Spoilers With Speculation

[SueB]

Vince Vincente & his entire band & his new manager

I'm excluding those who died in the teasers for each episode, because if you are IN the teaser, your purpose is to die about 99% of the time.

[Wayward Son]

5 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Wait, Mark Sheppard quit? Did he ask to be written out? I thought he said Crowley being killed off wasn't that much of a surprise. Not that he quit. That's a new one on me

 

3 hours ago, SueB said:

I'm fairly certain Sheppard was written out.  He would have been clear that he had chosen to leave on SM if that was the case.

This story direction, IMO, is clearly Dabb (with Singer's concurrence).  How it plays out is on Dabb as well.

 

3 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

I think that Mark felt that Crowley had run his course on SPN but I had never heard that he quit.  He never told his fans that on twitter or anywhere else that I have seen.  There were others besides those three that were killed off in the end.  The entire BMOL's (thank goodness), Eileen (not over it yet), a whole bunch of hunters, Kelly...that's all I can think of on the top of my head.

Ah, OK there was a misunderstanding on my part. I thought Mark had revealed at Cons he was the one who chose to leave and his moment of realisation came at the end of 11, when to paraphrase Mark's words, Crowley was propped up at a bar while saving the world was going down. 

 

Sorry for the mix up everyone.

[mertensia]

For supernatural critters there's the Alpha Vamp. Also a hunter or two in that episode.

Lady Toni's female minion.

[DittyDotDot]

8 hours ago, catrox14 said:

Wait, Mark Sheppard quit? Did he ask to be written out? I thought he said Crowley being killed off wasn't that much of a surprise. Not that he quit. That's a new one on me

No, it doesn't seem like Mark asked for Crowley to be written out, but I do think it may have been a somewhat mutual parting in the end. Mark clearly was not happy with what he was being given to work with for some time and that probably didn't look like it was going to change anytime soon. So, it might have been the show planned on the bloodbath with plans to bring Crowley back--just like with Cass--but Mark said he was done at that point? Misha said he knew they were planning to kill Cass, but didn't know for sure he'd be coming back until much later. So, we don't know what really happened behind the scenes with Mark, and may never know, but I wonder if something didn't happen in contract negotiations?

Quote

I agree that the online fandom doesn't represent the entire fandom.  However the ratings pretty much tanked last season.  I don't think SPN picked up many new viewers as the core fans gave up.  Dabb and Singer realised that many storylines didn't work out too well.  They both seemed eager to move on (hence the bloodbath).  I applaud the fact that they are willing to move back to a smaller more personal story.

I'd be willing to bet the show did pick up new viewers and lost some viewers just like normal. I'm pretty confident in saying the ratings tank wasn't due to the show itself. The ratings tanked network-wide, Supernatural seemed to hold their own better than most the shows on the network. I don't think the ratings are actually reflecting the whole audience these days since there are so many different way to watch TV. And, I also think their new deal with Netflix and pulling all their shows off Hulu played a role in the ratings dip for the network. So, I'm not putting a lot of stock in the ratings dipping saying the show is losing viewers.

I both agree and disagree that the bloodbath was an attempt to move on from storylines. I mean, we're still gonna have Lucifer and still gonna have Mary and still gonna have the Spawn, the only one not coming back is Crowley and he didn't have much of a storyline last season--and, I'm not convinced we are in fact done with the Brits--but I do think they got excited about the new alternate universe toy. 

My assessment of Dabb as a writer was that he tended to have interesting idea threads running through his episodes, but he didn't seem to really follow though on those ideas. That's kinda my assessment of him as showrunner; I think he's is an idea guy, but those ideas didn't seem to get enough care and feeding in the end.

So, I'm not so sure the alternate universe will last much past mid-season. We know the big bad for the back half of the season is something that comes through the rift--I agree with @SueB, my money is on Alternate Michael--maybe Dabb will have a new toy to play with by that time and the alternate universe will be a thing of the past?

Edited July 31, 2017 by DittyDotDot

[Pondlass1]

1 hour ago, DittyDotDot said:

My assessment of Dabb as a writer was that he tended to have interesting idea threads running through his episodes, but he didn't seem to really follow though on those ideas. That's kinda my assessment of him as showrunner; I think he's is an idea guy, but those ideas didn't seem to get enough care and feeding in the end

This is pretty much my assessment too.  BMOL, Mary returning, Jack, AU, etc., all pretty neat ideas.  But episodes just skim the surface and we're never really privy to motivations.  I rarely feel tension or even particularly involved.

Ideas are ok - but as the old adage says - it's all in the execution.  And Dabb has some weird fixation with Lucifer I don't get.  

[DittyDotDot]

2 minutes ago, Pondlass1 said:

And Dabb has some weird fixation with Lucifer I don't get.  

TBH, I think he's fixated on having Mark Pelligrino on the show more than Lucifer himself.

[Casseiopeia]

9 hours ago, catrox14 said:

The death pool for s12

BMOL deaths:

Ketch
Mick
Hess
Lady SHEDEAD
Other members during the raid on the BMOL bunker in 12.22, but unclear how many

Hunters:
Asa Fox and a few other  hunters at his funeral
Eileen
Wally

Non-hunter/hunter adjacent
Magda
Hitler and his minions
Tasha and Alicia Banes
Kelly

Supernatural entities:
Crowley
Castiel
Rowena
Billie

Am I missing any, non Apocalypses/Darkness released division?

Lol...it was a bloodbath!!

Didn't either Walt or Roy bite it too?

[SueB]

Watching "Everybody Hates Hitler" today, I was thinking 'wouldn't it be great if Aaron and the Golem showed up Wayward Sisters? (presuming it gets picked up).

Based on what Singer said, it's a "hellmouth" situation.  For those who don't get that reference, it's from Buffy the Vampire Slayer.  It means that somehow Jody & company have a specific location where evil shit happens more frequently that elsewhere.  Some complex backstory will be involved. But sort of like the way Missouri Mosley described the Winchester family home as having a 'wound' that attracted supernatural stuff, I suspect the premise of some location that attracts bad stuff (or helps generate it ... interdimensional rift?) is the main "Big Bad".  So... the Thule probably wouldn't go there, unless they needed something... ANYWAY, the point is that being able to see old characters back on the spin-off would be great IMO.  It allows canon lore to continue with those people and we get comfortable characters.  

Some visitors I'd love:
- Sheriff Kathleen from Minnesota who helped the boys out in The Benders
- FBI Linda Blair
- Whichever one didn't die - Roy or Walt
- The female hunter who survived in 3.01
- The ghost of Victor Henrickson (oh how I miss him)
- Not a visitor, but some old place of Bobby's storage area that they hadn't seen before -- then Bobby & Rufus in a flashback
- Mama Tran
- Garth
- the Zanna

Ohhh... maybe it's a crossover with a fairy realm?  Nah... even tho fairy realms are really nasty, they come across as cutesy by name only.

I'm not trying to imply it'd be nothing but 'greatest hits former guest stars', but there are MANY I'm fond of and while they're story maybe done on Supernatural, they could have a fresh topic on Wayward Sisters. 

[DittyDotDot]

5 minutes ago, SueB said:

Based on what Singer said, it's a "hellmouth" situation.  For those who don't get that reference, it's from Buffy the Vampire Slayer.  It means that somehow Jody & company have a specific location where evil shit happens more frequently that elsewhere.  Some complex backstory will be involved. But sort of like the way Missouri Mosley described the Winchester family home as having a 'wound' that attracted supernatural stuff, I suspect the premise of some location that attracts bad stuff (or helps generate it ... interdimensional rift?) is the main "Big Bad".

Which already makes sense because how many cases have they worked in Sioux Falls, ND already? I know it will probably be some new "hellmouth" due to the Spawn, but I would buy there already was one there. ;)

As for visitors, I wholeheartedly concur with Garth, Sheriff Kathleen and Mama Tran, but I hope they don't overdue it too soon with visitors. It's a tricky thing with spinoffs and I think it needs to stand on it's own for the most part at first.

[Wayward Son]

So now that we've all had time to process the spoilers released at SDCC I'm curious to know what storylines are you most looking forward to seeing play out? 

 

- The boys in our world dealing with the loss of allies and Jack 

- Castiel in an unknown realm dealing with an "old friend" and his presumed journey back to our world. 

- Lucifer and Mary in the alt!world 

- The introduction of the Wayward Sisters verse.

 

I think ive covered everyone alluded to? 

[DittyDotDot]

5 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

So now that we've all had time to process the spoilers released at SDCC I'm curious to know what storylines are you most looking forward to seeing play out? 

 

- The boys in our world dealing with the loss of allies and Jack 

- Castiel in an unknown realm dealing with an "old friend" and his presumed journey back to our world. 

- Lucifer and Mary in the alt!world 

- The introduction of the Wayward Sisters verse.

 

I think ive covered everyone alluded to? 

I'm most interested in where Cass is because that's the least known quantity right now, but I'm almost equally interested in Sam and Dean trying to rebuild after losing everyone.

I couldn't care less about Lucifer, but am curious who and how some blasts-from-the-past show up in the alternate.

I'm cautiously excited to see the Wayward Sisters--although, I prefer Wayward Daughters, myself--but I don't want to get too attached to the idea in case it ends up going nowhere.

Edited July 31, 2017 by DittyDotDot

[catrox14]

1 hour ago, Casseiopeia said:

Lol...it was a bloodbath!!

Didn't either Walt or Roy bite it too?

I think Roy and Walt both survived.

Quote

 

 

*Updated S12 Death pool h/t SueB, Mertensia

BMOL:
Ketch
Mick
Hess
Lady SHEDEAD
Lady SHEDEAD's Henchbitch
Other members during the raid on the BMOL bunker in 12.22, but unclear how many (10?)
Rogue Hunter/BMOL traitor  played by Aaron Douglas

Hunters:
Asa Fox and a few other hunters at his funeral(4?)
Eileen
Wally
Roy (presumed dead) *

Non-hunter/hunter adjacent
Magda
Tasha and Alicia Banes
Kelly
Vince Vicente and his bandmates (5?)
Supernatural entities:
Crowley
Castiel
Rowena
Billie
The Alpha Vamp and some vampires (10?)
Lucifer's minions (3?)
Crowley's minions (3?)
Hitler and his minions (5?)
Am I missing any, non Apocalypses/Darkness released division?

Thus far that is ~55 deaths in s12. Dang.

 

Edited July 31, 2017 by catrox14

[DittyDotDot]

7 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I think Roy and Walt both survived.

Didn't one of them die? I don't know who is which, so I can't say for sure, but I only remember one of them being present when Sam killed Hess and it seemed like there was that photo before the episode aired that had one of them dead? I might be remembering it wrong though; there was a lot of dead bodies toward the end of the season.

[SueB]

Roy takes a hit.  

Walt was the explosives guy.

Now it doesn't look like a headwound, so they could have dragged him out to the car after the dust settled.  It happened during the firefight right after they breached the building.  Sam got the guy who shot him right in the forehead.  

I wish they had at least shown Walt kneeling down next to him.  If they are a brother pair hunting for a long time, they deserved a moment.  BUT, as I said, it wasn't a clear headshot, so he could be just fine.

[catrox14]

15 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

Didn't one of them die? I don't know who is which, so I can't say for sure, but I only remember one of them being present when Sam killed Hess and it seemed like there was that photo before the episode aired that had one of them dead? I might be remembering it wrong though; there was a lot of dead bodies toward the end of the season.

to the SuperWiki (which I find not nearly as reliable as a couple of years ago)

There is conflicting information.  There is nothing in the transcript nor the synopses for either episode that explicitly states Roy was killed  but there is an entry under Roy the character  which says he was killed by the BMOL.

So I guess I'll add Roy to the list until I find out differently.

Bummer that he died as a hero working for the boys after murdering the boys.  He might be alive if he didn't join the hunter army, but that's not the same. I just really always wanted Dean to kill them, really Walt more than Roy.  So of course Walt lives and Roy dies and Dean doesn't get to kill either one. Can you tell I really don't like Walt and Roy? LOL

Edited July 31, 2017 by catrox14

[ILoveReading]

I'm looking forward to the scene Jensen described where Dean reaches out to Chuck to bring Cas, Crowley and Mary back.  I think Jensen is going to be brilliant as always. 

Every single storyline sounds 'meh' 

Hopefully it plays out better than it sounds.

Kind of disappointing that they didnt' go with Jensen's suggestion to keep the scruff to show where Sam and Dean are at mentally. 

Edited July 31, 2017 by ILoveReading

[SueB]

1 hour ago, ILoveReading said:

Kind of disappointing that they didnt' go with Jensen's suggestion to keep the scruff to show where Sam and Dean are at mentally. 

He would have had to have made that suggestion months ago so they could shoot out of order.  Since it starts back up immediately after Cas dies, he can't have a beard at the start of the episode. ONLY if there is a multi-week time jump at the end of the first episode could they film that.  But then the eventually have to film the start of EP13.1, which means no scruff.  They could have shot it out of sequence EP 3, EP 2, EP 1 ... but that takes pre-coordination.  

Still... you KNOW Jensen got the 'scruff of manpain' from fandom.  That was a favorite topic back in S9. 

[DittyDotDot]

2 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

Kind of disappointing that they didnt' go with Jensen's suggestion to keep the scruff to show where Sam and Dean are at mentally. 

Did Jensen actually suggest it, though, or say he would've suggested it if he'd known the direction they were going with the writing when they shaved the beards?

Anyway, like @SueB said, they really couldn't do it for continuity, but maybe they'll let them grow scruffy over the first few episodes to show their developing mental states?

38 minutes ago, SueB said:

Still... you KNOW Jensen got the 'scruff of manpain' from fandom.  That was a favorite topic back in S9. 

Oh, if only the beards could give Jared's hair a run for it's money...Aww, now I miss Mick! ;)

[ILoveReading]

44 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

Did Jensen actually suggest it, though, or say he would've suggested it if he'd known the direction they were going with the writing when they shaved the beards?

I should have been more specific.  Yes, Jensen said he would have suggested it had he know, and I know that it was too late by the time production started, I was refering more to 2nd episode.  It started the Monday after comic.  Being in San Diego allows JA and JP to build up scruff, they could have kept it. 

[catrox14]

53 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

I should have been more specific.  Yes, Jensen said he would have suggested it had he know, and I know that it was too late by the time production started, I was refering more to 2nd episode.  It started the Monday after comic.  Being in San Diego allows JA and JP to build up scruff, they could have kept it. 

I still think it's weird that JA brought up the beards at all. 

IMO, there is going to be a time jump either some time during 13.01, at the end of 13.01 or the beginning of 13.02. Jensen is a director. He understands the logistics of episodes and filming out of order. He did it for 10.3.  It doesn't make sense IMO for him to say he WOULD HAVE pitched the beards if he had the script for ep 13.01 where the show is picking up where it left and then carrying on from there with no time jumps. Otherwise, it sounds like Jensen has no idea what is going on and I don't believe that for a minute.  Since Spawnifer grew exponentially upon birth and looked like a creepy teenager then a 6 month time jump would explain why there is a Spawnifer who looks much older than a teenager and more like his RL age of 27 and why Jensen thought depression beards would be something he would pitch.

Edited July 31, 2017 by catrox14

[DittyDotDot]

15 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I still think it's weird that JA brought up the beards at all. 

IMO, there is going to be a time jump either some time during 13.01, at the end of 13.01 or the beginning of 13.02. Jensen is a director. He understands the logistics of episodes and filming out of order. He did it for 10.3.  It doesn't make sense IMO for him to say he WOULD HAVE pitched the beards if he had the script for ep 13.01 where the show is picking up where it left and then carrying on from there with no time jumps. Otherwise, it sounds like Jensen has no idea what is going on and I don't believe that for a minute.  Since Spawnifer grew exponentially upon birth and looked like a creepy teenager then a 6 month time jump would explain why there is a Spawnifer who looks much older than a teenager and more like his RL age of 27 and why Jensen thought depression beards would be something he would pitch.

Wasn't he asked about Dean's frame of mind or something like that? I thought he was just using the beards to answer the question, imply Dean's not dealing well.

Edited July 31, 2017 by DittyDotDot

[catrox14]

11 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

Wasn't he asked about Dean's frame of mind or something like that? I thought he was just using the beards to answer the question, imply Dean's not dealing well.

Yes, and I'm not saying anything that refutes that.

I think Jensen was speaking of the beards as something he would have pitched to show that frame of mind with IMO the implication being that the depression was happening over time, kind of like s7 with the few weeks after Bobby's death and Adventures in Babysitting and Dean was obsessing over Dick.  IMO, there wouldn't be much reason for Jensen to suggest beards as a sign of lack of self-care/depression for Dean if some kind of time jump weren't involved be it a week or a month. 

I'm still sticking my spec that there will be some kind of time jump by 13.03.

[DittyDotDot]

5 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Yes, and I'm not saying anything that refutes that.

I think Jensen was speaking of the beards as something he would have pitched to show that frame of mind with IMO the implication being that the depression was happening over time, kind of like s7 with the few weeks after Bobby's death and Adventures in Babysitting and Dean was obsessing over Dick.  IMO, there wouldn't be much reason for Jensen to suggest beards as a sign of lack of self-care/depression for Dean if some kind of time jump weren't involved be it a week or a month. 

I'm still sticking my spec that there will be some kind of time jump by 13.03.

I have no spec on whether there is a time jump or not, I just don't think what he said really points to anything in particular given the context of the question.

Edited July 31, 2017 by DittyDotDot

[catrox14]

25 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

I have no spec on whether there is a time jump or not, I just don't think what he said really points to anything in particular given the context of the question.

I understand this is your viewpoint. I guess we'll see come premiere time :)

[catrox14]

I'm fascinated with the black car in the first set of tweets. That's wild.

 

 

Edited August 1, 2017 by catrox14

[Casseiopeia]

This may or may not be interesting...

 

[Wayward Son]

14 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

This may or may not be interesting...

 

Oh god, please don't tell me Dean's hateful cuddly bear vampire is coming back! 

[ILoveReading]

7 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

Oh god, please don't tell me Dean's hateful cuddly bear vampire is coming back! 

As much as I would love to see Benny back, I believe Ty is from Vancouver.  So its more likely they met up as friends.

[SueB]

Huh... which one is Ty?  I see DJ Qualls.  Is that Ty without a beard?  No beard makes no sense (in story). 

[Casseiopeia]

7 minutes ago, SueB said:

Huh... which one is Ty?  I see DJ Qualls.  Is that Ty without a beard?  No beard makes no sense (in story). 

I guess it was DJ's bday but I wouldn't be surprised if AU Benny never became a vampire.

[DittyDotDot]

Awww, that's sweet they all went to the fights together!

19 minutes ago, SueB said:

Huh... which one is Ty?  I see DJ Qualls.  Is that Ty without a beard?  No beard makes no sense (in story). 

Isn't Ty the one in the back with the cap? My work computer screen is balanced dark so it's hard to tell.

10 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

I wouldn't be surprised if AU Benny never became a vampire.

But then wouldn't Benny be dead in the AU. I mean, wasn't he was turned into a vampire in the 30s or something like that?

[auntvi]

1 hour ago, DittyDotDot said:

Isn't Ty the one in the back with the cap? My work computer screen is balanced dark so it's hard to tell.

I agree. So who's the guy with a beard across from Ty?

So many shows film in Vancouver, couldn't they be in town filming different things? I get the impression that DJ Qualls works fairly regularly.

[catrox14]

2 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

This may or may not be interesting...

 

Okay my limited sleuthing reveals the following

• I think the bald dude is Paul Lazenby, a stunt actor. His IMDB shows he has worked on Supernatural as a fight coordinator, both Deadpool films, The Predator 2018, Legends of Tomorrow, and bunch of other things. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1342807/
• The guy with the beard behind Jensen looks familiar but I can't place him. The person that posted the tweet is Jesco Cassidy and seems to be a musician, and his pic on Twitter shows him with a beard so maybe he's the guy behind Jensen?  I don't know.  https://twitter.com/JescoCassidy
• The guy in cap is Ty Olsson and I rather love that his Twitter avi is fanart of Benny "Lord of Purgatory".  HEE
• I can't tell who the person is between DJ and Jared and doesn't seem to be tagged or referenced.

So at this point I think it's just a gathering of friends who like MMA, who also just happen to have ties to each other or Supernatural.  Heh. I think it could mean many things and nothing given the AU storyline. LOL

Edited August 1, 2017 by catrox14

[Casseiopeia]

2 hours ago, DittyDotDot said:

Awww, that's sweet they all went to the fights together!

Isn't Ty the one in the back with the cap? My work computer screen is balanced dark so it's hard to tell.

But then wouldn't Benny be dead in the AU. I mean, wasn't he was turned into a vampire in the 30s or something like that?

That's true so maybe he never went to Purgatory because he was never killed?  Vampires live forever right?

[DittyDotDot]

18 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

That's true so maybe he never went to Purgatory because he was never killed?  Vampires live forever right?

Yep! Although, I think it would be fun to meet Benny the human, too--I'm kinda torn here if I want them to do a retcon and change Benny's backstory. ;)

[Wayward Son]

The only appearance I want of Benny is us getting to see his head getting chopped off again ;). rid the universe of all the Benny's possible I say. 

[catrox14]

31 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

That's true so maybe he never went to Purgatory because he was never killed?  Vampires live forever right?

Vampires are not immortal. They can be killed. "If it bleeds you can kill it" In SPN verse, vampires are killed by beheading  but one of the squirrely things with Purgatory is if monsters die on Earth and go to Purgatory and they die in Purgatory where do they go. Or does it just end? I don't think they grow a new head like the Leviathan. So my hope is that Benny is still running around killing everything in Purgatory.

Of course, the AU is a whole other kettle of fish so there is no way to know if Benny is going to be a vampire there or not.

I hope Benny is alive and kicking and being happy somewhere.

I've been thinking that the only way the AU makes sense for existing if some how Sam and Dean are needed to make things right. I guess I feel that way because of Fringe which largely spoiled me on the best use of Alt/Parallel universe. I guess maybe what I want clarified is if the Apocalpyse world is really a parallel universe or a totally alternate universe.  If it's parallel then moving between universes should cause ripple effects that affect both universes and since Sam, Dean, and Cas have all been back and forth between the AU I wonder if we'll see slight differences in our universe.

This makes me want to watch Fringe again. What a great fucking show.

Can I have Lincoln Lee(Seth Gabel) on Supernatural please? He's not busy with Salem anymore since it's demise. My brain might melt with Jensen and Seth on the same show...but gods what a way to go. LOL

Edited August 1, 2017 by catrox14

[Aeryn13]

I hope Missouri is gutted in her appearance but probably no such luck since her granddaughter is gonna be part of the spin-off. Too bad, the only way I want that miserable bitch back is in pieces.

[bethy]

I would LOVE to see Benny again. I guess I need to go back and read this thread again to figure out the AU stuff people are talking about. :) A Benny and Dean reunion would make me happy. 

[Wayward Son]

3 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Vampires are not immortal

I think @Cassiopeia meant immortal in the sense that vampires can potentially live forever if they don't get on the wrong side of a hunter. Invincible is generally the word to use a character that can both live together and also have no known way of killing them ;)

[catrox14]

Just now, Aeryn13 said:

I hope Missouri is gutted in her appearance but probably no such luck since her granddaughter is gonna be part of the spin-off. Too bad, the only way I want that miserable bitch back is in pieces.

I honestly think they will kill off Missouri to make way for her granddaughter. Like maybe her granddaughter comes around because Missouri is in jeopardy and by the end of things Missouri dies. 

[Wayward Son]

5 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

I hope Missouri is gutted in her appearance but probably no such luck since her granddaughter is gonna be part of the spin-off. Too bad, the only way I want that miserable bitch back is in pieces.

Maybe we will both get lucky and you can have your Missouri gutting, and I can get Benny getting his head chopped off ;)

[DittyDotDot]

2 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Vampires are not immortal. They can be killed.

Well, they can be killed unnaturally, but they don't die of natural causes and they don't age. I think that fits the definition of immortal: living forever; never dying or decaying.

1 minute ago, Wayward Son said:

Maybe we will both get lucky and you can have your Missouri gutting, and I can get Benny getting his head chopped off ;)

Benny already got his head chopped off, we're talking about the Alternate Benny here. A Benny who wouldn't have the same backstory or the same connection to Dean. Personally, I'm kinda curious what they're going to do with Missouri. She was only in one S1 episode.

[catrox14]

4 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

I think @Cassiopeia meant immortal in the sense that vampires can potentially live forever if they don't get on the wrong side of a hunter. Invincible is generally the word to use a character that can both live together and also have no known way of killing them ;)

There  are known ways of killing vampires in the SPN verse. Dean killed vampires in Purgatory by beheading them.  I guess I don't really understand what you are saying here. 

Invincible means to me there is no way to kill it and it won't die.

Edited August 1, 2017 by catrox14

[DittyDotDot]

Just now, catrox14 said:

There  are known ways of killing vampires in the SPN verse. Dean killed vampires in Purgatory by beheading them.  I guess I don't really understand what you are saying here. 

My understanding of immortal is they never age or decay, doesn't mean they literally can't die.

[Wayward Son]

5 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

There  are known ways of killing vampires in the SPN verse. Dean killed vampires in Purgatory by beheading them.  I guess I don't really understand what you are saying here. 

Invincible means to me there is no way to kill it and it won't die.

 

4 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

My understanding of immortal is they never age or decay, doesn't mean they literally can't die.

Yes, sorry, I was trying to create a distinction between immortal, which as DDD says means to never age or decay and invincible, which means that along with there being no known way to kill you.

 

So 

Immortal = Will never age or decay if left alone to live their life in peace. However, there is a way to kill them with an outside force such as fire, beheading etc. 

Invincible = Will never age or decay and they can not be killed with any known weapon. 

 

I believe @Cassiopeia was referring to vampires as immortal rather than invincible. 

7 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

Benny already got his head chopped off, we're talking about the Alternate Benny here. A Benny who wouldn't have the same backstory or the same connection to Dean. Personally, I'm kinda curious what they're going to do with Missouri. She was only in one S1 episode.

Oh, I know, but the very concept of the character of Benny is offensive to me for reasons I've stated in Bitch vs Jerk! So the only way I'd want to see him on screen is if the writers rid the multiverse of another version of him ;)

Edited August 1, 2017 by Wayward Son

[DittyDotDot]

4 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

Oh, I know, but the very concept of the character of Benny is offensive to me for reasons I've stated in Bitch vs Jerk! So the only way I'd want to see him on screen is if the writers rid the multiverse of another version of him ;)

I understand. I like Ty and think a non-vampire Benny could be interesting, though. Sorry to hope for something that'll drive you crazy!! ;)

[catrox14]

9 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

Oh, I know, but the very concept of the character of Benny is offensive to me for reasons I've stated in Bitch vs Jerk! So the only way I'd want to see him on screen is if the writers rid the multiverse of another version of him ;)

I get how you feel. I have the same problem with a character in Arrow that I hate. And here I feel that way about Ruby and Lucifer. So if it's any consolation, I've started prepping my coping tools for s13 (whiskey, chocolate, wine, etc). You may want to consider doing the same. I  think we'll see Benny back more than once and likely not just to kill him off, especially if Jensen has anything to say about it. He has been mentioning getting Benny back repeatedly even after Benny had the appearance in s10. 

I want to see Team Purgatory back together but this time everyone is getting along and Cas and Benny aren't bickering.

[Wayward Son]

5 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I get how you feel. I have the same problem with a character in Arrow that I hate. And here I feel that way about Ruby and Lucifer. So if it's any consolation, I've started prepping my coping tools for s13 (whiskey, chocolate, wine, etc). You may want to consider doing the same. I  think we'll see Benny back more than once and likely not just to kill him off, especially if Jensen has anything to say about it. He has been mentioning getting Benny back repeatedly even after Benny had the appearance in s10. 

I want to see Team Purgatory back together but this time everyone is getting along and Cas and Benny aren't bickering.

OR Cas gets to be the one to chop off Benny's head this time! That would actually be amazing *goes off to write fanfic* 

 

And yeah apparently Jensens mentioned wanting him back, but I'll live in hope the writers will continue to ignore Jensen until the end of the show! Rather than bring back an utter caricature of a Mary Sue vampire. 

 

But we can agree to disagree :) 

[catrox14]

7 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

OR Cas gets to be the one to chop off Benny's head this time! That would actually be amazing *goes off to write fanfic* 

 

And yeah apparently Jensens mentioned wanting him back, but I'll live in hope the writers will continue to ignore Jensen until the end of the show! Rather than bring back an utter caricature of a Mary Sue vampire. 

 

But we can agree to disagree :) 

I wasn't trying to convince you of anything. Sorry if something I said was implying otherwise. Wasn't my intention at all.