit both Kingdoms (as he did IRL, ultimately taking the North as well to unite England). Meanwhile, Uhtred is still alive and kicking ass (at an implausibly advanced age - Bernard Cornwell is on record as having to fudge his age), but HAS learned a bit of political savvy and as of the latest book actually has succeeded in recapturing Bebbanburg.

I would not be at all surprised if they keep Alfred alive "too long" as he's probably the second most important/interesting character in the show. Which would be playing fast & lose with history, but when did that stop anyone!

[ChelleGame]

Just finished season 2. I love this show.  Tempted to read the books but I'll try and hold off.

It was soapy as hell but I loved the romance between the princess and the viking Mostly cause I detest her punk-ass husband and Eric seemed like he might know how to throw down.

Also, I liked the brothers Erik and Sigfried.  They were great together. 

Hope there is a season three.

[SimoneS]

I watched the first episode of season 2. Gawd, I love this show with all its brutality and humor.  I busted out laughing when Uhtred rolled his eyes in annoyance and some disgust at Beocca, Hild, and other priest in awe about the vision and crossing themselves. Ah, Uhtred don't ever change. You are hilarious, ridiculous, and brave all at once. I am so glad that Thyra is still alive albeit living in a horrendous situation. I hope this means that her brothers and Brida will rescue her and she gets her revenge.

I had to stop myself binge watching the whole season. There is nothing to watch weeknights other than The Mist and sometimes Blood Drive so I have to string out watching these episodes.

Edited June 28, 2017 by SimoneS

[SimoneS]

I just watched episode 4. Damn that was brutal and so cathartic. Ragnar lost it during that fight. I was glad that Thyra got her revenge and was freed. No doubt Beocca, who I love with his "god" not "gods," will attempt to convert her.

This is show is full of some of the best looking men. I don't know who I lust after the most; Uhtred, Ragnar or Finan. Actually, I demand all three.

Both Uhtred's confrontations with Guthred were both well done. I was glad that Uhtred threw Alaric's death in his face. Good to see that he figured out that Alfred gave the guy orders to kill him if he didn't go back. Maybe he is getting a little smarter, nah this is Uhtred.

Uhtred and Ragnar's farewell before the fight and after was so sweet. They love each other so much. I love having Brida back. Like Hild, she is tough and a fierce warrior. I smiled when she referred to Uhtred as assling, the nickname their deceased friend gave him. I am so glad that she loves Ragnar totally and isn't pining over Uhtred even a little bit.

Alfred's nephew cracks me up. He was surprisingly insightful. I was surprised he survived the fight.

[skyways]

The next 4 episodes are better than the first 4 if at all possible. I had to take a break after the 4th episode thinking there will be a let down but no.......even more absorbing than ever. I keep feeling that I should be watching this show by now but I have to remind myself that I hurridely watched everything much too quickly..... Urgh..

Edited July 12, 2017 by skyways

[John Potts]

I can't seem to edit ATM, but this is a slight correction to the historical record in my previous post:

Spoiler

Although the first King of All England Aethelstan was IRL the son of Edward the Aethling (Aethelflaed's younger brother), Bernard Cornwell has him as being Aethelflaed's son. He WAS fostered with her as a boy though so maybe that's why Bernard Cornwell wrote it that way. In any case, Aethelstan was the heir to both Wessex and Mercia and after uniting the two Kingdoms, went on to conquer Northumbria and so establish England as it exists today (with some minor adjustments in the borders of both Scotland and Wales).

[supposebly]

Just finished season 2. I watch this one slowly because I hate it when I have no more to watch. I think it's all the guyliner making this show rather addictive. And I think it's overall rather funny. Even without @Razzberry's hilarious commentary. Please, keep them coming!

So, first I have to get this out of the way.

Erik! Noooooo!

Siegfried! Nooooooo!

Sorry. Aehm. Absolutely adored those two. For the murdering and raping assholes they were. At least they were fun. I had to laugh at Erik talking about Aethelfeld's face when they had their first date. I thought, yeah, well you've probably never actually looked at a woman's face before. Still, while I could believe him getting a bit infatuated, it seemed a bit much in such a short time. Still, it was entertaining enough. There I was, in my head singing: Erik and Aethelfeld, sitting in a tree, k-i-s-s-i-n-g. First comes sex, then comes betrayal, and it all will end in death.

For the last few episodes, I was constantly hoping Uthred would just get it over with, side with them, wait for the money, help raise the army and then just go raid Wessex, history be damned. I can't stand prickly Alfred and his creepy wife. I can't believe Odda did what Alfred didn't have the guts to do. Put Wessex before everything. Granted, Odda the younger was no price but still. Alfred got lucky. And he has good men that are better than him.

I find am more enamored of Dreymon's take on this character. I was starting to find him actually somewhat fascinating this season. I also think he has improved a lot since last season. Or maybe it's the hair. Or more guyliner. Still, I was actually surprised Uthred made sure to have Sihtric check out if this dead-guy business was kosher. He does seem to learn. Albeit slowly.

Happy for Father Beocca and Thyra. It broke my heart when he thought she was dead.

I do hope Hild is going to find a reason to take up her sword again. It suited her.

I love Aethelwold. I can't decide whether he's just stupid since the degree of arrogance is astonishing in that weasel, then he shows flashes of intelligence and compassion. I think Alfred might be better advised to keep him close. One day, it might be him who gets lucky.

I don't see this as history since I know nothing about it, so for me, I watch this kind of like GoT. Fantasy. With lots of guyliner. I think GoT could use some too.

Once Erik was so nice to Aethelfled, I knew he and his brother were doomed. I hope she has a sword in her bedroom so that prick of a husband is gonna behave. I can't believe Uthred saved that pig's arse from Siegfried.

So, Haesten survived. I guess he saw it all coming and in the end thought, nope, not going to Valhalla this time. Not for a girl.

Edited August 8, 2017 by supposebly

[Jil]

I haven't read the books. I just found out there were books!!! Do the books tell more of Alfred's son, George? After he was healed in the marsh we never see him again..  

I'm hoping there will be a third season. I must say that I really enjoy this more than GOT. The gratuitous sex scenes and the swearing are too much. 

Does anyone else think this guy who played Uhtred is a cross between brad Pitt and Brendan Frasier?

One last thing... I loved Eric... 

[SimoneS]

I just finished watching the final four episodes. I love this show, love. I think season 2 was better than season 1. All these mouth watering men! I missed the hotness that is Ragnar, but Erik made up for it.

Poor Erik and Aethelflead. The circumstances in which they fell in love was morally questionable, but he was sweet to her and after that asshole husband of hers, it is no wonder she responded to Eric's kindness and gentleness. They never really had a chance of escaping, but they came so close. I really do hope that Aethelflead has a baby Eric on the way. That promise she extracted from Uthred to come to her aid will be that her asshole husband's downfall. Uthred meant it.

I love Uthred. I love that he loves Hild and Aethelflead and is devoted to his men. I felt so bad with his loyal soldier got hurt and sacrificed himself so they could escape. Uthred is also a modern husband. He doesn't like it, but he lets his wife say her piece. I agree with him about Hild, she can do better than devoting herself only to god. She is an amazing woman.

I am glad Beocca and Thyra found love with each other. She deserves to be loved and treasured. I was smiling with Uthred for their happiness. I was so relieved that Thyra survived the raid. 

I go back and forth with Aethelwold, but honestly Alfred would drive even the most reasonable man to the brink and it was kind of him to bring Oddo the knife and save him from humiliation.

I used to be conflicted about Alfred, but now I just hate him. He is so self-involved and full of bullshit even his annoyingly over pious wife is more tolerable. I want someone to smash him in the face. 

[Tyro49]

Why wasn't this thread divided into individual episodes like all of the other programs? That's usually what I like about this site.

Accidentally started the audiobooks in the middle of the series, before knowing it was a series, so I know what happens at the end, but not the beginning. Started watching season 1, then read the first two books. Now watched season 2, haven't caught up with the next books yet. Glad video Finnan sounds just like audio Finnan - that accent is so cute - he's always joking arounf.

So when is season 3 going to start?????

One thing about televised Bernard Cornwell - in the books Richard Sharpe is often described as having black hair, is played by a blond actor.  Uhtred is described as a blonde (usefull when  passing as a Dane) - played by a dark-haired actor.

[Tyro49]

I love how in the books Uhtred describes himself as switching between speaking Danish and Saxon as the situation requires. They haven't really shown that in the series.

[skyways]

1. When is season 3 coming back??? whaaa whaaa........yes I'm a baby about this.