Empire in the Media: Read It In Billboard

[Dee]

So there's more to the story. Interesting.

[RealReality10]

4 hours ago, Dee said:

When did I ever say it wasn't?

No. The rate of actual hoaxes being dwarfed by the rise of hate crimes which began long before this Jussie debacle happened is proof that one person's actions do not "set us back,"

No.

Jussie being removed from the final episodes is a fact.

Jussie losing his job is speculation.

LGBT & Black fans turning on Jussie en masse is conjecture.

Also the fact that you stated those labels as separate undercuts any potential points you were attempting to make.

Which is what you're attempting to do. If you have an issue with others expressing their opinions, that's your fault.

I feel like the number of hate crimes is nothing js is responsible for.  Though, there is always pathetic desperate hateful people looking for attention and so I would not be surprised if js hoax spawned a "copycat" actual hate crime.

What js is responsible for is for making this community of victims less likely to be believed by the majority.  

I mean you want to maintain that black lgbtq victims are not believed, but everyone believed smolletts story when it first came out.

There was no backlash, no outcry from the right wing when his story first came out.  Heck more people believed him than believed Dr blasie Ford, a privileged white woman.  

[jsbt]

Like I said a day ago:

13 hours ago, jsbt said:

You don't hire Mark Geragos to confess and throw yourself on the mercy of the court. You hire him to obfuscate as much as possible.

People's recent Twitter jokes aside, I highly doubt Jussie wrote the dudes a check for 'fake hate crime' to pay them for the whole charade. This is likely a defense leak to try to help his case at trial. Both leaking the check and the drug thing are attempts at muddying the waters but that's typical Geragos for you. I didn't think he'd see jail time regardless but his career is likely done, and I guess that's some small measure of justice.

[Dee]

Black-ish Star Jenifer Lewis on the Jussie Smollett Controversy: 'We Have to Have Compassion'

Quote

“I’m not going to lie to you, I am one of the most compassionate people on this planet. I love people. I’m an entertainer,” said Lewis, 62. “But when we make a mistake — I mean, who knows the true story? But I do know that we have to have compassion. But more than that, there has to be consequences — for whatever happened.”

“Because the temperament of the country right now, it’s fragile,” she continued. “All I can say is let’s all put one foot forward and stand with each other. We need to unite now. It doesn’t matter who does what, because it’s going to be a lot of things going on. Our job is to stand together on the frontline and say, ‘No!’ when we know it’s not right.”

[thebigboot]

5 hours ago, Dee said:

Black-ish Star Jenifer Lewis on the Jussie Smollett Controversy: 'We Have to Have Compassion'

Compassion for what? A known liar who hit every button to get people riled up? Ellen Page wasn’t calling for compassion, AOC wasn’t calling for compassion, Booker and Harris wanted to use his lies to justify a lynching bill. I mean even after the Nigerian brothers got arrested he didn’t open his mouth about them working together as he is now after he’s been indicted. Any compassion he could have gotten went out the window when he doubled down on his lies.

[RealReality10]

53 minutes ago, thebigboot said:

Compassion for what? A known liar who hit every button to get people riled up? Ellen Page wasn’t calling for compassion, AOC wasn’t calling for compassion, Booker and Harris wanted to use his lies to justify a lynching bill. I mean even after the Nigerian brothers got arrested he didn’t open his mouth about them working together as he is now after he’s been indicted. Any compassion he could have gotten went out the window when he doubled down on his lies.

Yeah, I would save my compassion for actual hate crime victims and hate crime  victims after this who are subject to a higher degree of public scrutiny because the public remembers being Hoodwinked by jussie Smollett.

I might even see clear to offering some compassion if jussie smolett had even bothered to admit he did something wrong and asked for forgiveness instead of trying to low key blame drugs or suggest that he was not involved because he really paid $3500 for a workout plan.

Again, people need to learn when to cut someone loose and call them out on their bs.  IMO, this is as nearly as bad as people who are apologists for racist politicians.

[Rickster]

Chicago Police Superintendent told Robin Roberts on ABC this morning that there is much more evidence that has not been made public.

[Princess Sparkle]

Mod Note: I'm locking the thread for 12 hours to give everyone a chance to cool off. Posts have been hidden. I know this is a difficult subject that everyone has strong opinions on, but remember to take a pause and breathe before you post.

[Princess Sparkle]

Mod Note: When it comes to the Jussie situation, I know tensions are high, opinions are strong, and new information is continually coming out. Remember to keep your snark and opinions focused on the situation  and not your fellow posters. 

[jsbt]

[thebigboot]

10 minutes ago, jsbt said:

But I thought the brothers were good wholesome non homophobic folks, isn’t that what the Empire cast said?

[RealReality10]

^^ at this point it sounds like js's team is just putting anything out there might stick like the proverbial spaghetti to the wall.

[Dee]

The Obsession With Jussie Smollett’s ‘Hoax’ Is Obscuring the Real Threat of Racist Violence

Quote

Smollett’s alleged hoax matters, of course, but not as much as the real-life activities of real, live racists—and yet Smollett is getting by far the most coverage. And the fact that Smollett apparently lied about a hate crime should not obscure the fact that hate crimes are increasing in the age of Trump. We, the media, must do better here.

[thebigboot]

18 minutes ago, Dee said:

The Obsession With Jussie Smollett’s ‘Hoax’ Is Obscuring the Real Threat of Racist Violence

Like the Jews being assaulted in NYC with no press? Oh wait, that’s not a threat because it’s happening but since it’s not MAGA hat wearers committing the assaults it’s not important. Yeah, I think the obsession with Jussie’s hoax is the fact so many people fell for it and rode it going so far as to try to introduce a bill because of it and he can’t even say sorry.

At least it’s getting the MAGA assaults some publicity!

81 year old assaulted for wearing MAGA hat

Man charged for pulling gun on MAGA hat wearing couple

Woman arrested for assaulting MAGA hat wearer in Cape Cod

Edited February 26, 2019 by thebigboot

[jsbt]

What I appreciate most about the Craig Jenkins Vulture piece posted earlier is that he validates and identifies with the same feelings I feel: "People don’t easily believe victims of assault. Judiciary presumption of innocence places the burden of proof on the accuser. The court of opinion turns cases into public referendums on the goodness of the victim. Fear is still treated as a legitimate catalyst for deadly force. Gay and trans panic defenses in most states continue to allow heterosexual perps to claim temporary insanity for violence against LGBTQ victims. Staging a sham hate crime in an era where people don’t believe the real ones is unforgivable. [...] Smollett should right whatever wrong he’s responsible for, although I couldn’t begin to say what that would look like, because this thing put a lot of wind in the sails of people who would like nothing more than to suggest black men, gay men, and/or black gay men love to play victim." That's what Jussie's sham has wrought, and it's very real and he's only making it worse, he's emboldened the bigoted people he tried to pin it on for his personal gain and made people like him more vulnerable.

As for the legendary Jenifer Lewis, she also says that there definitely needs to be consequences for his actions. And she's absolutely right.

[RealReality10]

Well, it is sad.  We do have hate crimes that get attention (Charlottesville).  

But, let's say that the hate crime attention level was at a baseline of 0.  After this incident, the attention is now negative which means that instead of being at a 0 the general attention is like a -10 in that people are wary and more likely to consider a publicized hate crime a hoax.  And it's pretty unfortunate because someone like JS could have chosen any number of actual hate crimes from across the country or the world and garnered national and international attention for the cause, which would have given victims and the issue a higher profile.

@thebigboot -- the world is sad.  Maybe the nudists have it right 

[Margohill]

Tbh this will be a week defense for Smollett. The brothers follow him across social media and consistently use his music in social posts. https://www.pride.com/news/2019/2/19/brothers-jussie-smollett-case-were-instagram-friends-actor …

It's already on Facebook now🤣🤣🤣🤣

No damage control will change my current perception of him: A BONAFIDE LIAR. The image of him lying on GMA will always remain with me. The question that still bugs me is why JS why? He had the meatiest role of all the brothers on Empire with everything going for him but selfishness got the better of him. He didn't spoil things for himself alone but he had to disgrace his show and cast mates 

What a nightmare!! 

Edited February 27, 2019 by Margohill

[Dee]

Supporting Jussie Smollett & Tawana Brawley Wasn't Wrong. Discrediting Black Victims Is.

Quote

The conservative agenda is clear when pundits use Brawley — and now Smollett — to discredit and cast doubt upon people of color when they claim to be victims of racial violence. They want you to ignore the hate crime statistics, the footage of Trump rallies, and the brutality of the Trump-supporting alt-right in Charlottesville. They want you to think that African Americans and other people of color are liars, scammers, and "race baiters." But the Black community should bear no shame for supporting a 15-year-old girl who alleged a violent rape, nor for believing a queer Black man who alleged a violent attack.

[RealReality10]

8 hours ago, Dee said:

Supporting Jussie Smollett & Tawana Brawley Wasn't Wrong. Discrediting Black Victims Is.

The amount of mental jijitsu being done to somehow absolve jussie smollett of any responsibility is jarring.

I think that continuing to try to make excuses for liars gives our community even less credibility.  

[SimoneS]

The Hollywood Reporter has this article on Jussie. While I am an Empire fan, I never knew anything major about the actors other Taraji and Terrance so I found this article on Jussie interesting. Incorporating a psychologist was a bit much, but give the source, the article more compassionate than other media would have been.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/features/im-break-jussie-smollett-pressure-hollywood-fame-1190649

[Margohill]

2 hours ago, RealReality10 said:

The amount of mental jijitsu being done to somehow absolve jussie smollett of any responsibility is jarring.

I think that continuing to try to make excuses for liars gives our community even less credibility.  

So true. Instead of advising him to confess and apologize, they unleash a barrage of explanations, excuses and psychological analysis. People know he lied and then double downed on it on a major TV show.

It is an exercise in futility because people can see it for what it is= mental jujitsu. I just feel bad for all the people he has disgraced. Terrible.

[Tikichick]

On 2/25/2019 at 8:09 AM, thebigboot said:

Compassion for what? A known liar who hit every button to get people riled up? Ellen Page wasn’t calling for compassion, AOC wasn’t calling for compassion, Booker and Harris wanted to use his lies to justify a lynching bill. I mean even after the Nigerian brothers got arrested he didn’t open his mouth about them working together as he is now after he’s been indicted. Any compassion he could have gotten went out the window when he doubled down on his lies.

I think compassion in the sense that a means to forgiveness should be possible.  What he did was wrong, very wrong, and potentially very damaging to others who are genuinely victims of hatred.  He should face punishment.  I am hopeful he will reach the point, sooner rather than later, that he accepts responsibility for what he's done and sincerely apologizes.  It would be horrible for him to become so absolutely cornered, permanently labeled irredeemable and persona non grata.  He made a terrible mistake, but there is room to forgive and be compassionate if he seeks to take ownership of his actions. 

[RealReality10]

19 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

I think compassion in the sense that a means to forgiveness should be possible.  What he did was wrong, very wrong, and potentially very damaging to others who are genuinely victims of hatred.  He should face punishment.  I am hopeful he will reach the point, sooner rather than later, that he accepts responsibility for what he's done and sincerely apologizes.  It would be horrible for him to become so absolutely cornered, permanently labeled irredeemable and persona non grata.  He made a terrible mistake, but there is room to forgive and be compassionate if he seeks to take ownership of his actions. 

I think that path cannot even be considered without a full explanation and apology.  And not an apology that is basically a last resort when nothing else will work.

And even then, I don't know how I feel about him enjoying a public career again.  The level of sheer assholery in using a symbol like a noose as a way to get more attention is something I'm not sure will ever be okay with me.  Also, I still don't forgive or forget people like Susan Smith and others who blamed "random black man" for their criminal hoaxes, because what if a random black man had been driving around Columbia south carolina when Susan Smith claimed she was carjacked?  What if some random white dudes had been on the street in Chicago?

But I can for sure say that to me, even broaching a path to forgiveness is impossible without an explanation and apology, one where he accepts full responsibility for his actions and doesn't deflect.  And not an apology done because nothing else is working.

[Tikichick]

25 minutes ago, RealReality10 said:

I think that path cannot even be considered without a full explanation and apology.  And not an apology that is basically a last resort when nothing else will work.

And even then, I don't know how I feel about him enjoying a public career again.  The level of sheer assholery in using a symbol like a noose as a way to get more attention is something I'm not sure will ever be okay with me.  Also, I still don't forgive or forget people like Susan Smith and others who blamed "random black man" for their criminal hoaxes, because what if a random black man had been driving around Columbia south carolina when Susan Smith claimed she was carjacked?  What if some random white dudes had been on the street in Chicago?

But I can for sure say that to me, even broaching a path to forgiveness is impossible without an explanation and apology, one where he accepts full responsibility for his actions and doesn't deflect.  And not an apology done because nothing else is working.

I believe I covered that by stating "a means to forgiveness should be possible", "he should face punishment", "accepts responsibility for what he's done and sincerely apologizes", "takes ownership of his actions".

I'm not suggesting we all simply clasp hands and sing Kumbya for a spiritual exercise with the idea of exonerating him just because.  I simply think too many situations and too many people today are being eviscerated by social media, end of story, do not collect $200 for passing go.  At some point we're going to wind up with a majority of folks permanently sidelined because they were thrown in the trash when social media demands what essentially amounts to blood vengeance.    

[Apprentice79]

1 hour ago, RealReality10 said:

And even then, I don't know how I feel about him enjoying a public career again.  The level of sheer assholery in using a symbol like a noose as a way to get more attention is something I'm not sure will ever be okay with me.  Also, I still don't forgive or forget people like Susan Smith and others who blamed "random black man" for their criminal hoaxes, because what if a random black man had been driving around Columbia south carolina when Susan Smith claimed she was carjacked?  What if some random white dudes had been on the street in Chicago?

They did question a Black man in the Susan Smith case and I remember the White man in Boston who shot his pregnant wife caused the police to go to Black neighborhoods arresting lots of Black men who were questioned and were later released after the truth came out.  A Black man almost confessed to a crime he did not commit.  I doubt very much that a White man would have been arrested in Jussie's case. Black men are treated harsher whenever they are accused of a crime because society sees Black men as dangerous violent animals and it is why Black men are killed by police. 

[jsbt]

I don't mind aspects of the THR article, I think it's decent. But it tries too hard to find an emotional throughline for what is, at present, an opaque and unknowable personality and motive. Whatever we thought Jussie Smollett was before - me included, I really admired his work and choices - he is clearly something else. And everything it accurately pinpoints as potential moral weaknesses can only be fully reckoned with by him accounting for his crimes and making public and private amends. Until he does that - and stops leaning on Michael Jackson and Scott Peterson's defense attorney - I have no time for forgiveness.

Edited February 27, 2019 by jsbt

[Dee]

The THR article was pretty good. It got some minor facts wrong, but it was, relatively, fair.

[RealReality10]

3 hours ago, Tikichick said:

I believe I covered that by stating "a means to forgiveness should be possible", "he should face punishment", "accepts responsibility for what he's done and sincerely apologizes", "takes ownership of his actions".

I'm not suggesting we all simply clasp hands and sing Kumbya for a spiritual exercise with the idea of exonerating him just because.  I simply think too many situations and too many people today are being eviscerated by social media, end of story, do not collect $200 for passing go.  At some point we're going to wind up with a majority of folks permanently sidelined because they were thrown in the trash when social media demands what essentially amounts to blood vengeance.    

I guess I don't know what forgiveness looks like.  If it looks like "you sincerely apologize and you get your life back as it was" then I'm not sure I would be okay with that.  

The more crappy excuses he tried to float also makes any apology less sincere to me because it looks like a last resort and less like anything heartfelt and sincere.

Edited February 27, 2019 by RealReality10

[Apprentice79]

2 hours ago, RealReality10 said:

I guess I don't know what forgiveness looks like.  If it looks like "you sincerely apologize and you get your life back as it was" then I'm not sure I would be okay with that.  

The more crappy excuses he tried to float also makes any apology less sincere to me because it looks like a last resort and less like anything heartfelt and sincere.

There is a difference between forgiveness and restoration. Just because some people may forgive Jussie in time does not mean his career and the goodwill that he had will be restored to what it was before his elaborate hoax.   I think that his career is irrevocably ruined in my opinion. He has done so much damage.  I can't get over the noose thing and why he would use that symbol, knowing the horrific history behind it.  

Edited February 28, 2019 by Apprentice79

[jsbt]

Yeah, the fact that his only current actions appear to be "muddy the waters" and "pin it all on my flunkies" don't speak well to any kind of redemptive narrative or genuine remorse.

I'll never get over any of it really or take him seriously again or respect him having any kind of public career - which I don't think he'll ever have again. But for me the noose and bleach are definitely the things that I will never get out of my head. I completely believed that part of the story and it was so horrifying.

Edited February 28, 2019 by jsbt

[Dee]

Jussie Smollett, the Chicago Police, and What We Mean by ‘Presumption of Innocence’

Quote

Numerous politicians, pundits, journalists, and others jumped on the CPD’s assertions as definitive proof that Smollett cynically staged a hate crime for his own personal gain. However, a small number of others have cautioned that we should not rush to assumptions about what did or didn’t happen. These voices have comprised a small minority, even in light of new reports that the CPD’s case (that Smollett effectively attacked himself for the sake of his career) may be showing some cracks of its own.

Over the last several days, reports have come out that contradict some of the CPD’s claims about the attack on Smollett. For starters, both TMZ and ABC News report having obtained copies of the check from Smollett to the brothers, and its memo ledger lists a fitness and nutrition program. And while the CPD claims that Smollett sent threatening letters to himself, TMZ has reported that unnamed sources with the FBI (who are assisting Chicago police with the investigation) now say that the CPD overstated that matter, and that it’s not clear yet who sent the letters.

“Like any other citizen, Mr. Smollett enjoys the presumption of innocence, particularly when there has been an investigation like this one where information, both true and false, has been repeatedly leaked,” attorneys for the actor told Deadline last week.

Though there’s no indication that the CPD is handling this case with anything but professional integrity, it’s also important to note that many within the slim minority of people who question the Chicago Police’s reported findings are motivated by precedents of corruption and racism from the department.

[RealReality10]

1 hour ago, Dee said:

Jussie Smollett, the Chicago Police, and What We Mean by ‘Presumption of Innocence’

To me, the more jussie smollett and his team encourage this or cosign these stories, the less likely it is that I would find his eventual apology acceptable.

This all just feels like more spaghetti js and his team are throwing at the wall to hope it sticks because he doesn't feel real remorse, he just wants to see if there is any way he can get away with what he did, and if he can't then he will apologize.

And really, what is the story here?  That JS wasn't dumb enough to put "payment for attack" in the memo line of his check? 

Is JSs story going to be that the brothers attacked him even though they are friendly with each other?  And that doesn't square with the fact that JS insisted he could see that his attacker was white, which the brothers are clearly not. 

Is he going to say that the brothers, men he trusted enough to personally train him, were really racist homophobic trump supporters?  

Is he going to take another swipe at Chicago PD and say they coerced the confession from the brothers?  I don't think that's true, but more importantly for JS I don't think he will have a leg to stand on there, because the brothers story would have had particular elements fact checked before they went to indict JS.

That JS is willing to drag this out seems selfish and messy. There is really no logical end game here, and the desperation in all these stories makes it seem like he has no true remorse at all, and would make me, personally less inclined towards forgiveness.

Edited February 28, 2019 by RealReality10

[jsbt]

If it'll keep him out of jail (and I assume it will based solely on establishing reasonable doubt, as well as his privilege as a wealthy celebrity), that's all Geragos cares about. The spaghetti strategy is viable for that purpose.

For getting his career and his name back? Nope.

[pennben]

Honestly, I fear that he did things so profoundly stupidly throughout this that it could actually provide a through line of defense of “no one could be this stupid” that could sway just one juror.  The “its so dumb, he couldn’t have done it defense”.  I really worry about folks underestimating stupidity. 

[RealReality10]

23 hours ago, Tikichick said:

 I simply think too many situations and too many people today are being eviscerated by social media, end of story, do not collect $200 for passing go.  At some point we're going to wind up with a majority of folks permanently sidelined because they were thrown in the trash when social media demands what essentially amounts to blood vengeance.    

I did want to circle back to this point because I totally agree with it.  

I know that in the heat of the moment I have acted in an abominable way, and I can think of one instance in particular where I would have hated me and I would have certainly earned the enmity of random strangers had they seen it.  I don't think it's a reflection of who I am and I sincerely regret that moment in retrospect.

Nothing I've ever said has been racist or sexist or homophobic or anything like that, but it was still terrible.  Okay, I'll tell you..I yelled at a kid and it was like the worst thing I've done in a while.  I still feel awful about it.  Geez, confessing to strangers feels good.  Anyways obviously anyone who saw that on social media would rightfully hate me, but i don't think it's who I am as a person.

Having said that, I feel like there is a difference between the idiotic things we do in the heat of the moment and something as planned as this. 

[jsbt]

There's writing a bad check and then there's faking a fucking hate crime.

[jhlipton]

On 2/27/2019 at 11:00 AM, Tikichick said:

I simply think too many situations and too many people today are being eviscerated by social media, ....  At some point we're going to wind up with a majority of folks permanently sidelined because they were thrown in the trash when social media demands what essentially amounts to blood vengeance.    

I think that people leaving Twitter or Instagram completely is kind of silly.  I know on Twitter, you can set your account to private (as Andre Braugher has done) and only those you let in can see and respond to your posts.  I would imagine that "the 'Gram" has the same feature.

[jsbt]

Welp:

[Dee]

Desperate suspects will say anything to move the targets off their backs.

[jsbt]

Agreed! Which would explain why Jussie went from initially refusing to charge the brothers when he was alerted they'd been found by the police (after calling them before and after the attack), and now upon hiring Geragos, his defense strategy has shifted to include an alleged drug habit, a handful of flimsy semantics claims, a series of desperate leaks to TMZ, and now, finally, claiming that oh, his good friends the brothers are homophobes after all despite being his friends, chosen trainers and on-set co-workers for a long time.

[Margohill]

2 hours ago, Dee said:

Desperate suspects will say anything to move the targets off their backs.

The desperate suspect here is JS. The 2 brothers are just pawns in his sick and selfish game to get paid more money by his employer. Looking at it critically, JS is the one trying move the target off his back. He's tried everything including his costar's baby, but the performance he gave on GMA sealed people's impression of him as a 1st grade liar. He made his bed and he will lie in it.

Edited March 1, 2019 by Margohill

[Tikichick]

19 hours ago, jhlipton said:

I think that people leaving Twitter or Instagram completely is kind of silly.  I know on Twitter, you can set your account to private (as Andre Braugher has done) and only those you let in can see and respond to your posts.  I would imagine that "the 'Gram" has the same feature.

I could care less about whether people leave Twitter or Instagram.  When I said sidelined I was referring to sidelined in life, such as being permanently unemployable in their profession.  

[Tikichick]

On 2/28/2019 at 1:58 PM, RealReality10 said:

I did want to circle back to this point because I totally agree with it.  

I know that in the heat of the moment I have acted in an abominable way, and I can think of one instance in particular where I would have hated me and I would have certainly earned the enmity of random strangers had they seen it.  I don't think it's a reflection of who I am and I sincerely regret that moment in retrospect.

Nothing I've ever said has been racist or sexist or homophobic or anything like that, but it was still terrible.  Okay, I'll tell you..I yelled at a kid and it was like the worst thing I've done in a while.  I still feel awful about it.  Geez, confessing to strangers feels good.  Anyways obviously anyone who saw that on social media would rightfully hate me, but i don't think it's who I am as a person.

Having said that, I feel like there is a difference between the idiotic things we do in the heat of the moment and something as planned as this. 

I agree about heat of the moment.  So does the law in regards to the crime of homicide.  Heat of the moment without taking a beat to consider -- second degree.  Premeditation, even for a moment, first degree. 

I'm not prepared to say this is a life offense.  As awful as this was, if he can take responsibility and own what he's done I think he should be able to come back after he faces the punishment.

[Jane Tuesday]

Let's say for the sake of argument that the brothers attacked JS and it wasn't a hoax, that he had no idea it was them.

Why, then, would he state with so much confidence that his attackers were white?  Not that he didn't know, or couldn't identify them.  He clearly stated they were white, and they plainly are not.

I originally only heard the bare bones of the story, that he had been attacked in Chicago for being black and gay.  Sadly, I could totally buy that.  But now that I've heard more, the MAGA stuff was unbelievable.  Anybody who knows Chicago knows that it couldn't be less "MAGA country".  It's the bluest of blue cities, behind maybe San Francisco.

Edited March 1, 2019 by Jane Tuesday

[Apprentice79]

28 minutes ago, Jane Tuesday said:

Let's say for the sake of argument that the brothers attacked JS and it wasn't a hoax, that he had no idea it was them.

Why, then, would he state with so much confidence that his attackers were white?  Not that he didn't know, or couldn't identify them.  He clearly stated they were white, and they plainly are not.

I originally only heard the bare bones of the story, that he had been attacked in Chicago for being black and gay.  Sadly, I could totally buy that.  But now that I've heard more, the MAGA stuff was unbelievable.  Anybody who knows Chicago knows that it couldn't be less "MAGA country".  It's the bluest of blue cities, behind maybe San Francisco.

Sadly, I could see him being bash for being Gay by Black homophobes. I am Black and homophobia is rampant in the Black community.  Jussie got too creative and fantastical in his hoax by saying MAGA country.  He should have kept his lie minimal and grounded in reality.  The noose and Bleach really were bizarre.  What is scary is that he wanted them to pour gasoline on him, but, it was changed at the last minute. Would he have wanted them to light him on fire?  Jussie's mind is scary to say the least..

I don't see him bouncing back from this ever.. He may not feel the full scope of the consequences now, but, he will no longer be invited to the great parties in Hollywood, industry events and events that have to do with the Black community and the LGBT community. He has really done damage to the Black LGBTQ community who not only have to face discrimination for their color, but, also for their sexuality.  Black transgender women don't live past the age of 35 in this country. Why couldn't he bring attention to that awful statistic with his celebrity and artistry. He did all of this for his own greed. What a waste! 

Edited March 1, 2019 by Apprentice79

[Dee]

Homophobia is no more 'rampant' in the Black community than any other community.

[crowceilidh]

I haven't been following this too closely, because frankly, the world sucks and someone whom I casually considered to be one of the good guys turns out to be a careless unforgiveable idiot.  But I would just like to say that at one point Chris Brown's career was ruined....

Also, if he can use an insanity or mental instability-type defence, then all of the people who are supposed to be making mental illness something we can talk about and through, will be somewhat forced to find a path to forgiveness for him.  

I think Empire needs Jamal more than Hakim or Andre, so killing him off is really a no go.  It seems to me that he's more central to the core Shakespearian storyline.?

[Margohill]

6 hours ago, crowceilidh said:

I haven't been following this too closely, because frankly, the world sucks and someone whom I casually considered to be one of the good guys turns out to be a careless unforgiveable idiot.  But I would just like to say that at one point Chris Brown's career was ruined....

Also, if he can use an insanity or mental instability-type defence, then all of the people who are supposed to be making mental illness something we can talk about and through, will be somewhat forced to find a path to forgiveness for him.  

I think Empire needs Jamal more than Hakim or Andre, so killing him off is really a no go.  It seems to me that he's more central to the core Shakespearian storyline.?

Oh! Please. With an opportunity now for center stage and meatier scripts, Andre and Hakeem can handle Empire just fine. Jamal doesn't need to be killed off, he just needs to be written off to go back to London with that his childish and whiny boyfriend Kai. 

Jamal was extremely good in S1 because of his storyline and his extreme bond with his mother. Since S2 that bond had been irreparably damaged when he kicked his own mother out of the house and his storyline has wavered since then jumping from one useless boyfriend to another with less emphasis on creating great music as he did in S1. 

Now is the time to give Andre ( who is the strongest actor of the 3 brothers BTW) a chance to take center stage. Along with Hakeem and Lucious's new son,  and the rest of the cast, Empire can still carry on stronger than ever if well written. I will not miss Jamal at all if he is written off. Just my opinion.

[jsbt]

10 hours ago, crowceilidh said:

Also, if he can use an insanity or mental instability-type defence, then all of the people who are supposed to be making mental illness something we can talk about and through, will be somewhat forced to find a path to forgiveness for him.  

Will we, though? 

[Princess Sparkle]

Mod Note: The topic is Empire in the Media; do not use Jussie's story to talk about other unrelated politics. Posts have been hidden.