S10.E16: Lockdown

[thewhiteowl]

 

When two guards at a privatized maximum security prison in Texas are murdered, the BAU suspects that more than one UnSub within the prison could be at work.

 

 

[Danielg342]

Did CM move this up or is it still on March 4?

[thewhiteowl]

I'm showing it as March 4th but I will update if it changes. It didn't.

[Danielg342]

Guess I get to open the scoring. :P

Score this one as a rare victory for me. I knew right away that the Captain did it, but I still thought exploring that web of corruption and prisoner abuse was pretty fun. Plus that one guard who was so concerned about his daughter...he acted brilliantly. There was a sense of urgency in this episode that was missing in many previous ones, and the story progressed really well.

I also quite enjoyed seeing the prisoners be made sympathetic, even if it is a bit of a cliche. I liked how everyone took to Devon White (who I take it isn't related to the former Blue Jay), especially Mr. Pritchett, whom I felt so sorry for because he lost his books, making it quite the joy when Rossi gave them back to him. One thing I didn't see coming was the one prisoner who stood up for Morgan- he seemed like a bit player, but his reasoning was great, and Morgan's look at the end was great. Morgan wouldn't want to admit it, but the prisoner is right, sadly- Morgan went through the same struggles, and likely still does. He might be accepted at work but even he knows that racism is still sadly a thing, and "brothers" still need to look out for each other.

Speaking of Morgan...well, great to see him in a fight again, and hold his own this time. Sure he got taken down, but at least this time it made sense- I think they needed three prisoners to restrain him and he only stopped really to diffuse the situation and save Kate and the other guard (Kate, by the way, seems to stink at fighting, which I guess is appreciated given that we've got ninja JJ). I also liked that he got the last hit in the end, taking one guy down so the SWAT team could come in and take everyone to safety. The fight scene itself was a bit clunky but I thought it made sense.

Other stuff- pretty good involvement by the males in this episode, with a lack of contribution from the females (aside from Kate getting whupped and Garcia's occasional information). Reid was Reid, Hotch took charge and Rossi was at his profiling best.

I suppose the only real irks in this episode was that there wasn't a whole lot of actual profiling- this seemed more like a police investigation than a BAU one- and nothing seemed to be made of "Mr. Helpful M.E." that JJ supposedly "lit a fire under", but, overall, this episode was about the story and the personal struggles, and that made up for whatever it may have lacked.

So, overall, very good. A I would say.

[SSAHotchner]

I was distracted during the ep due to some computer problems. Also I don't much care for prison stories, but all of those I was chatting with during the episode were pretty sure how it was going to turn out. I thought it was predictable, but there were some things I enjoyed. NOT the chocolate thunder remarks or Garcia's silly hair ornaments. While I enjoyed Reid showing us his speed reading, I felt the method Thomas used to film this idea was kind of tacky and not current. I also didn't like Reid using his method of speedy line delivery, but I did enjoy that he had lines. Not too much Kate or JJ, there was a fairly good balance of lines and screen time for the team. My computer really messed up toward the end and I had to reboot so I missed some important stuff, but I'm not sure I want to watch it again to find out what I missed. I guess I probably should, though, so I can really comment more on the plot and not the superficial stuff. I thought TG did a good job throughout the ep of hiding JLH's pregnancy, but then that big shot of her at the end made it quite obvious. I wonder how and if they will address this in future episodes. I also thought the makeup folks must have had fun putting tats on those who didn't have their own, although they did look as if they'd been applied with Sharpies. 

[Old Dog]

I thought TG did a pretty great job of creating the atmosphere of prison and even though it was obvious the captain was involved from early on in the episode it still managed to be suspenseful. I liked the spread of team in this and thank goodness the clues came from Reid assimilating information and not from Garcia's computer. I found the few scenes Garcia had tremendously irritating - she really is a complete parody of her original sparky self now. And yes, JLH's baby bump was very obvious in that shot at the end! Not the best episode ever but pretty good and I did like the way it was directed. I am not usually a great fan of TG's direction but it worked in this one for me.

[zannej]

I've been having a lot of fatigue lately so I found myself starting to drift off at some parts. I don't know if it was because they were boring or if its just that I'm tired. The whole corrupt prison guard thing has been done to death. I do like how they made the inmates seem human, but there were some nitpicks I had with the speed/progression of the story.

 

Some of the tatts looked fake, and I felt too much time was spent on the mugshots. I also didn't like the technique where they zoomed in to the faces so close that the top and bottom of the heads were cut off.

 

I have to agree that there was almost no profiling and people from the team just disappeared for long periods of time. I felt like something about this was jumbled and lacked cohesion. It didn't really feel like a criminal minds episode.

 

The volume of the music just before the team arrived at the prison was a bit too loud, IMO. I also agree that while Reid speed-reading was cool, having Hotch enter the room so slowly while Reid was finishing the files seemed odd.

 

I actually liked that JJ was used less, but that she was still helpful. I liked her saying she was going to light a fire under Dr. Helpful (or whatever she called him).

 

I was confused that they said they didn't have cameras and then at the end the guy was in a room full of cameras and nobody else could get into the room and then the guy shot himself...

 

I liked that Reid noted the one prisoner had disappeared and realized that it was 3 and 4 instead of 7. I just don't get why they didn't ask someone to check up and see if the guy had supposedly arrived at the place where they claimed he was transferred to. And why would they just hide his body and not just say he got into a fight with another inmate and got killed or that he attacked a guard and got killed? That part didn't make sense. Because from what I've heard, its not unusual for prisoners to die and nobody thinks much about it because LEOs tend to see it as a good thing (or at least OK) when criminals take each other out (and I know this from talking to some of them who had this attitude).

 

I found it funny when they mentioned that the food was not good because prisons are required to have better food than public schools.

 

There was a factual error that I noted when watching but I forgot what it was and I'll have to watch again and see if I can remember.. Unless I'm confusing it with another show.. I should have taken notes.

 

Oh, and why did the prisoners stab the guard but not stab Morgan?

 

I didn't have a problem with Kate having a hard time fighting. She was up against multiple guys who were much larger. Grabbing the chair to defend herself made sense (especially when her opponents had knives).

 

Overall it was a decent episode and I could watch it again. I don't think it was anything to rave about though.

[myKingAndQueen]

I liked this episode. It was interesting enough to keep me watching, and this is a victory these days.

 

Prison stories are always interesting but the outcome seems to be always the same. I mean who didn't know that it was the captain? So obvious. *sigh*

 

Still, the characters were explored well and even the team did some nice work. (except from profiling but it wasn't a JJ show or a where-the-hell-are-Hotch/Reid/Rossi-episode)

Liked the action in the end and I REALLY liked that it was Kate and not JJ because let's be honest: Ninja JJ would have fought them off and it was refreshing to see Kate and Morgan 'lose' the fight.

Edited March 5, 2015 by myKingAndQueen

[zannej]

Yeah, I thought it was realistic that Kate and Morgan lost the fight. They were outnumbered and the inmates had weapons. 

It was also a bit convenient for the two dead guards to have their bank information match up so much. You'd think if they were smart they would have taken out different amounts and paid each other in cash or something. They would have to know that someone might check their finances at some point and it would be best to not be able to trace things. Also, the entire fight club in prison thing seemed dumb to me.

 

I did like that the one inmate joked about how he had meetings and stuff to do.

 

I forgot to comment on how odd it was that they focused on Kate for so long as she was leaving the prison. I know they wanted to establish that she was stressed out and wanted to get out of there, but there was something off about it and I kept expecting them to have more said about it. Like find out she was pregnant or have her say something to one of the other team members. I did like how Reid rushed over to her when he came in after the SWAT team. I was hoping to see more reactions from the team when they saw that Morgan and Kate were trapped inside with a riot though.

 

Edit: I finally remembered what it was that I was forgetting. It wasn't a LEO rule, but a plumbing code rule. Under current plumbing code, all showers/tubs etc. must be equipped with anti-scald protection. Maybe 20 or 30 years ago they could have been able to crank up the temperature, but in order to pass inspection, the prison would have to be up to building/plumbing codes and would be required to have some anti-scald protection built-in. So it would not have been possible to just crank up the heat the way they did to scald the one prisoner.

Edited March 5, 2015 by zannej

[wknt3]

I suppose the only real irks in this episode was that there wasn't a whole lot of actual profiling- this seemed more like a police investigation than a BAU one- and nothing seemed to be made of "Mr. Helpful M.E." that JJ supposedly "lit a fire under", but, overall, this episode was about the story and the personal struggles, and that made up for whatever it may have lacked.

Agree about the lack of profiling. It's a shame too since there are plenty of great angles - how do you sort through a population that by definition displays the personality traits of violent criminals, the psychology of guards vs. prisoners, etc. All sorts of ways you can be different from the many times this story has been done before and carry out the mission of the show. But as you said it was entertaining and pretty well done.

[JMO]

This one was just 'okay' for me.  I liked it a little better on a re-watch, but not a whole lot.  In part, I think I reacted to the dreariness of the setting. If that was purposeful, it worked.

 

It was nice to see Reid deduce a few things, and I appreciated the depiction of his actually remembering the details of all that reading he did, in such little time.  I liked his working with Hotch, and Hotch's reliance on him.

 

It just didn't feel suspenseful.  Not even when Morgan and Kate were taken.  To me, the fight scenes weren't all that convincing.  Once they were taken, Morgan looked more worried than Kate did, and the whole thing was over before I had time to become invested in it.  We barely saw the rest of the team's concern about their two captive members, and then it was anticlimactic when they all walked, single file and at a normal pace, into the room with all of the prisoners. 

 

If any of you understand this better than I, please advise.  What did the guard who released the prisoners from their cells hope to accomplish?  Was he hoping to have them kill the other guards and the BAU team, thereby covering his tracks?  Did he think the glass would protect him from a horde of angry cons?

 

Finally, I found the camera work disturbing, in a motion-sickness kind of way.  They were filming in a confined space, so maybe there weren't a whole lot of options to help keep things interesting.  But I found the hand-held filming, and then the angles switching from above, to below, and back again, to be hard to watch.  It's not something I usually notice at all----maybe it was used more often than usual this episode?

 

Not one I'll watch again (except to fast forward to the Reid scenes).

 

 

[normasm]

I have to say I was entertained. Won over by having Reid's mind respected and used, for once. And I think this is as close to zannej's and my fantasy of a Garcia-less solution, being that she only found the corruption on the 2 dead guards, everything else was deduced by Reid. 

 

I found a few things bogus: the scalding thing; the way the broken fingers looked - good lord, haven't any of these people ever had a broken finger? They do NOT look remotely like that!!

 

I like how tired JJ seemed, she was sitting more than half the time. I like that a show with so many people in it didn't take away from the team! I like that Kate sucks at fighting, like any average woman would. I liked the paucity of Garcia's presence. Even with the predictability of a prison lockdown scenario, this one was overall good. 

[zannej]

JMO, I think you hit the nail on the head with the part of Morgan and Kate being held hostage. We didn't get to see the team have time to react and be concerned. It was over too quickly.

I also think that since they plan to write in JLH's pregnancy, that it would have been an interesting time to break the news. If they had moved to stab her or something and she said "I'm pregnant!". Or maybe that would be too tropey... I don't know. I think there was room for improvement.

I also agree that the captain's plan didn't seem to make sense. I get that he was panicking, but if he wanted to avoid getting caught, having a riot was one of the worst ways to do things because it would have guaranteed more attention. It would have hit the media and the FBI would have rained a shitstorm down on that place if agents were killed there.

[SSAHotchner]

I also hated the chocolate thunder exchange between Garcia and Morgan, but at least we were spared a lot more of her in this episode. I'm so tired of her silly hair ornaments. It would have been interesting to have Kate reveal she was pregnant during the fight, even have Morgan show surprise, although with the view we got of her abdomen at the end, anyone working with her day to day would have noticed long before now. 

 

I was unclear on a lot of items, but I wasn't sure whether it was just my distraction or if the writing didn't add up. I couldn't believe that only prisoners were able to disable every single security camera for that riot incident they spoke of without any of them being caught. I don't know how many times I have said this, but why don't they have someone read these scripts to check for things that don't make sense or unanswered questions before they are filmed? Do some freaking research, Writers, or get someone who will. Did anyone actually check out prison procedure or are they just going by what other TV shows and movies have shown us that prisons are like? We were also commenting on the fact, while watching, that several of the team have been in prisons before for interviews with inmates, so they'd be aware of what was possible and would have suspected the guards and officials right away, just as all we viewers did. 

[Calamity Jane]

This one was just 'okay' for me.  I liked it a little better on a re-watch, but not a whole lot.  In part, I think I reacted to the dreariness of the setting. If that was purposeful, it worked.

 

It was nice to see Reid deduce a few things, and I appreciated the depiction of his actually remembering the details of all that reading he did, in such little time.  I liked his working with Hotch, and Hotch's reliance on him.

 

It just didn't feel suspenseful.  Not even when Morgan and Kate were taken.  To me, the fight scenes weren't all that convincing.  Once they were taken, Morgan looked more worried than Kate did, and the whole thing was over before I had time to become invested in it.  We barely saw the rest of the team's concern about their two captive members, and then it was anticlimactic when they all walked, single file and at a normal pace, into the room with all of the prisoners. 

 

If any of you understand this better than I, please advise.  What did the guard who released the prisoners from their cells hope to accomplish?  Was he hoping to have them kill the other guards and the BAU team, thereby covering his tracks?  Did he think the glass would protect him from a horde of angry cons?

 

Finally, I found the camera work disturbing, in a motion-sickness kind of way.  They were filming in a confined space, so maybe there weren't a whole lot of options to help keep things interesting.  But I found the hand-held filming, and then the angles switching from above, to below, and back again, to be hard to watch.  It's not something I usually notice at all----maybe it was used more often than usual this episode?

 

Not one I'll watch again (except to fast forward to the Reid scenes).

My understanding was that the prisoners were released specifically to take out the guard who was spilling the beans, which is why  he was knifed but the other two were not.  

This one was just 'okay' for me.  I liked it a little better on a re-watch, but not a whole lot.  In part, I think I reacted to the dreariness of the setting. If that was purposeful, it worked.

 

It was nice to see Reid deduce a few things, and I appreciated the depiction of his actually remembering the details of all that reading he did, in such little time.  I liked his working with Hotch, and Hotch's reliance on him.

 

It just didn't feel suspenseful.  Not even when Morgan and Kate were taken.  To me, the fight scenes weren't all that convincing.  Once they were taken, Morgan looked more worried than Kate did, and the whole thing was over before I had time to become invested in it.  We barely saw the rest of the team's concern about their two captive members, and then it was anticlimactic when they all walked, single file and at a normal pace, into the room with all of the prisoners. 

 

If any of you understand this better than I, please advise.  What did the guard who released the prisoners from their cells hope to accomplish?  Was he hoping to have them kill the other guards and the BAU team, thereby covering his tracks?  Did he think the glass would protect him from a horde of angry cons?

 

Finally, I found the camera work disturbing, in a motion-sickness kind of way.  They were filming in a confined space, so maybe there weren't a whole lot of options to help keep things interesting.  But I found the hand-held filming, and then the angles switching from above, to below, and back again, to be hard to watch.  It's not something I usually notice at all----maybe it was used more often than usual this episode?

 

Not one I'll watch again (except to fast forward to the Reid scenes).

I think we are at the point with this show where logic is not something we can expect anymore in the plots, just suspend your disbelief and go along for the ride.  Or not.   

[Tink]

Seemed as though it kind of mimicked Shawshank Redemption, but of course not nearly as good. I love that movie!

Edited March 5, 2015 by Tink

[zannej]

Yeah, Garcia repeating "chocolate thunder" and claiming she got "itchy" if she couldn't talk to him. Ugh..How pathetic are they trying to make her? The woman has an unhealthy obsession and dependence on him.

 

I do wonder what the procedure is on reading scripts and figuring out if something makes sense or not. I think one of the problems is perhaps the writer explains their entire vision including elements that don't make it to the screen and because they know things that don't get shown, it makes sense to them, but wouldn't necessarily make sense to the viewers. But another problem is that some stuff is just so bogus, but the people in charge of scripts don't seem to mind that.

 

I know they said fairly early on that it was possible a guard was involved in some of the killings, but they didn't seem to show as much caution as they usually did when they suspected something.

 

I don't know if the team members would really have noticed or picked up on Kate being pregnant-- they might just think she was gaining weight from eating comfort food. And when you are with someone on a day to day basis, weight gain seems more subtle. It's much more obvious when you haven't seen someone in awhile and the last time you saw them they were 20lbs lighter.

[Calamity Jane]

Seemed as though it kind of mimicked Shawshank Redemption, but of course not nearly as good. I love that movie!

In my mind, I was calling it Criminal Minds, Shawshank edition. 

[Bookish Jen]

I think I'll give this episode a solid B-. I did appreciate how there was a brief mention of the prison industrial complex being run by for-profit companies and how it could lead to so much fuck-wittery. And I was glad the CM showed Reid going over the cases, giving him (and Matthew) something to do. I would have loved to have seen Reid give the books back to Mr. Pritchett because he is such a voracious reader. And then I remembered Rossi is a published and successful writer so it made sense to me. It really bothered me to see those books confiscated. Weapons and drugs? Sure. But books? Then I remembered books open the mind to knowledge, learning and the willingness to educate oneself. Lord knows, we can't have any of that (yes, I'm being sarcastic).

 

Really got pissed when the racist prisoner called Morgan an affirmative action hire. I'm surprised he didn't accuse the BAU ladies of sleeping their way into their jobs.

 

Still, I wish they would have focused more on the profiling. I really like the "story behind the story" aspect of CM. But I guess it was more important to see a bunch of ass-kicking. Oh well, can't have it all.

[RedheadZombie]

It's been years since I've watched this show for reasons other than boredom, but I really didn't enjoy this episode.  I don't understand how an inmate can just "disappear".  Wouldn't they assume he escaped and then conduct a full-scale man hunt?  The warden gave them access to landlines, yet Morgan and Garcia talked as if they were all incommunicado, and if Morgan hadn't gone outside to call her on his cell, it would have been impossible for them to communicate.

 

Even after suspecting the guards, Hotch conducts interviews with the guards without attempting to shut off the observation cameras, or moving to a room that isn't observable.

 

When the bad guy barricaded himself in the camera room and unlocked all the cells, everyone responded as if they all had a detailed plan.   I realize that riots are not uncommon, but they stepped out of their cells, and within five seconds they were working in a coordinated attack.

 

Instead of attempting to escape, the prisoners chose instead to attack and attempt to kill federal agents. 

 

The inmate who grabbed Kate was ridiculously over the top.  He's licking his lips and drooling all over her, then hissing threats.  I was waiting for, "and your little dog, too!".

 

The captain who barricaded himself in the room - how could he possibly have thought he would get away with what he did?  Did he think that he could have all the FBI agents killed, and nobody would notice?   That was so beyond stupid.   As if the wrath of hell wouldn't have come down on that prison.

 

And the ripping off of one of my all time favorite movies made my blood boil.

[RedheadZombie]

I found a few things bogus: the scalding thing; the way the broken fingers looked - good lord, haven't any of these people ever had a broken finger? They do NOT look remotely like that!!

 

The scalding was ridiculous, but I'll buy the fingers.  Since they were broken post-mortem, there wouldn't be the swelling and bruising we're used to seeing.

[Lillybee]

I know two guards who worked in a private prison in AZ.. They were young women who made a dollar above minimim wage. Both were smallish. They got laid off when their private prison was sold. The guards in a private prison are treated like shit.

[vanarnd1]

It's been years since I've watched this show for reasons other than boredom, but I really didn't enjoy this episode.  I don't understand how an inmate can just "disappear".  Wouldn't they assume he escaped and then conduct a full-scale man hunt?  The warden gave them access to landlines, yet Morgan and Garcia talked as if they were all incommunicado, and if Morgan hadn't gone outside to call her on his cell, it would have been impossible for them to communicate.

 

Even after suspecting the guards, Hotch conducts interviews with the guards without attempting to shut off the observation cameras, or moving to a room that isn't observable.

 

When the bad guy barricaded himself in the camera room and unlocked all the cells, everyone responded as if they all had a detailed plan.   I realize that riots are not uncommon, but they stepped out of their cells, and within five seconds they were working in a coordinated attack.

 

Instead of attempting to escape, the prisoners chose instead to attack and attempt to kill federal agents. 

 

The inmate who grabbed Kate was ridiculously over the top.  He's licking his lips and drooling all over her, then hissing threats.  I was waiting for, "and your little dog, too!".

 

The captain who barricaded himself in the room - how could he possibly have thought he would get away with what he did?  Did he think that he could have all the FBI agents killed, and nobody would notice?   That was so beyond stupid.   As if the wrath of hell wouldn't have come down on that prison.

 

And the ripping off of one of my all time favorite movies made my blood boil.

 

I agree the captain came off as very cartoonish and his plan made no sense, and the one prisoner who threatened Kate was ridiculous as well. It kind of seemed like the whole episode was a contrived to set-up the danger at the end and I thought it could have been done much better.

[MrWhyt]

I don't understand how an inmate can just "disappear".  

When the guy in charge of the guard and keeping track of prisoners is the one who made him disappear i imagine it wouldn't be as hard as you'd think.

[normasm]

If Spencer hadn't been able to retain the name in his head and note that, of all the inmates, that name didn't have the requisite case file (which they supplied later, and which had obviously been waylaid in hopes nobody would notice), they might have gotten away with it. It's easier than you think to make someone in a big system "disappear" - just ask war veterans, for one.

[needschocolate]

Who was the short prisoner who stepped in to protect/save Morgan and Kate?  Had we seen him before? At first I thought it was the guy who liked to read, but the age was off.  So, I was left sitting there wondering why this guy is the voice of reason.

 

Things to be thankful for - No JJ as superhero. When Morgan and Kate were being held hostage, I fully expected JJ to burst into the room and save them, singlehanded. Instead, they were rescued by actual police/guards in full riot gear.   

 

This just popped into my head as I typed, so I could be off-base here --- Why are most of the men usually called by their last names - Reid, Hotch, Morgan, and most of the women usually called by their first names - JJ, Kate?    

[Droogie]

And interestingly enough, Emily was often called "Prentiss."

[thewhiteowl]

Why are most of the men usually called by their last names - Reid, Hotch, Morgan, and most of the women usually called by their first names - JJ, Kate?

 

 

 I have a guess based my experience and it's that it seems disrespectful to call a woman by her last name without adding Miss or Mrs.  Just a guess because I have asked many men I worked with why they do this and they have no clue, usually.

[normasm]

Actually, I think they call Kate "Callahan", and of course they usually called Emily "Prentiss", except for Reid (Emily). Hotch and Rossi always use first names for each other, JJ calls Reid "Spence", Rossi now calls Reid Spence. It does vary. 

 

I remember a colleague of mine saying he didn't want to be called by his last name, as it sounded like a law firm (his wife was a lawyer). 

[Droogie]

Now that I think about it, they also say "Garcia," and Alex was usually "Blake."

[ForeverAlone]

That is actually a weird thing I have noticed on this show: they nearly all refer to each by their last names. I mean, they are supposed to be friends with each other. I have never referred to my friends by their last names, even if I was working with them. It is just something that stands out to me.

Edited March 7, 2015 by ForeverAlone

[needschocolate]

Thanks - I knew you people would set me straight on the last/first name thing.  Maybe it is just me that refers to them as Hotch, Reid, Morgan, Rossi, JJ, and Kate (I do use Garcia over Penelope, however).  

[Danielg342]

According to this guide to the FBI, this is how the naming system works:
 

Before graduating and joining the FBI, they are told what name to go by. No two agents can have the same name, so some are told to go by their middle name while at work, or to use their middle initial, etc.

 

(It's dated, from 1999, and it was written as a fanfiction guide to The X-Files, but it's pretty comprehensive)

 

I imagine a lot will use their last names, but you could have cases where middle names are used just so that you don't wind up with two people named "Agent Smith". So perhaps "JJ" and "Kate" comes from that. Of course, it could just simply be a "family" thing, where the team is so comfortable with each other that they forgo formalities since the respect they have for each other should already be there.

 

I should point out it's not just Agent Jareau with a nickname- Morgan loves assigning his nicknames, especially to Reid and Garcia, and Agent Hotchner has one too, "Hotch". You can't get more "the team is a family" than have the teammates be willing to assign a nickname to their boss.

[zannej]

I'm glad you brought up the last name thing and the "Agent" thing. It was one of my father's pet peeves when watching television shows. He said that LEO's do NOT just call each other by their last names and they certainly don't refer to each other as "Agent". He called his subordinates by their first names and they either called him "Dave" or "Mr. Johnston". There were some people who went by nicknames-- such as the AOIC was nicknamed "Moose" and one of the women in the office was nicknamed "mamayama". But the whole last name thing and calling people "Agent" is not realistic. I can understand people calling Hotchner "Hotch" since it is his nickname. And "JJ" is also a nickname. I've noticed that Reid started to call Morgan "Derek" and he has called Rossi "Dave". But calling each other by their first names is better, IMO.

[Danielg342]

I figure at this stage everyone should be so chummy with each other that they should all have "pet names" for each other, along with a ton of inside jokes and a more realistic propensity for pranks with each other. I also think they ought to be a bit more snarky with each other since we all know that once you get comfortable with someone, you stop "trying to be nice".

 

Speaking of nicknames, has anyone not on the team ever called Hotch, "Hotch"? Did the Warden here in this episode do it? Apparently he was a friend of Hotch, so I could see that happening.

[Droogie]

When they all met each other and were still getting to know one another, it was probably natural to say, for example, "Reid" instead of "Spencer." Now that they are truly friends, maybe those names just stuck.

Personally, I'm a nickname-er, if I like someone. I can't help it; it just sort of rolls out of my mouth. Especially if I like someone. Maybe that's why I love that Morgan calls Reid "Pretty Boy."

[Calamity Jane]

Interesting about first/last names.  In my workplace, calling someone by their first name or "Mr. Smith" or "Mrs. Jones" is formal, whereas referring to someone by last name only indicates you know the person well.  I actually got in trouble once for calling an older colleague by his last name only when he felt we weren't well enough acquainted for me to do so. 

[PamelaMaeSnap]

Re: the question about the prisoner who steps in to defend Morgan and Kate, I think he was the very first guy they interviewed ... he had been a recent arrival, around the time the murders occurred, so they thought that could be a connection. 

 

And I also thought ... Oh, man, no, not Devon White! I LOVED him when he played baseball!

 

I also had a few areas where I was confused ...

 

The guard who gets knifed after the captain unlocks the cells ... someone mentioned they went straight for the guard who was spilling the beans, but had we already seen him spilling beans? I didn't remember having seen him before this so I didn't make that inference. I might have been in the bathroom or something (though since I watch via TiFaux I usually stop the tape) ...

 

Also, did the guard who was worried about his daughter end up dying? I thought he did (the white light) but wasn't sure.

 

And finally, did we ever actually find out who DID kill the guards and the redneck prisoner? Was it the Captain on all three? Or was he just in on it? For some reason, by that point I was confused ... so if it was the Captain, then it wasn't someone who was getting revenge but rather someone who wanted to keep people quiet?

 

I thought while much of it was predictable from a whodunnit POV, it also made me very sad ... especially the fact that they highlighted the fact that both White and Butler were non-violent criminals.

 

 

[ForeverAlone]

I actually have no clue who actually killed the three people. It was implied that the one prisoner who the guard captain killed killed the first three (since the weapons were found in his cell-but I always assumed they were planted as justification to kill him because I can't see him being so stupid to keep that stuff in his cell), I suppose for revenge. But even if that prisoner did kill the first three, he still would have had guard help with the keys? So I guess it was the guard captain, but why would the captain want to kill the other two guards when they were actually profiting from the fight club. There were some fundamental questions that I don't think were answered in this episode.

Edited March 8, 2015 by ForeverAlone

[needschocolate]

Re: the question about the prisoner who steps in to defend Morgan and Kate, I think he was the very first guy they interviewed ... he had been a recent arrival, around the time the murders occurred, so they thought that could be a connection. 

 

 

I also had a few areas where I was confused ...

 

The guard who gets knifed after the captain unlocks the cells ... someone mentioned they went straight for the guard who was spilling the beans, but had we already seen him spilling beans? I didn't remember having seen him before this so I didn't make that inference. I might have been in the bathroom or something (though since I watch via TiFaux I usually stop the tape) ...

 

Also, did the guard who was worried about his daughter end up dying? I thought he did (the white light) but wasn't sure.

 

And finally, did we ever actually find out who DID kill the guards and the redneck prisoner? Was it the Captain on all three? Or was he just in on it? For some reason, by that point I was confused ... so if it was the Captain, then it wasn't someone who was getting revenge but rather someone who wanted to keep people quiet?

 

Thanks for the info on the prisoner who tried to save them.

 

I thought the guard who gets knifed, the guard who spilled the beans, and the guard who was worried about his daughter were all the same guy.

 

And I didn't realize that they didn't say who killed everyone until you pointed it out.  

[PamelaMaeSnap]

There were actually a few guards who got knifed ... I was referring to the first one, who got knifed as soon as the inmates all came out of their cells.  He was black.

 

But yes, the guard (Tom?) who was worried about his daughter because the captain had actively threatened her and who spilled the beans was white and he did get knifed during the melee later ... did he die?

 

I thought maybe there was more than one guard spilling beans. 

 

Yeah, I'd like to see a script on this ... I thought I was just missing something but maybe whatever they implied was not that clear. 

 

I definitely assumed that Butler was being framed with them planting the weapons in his cell.  The way I read it, he had been friends with White which was why they thought it would be "fun" to make them fight to the death and that incident really messed with his head (what a shock). So when the captain/guards came to him to threaten him not to say anything to the BAU, I guess he felt he had nothing left to lose which is why he asked "will you just disappear me too?" or something along those lines. That's when they killed him. My assumption was because they couldn't scare him into not saying what he knew.

 

Because if he'd killed the guards, wouldn't he be in a lot more trouble than the Captain would be for having the  fight club? So why would the Captain be so worried about his saying anything? And why would he have to set him up?

 

I didn't think it was that he had killed the guards or knew who had, but rather that he knew what the guards were doing to get themselves killed. 

 

That's not to say that he didn't kill the guards. I hope he did. I just didn't infer that from the script. 

 

BUT ... yeah, maybe the fact that the beatings and fights were going down in Cell 34 was to imply that the killers were the inmates being forced to fight, as payback. And Butler would have been one of them.

 

And now I'm even more confused than I was to start with!!!

 

The whole part with the inmates streaming out of their cells and rioting, that just seemed so random, like they had been pre-programmed or something. 

 

I love this show, and I bingewatched the entire first nine seasons leading up to the beginning of Season 10, but I have to say I'm overall disappointed with S10 so far. This episode, actually, was the first one to "move" me at all, but on the other side of the coin SO many unanswered questions and sloppy scriptwriting.

Edited March 8, 2015 by PamelaMaeSnap

[RedheadZombie]

There were actually a few guards who got knifed ... I was referring to the first one, who got knifed as soon as the inmates all came out of their cells.  He was black.

 

I was actually shocked that they threw in a token black guard.  The guards were almost exclusively white, and the prisoners were almost exclusively black.  And the prison is in Texas, yet was there one Hispanic anything?    It stuck out, and it irritated me.

[ForeverAlone]

Texas seems to have a corruption problem with their law enforcement officers. First local cops from last season and prison guards from this season. And let's not forget two useless medical examiners.:) :) :)

Edited March 8, 2015 by ForeverAlone

[missmycat]

I saw this episode and for the most part I did like it. Despite the fact I felt it did have some problems. I did really love that Reid was allowed to show his genuis. And it was refreshing to be able to watch an episode where I didn't feel like JJ had essentially taken over once again. Also, even though I'm okay with Kate for the most part, I could absolutely see how this episode might have been a problem for those who can't stand her character. But at least the way she fought to defend herself was a lot more realistic than the crap they came up with for JJ in the past. IMHO that scene in the season 7 finale with JJ doing that round house kick in slow motion was absolutely ridiculous to me.

 

I've got to say this isn't the first time the show has chosen to portray people in some type of law enforcement in a less than flattering light.And it isn't only that, but there is the fact that the BAU seemed to work better in conjunction with the local LEOs in the earlier episodes. And I feel a lot of it had to do with Ed Bernero himself being a former cop. And with that I did appreciate Virgil letting the swat team play a part in Kate and Morgan's rescue.

[ForeverAlone]

Yeah, upon second viewing, I still don't think it was all that clear who did what and why. I mean, did Butler REALLY do it or did Shavers just plant the "evidence" on him? I mean, it certainly didn't look like they actually found all that stuff in that guy's mattress. And if Butler had that much dirt on the guards that he would be killed to protect it, why would he have had protected status (not that we had any indication he was, but he would have to have been to kill everybody). And that one guard (the one who was about to confess) said he gave Butler keys, but denied helping him kill anyone. So why did he give him keys? What exactly did this guy know and do? I mean if he had that much of a conscience to be bothered about helping dispose of Devon's body, why not just report it to the police and cut a deal? Because if he gave Butler those keys knowing that the guards would be killed, that is basically conspiracy, which is much worse than accessory after the fact. And all along, we kept hearing that a guard must be directly helping in the murders. If so, who was it, if it was not that one guard? Then we have to wonder what Shavers hoped to accomplish by letting those prisoners loose. Did he hope/assume that Kate, Morgan and the guard would be killed and that would be it? That the feds wouldn't come down on the prison like a ton of bricks if two federal agents were murdered by prisoners? There just were way too many loose ends and things left unexplained. It was like Virgil chose to forgo tight storytelling for a big prison fight scene at the end. I saw some very negative parallels to "Demons" last year. Same freaking state, same freaking corrupted law enforcement officers, and same freaking idiot behavior where corrupted officials try and murder federal agents to cover their tracks, when lying low would help their case.

Edited March 8, 2015 by ForeverAlone

[zannej]

Who did they plant the socks and knives on? Was it Devon's friend? I can't remember. IIRC, I think they assumed that if they planted evidence and the killer was "caught" that the FBI would assume it was a closed case and leave. So I think the Captain arranged for that. I will have to re-watch to see if I figure out anything more.

 

Good point about there not being any hispanics in the prison. 

 

Someone on IMDB had a fit about the white guards and the one white prisoner being villains (and one of the white guards was a coward) and then showed the black inmates as sympathetic.

[ForeverAlone]

Yeah, it Devon's friend, Patrick Butler, who the guards said all the murder paraphrenalia. Now I could buy that Shavers planted it on Butler to make the FBI think they had caught the killer, but if that was the case, who are real killers? Like I said before, way too many loose ends and unexplained storytelling devices for this episode to be a strong and coherent one.

[PamelaMaeSnap]

So who was skeevy meal-server inmate and what was his connection to everything? The one who threatened Pritchett not to say anything (so, we know that the inmates knew SOMETHING, but I'm not sure if we were supposed to assume they knew about the fight club, the death of Devon White, or who killed the guards -- or all three)?

 

How many "factions," so to speak, were we dealing with here? Were we to assume that there were two sides -- the guards and the inmates? Or were there also separate factions within the inmates (either divided racially or otherwise)?

 

Skeevy meal-server (he's the one who got killed AND scalded, right?) clearly was no friend of Pritchett's ... and we assume, I guess, that he was killed by the same people who killed the guards, right? Or do we take the next leap to think that he was killed by the Captain to make it LOOK like he was killed by the same people who killed the guards, when in fact he might have been one of the killers?

 

I'm confusing myself now. But that scene (where he served the lovely box lunch) made me think that even within the inmate population there were definitely divided camps. 

[zannej]

I think it was just confusing. LOL. I don't know if they ever identified which of the inmates (or how many) were involved in killing Hightower (nice shout out to Police Academy movies) and the other guard.

 

I think the guy who was scalded (skeevy meal-serving guy) was in league with the evil guards and he was warning people to stay quiet and not reveal the truth to the FBI. I think he was killed by inmates because of his complicity with the guards.

 

I know the Captain told the inmates who rioted that he needed them to do something- so I think he told them to stab the one guard and take the FBI agents prisoner. Or maybe he told them to kill them.. I'm not sure which. I'm assuming he told them to kill them. But of course because they had magical main character powers of protection, they didn't get shanked. I can understand why they didn't shank Kate (to quote Captain Barbosa from Pirates of the Caribbean: "Waste not, want not."), but there was no reasonable explanation for why they didn't shank Morgan. Well, unless they planned to hold hostages and make demands.

 

I think there were probably multiple different factions inside the prison. Back in the 80s when the Cuban riots happened, some of the ones leading the riots were crazy (literally insane because they had been released from prisons for the criminally insane and shipped over by Castro to get rid of them) and there were other inmates who were scared of them and didn't want to be part of the riot. Those ones went to the fence to talk to the law enforcement agents outside. They passed along info and really just wanted to be safe but there was a massive fire and there was a pregnant woman being held hostage (she was one of the Bureau of Prisons employees).

 

On a complete side note, I got to go on a tour inside the prison grounds-- they had large open grassy areas and large windows for the areas with the guards. Right outside the guard areas in the grassy area, they had large rocks for decoration. When the riots started, the inmates used those rocks to smash the windows. (we're talking larger than baseball sized rocks-- the designer for that was an idiot).

[whitespace]

That white guy who got fried was a rapist and devon white was raped too. Maybe the guards threatened the "fight club" participants, that if they don't play along, they arrange a rendevous with him.

 

Whatever the story was, I think it was either not well written or delivered.

 

Just a sidenote: That Julio guy(the first one they interrogate and saved Morgans life) must be a crap negotiator it he turned on his friends to get a lesser sentence and all he got was life +30 years ...

 

On a complete side note, I got to go on a tour inside the prison grounds-- they had large open grassy areas and large windows for the areas with the guards. Right outside the guard areas in the grassy area, they had large rocks for decoration. When the riots started, the inmates used those rocks to smash the windows. (we're talking larger than baseball sized rocks-- the designer for that was an idiot).

I bet it looked nice when they arranged it ;)

Edited March 10, 2015 by whitespace