TCM: The Greatest Movie Channel

[Charlie Baker]

I enjoy the SIm, Scott, Owen versions very much.  But it really was a missed opportunity to put Stewart in a conventional version, and not preserve his one man show version.

[prican58]

Swing Time and Top Hat back to back at 8 pm tonight.  Double shot of Eric Blore which is as good a present as I can imagine. And Erik Rhodes as Beddini in Top Hat is just so much fun.

[voiceover]

voiceover, we have it recorded under "Switchmas" 

Ha! I noticed that it was running "instead of", and I was ever-so-grateful, as this afforded me a few more watchings.

 

One of the fascinations of Sim-as-Scrooge is the way he turns from frightening & ugly to handsome & warm.  And, yes -- quite physically imposing.  AND, funnier than anyone else onscreen:

Ghost of Christmas Present: "You have never seen the like of me before!"  

Sim: "Yes.  And I wish that the pleasure had been indefinitely postponed."

[ratgirlagogo]

 

Double shot of Eric Blore

Merry Christmas to all!

[prican58]

Wow, New Year's Eve on TCM is pretty fantastic. Marathon Marx Bros in the morning through the evening and all the Thin Man pictures in order, during prime time. 

[Bastet]

I'm so glad they're resurrecting the New Year's Eve Thin Man marathon.  The first year I decided I was done with going out on NYE -- the crowds, the jacked-up prices (and limited "special" menus), and the amateur drunks on the road got to be too much -- about 15 years ago, TCM aired a Thin Man marathon and I promptly declared that to be my new tradition.  (Which, in most subsequent years, meant watching my tapes and then DVDs.)  I'll be watching bowl games until 9-ish, as they're the semi-final games for the national championship, so I'd come in after the first three - which are the best.  So I'll still have to watch my DVDs, but it's rather cool that my favorite NYE marathon is back on the dial.

 

Although, really, unlike OU, I don't care about Michigan St. and am only rooting for them because I don't like Alabama, so I could skip the second game and just watch along with TCM all night ...  Yeah, I think I just abandoned football come 5:00.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Bastet

[bmoore4026]

Rinaldo, on 18 Dec 2015 - 1:26 PM, said:

Yes, last night was another Disney night. Anybody see 'em?

 

I missed them, sadly :(

 

What was on?

[Rinaldo]

As mentioned on a previous page of the thread (where it was easy to miss), the main items were So Dear To My Heart and Babes in Toyland. I've now watched the former and found it as sweet and nostalgic as it intended. The Toyland is pretty hard to get through (I say it as a lover and scholar of operetta -- but this production evokes cheesy 60s TV specials in the 20 minutes I've seen), but I'll make it to the end eventually.

 

My favorite Scrooge is George C. Scott (with great respect for several others), and the production around him is very good too, I think, with an unusually fine cast.

[Charlie Baker]

Sad to see Haskell Wexler has died.  An impressive career, and also, I never knew he was an activist to improve working conditions for film crews, among other things.

 

Edited to lose bad link.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Charlie Baker

[CMH1981]

I watched the Disney night, and it was my first time watching So Dear to My Heart, and I have to say I fell in love w/ the film from this first viewing.  It's just a wonderful film.

 

I agree about Babes in Toyland, it is a chore to get through, it's very schmaltzy....it seems like something NBC would produce for one of their live musicals.

 

I'm watching Room for One More, and I love this movie so much.  I first fell in love w/ it about a year ago after viewing it on TCM.  It's such a great film.

[Inquisitionist]

Edited to get working link.

That link isn't taking me anywhere, Charlie Baker.  Here's a link to the LA Times coverage.

 

Describing his camera work in a 1993 interview with American Cinematographer magazine, Wexler said, “Movies are a voyeuristic experience. You have to make the audience feel like they are peeking through a keyhole. I think of myself as the audience. Then I use light, framing and motion to create a focal point.”

 

[Charlie Baker]

Apologies for the bad link to Wexler's IMDB page.

Try this one  click or as a cut and paste:

 

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0005549

 

And thanks, inquisiitionist.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Charlie Baker

[bluepiano]

One of the fascinations of Sim-as-Scrooge is the way he turns from frightening & ugly to handsome & warm. 

 

Yes, the first time you see him smile the transformation is startling. That's real acting. (This may be an odd association, but I've always wanted to see a "Jekyll and Hyde" movie in which there is no make-up, and the difference between the two sides of the split personality are conveyed solely by facial expressions and demeanor, as they were in the original story).

 

Back to Sim, as someone else commented, when he apologizes to Fred and his wife it's just so completely endearing.

 

And thanks to TCM for also screening my favorite "soft Christmas" movie*, The Shop Around the Corner. For me, It's on a short list of perfect movies, where there isn't a single thing I can imagine being done differently, and I never tire of watching it.

 

* By my definition, one in which the holiday provides background or flavoring, but the entire plot doesn't hinge on Christmas

Edited December 28, 2015 by bluepiano

[voiceover]

Wow, New Year's Eve on TCM is pretty fantastic. Marathon Marx Bros in the morning through the evening and all the Thin Man pictures in order, during prime time. 

I'll see your "Wow!" and raise you a "Yahtzee!"  

What a fabulously elegant way to spend the day.

[prican58]

voiceover, that would be a perfect day to be snowed in and not be able to get to work, wouldn't you say?

[voiceover]

And wear your elegant earrings (or a nice bow tie), while sipping an elegant cocktail.

[Crisopera]

This may be an odd association, but I've always wanted to see a "Jekyll and Hyde" movie in which there is no make-up, and the difference between the two sides of the split personality are conveyed solely by facial expressions and demeanor, as they were in the original story

 

 

Actually, the Spencer Tracy version of Jekyll & Hyde does without prosthetics - unfortunately, it's not very good.  It's very plush and dull.  Ingrid Bergman is good though, as a Swedish-accented Cockney prostitute.

[bluepiano]

Maybe I need to see it again, but my memory is that while Tracy doesn't wear extensive facial prosthetics like Frederic March in the 1931 version, there is still a generous amount of make-up applied to give his Jekyll a frightening, bestial look.

 

As a huge Rita Hayworth fan, I can't believe I'd never seen Affair in Trinidad, which TCM just aired. It was Rita's return after 4 years away from the movies. The studio was obviously trying to recapture the magic of Gilda, with a similar plot, Glen Ford again as the love/hate interest, a back lot Trinidad instead of a back lot Buenos Aires, and even the same singer dubbing Rita's vocals. Robert Osborne said in his lengthy intro that after her time away Rita lacked confidence in her acting, but I thought she was actually very good. The character she was playing had more depth and was more of a real woman than the fantasy figure of Gilda. And speaking of "real woman," you can see in her first dance number that she's added a few pounds, but she's still very beautiful and sensual. And I thought that her dance numbers (choreographed by well-known modern dancer Valerie Bettis, who also acts in the movie) were actually more interesting than the ones in Gilda. (though certainly less iconic).

 

Affair in Trinidad has generally a poor reputation, but i found it very entertaining. You need to overlook a messy and confused story line, but in the end it doesn't matter, it's all Rita's show. Considering how frequently Gilda is shown, it would be nice to see this one pop up on occasion. (Strangely, it did better at the box office upon its release than Gilda).

Edited December 29, 2015 by bluepiano

[Julia]

Maybe I need to see it again, but my memory is that while Tracy doesn't wear extensive facial prosthetics like Frederic March in the 1931 version, there is still a huge amount of make-up applied to give his Jekyll a frightening, bestial look.

 

The story I'd read (I think maybe in Garson Kanin's book?) was that he wanted to play it without makeup and was very disappointed that they wouldn't let him. This is what it looked like, fwiw... There's also a story that he wanted Katharine Hepburn to play both Ivy and Beatrix.

[bluepiano]

One time TCM showed both the March and Tracy versions, with the great make-up artist Rick Baker as studio guest. He and Robert Osborne were laughing about how in the pub scenes, people aren't even giving a second glance to Jekyll's appearance. They're talking to him as if he's any other bloke you'd see walking down the street in London. Crude, loud, and obnoxious, but still normal. Which would be true to the original story. But in both movie versions, his physical appearance is completely freakish. Especially the Frederic March Jekyll, who's made up to look like some kind of missing link, with simian features. Realistically, he would've sent most people scurrying away in fear.
 

.

Edited December 30, 2015 by bluepiano

[Spunkygal]

voiceover, that would be a perfect day to be snowed in and not be able to get to work, wouldn't you say?

  

And wear your elegant earrings (or a nice bow tie), while sipping an elegant cocktail.

With your trusty wire fox terrier at your side?

[Inquisitionist]

FYI:  The Kennedy Center Honors for 2015, featuring actors Rita Moreno and Cicely Tyson and director George Lucas, are being broadcast on CBS tonight at 9e/8c.

[ratgirlagogo]

 

One time TCM showed both the March and Tracy versions, with the great make-up artist Rick Baker as studio guest.

Both are well worth watching  and while everyone can see they both use makeup I believe both use prosthetics - the March one it's obvious but I think the Tracy one does with the teeth/mouth as well.  I wish I had seen/heard Rick Baker's commentary since of course his opinion is obviously more informed than mine.  

 

The main thing I always remember about these two films is that when MGM made the Tracy version they bought up every copy of the (Oscar winning)  Paramount March version they could find and destroyed them, so that exhibitors couldn't show the March one instead.  And IIRC we still have the March version because Roddy McDowall and Orson Welles both had copies in their private libraries.  GOD BLESS HOARDERS.

[imjagain]

I think it's pretty funny that TMC was running movies all day about drunks before NYE.

I'm recording Cat on a hot tin roof and Who's afraid of Virginia Woolf? Can't wait to watch them later.

Edited December 30, 2015 by imjagain

[jjj]

I think it's pretty funny that TMC was running movies all day about drunks before NYE.

I'm recording Cat on a hot tin roof and Who's afraid of Virginia Woolf? Can't wait to watch them later.

I noticed the "drunk" theme, but did not connect it to New Year's Eve!  It was a little too early in the day for "Days of Wine and Roses" for me!  I don't think they have shown "Come Back, Little Sheba" for quite a while; that would have fit in today. 

[elle]

Good news for those of us subjected to the TCM blackout (obligatory curse at cable), Syfy is running its NYE Twilight Zone marathon starting tonight.  Its not the Marxs Bros and the Charles', but it is a chance to catch some familiar faces.  :0)

[prican58]

elle, there's always a silver lining. While I will be watching the later Marx films and probably the first 2 Thin Man's, locally we have the annual Honeymooners marathon at midnight as well as an Odd Couple marathon. It's not TCM but classic tv is just as fun.

 

Watching Virginia Woolf, I was struck at just how good Taylor could be. She is simply amazing in it and it's odd to think of the girl from National Velvet, Lassie and Father of the Bride as this alcoholic, cig smoking, foul mouthed woman.

 

I started to think about Sandy Dennis and how strange of an actress she was. She is, however, very much someone I can't take my eyes off. I always thought it one of those stranger than fiction situations when I think about her and some other actresses of her generation who all passed away rather young from cancer. SD was born in 1937 and died at 54 of ovarian; Joan Hackett 1934-1983 (49) ovarian, Diana Sands 1934-1973 (39), Carolyn Jones 1930- 1983 (53), Diana Hyland 1936-1977 (41) and Janet Margolin 1943-1493 (50) ovarian. Pretty sad.   

 

Who is January's Star of the Month?

[Sharpie66]

Someone up thread mentioned that Wait Until Dark is going to be on this week, or maybe I already missed it. Either way, it is a really good film! My sister introduced it to me in high school, making sure that we watched it with all of the lights off, making that final confrontation with Harry Roat, Jr. even scarier. I literally jumped out of my seat at that moment (being vague because spoilers), and I made sure to show it to a college friend in the same way and enjoyed seeing her just elevate off the couch at the same spot.

[ratgirlagogo]

 

Syfy is running its NYE Twilight Zone marathon starting tonight.  Its not the Marxs Bros and the Charles', but it is a chance to catch some familiar faces.

The one bad thing about this marathon (but it is seriously a majorly bad thing) is that SyFy has always been one of the worst offenders when it comes to squishing the closing credits.  With Twilight Zone finding out who the actors were is of course  one of the most fun things about watching the episodes!  Bastards.  You can look it up on IMDB, but come on.  Why can't all the other channels be more like TCM?

Edited December 31, 2015 by ratgirlagogo

[elle]

It's not TCM but classic tv is just as fun.

And classic TV is where many an "old" movie actor was first met.

 

 

 

You can look it up on IMDB,

Thank goodness for that!  So often, I recognize the actor but not the name.  If I can find the episode (or movie!), I can usually get a match.  If not there, off to google!

[jjj]

I started to think about Sandy Dennis and how strange of an actress she was. She is, however, very much someone I can't take my eyes off.

I will always try to tune in when a Sandy Dennis film is showing.  I saw several of her films on television when I was very young, and they/she made quite an impression on me!  The original "Sweet November" still shows up on TCM, I think -- I know I saw it in the past month or so.  Something about her flat affect in that made the role very striking rather than sad. 

With Twilight Zone finding out who the actors were is of course  one of the most fun things about watching the episodes!  Bastards.  You can look it up on IMDB, but come on.  Why can't all the other channels be more like TCM?

This is a great site for extensive background information on the episodes -- but unfortunately, not all the actors are listed, so IMDB is still the most reliable place for that.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_The_Twilight_Zone_episodes

[ratgirlagogo]

You're right, and thanks for the link.  Not that it makes me less annoyed.   I have a couple of books on the Twilight Zone - it's not so much that I COULDN'T find out the answer - it's that WHY SHOULD I HAVE TO  when the original show has the credits right there, helpfully, at the end?  Surely SOMEBODY at SyFy should realize how maddening it is.  Shove another commercial in the body of the show if necessary, by all means - but please show us the damned credits.

[henrysmom]

 

Who is January's Star of the Month?

 

Oh, interesting.  Fred MacMurray.  We were talking about him not too long ago.  Intriguing write up on him on the TCM page:

 

http://www.tcm.com/this-month/article/1147865%7C0/Fred-MacMurray-Wednesdays-in-January.html

 

From the above article--this boggles the mind:

 

 

When Wilder came calling with another cynical role, the screenwriter-turned gigolo in Sunset Boulevard (1950), MacMurray turned it down, leaving William Holden to play the career-changing role.

 

I had never heard that.  Now I am pondering Fred MacMurray as Joe Gillis.  I think he may have been a little too old for the part, but I would have liked to have seen MacMurray tackle it.

Edited December 31, 2015 by henrysmom

[Crisopera]

I never could stand Fred MacMurray in his 60s TV years - SO bland and dull.  But then I discovered his screwball 30s movies, and THEN Double Indemnity and The Apartment and barely recognized him as the same actor.  Amazing how different he could be.

 

Much as I love William Holden in Sunset Boulevard, I still think about what it would have been like with Wilder's first choice, Montgomery Clift.  I didn't know he had offered it to MacMurray, which would have been interesting.

[Rinaldo]

There's a wonderful book (at least for me, madly interested in the subject) about film scores that were replaced. Pretty much every great (and not-so-great) movie composer got his music thrown out somewhere along the line, so it's a rich subject, given satisfyingly detailed treatment.

 

But the reason I bring it up is that someone should write a book devoted to movie casting that almost was: first and second choices who turned a project down, stars who got sick or proved too expensive or demanding... it has happened again and again over the decades. And not just listing them, but devoting some thought to the differences they might have made. Think about an All About Eve tailored to Claudette Colbert rather than Bette Davis, or Jaws with Sterling Hayden as the old pro, or The Graduate with any of the dozens of initial choices.

[henrysmom]

 

The Graduate with any of the dozens of initial choices.

 

Although I am a big Doris Day fan, I can't picture her as Mrs. Robinson (either she or her husband/manager turned the role down--I've heard both stated).

[Julia]

I can't really picture it, but I'd love the see the Philadelphia Story that didn't get made with the cast Katharine Hepburn wanted, Clark Gable as CK Dexter Haven and Spencer Tracy as Mike Connor.

 

Wow, is the site behaving oddly for anyone else?

Edited December 31, 2015 by Julia

[Rinaldo]

Although I am a big Doris Day fan, I can't picture her as Mrs. Robinson 

Neither can I. Nor do any of the favored Benjamins seem much righter to me than Dustin Hoffman (and although I was in the perfect demographic for the movie when it came out -- a junior in college -- he seemed wrong to me from the beginning; I know, the magic of acting the illusion of cinema blahblah, but there has to be some initial visual plausibility, and the whole story hinges on his being on the border between immaturity and adulthood). Robert Redford (an actor I've always admired) and Warren Beatty were around 30 too, and worse, had been appearing as adults in movies for years. Of others considered, Brandon deWilde (a former child star) and Harrison Ford (then totally unknown) were both 24, close enough, and seem the right type too. Some others were ludicrously well established as adults onscreen (Steve McQueen? Robert Wagner?).

 

Of others considered for Mrs. Robinson, Angela Lansbury intrigues me. But if she'd taken the part, she probably couldn't have opened the musical Mame on Broadway, and I'd rather have that.

[Bastet]

I can't really picture it, but I'd love the see the Philadelphia Story that didn't get made with the cast Katharine Hepburn wanted, Clark Gable as CK Dexter Haven and Spencer Tracy as Mike Connor.

 

I feel about that one the same as I do about the original planned cast for Libeled Lady (with Clark Gable in Spencer Tracy's role): I love the existing casting, so would never want those movies to not have been made as-is, but I'd love some parallel universe where I can also see how they'd have come out with the alternate casts.

 

I recently watched A League of Their Own again for the first time in some years, and did a little reading on it -- the number of actors considered (or, in at least one case, cast) for Dottie before Geena Davis ultimately won the role is a little mind boggling.

[Inquisitionist]

Reportedly, after Marisa Tomei turned down the part of Carrie in Four Weddings and a Funeral, Jeanne Tripplehorn was cast but pulled out just before filming began due to her mothers death.  Not sure Tripplehorn would have been much of an improvement over Andie MacDowell (who many, including me, see as the weak link in the cast), but I think Tomei could have done a lot more with the role.

[ratgirlagogo]

 

Wow, is the site behaving oddly for anyone else?

Yes.  Crashed the browser a few minutes ago.

[Milburn Stone]

I know it can't be so that serendipity happens every time, but with every example that ever comes up of casting that almost happened and didn't, I feel we can thank the cinema gods for making it happen the way it did. Sunset Blvd. wouldn't be Sunset Blvd. without Holden; The Graduate wouldn't be The Graduate without Dustin Hoffman; The Apartment wouldn't be The Apartment without MacMurray; etc. Any more than the Beatles would be The Beatles without Ringo. You can imagine better drummers than Ringo; but you can't imagine the music of The Beatles being as heaven-sent with any of them. 

 

I want to read that book about movie scores that got thrown out.

[Rinaldo]

This is it: Torn Music: Rejected Film Scores, a Selected History by Gergely Hubai. Despite that "selected," it's pretty darned comprehensive, including a few films given new scores after release, or for television broadcast, or on home video. 476 pages of fun, for those like me who eat up this sort of thing.

[elle]

I feel about that one the same as I do about the original planned cast for Libeled Lady (with Clark Gable in Spencer Tracy's role): I love the existing casting, so would never want those movies to not have been made as-is, but I'd love some parallel universe where I can also see how they'd have come out with the alternate casts.

I agree about the cast we get in TPS, I can not imagine anyone I would change.  It is like Casablanca in that respect, we say "what a cast!" and even more so when hearing who we could have had.

 

I would have liked to see Gable in Libeled Lady, not only would it have been a re-teaming of Gable, Loy, and Powell but also Gable and Harlow had such sparkling chemistry.

[Bastet]

Yeah, it seems virtually guaranteed that Libeled Lady would be even better with Clark Gable, as he worked so well with all three of the other stars.  But the film is so close to perfect as is, it's a little difficult for me to imagine it differently.  But I do think its weak link is the Gladys/Haggerty relationship - I've no idea why she wants to be with him - so it would be interesting to see if I was invested in them with Gable in the role.

[Milburn Stone]

Torn Music

 

Clever title.

 

Thanks.

[Charlie Baker]

Here's to a 2016 of revisiting favorites and discovering great vintage film, TCM fans.

[elle]

Happy New Year, everyone!

 

I had a nice late 2015 "gift" in the form a double showing of the wonderful Young Frankenstein.  As I told my determined-to-stay-up daughter, if we can't watch The Thin Man at least we have the best homage to the Universal monster movies of old.  Then I proceeded to try to explain all about the original movie, and the original sets, and why I was laughing so hard.

 

This morning the treat was the TZ episode "Nothing in the Dark" with Gladys Cooper and Robert Redford.  I realize as I was watching how informed I now am about her career.  It is hard to see how this frail terrified sympathetic old woman could be the same frightening dragon-mother of Now Voyager as well as the wonderful witty mom of Prof. Higgens!

[Padma]

Happy New Year, everyone!

 

I had a nice late 2015 "gift" in the form a double showing of the wonderful Young Frankenstein.  As I told my determined-to-stay-up daughter, if we can't watch The Thin Man at least we have the best homage to the Universal monster movies of old.  Then I proceeded to try to explain all about the original movie, and the original sets, and why I was laughing so hard.

 

This morning the treat was the TZ episode "Nothing in the Dark" with Gladys Cooper and Robert Redford.  I realize as I was watching how informed I now am about her career.  It is hard to see how this frail terrified sympathetic old woman could be the same frightening dragon-mother of Now Voyager as well as the wonderful witty mom of Prof. Higgens!

Yes, she was so wonderful in everything you mention. I'll also never forget her as Deborah Kerr's horrible mother in "Separate Tables".

 

I really wish someone would bring back reruns of the old tv show "The Rogues" with Cooper as the head of a family of (kindly) con-artists. It didn't last long, but, was full of charm, between Cooper and her three sons who were all former movie stars, too--Charles Boyer, Gig Young, and David Niven.  She was such a wonderful talent.

 

Re: recent TCM. I wonder if anyone else saw the Sinatra movie, "The Joker Is Wild", the other night. I thought he was excellent as stand up comedian (and real life Sinatra friend) Joe E. Lewis. It's one of my favorite Frank Sinatra performances.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Padma

[bluepiano]

Re: recent TCM. I wonder if anyone else saw the Sinatra movie, "The Joker Is Wild", the other night. I thought he was excellent as stand up comedian (and real life Sinatra friend) Joe E. Lewis. It's one of my favorite Frank Sinatra performances.

 

And it screened right after The Man with the Golden Arm, which is generally considered Sinatra's greatest dramatic performance. He's definitely very good in it, but for me the movie itself is a mixed bag. The obvious Hollywood sets and back lot locations strongly undermine the sense of realism, as do some of the over-the-top supporting performances. Even Eleanor Parker, who I usually really like, seemed to struggle. (It doesn't help that the character she plays defies believability.)

 

Earlier in his career Preminger had directed some really wonderful stylized film noirs (Where the Sidewalk Ends, Angel Face). It would've been interesting to see him take that approach with Golden Arm, which is visually one of this least interesting movies. It often feels like watching a filmed stage play.

Edited January 2, 2016 by bluepiano