Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Joenigma]

 

So is her voice somehow tied to her magic?  We're supposed to meet Poseidon in her backstory as well.  Whatever Hook did to her, maybe it led to her father stripping some of her magic away.

 

I wonder if what is soul crushing that Hook did to Ursula is somehow tied to Poseidon himself. I can't shake the feeling that whatever Hook did to Ursula resulted in Poseidon's death. Sort of like, Ursula's singing has healing effects and she loses that ability because of Hook and couldn't save her father's life as a result.

[Mari]

ParadoxLost had a good question in the episode thread.

 

If Maleficent is Lily's mother, who is her father?  Because like ParadoxLost said--they're all connected somehow.

[YaddaYadda]

Probably Stefan.  Which would still make Lily and Aurora related since Aurora now lives in Storybrooke.  Next week is Maleficent's backstory.  Both Sebastian Roché (eeee) and Sarah Bolger are supposed to be on.

 

I'm assuming that one of the reasons Maleficent curses Aurora is because Stefan rejects the baby after she tells him about it.

[MaiLuna]

Well we know King Stefan is in next episode, and he did screw her over in the latest Maleficent movie. Though when we see them in the promo it looks like they're already enemies and that's when Regina is still young...I guess we'll see tomorrow in the press release or maybe they'll hold that secret until the end of the season.

 

 

Stefan is in it, so that confirms that.

That's what I just said :P

Edited March 9, 2015 by MaiLuna

[YaddaYadda]

Canadian Promo

 

Stefan is in it, so that confirms that.

[Bluerang1]

I think the secret is that Emma has an older sibling, you know, because Zelena wasn't far enough out of left field.

 

I was really worried about this happening. 

 

I'm so happy that next week is the Maleficent episode. I thought it was Ursula's but then the US promos made it look Regina-centric which let me down. ABC needs to take promo tips from CTV. A casual viewer won't really be interested in what they put out but if they referenced Mal's backstory as opposed to focus on undercover Regina, it'd draw more interest.

 

Also are they not even going to address Mal's costume change at all? Lol

[KingOfHearts]

 

I'm assuming that one of the reasons Maleficent curses Aurora is because Stefan rejects the baby after she tells him about it.

Maleficent went after Aurora's mother some time before the curse before proceeding to go after Aurora herself. Maleficent was pregnant at the same time Snow was, so if the next flashback is with young Regina training with Rumple, she would have already had her problem with Stefan a long time ago. Unless of course the Stefan flashbacks happen at a different from time from Regina's, but then there would be a question of why Maleficent would go after Aurora's mother first.

Edited March 9, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[ParadoxLost]

Also are they not even going to address Mal's costume change at all? Lol

 

Did they run out of money and steal it from the set of 'Agent Carter' because WTF.

[Serena]

Maleficent went after Aurora's mother some time before the curse before proceeding to go after Aurora herself. Maleficent was pregnant at the same time Snow was, so if the next flashback is with young Regina training with Rumple, she would have already had her problem with Stefan a long time ago. Unless of course the Stefan flashbacks happen at a different from time from Regina's, but then there would be a question of why Maleficent would go after Aurora's mother first.

So, Stefan rejects Maleficient and decides to marry Aurora's mother. Mal goes after her, curses her, fails, the retires. Some years later (how old is Aurora? Let's say 20), Mal and Stefan "reunite", she gets pregnant, and thinks THIS is the time he's finally gonna chose her. No dice. So he goes after Aurora, who's getting everything HER child should be getting. BOOM.

 

Did anyone else read the interview (I think from THR?) where the writers implied Mal's baby could be hatched from an egg?

[Bluerang1]

Did they run out of money and steal it from the set of 'Agent Carter' because WTF.

Haha true and I was just about to mention this but I mean her purple Maleficent outfit. Even in the promo she looked out of place next to Regina when they're with Stefan. I though maybe she started dorning the black outfit after being scorned by Stefan or something.

Again pissed that Snowing are the ones who wronged her the most, they're intertwining stories too much which isn't surprising with this show. I want to know how Aurora comes into play and who the best was that she was talking about to Regina in season 1.

[plender]

Haha true and I was just about to mention this but I mean her purple Maleficent outfit. Even in the promo she looked out of place next to Regina when they're with Stefan. I though maybe she started dorning the black outfit after being scorned by Stefan or something.

Again pissed that Snowing are the ones who wronged her the most, they're intertwining stories too much which isn't surprising with this show. I want to know how Aurora comes into play and who the best was that she was talking about to Regina in season 1.

For me, my explanation for the costume change is that Maleficent wears her black outfit outdoors because most of the scenes that we see her in the purple outfit in season 1 was indoors. Just my take

[SilverShadow]

So I just realized, it was super obvious that Lily is Maleficent's kid from the start because she's the "lily among the thorns". Ba-dum cha. *Groan*

[Mathius]

For me, my explanation for the costume change is that Maleficent wears her black outfit outdoors because most of the scenes that we see her in the purple outfit in season 1 was indoors. Just my take

All of them were indoors. That's my take too, her black outfit is her "supervillain costume", her purple outfit is casual wear. She wore it when chilling with Regina and when going to sit on her throne without knowing Charming was there. When she needs to actually go and intimidate people, she goes in black.

[Emma]

http://www.spoilertv.com/2015/03/once-upon-time-episode-414-enter-dragon_18.html

“Enter the Dragon” – In order to infiltrate the Queens of Darkness as a spy for the heroes, Regina must prove she’s still willing to get her hands dirty. Meanwhile, Emma, David and Mary Margaret scramble to keep tabs on their undercover operative. Hook requests an unusual favor from Belle as Henry makes progress on his search for the Author. In a Fairy Tale Land flashback, Regina befriends Maleficent and helps her to rekindle her lost spark, on “Once Upon a Time,” SUNDAY, MARCH 15 (8:00-9:00 p.m., ET) on the ABC Television Network.

“Once Upon a Time” stars Ginnifer Goodwin as Snow White/Mary Margaret, Jennifer Morrison as Emma Swan, Lana Parrilla as the Evil Queen/Regina, Josh Dallas as Prince Charming/David Nolan, Emilie de Ravin as Belle, Colin O’Donoghue as Hook, Jared S. Gilmore as Henry, Michael Socha as Will Scarlet and Robert Carlyle as Rumplestiltskin/Mr. Gold.

Guest stars include Tony Amendola as Marco/Geppetto, Eion Bailey as August, Sarah Bolger as Aurora, Merrin Dungey as Ursula, Victoria Smurfit as Cruella De Vil, Jakob Davies as Pinocchio, Sebastian Roche as King Stefan, Kristin Bauer van Straten as Maleficent, Noah Beggs as Bartender and Russell Roberts as Visiting Duke.

”Enter the Dragon” was written by David H. Goodman and Jerome Schwartz and directed by Ralph Hemecker.

[kili]

In a Fairy Tale Land flashback, Regina befriends Maleficent and helps her to rekindle her lost spark [sNIP] Noah Beggs as Bartender and Russell Roberts as Visiting Duke.

 

Noah Beggs has been on Once twice before in Chlld of the Moon and Broken (Mob Guy and Man respectively - he was presumably a nameless face in King George's anti-Ruby mob). Did he just land a bigger role or did his previous role just get better defined? Is he the love of Mal's life? Or is it the visiting Duke who is from the same line of work as the visiting Prince John? Or is Mal's former spark Stefan and all her cursing of Aurora has to do with spurned love and visiting the break-ups of the father on the daughter (this is really starting to feel like Cora all over agian).

 

Why is Regina playing wingman in the EF? That doesn't seem her speed from what we've seen so far. I guess the Author just forgot to put all those "Regina helps random people find their happy endings" parts in the book. Regina is just like Snow! (except not quite so evil).

[retrograde]

Hook requests an unusual favor from Belle

 

 

Will this be that scene where she gives him the dagger? What could he do with it?

[YaddaYadda]

Will this be that scene where she gives him the dagger? What could he do with it?

I had totally forgotten about that scene.  Does that mean Rumple follows them to where Belle hid the dagger?

 

I thought his request might have to do with trying to fix whatever it is he has done to Ursula since her centric is after next week.

 

We got BTS where they filmed in Steveston, didn't we?  I think Rumple was even out in the open during the day or maybe I'm thinking about the following episode.  It was the BTS with them holding the page from the book that Henry finds in August's things.

[RadioGirl27]

Hook requests an unusual favor from Belle as Henry makes progress on his search for the Author.

Will this be that scene where she gives him the dagger? What could he do with it?

Maybe it has to do with whatever Henry has found. We really don't how how is the relationship between Hook and Henry right now, after the Shatered Sight spell, so I can see Henry asking for Hook's help and him doing whatever it takes to please the kid, and we now that little creep can be really persuasive.

 

Both Eion Bailey and the kid that plays Pinocchio are in this, so it seems August is back in present time. Maybe Regina makes a spell to make him an adult so he can tell them everything. Maybe that's why they need the dagger. Or that's what Hook asks Belle.

Edited March 9, 2015 by RadioGirl27

[Shanna Marie]

You know, maybe whatever Hook did to Ursula did happen in his early pirate days, and then she ran into him again later after he was already Hook, so her use of that name isn't necessarily because that's how she knows him but more as a taunt. Though then you have to wonder why he's still alive if she ran into him later, unless she took the "he's just not worth it" approach.

[KingOfHearts]

 

Both Eion Bailey and the kid that plays Pinocchio are in this, so it seems August is back in present time.

That's so creepy. So a little kid had already slept with girls in Hong Kong? I don't care if it's just a magic thing or not. It's still gross. And not only that, but he's back to his adult self? The Author plot is so disturbing.

Edited March 9, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[Serena]

Is this the episode with B&H with the dagger? So Hook asks her for a favour, they bond some more, and then at the end when they've found out Rumple is back (which they should assume IMMEDIATELY after getting proof the queens are up to no good) she gives him the dagger because she doesn't want to deal with Rumple and she trusts him.

[YaddaYadda]

Is this the episode with B&H with the dagger? So Hook asks her for a favour, they bond some more, and then at the end when they've found out Rumple is back (which they should assume IMMEDIATELY after getting proof the queens are up to no good) she gives him the dagger because she doesn't want to deal with Rumple and she trusts him.

Rumple's head goes kaboom.

[Notwisconsin]

Maybe this time August isn't August or Pinocchio. Look, August was KILLED by the Blue Fairy.

[retrograde]

I don't think Eion Bailey's presence means he's in the present. In fact, given what happened last episode, I'd bet it's a flashback. Didn't A&E say there'd be some flashbacks to pre-Emma Storybrooke? 

 

The storybook page shows a door from the portal in Jefferson's hat. There's no chance he is coming back, but there was that BTS photos in the Ursula-centric (ETA Cruella-centric, rather) that showed a bike with Jefferson's daughter's name on it. Is it possible Henry will buddy up to her for info?

Edited March 9, 2015 by retrograde

[YaddaYadda]

Ursula-centric

 

Cruella-centric, Dahling.

[Shanna Marie]

Do we know when the Ursula-centric episode is supposed to be? This next one is Mal, right? (Though you wouldn't know it from the ABC promo.)

[retrograde]

Yeah, next one is Mal (Enter the Dragon), followed by Ursula (Poor Unfortunate Soul). The Cruella-centric (thanks, YaddaYadda, I typed the wrong name in my last post) is a few episodes later. 

[Shanna Marie]

I should have known. The Ursula one that presumably contains the Hook backstory will be on a night when I'm out. I swear, they deliberately schedule episodes I want to see against my choir stuff. This time, it's the final performance of Mary Poppins, where I'm singing backstage backup during ensemble numbers. When I agreed to do that performance, I thought it would be at 2 in the afternoon, but they moved it to 5, and it's a nearly 3-hour show.

[Rumsy4]

 

Guest stars include Tony Amendola as Marco/Geppetto, Eion Bailey as August, Sarah Bolger as Aurora, Merrin Dungey as Ursula, Victoria Smurfit as Cruella De Vil, Jakob Davies as Pinocchio, Sebastian Roche as King Stefan, Kristin Bauer van Straten as Maleficent, Noah Beggs as Bartender and Russell Roberts as Visiting Duke.

 

Since the flashback involves Mal, Aurora and King Stepfan will be part of that flashback. Regina helping Mal to get her "spark" back is something to do with Mal's dragon form. The trailer had Rumple alluding to that while tutoring Regina in the Dark Arts. 

 

At first I thought August's appearance was going to be connected to a flashback to his days in the Real World, but now I'm starting to wonder if poor Pinocchio is going to do some rapid ageing. I don't think they do flashbacks for two separate characters in one episode. If it is an August flashback scene, why would Geppetto and Pinocchio be in the episode? 

[pezgirl7]

I don't think Eion Bailey's presence means he's in the present. In fact, given what happened last episode, I'd bet it's a flashback. Didn't A&E say there'd be some flashbacks to pre-Emma Storybrooke? 

 

That's what I was thinking. August will be appearing in a flashback, as it relates to the book.

 

Has this EW article been posted yet? "Once Upon a Time' postmortem: Snow and Charming's big secret revealed"

 

“That’s the tip of the iceberg of the secret that you saw in the second episode,” executive producer Adam Horowitz reveals. “Our hope is that by the time everything is revealed, you’ll see it really informs who they were in season 1 when you met them for the first time.”

 

 

That's good to know, just because what was revealed was kind of lame.

 

As for whether we’ll find out who Maleficent’s baby daddy is, Kitsis replies, “If there is one.” Does that suggest Mal could be lying? “I’m suggesting this is a show where Dwarves are hatched from an egg,” Kitsis adds.

 

 

Would the egg still need a baby daddy though? Does that mean the egg that Charming put in her, which was given to him by Rumple, grows up to be Lily? Which means Rumple engineered Lily from the very beginning?

[KingOfHearts]

 

Does that mean the egg that Charming put in her, which was given to him by Rumple, grows up to be Lily? Which means Rumple engineered Lily from the very beginning?

Well, Emma got the egg out of her in 1x22. What I think is that it might have magically impregnated her. The timeline of the pregnancy works out. There's the "eggs" spoiler too. Maybe that's why Rumple chose that hiding place, and why it's shaped like an egg. Perhaps the container is magical and the True Love potion powered it. Maybe Lily was a back-up plan in case Emma couldn't do what he wanted?

 

 

Sometimes I'm not sure if Adam is speaking from the point of view of the characters, or he really believes in all this crap. I don't know which option is worse...

I think this show would be amazing if the writers knew the characters were crazy and that their morals were twisted. All the material you could work with if there was a voice of sense somewhere. Actually dealing with Snow's guilt complex, Regina's psychotic mind, Henry's disturbed childhood, etc. 

Edited March 9, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[Rumsy4]

That article makes me want to rage and throw things at the wall!!

 

“Snow was asked to keep a secret and couldn’t keep her mouth shut,” Horowitz says. “Can Regina keep her mouth shut? Regina is probably a stronger and better secret keeper than Snow White, but it does create a bond between the two of them. She was her step-mother.”

 

Really, Adam? Really?  Regina is a "stronger and better" secret keeper than 10 year old Snow?? What creates a bond between them? Being a step-mother who was trying to kill her step-daughter for 30+ years? Sometimes I'm not sure if Adam is speaking from the point of view of the characters, or he really believes in all this crap. I don't know which option is worse...

Edited March 9, 2015 by Rumsy4

[Shanna Marie]

Yeah, I don't know why a fully grown adult would be better at keeping secrets than a 10-year-old kid, whether or not you throw a master manipulator into the mix. Geez louise, these writers.

[pezgirl7]

Well, Emma got the egg out of her in 1x22. What I think is that it might have magically impregnated her. The timeline of the pregnancy works out. There's the "eggs" spoiler too. Maybe that's why Rumple chose that hiding place, and why it's shaped like an egg. Perhaps the container is magical and the True Love potion powered it. Maybe Lily was a back-up plan in case Emma couldn't do what he wanted?

 

Thanks, I had totally forgotten that Emma retrieved the egg, and it had the true love potion in it. So that means Mal gave birth to Lily, while keeping the egg inside her the whole time? So weird.

[YaddaYadda]

A&E should never give interviews.  Guess I will not be reading this one.  I sure hope a fucking adult knows how to keep a secret.  Ten year olds should not have to carry that burden for an adult.

[KingOfHearts]

 

A&E should never give interviews.  Guess I will not be reading this one.  I sure hope a fucking adult knows how to keep a secret.  Ten year olds should not have to carry that burden for an adult.

Even if Snow was an adult, Cora was a manipulative mastermind preying on her feelings of losing a mother. It's not like Snow just ran up to Cora and told her, thinking she'd understand.

[kili]

As for whether we’ll find out who Maleficent’s baby daddy is, Kitsis replies, “If there is one.” Does that suggest Mal could be lying? “I’m suggesting this is a show where Dwarves are hatched from an egg,” Kitsis adds.

 

Eggs laid without "Daddy's" being involved don't hatch. Does somebody need to send Adam a health sciences primer? Or is he just so in love with this Great Idea that he didn't want to bother thinking about the logistics of finding a Daddny? "What is the evilest thing that we can get Snow to do? Something unforgivable? I know, make her be responsible for another baby being separated from her Mom....who is the Mom...Mal! Who is the dad? Who cares! There isn't one! How cool is that!?!?!?!"

 

If Lily hatches...how does she have a child in this world? With whom?

[ParadoxLost]

Eggs laid without "Daddy's" being involved don't hatch. Does somebody need to send Adam a health sciences primer? Or is he just so in love with this Great Idea that he didn't want to bother thinking about the logistics of finding a Dadd?

 

I have three pseudo-no Daddy scenarios although I agree with the Stefan theory:

 

- Rumpel made a deal that got him James' sperm (I don't want to know how) and the egg made Mal pregnant.  This makes Lily and Emma cousins.  I really hope Charming and the egg has nothing to do with this.

- We have a Jurassic Park 'life will find a way' scenario

- Mal's dragon and donkey unicorn got it on.  Its really the only explanation for why a pregnant Mal would bodily through herself in the way of Regina's fireball to save Donkey unicorn in season 1

 

The bartender guest star momentarily brought me to a place in my head where Mal hooked up with Robin because Regina chickened out on meeting him.  There was much pointing and laughing in my head.

[YaddaYadda]

This makes Lily and Emma cousins.

 

How would that be possible?  

 

I find it sad that Emma's most significant relationships before she knew where she was from were with people from the EF. 

[ParadoxLost]

How would that be possible?  

 

I find it sad that Emma's most significant relationships before she knew where she was from were with people from the EF. 

 

So James is Charming's twin brother and there used to be a mad scientist by the name of Whale...

[kili]

I have three pseudo-no Daddy scenarios although I agree with the Stefan theory:

- [James is the dad in some convoluted way]

If everybody is to be related, I kind of like that theory. I even kind of like James/Mal torrid affair and Mal having a long gestation period. Plus, it is a way to have a "Dad" (ie have some logical consistency with how things work) and not have to worry about a "Dad" being around.

 

- We have a Jurassic Park 'life will find a way' scenario

 

That "works" because they used frog DNA and some frogs who are in all female colonies will spontaneously change genders. There is still a dad. I suppose Cruella or Ursula may have swapped genders if the "female only colony" gene kicked in, but I'm not sure Once wants to go there.

 

If there is no other involved in having a child, then you are just cloning yourself. Goodness knows what happens with the dwarf eggs, but given they are diverse, there is likely more than one party involved.

 

- Mal's dragon and donkey unicorn got it on

 

Sadly, that is a copyrighted fairy tale from a Disney competitor, so that cannot happen. Donkey was actually a fairly involved dad.

Edited March 9, 2015 by kili

[YaddaYadda]

So James is Charming's twin brother and there used to be a mad scientist by the name of Whale...

 

Please, no more.  

[buildmeupbuttercup]

From the EW article:

Snow White and Prince Charming aren’t the heroes that Once Upon a Time fans thought they were.

And the first line makes me want to throw things. These aren't real people!! These are characters that the writers are manipulating and retconning to fit their new "exciting" narrative to prove that instead of their old mantra of "evil isn't born it's made" actually its more like "heroes and villains--they're practically the same".

 

She’s going to have to convince Maleficent that she’s more Evil Queen than good, that she’s still the friend that she knows. These women have a love and affection and respect.

Really that's what Regina has to convince Mal of? That's she's still Evil Queen and doesn't spit light magic? Not APOLOGIZE for trapping her as a dragon under the library for 30 years?

 

Regina is probably a stronger and better secret keeper than Snow White

And a better mayor, lasagna maker, mother...the list goes on. Please tell me more things that adult Regina is better at than a 10 year old.

 

I hate when these two idiots talk.

[YaddaYadda]

So it would seem that all the QoD will be staying at Granny's since they are apparently meeting there as well and plotting like there's nothing to it.

 

When they filmed this episode, there was a moment when Emma leaves Granny angry or upset before she bumps into Hook and they have this talk.  

 

Anyone else thinks she has a run-in with those three, because if she does, then I cannot wait to see it.

 

Also, is Granny hurting for money that she would rent room and board to those three?  She wouldn't even serve them a drink, but rooms she rents?

Edited March 9, 2015 by YaddaYadda

[kili]

So it would seem that all the QoD will be staying at Granny's since they are apparently meeting there as well and plotting like there's nothing to it.

 

So Granny completely ignores Ursula/Cruella refusing to make them a cocktail, but she lets them stay and plot in her guest house? Granny has got some weird priorities.

 

I want Ursula and Cruella living in her car. I loved all those parking tickets. That was awesome.

[ParadoxLost]

There's the "eggs" spoiler too.

 

I forget, what were the other two words they gave us?

[YaddaYadda]

I forget, what were the other two words they gave us?

 

Feinberg and voice.

[MaiLuna]

Do we know what episode 16 is supposed to be about? 14 is Maleficent, 15 is Ursula, 17 is Robin/Marian and 18 is Cruella. Whose centric is 16? Rumpel? The Charmings?

Edited March 10, 2015 by MaiLuna

[YaddaYadda]

We don't really know what episode 16 is.  It's called Best Laid Plans and I think it's the episode where this serkit blows up in Snowing's faces.

[ParadoxLost]

We don't really know what episode 16 is.  It's called Best Laid Plans and I think it's the episode where this serkit blows up in Snowing's faces.

 

IMDB although not completely reliable seems to be tracking pretty well on guest stars for the other eps.  That makes this one seem like its more core character centric because the guests are Hook and Robin Hood related.  Not a lot of names that show up in the Mal, Ursala, and Cruella centrics.