Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Shanna Marie]

I kind of like the idea that Zeus gives Hook another chance at life as a reward for his role in helping put Hades back in his place and/or undoing some of the wrong done in the Underworld by Hades. That way, in a way, Hook rescues himself. It's an opportunity he might not have had if Emma hadn't come and freed him from the torture and possibly even if they hadn't passed the True Love test and earned the ambrosia, even if the ambrosia wasn't there, but still, the ultimate victory would be because of something he did, so he's not entirely a damsel in distress (for a change). It may be a combination of all the things that leads to Hook being brought back -- passing the True Love test with someone who came after him to earn another chance (maybe Zeus has a stockpile of ambrosia and shares, since Hook and Emma did earn it) plus doing something big enough that Zeus owes him a favor. Those are conditions big enough and specific enough that it makes it unlikely to work on anyone else (unless the plot requires it, in which case, bringing someone back from the dead will be as watered-down as a True Love's Kiss and will happen every other episode).

I've imagined a couple of ways it could go. One is that Zeus might offer Hook Hades' old job and the chance to be lord of the Underworld, and Hook declines, possibly asking for life back instead. The other is that Hook might be thinking he's allowed to move on, seems to be heading across that bridge into heaven, and finds himself in Storybrooke, realizing that it was a favor from Zeus.

[InsertWordHere]

36 minutes ago, Shanna Marie said:

One is that Zeus might offer Hook Hades' old job and the chance to be lord of the Underworld, and Hook declines, possibly asking for life back instead.

I was thinking he might offer him a Davy Jones/Charon like position of ferrying the souls to the Underworld. Obviously, the spoiler pics for 5.22 indicate that's not going to happen (well, I hope so anyway, it's possible his resurrection has strings), but it would be funny if it's Hook that was supposed to be Davy Jones. 

I very much like the idea of Hook coming back on his own, with shades of his return at the end of Season 2 and showing up in NYC at the end of Going Home. He always shows back up when Emma least expects it.

Even though the synopsis indicates his subplot revolves around the missing pages, I would still like to see Hook be the one who frees the souls from the River. Not only would he free Milah, his lost love who Rumple killed and pushed into the River, but he'd free Pan, his enemy who was killed by Rumple twice, James, his mate's (or whatever) brother whose first death can kind of be attributed to Rumple, Gaston (okay, he likely doesn't have anything to do with Hook other than running afoul of Rumbelle), and um Auntie Em, who Hook probably thinks has a nice name I guess. Also, I like the idea of the waters of the Underworld also being able to bring back what was lost, as we were told in Wonderland that the healing water runs under every realm. In the Underworld, it probably just got corrupted. It's most likely the ambrosia that does it though. Either Hook finds some or Zeus has access to some. 

Edited May 5, 2016 by InsertWordHere

[KingOfHearts]

I'm kind of hoping Zeus blesses Hook with being able to live as long he wants. I really don't want another chance of Hook dying in the future.

[KateJones]

I can envision Hook somehow getting the pages back to Emma, and then going to cross the bridge to move on, the bright light appearing and him ending up in Olympus and meeting Zeus and then coming back to Storybrooke. 

[daxx]

That sounds more like this show than a lot of the more complex theories I've read.

[ABitOFluff]

8 hours ago, InsertWordHere said:

Even though the synopsis indicates his subplot revolves around the missing pages, I would still like to see Hook be the one who frees the souls from the River. Not only would he free Milah, his lost love who Rumple killed and pushed into the River, but he'd free Pan, his enemy who was killed by Rumple twice, James, his mate's (or whatever) brother whose first death can kind of be attributed to Rumple, Gaston (okay, he likely doesn't have anything to do with Hook other than running afoul of Rumbelle), and um Auntie Em, who Hook probably thinks has a nice name I guess. Also, I like the idea of the waters of the Underworld also being able to bring back what was lost, as we were told in Wonderland that the healing water runs under every realm. In the Underworld, it probably just got corrupted. It's most likely the ambrosia that does it though. Either Hook finds some or Zeus has access to some. 

Actually, I think I read that during Colin's con panel in London, he indicated that Hook would find out what Rumple did to Milah, so you might be on to something there.

[RulerofallIsurvey]

13 hours ago, Souris said:

Honestly, I'm pretty sure they're just going to Zeus ex machina away every potential problem with Hook returning. 

:)  Love this expression for this show plot.  And if (when) it happens, from then on, this will be the explanation.  

[KateJones]

If they are loosely following the Disney Hercules movie, Hook will have a choice at Olympus and choose to stay with Emma. The how they get there in the time they have left is what I'm really wondering. 

[Curio]

Regina in 5x19: But you're not going to get the chance to do anything because you're not going to see [Hades] again.

Regina in 5x19: I think you have another love to find. Hades. Go to him.

Regina in 5x20: I'm trying to trust Zelena. She thinks she can change Hades.

Regina in 5x21: I know this is hard to hear, but [Hades] is not the man you think he is.

Holy whiplash, Batman.

[YaddaYadda]

this is an instance where I'm willing to cut Regina some slack over the whole Hades thing. If she thinks that she changed because of love (Henry's or whomever's), then I can see her thinking that Zelena could change Hades. But that's on the writers though, because they are trying to beat into our heads that it's possible to change someone, when the actual truth of it, is that people change because they want to, not because someone is trying to. I don't understand how they can get it right with a character, and get it wrong with a bunch of other ones.

Anyway...There's also the fact that unlike Hades, Regina in 5x19 did not force Zelena to choose between her and him. I'm assuming this will come back into play.

[Rumsy4]

Regina should know that as she didn't change overnight, it was unlikely that Hades would. And yet, she encouraged Zelena to go for Hades, risking everyone else in the process. She was the one to let the QoD into Storybrooke as well. As a still reforming villain who has been cut too much slack by the so called heroes, she is foolishly doing the same to other villains. And she is steamrollering the concerns of their victims to do so (Killian and Robin in this instance). And now Hades is powerful and in Storybrooke, Zelena is emotionally unstable, baby Pistachio is with Hades, and Killian is still stuck in the UW. But guess what--it will all be blamed on Emma in the end.

[Curio]

Responding in the Regina thread.

[Serena]

Matt Mitovich just said on the Ask Ausiello After Show that he's gonna have a big story on Monday reacting to the "huge development" *cough*Robin's death*cough* on Sunday's episode. Not really a spoiler, just another little hint that it's happening.

[InsertWordHere]

I am unbelievably bummed that I won't be able to watch this episode live, even though I don't care much for Robin.

With regards to Hook and Emma's sex life, all they have to do is open 5.22 with them in bed together. Or have Emma flashback to them in bed together while she's mourning him.

[YaddaYadda]

4 minutes ago, InsertWordHere said:

With regards to Hook and Emma's sex life, all they have to do is open 5.22 with them in bed together. Or have Emma flashback to them in bed together while she's mourning him.

There's no time for that! There's crisis, and everyone's feelings that need to be taken into consideration.

There's a proposal coming though, so something's got to give eventually. 

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

"We're just the writers," he added coyly. "We don’t ask what they do behind closed doors…"

"We're just the writers. Not like we dictate what they do or anything." Just goes to show these writers don't value important moments like consummation. They're more interested in peril, death, and torture. Their replies are so stupid because they act like they don't know what's going to happen (or has happened) in their own fictional universe.

I love how the title of the article is, "Once Upon a Time bosses answer your burning questions", and they answer nothing.

Quote

"And if it had been that simple, I think it just wouldn’t have been that interesting. So it needed to not be that simple and it sure wasn't."

So Emma's plan working out would have been "simple", but Hook coming back another way in the next episode is "interesting"? How is going to the Underworld to save your boyfriend by splitting your heart with him not "interesting"?

Edited May 5, 2016 by KingOfHearts

[profdanglais]

Forget CS in bed together, at this point I'd be happy to see them hug when they're wearing something other than leather. I can't get rid of the little voice in my head that insists on pointing out how bulky and sticky that must be. 

[PixiePaws1]

14 minutes ago, profdanglais said:

Forget CS in bed together, at this point I'd be happy togettinghem hug when they're wearing someth ing other than leather. I can't get rid of the little voice in my head that insists on pointing out how bulky and sticky that must be. 

Cheated! Cheated! Cheated! That's how I feel! One scene! One miserable scene of them in bed, getting ready for bed...or wearing out any other surfaces. That's all I wantef. I don"t care how shallow I am being, I don't care that Colin would be redder than a tomato ... but what do we get? No embaressed reverse taco scene with patents walking in, no getting dressed after crypt sex....we get  and blood and angst! Cheated!

 

Sorry for the rant but I have paid for it cos this mobile version means I can't use auto correct or predi tive text...and it sucks!

[YaddaYadda]

Quote

Robin Hood (Sean Maguire)
KITSIS: Robin Hood is going to be dealing with the ramifications of this weekend’s episode.

Like why answer a question, if you make sure it means nothing?

I swear, I have a headache since reading the E! or whatever earlier interview that also did nothing other than irritate the hell out of me.

[InsertWordHere]

Quote

KITSIS: Snow and Charming are going to find themselves in an old situation in a very new place.

The old situation is being separated from their daughter. The new place is the mental institution or wherever they go.

Quote

HOROWITZ: We’re going to see some of Snow’s growth from, as we’ve seen this season, Mary Margaret to really embracing that she is Snow White. Long past wounds, particularly with Regina, are dealt with in this finale.

Just in time for Regina to unwillingly go evil again. Her wounds better actually be dealt with and not just another "So what if you were separated from your daughter? You found her eventually, didn't you?"

The answer to the Robin question is annoying. 

[Curio]

Quote

HOROWITZ: We’re going to see some of Snow’s growth from, as we’ve seen this season, Mary Margaret to really embracing that she is Snow White. Long past wounds, particularly with Regina, are dealt with in this finale.

This is the only quote that interested me. Will Regina finally confess that she had a hand in murdering Snow's father and apologize for it? Will she apologize for separating Snow and Emma for 28 years? Will she apologize for attempting to kill Snow dozens of times? Or will it be like, "Being in the Underworld and meeting all the people who held a grudge against me (which apparently happened off screen) made me realize I never fully apologized for everything that's happened between us. Hug?" "Hug!" Snow/Regina conflict resolved and never brought up again.

Apparently Snow and Emma will be dealing with Regina in not-so-friendly ways in the finale. Now that they think Regina is a "hero," are they not as afraid of yelling at her? Will they feel like they don't need to step on eggshells around her anymore, so the fact that they finally bring up how terrible Regina was to them force Regina to revert back to being the Evil Queen?

Edited May 5, 2016 by Curio

[RadioGirl27]

A&E are so annoying. Their interviews are always pointless and infuriating. 

[Sarcastica]

2 hours ago, PixiePaws1 said:

Cheated! Cheated! Cheated! That's how I feel! One scene! One miserable scene of them in bed, getting ready for bed...or wearing out any other surfaces. That's all I wantef. I don"t care how shallow I am being, I don't care that Colin would be redder than a tomato ... but what do we get? No embaressed reverse taco scene with patents walking in, no getting dressed after crypt sex....we get  and blood and angst! Cheated!

 

Sorry for the rant but I have paid for it cos this mobile version means I can't use auto correct or predi tive text...and it sucks!

+1

Dear Adam and Eddy, I need to see the receipts for bang bang time. 

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

This is the only quote that interested me. 

Coupled with this:

Quote

KITSIS: There’s a karmic debt that she still hasn’t repaid.

Regina has karmic debt?? Is this really A&E talking? They must have come up with some "interesting" storyline that requires bringing up Regina's past.

Quote

HOROWITZ: We’re going to see some of Snow’s growth from, as we’ve seen this season, Mary Margaret to really embracing that she is Snow White. Long past wounds, particularly with Regina, are dealt with in this finale.

Quote

Prince Charming (Josh Dallas)
KITSIS: Snow and Charming are going to find themselves in an old situation in a very new place.

I think this pretty much means Robin is going to be paralleled with Daniel. Like some have been saying, Emma and Hook will be playing the parts of Snow White and Prince Charming. That second quote about Charming pretty much confirms it.

Quote

HOROWITZ: Henry is the driving force of what’s happening in the season finale. In many ways, it’s coming full circle to how the whole series started. Once again, he’s the catalyst for many of these events.

I'm actually typing this post as I'm reading the article. This is some crazy confirmation here.

Quote

KITSIS: Zelena is going to be finding herself teaming up with people she thought she never would be.

More whiplash. Hades can't change! Oh wait he can! Oh wait he can't! I'm interested to see how she reacts Regina going EQ.

Quote

KITSIS: Robin Hood is going to be dealing with the ramifications of this weekend’s episode.

Yes. He will be actively dealing with being dead.

Quote

HOROWITZ: I don’t know if we’re just remembering him fondly or if he’s back.
KITSIS: Don’t know what’s going to happen to him. It sure looked like he was stuck in [the Underworld].

So you don't know what's going to happen in an episode you wrote and that has already been shot? Do they think we're five year olds?

I'm really hoping EQ isn't the only major cliffhanger. There better be more on the table that isn't suffering for CS.

Edited May 5, 2016 by KingOfHearts

[YaddaYadda]

11 minutes ago, Curio said:

This is the only quote that interested me. Will Regina finally confess that she had a hand in murdering Snow's father and apologize for it? Will she apologize for separating Snow and Emma for 28 years? Will she apologize for attempting to kill Snow dozens of times? Or will it be like, "Being in the Underworld and meeting all the people who held a grudge against me (which apparently happened off screen) made me realize I never fully apologized for everything that's happened between us. Hug?" "Hug!" Snow/Regina conflict resolved and never brought up again.

Apparently Snow and Emma will be dealing with Regina in not-so-friendly ways in the finale. Now that they think Regina is a "hero," are they not as afraid of yelling at her? Will they feel like they don't need to step on eggshells around her anymore, so the fact that they finally bring up how terrible Regina was to them force Regina to revert back to being the Evil Queen?

I'm pretty sure you know that this has nothing to do with Snow or Emma, and everything to do with Regina. Regina might "apologize" for trying to kill Snow, but that's as far as I see things going.

But honestly, in terms of Robin meeting his maker, it actually makes a whole lot of sense now why they brought up Daniel's death in 5x05, and Emma got to see what happened. It's not some abstract idea for her. She got to see it too. It just means that Robin was slated to die this season, and it's not like it's a last minute decision from the writers. 

Emma is going to get Killian back, and she's already planning her future. Whatever goes down with Robin, it sounds like it's part Regina's karma, and part other stuff.

I will be shocked if they bring him back.

[Curio]

18 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

Whatever goes down with Robin, it sounds like it's part Regina's karma, and part other stuff.

It really sucks that nice people have to die on the altar of Regina's karma.

[Serena]

Yeah, but at least Emma, who's a good person, is getting her boyfriend back, and Regina, who killed so many people's loves, is 100% losing her soulmate with no takebacks. Sucks to be Robin, but I don't really care about him, AND he's the one who decided a mass murderer was "bold and audacious" and DGAF when he found out she murdered his wife, so... 

[KingOfHearts]

3 minutes ago, Serena said:

AND he's the one who decided a mass murderer was "bold and audacious" and DGAF when he found out she murdered his wife, so... 

He also handed his baby to the Wicked Witch of the West, the woman who raped him and also murdered his wife. 

Edited May 5, 2016 by KingOfHearts

[YaddaYadda]

2 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

He also handed his baby to the Wicked Witch of the West, the woman who raped him and happens to be dating Hades, the Lord of the Dead.

He didn't wanna do that though. Granted, he should have fought Regina on it more, and stood up for what he believed, but I don't think it would have changed anything. This is really when we see the imbalance in the relationship. Robin has no voice.

Edited May 5, 2016 by YaddaYadda

[Rumsy4]

Robin really is TSTL. Poor guy. 

[KingOfHearts]

4 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

He didn't wanna do that though. Granted, he should have fought Regina on it more, and stood up for what he believed, but I don't think it would have changed anything.

He could have gone with them, but he wanted to stay with Regina. He left a defenseless child with a rapist in favor of staying with his girlfriend, who was capable of handling herself. What was Robin going to do if something happened that Regina or anyone else there couldn't? 

Quote

This is really when we see the imbalance in the relationship. Robin has no voice.

Neal had the same issue. Writers didn't give a crap what he thought. 

Edited May 5, 2016 by KingOfHearts

[YaddaYadda]

Just now, KingOfHearts said:

He could have gone with them, but he wanted to stay with Regina. He left a defenseless child with a rapist in favor of staying with his girlfriend, who was capable of handling herself. What was Robin going to do if something happened that Regina or anyone else there couldn't? 

No one ever called him bright. I wonder how he lived all those years in the forest, and was a leader of men. 

If he had gone with them, I'm sure he would have died sooner than 5x21.

[InsertWordHere]

14 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

Captain Swan reunion pics

And Robin dead on the floor.

Looks like they put arrows on his coffin.

It stops raining, the sun comes out, and Hook appears :)

Edited May 6, 2016 by InsertWordHere

[Curio]

Well, just in case anyone was in denial about Robin's death... those new photos pretty much put the nail in his coffin. (I hope someone saves those photos to their computer because I have a feeling those weren't supposed to leak until after the episode aired.)

Also, I was kind of close with my speculation.

On May 2, 2016 at 3:42 PM, Curio said:

They're going to have Hook show up behind Emma while she's pouring rum on his grave and giving a heartfelt speech, aren't they?

But instead of Hook's grave it's Robin's grave.

[YaddaYadda]

No promo, here's a bunch of spoilery pictures though.

Hades kills Robin then. No way this death doesn't stick.

[Curio]

I'm impressed we called Robin's death however long ago. Anyone have receipts of when it first started getting tossed around? Was that fake-looking email about Sean looking for work legit then?

[InsertWordHere]

I would have preferred Hook to show up before Robin dies, but the reunion looks nice. At least, with a small window of both Robin and Hook being dead, certain shippers will have a nice jumping off point for canon divergent fics. 

ETA: 

Quote

But instead of Hook's grave it's Robin's grave.

I think the rum part is at Hook's grave. That grave is covered and Robin's coffin hasn't been lowered yet (which is one of the first times I've seen tv or movies get that right).

Edited May 6, 2016 by InsertWordHere

[Watt]

Well,  shit.

 

Hook and Emma are my babies though I love them so much.  Too bad Regina has to rehash season one all over again by making Emma and Hook miserable.  Because obviously she will. What clever schemes will she come up with to separate them? Because what Captain Swan needs is more death and angst.

Edited May 6, 2016 by Watt
Added info.

[YaddaYadda]

3 minutes ago, Curio said:

I'm impressed we called Robin's death however long ago. Anyone have receipts of when it first started getting tossed around? Was that fake-looking email about Sean looking for work legit then?

I'm pretty sure we started mentioning Robin's death back after 5x02 aired. I can even remember some conversations after 5x01 when he was being held hostage for the wand.

[RulerofallIsurvey]

9 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

No promo, here's a bunch of spoilery pictures though.

Hades kills Robin then. No way this death doesn't stick.

And it doesn't look like Emma was even present - so not sure how Regina can really blame CS.  (Yeah, I know - it's Regina.  Logic doesn't matter, but still - not even a direct line, imo, like with Daniel/Snow.)

[YaddaYadda]

2 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

And it doesn't look like Emma was even present - so not sure how Regina can really blame CS.  (Yeah, I know - it's Regina.  Logic doesn't matter, but still - not even a direct line, imo, like with Daniel/Snow.)

Well technically the blame for this can be laid right at Regina's doorstep when they allowed Ursula and Cruella to come into town with their precious Dark One cargo. Everyone can play the blame game.

Also, Emma is at the funeral. More pics have been posted.

[InsertWordHere]

5 minutes ago, RulerofallIsurvey said:

And it doesn't look like Emma was even present - so not sure how Regina can really blame CS.  (Yeah, I know - it's Regina.  Logic doesn't matter, but still - not even a direct line, imo, like with Daniel/Snow.)

The line will be that Hades wouldn't have come to Storybrooke if Emma hadn't gone for Hook, I think. I know that's debatable, but this is Regina Logic. Of course, Regina should remember that Hook wouldn't have died in the first place if Emma hadn't taken the Darkness in place of Regina. And the Darkness would have never been free if Rumple had never come back to Storybrooke (or life at all, thanks Neal).

As usual, this is all Rumple's fault. 

Quote

Also, Emma is at the funeral. More pics have been posted.

I think the poster meant that Emma isn't present when Robin dies. I wonder where she is? Dealing with Arthur?

Edited May 6, 2016 by InsertWordHere

[RulerofallIsurvey]

4 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

Well technically the blame for this can be laid right at Regina's doorstep when they allowed Ursula and Cruella to come into town with their precious Dark One cargo. Everyone can play the blame game.

Also, Emma is at the funeral. More pics have been posted.

I meant present when Robin is/was killed.  I only saw Hades, Zelena, Regina, and Robin in those pics.  Sorry if I wasn't clear.  

Edited May 6, 2016 by RulerofallIsurvey
InsertWordHere beat me to it!

[Watt]

Nah  Regina can blame Emma because Emma is the one who wanted everyone to go to the underworld to begin with and if they hadn't gone she'd still have Robin.  No matter they went on their own free will and Emma tried to get them to leave multiple times.  Logic doesn't matter to Regina when she's emotional,  only she needs someone to take it out on.

[Sarcastica]

I had to look at every single one of those pictures. I have no control.

This entire time, I've had no feelings towards Robin...good or bad...he was just there.

But damn, I actually feel bad now. We all saw it coming and yup...It's really happening. Welp...

[Curio]

13 minutes ago, InsertWordHere said:

I think the rum part is at Hook's grave. That grave is covered and Robin's coffin hasn't been lowered yet (which is one of the first times I've seen tv or movies get that right).

I was saying I called the Hook-showing-up-behind-Emma part, but I guessed it would come after the rum scene at Hook's grave, not after Emma standing in front of Robin's grave.

[YaddaYadda]

Called that Robin would be killed by that Olympians Crystal. I feel great about the speculation panning out, but kinda sad for the Hobbit baby. I know he has his real dad Little John, but poor child.

Edited May 6, 2016 by YaddaYadda

[InsertWordHere]

1 minute ago, Curio said:

I was saying I called the Hook-showing-up-behind-Emma part, but I guessed it would come after the rum scene at Hook's grave, not after Emma standing in front of Robin's grave.

I think I would have liked your scenario better. That one look Emma has when she's hugging Hook and looking at Robin's grave tells me they are going to make part of the reunion scene be about Emma's guilt over Robin and Regina's grief. Shades of the Season 3 and 4A finales. 

Thematically, I really would have preferred it if Arthur killed Robin, not Hades. Going out fighting a corrupt king is a better fit for the Robin Hood legend. Plus, Arthur already killed Hook so I don't think Regina could blame Emma as easily. 

[Curio]

I can't believe they're going to kill off Robin without giving us a single Snow/Robin or Merida/Robin archery scene. They really didn't care at all for his character, did they? I guess it will forever remain an offscreen mystery whether or not Robin found out about Regina torturing Marian...

[KingOfHearts]

It's a cruel irony that Hook shows up right after Robin's funeral. This is going to be one emotional episode. I wonder what the heck happens to Hades and why he's not there when Robin is dead. I don't understand why Zelena has the crystal, either.