Agents Of S.H.I.E.L.D. and the MCU

[Enigma X]

Does Gunn even determine what's canon? I would assume someone higher in Marvel and Disney ranks would.

[Llywela]

There absolutely was coordination in the early seasons - there were character crossovers and multiple episodes specifically linked to developments in the movies. That coordination disappeared after S2, but it is factually untrue to say that there was never any coordination at all.

Gunn's opinion will not have any impact on my personal feelings about what is or isn't canon!

[Raja]

22 minutes ago, Enigma X said:

Does Gunn even determine what's canon? I would assume someone higher in Marvel and Disney ranks would.

Under my working definition of the director of the next movie decides what is canon since they have been known in past franchises to decanonise stuff for their own creative vision Gunn would qualify. However in the MCU specifically  we are told the producer Feige does hold veto. And Gunn's story would have never intersected with S.H.I.E.L.D.'s  unless he had wanted to use one of the Deathlok's or one of the Ghost Riders.

Being seemingly their highest prospect character I think AoS's inclusion in the future ultimately comes down to how they handle Ms. Marvel being an Inhuman like the moon royals that everyone wants to throw out or a wild born "Nuhuman" like Daisy and Yo-Yo

[TVSpectator]

5 hours ago, Enigma X said:

Does Gunn even determine what's canon? I would assume someone higher in Marvel and Disney ranks would.

Gunn isn't the final say, that would be Feige and that is where I would say is who can determine what is and isn't canon. Although, with Gunn, he seems to be more open to talk to people (he even told us what IP rights that FOX  and the MCU had before the FOX buy-out). So I would say that he is very important but not the final say in anything. That being said, has Feige ever clearly stated that the pre-WandaVision Marvel shows are/were part of the MCU.

 

5 hours ago, Llywela said:

There absolutely was coordination in the early seasons - there were character crossovers and multiple episodes specifically linked to developments in the movies. That coordination disappeared after S2, but it is factually untrue to say that there was never any coordination at all.

Gunn's opinion will not have any impact on my personal feelings about what is or isn't canon!

Very little, if nothing at all. I do remember Joss Whedon talking about this and saying how things are not really connected and there was very little communication between the two divisions., right after he officially left the MCU/Marvel to do other things (after people were complaining about AoU, the whole Black Widow/Hulk romance, Hawkeye having a family, etc...)  Look everyone talks about how in the beginning, how each side didn't know what the other side was doing/did. Joss talked about how Feige came to him, while was in the early stages of creating AoS, and that he was asked why he hasn't started working on AoU. Joss said he was making a TV show about SHIELD and Feige literally told him that they already had plans to destroy that organization in the upcoming Winter Solider movie (which by the time the show first aired, was roughly six-months away). I also remember watching a youtube video of the Russo Brothers talking about the same thing but from their perspective. Apparently they eventually stated that the showrunners got a preview of the Winter Solider and they left with their jaws dropping (meaning that they realized that the movie basically destroys SHIELD with literally no way of it coming back). 

 

As with the multiple crossovers, and the so called, tie-ins well.... Once the multiverse comes fully in play, in the MCU, then the entire show can be placed in another timeline/reality/branch/variant/universe, etc... Another thing that I noticed was that once Joss Whedon left the MCU the so called tie-ins became much more less meaningful to the story (well the Season 2, tie-in was also not very connected to the main plot of Season 2 of AoS) and we have already seen some major differences starting in WandaVision and now we have the TVA in Loki. 

 

Overall, I would assume that Gunn at least knows more about what is happening behind the scenes than others. 

 

4 hours ago, Raja said:

Under my working definition of the director of the next movie decides what is canon since they have been known in past franchises to decanonise stuff for their own creative vision Gunn would qualify. However in the MCU specifically  we are told the producer Feige does hold veto. And Gunn's story would have never intersected with S.H.I.E.L.D.'s  unless he had wanted to use one of the Deathlok's or one of the Ghost Riders.

Being seemingly their highest prospect character I think AoS's inclusion in the future ultimately comes down to how they handle Ms. Marvel being an Inhuman like the moon royals that everyone wants to throw out or a wild born "Nuhuman" like Daisy and Yo-Yo

Sure Gunn doesn't have the final say in what is and isn't canon but he probably knows more about the inner workings than others. Overall, it's really Feige who has the final say and he hasn't really never answered if AoS is canon or not. He seemed to have always avoided given out a definitive answer.  

 

Overall, Ms. Marvel may be the final say but Feige doesn't like to do origin stories and their were rumors that the Inhumans were supposed to have a subplot in F&WS but it got scraped (and I don't know exactly how it would've been fitted into the plot. There was also another subplot about some kind of virus outbreak but that was taken out due to the the actual real-life Coronavirus pandemic). 

 

Edit

 

Fixed some typos

Edited July 5, 2021 by TVSpectator

[swanpride]

There clearly was coordination. Most obviously for Age of Ultron. I mean, AoS basically had a f... trailor for the movie in the show. You can't do that without coordination and information. 

[TVSpectator]

9 hours ago, swanpride said:

There clearly was coordination. Most obviously for Age of Ultron. I mean, AoS basically had a f... trailor for the movie in the show. You can't do that without coordination and information. 

If you are talking about the Turn, Turn, Turn spoilers that was already found out when the showrunners were told that the show they were working on, the movie side already decided to get ride of the organization that they were going to base the said show on, roughly  6 months before the first episode aired. 

 

As with the AoU tie-in that was because Joss and Feige told the showrunners of AoS. That was about it as far as communications went. Even Joss Whedon literally said that communication was basically zero. I would take his word on this since, looking back, that makes the most since, IMO. Especially when it came to Season 3 where the show just diverts and jumps the shark, from the MCU and logic, IMO. 

[Kel Varnsen]

On 7/5/2021 at 4:46 PM, TVSpectator said:

Sure Gunn doesn't have the final say in what is and isn't canon but he probably knows more about the inner workings than others. Overall, it's really Feige who has the final say and he hasn't really never answered if AoS is canon or not. He seemed to have always avoided given out a definitive answer.  

James Gunn's absolutely knows more than most people about what goes on in the movies, especially IW and Endgame. I believe he did some script polishing for the Guardians scenes in those movies. Plus his brother is the on set stand in for Rocket (which makes for some hilarious behind the scenes footage). I would be shocked if anyone from AoS had that kind of connection.

[swanpride]

No, I wasn't talking about Turn, turn, turn. That was the Civil war tie in. I am talking about the Age of Ultron tie in one season later. We had:

1. AoS explaining how the Avengers knew about the Hydra base

2. Raina having a vision of the destruction of Sokovia (which aired in the week before the movie premiered)

3. An explanation where the Helicarrier came from (which aired in the week after the movie premiered). 

You can't do that without communication. Granted, most of the communication most likely happened between Josh and Jed Whedon, but it is simply not true that there was never any communications between AoS and the movies. There was.

[TVSpectator]

On 7/7/2021 at 12:26 PM, swanpride said:

No, I wasn't talking about Turn, turn, turn. That was the Civil war tie in. I am talking about the Age of Ultron tie in one season later. We had:

1. AoS explaining how the Avengers knew about the Hydra base

2. Raina having a vision of the destruction of Sokovia (which aired in the week before the movie premiered)

3. An explanation where the Helicarrier came from (which aired in the week after the movie premiered). 

You can't do that without communication. Granted, most of the communication most likely happened between Josh and Jed Whedon, but it is simply not true that there was never any communications between AoS and the movies. There was.

Yeah, I would say that is mostly Joss and Jed Whedon talking between them but overall, from what I understand, Joss told Jed all that after AoU was done filming. So the connection was (and still is) AoS responding to the movies. They just got lucky that Joss told them something but you can tell that afterwards, the connections got really small and then they stopped. Clearly there wasn't anything going on and I remember Joss Whedon saying that both sides (the movie side and TV side) barely talked to each other (like the bare minimum) but you can tell by the end of Season 5 they weren't talking to each other and Gunn I would say is more right about what is going on right now. 

On 7/7/2021 at 10:47 AM, Kel Varnsen said:

James Gunn's absolutely knows more than most people about what goes on in the movies, especially IW and Endgame. I believe he did some script polishing for the Guardians scenes in those movies. Plus his brother is the on set stand in for Rocket (which makes for some hilarious behind the scenes footage). I would be shocked if anyone from AoS had that kind of connection.

Yes, I agree that he knew/knows more about what is going on and I would trust what he says. That being said I do remember hearing how Feige got all of the main directors together and had them work on Infinity War, together. Like Gunn would've done his part on his characters, and Taika Waititi would've done his part on Thor, etc... But it was all collaborative. 

[Llywela]

Yes, we all know that the connection between AoS and the movies died away over the seasons, that isn't in question. The point is, though, that Gunn is factually wrong to say that there was never any connection at all. There was. Those conversations between Joss and Jed Whedon weren't luck, they were a plan. The show was explicitly commissioned to form part of the wider Marvel universe, and just because the movie people later changed their minds about it doesn't alter that fact.

But anyway, the multiverse, which was established in AoS as far back as S5 and is now movie canon also, neatly resolves any and every discrepancy. In my branch of the multiverse, everything AoS is canon! I don't need everyone else to agree, they can just be in the branch of the multiverse where it isn't! 😀

Edited July 19, 2021 by Llywela

[TVSpectator]

On 7/19/2021 at 4:36 AM, Llywela said:

Yes, we all know that the connection between AoS and the movies died away over the seasons, that isn't in question. The point is, though, that Gunn is factually wrong to say that there was never any connection at all. There was. Those conversations between Joss and Jed Whedon weren't luck, they were a plan. The show was explicitly commissioned to form part of the wider Marvel universe, and just because the movie people later changed their minds about it doesn't alter that fact.

But anyway, the multiverse, which was established in AoS as far back as S5 and is now movie canon also, neatly resolves any and every discrepancy. In my branch of the multiverse, everything AoS is canon! I don't need everyone else to agree, they can just be in the branch of the multiverse where it isn't! 😀

I think that Gunn is talking about the movie side, per se. There are not any connections to the movies (aside from Coulson and a few cameos that now all can be lumped into some other timeline in the multiverse), in  the movies. He is right to say that because Feige and Joss seemed to have either didn't care and/or forgotten about Joss  telling Jed about what was going to happen in AoU. Because they never put a reference (or an obvious reference) in AoU and after wards. 

There is something called the "Marvel Multiverse" where everything that Marvel has done (TV shows, cartoons, comics, etc...) exist. There is no doubt that AoS is in this Marvel Multiverse (and I think after that are worlds like DC, Star Wars, GI Joe, etc...) are supposed to exist and then there are world like ours where their are no superheroes at all. But aside from that I doubt that AoS is (especially at this point) is canon. The multiverse theory actually makes AoS not canon to the MCU because they are not part of the official main timeline/canon of the MCU (which would be Earth-199999). 

 

Edit

Edited July 21, 2021 by TVSpectator

[Raja]

1 hour ago, TVSpectator said:

I think that Gunn is talking about the movie side, per se. There are not any connections to the movies (aside from Coulson and a few cameos that now all can be lumped into some other timeline in the multiverse), in  the movies. He is right to say that because Feige and Joss seemed to have either didn't care and/or forgotten about Joss  telling Jed about what was going to happen in AoU. Because they never put a reference (or an obvious reference) in AoU and after wards. 

There is something called the "Marvel Multiverse" where everything that Marvel has done (TV shows, cartoons, comics, etc...) exist. There is no doubt that AoS is in this Marvel Multiverse (and I think after that are worlds like DC, Star Wars, GI Joe, etc...) are supposed to exist and then there are world like ours where their are no superheroes at all. But aside from that I doubt that AoS is (especially at this point) is canon. The multiverse theory actually makes AoS not canon to the MCU because they are not part of the official main timeline/canon of the MCU (which would be Earth-199999). 

 

Edit

In the movies the only  references were Vision's cryptic line about an exponential increase in enhanced people. When we only saw an arithmetic increase in the movies. And of course a crewed flying aircraft carrier from a non existent agency with Captain America saying this is what that dead agency was supposed to do. Until an obvious contradiction is made I still do hold to AoS to Age of Ultron being the functional equivalent of Rogue One to Star Wars a New Hope, it just wasn't made 40 years later

[BaggythePanther]

1 hour ago, TVSpectator said:

There is something called the "Marvel Multiverse" where everything that Marvel has done (TV shows, cartoons, comics, etc...) exist. There is no doubt that AoS is in this Marvel Multiverse (and I think after that are worlds like DC, Star Wars, GI Joe, etc...) are supposed to exist and then there are world like ours where their are no superheroes at all. But aside from that I doubt that AoS is (especially at this point) is canon. The multiverse theory actually makes AoS not canon to the MCU because they are not part of the official main timeline/canon of the MCU (which would be Earth-199999). 

But the multiverse is part of the MCU now so technically that makes everything canon, even if it isn’t part of the main MCU timeline.

[TVSpectator]

On 7/21/2021 at 12:18 AM, BaggythePanther said:

But the multiverse is part of the MCU now so technically that makes everything canon, even if it isn’t part of the main MCU timeline.

No. It's a concept. It's like this. What the MCU just did was more or less created their own multiverse but the Marvel multiverse has been around for decades. It's basically something that Marvel (as a comic book company and entertainment company) created to say that all of their past tv shows, movies, comic books, etc... exist within a multiverse (it's just a collection of different universes. In that each universe exist next to each other but they are not the same universe. MCU seems to have just created their own version but that's not to say that AoS and the other old Marvel live action tv shows are part of the same universe and/or canon.  I will just past and copy something from Wikipedia that helps explain the continuity of each universe:

Quote

 

Continuity[edit source]

A Universe/continuity is a single reality, such as Earth-616, the mainstream Marvel Universe/Continuity. In Marvel Comics, the concept of a continuity is not the same as "dimension". For example, demons like Mephisto and gods like Odin hail from separate dimensions, but they all nevertheless belong to Universe-616. A continuity should also not be confused with an imprint; for example, while the titles of some imprints, such as Ultimate Marvel, take place in a different continuity, some or all publications in other imprints, such as Epic Comics, MAX, and Marvel UK, take place within the Earth-616 continuity. Note that whether any given specific use of the term "Marvel Universe" refers to the Marvel Multiverse (in general) or to the Earth-616 continuity (in particular) can only be determined by the context of its use.[4]

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse_(Marvel_Comics)

[tv echo]

FYI, Clark Gregg is part of the voice cast list for Marvel's What If...? animated series...

 

Here's the link to the What If...? forum here at Primetimer:
https://forums.primetimer.com/forum/4565-what-if/

[BaggythePanther]

On 8/1/2021 at 5:17 PM, TVSpectator said:

It's basically something that Marvel (as a comic book company and entertainment company) created to say that all of their past tv shows, movies, comic books, etc... exist within a multiverse

At this point there’s no reason to dismiss the idea that the MCU isn’t following a similar path, where it’s possible for any property to be part of the multiverse. Especially considering that they’re bringing back actors from a previous Marvel movie to be in

Spoiler

Spider-Man.

Unless Feige comes out and explicitly says the shows aren’t canon and have absolutely nothing to do with the MCU, or the multiverse is defined as the movies & Disney+ shows only it’s still possible for the show to be canon as part of a different timeline or different universe or whatever.

[TVSpectator]

2 hours ago, BaggythePanther said:

At this point there’s no reason to dismiss the idea that the MCU isn’t following a similar path, where it’s possible for any property to be part of the multiverse. Especially considering that they’re bringing back actors from a previous Marvel movie to be in

  Reveal spoiler

Spider-Man.

Unless Feige comes out and explicitly says the shows aren’t canon and have absolutely nothing to do with the MCU, or the multiverse is defined as the movies & Disney+ shows only it’s still possible for the show to be canon as part of a different timeline or different universe or whatever.

Didn't Feige made the comment that starting with WandaVision, the MCU will be having it's first TV show? 

Spoiler

 As with that spoiler, that has more to do with Sony and Feige working together (and Feige has worked on all of the previous Sony Spider-Man movies as well as several other non-MCU Marvel movies)

I just feel like their is a lot of wishful thinking and also also grasping at straws trying to explain away the AoS (and well as the other Marvel Entertainment Shows) canon Continuity to the MCU films. 

Edited August 3, 2021 by TVSpectator
Fixing Spoiler Tag

[swanpride]

Everyone knows that the streaming shows are "different", and yes, between them, WandaVision ended up being the first out of the gate. That doesn't automatically mean that Agent Carter and Agents of Shield aren't a thing. 

 

And in general, I am kind of stunned how keen a part of the fandom seems to be to have Agents of Shield out of canon while insisting on Disney picking up again Daredevil in the same breath. Between those two, AoS is clearly way closer connected. 

[Raja]

8 hours ago, swanpride said:

Everyone knows that the streaming shows are "different", and yes, between them, WandaVision ended up being the first out of the gate. That doesn't automatically mean that Agent Carter and Agents of Shield aren't a thing. 

 

And in general, I am kind of stunned how keen a part of the fandom seems to be to have Agents of Shield out of canon while insisting on Disney picking up again Daredevil in the same breath. Between those two, AoS is clearly way closer connected. 

I think because DareDevil land Kingpin are important legacy characters and the fan base likes how Charlie Cox and Vincent  D'Onofrio portrayed them. Maybe The Punisher and Jon Bernthal is on the list that we want them all in a movie too. All were long standing legacy characters who had already headlined many pre MCU productions.

 

Meanwhile Chloe Bennet broke out with negative opinion as Skye and by the turn to their only legacy comics character Daisy Johnson the die had been cast. But because S.H.I.E.L.D. was dead and they didn't want to spend the screen time to bring it back to life, even with helicarriers appearing with Director Fury and Commander Hill as if by magic only a cameo by a cast member in a movie makes the show canon.

As Samuel L Jackson continues to age nobody will turn around to film anything, maybe animators will, to explain who fixed that helicarrier  Fury had. Meanwhile when a Ghost Rider  shows up will be one of the two who rode a motorcycle.

In the end nobody will except that while The Avengers brought back half of the people that Daisy Johnson saved the earth from a worse fate

[swanpride]

So...I am nobody? 

[Raja]

56 minutes ago, swanpride said:

So...I am nobody? 

Well among the MCU canon magisterium I guess only what Feige says  counts, not what shows up on screen like it does in the Trek community. But the Trek fans had seen a changing of the guard.

I guess even with Purlmutter and Whedon being cancelled it is easier since Roddenberry and and Rick Berman from an earlier era didn't face it.

[Llywela]

At the end of the day, does it really matter? In the grand scheme of the MCU, does it matter if fans of AOS choose to consider the show canon, regardless of what the current MCU head producer or one of his directors does or doesn't say? Marvel has a sprawling franchise, in which the multiverse has been established in several different ways, and what is considered canon has already changed a bunch of times since that franchise began. It doesn't hurt anyone if fans decide, in those circumstances, to decide for themselves what to include in their re-watches or head canons, rather than going along with whatever the head honchos are currently saying, which might change again next year anyway.

AOS was a good show which was originally commissioned to form part of the wider Marvel Comic Universe. In its early seasons there were multiple movie crossovers, which were planned in consultation with the movie writers. Why shouldn't fans of the show continue to consider it canon if they want to? What difference does it make to anyone else? Live and let live. 🙂

[swanpride]

But Feige hasn't said that AoS is no longer part of canon. In fact, he is very careful to not say either way. 

 

But yeah, even if he had said something definitive about it, what is the big issue if fans still decide to consider the show canon? 

[Llywela]

17 minutes ago, swanpride said:

But Feige hasn't said that AoS is no longer part of canon. In fact, he is very careful to not say either way. 

That's what I thought, and yet here the argument is being made! Hence this discussion. I think what some see as muddiness mostly comes from comments made by other MCU directors like James Gunn.

Disney+ has the show listed as a Marvel Live Action series. So to my mind it is a moot point. But since the argument has been made here (see above) that it shouldn't be considered canon, I just wanted to point out that even if that were the case, it is okay for fans to make that decision for themselves, since what each individual thinks really doesn't affect anyone else anyway!

[dwmarch]

Personally, I think Feige knows those Marvel Entertainment shows have legions of fans and he doesn't want to piss those fans off by dismissing those shows outright. But at the same time, he reserves the right to pick and choose from those shows without being beholden to the storylines and supporting casts that should come along with them. So for example, I have read numerous times that Jon Bernthal is considered the definitive Punisher and if the Punisher is going to be introduced to the MCU, Bernthal is the one they want. But is Jigsaw coming along? Dinah Madani? Micro? Probably not or if they do, not necessarily by the same actors.

I read all of those clickbait articles in which Feige is asked about adopting the Netflix shows and the Marvel Entertainment shows and he always says "We'll see". But FWIW, these are the names that keep coming up as keepers (spoiler coded as this gets into everything including upcoming stuff):
 

Spoiler

 

Jon Bernthal
Charlie Cox
Vincent D'onofrio

All of the above are supposed to be popping up in No Way Home. I believe I may have also seen a picture or article of Deborah Ann Woll being on set for this production as well but I don't remember where I saw that.

Another one we can be pretty sure about is Ryan Reynolds popping up as Deadpool. There is a video out there already of Deadpool and Korg reacting to the trailer for Free Guy.

I remember a rumor that said Krysten Ritter was due to pop up as Jessica Jones in one of the movies (Endgame, I think) but it was decided that Marvel fans would be too confused by references to Marvel characters in their Marvel movies (or more likely, too many goddamn characters in that movie already). Luke Cage is rumored to be recast and I have also heard a nasty rumor that Finn Jones would be brought back as Iron Fist for the specific purpose of killing him off (although I think this may be folks sipping from the Haterade fountain - personally I thought Iron Fist was cancelled just as it was getting good). As always, take any and all of these with huge grains of salt because every time Feige farts someone puts out an article about how he either just confirmed or denied that so-and-so is part of the MCU. But with Into the Spider-Verse and Loki, the groundwork has certainly been put in to have any character from any Marvel property pop up anywhere with little to no explanation (Spider-Ham anyone?). Wanda already reached over to the X-Men universe to pluck their Quicksilver and I am sure we have all heard the rumors about actors who have played Spider-Man in previous pre-MCU films popping back up in No Way Home.

Conspicuous by their absence:

Inhumans (but really, fuck this show to the moon and back even if that dude from Game of Thrones is in it)
Cloak and Dagger
Runways (which Dr. Strange took a dump on already although this might have been before the show even started)
Helstrom (which you would not even know was a Marvel show except for a Roxxon gas station)
Ghost Rider as portrayed by Gabriel Luna (he was supposed to get his own show but it was Marvel Entertainment and got shit-canned with everything else)

 

 

[TVSpectator]

On 8/4/2021 at 12:34 AM, swanpride said:

Everyone knows that the streaming shows are "different", and yes, between them, WandaVision ended up being the first out of the gate. That doesn't automatically mean that Agent Carter and Agents of Shield aren't a thing. 

 

And in general, I am kind of stunned how keen a part of the fandom seems to be to have Agents of Shield out of canon while insisting on Disney picking up again Daredevil in the same breath. Between those two, AoS is clearly way closer connected. 

 

They are different in that Feige mentioned that it would be the first time the MCU has a TV show and it will be tie-in to the movies, though. That is a big hint that he isn't counting the previous shows. 

 

As with Agent Carter, I think it's easier to accept that as canon and/or a parallel universe that is part of the Feige's larger MCU multiverse than AoS. With the point that Feige was involved with creating that show, as a producer, so that is at least a direct connection that AoS doesn't have. Sure the show had Joss Whedon and also Jed Whedon but overall Feige is the main sticking point.

Spoiler

As with the other rumored appearances, you have realized that Feige HAS worked on all of the other SONY Spider-Man movies (okay, I am not 100% sure if he was involved with Into the Spider-Verse or Venom, but I won't be surprised if he was) and also with a number of the FOX Marvel movies (including the 2000s Fantastic Four movies staring Chris Evans as Johnny Storm), Punisher: War Zone, Man-Thing, Elektra , Daredevil (the 2003 one with Ben Affleck), and Ang Lee's Hulk. He worked on those movies and it won't be crazy to think that he would call up on actors he worked before, in my opinion, and that would also include Jamie Fox (but even Jamie Fox claims that he isn't playing the same version of Electro). Also, MCU HAS to work with SONY because SONY owns the movie rights to all of the Spider-Man library. So the deal is that they will get involved as well. 

 

On 8/4/2021 at 2:02 PM, Llywela said:

At the end of the day, does it really matter? In the grand scheme of the MCU, does it matter if fans of AOS choose to consider the show canon, regardless of what the current MCU head producer or one of his directors does or doesn't say? Marvel has a sprawling franchise, in which the multiverse has been established in several different ways, and what is considered canon has already changed a bunch of times since that franchise began. It doesn't hurt anyone if fans decide, in those circumstances, to decide for themselves what to include in their re-watches or head canons, rather than going along with whatever the head honchos are currently saying, which might change again next year anyway.

AOS was a good show which was originally commissioned to form part of the wider Marvel Comic Universe. In its early seasons there were multiple movie crossovers, which were planned in consultation with the movie writers. Why shouldn't fans of the show continue to consider it canon if they want to? What difference does it make to anyone else? Live and let live. 🙂

It doesn't really matter if it's a fan's personal headcanon but if it is starting to clash with each other (like how the Darkhold in WandaVision wasn't the same one from AoS and that Loki started out with only 1 timeline, etc...) then it does.. 

[swanpride]

...AoS established that the Darkhold is different for everyone, so that is not a clash. Nor is Loki starting out with only 1 timeline, because time works differently in the TVA anyway. For the TVA timeline, the crack could have happened before AoS started meddling with time. Not to mention that the explanation for the 

Spoiler

different Loki variants is right in line with the ripples vs wave principle Deke explained. 

 

[ProudMary]

Interesting rumor and/or innuendo.
Agents of SHIELD Star Has Secret Invasion Fans Excited for Jemma's Return in New Post

Quote

There's something afoot in Agents of SHIELD land. Friday, news surfaced Chloe Bennet was leaving The CW's Powerpuff Girls series due to "scheduling conflicts, leading some to believe the actor is appearing in Secret Invasion after months of speculation. Now, Bennet's costar Elizabeth Henstridge has fans thinking there may be a potential SHIELD reunion coming to the Disney+ show in a matter of months. This week, Henstridge shared a video to her Instagram account of herself taking a sip of champagne having just purchased a house in Atlanta with longtime partner Zachary Abel.

While that isn't definitive confirmation Henstridge's beloved Jemma Simmons is in Secret Invasion, naturally, there are a few things to note on the post itself. In the comments, one fan asked if she's "in the MCU," suggesting the actor is filming more projects as Simmons. Henstridge replied to the comment with the "silent-but-smile" emoji. You know the one.

In the post itself, Henstridge makes note that she can't move in to her new house not quite just yet because she already has her bags packed to go to England. Sure, Henstridge is an England native, but Secret Invasion also just so happens to be filming in and around London in the coming months. Coincidence? 

 

[swanpride]

Argh...don't get my hopes up. It would be such a huge disappointment when this doesn't pan out.

[BaggythePanther]

On 8/19/2021 at 10:59 PM, ProudMary said:

In the post itself, Henstridge makes note that she can't move in to her new house not quite just yet because she already has her bags packed to go to England. Sure, Henstridge is an England native, but Secret Invasion also just so happens to be filming in and around London in the coming months. Coincidence? 

Elizabeth just got married in England a few days ago. A few AoS cast members were there so of course people are speculating the wedding could be a cover to explain why a bunch of AoS actors are in the same location as the new Marvel show being filmed. AoS conspiracy theories get crazier and crazier. 

[swanpride]

Well I guess currently it is easier for her to get married in England than to flow out her family for a wedding in the us....

[ProudMary]

On 8/22/2021 at 3:01 PM, BaggythePanther said:

Elizabeth just got married in England a few days ago. A few AoS cast members were there so of course people are speculating the wedding could be a cover to explain why a bunch of AoS actors are in the same location as the new Marvel show being filmed. AoS conspiracy theories get crazier and crazier. 

Photo from Elizabeth's wedding of the beautiful bride with Iain deCastecker, Jeff Ward and Clark Gregg (from Clark's FB page.)

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=389262125898533&id=100044442459312

[swanpride]

You know, the dress she wore in the show was actually nicer...and that is a low bar to stay under. But it's great that they all look so happy. 

[tv echo]

Secret Invasion: Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Vet Chloe Bennet Firmly Denies Involvement in New Marvel Series
By Matt Webb Mitovich / September 22 2021
https://tvline.com/2021/09/22/secret-invasion-chloe-bennet-not-playing-quake-agents-of-shield/ 

Quote

Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. alum Chloe Bennet has a message for those expecting her to play a role in Disney+’s upcoming Secret Invasion series: “I am in no way attached or involved.”
*  *  *
In comic book lore, Nick Fury tapped Daisy Johnson to head up a Secret Warriors team that would defend against shapeshifting Skrull sleeper agents on Earth.

But Bennet on Wednesday evening shared a multi-part Instagram story in which she set the record very straight. “I am in no way attached or involved, even at all or a little bit, in the Secret Invasion Marvel thing,” she avowed. “I honestly don’t even know what that is.”

Explaining the impetus for her full-throated denial, Bennet said that she thought the speculation “would maybe blow over… but it has not.” Rather, “It’s gotten to the point where every day I’m getting hundreds of messages about this” and “getting approached in person — today it was in the tampon aisle at Target — so I figured I would clear the air.”

Knowing how excited S.H.I.E.L.D. and Marvel fans were by the prospect, Bennet added, “To be clear, I love the enthusiasm, and all of your messages are from such a pure place…. I just feel really bad” that the casting rumor isn’t true.

Months ago, there was a report that Secret Invasion was looking to cast “a Chinese-American woman, aged 20-25” in the role of Daisy/Quake — which would once again distance the Marvel TV-produced S.H.I.E.L.D. from the MCU, by not simply keeping Bennet in the role.

 

Edited September 23, 2021 by tv echo

[Raja]

Th latest rumor about the Hawkeye miniseries beyond besides Vincent d'Onofrio showing up as Kingpin, since characters related to him are in the show trailers is that a Bobbi (Mockingbird) Morse might show up as either a character or an Easter Egg. If true it does have the potential to do something to directly contradict the AoS story before the season 5 finale. Or before it is done to Inhumans to get Ms. Marvel Kamala Khan on the air.

[swanpride]

I believe it when I see it...but it would be soooo awesome to see Bobby again. 

[tv echo]

This article incorporates every season of Agents of SHIELD into its MCU timeline...

The MCU in order: The Marvel Cinematic Universe timeline in chronological order
BY IAN SANDWELL AND GABRIELLA GEISINGER     November 5, 2021
https://www.digitalspy.com/movies/a825774/marvel-cinematic-universe-in-chronological-order/

[Raja]

22 hours ago, tv echo said:

This article incorporates every season of Agents of SHIELD into its MCU timeline...

The MCU in order: The Marvel Cinematic Universe timeline in chronological order
BY IAN SANDWELL AND GABRIELLA GEISINGER     November 5, 2021
https://www.digitalspy.com/movies/a825774/marvel-cinematic-universe-in-chronological-order/

So they are going with the season 6 happened  during the 5 year gap along with the last season of The Runaways. It would have to be  that enough time had elapsed that it wasn't mentioned. But besides the opening of Avengers Endgame the only look at Blip life.

It doesn't fit in with the feelgood epilog of season 5 with Phil and Melinda flying off to Tahiti. However except having that small crew looking at the decimation of the snapture but known only to them that they had just saved earth from a fate worse than Thanos caused.

If all of the original Avengers survived and all but one of the Guardians got blipped then everyone in S.H.I.E.L.D.'s main command team could survive just by a third improbable statistical feat. They will never explain who Fury and Commander Hill were trying to mobilize when they got snapped

Edited November 21, 2021 by Raja

[swanpride]

...Captain Marvel? I thought that was clear....

[Raja]

2 hours ago, swanpride said:

...Captain Marvel? I thought that was clear....

Before Fury pulled the pager while they were still driving. It seemed like they were talking an organization. Post Spider-Man it could have been Skrulls

[Raja]

Look what the Googlebot sent to me. The videographer is covering all of marvel TV and their connections.

[LJones41]

Quote

“AGENTS OF S.H.I.E.L.D.” had worked harder to connect to the franchise’s films than the latter has done to connect to the series. Characters from the films like Nick Fury, Maria Hill, Lady Sif, Peggy Carter, Jim Morita, Dr. List and Gideon Malick have appeared on the series during Seasons One, Two and Three. After Season Three, I have not seen one character from any of the movies on the show. And Kevin Feige has never allowed any of the show’s major characters to appear in the movies. Never. The series managed to continue connecting to the films up to late Season Five. What happened? Well, during the events of “INFINITY WAR”, Glenn Talbot had become Graviton. And when he learned from the aliens who had allied themselves with HYDRA mole General Hale of Thanos’ impending threat to Earth, he decided to mine more gravitonium underneath Chicago in order to become more powerful.

Now, the show’s sixth season did not bother to reference the Snap from “INFINITY WAR”. And because it didn’t, “AGENTS OF S.H.I.E.L.D.” suddenly developed this reputation as a failure for the franchise, because it had “failed” to connect to the movies. To make matters worse, Kevin Feige claimed that the series had “failed” to connect to the MCU franchise and its movies … and that the new shows from the Disney Plus streaming series will be among the first that will connect to the franchise. In fact, this whole campaign that "S.H.I.E.L.D." was never part of the MCU franchise began around this time - between "INFINITY WAR" and "ENDGAME". Even ABC and the Whedons' Mutant Enemy production company were forced to proclaim this. Many people . . . especially the media had swallowed Feige’s bullshit like it was candy. And I find myself thinking about actress Chloe Bennet, who has angrily expressed on numerous occasions about the tendency of the franchise's movies to ignore not only “AGENTS OF S.H.I.E.L.D.”, but other MCU shows on the ABC network and on the Netflix and HULU streaming television channels.

Edited October 29, 2022 by LJones41

[Llywela]

46 minutes ago, LJones41 said:

“ In fact, this whole campaign that "S.H.I.E.L.D." was never part of the MCU franchise began around this time - between "INFINITY WAR" and "ENDGAME". Even ABC and the Whedons' Mutant Enemy production company were forced to proclaim this. Many people . . . especially the media had swallowed Feige’s bullshit like it was candy. And I find myself thinking about actress Chloe Bennet, who has angrily expressed on numerous occasions about the tendency of the franchise's movies to ignore not only “AGENTS OF S.H.I.E.L.D.”, but other MCU shows on the ABC network and on the Netflix and HULU streaming television channels.

Meanwhile, some of us have longer memories and remember very clearly that when the show was first launched, all parties involved with the MCU were only too happy to advertise it as part of the extended, interconnected Marvel Universe (that's why it was possible to have characters from the movies involved in the show in the first place)...

Edited October 29, 2022 by Llywela