Spoilers With Speculation

[DittyDotDot]

2 minutes ago, rue721 said:

OOOOOoooooh my gosh. Finally. I wonder what the BMOL are gonna have to do to finally make her have some doubts.

Probably explicitly lay out their plans to kill her. Apparently, anything short of that isn't enough for her. ;)

[ILoveReading]

Maybe she comes across Dean and Sam's files. 

[catrox14]

4 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

Maybe she comes across Dean and Sam's files. 

Shouldn't she already KNOW they were on file given Lady TheActualWorst had their dossiers already? I mean Mary can't really be that stupid can she?

[ILoveReading]

4 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Shouldn't she already KNOW they were on file given Lady TheActualWorst had their dossiers already? I mean Mary can't really be that stupid can she?

Probably.   I can imagine the first draft of the script.

Mary- "Ketch, why do you have files on my boys."

Ketch- Mrs. Delores Umb...I mean Miss Hess wants us to kill all American Hunters,"

Mary- "But my boys...I can't let anything happen to those two my two sons.  I haven' gotten to know them yet."

Ketch- "Sorry Mary, the boss has spoken.  Its the code."

Mary- "Okay, Ketch, I'll give you one more chance but if hurt my boys we're through..."

Since Dean likes to give nicknames, I have this weird desire to hear him starting calling Ketch, Artie.

[rue721]

I think she's probably going to see them flat out murder Tasha or one of the witch twins.

The finally having "some" doubts cracks me up, though. I mean dude did she have NO doubts even going into recruitment? Not even a single solitary doubt showed up during one of their numerous botched skirmishes with monsters/demons/what-have-you?

Maaaaaary, OMG! Let me just say, someone as gullible and gung ho as all that would be hell to try and take out to a bar or club. I can just see dragging her away from one loser after another!

[DittyDotDot]

Promo for The Future:

I'm getting a strong Goodbye Stranger vibe from Cass in that promo. If Heaven fucked with Cass again...not cool. Not cool at all. 

[catrox14]

 I'm officially freaking out about Cas' status now. :(

[ILoveReading]

The thing I noticed is that Cas is fighting, Sam is firing a gun and Dean.... appears to be lying on the ground.

Quote

 I'm officially freaking out about Cas' status now. :(

@catrox14

There was a spoiler that Cas was more powerful than he was supposed to be.  I wonder if through his time in heaven Sam got promoted to arch angel. 

Edited April 14, 2017 by ILoveReading

[Idahoforspn]

Dean laying on the ground with Sam shooting to save him and Cass....AGAIN. 

[catrox14]

33 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

The thing I noticed is that Cas is fighting, Sam is firing a gun and Dean.... appears to be lying on the ground.

@catrox14

There was a spoiler that Cas was more powerful than he was supposed to be.  I wonder if through his time in heaven Sam got promoted to arch angel. 

Do you mean you wonder if Cas got promoted to archangel?

I speculated on that some time ago. I still wonder if the Michael Lance did something to Cas that gave him archangel juice besides allowing him to just not die.  I dunno. Something is definitely up with Cas.

I don't get why Sam is wasting his bullets that they already know won't kill Dagon. desperate times. Why isn't Dean in the fight to save his best friend?

i was thinking about something.

If Princes of Hell are more powerful than regular angels, could they actually be fallen angels that Lucifer turned into demons.

Because Azazel and Ramiel are angelic sounding names. Azamondius sounds angelic too.

[trxr4kids]

57 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

If Princes of Hell are more powerful than regular angels, could they actually be fallen angels that Lucifer turned into demons.

I've wondered that too although I've always just wondered if it was the result of them choosing to fall with Lucifer not a result of something Lucifer actively did to them.

[auntvi]

46 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

If Princes of Hell are more powerful than regular angels, could they actually be fallen angels that Lucifer turned into demons.

Because Azazel and Ramiel are angelic sounding names. Azamondius sounds angelic too.

Thanks so much, I just spent time googling when I should have been working. ;P

Azazel is from the Hebrew bible and belongs to the class of "se'irim," goat-like demons, jinn haunting the desert, to which the Israelites offer sacrifice. He was/is part of Yom Kippur atonement ceremonies; he was literally the scapegoat.

But this is what Kripke and the original writers probably read on Wikipedia:

Quote

In the fifth-century 3 Enoch, Azazel is one of the three angels (Azza [Shemhazai] and Uzza [Ouza] are the other two) who opposed Enoch's high rank when he became the angel Metatron. Whilst they were fallen at this time they were still in Heaven, but Metatron held a dislike for them, and had them cast out. They were thenceforth known as the "three who got the most blame" for their involvement in the fall of the angels marrying women. It should be remembered that Azazel and Shemhazai were said to be the leaders of the 200 fallen (or Grigori), and Uzza and Shemhazai were tutelary guardian angels of Egypt with both Shemhazai and Azazel and were responsible for teaching the secrets of heaven as well. The other angels dispersed to "every corner of the Earth."

So, yeah, Azazel is a powerful angel, who was a leader of the the fallen angels.

[Aeryn13]

Quote

The thing I noticed is that Cas is fighting, Sam is firing a gun and Dean.... appears to be lying on the ground.

It`s an honest promo, I`ll give it that. 

Cas seems to be in some kind of heavenly attack dog mode. If this is the big transformation they spoke of? Eh.   

[DittyDotDot]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

If Princes of Hell are more powerful than regular angels, could they actually be fallen angels that Lucifer turned into demons.

Hey, that's what I said almost two months ago: 

[catrox14]

59 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

Hey, that's what I said almost two months ago: 

I'm sorry DDD. I didn't remember that you said that. My apologies.  I wasn't trying to steal anyone's thunder.:(

[Wayward Son]

I am not saying it is impossible for the show to retcon the prince(ss) of hell into fallen angels, but I don't think that is needed to explain why they are more powerful than run of the mill angel. The most powerful demon of all (Lilith) was explicitly described as a human prior to her conversion and she was said to be more powerful than everything but the archangels. Another white eyed demon Alastair  was also shown to rather effortlessly defeat Castiel when they battled against one another. I'd say their inherent strength is down to power granted to them by Lucifer in the same way Lilith's power and the power of Knights such as Abbadon derived from Lucifer.

[DittyDotDot]

23 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I'm sorry DDD. I didn't remember that you said that. My apologies.  I wasn't trying to steal anyone's thunder.:(

Not my thunder--my thunder is so much louder, believe me--just thought the previous discussion could be helpful for the current one. 

Carry on with the crack pot spec... .

[catrox14]

2 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

Cas seems to be in some kind of heavenly attack dog mode. If this is the big transformation they spoke of? Eh

Let's say my ongoing spec about Cas being on his way out is correct. 

 I think he might get some extra juice in Heaven to take out Dagon and then it takes him almost dying for him to unleash the power. Maybe he made a deal to take the Nephlim back to Heaven for it's fate, but instead he just suddenly teleports away and takes the Nephilim to parts unknown. Hence the stunned looks on Dean and Sam's faces at the bright light. If Misha wants some time away this writes him out but leaves him room to return as a guest star

I'm really curious about why the boys are going to have a flat screen TV and barcoloungers. Someone asked them at the con, why the boys don't have recliners etc int he bunker and they got kind of nervous and said...there is something kind of along those lines coming up. I'm wondering if that will be in THIS bunker or maybe they find a new bunker. 

Or the boys are going to be forced to flee the bunker and go back out on the road again and next season will be the boys going underground again. Maybe they have to live without Baby again :( for a while.

Edited April 14, 2017 by catrox14
for clarity and removing redundant sentences

[catrox14]

[catrox14]

They are idiots. LOL

[Diane]

That was too funny!!

[catrox14]

Jensen giggling like that just made me giggle.

Here is the you tube version

 

[SueB]

Ramiel went poof, versus dying in agony.  I think he is demon-species vice angel-species.  

[Goldmoon]

This is way out there, but after reading the theory that Dean is "only dreaming" this season, I wondered if the renewal for S13 is a foiler.  What if JA IS going to direct but the two Js will no longer be in the show?  What if Claire and others will be the next generation of hunters taking over for the boys next season?  I don't want that - of course - but wondered if that is why the character of Dean got a goodbye and Sam is getting a lot of time in the spotlight in this half of the season.

I kind of like the idea that Dean is in the Empty and this season Sam and Cas have been trying to get him back.  Perhaps Crowley is helping them.

I need a fic, stat!

[catrox14]

17 minutes ago, SueB said:

Ramiel went poof, versus dying in agony.  I think he is demon-species vice angel-species.  

Not all demons die in a poof either. Most of them really don't. They emit yellow light and then just die. Azazel didn't poof out and he was a Prince of Hell. I think it's only being killed by the Michael Lance that made him go poof in a puff of smoke.

9 minutes ago, Goldmoon said:

This is way out there, but after reading the theory that Dean is "only dreaming" this season, I wondered if the renewal for S13 is a foiler.  What if JA IS going to direct but the two Js will no longer be in the show?  What if Claire and others will be the next generation of hunters taking over for the boys next season?  I don't want that - of course - but wondered if that is why the character of Dean got a goodbye and Sam is getting a lot of time in the spotlight in this half of the season.

I kind of like the idea that Dean is in the Empty and this season Sam and Cas have been trying to get him back.  Perhaps Crowley is helping them.

I need a fic, stat!

I would forgive so many things if my Dean is in prison still and Hallucinating or this is his worst nightmare or @ILoveReading Dean in the Empty theory would come to fruition, I would be ecstatic. LOL

Sadly, I don't think it will happen but man, I'd be on board

[DittyDotDot]

4 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Not all demons die in a poof either. Most of them really don't. They emit yellow light and then just die. Azazel didn't poof out and he was a Prince of Hell. I think it's only being killed by the Michael Lance that made him go poof in a puff of smoke.

Crowley said the Lance killed angels--like Cass--nice and slow and demons went up with a poof. So, @SueB is saying that if Ramiel was an angel he wouldn't have poofed. Ergo, Ramiel must be a demon.

[catrox14]

Just now, DittyDotDot said:

Crowley said the Lance killed angels--like Cass--nice and slow and demons went up with a poof. So, @SueB is saying that if Ramiel was an angel he wouldn't have poofed. Ergo, Ramiel must be a demon.

I understood that the first time. Sadly part of my comment went missing when I posted. That's weird.

Anyway, I had added that Ramiel could have started out as an angel and then was changed into a demon, but not that he had lost all of his angel power, like the ability to smite like angels can smite, but he still died as a demon so he went poof.

It's kind of like when Lily Sunder was able to smite because she had gained some angelic power via Enochian spells.

If they aren't angels that were turned into demons, maybe they just have the same kind of power that Lily Sunder acquired via spellwork. 

[RulerofallIsurvey]

40 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Anyway, I had added that Ramiel could have started out as an angel and then was changed into a demon, but not that he had lost all of his angel power, like the ability to smite like angels can smite, but he still died as a demon so he went poof.

I'm not sure it works like that (an angel can 'change' into a demon).  (I've tried to make that work in the past, myself)  But in this case, it falls apart for me, because the biggest 'angel to demon' would obviously be Lucifer, except that Michael made the sword to kill Lucifer nice and slow - and therefore Lucifer was/is still considered an angel.  Also because I thought demons were supposed to be made from twisted souls and angels do not have souls.  

[catrox14]

10 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

I'm not sure it works like that (an angel can 'change' into a demon).  (I've tried to make that work in the past, myself)  But in this case, it falls apart for me, because the biggest 'angel to demon' would obviously be Lucifer, except that Michael made the sword to kill Lucifer nice and slow - and therefore Lucifer was/is still considered an angel.  Also because I thought demons were supposed to be made from twisted souls and angels do not have souls

 

Knights of Hell were supposedly more powerful than any other demons until Princes of Hell were pulled out of Davy Perez's ass/Andrew Dabb's ass.

Reapers weren't angels until they were.

Demons couldn't be cured until they could.

Humans were supposed to only become demons after being tortured in Hell for who knows how long, yet demon!Dean happened because of the Mark of Cain.

Michael was the older brother until in the past two seasons, Lucifer is now being referred to as the older brother.

Chuck wasn't God until he was

My point is that canon and continuity mean squat to the writers now.

Lucifer is still an archangel, That's never been disputed. I don't see any  reason why an archangel can't use their power to turn an angel into a demon. Since we don't know anything about Princes of Hell, it's entirely possible Lucifer put demon souls into an angel. Since this is completely new anything is really possible. So who knows!

Ramiel never said which angel the Lance of Michael was supposed to make suffer. The assumption was Lucifer, but IMO that doesn't comport with how Michael thought of Lucifer throughout the show. He didn't hate Lucifer. He loved him. There was no indication that Michael had designs on tormenting Lucifer with an agonizing death. So I am not convinced that was intended only to be Lucifer and I'll stand by that until the show specifically states that to be the case.

Of course, given the complete character assassination of Michael, why not destroy the canon narrative that Michael loved Lucifer, didn't want to kill him but thought he was doing what God wanted him to do. But I'm pretty sure I veer FAR from most on that viewpoint.

[RulerofallIsurvey]

Some of the things you see as canon/continuity failures, I see as a typical learning curve.  "Demons couldn't be cured until they could"  Sure, and people couldn't travel faster than the speed of sound until they could.  New information is always being revealed, so it makes sense to me that Sam and Dean would know more now - like how to cure a werewolf - than they did in S1 or S2.  

And even if all the changes to canon don't make sense, it doesn't mean they are going to make this change with angels now becoming demons.  Then again, they might.  

I don't think it was just an assumption that the Lance was to kill Lucifer.  IMO, it was pretty heavily implied.  ymmv.

[catrox14]

Just now, RulerofallIsurvey said:

I don't think it was just an assumption that the Lance was to kill Lucifer.  IMO, it was pretty heavily implied.  ymmv.

I'm revising my opinion. Until the show, shows me in some clear canonical flashback that Michael wanted and intended to torture Lucifer to death, I don't accept the implication that it was Lucifer. And even then I'll put that down to LOLCanon.

3 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

Some of the things you see as canon/continuity failures, I see as a typical learning curve.  "Demons couldn't be cured until they could"  Sure, and people couldn't travel faster than the speed of sound until they could.  New information is always being revealed, so it makes sense to me that Sam and Dean would know more now - like how to cure a werewolf - than they did in S1 or S2.  

 

My point was that canon/continuity/"new information" is always changing in this show. So I see no reason why they can't have an angel be turned into a demon if they wanted that to happen.

7 hours ago, auntvi said:

Thanks so much, I just spent time googling when I should have been working. ;P

Azazel is from the Hebrew bible and belongs to the class of "se'irim," goat-like demons, jinn haunting the desert, to which the Israelites offer sacrifice. He was/is part of Yom Kippur atonement ceremonies; he was literally the scapegoat.

But this is what Kripke and the original writers probably read on Wikipedia:

So, yeah, Azazel is a powerful angel, who was a leader of the the fallen angels.

Oh sorry I missed this earlier. Interesting stuff. Thanks for going down the rabbit hole! LOL

[ILoveReading]

Saw this on tumblr  Not sure where it came from

Quote

Important Notice: Stick around for the last 30 seconds after the screen goes black in 12x23

[Wayward Son]

23 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

Saw this on tumblr  Not sure where it came from

Is that a recycled spoiler or someone trolling us? That was the exact spoiler they used to describe Demon!Deans arrival in 9x23 

[Aeryn13]

Well, they recycle storylines/moments all the time so it wouldn`t be surprising. Maybe Lucifer is "supposedly" defeated and then at the end Sam`s eyes flash or something. Granted, they would have to get around the giving consent moment shown onscreen but `they love shock value cliffhangers at the end of the Season. Singer admitted they do something with no real plan and then spend summer trying to think their way out of it. Or Sam gets his powers back. This might tie in with what Jared said he liked.    

[ILoveReading]

5 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

Well, they recycle storylines/moments all the time so it wouldn`t be surprising. Maybe Lucifer is "supposedly" defeated and then at the end Sam`s eyes flash or something. Granted, they would have to get around the giving consent moment shown onscreen but `they love shock value cliffhangers at the end of the Season. Singer admitted they do something with no real plan and then spend summer trying to think their way out of it. Or Sam gets his powers back. This might tie in with what Jared said he liked.    

I'm still wondering if Jensen's mention of the end of s1 was foreshadowing and all the main characters, Sam, Dean, Cas and Crowley are in peril. 

Maybe the British Men of Letters or Lucifer blows up the bunker.

[catrox14]

I'm officially  calling it will be a time jump or a reset of some kind.

I think that 30 seconds will  be the scene from s13 that the boys said they already filmed.

And I wonder if it's going to involve the  boys in their recliners and the flat screen tv they mentioned in the con.

[Aeryn13]

Quote

I think that 30 seconds will  be the scene from s13 that the boys said they already filmed.

And I wonder if it's going to involve the  boys in their recliners and the flat screen tv they mentioned in the con.

Could be of course. Though in that case, it would look more like a funny aside, tacked on after the episode ended. That would be a tad...anticlimatic. 

Quote

I'm still wondering if Jensen's mention of the end of s1 was foreshadowing and all the main characters, Sam, Dean, Cas and Crowley are in peril. 

It was an answer to a question about his favourite Finale, though. So, I don`t know if that was spoilery in any way. IMO when actors bring up stuff on their own, then it has a higher chance of playing out in what they are currently shooting.  

[SueB]

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/inside-worlds-greatest-scavenger-hunt-part-1-184128389.html

in the video about GISHWHES, they show a bit of Misha filming.   He's practicing a scene where it's Cas vs Dagon in the sandbox entrance to Heaven. Don't know what Episode. 

[catrox14]

It's Dagon and Cas at the portal to Heaven. And I see the Impala in the background. 

But WHY IS CAS wearing regular clothing. Those aren't Misha's clothes IMO. ? The  episode is called the Future. 

Man. I'm really thinking 12.19 is the last episode for Cas this season. I don't understand why they are doing this interview on set and then Misha says something about trying to find the time to do all these things.O_O

 

Edited April 15, 2017 by catrox14

[DittyDotDot]

55 minutes ago, SueB said:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/inside-worlds-greatest-scavenger-hunt-part-1-184128389.html

in the video about GISHWHES, they show a bit of Misha filming.   He's practicing a scene where it's Cas vs Dagon in the sandbox entrance to Heaven. Don't know what Episode. 

I don't have anything to point to other than a feeling, but my money is on The Future. 

ETA: Maybe I do, just checked the spoiler sheet and I don't see Ali Ahn who plays Dagon listed as a guest star after The Future. Maybe she dies in that episode?

 

Here's an updated episode list going forward from http://ibelieveinthelittletreetopper.tumblr.com/post/147242139088/supernatural-season-12-spoiler-sheet:

12x19   The Future

• OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS:  KELLY MAKES A BOLD CHOICE – Sam (Jared Padalecki) comes up with a way to stop Lucifer’s (Mark Pellegrino) baby but Castiel (Misha Collins) has something else in mind for Kelly (guest star Courtney Ford). Dean (Jensen Ackles) is furious when he finds out someone stole the colt. Kelly makes a bold choice about the baby’s future. Amanda Tapping directed the episode written by Robert Berens & Meredith Glynn (#1219). Original airdate 4/27/2017
• Written by:  Robert Berens and Meredith Glynn / Director:  Amanda Tapping
• Filming Dates: March 1 - March 10 / Airdate: April 27 (no new episode April 20)
• Castiel? Yes Crowley? No.
• Guest stars: Courtney Ford (Kelly Kline), Paul Barton (Joshua), Damien Mavis (Hozai), Paul Barton (Joshua), Ali Ahn (Dagon), Nathan Mitchell (Kelvin)
• Supposed to be heavily focused on Castiel, will be Misha's 100th credit on the show.

12x20    Twigs and Twine and Tasha Banes 

• OFFICIAL SYNOPSIS:  RICHARD SPEIGHT, JR. DIRECTS – Alicia Banes (guest star Kara Royster) calls Mary (guest star Samantha Smith) for help after her mother, Tasha (guest star Alvina August), goes missing. Sam (Jared Padalecki) answers Mary’s phone and he and Dean (Jensen Ackles) head out to help Alicia and her twin brother, Max (guest star Kendrick Sampson), find their mother who was hunting a powerful witch. Meanwhile, Mary starts to have some doubts about the British Men of Letters. Richard Speight, Jr. directed the episode written by Steve Yockey (#1220). Original airdate 5/4/2017.
• Written by: Steve Yockey / Director:  Richard Speight Jr
• Filming Dates: March 13  - 22 / Airdate: May 4
• Castiel? No. Crowley? No.
• Guest stars: David Haydn Jones (Mr. Ketch), Kara Royster (Alicia Banes), Kendrick Sampson (Max Banes), Alvina August (Tasha Banes), Tim Carlson (Andy), Samantha Smith (Mary Winchester), Elizabeth Blackmore (Toni Bevell)
• Jared’s daughter was born during filming, might be Sam-lite.

12x21   There’s Something About Mary

• Written by:  Brad Buckner and Eugenie Ross-Lemming / Director:  PJ Pesce
• Filming Dates: March 23 - April 3 / Airdate: May 11
• Castiel? Probably not. Crowley? Yes.
• Guest stars: Samantha Smith (Mary Winchester), David Haydn-Jones (Mr. Ketch), Mark Pellegrino (Lucifer),  Elizabeth Blackmore (Toni Bevell), 

12x22   Title unkown

• Written by: Robert Berens / Director:  John Showalter
• Filming Dates: April 4 - April 13 / Airdate: May 18 (preceding finale)
• Castiel? Possibly. Crowley? Possibly Not.
• Guest stars: Samantha Smith (Mary), David Haydn Jones (Arthur Ketch), Kim Rhodes (Jody Mills), Courtney Ford (Kelly Kline), Elizabeth Blackmore (Toni Bevell)

12x23  (Currently filming)  Title Unknown

• Written by: Andrew Dabb / Director:  Robert Singer
• Filming Dates: April 14 - April 26 / Airdate: May 18, 9pm (following 12x22 at 8pm)
• Castiel? Yes, Crowley?  Possibly.
• Guest stars: Mark Pellegrino (Lucifer), Courtney Ford (Kelly Kline)

7 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

But WHY IS CAS wearing regular clothing. Those aren't Misha's clothes IMO. ? The  episode is called the Future. 

Man. I'm really thinking 12.19 is the last episode for Cas this season. I don't understand why they are doing this interview on set and then Misha says something about trying to find the time to do all these things.

In the actual scene, it appears Cass is in his regular trenchcoat. So, maybe those are Misha's clothes and he was finished for the day when they did the interview? 

Edited April 15, 2017 by DittyDotDot

[catrox14]

2 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

In the actual scene, it appears Cass is in his regular trenchcoat. So, maybe those are Misha's clothes and he was finished for the day when they did the interview? 

I don't think so. There are on set photos of Cas wearing the blue shirt and slacks without the sweater. I thought I posted them a while back. 

[MysteryGuest]

I suppose anything is possible, but I just don't see them killing Cas off.  Misha might want out to devote his time to his charities, but the link to SPN definitely helps those charities, so I'm not sure he'd do that.  Plus, he really doesn't work all that much on SPN.  I guess we'll have to wait and see.  I would think the fan outcry would be overwhelming if they killed him off, though.  And I'm not sure they'd bring him back from the brink of death in one episode, just to turn around a few episodes later and kill him off.  

This might be his last episode this season, but I have to think he'll be back next year.

[DittyDotDot]

14 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

I suppose anything is possible, but I just don't see them killing Cas off.  Misha might want out to devote his time to his charities, but the link to SPN definitely helps those charities, so I'm not sure he'd do that.  Plus, he really doesn't work all that much on SPN.  I guess we'll have to wait and see.  I would think the fan outcry would be overwhelming if they killed him off, though.  And I'm not sure they'd bring him back from the brink of death in one episode, just to turn around a few episodes later and kill him off.  

This might be his last episode this season, but I have to think he'll be back next year.

I don't think it's his last episode of the season, the spoiler sheet has him down as being in episode 23 as well. It might be they end up making Cass into something other than what he currently is, though? He's supposed to get a power boost of some kind. I wonder if he ends up killing Dagon and takes on her power for some reason? Or maybe they give him the power boost in order to take out Dagon, but it ends up burning out in the effort and Cass will be back to being human again? 

But yeah, I'm pretty sure confident Cass will survive the season in some form too.

[MysteryGuest]

Powering him up somehow makes sense.  We still have no idea what happened while he was in Heaven, but I'm sure we'll find out soon enough.  The preview says that Cas has a plan for Kelly, so maybe that's why he was called back to Heaven...to find some way to deal with the Nephilim?  It would be nice if it actually worked.  The angels have been pretty boring since the early days of Cas and Uriel, etc.  It would be good to see them as powerful again.

[SueB]

I wonder if they are taking Kelly to Heaven to isolate the baby from Earth?  It that's what Cas thinks but Heaven may not be really planning a baby shower but a burial.  We'll see. 

I think Cas in heaven may have been given the power to defeat Dagon.  He's probably made the equivalent of some Angelic deal and it won't be pretty.  

I wonder who steals the Colt?  

[DittyDotDot]

1 minute ago, SueB said:

I wonder who steals the Colt?

Well, the obvious answer might be Ketch, but I wonder if it won't be Mary? 

3 minutes ago, SueB said:

I wonder if they are taking Kelly to Heaven to isolate the baby from Earth?  It that's what Cas thinks but Heaven may not be really planning a baby shower but a burial.  We'll see. 

That seems the most plausible right now. 

[MysteryGuest]

If Mary steals the Colt back from the boys, that's not going to help her PR campaign.  I hope the show doesn't go there.  There's so little to like about her right at this moment.  I would also think that Sam and Dean would take some additional precautions, considering the Bunker is now open to all comers.  My guess would be Ketch or the dreaded Lady Toni.

[ILoveReading]

21 minutes ago, SueB said:

I wonder who steals the Colt?

I wonder if it might be Cas.  He might have been tasked with killing the nephilim and his mother before the birth.  That one part in the promo he looks surprised to see Sam and Dean.

[DittyDotDot]

21 minutes ago, MysteryGuest said:

My guess would be Ketch or the dreaded Lady Toni.

Ooooh, Lady Toni is a very good bet. The timing would fit with her reemergence. Hmmm?

22 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

I wonder if it might be Cas. 

I'm trying really hard to not go there. I already have really strong S8 vibes from the promo, but I'm hoping they're not just recycling Cass around again and instead are just trying to mess with our expectations. Maybe this will be the time Cass gets it right?

BTW, it's really hard to type with one's fingers crossed. ;) 

[catrox14]

Here is the set pic from 12.19