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Celebrating 25 Years Of The West Wing

Spoilers With Speculation

SueB

By SueB
in Supernatural

ohjoy
Message added by ohjoy

Please keep your speculation and comments on the end of Supernatural in the Supernatural Ending topic. Use this topic here or the Bitter Speculation topic for discussion of the upcoming season only. As always, keep Bitch vs. Jerk discussion in its own topic.

Thank you.

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PeterKahlke
PeterKahlke

NEXT ON SUPERNATURAL Sam and Dean search for the yellow-eyed thing that killed their mom.

devlin
devlin

I don’t care who JA is going to be playing. I could seriously watch this guy read the phone book and be completely enthralled. I am just looking forward to some powerhouse acting full of nuances by wh

gonzosgirrl
gonzosgirrl

So, so over it. You're a big boy - if you don't agree, put up or shut your judgey piehole.

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SueB

SueB

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J2 was ‘invited back’ at the beginning of November.  I don’t know when negotiations were done (yes, it’s definitely with WBTV) but by Christmas makes the most sense.  This would allow WBTV to negotiate with the CW at the beginning of January.  That would support an announcement as early as the January TCA press tour (like they did in 2017).  It also supports locking down your leads before pilot season (casting calls also starts in January for most).

I thought the boys signed two year deals at a time after the first seven.  I don’t have a source for that but that was something I heard with 8/9 while watching a con video.  Probably secures them for the next season and guarantees them something for ‘sitting out’ Pilot season with an option for the second year.   I agree the other regulars don’t seem to get the same respect in terms of timing and they definitely seem yearly.

What was evident at Paleyfest was a longer view than just another season.  This, IMO, supports the two-year approach.  And I think Singer’s comments regarding Alex suggest they’ve made the decision to not kill off Jack and bring him back for next year.  Misha seems safe.  OTOH, Mark P’s lack of appearance does not bode well for him in S14 (which makes me happy).  

Finally, I suspect they killed off Crowley because Mark S. was expensive compared to getting both Mark P & Alex.  And they had ‘redeemed’ Crowley (mostly... as far as one could with the human blood-infected King of Hell).  

If they drop Mark P in S14, that probably supports keeping Alex and more recurring characters.  Having said that, they had quite a few recurring guests in S13. But I have no doubt that part of what Dabb/Singer does is work that math to stretch their dollars.  But J2’s salaries and conditions, of course, are foundational before any other decisions are made.  That’s another reason why Inthink they locked them in by Christmastime. 

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enaiowen

enaiowen

I'm still no fan of the idea of Michael!Dean.  I was glad that it didn't happen in Season 5 and I have very little faith in the current writers to be able to deliver

a.) something that doesn't destroy Dean's character and

b.) something that will live up to the near mythic proportions that the possibility has been built into. 

And while it might turn out to be the most incredible, amazing thing ever (which, despite not being something I particularly want, I would be thrilled if that were the case)........

I am afraid that, as a very wise someone once said:

"you (the general you) may find that 'having' is not so pleasing a thing after all as 'wanting.'

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gonzosgirrl

gonzosgirrl

@enaiowen I think many Dean fans share your concerns - I know I do. Be careful what you wish for is very much in play here. I'll admit that the Scooby episode turned out better than anticipated, but a big part of that for me is simply deciding to disregard the things they got glaringly wrong (Dean-wise) and enjoy the spectacle. I won't be able to do that with a serious arc, and one with so much potential.

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Castiels Cat

Castiels Cat

(edited)
3 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

Michael?

 

image.thumb.png.0c3c2e96fc08f1e61c290e174457b3d5.png

 

Three depictions of angels all (?) With swords.  No defining attributes to confirm Michael per show canon, ie. The lance.  Definitely something that they wanted us to notice.  Unlikely to refer to any angels that we have seen any ho hum random angel.  Both of the paintings have green garments.  I googled archangel with green garments and apparently there is a fantasy series in which Uriel wears green however he would be can odd choice as his one standout characteristic was a great sense of humor According to other angels. 

The other thing rhat strikes me is the blue light around the first image.  Maybe a Michael hint. Was his light uber blue?

I think they want us to be spec'ing angels.

1 hour ago, enaiowen said:

I'm still no fan of the idea of Michael!Dean.  I was glad that it didn't happen in Season 5 and I have very little faith in the current writers to be able to deliver

a.) something that doesn't destroy Dean's character and

b.) something that will live up to the near mythic proportions that the possibility has been built into. 

And while it might turn out to be the most incredible, amazing thing ever (which, despite not being something I particularly want, I would be thrilled if that were the case)........

I am afraid that, as a very wise someone once said:

"you (the general you) may find that 'having' is not so pleasing a thing after all as 'wanting.'

My worry is Singer, Dabbler and Hacks 

2 hours ago, SueB said:

J2 was ‘invited back’ at the beginning of November.  I don’t know when negotiations were done (yes, it’s definitely with WBTV) but by Christmas makes the most sense.  This would allow WBTV to negotiate with the CW at the beginning of January.  That would support an announcement as early as the January TCA press tour (like they did in 2017).  It also supports locking down your leads before pilot season (casting calls also starts in January for most).

I thought the boys signed two year deals at a time after the first seven.  I don’t have a source for that but that was something I heard with 8/9 while watching a con video.  Probably secures them for the next season and guarantees them something for ‘sitting out’ Pilot season with an option for the second year.   I agree the other regulars don’t seem to get the same respect in terms of timing and they definitely seem yearly.

What was evident at Paleyfest was a longer view than just another season.  This, IMO, supports the two-year approach.  And I think Singer’s comments regarding Alex suggest they’ve made the decision to not kill off Jack and bring him back for next year.  Misha seems safe.  OTOH, Mark P’s lack of appearance does not bode well for him in S14 (which makes me happy).  

Finally, I suspect they killed off Crowley because Mark S. was expensive compared to getting both Mark P & Alex.  And they had ‘redeemed’ Crowley (mostly... as far as one could with the human blood-infected King of Hell).  

If they drop Mark P in S14, that probably supports keeping Alex and more recurring characters.  Having said that, they had quite a few recurring guests in S13. But I have no doubt that part of what Dabb/Singer does is work that math to stretch their dollars.  But J2’s salaries and conditions, of course, are foundational before any other decisions are made.  That’s another reason why Inthink they locked them in by Christmastime. 

You think season 15 and possibly beyond then.

I miss Mark Shepherd's Crowley.  He is a loss and they know it. Hence the abhorrent Crowley adjacent characters they have tossed in.

Edited by Castiels Cat
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SueB

SueB

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ITA the Archangel motif is heavy in the episode.  I haven't checked but I'm pretty sure it's NOT in the original 1970's "A Night Of Fright Is No Delight". But here's the conundrum... they've been off animating this episode in Thailand (?... somewhere in Asia) for the last year.  At what point did Dabb & Singer decide "hey, throw in some different artwork in the background with the Archangel motif?"  That's just not something I think the big Supernatural fan from Scooby Doo would do on their own.  Certainly easier to put that stuff in say last fall that recently... but that's a pretty big "put" into the animation.  So, it seems credible but it also seems to me it's been known since the season start by Dabb/Singer if it's intentional (which, again, seems credible).

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SueB

SueB

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(edited)
32 minutes ago, Castiels Cat said:

You think season 15 and possibly beyond then.

I miss Mark Shepherd's Crowley.  He is a loss and they know it. Hence the abhorrent Crowley adjacent characters they have tossed in.

 

I think the boys are signed for S15 as at least a pre-negotiated option.  If they don't annouce SPN S14 as it's "final year" at the Upfronts then I think S15 is likely. 

I say this for two reasons, the Smallville experience and CW needs the show. 
1) Smallville was the last decade-long genre show that they had before Supernatural.  They announced Smallville's final season at the May Upfronts and spent the entire year advertising it that way.  It seemed obvious they were hoping for fans who had left to come back to see the final year play out.  I just don't see the CW passing up on the opportunity for the free press and milking every possible viewer the last season.  
2) The second reason I think S14 isn't the last is that I think the CW doesn't just want Supernatural, they NEED it.  Supernatural was the #2 show last fall, and although Black Lightening beat it for several weeks early on, Supernatural won this past week for the CW.  The Flash was a rerun and Black Lightening only got a .5 and a 1.51.  SPN has been doing better than the .5/1.51 in general, let alone this past week's special episode.  So, while there may be some haggling between WBTV and CW on the per episode price as the CW tries to accomodate adding Sunday programming, I think they are not in a strong position to negotiate much lower than they already pay per episode.  You probably already know that the CW already does NOT pay the full $2M per episode it costs for production, WBTV makes it money through more than one method. But it's not beyond them to try and push.  Add the complication of trying to get Wayward off the ground and negotiations could be more complex.  But Supernatural is still kicking butt and taking names in the ratings, the CW is going to have to make a reasonable offer.    What the CW needs is one of it's new pilots (or Black Lightening) to become as strong a lead-in as Supernatural.  The 8pm show is generally the stronger show and they want the audience to stay for the 9pm show.  When they moved Supernatural (a show that REALLY should be on at 9pm) to 8pm, they did so based on strength of performance.  Black Lightening is at 9pm but I suspect they'll move up to an 8pm show next year.  That means The Flash, Black Lightening, Supernatual, and Supergirl as four of the six needed 8pm shows.  Arrow has really slipped and needs to be paired back with The Flash or Legends of Tomorrow.  

Bottom Line: I don't see S14 as being announced as the last year at the May Upfronts.  I think if they DID decide S14 was the last year it would be due to surprisingly poor ratings next fall combined with the pilots really taking off.  Seems unlikely to me.  So, S15 at the earliest IMO as the end date.  And I think that's consistent with the way the producers and cast are talking about the show these days.  

Edited by SueB
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Jonesy

Jonesy

6 hours ago, SueB said:

J2 was ‘invited back’ at the beginning of November.  I don’t know when negotiations were done (yes, it’s definitely with WBTV) but by Christmas makes the most sense.  This would allow WBTV to negotiate with the CW at the beginning of January.  That would support an announcement as early as the January TCA press tour (like they did in 2017).  It also supports locking down your leads before pilot season (casting calls also starts in January for most).

I thought the boys signed two year deals at a time after the first seven.  I don’t have a source for that but that was something I heard with 8/9 while watching a con video.  Probably secures them for the next season and guarantees them something for ‘sitting out’ Pilot season with an option for the second year.   I agree the other regulars don’t seem to get the same respect in terms of timing and they definitely seem yearly.

What was evident at Paleyfest was a longer view than just another season.  This, IMO, supports the two-year approach.  And I think Singer’s comments regarding Alex suggest they’ve made the decision to not kill off Jack and bring him back for next year.  Misha seems safe.  OTOH, Mark P’s lack of appearance does not bode well for him in S14 (which makes me happy).  

Finally, I suspect they killed off Crowley because Mark S. was expensive compared to getting both Mark P & Alex.  And they had ‘redeemed’ Crowley (mostly... as far as one could with the human blood-infected King of Hell).  

If they drop Mark P in S14, that probably supports keeping Alex and more recurring characters.  Having said that, they had quite a few recurring guests in S13. But I have no doubt that part of what Dabb/Singer does is work that math to stretch their dollars.  But J2’s salaries and conditions, of course, are foundational before any other decisions are made.  That’s another reason why Inthink they locked them in by Christmastime. 

I agree with everything you say here but I do think Mark P. will still be back as a regular next year along with Alex and J2M--really think he was just holding down filming while the others went to Paley and wasn't a sign he's gone.  Don't think Micheal/Lucifer will be wrapped up at end of season.  Also have been confident 14 won't be the last season--so yes at least to 15...I think that's the case if they sign or plan it two years for everybody OR sign everyone up one year at a time.  I think either way they will negotiate to at least 15--there seems to be positive vibes all around that it's not ending at 14.

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Wayward Son

Wayward Son

(edited)

IMO whether the regulars (Misha, Mark P and Alexander) stay with the show will most likely come down to financial logistics. 

 

While Supernatural only has two leads, compared to the other ensemble CW shows which have 5 or 6, it has two very expensive (for the CW) leads. IIRC the last publicly released per episode figure for J2 was $175,000 each, which means the two alone cost $350,000 per episode. That figure was released in 2016 and may have increased further since. By contrast the last public per episode figure for Arrow lead Stephen Amell was $50,000 though again that may have gone up in negotiations that have taken place since then. So J2 roughly cost the same as seven leads on the networks second oldest show. As a result there isn’t as much left in the budget for the regulars as people may think based on the fact there’s only two leads. 

 

Unless they feel Jack has come to his natural end storyline wise I can’t imagine they’ll let Alexander go. I’d imagine he’s a relatively cheap regular. He’s young, with limited overall experience and therefore needs to build a name for himself, and he’s only new to the show this year. All factors which don’t allow him to go to the negotiations table expecting a large wage. 

 

Without access to the exact figures its impossible to know who is a more costly regular, Misha or Mark P. On the one hand, Misha has SN seniority. He has been with the show every season for ten years now and has been a regular for the last five.  It is also well known Castiel is a beloved character with a strong fan base, which gives him a stronger position at the negotiating table. Misha has also recently been upgraded billing wise so the credits read “And Misha Collins”. Was this a perk for his CV or was it offered in lieu of a pay raise? If so is Misha actually a much cheaper regular than we’d expect?

 

On the other hand, Misha hasn’t made much of an impact on the entertainment world outside of Supernatural. Mark Pellegrino however has been on numerous shows and has established a strong reputation for himself as a result. Would the fact he’s a better overall known name than Misha be able to enough offset Misha’s advantages and earn him a higher pay?

 

I think the answer to that question would probably have a large influence on who stays or goes between Misha and Mark P if one of them needed to be let go for budgetary reasons. 

Edited by Wayward Son
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Jonesy

Jonesy

(edited)

No doubts Misha is there to the last show--zero doubt.  If they were going to get rid of him, they would have left him dead this season(which I never thought they would).  Alex is cheap and Mark P. is not expensive.  Budgetary--this whole cast compared to many shows is relatively cheap.

Edited by Jakes
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Wayward Son

Wayward Son

1 minute ago, Jakes said:

No doubts Misha is there to the last show--zero doubt.  If they were going to get rid of him, they would have left him dead this season.  Alex is cheap and Mark P. is not expensive.  Budgetary--this whole cast compared to many shows is relatively cheap.

For the reasons I outline above I don’t think this shows cast is cheap compared to the rest of the CW. However, if we are talking about tv in general then I’d agree the cast are cheaper, or similar to, the cast of shows on bigger networks such as ABC, NBC and CBS.

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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

(edited)
12 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

his whole cast compared to many shows is relatively cheap.

*quoted wrong post.  Above quote is from @Jakes

Not really.  Jared and Jensen are the highest paid actors on the CW and if this a contract year salaries are most likely to go up. 

As for the angel imagery I don't think it means anything.  There was an episode a few years back ( i can't remember what one) and there was a big picture of Michael in the back ground.  Fans tweeted Jim Michaels and asked if it was significant.  He was like "yes of course, we take so much care with these things." Shocker it turned out to mean nothing.  Last year when they had the perfect opportunity to reference Dean's connection to Michael, they gave the spear to Sam. 

So I don't see any bread crumbs laid.  I think its something they decided at the last minute.   I still don't even know what the mainstory line or villian is this year.  There are too many irons in the fire and none are getting the attention they deserve.  The last thing they needed to do was add another storyline with Gabriel.  If Dean is going to vessel Michael, whats the point? 

As for Mark P, I don't see him going anywhere, unfortunately.  He was only missing from Paley because he was filming.  I don't think it means anything status wise that he wasn't there.

7 hours ago, enaiowen said:

I'm still no fan of the idea of Michael!Dean.  I was glad that it didn't happen in Season 5 and I have very little faith in the current writers to be able to deliver

I have reservations and I know that there are multiple ways this could set Dean's character up to fail, but at this point anything is preferable to Valium Dean.

Edited by ILoveReading
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Jonesy

Jonesy

(edited)
33 minutes ago, Wayward Son said:

For the reasons I outline above I don’t think this shows cast is cheap compared to the rest of the CW. However, if we are talking about tv in general then I’d agree the cast are cheaper, or similar to, the cast of shows on bigger networks such as ABC, NBC and CBS.

Yeah, to some of the CW perhaps--though we only have 5 regulars(and 2 of them cheap) and most on the CW have more(some many more) and we already saved with Mark S.--plus super hero shows have more effects and production money.   That said I don't think the budget for SPN is too far bigger than even CW shows and it's amazingly low for a 13 year old show.  Plus SPN brings in more than the other CW shows via syndication, dvds, etc.  So in the end I don't think the cast budget in total context is too bad and I don't think they'll need to chop any cast members imo.

Edited by Jakes
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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

(edited)
Quote

As for Mark P, I don't see him going anywhere, unfortunately.  He was only missing from Paley because he was filming.  I don't think it means anything status wise that he wasn't there.

I thought they would shelf him for a bit after "Beat the Devil" - not write out of course but just put somewhere for further use next Season. But apparently he remains in the thick of things. Don`t know what happens there because right now he simply isn`t a power player. Even Heaven, he only rules on a sham because angels are terribly stupid.

He needs archangel grace to level up again and the only avenue I see right now is him stealing it from AU!Michael as "dramatic irony". But that requires brining AU!Michael in a really vulnerable position first because right now he would wipe the floor with everyone with the possible exception of Jack. 

It could be Rowena gets involved there and whatever she means to use against Lucifer accidentally works on AU!Michael and helps Lucifer. 

Edited by Aeryn13
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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

18 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

I thought they would shelf him for a bit after "Beat the Devil" - not write out of course but just put somewhere for further use next Season. But apparently he remains in the thick of things. Don`t know what happens there because right now he simply isn`t a power player. Even Heaven, he only rules on a sham because angels are terribly stupid.

He needs archangel grace to level up again and the only avenue I see right now is him stealing it from AU!Michael as "dramatic irony". But that requires brining AU!Michael in a really vulnerable position first because right now he would wipe the floor with everyone with the possible exception of Jack. 

It could be Rowena gets involved there and whatever she means to use against Lucifer accidentally works on AU!Michael and helps Lucifer. 

Based on spoilers, I'm guessing that Sam and Rowena confront Lucifer in ep 21 and it goes really badly.  Leaving Sam injured, and beat up (again).  Then Michael ends up in our world for...reasons and Jack, Gabriel, Asmodeos, Mary, Bobby, and Lucifer, Rowena, and Sam are doing...stuff.

Dean figuring he needs a power boost says yes to Michael as part of a plan. 

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

Yes, all the renewed shows were super-expected. Maybe they will even think out the plot for Season 14 a bit and not just do "cliffhanger" ending of Dean as possibly Michael (or whomever) and then go "okay, what`s next?"  

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Wayward Son

Wayward Son

1 minute ago, Aeryn13 said:

Yes, all the renewed shows were super-expected. Maybe they will even think out the plot for Season 14 a bit and not just do "cliffhanger" ending of Dean as possibly Michael (or whomever) and then go "okay, what`s next?"  

They’ll probably do Dean!Michael episode 22 and 23. He succeeds in defeating Au!Michael and the cliffhanger scene is Michael refusing to exit Dean as promised and disappearing leaving Sam and possibly Cas staring at the spot he stood.

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

Didn`t the spoiler say he was only going to play whomever-it-is in the Finale? Though I could see it as a mini-cliffhanger of episode 22 and then fully in episode 23.  

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Jonesy

Jonesy

4 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

Didn`t the spoiler say he was only going to play whomever-it-is in the Finale? Though I could see it as a mini-cliffhanger of episode 22 and then fully in episode 23.  

We don't know how exactly long Dean will play whomever--could go some beyond this year.

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

No, I didn`t mean about the longevity but the spoiler did say, as far as I remember, that for this Season, Jensen would only play the character in the Finale. Compared to, like the last three or so. 

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Jonesy

Jonesy

2 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

No, I didn`t mean about the longevity but the spoiler did say, as far as I remember, that for this Season, Jensen would only play the character in the Finale. Compared to, like the last three or so. 

Hmmm...not sure about that.

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Wayward Son

Wayward Son

6 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

No, I didn`t mean about the longevity but the spoiler did say, as far as I remember, that for this Season, Jensen would only play the character in the Finale. Compared to, like the last three or so. 

I don’t think I read that. I’ll amend my statement to Michael possesses him at the very start of the episode and the cliffhanger is Michael refusing to leave Dean as agreed. 

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gonzosgirrl

gonzosgirrl

They showed a little clip from the next episode on The Talk (J2 on today) and *gasp* Dean is actually doing research and found what they were looking for. Maybe they really did have some serious negotiations. Heh.

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Aeryn13

Aeryn13

*thump*

Excuse me, I seem to have lost conciousness. Checks who the writer is. Sees it`s Davey Perez.  *thump*

Really need to look into that feinting thing. 

Thanks for the headsup.

Something I found amusing about the promo for next week`s episode is that IMO it gives the conclusion away. Well, as much as that is possible anyhow. The summary said they are looking for another ingredient in that new bunker - seal of Solomon? - and in the promo they have have the "now all we need is archangel grace" line. So, I guess their hunt is successful then. Hahahaha. Thanks, promo.

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Jonesy

Jonesy

Almost forgot about The Talk--seriously I don't think Jensen dislikes how Dean has been written the last few years as some Dean fans do--and NOT this Dean fan(overall treat him as the leader and not a dummy)...think he has been written well.  Jensen always likes comic parts of Dean which are parts some Dean fans dislike and which I like.

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Bobcatkitten

Bobcatkitten

I went from super excited about the renewal to super annoyed about this tease. Please no - stop bringing everyone back. Especially when they do hardly anything. A one-off scene filler isn't what we need. We already have too many freaking characters this year. I beg them to go small next year. 

 

Question: Anything on the remaining episodes of Supernatural? —Claire
Ausiello: Executive producer Andrew Dabb promises not one but “two very surprising returns” before Season 13 is over, while EP Robert Singer confirms that “there’ll be an alternate universe” version of a character à la Alt Bobby and Alt Kevin Tran. Adds Singer: “A lot of the end of this season is getting the whole gang back together. Scheduling has been really difficult with everybody because they’re all working actors, but we’ve managed to cram pretty much everybody that the audience loves into this final run of episodes.” You guys thinking what I’m thinking?!

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bearcatfan

bearcatfan

2 minutes ago, scribe95 said:

I went from super excited about the renewal to super annoyed about this tease. Please no - stop bringing everyone back. Especially when they do hardly anything. A one-off scene filler isn't what we need. We already have too many freaking characters this year. I beg them to go small next year. 

 

Question: Anything on the remaining episodes of Supernatural? —Claire
Ausiello: Executive producer Andrew Dabb promises not one but “two very surprising returns” before Season 13 is over, while EP Robert Singer confirms that “there’ll be an alternate universe” version of a character à la Alt Bobby and Alt Kevin Tran. Adds Singer: “A lot of the end of this season is getting the whole gang back together. Scheduling has been really difficult with everybody because they’re all working actors, but we’ve managed to cram pretty much everybody that the audience loves into this final run of episodes.” You guys thinking what I’m thinking?!

John?

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Wayward Son

Wayward Son

3 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

He can`t be an AU-version, though, because AU-John is dead. Unless he is possessed by a demon. 

Charlie?

Unless they introduce another AU? 

 

I think we can rule out Genevieve / AU Ruby since they talk about scheduling and “working actors” and I think Gen is a stay at home mom these days? 

 

Who else other than JDM has regular work at the moment?

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gonzosgirrl

gonzosgirrl

14 minutes ago, scribe95 said:

I went from super excited about the renewal to super annoyed about this tease. Please no - stop bringing everyone back. Especially when they do hardly anything. A one-off scene filler isn't what we need. We already have too many freaking characters this year. I beg them to go small next year. 

 

Question: Anything on the remaining episodes of Supernatural? —Claire
Ausiello: Executive producer Andrew Dabb promises not one but “two very surprising returns” before Season 13 is over, while EP Robert Singer confirms that “there’ll be an alternate universe” version of a character à la Alt Bobby and Alt Kevin Tran. Adds Singer: “A lot of the end of this season is getting the whole gang back together. Scheduling has been really difficult with everybody because they’re all working actors, but we’ve managed to cram pretty much everybody that the audience loves into this final run of episodes.” You guys thinking what I’m thinking?!

That last line, "You guys thinking what I'm thinking?!" is a link to the TVLine article from last spring about Crowley getting killed off. Now that would be a truly shocking twist.

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Wayward Son

Wayward Son

Bearing in mind @Aeryn13‘s reminder that AU!John is dead there’s only one thing I can think of. What if AU!Michael resurrects AU!John to act as a vessel in response to Dean saying yes to our Michael?  

 

Yes, I know he has a vessel, but thereotically true vessel Dean would give our Michael a large boost over AU, and it would make sense for him to seek a Winchester bloodline vessel of his own to somewhat balance it out. 

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Bobcatkitten

Bobcatkitten

5 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

That last line, "You guys thinking what I'm thinking?!" is a link to the TVLine article from last spring about Crowley getting killed off. Now that would be a truly shocking twist.

I would be shocked - and happy - if it was Mark Shepard given how things ended. But maybe they realized they made a mistake? Who knows. Thinking outside the box it could be Ellen or Adam or Charlie. So many departed characters to pick from. 

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catrox14

catrox14

If they bring back Crowley, it would be a re-cast and I think it would piss off most of the audience if it's not Mark Sheppard.

I can't fathom them doing that other than to be assholes.

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gonzosgirrl

gonzosgirrl

(edited)
3 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

If they bring back Crowley, it would be a re-cast and I think it would piss off most of the audience if it's not Mark Sheppard.

I can't fathom them doing that other than to be assholes.

I'm just saying, Ausiello doesn't usually play coy, and it's a link to an article about Mark. 99.9% it's just wishful thinking on his (and my) part, but it is funny he'd choose to link that, of all possible speculation. I expected it to be a link to something JDM related.

ETA: I'll eat my hat if Charlie isn't one of the characters brought back.

Edited by gonzosgirrl
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ILoveReading

ILoveReading

One of the characters is Naomi.  There was a pic posted of her on set and it looked like she was wearing her Naomi outfit.

I really hope the AU character isn't an AU Dean because that would be the biggest cop out on the Jensen isn't going to play Dean.  An AU Dean is still a version of Dean. 

TBH, the last thing this season needs is more characters crammed in.  The final two episodes are going to be so jammed packed nothing is going to make sense.

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Diane

Diane

3 minutes ago, ILoveReading said:

One of the characters is Naomi.  There was a pic posted of her on set and it looked like she was wearing her Naomi outfit.

I really hope the AU character isn't an AU Dean because that would be the biggest cop out on the Jensen isn't going to play Dean.  An AU Dean is still a version of Dean. 

TBH, the last thing this season needs is more characters crammed in.  The final two episodes are going to be so jammed packed nothing is going to make sense.

She directed an episode, she may not have been acting.  She has directed a least one more episode in a previous season.

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