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Spoilers With Speculation

SueB

By SueB
in Supernatural

ohjoy
Message added by ohjoy

Please keep your speculation and comments on the end of Supernatural in the Supernatural Ending topic. Use this topic here or the Bitter Speculation topic for discussion of the upcoming season only. As always, keep Bitch vs. Jerk discussion in its own topic.

Thank you.

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PeterKahlke
PeterKahlke

NEXT ON SUPERNATURAL Sam and Dean search for the yellow-eyed thing that killed their mom.

devlin
devlin

I don’t care who JA is going to be playing. I could seriously watch this guy read the phone book and be completely enthralled. I am just looking forward to some powerhouse acting full of nuances by wh

gonzosgirrl
gonzosgirrl

So, so over it. You're a big boy - if you don't agree, put up or shut your judgey piehole.

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goldy

goldy

3 hours ago, catrox14 said:

So....I'm gonna just state my worry about Cas. I haven't heard any reports of Misha filming since the end of October. Have you guys heard anything?

Misha was there (wearing his Castiel costume) with Jensen and Jared when they were doing this interview. I believe they were filming episode 10 there (the one with Alicia Witt) and the episode they are doing right now (episode 12) is suppose to be Cas centric so I'm guessing he's in this one too.

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Demented Daisy

Demented Daisy

http://tvline.com/2016/12/01/the-flash-season-3-winter-spoilers-new-threat/

Quote

Any Supernatural scoop? —Wendy
As seen in these photos (from episode 7), a banished and decaying Lucifer “does come back into play pretty significantly” in this Thursday’s episode, says Misha Collins, who is “excited to see how that big twist” with the fallen angel’s storyline plays out. Meanwhile, Dean and Sam will finally encounter Rick Springfield’s incarnation of Lucifer — but sadly, not for very long. “Most of [our] time was spent tracking him down,” Jensen Ackles explains. “So unfortunately, we didn’t really get the pleasure of working with [Rick] that much.”

Is there a spoiler in there?  

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Demented Daisy

Demented Daisy

Not really a spoiler, but....

Can JDM return to Supernatural after The Walking Dead?

 

Quote

 

“I don’t really worry about that because by the time he comes back, I’m sure [Supernatural] will have been on for 20 seasons at that point, and The Walking Deadwill be long over,” (Dabb) says with a laugh before noting that “Jeffrey’s an amazing actor… He plays such a great bad guy. But at the same time… if you give him really good material, he can go back to being someone we know and love and someone we can empathize with.

“I have full faith in him as an actor,” the EP adds, “and I’m excited to see [him return as John] if it ever comes to pass.”

 

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catrox14

catrox14

16 minutes ago, AwesomO4000 said:

I wouldn't mind John returning, because that might mean that Negan is done... and I personally hate the character.

I hate to tell you but Negan will be around for at least another season, per JDM

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iRarelyWatchTV36

iRarelyWatchTV36

5 hours ago, catrox14 said:

I hate to tell you but Negan will be around for at least another season, per JDM

*groooooan*

I really like JDM, the actor, but the Negan character is the worst!  Its a big credit that JDM makes me hate Negan so much, but good lord, the monologuing deserves its own starring credits in TWD by now.

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catrox14

catrox14

Welp, this isn't the end of the Lucifer SL per Singer and Dabb.

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/12/08/supernatural-andrew-dabb-bob-singer-mid-season-finale-lucifer-president

Quote

Those obstacles will be faced by the Winchesters, along with Castiel, Crowley, and even Rowena as the episode puts everyone on the same team to try to take down Lucifer. “It’s the big showdown with Lucifer, part 1,” Singer says, noting that the archangel will return later in the season. Dabb adds, “There’s a new chapter being opened in the Lucifer story line.” And part of that has to do with the return of the British Men of Letters.

Starting in the mid-season finale, Dabb says, “The British Men of Letters are going to come back a lot stronger, and then we’ll bring them more to the foreground as the season goes on. But it starts in this episode when we introduce a character — we’ve heard his name a few times and we’ve seen him a little bit but we get our first big introduction to him in episode 8 and use this as a launch pad into the next two-thirds of our season.” (Perhaps we’re talking about Mr. Ketch?)

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MysteryGuest

MysteryGuest

I pretty much knew it was too good to be true that tonight's episode might be the end of Lucifer.  My guess is then that he'll be the ultimate big bad that ends up uniting the American hunters with the BMOL to finally put him back where he belongs.  Or maybe they can bring him back next season for more shenanigans...

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7kstar

7kstar

I was afraid he wasn't gone because of how his light went down the vent.  Most likely dear Mr. Ketch didn't tell the whole truth.  Darn I wanted this part DONE.

Maybe Ketch thinks he can control Lucifer and finds himself needing backup for the first time.  He could be interesting but I'm afraid they will just go the wrong direction instead.  Will wait and see for now.

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Demented Daisy

Demented Daisy

I expect the next episode to be a mix of Folsom Prison Blues and Jus in Belo -- with a twist, probably.  Something to make it a little different.  Like, demons lay siege to the site, but to save Sam and Dean this time.

Though this would be the perfect time for the episode I've wanted for years, when everyone (and I mean everyone) gets together for the first time.  All of Sam and Dean's supernatural allies band together to fight the world-ending threat.  Except this time, they're joining forces to save Sam and Dean.  That could be an incredibly fun episode.

And, hey, with all that power, it could work.

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catrox14

catrox14

It will be interesting to see if Dean and Sam pray to Chuck and Amara for help and if they ignore them. . I mean this really should be the kind of thing they help the boys with especially since Lucifer is a problem Chuck made in the first place. Literally none of this happens without Chuck putting the Mark on both Amara and Lucifer.

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goldy

goldy

(edited)

Supernatural bosses: Mary still 'has some big stuff to do' this season

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/12/09/supernatural-mary-season-12

Supernatural’s mid-season finale was full of twists: Lucifer as POTUS, Sam and Dean in handcuffs, and of course, there was that whole spawn of Satan thing. But as Sam and Dean joined forces with Castiel, Crowley, and even Rowena to take down Lucifer, there was one face missing: Mary Winchester. 

“Since episode 3, Mary’s been on an eat, pray, love journey to reorient herself,” showrunner Andrew Dabb tells EW. But the good news is: Mary’s story isn’t over yet. In fact, her strongest stuff might still be to come.

“When she comes back into our story, which she’ll come back most strongly in episode 9, it’s going to be someone with a lot more of a sense of purpose,” Dabb continues. “She’s got the lay of the land. She understands the world a little bit more. She understands her sons a little bit more. Starting in episode 9, she becomes a much more proactive character in our world. She’s not going to be necessarily living in the bunker with Sam and Dean but she’s going to be more of a player in our show.”

Showrunner Robert Singer adds: “She has some big stuff to do. You’ll see her quite a bit in the back half [of the season]. What [Samantha Smith’s] done this year is just great. She has knocked it out of the park; we’re just so happy to have her back and the work she’s doing is terrific.” 

Supernatural returns Thursday, Jan. 26 in its new timeslot at 8 p.m. ET on The CW.

 

 

 

 

And there's also this:

 

 

Should I be nervous about Samantha's "#ImNotDeadYet" hashtag? Does that mean that they're gonna kill Mary off eventually?

Edited by goldy
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Demented Daisy

Demented Daisy

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/12/09/spoiler-room-vampire-diaries-supernatural-once-upon-time?xid=entertainment-weekly_socialflow_twitter

Quote

Will we see more of Mr. Ketch when Supernatural returns? — David
Not only will fans be seeing more of Mr. Ketch, but they’ll be seeing more from the British Men of Letters in general. “The British Men of Letters are very big in the second half [of the season],” showrunner Robert Singer says. “They’re certainly helpful in episode 9, and then we play them out in a really interesting way. I think the first half of the season with the British Men of Letters was a little bit of a tease letting the audience know what their capabilities were and what their goals were, and they’re quite heavy in the second half.” Maybe they can help with that whole spawn of Satan situation?

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goldy

goldy

2 hours ago, Demented Daisy said:

http://www.ew.com/article/2016/12/09/spoiler-room-vampire-diaries-supernatural-once-upon-time?xid=entertainment-weekly_socialflow_twitter

I'm glad for the reintroduction of the BMoL. I find them interesting (but I'll take anything over the Lucifer storyline). I wonder if we'll see Toni again or are we left with only  Mr. Ketch for now.

I also want to know what they'll do with the Nephilim storyline. I know that a Nephilim is consider to be an abomination but are they really dangerous to the world? We saw a Nephilim before, on S8 (when Cas was sent by Metatron to kill it) and she wasn't dangerous as far as I remember (she only reacted when she realized Cas wanted to kill her) and it would be a baby, and I can't see Sam and Dean killing a baby.(well, unless he'll be like Amara and will grow up super fast). 

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catrox14

catrox14

Well, I've decided to prepare myself for a mostly Dean lite series of episodes post 12.10 given Jensen's twins were born the week they were filming 12.11 or 12.12. I think one of those is the Cas-centric episode which should be interesting if it's as good as The Rapture or The Man Who Would Be King and ties into the current story arcs like those did.

I guess it all depends on how long they stretch  the black site part of the story. They could stretch it for several episodes. Theoretically the boys could film all their prison scenes in one day if this was planned around Jensen's need for more time away.  Thinking back to s9, which was when JJ would have been a few months old, Jensen had more time off yet the MoC still progressed and we still saw it affecting Dean. IMO, the writing camouflaged Jensen's time off better, like in Mother's Little Helper, unlike with American Nightmare where IMO Dean's absence was more noticeable and never shown or adequately explained ON SCREEN. 

They could have only Sam get out of the black site, giving Sam more to do and gives Jensen more time off for his twins.  Maybe Sam makes some kind of deal to get out in order to help get Dean out.

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goldy

goldy

17 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Well, I've decided to prepare myself for a mostly Dean lite series of episodes post 12.10 given Jensen's twins were born the week they were filming 12.11 or 12.12. I think one of those is the Cas-centric episode which should be interesting if it's as good as The Rapture or The Man Who Would Be King and ties into the current story arcs like those did.

Actually, the twins were born just as they were finishing up 1212 (which is the Cas centric episode) I have no idea about 1210, only that its the Alicia Witt episode but I think that 1211 is the "Yellow Fever" episode which suppose to be Dean centric. 

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DittyDotDot

DittyDotDot

28 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Thinking back to s9, which was when JJ would have been a few months old, Jensen had more time off yet the MoC still progressed and we still saw it affecting Dean. IMO, the writing camouflaged Jensen's time off better, like in Mother's Little Helper, unlike with American Nightmare where IMO Dean's absence was more noticeable and never shown or adequately explained ON SCREEN. 

Actually, Dean didn't have the Mark until the back-half of S9 and JJ was born in the summer.

I don't think we'll notice it, myself. It didn't seem like Jensen was taking more time off than normal and they were almost done filming before the break when the twins were born. I think they planned the Cass-centric episode to be the last episode before everyone went on break just in case Jensen needed to vamoose around that time.

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SueB

SueB

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1 minute ago, DittyDotDot said:

Actually, Dean didn't have the Mark until the back-half of S9 and JJ was born in the summer.

I don't think we'll notice it, myself. It didn't seem like Jensen was taking more time off than normal and they were almost done filming before the break when the twins were born. I think they planned the Cass-centric episode to be the last episode before everyone went on break just in case Jensen needed to vamoose around that time.

 

I think so too.  At ATLCon, when talking about filming the 250th, they mentioned Peter Roth was there and came to site and had dinner in their trailer with them. They were filming a Fraturday (Friday going into Saturday).  And the boys mentioned it was the FIRST time in 12 years that they had a Fraturday switchup due to bad weather the weekend before.  So Jensen worked until 5:30am on Saturday ... doesn't seem like they are easing off on their schedule to me.  I DO think planning a Cas-heavy episode (12.10) may have been a 'just in case' for Jensen.  But when the twins were born, per SFCon, Jensen was filming the entire day until 6 hrs before their birth.  That's pretty precise timing.  I'm going to guess it was C-section (schedule a week earlier due to the baby's being ready to come out on their own). With the cord wrapped around the boy, twins, over-35 mother, etc. random early delivery of twins would surprise me. He also mentioned her being 4 days in the hospital, which tracks.  All of this leads to - they knew what the circumstances were going to be and have planned ahead. Filming starts back up after a 4 week vacation. Finally, contract negotiations were done well before last Mar/Apr when Daneel got pregnant.  Whatever schedule they work (besides a wee bit of tactical changes), is the schedule they negotiated.  I think the big change was when they put both Mark and Misha as regulars.  That's when the boys made their time negotiations IMO.  And I suspect if they are not going to go back to JUST J2.  If that's the only story the fans are interested in, I think the boys will say it's time to hang it up.  And I don't blame them.  I personally enjoy Cas and Crowley. Like, a lot.  Yes, J2 is often more compelling for me but I find a lot of facets to Sam and Dean with their relationships with Cas and Crowley.

 

As for what's ahead.  Here's IMO the best source: http://ibelieveinthelittletreetopper.tumblr.com/post/147242139088/supernatural-season-12-spoiler-sheet

I used to keep track in detail but I found she pretty much had everything I had.  Using Jessica's cheat sheet combined with Con stuff, here's what I see:

12.09: First Blood. I'm guessing Cas and Mary rescue Sam and Dean.  Because the next 12.10 episode DOESN'T appear to have Mary but it does have the boys in a church. It's possible it's all flashbacks but I doubt they'd leave the boys incarcerated that long. Further 12.11 doesn't look remotely like they are in prison. Jensen filmed longer than Jared when they were on location (by 4 hrs). So perhaps his stunts or scenes are longer. 
Title Theory: It sure SEEMS like its connected to SSOTUS (Satan Spawn of the United States) but I'm not sure. I think could be left open for a long time (or not... Billie is mentioned in the Spoilers).

12.10 Cas backstory episode. They seemed to have made a fuss over the actress playing his former nemesis.  

12.11 Bunnies and Dean as somewhat de-aged.  Doesn't seem Jensen light to me.

12.12: Stuck in the Middle with You: Cas-centic, Richard Speight directed. Mary is there. If Jared really liked the script, Sam probably has some nice bits.

12.13: Family Feud: Rowena. Gavin! and Young Mary!  WHUT?? But it's B-L.  So that's alarming.

12.14 to 12.23 no news except the BMoL are back and big.  Since they are in 12.09 but not evident in 12.10-12.13, I'm guessing they start popping up more in the last 9.  

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catrox14

catrox14

JJ was born May 30, 2013 so she was less than a year old during the entirety of the filming s9 which started in July and ended in April.   I remember reading at other forums and TV sites that Jensen had been taking more time off, I have no reason to think that wasn't the case. 

My point was more that I think they still managed to keep Dean's MoC SL in the forefront even if Jensen/Dean was not on screen as much. Dean's SL didn't just go completely missing. It was referenced in some way. 

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catrox14

catrox14

2 minutes ago, Diane said:

I don't remember Jensen taking more time off the season that JJ was born, except choosing not to direct because he would have had to go back a couple of weeks early.

Yes, I remember reading about that as well as the comments that Jensen was taking more time off during the season.  I don't know why they would say that if that weren't the case. That's all I know.  

I'm SPECULATING that now with him having twins he could very well ask for more time away.  IF , IMO American Nightmare and LOTUS are what I have to look forward as examples of either J or J2 lite episodes, color me unimpressed. 

Quote

 I think the big change was when they put both Mark and Misha as regulars.  That's when the boys made their time negotiations IMO.  

M2 being regulars only means that SPN is the actors first priority. They can't become regulars on any other shows.   They don't have to be in every episode.  Misha  and Mark are in 11 to 13 episodes of each season since Misha was made a regular in s9 and Mark in s10.

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DittyDotDot

DittyDotDot

45 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

JJ was born May 30, 2013 so she was less than a year old during the entirety of the filming s9 which started in July and ended in April.   I remember reading at other forums and TV sites that Jensen had been taking more time off, I have no reason to think that wasn't the case. 

My point was more that I think they still managed to keep Dean's MoC SL in the forefront even if Jensen/Dean was not on screen as much. Dean's SL didn't just go completely missing. It was referenced in some way. 

I don't recall Jensen taking any time off due to JJ being born--other than choosing not to direct that year--nor do I recall his screen time being reduced in S9. He did request some time off in the back half, and they rewrote Mother's Little Helper because of it, but it wasn't due to suddenly having a daughter. He'd simply had a very heavy schedule and was burning out, as I recall. But it was only one episode and he was still in it. In fact, I think that was the season everyone was speculating if Jared was leaving the show because he'd had so much time off in comparison to Jensen.

It's kinda funny to me that both Jared's kids were born during filming and Jensen's were far more conveniently placed. ;)

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Diane

Diane

1 minute ago, DittyDotDot said:

I don't recall Jensen taking any time off due to JJ being born--other than choosing not to direct that year--nor do I recall his screen time being reduced in S9. He did request some time off in the back half, and they rewrote Mother's Little Helper because of it, but it wasn't due to suddenly having a daughter. He'd simply had a very heavy schedule and was burning out, as I recall. But it was only one episode and he was still in it. In fact, I think that was the season everyone was speculating if Jared was leaving the show because he'd had so much time off in comparison to Jensen.

It's kinda funny to me that both Jared's kids were born during filming and Jensen's were far more conveniently placed. ;)

I agree with this, I didn't think his work time was changed, but maybe my memory is off.

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)

Well, I was new to the show in 2013 and started watching live in s9 and wasn't really into all that BTS stuff until later.  I read stuff that said he did take time off beyond not directing so maybe the stuff I read was wrong. I dunno.

Either way, I'm only speculating about the back half of s12.  I'm not saying it's a foregone conclusion.  Who knows.

Edited by catrox14
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auntvi

auntvi

2 hours ago, SueB said:

12.13: Family Feud: Rowena. Gavin! and Young Mary!  WHUT?? But it's B-L.  So that's alarming.

If they're doing 3 eps this season (can't remember where I heard), this is it. The silver lining is that they won't be involved is the last few episodes. I do hope ....

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DittyDotDot

DittyDotDot

16 minutes ago, auntvi said:

If they're doing 3 eps this season (can't remember where I heard), this is it. The silver lining is that they won't be involved is the last few episodes. I do hope ....

Oh, that would be nice. They usually write four episodes while most the other writers do three. Crossing my fingers so tight...gonna be hard to get work done, but it'll be worth it! ;)

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catrox14

catrox14

(edited)

I peruse that same tumblr spoiler page fairly frequently.  She gets some good spoilers and makes some good guesses which she acknowledges as such and lists guesses in italics on her page.

Right now, for 12. 13, she has BuckLemming as writers, and young!Mary/Amy Gumenick and Gavin listed as guesses but she doesn't have any reasons for those guesses noted, not that I saw. So I'm trying to not get TOO excited at the idea of young!Mary. 

Maybe the guess about young Mary is based off this Tweet from Ruth Connell with her and Amy that Ruth posted on Sunday. The pic looks like it's taken at the same place that Ruth does live tweeting of episodes from time to time with Lisa Berry, Sam Smith and others even when those actors are not necessarily in the episode she's live tweeting.  Also, Ruth posted it Sunday but that doesn't necessarily mean it was taken on Sunday. 

https://twitter.com/RuthieConnell/status/808082713538199552

I HOPE if Amy is filming this week, maybe we'll get some more clear hints or even a set pic.  

Serge tweeted this yesterday

Amy put this on Instagram. She works in Vancouver on other shows so this may or may not be for SPN.  I hope she is because I think she is terrific and she's my favorite Mary.  I will say that her glasses look kind of funky 70s retro but that doesn't mean anything necessarily either.

 
** Removed notation. I misread the filming dates on the schedule. 
Edited by catrox14
** removed info because I misread the information.
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MysteryGuest

MysteryGuest

Since they've already used Samantha Smith in a flashback scene from when Dean was a baby, would they bring  Amy back to play Mary from the same time period?  That seems odd, unless the couldn't get Amy for that episode.  But to then bring her back for a later episode just seems strange.  I totally liked Amy as young Mary, but using both actresses to play young Mary in the same season makes no sense.  But this is Supernatural, so...

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catrox14

catrox14

The only reason I can see for AmyG!Mary would be a flashback to her being 19 again. The flashback with Sam Smith was when Mary was 25 or 26, since Dean was a year old when she saved Asa Fox. Sam Smith can't pass for 19 or 20 even with pigtails.

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